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Imperial Mafia - Page 507

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12968 Posts
January 17 2015 15:36 GMT
#10121
On January 18 2015 00:34 Palmar wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 18 2015 00:29 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On January 18 2015 00:28 Palmar wrote:
On January 18 2015 00:26 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On January 18 2015 00:12 justanothertownie wrote:
On January 18 2015 00:11 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On January 18 2015 00:07 marvellosity wrote:
On January 18 2015 00:01 justanothertownie wrote:
On January 17 2015 23:59 marvellosity wrote:
On January 17 2015 23:57 justanothertownie wrote:
I wonder how many pages a townmarv would have gotten this game.

hopefully not more, hopefully less.

I am actually pretty serious about trying to tone down my posting as town, so I don't have to go through this kind of game again as mafia.

I was bound to be in enough trouble this game without trying to at least vomit filter length too :/

It seems like you are really aiming for that mislynch.

maybe. i think i can look very town without posting a lot when i am town though. i can't as mafia.

I think your push on Lazer at the end actually looked a lot like Townmarv. If you could copy that as scum before you're in mortal danger it'd actually be quite hard to discern your alignment.

You are telling me townmarv who is left alive by scum for some unknown reason constantly tunnels on the same lynchbaity player for the last days? No fucking way.

I'm not talking about the overall picture, he was obviously mafia for it. I just mean that the way he pushed his target there resembled townmarv.

It actually looked nothing like townmarv

What do you feel was different about it? It was a very concise point on why LM was scum.

Because by day 5 townmarv has actual reads to base things on.

He had been going after LM for a while. It was a continuation of that case, but much more concise and to the point than he had been before. I'm talking about the posts in a vacuum rather than considering it was D6 and all.
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36160 Posts
January 17 2015 15:36 GMT
#10122
Koshi made a great point in QT actually how i managed to paint myself into a corner by townreading everyone i should be townreading, leaving me with 3 scum by PoE who i kinda hadn't pushed at all.
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
Palmar
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Iceland22632 Posts
January 17 2015 15:36 GMT
#10123
like it looked like townmarv, had he did something like that on day 1.
Computer says mafia
Palmar
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Iceland22632 Posts
January 17 2015 15:37 GMT
#10124
On January 18 2015 00:36 marvellosity wrote:
Koshi made a great point in QT actually how i managed to paint myself into a corner by townreading everyone i should be townreading, leaving me with 3 scum by PoE who i kinda hadn't pushed at all.

Yes, didn't I try to force you into that position at one point?
Computer says mafia
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12968 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-01-17 15:38:19
January 17 2015 15:37 GMT
#10125
On January 18 2015 00:36 marvellosity wrote:
Koshi made a great point in QT actually how i managed to paint myself into a corner by townreading everyone i should be townreading, leaving me with 3 scum by PoE who i kinda hadn't pushed at all.

Yeah, I think your biggest flaw (other than not pushing your suspects as strongly) as scum is clearing people too quickly, but I guess you kind of have to since that's what you do as town.
marvellosity
Profile Joined January 2011
United Kingdom36160 Posts
January 17 2015 15:38 GMT
#10126
On January 18 2015 00:37 Palmar wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 18 2015 00:36 marvellosity wrote:
Koshi made a great point in QT actually how i managed to paint myself into a corner by townreading everyone i should be townreading, leaving me with 3 scum by PoE who i kinda hadn't pushed at all.

Yes, didn't I try to force you into that position at one point?

yes, you did, and it was essentially successful.

like there's a bunch of players i know (like you) and a bunch of players who townmarv should be reading as town, and then there's mafia I'm trying not to bus (If i bus Damdred, damdred dies), and... that leaves me with nothing.

you were right to do it
[15:15] <Palmar> and yes marv, you're a total hottie
Palmar
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Iceland22632 Posts
January 17 2015 15:40 GMT
#10127
On January 18 2015 00:37 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 18 2015 00:36 marvellosity wrote:
Koshi made a great point in QT actually how i managed to paint myself into a corner by townreading everyone i should be townreading, leaving me with 3 scum by PoE who i kinda hadn't pushed at all.

Yeah, I think your biggest flaw (other than not pushing your suspects as strongly) as scum is clearing people too quickly, but I guess you kind of have to since that's what you do as town.

yep he has to.

Marv will should win a scumteam a game. His job is to distract town for long enough to allow his team to sweep up. Most higher profile players need to take this role because in the end it will be obvious they are mafia.

The alternative option is sooo difficult to pull off.
Computer says mafia
Palmar
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Iceland22632 Posts
January 17 2015 15:40 GMT
#10128
and koshi was so spot on with that point in the QT.

You bastards shouldn't have killed koshi, he was my boy.
Computer says mafia
Holyflare
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United Kingdom30774 Posts
January 17 2015 16:04 GMT
#10129
On January 18 2015 00:40 Palmar wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 18 2015 00:37 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On January 18 2015 00:36 marvellosity wrote:
Koshi made a great point in QT actually how i managed to paint myself into a corner by townreading everyone i should be townreading, leaving me with 3 scum by PoE who i kinda hadn't pushed at all.

Yeah, I think your biggest flaw (other than not pushing your suspects as strongly) as scum is clearing people too quickly, but I guess you kind of have to since that's what you do as town.

yep he has to.

Marv will should win a scumteam a game. His job is to distract town for long enough to allow his team to sweep up. Most higher profile players need to take this role because in the end it will be obvious they are mafia.

The alternative option is sooo difficult to pull off.



Yuuuppp
justanothertownie
Profile Joined July 2013
16317 Posts
January 17 2015 16:06 GMT
#10130
On January 18 2015 00:27 Palmar wrote:
Also I don't understand why people are so resistant to advice. I am not a great mafia player, but I have played more than just about anyone here (maybe with VE as an exception). When I say shit, it's not because I like spouting random nonsense, it's because trial and error, in addition with what I learned from people who played before, has taught me that despite anecdotal evidence (hey look, this worked once), there are certain things that are generally good or bad to do. Some examples:

  • Don't voteswitch in the last few hours of the day. Have the lynch lined up at least 4 hours prior and an alternative in case the target goes balls to the walls town on us all.
  • Don't fakeclaim as town. Do your best to be a target for mafia if you're vanilla. Make them fear you to protect the blues. Don't try to wifom a shot out of them because it fucks with other townies even more.
  • Don't make associative reads. You do not know what the mafia wants to do, you're literally handing them weapons to use against you if you allow their actions to control your reads.
  • Don't use meta unless you absolutely know what you're doing. Generally only use meta on people you know extremely well, and only trust meta when it focuses on overall style, not specific things.


There's probably a ton more. I keep saying these things, and we keep failing on them.

I somewhat disagree with point 1 but it is situational.
justanothertownie
Profile Joined July 2013
16317 Posts
January 17 2015 16:08 GMT
#10131
Like if I have doubts about both wagons then I WILL push the scumread I am more confident on and I don't think that is wrong at all.
Palmar
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Iceland22632 Posts
January 17 2015 16:13 GMT
#10132
On January 18 2015 01:08 justanothertownie wrote:
Like if I have doubts about both wagons then I WILL push the scumread I am more confident on and I don't think that is wrong at all.

Sure, but you have to understand what you're losing.

I guess the main problem is people voting too late. Like there needs to be a compelling reason to actually votswitch. None of these I listed is a hard and fast rule, the problem is that everyone thinks they're the unique snowflake the rules don't apply to.

If you use hours 36-48 to decide the actual lynch, close to 100% of the people in town get to help make that choice. if you only use hours 44-48 to do it, you're cutting off a significant portion of town.

Back in the day, late deadlines (US deadlines), were much more common than they are now. And towns would sometimes impose "soft" deadlines on themselves to make sure you include everyone in the process. Basically "we're not changing the lynch after this unless there's a massively good reason to".
Computer says mafia
justanothertownie
Profile Joined July 2013
16317 Posts
January 17 2015 16:16 GMT
#10133
On January 18 2015 01:13 Palmar wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 18 2015 01:08 justanothertownie wrote:
Like if I have doubts about both wagons then I WILL push the scumread I am more confident on and I don't think that is wrong at all.

Sure, but you have to understand what you're losing.

I guess the main problem is people voting too late. Like there needs to be a compelling reason to actually votswitch. None of these I listed is a hard and fast rule, the problem is that everyone thinks they're the unique snowflake the rules don't apply to.

If you use hours 36-48 to decide the actual lynch, close to 100% of the people in town get to help make that choice. if you only use hours 44-48 to do it, you're cutting off a significant portion of town.

Back in the day, late deadlines (US deadlines), were much more common than they are now. And towns would sometimes impose "soft" deadlines on themselves to make sure you include everyone in the process. Basically "we're not changing the lynch after this unless there's a massively good reason to".

That's all really nice in theory but many people won't even defend themselves properly before it is really late. And the closer you get to the deadline the more obvious scum gets usually.
Koshi
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Belgium38797 Posts
January 17 2015 16:21 GMT
#10134
I am a big fan of voteswitches. It provides a lot of information for later days. Sometimes just even activity based.
I had a good night of sleep.
raynpelikoneet
Profile Joined April 2007
Finland43268 Posts
January 17 2015 16:49 GMT
#10135
On January 18 2015 01:06 justanothertownie wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 18 2015 00:27 Palmar wrote:
Also I don't understand why people are so resistant to advice. I am not a great mafia player, but I have played more than just about anyone here (maybe with VE as an exception). When I say shit, it's not because I like spouting random nonsense, it's because trial and error, in addition with what I learned from people who played before, has taught me that despite anecdotal evidence (hey look, this worked once), there are certain things that are generally good or bad to do. Some examples:

  • Don't voteswitch in the last few hours of the day. Have the lynch lined up at least 4 hours prior and an alternative in case the target goes balls to the walls town on us all.
  • Don't fakeclaim as town. Do your best to be a target for mafia if you're vanilla. Make them fear you to protect the blues. Don't try to wifom a shot out of them because it fucks with other townies even more.
  • Don't make associative reads. You do not know what the mafia wants to do, you're literally handing them weapons to use against you if you allow their actions to control your reads.
  • Don't use meta unless you absolutely know what you're doing. Generally only use meta on people you know extremely well, and only trust meta when it focuses on overall style, not specific things.


There's probably a ton more. I keep saying these things, and we keep failing on them.

I somewhat disagree with point 1 but it is situational.

I somewhat agree. People tend to not give any fucks until 10min to EOD which is awful and that's why Palmar has a point.
table for two on a tv tray
Damdred
Profile Joined July 2014
15669 Posts
January 17 2015 17:08 GMT
#10136
Palmar i'm sorry I really felt bad about lynching you out, and I actually read the games you posted for no reason but to do so lolz.

Palmar was the worst lynch of the game tbh.
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
January 17 2015 17:25 GMT
#10137
See what happens when a bunch of baddies lynch Geript. I am accepting apologies for your stupidity now.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12968 Posts
January 17 2015 17:26 GMT
#10138
On January 18 2015 02:25 geript wrote:
See what happens when a bunch of baddies lynch Geript. I am accepting apologies for your stupidity now.

I'm sorry Geript, I didn't know you were town!
geript
Profile Joined February 2013
10024 Posts
January 17 2015 17:27 GMT
#10139
On January 18 2015 02:25 geript wrote:
See what happens when a bunch of baddies lynch Geript. I am accepting apologies for your stupidity now.

Try again scumbag Artanis.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12968 Posts
January 17 2015 17:32 GMT
#10140
On January 18 2015 02:27 geript wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 18 2015 02:25 geript wrote:
See what happens when a bunch of baddies lynch Geript. I am accepting apologies for your stupidity now.

Try again scumbag Artanis.

I guess I can't apologize then
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