[M][N]Hammertime Mafia

On January 26 2015 08:24 Toadesstern wrote:
Game has started. Is there a mayor spot in this game? I don't want to end up pardoner again ... but there's no mayor spot in this game... so

I plan on running for [pseudo-] mayor

The 2 major aspects of my candidacy:

• I am awesome d1
  
• I am unreadable according to pretty much every vet on TL except for syllo [and marv]

you do what I say, I am happy. A happy Toad means I get to do the stuff I need to do to solve this game and can't
a) get annoyed about some idiot that needs some talking to because you simply do as I say
b) pretend to be dealing with some idiot that needs some talking to because you simply do as I say

sounds good, right? Who wants to be my sheriff. The position is currently up for grabs. You can't sign up for it but I will call out to whoever seems up for the job.

On January 26 2015 08:56 GlowingBear wrote:
OMG wait I forgot it is instant!!!

##Unvote

On January 26 2015 08:41 Toadesstern wrote:


I see. That explains why you voted me indeed.

On January 27 2015 00:20 Onegu wrote:



Dude look at fantasy football mafia 2 and to mafia lxviii. And compare GB's posts in those games he's town.

On September 16 2014 02:52 GlowingBear wrote:


Haven't read the whole thread because I was working when the thread boomed. But for what I've read, this is totally town Robik. I don't know VE's meta but he seems too passive, saying he is voting palmar but he is not sure. I don't like this. If he is not sure he should be searching for other possibilities, other scummy posts.

There is only three options: you think someone is town, you think someone is scum, or you have no idea. You vote for the ones you think could be mafia, you discuss with the ones you think is town, and you inquire null reads. He is not inquiring palmar, he is freely voting on him.

On September 16 2014 23:25 GlowingBear wrote:
Robik's tone completely changed over the pages, marv. He was at least scum hunting but then he started just defending himself and calling people bad over nothing, and left the thread. This is how he plays as scum. I showed my motives right after the vote.

I can't stand playing with Robik anymore, he really thinks he is better than he actually is

On September 16 2014 23:31 GlowingBear wrote:


"You're bad because your read is bad. I think this guy is mafia because *okay reasoning*" = town Robik

"You're bad because you're bad. I think this guy is mafia because he called him Harry Potter instead of his actual nickname. LOL u calling me mafia? You guys suck only for that I'm getting out of the thread because I'm pissed off" = scum Robik

He can call people bad anytime, that's Robik. Calling people bad for nothing and not building a good scum hunt, that's scum Robik.

His gameplay started as town and got scum, so I voted him

On January 27 2015 08:00 Toadesstern wrote:

I'm mostly still townreading him for the vote on me that had a townish confidence to it to not give a fuck

About your case. I actually quite like it and am considering GB a null at best right now...
I don't care so much about your first point about him and your last point, but the second one about Onegu just commenting on the vote without trying to figure anything out when indeed he was confused and asked about wether it's a troll / mayor / lynch vote at just that time.

That could very well be painting someone red rather than trying to read someone.

On January 27 2015 04:13 Half the Sky wrote:


Yes.

Liancourt's town play in Carol (he was the veteran in that game) was a PERFECT example of this. He was criticised for not being convincing, he pissed away 4 cycles yelling at people his reads, particularly to lynch Holyflare but people ignored him. He was right but failed to be convincing.

On January 27 2015 04:22 Toadesstern wrote:


though if he's tunneling he has confirmation bias by definition. If that's what he's doing it's likely he might ignore the parts you're blaming him for simply because he's certain you're mafia and looking at it only one way: Try to point out things that don't fit with your townmeta because you're mafia anyways

Both what you said and what I said come down to the same thing I feel. It could very well be malicious just the way I think locking on to just one target could be something malicious because that way he doesn't have to make up stuff about a lot of people and can just focus on one guy. But if he does tunnel a lot that's a moot point.

On December 20 2014 10:05 liancourt wrote:
U know why ppl arent lynching hf? Because they are reading his posts and not ignoring the content.

All of hfs posts whether scum or town are all superb. They are alwsys pro town in both alignments.

The thing u have to realize is hf busses nearly everytime. And when he s town he generally gets scum most of the time.

The only scum tell he prolly has is how he reacts to certain posts. If his reaction is genuine fake calm angry etc. Town hf is more angry more frustrated. Scum hf is calm then tries to be angry on purpose and fakes reactions. Ppls pov will differ on whether hfs reactions are fake or not but imo hf has been faking a lot this game. Just like the vote deadline faking anger. He can be angry in both alignments yes but it looked so fake to me. U guys cant put a case on hf for content cos he busses teammates. His content will alwsys be good. U have to read him as how me and slam read him. Slam knows hf so well. I still believe slam is town but dont know why u didnt vote hf when u did last time....slam??? Why????

At gb i m from asia

On December 20 2014 10:13 liancourt wrote:
Gb what is wrong with u???? Are u reading his posts? Stop reading hfs posts. And think for yourself.

Why its korean standard time. Because i m in korea.

On January 27 2015 04:22 Toadesstern wrote:


though if he's tunneling he has confirmation bias by definition. If that's what he's doing it's likely he might ignore the parts you're blaming him for simply because he's certain you're mafia and looking at it only one way: Try to point out things that don't fit with your townmeta because you're mafia anyways

Both what you said and what I said come down to the same thing I feel. It could very well be malicious just the way I think locking on to just one target could be something malicious because that way he doesn't have to make up stuff about a lot of people and can just focus on one guy. But if he does tunnel a lot that's a moot point.

On December 20 2014 10:05 liancourt wrote:
U know why ppl arent lynching hf? Because they are reading his posts and not ignoring the content.

All of hfs posts whether scum or town are all superb. They are alwsys pro town in both alignments.

The thing u have to realize is hf busses nearly everytime. And when he s town he generally gets scum most of the time.

The only scum tell he prolly has is how he reacts to certain posts. If his reaction is genuine fake calm angry etc. Town hf is more angry more frustrated. Scum hf is calm then tries to be angry on purpose and fakes reactions. Ppls pov will differ on whether hfs reactions are fake or not but imo hf has been faking a lot this game. Just like the vote deadline faking anger. He can be angry in both alignments yes but it looked so fake to me. U guys cant put a case on hf for content cos he busses teammates. His content will alwsys be good. U have to read him as how me and slam read him. Slam knows hf so well. I still believe slam is town but dont know why u didnt vote hf when u did last time....slam??? Why????

At gb i m from asia

On December 20 2014 10:13 liancourt wrote:
Gb what is wrong with u???? Are u reading his posts? Stop reading hfs posts. And think for yourself.

Why its korean standard time. Because i m in korea.

On January 27 2015 12:53 liancourt wrote:


very accurate representation except i wasnt vet i only breadcrumbed vet so that they wouldnt shoot me. Well I'm not afking this game and just leaving my vote on eden. I intend to convinve town he's scum unless there are better cases that can sway me, but atm I don't see any except maybe a policy lynch on palmar, but he said he's posting a read so I'll wait for that.

On January 27 2015 14:17 Onegu wrote:



Here you go lian my scum read on you. First was just a pressure vote, but now here is my reason

On January 27 2015 13:22 Onegu wrote:



Ok yeah I'm happy to kill this guy with fire now... Why the hell are you talking about that?!

On January 27 2015 14:23 Onegu wrote:



He just came in. Had your obnoxious post that you quoted 20 times. Had posts from hts and a vote from me. And he comes in and is like yup you scum and I'm never going to listen to you. When have you ever seen town do that.

On January 26 2015 09:23 GlowingBear wrote:


Isn't it odd that he didn't Unvote yet, and how do you think mafia would react to my vote on you?

On January 26 2015 09:31 Toadesstern wrote:


I'm usually read as obviously townie by most people in the game, no matter if I'm town, mafia or 3rd party.

I took like 3 mafia hits and an SK hit when I rolled 3rd party ninja/assassin in one of Palmars (?) games during night1 + night2. (LOL bulletproof)
My most recent Mafia game was the shadow-vet game I replaced into for HF (iirc?) with Sandroba being lynched d1 and ending up one of the most townish guy for everyone except for the guy I got lynched on whatever cycle wer were on. We ended up winning that in a landslide despite Marv asking me to replace into an "already lost game"
My most recent game as Town was the one that had 15 people divided into 5 cells of 3 where especially HF made it his best effort to put my cell first because it was the easiest one with a lot of people, including him and Marv, agreeing that I'm town.

That's the reason I said I liked qtpi's answer to my first question in the thread. If she doesn't know me it makes perfect sense, it just doesn't apply to me but no way for her to know that.

On January 26 2015 13:04 Eden1892 wrote:
Coming-down-Magic was fun but not for why you'd think it would be.

Anyway I am back and I ?hope? of sound mind and judgment.

I feel like my liancourt read was still pretty coherent. Maybe not in execu-- no, definitely not in execution, but at least in the logic. Let me try to explain it with a little more clarity of mind.

My play style was different from both games he's seen from me, and I was mafia in one and town in the other. At the very least he's obscuring the truth by citing Imperial as the inspiration for his read without making any mention of the fact that my play is different from the time he saw me play mafiasided. I feel like a townie would make mention of this and try to give the other player a fair shake instead of simply going "different from this town game therefore mafia!" while ignoring the equally-important "different from this mafia game therefore ???"

I also kinda felt like it was a cheap shot trying this kind of obscurantist read while I wasn't quite at full mental capacity, but to be fair it's not his fault that I decided to try new alcohol right before he gave his reads. Idk maybe it's unfair to hold that to him, but I felt like it was more sinister than a misunderstanding or error.

I'm gonna go reread but off the top of my head, I have the impression that Toad was town for a particular sequence of decisions: (1) intro post kickstarting discussion into (2) repeated attempts to question/probe other players for their positions while (3) demanding more scrutiny onto himself from other players. Mafia can emulate (1) just fine and regularly do (which is why I just called him a chill dude instead of something alignment-indicative), mafia have a harder time with (2) and especially with (3) - (2) because they struggle to get into a townie mindset and ask questions that make sense / are going somewhere (although it's not a huge struggle, it still requires effort, which is a harder threshold to achieve than you'd think), and (3) because they don't know whether or not they're actually being suspicious/not doing enough to be townread, and so daring people not to townread them so hard/so quickly can come off as tone-deaf with regard to how much a townie should suspect someone and backfire badly. (Imagine the sequence: "Why don't you suspect me?" "Why should I?" "...shouldn't you?" It would clearly indicate a guilty conscience on the part of the first speaker, which wouldn't automatically exist with a townie. Naturally it would never be that obvious, but you get the idea behind it.)

None of this is to say that he strictly speaking couldn't do any of what he's done as mafia, but that I think it would be far more likely for him to do it as town. So he's town.

I also feel like GlowingBear was townie but I don't remember why. Maybe I'll know when I reread.

Robik is suspicious to me because I feel like he's not really been very genuine with his posts. I'll reread to see if I'm right about this, but I remember his post about why he voted for HTS, and his post against GB, and both of them seemed illegit. The HTS thing was probably a joke so eh, but he says "get rekt mafia scum" or whatever when arguing for a kill on GB and it's just like... no one says this. Not even Robik says this. C'mon man.

I forgot Onegu even posted so we could kill him too. Palmar as well until he posts

On January 14 2015 07:51 Eden1892 wrote:

I'll do it instead since SL apparently isn't in an explaining mood.

If lalalipop is mafia then the d2 wagons were mafia/mafia. Oatsmaster only went on a late tiebreaker -- Breshke switching off of lalalipop onto a 3rd party. If Breshke and lalalipop are partners, Breshke probably isn't on lalalipop in the first place and he's definitely not switching to a 3rd party and hoping for no vote switches; he's moving onto Oatsmaster to ensure his teammate gets saved or, alternatively, he's not moving to get that bus cred.

So Breshke's vote move makes no sense if lalalipop is mafia, ergo lalalipop is town

On January 27 2015 02:37 IAmRobik wrote:

WTF are you doing? You literally just said you think Palmar is town and now you're grilling him. Palmar will play the game when he wants to play the game and if he doesn't want to play the game then he'll sub or we'll lynch him

On January 22 2015 05:52 Koshi wrote:

I now lynch people I know will be though to read later over people that will be readable. Because I don't lynch enough scum D1.

On January 27 2015 04:13 Half the Sky wrote:


Yes.

Liancourt's town play in Carol (he was the veteran in that game) was a PERFECT example of this. He was criticised for not being convincing, he pissed away 4 cycles yelling at people his reads, particularly to lynch Holyflare but people ignored him. He was right but failed to be convincing.

On January 28 2015 00:35 Palmar wrote:

Yeah but I'm such a dear while I'm at it that it's ok.

On January 28 2015 01:23 GlowingBear wrote:


Yeah, that is a scum giving up.

Gg well played

On January 28 2015 08:20 Onegu wrote:
Ok can we talk about my liancourt case? Like since GB stepped off the cliff, and is most likely town doing the same shit I did. I think a liancourt lynch is best, followed by palmar, like getting it pointed out he didn't pollicy lynch someone in another game that martyred is a big red flag. Plus it is highly likely that liancourt is mafia and just wasn't around to hammer GB as he was sleeping because it was like 2am in Korea at the time i think.

On January 28 2015 10:24 VisceraEyes wrote:
Ehhhhh...I think I like this the most.

##Unvote
##Vote: liancourt

Palmar feel free to elaborate on your Toad read whenever you get the chance. If I agree with it I might reconsider - I'm historically bad at reading Toad, so meh.

On January 28 2015 13:10 Eden1892 wrote:
ugh please make it stop

this is like watching sandpaper scratch a chalkboard drying

On January 28 2015 22:16 Half the Sky wrote:
Robik has been doing less and less. Off the cuff, my issue with Robik is that he doesn't seem to have any other scum reads than GB.

On January 28 2015 09:26 Eden1892 wrote:
Wait hol up Palmar

What is case on Toad

On January 29 2015 07:09 Eden1892 wrote:
Ugh fuck it. I expect better from Palmar. We gave him a day, he had the beginnings of a case on Toad and then spammed the thread with "kill Toad" without actually attempting to convince people to kill Toad. If he's going to insist he's not trolling then I'm going to treat his play with appropriate seriousness.

##UNVOTE
##VOTE: Palmar

On January 28 2015 11:02 GlowingBear wrote:


Lian is probably town, why are you voting him again?

On January 29 2015 01:48 liancourt wrote:
does this mean i can't sleep?

On January 30 2015 08:21 Onegu wrote:




Here he is on the GB lynch after voting GB then Palmar.



Here he is saying he is leaning town on lian.





But notice between calling lian townie, he never mentions lian again before voting him. And gives no reason for voting lian.



When pushed he gives this BS reason







And now the unvote with no reason as lian gets close to being hammered.


And the rest of his filter is calling palmar scum.

On January 30 2015 08:49 Onegu wrote:



This is a lie you didn't follow up on it. The next time you mention him following up is when you call me scum for voteing him and my case. Then you make one more post saying you are between me and him. How the hell is that following up?

On January 30 2015 13:56 Onegu wrote:
Wtf are you talking about liancourt?

On January 29 2015 01:48 liancourt wrote:
does this mean i can't sleep?

On January 28 2015 13:41 liancourt wrote:


why are you so butt hurt? Did my ignoring you hurt your feelings so bad that you're acting childish like this? I'd like to play a game where we don't post petty insults at each other as much as the next man. I can play like a dick as I've previously shown in titanic d1 and last days of carol and nye. I've reverted to playing my original meta that I used in FFL, FFL2, and hearthstone because I actually enjoyed those games. I'm not being a dick here on purpose like i played in my latest 3 games, but why are you being a dick here? If you keep behaving like this I'll just vote myself or get replaced out. I'd actually like to play a game of wits instead a battle of dick smashing insults. Sure you can go aggressive but insulting and being bm is uncalled for. If you believe my ignoring you was bad mannered and it pissed you off I apologize, if you want to report me for ignoring you and you want to warrant a ban for it I'll take the ban. But if you want to play the game you need to get that prejudice lifted because it is doing you no good.

This is my playstyle. I reread like this and comment on a post i agree on. You can scrutinize criticize saying it's a bad way to play and what not but down right insulting it like this is shallow and childish. I would prefer you refrain from doing these kind of actions in the future.

Good day. I will come back tomorrow before deadline if i can wake up early enough.

3 people I'm willing to lynch today is

onegu > gb > toad

On January 29 2015 01:48 liancourt wrote:
does this mean i can't sleep?

On January 26 2015 09:06 liancourt wrote:
gb was joking and i too was joking

but since it's first day I'll tell you this.

toad claims no one can read him. From my experience a player that cannot be read by other players don't play very townie. They mostly joke around and troll but through many many games they do this so even vets know that even if they don't do anything townie like giving reads or pointing fingers the other players will just let him be. One prime example of this case is Alakaslam. Many of you playing will hopefully know how he plays. I pride myself on reading him correctly despite him using chupazi and hijole. It's because I've seen many of his games and know his slight meta change in different allignments.

However, I have no idea how this guy, Toad, plays when he is town or mafia, and he goes far as to say he is unreadable. Well that really scares me as a player. To me it's like he was saying, "Guys I'm not going to do anything townie so that's that, but read me as town."

On January 26 2015 09:27 liancourt wrote:


give me a reason to unvote. It's not like he has 3 votes on him so mafia can hammer

On January 26 2015 09:46 liancourt wrote:


You're saying you get townread whatever allignment you roll. is this the same as being unreadable? If you do townie things whichever allignment I wouldn't call that being unreadable. I'd call that being a good mafia player. I guess it depends on whether I agree with your reads or not. Even if your townie, if I don't agree with the reasoning you're prolly scum. Right now you haven't really done anything as of yet so it's prolly null

On January 27 2015 11:13 liancourt wrote:


The part where you HARD defend toad kinda looks familiar to a certain game I played with you...



HARD defending your partner lala.

There is literally no reason for town to HARD defend another town this detailed. Not sure if toad is his partner yet, but I'll keep my eyes open. Town should be scum hunting not hard defending other players. Everyone who has ever played mafia knows it's less stressful to call someone town than to call someone mafia. And eden here is doing the same thing calling me scum because I caught him and he is OMGUSing me like he did in new years.

On January 27 2015 12:35 liancourt wrote:


I agree with this part "palmar will play when he wants to play"

If he is indeed town he will give reads, good reads infact from the things i've seen in imperial. He was very right in that game, but got lynched anyway. But really this game he has been really...meh from the get go. His d1 in imperial was very decent and good and you could get town vibes off of him. This game...meh he just isn't interested in playing the game. Am I willing to wait for palmar to be interested in this game so he can actually figure out the game? i don't know, what he's the same on d2, we get nothing. From the teachings of koshi



There is no guarantee of palmar suddenly starting to play the game and he will prolly remain unreadable like this so I like a policy lynch on him, but I'd prefer eden because I have a scum read on him.

Lynchpool: eden > palmar.

On January 27 2015 12:53 liancourt wrote:


very accurate representation except i wasnt vet i only breadcrumbed vet so that they wouldnt shoot me. Well I'm not afking this game and just leaving my vote on eden. I intend to convinve town he's scum unless there are better cases that can sway me, but atm I don't see any except maybe a policy lynch on palmar, but he said he's posting a read so I'll wait for that.

On January 31 2015 09:35 Onegu wrote:
PALMAR GET THE FUCK IN HERE BEFORE YOU SLEEP OR I SWEAR ILL VOTE YOU. I KNOW YOU ARE AROUND. IF YOUR TOWN FIGURE HELP FIGURE THE GAME OUT. IF NOT JUST DO WHAT YOU ARE DOING.