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The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 06:25 GMT
#1055
Ninjad. Trfel got the read before I did lol. And yeah, I posted the times, too, I sincerely apologize for the vote mixup. Really thought I was onto something for a moment.
Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 06:38 GMT
#1060
As am I. I hate to say it but diving/skimming everyone for their stances on Tere kind of took it out of me. Also I forgot Zlefin.

Zlefin - Null on Tere, healthy suspicion but seems to be more set on pushing Ely or Silver.

Speaking of Silver...you got me interested in the exercise I just did with Tere.

As far as I see, Trfel is leaning scum or at least willing to lynch Silver.
Tere dropped her to being scum with me.
Ely and Zlef both see Silver as scummish, as per the lists they posted.
JJB is calling her forgettable up until now, but points out that she did take the effort to scumread Tere, although he is incorrect in saying Tere's being accepted as a townread.

Did you miss the part where we got at eachother? lol. Also, definitive answer for Silver, please. You leaning scum or town?
Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 06:46 GMT
#1063
Naw, directed at JJB. You're made it clear that you could possibly lynch Silver but also made it clear you don't want to go too much further.

Regardless, EVERYONE minus myself scumming Silver is raising red flags for me. I was null on her but now I truly have to dive her. I did mention that Tere's suspicions seemed pretty scattershot, with the only constant being her scumread on me. But that read when she first entered the game was a slight town lean, too.

Also, I believe that was somewhat original on Silver's part. Trfel did comment that people seemed to pick up on his reads and analysis but did not specify which ones, I think. And I pinged on the fact that Tere rescinded her Ely read for a town read off of 1 post that, IMO, could come from either alignment.

It could just be a coincidence that Tere decided to replace Ely with Silver following Trfel's analysis of her but it is a good point to look into.
Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 06:47 GMT
#1064
On February 19 2015 15:44 Trfel wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 19 2015 15:38 The Shining wrote:
Did you miss the part where we got at eachother? lol. Also, definitive answer for Silver, please. You leaning scum or town?
Is this directed at me?

Anyway, thanks a bunch for digging up all of this. I don't think I see any strong reasons to scumread Tere that I missed, but I'll take another look.


I could just be wrong on Tere, but I won't be able to get a good feel on it for sure until I see her at EoD. And no prob.
Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 06:49 GMT
#1067
On February 19 2015 15:48 jarjarbinks wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 19 2015 15:38 The Shining wrote:
As am I. I hate to say it but diving/skimming everyone for their stances on Tere kind of took it out of me. Also I forgot Zlefin.

Zlefin - Null on Tere, healthy suspicion but seems to be more set on pushing Ely or Silver.

Speaking of Silver...you got me interested in the exercise I just did with Tere.

As far as I see, Trfel is leaning scum or at least willing to lynch Silver.
Tere dropped her to being scum with me.
Ely and Zlef both see Silver as scummish, as per the lists they posted.
JJB is calling her forgettable up until now, but points out that she did take the effort to scumread Tere, although he is incorrect in saying Tere's being accepted as a townread.

Did you miss the part where we got at eachother? lol. Also, definitive answer for Silver, please. You leaning scum or town?



I'm not done with the filter, sorry. Posting thoughts in segments lol I did see that. Are you still that suspicious of her? It seems like you are less. Trf seems less.


Of who, Tere?
Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 07:07 GMT
#1072
JJB, I'm slightly less suspicious of her in the sense that, post interaction, I realized I'd get nowhere pushing her. I still have my gut feeling and I've made it abundantly clear why she could possibly be scum, but I'm also weary of putting us into lylo with another mislynch and, to be fair, there are some town points and good posts in her filter to counteract my thoughts.

In other words, I'm concentrating my efforts on finding the other scum. That will, imo, either give her away as the 2nd scum or exonerate her, depending on who flips. Once she interacts with me tomorrow, and of course post lynch flip, I'll have a more definitive answer.

And I agree with the fact that holding back reads or thoughts sometimes forces others to put original thoughts into the thread. It is how we interpret those original thoughts that makes the strategy useful.

And please, once you're done with Silver, a read either way would be helpful.

Trfel WIFOM? It's a newbie game, we could have first time scummers or scum team could be the most experienced in the game. Do you really think it would be such a seamless bus that we wouldn't be able to pick up on who was least committed to the Silver scumread? You're either putting a lot of faith into the scum team or little to no faith in your/our scumhunting abilities as town.

Also, am I wrong in thinking that with this much time left in the day, a counter wagon would be at least attempted before scum buses a partner in a game this small?
Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 07:09 GMT
#1073
Aye...night, Trfel. JJB, I'm off to do something but I'll be F5'ing every 5 mins or so, don't think I abandoned you.
Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 07:27 GMT
#1078
Trfel, I'm just asking you to look at both sides of it. If you're willing to believe scum is capable enough to bus without it being noticeable(i.e. not really speaking on Silver or suspecting her until now), you have to think, in a Newbie game, they might be just as likely to be incapable of a proper bus and that this really is just taking advantage of a bad-looking townie.

We had this many willing to lynch Hier. He flipped town. I don't want that happening again.
Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 18:12 GMT
#1096
Zlefin - Since you missed it the first time.

On February 19 2015 07:37 The Shining wrote:
For Zlefin:

Townish: Trfel, me.
Null:JJB, Silver, Zlef(diving these filters + Ely right now)
Scummy: Tere rescinded Ely too fast off of one post, considering it was your other strong scumread besides me. So Tere - ElyAs


Ely - Just getting into thread and want to cross check some things but I've honestly been waffling on whether the Godfather is Trfel or Tere myself, since the game started. I'll see which of those options I like best, or if it is just a ploy to deflect suspicion off of you.

Tere - The question that was never answered. It's a new day. I'm here. Answer it pl0x. WTF makes Ely's one post you claim to town read him off of so special that you towned him so hard for it? You have a vote up on Trfel of all people. It doesn't escape me that my only 2 scumreads are now setting up to push Trfel together. Explain your Trfel vote or it'll garner no support. And do it earlier than a few minutes before EoD, please.
Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 18:13 GMT
#1098
EBWOP: You can ignore the question part, Tere, I didn't notice that you had ninja'd in a post responding to me and I thank you for that.
Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 18:16 GMT
#1101
Ely I gathered you would be back 2 hours before EoD by reading this post here:

On February 19 2015 02:27 ElyAs wrote:
It really took an hour to write this ? Holy hell. I don't want to leave this post alone but I won't have the time to do another one of these right now. [b]I'll be back for 11PM CET for follow-up.[b]


11:00 PM Thursday, Central European Time (CET) is 5:00 PM Thursday, Eastern Time (ET). Okay nevermind, I made another time mistake. You actually said you'd be back AT EoD, not before it. I guess I misunderstood this post as saying you would not be back before then, but obviously you're here, so point is moot.
Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 18:50 GMT
#1109
Actually, you know what, Ely. I don't really like that post. On the outside, it looks like a good analysis and 3 different point of views to consider. When you look into it, pardon my scumread bias showing here but I can see it coming from scum, too. You offer 3 options to town, 2 or possibly even all 3 of which could be mislynches, and the points don't seem too solid.

For Trfel, I can understand why he is done with Tere's breadcrumbing, I noticed it myself and it hasn't stopped me from scumming her. It could come from either alignment. And distancing himself from easy lynches? He cased Silver, who arguably has given us less content this game than you have.

For me, I'm just going to be clear and say I'm not scum at all, let alone the godfather.

For Tere, this is pretty much exactly the problem I had with her. She seemed to breadcrumb which led us to nothing and although there's a lot of time and effort in her WOTs, nothing has been really consistent. Scumreads keep becoming townreads while town and nulls get dropped to scum.

Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 18:52 GMT
#1111
I want you to commit on your one train of thinking. If I'm correct, you said option 1 is most viable, right? If you're going to give me more, I'd prefer it be a case for whichever option you're going to push.
Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 19:17 GMT
#1123
You would claim Doc as I'm leaving for work. FFS. I'll be back when I get to work...45 mins to an hour.

Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 20:50 GMT
#1155
Trfel, the defensiveness while claiming to not defend yourself is strong. I wasn't scum reading you. I'm still not. Ely has an unCC blue claim but I don't really like it. Hindsight is 20/20 but RSo would've been a much better save N1. And claimed with absolutely no pressure, no risk of being lynched yet. It doesn't sit well with me. We had a Doc claim in the last Newbie game. Celestial was scum.

I need to get on my tablet, on phone right now.
Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 20:55 GMT
#1156
Zlefin, you seem to be showing suspicion of Trfel. Had him listed null before. He has a very extensive filter, a lot to analyze. There have been reads, pushes, willingness to engage, quick retractions when wrong and reading the thread. This is why I town read him.

With a player with a filter this big, with valid scumhunting, are you still null on him? If so, how? If not, where are you leaning on him?
Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 21:15 GMT
#1168
Well, say I believe the Doc claim, right? That means I'm wrong on one of my reads. Ely goes from red to blue in my eyes. That forces me to look for another possible scum, as Tere can't work alone.

Didn't Tere also bump Zlefin up a couple of notches on her town list? Defends his wanting to lynch Trfel for info as a Newbie play. Suspicious of him then bumps him up to new townie finding his voice once he says he'll give her slot a pass.

Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 21:27 GMT
#1174
Zlefin, I asked because you are voting with Trfel by voting Silver. Just wanted to make sure you weren't voting with a scumread. That's just bad.

Wow, Tere, that's a case. Let me get through it, shouldn't be more than 10 mins. On the surface, it looks pretty damning, as some of it echoes thoughts I had on Trfel with my early suspicions.
Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 21:29 GMT
#1175
Tere, you realize if Trfel flips town, you'll likely be gladiated anyway?

And if your case is to be believed, plus your thoughts on Silver, you're saying our only 2 wagons are both scum?
Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
The Shining
Profile Joined December 2014
United States2406 Posts
February 19 2015 21:33 GMT
#1177
30 mins to EoD. Some reactions to the Tere case would be nice. Wish you hadn't posted it so close to EoD.

JJB, Silver, not voting. Seems to be a big tell on Silver here, not really sure why JJB is afk.

I need to see those votes.
Always and Never are two words you should always remember never to say.
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