EPTWould like a coach if possible!
Also: Breshke - we meet again.
Campus Mafia (New/Newish Players Welcome)
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Elvis!
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Would like a coach if possible! Also: Breshke - we meet again. | ||
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I blame Blazinghand for getting too drunk on Halloween to start hosting today. | ||
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On question: Don't you mean 8pm CET? That'd be exactly the time theGDmeal starts :D . | ||
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His disputed post just seems so trolly, wanna see if he actually pulls through (which would be retarded as fuck - I'm not used to Superbia doing stuff that stupid), so I'll not go on the wagon yet. If he actually does that shit, holy moly he's gon get lynched. | ||
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On November 03 2014 11:37 KelsierSC wrote: There are other things to discuss outside of supers post Make an example | ||
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2 things 1. people will go ham on you if you talk about being newbie since it doesn't help town, you have to be certain about your reads as town. once is fine, just don't repeat. 2. on tunneling: look this and everything you will ever not know (in all of your life) up here: http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Main_Page | ||
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Don't have a real read on the others, since most of the fluff is either about superbia/sentinel "tunneling" and not reading the op correctly. I've seen people get blamed for not reading the op (loafery, the last newbie game which you were in as well) endlessly to no avail. Atm sentinel looks really strongly like a second loafery, since people are calling him scum for not reading everything properly. I'll still have a look at what sentinel proceeds to post. | ||
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Stop trying to make reasonable posts in the first pages happen. Its not gonna happen. Surely trolly behaviour is typically scum, because scum want to distract from something with it. Is he distracting from something? As long as he doesn't go full retard and fulfill his promise, I don't read him town/scum for that. His reaction is all that counts. | ||
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Mind I posted way into the night yesterda, when I couldn't really get my head around things. Will at least keep up with the thread until then and hunt all the scum! | ||
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On November 03 2014 23:16 LightningStrike wrote: After reading some people's posts about him it just seem like they basically saying he is just been trolling in the opening. and I checked Grackaroni and he seemed to not follow through about a strange answering why it was a strange vote. As I said I still a new player and trying to learn while playing. To the things in bold: So you changed your mind because of whom? A pink whale told you so, as a nda information? If not, please quote and give reasons, this just looks like "oh the mainstream is now doing something different, let's change wagons so we don't look suspicious. Also, stop pulling the newbie card 24/7. It's okay to be unsure about something, but don't ever blame things on you being newbie. This is just a spontaneous post on my way home and not the big promised post yet. I'll do that once I arrived. | ||
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On November 03 2014 13:06 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Trolling is distracting in its nature because people react and it creates a chaotic situation favorable to scum instead of everyone trying to find out who the scum is. You (and bat) I'd give you two towncred for your presence in the thread. You're both arguing your points (the motivations of kush, etc.), progressing logically, and incorporating new information as it comes up. That's pretty good town play and solid considering we're working with a single-digit number of actual game pages at this point. This doesn't incorporate into my read on batsnacks much (namely because he's one of my top two towns at this point), but I've frequently seen scum give themselves subconscious townie points by helping the mods since it looks like it's done in the name of clarity. Him offering the filters/important posts doesn't seem like scum covering themselves up though, because he's so active without the offerings, but if he drops off in later days it will be something I factor into my consideration. FF Null. Not sure if this is a joke but I kinda felt like he was jumping the gun here: Otherwise, nothing to report. bresh Null-town. Contributing where he can. He does bring up a good point here: But I think the wagon on Superbia isn't anything to be worried about if he is in fact town. A lot of people are simply waiting on him to show up and offer some new evidence, and if I like what I see when he wakes up, I'll drop my own vote as well. Grack I like his open-mindedness: but I would like to make note of his self-admission to trolling at the start of games. I'd rather wait and see what he does before making a decision. Elvis Null-scum. I don't really like his aversion to getting into the game: and particularly his aversion to the few points of discussion we have at this point: He calls the entire discussion fluff, and then summarizes the game up to that point. (For the record, and for the final time, I read everything properly, I just read the "random" part with a grain of salt because, again, I host rigged "random" games on a regular basis and my first instinct is to compare knowledge of this game with my own knowledge.) And it seems like he's nervous to get into the game, but also like he's trying to participate but avoid contributing, if that makes sense. Probably the scummiest out of the active players, but with a few lurkers left and with kush and Superbia leaving the thread, that's not saying much. so posting something trolly on the second page makes someone scummy, inflicts (apparently) massive amounts of chaos and confusion. Okay I guess. So we should be having ~5 scum caught already since a lot of people posted stuff like that on the first couple of pages. I would like to see your reaction now that Superbia showed what this was all about. You pushed Superbia a lot more serious than others and are yet to retract your vote. I still don't see Superbia's post as particularily scummy, apparently he's known for being a bit like that and I'd much rather say the people endlessly talking about his post did inflict more chaos than he did. Good thing people stopped doing that now. For me, you lean scum atm. Immaterial: I don't want to further repeat things that have been posted already, but supporting ff's "totally reasonable posts" that didn't have significance, pushing on Superbia for something he doesn't even know about, and mostly for something he isn't even sure if he understood. Then saying "It's trollish at the very least.", "He just dropped it and bailed" . This sounds so much like someone - wait a second - tunneling on Superbia? As already explained, he it was late in his country, about midnight, a reasonable time to go to bed. That's not what I call "dropped and bailed" . Saying "trollish at the very least" - so what is it? I don't see it being anything except trollish and mostly not alignment indicative. Now that he's explained himself, I'm looking forward to your posts. For me, you lean scum as well. Superbia: I'm not sure about your methods, but you got a slight read out of it so I guess it's fine. I agree with your read on Sentinel and am looking forward to more posts from your side. You look town. Chelsea: I'm not quite sure about your posts, you did feel good about your push and then realised it's not good enough and retracted it. Seems quite reasonable and townie, but I wanna see more on other people (which you want to talk about, which is good, not keeping with the bad wagon we had for a while) before I make a proper judgement. You lean town. Disgustingnameguy: Have him as a null read right now. Didn't do much productive or distracting. Last time I played with him he was quite a clever scum(not counting my short appereance in the other recent game), so I'll have a look what happens this time. Other people: Don't have time now, it's training time. Will comment on everyone else afterwards and more throughoutly as I then have the reactions of everyone to Superbia's reappereance. | ||
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On November 04 2014 04:19 Grackaroni wrote: I don't read Sentinel's posts the same way as you do. How was he the most serious person to push Superbia? He sheeped KSC's reasoning while stating that his read will change based on what Superbia posts tomorrow. He hasn't even posted since Superbia came back to thread (i.e. he couldn't retract his vote), so I don't understand how you came to this conclusion. I would like you not to turn words around in my mouth. I never said the most, I said a lot more than some others, since some people just were like "I like the case vote superbia". Also, not posting doesn't mean he hasn't seen it yet AND some people (I'm positively looking at you, chelsea) retracted when they realised it wasn't useful, BEFORE superbia even posted. Even if he really at that point didn't see it yet, he still had it at least until then, even though people agreed way beforehand that it's not a topic that will find us scum. Of course the scenario exists, where he posted his last post, went off, didn't look at anything until some time after superbia posted. But this is mafia, people usually read it a lot if they're clever, be it mafai (thanks superbia) or town. | ||
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On November 04 2014 05:50 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: The difference is that what Superbia did became central to our discussion. Hell, even my post about RNG-rigging could have been a similar reason to pressure vote me, although I was around to clear up the discussion while Superbia went to sleep. Well then even you say that your post was as trolly/chaotic as superbia's? A scum slip this early? | ||
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Why would town Elvis continue to mention that your post was trolling if he was trying to get people to discuss something else? That doesn't seem very sensible to me; it just refocuses discussion on the nature of your post. Sooooo in what way is saying that this is an unnecesarry topic bringing the focus back to it? Especially most of my posts were in a row and people didn't even have time to write something in between? | ||
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On November 03 2014 13:24 Breshke wrote: Elvis sentinel raises a good point. I want to kind of rephrase it as an actual question to you. You entered the thread saying you couldn't get a read off anyone because everyone was reading into a trolly post. Then in basically every single one of your following posts you continue to mention the superbia situation. Why didn't you try and guide the conversation towards something else instead of just letting us talk about something you thought was not very useful. I don't like that this post makes it seem like you arn't in the mindset to try and find peoples alignments from their posts and need someone to specifically point stuff out to you. This isn't what i remember you being like last game. See explanation below. On November 03 2014 11:42 Breshke wrote: I disagree with the superbia bandwagon and i know its early and votes can change but the amount of people that are voting him for such a small post are surprising. Elvis do you have no reads from the rest of the game even leaning town or scum? Immaterial could you explain to me why you think what superbia did makes him mafia? At that point, due to tiredness and not knowing what to say about people who are mostly talking about fluff, I didn't wanna give reads, because they would just have been really terrible gut feelings. Now that I had a little bit more information and mostly time to post stuff and think about stuff, I did post what I think of people. To add to that, I consider you leaning town this game, as you're 1. sheeping less than the last games. 2. have less contradictions. 3. don't make confusing posts and most importantly: 4. do ask relevant questions. You lean town. If I missed a question or if I'm still puzzling you, go and ask more. If not, let's go on! | ||
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So he begins with a vote on superbia. ... I don't even... Like how can you vote someone without giving reasoning. Ok, he later on gives reasoning after being asked multiple times, as he says "I have read chelsea's posts (and I wanna look town so I agree with the guy who people think is townie)" Then he's like, "wait a second, chelsea pulled his vote back. Time to pull mine back as well so I fit in again and don't look suspicious. Being mafai is so easy". Then he sees people going on about Immortal. Now guess what happens next. He calls someone fishy without reasoning what exactly is meant, why it is fishy, why that appears scummy or anything of importance. Generally, I am yet to see him post his own opinion that isn't basically copy-pasted from someone (especially chelsea), rephrased or wishy-washy (referring to his recent post on Immortal being "fishy"). I am yet to see his posts exceed 4 lines, and even those 4 lines don't ever have content. He just rephrases stuff and basically reposts others, and I'm yet to see anything productive from him. He doesn't even remotely try hunting scum For now, if he doesn't drastically change his playstyle or someone more definitive arrises, I view him as a mafia lurker. ##Vote LightningStrike . | ||
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(Blitz means lightning in German) | ||
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On November 04 2014 10:20 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: We had different motivations to same effects. I was trying to work out a way to help find scum by way of setup. He was trying to find scum by setting out a trap. Neither ended up working and ended up in disorder, his more than mine. Well, here are all the posts in your filter, in order, starting with #6 and ending with #10: + Show Spoiler + On November 03 2014 11:31 Elvis! wrote: As a note on Superbia: His disputed post just seems so trolly, wanna see if he actually pulls through (which would be retarded as fuck - I'm not used to Superbia doing stuff that stupid), so I'll not go on the wagon yet. If he actually does that shit, holy moly he's gon get lynched. On November 03 2014 11:32 Elvis! wrote: Also I can't get any reasonable townreads as of yet, since everyone is just reading into an obviously trolly post. On November 03 2014 11:33 Elvis! wrote: If superbia doesn't pull through we'll just have wasted a fuckton of time going after someone with like 2 posts. On November 03 2014 11:38 Elvis! wrote: Not wanting to sheep superbia, his post is really weird, just don't know if it's town weird or scum weird until he posts again Pretty much focused on Superbia, but also note that you call it an "obviously trolly post", and also say that if Superbia does nothing then the whole discussion is a waste of time. But then why perpetuate the discussion with five more posts in a row? You're filling a quarter of a page in a game where the volume of posting is low on a player who you deem irrelevant to events. Sooooo you know that was in the time span of 8 minutes, which I said earlier. Oh wow 5 small posts filling up a little bit of space, that didn't ever happen before. I only even mentioned it for 8 minutes, all the time saying I think it's unnesesarry to talk about. I don't even know how you try to pull my last one into this, where I ask Chelsea which targets are the most important right now, futherly getting the focus to something else. I don't even remotely get how you think this is me putting it into spotlight. Like 0 understanding of your reasoning. But as I just thought nothing more weird could happen Serejai appears with a post without anything that makes any sense: On November 04 2014 10:40 Serejai wrote: Fecal seems like someone who just went into mafia chat with Elvis and they just decided to start shifting the focus to a new townie after they realized it wasn't working on Superbia. Like I never even shifted any focus to Superbia. I tried getting people away from the Superbia wagon and onto something else. You're just straight up lying. Serejai officially either complete and utter donkey town or complete and utter donkey scum. This is even more donkey than loafery. | ||
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Will go to sleep now, don't know when I'll post again. Some time during uni tomorrow, ETA 12 hours. Will defo make a decently big post before EoD and some smaller ones before that. Maccaroni, so now that some people have posted opinions on several suspects, what's your: most scum / view on the recent posts. | ||
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You are specifically scum reading sentinel because you don't agree with the Superbia case and you think he was pushing it harder than others correct? One point what I thought was scummy was exactly what you said. To be fair, some of this push was to pressure to get him to answer. I couldn't know that he didn't have time to answer / retract the vote, so I thought him not posting again is intentional and strenghening the power if his push. It might still be, mafai can lie about not having time, but atm my leaning scum read is more based on ff's push, since he also did after all retract his vote (which doesn't mean too much, considering noone else is voting on him anymore). | ||
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On November 04 2014 22:16 Serejai wrote: Either Sentinel is scum or Elvis+Fecal are scum. Still leaning Elvis because of how much he contradicts himself. Starts off calling out Superbia because "Surely trolly behaviour is typically scum". Then once Sentinel says the same thing, Elvis suddenly flip-flops and says "so posting something trolly on the second page makes someone scummy... Okay I guess." in sarcasm and proceeds to call Sentinel scum. I come into the game with a troll post as well and, once again, Elvis does a complete flip-flip and suddenly trolling = obvious scum again. Don't know how you guys play online mafia but this is pretty cut and dry mafia play for IRL games. I would put Bresh, Grack, and Sentinel as town at the moment because they're the only ones that seem to notice some of the sketchy posting by Elvis. Lightning is null to me; he may post scummy but surely if he were mafia his teammates would step in and help improve his posting - unless they are intentionally trying to throw him under the bus. If Lightning gets lynched and turns town we should probably look at the people who were pushing for him (coincidentally Elvis is at the top of that list). I don't think you even read what I'm writing. On November 03 2014 11:51 Elvis! wrote: Surely trolly behaviour is typically scum, because scum want to distract from something with it. Is he distracting from something? As long as he doesn't go full retard and fulfill his promise, I don't read him town/scum for that. His reaction is all that counts. You say I call Superbia out. In the very post you quote me on I say I don't read him as scum since it's not him distracting people. I always stayed with my opinion of not calling Superbia scum. No flip-flop happened. Straight up lies. When exactly do I flip-flop on you? I can see why you didn't qoute me on it because there is nothing. Trolling can be different and trolling on the second page is a bit different than what you're doing. If you want me to further elaborate on that I can. Again straight up lies. I don't even wanna start on how IRL mafia barely relates to a lot of things in forum mafia. Also I just don't see the connection here. Sooooo you define town solely on people who are "detecting my sketchy play". Yes, detecting sketchy play and thus hunting scum is what town does. But there has been sketchy play by quite some people - especially by straight up lying. So because you tunnel me, any scummy play by people who aren't me is irrelevant to you apparently. Why don't you define town by them being useful in catching scum. They can and are supposed to question everyone's play including mine, but you can't define town by them tunneling on the same guy as you . I especially dislike you sheeping Lightning here. Saying his play is scummy but you rate him null because of what reason? Because his partner would tell him to not post something stupid? Why didn't you tell him then, since for me you two are scum here. This is one of the weirdest sheeping going on I have seen in a while and with that a major scumslip . Please other people give intel on who of these two to lynch first. Atm I'm on ##Vote Serejai | ||
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formatting ##Unvote LightningStrike ##Vote Serejai Then @LightningStrike Please show where exactly I have changed my view a lot. I haven't. Apart from changing one's mind in the game of mafia being a perfectly normal thing as with new information comes new intel. | ||
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Also "It screams scum since sentinel and me are townie". That doesn't even remotely make sense. I consider you and serejai scum and sentinel null/leaning scum. Why would I not post about the people I think are scum? Why would hunting scum be scummy? You guys. | ||
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On November 04 2014 23:42 LightningStrike wrote: First you start off saying this .Then you quickly shifterd to this like 2 of your posts later Saying his reaction is all that counts is fishy as someone trying to defend their fellow scum Then when everyone was talking about Sentinel you quickly changed the target to me in this post You got scum all over you now in my eyes due to those posts. So I start of by saying I'm not calling him scum for his trolly post and that I'm waiting for how he follows it up, since his trolly post alone doesn't have any meaning . Then I go on and elaborate a little bit on that, not contradicting myself at all. Waiting for his reaction is natural here, since most of the information is missing at that point and his initial post is only relevant if he follows it up in a matter that I state in the first thing you qoute me on. Then, town is supposed to post reads on people so they can discuss them. I posted reads on the persons I find relevant or was asked to post about. . This post is basically just OMGUS, manifesting my opinion about you being scum. No reasoning, lies, turning words around, not even reading my posts properly, not showing scum indicators and basically just calling me scum for calling you scum. You actually even phrase it that way, saying I'm scum for calling you scum. If your recent posts aren't scumslips I don't know what is. | ||
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On November 05 2014 03:37 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Who do you think is mafia? Vote for them and make a case. Do you still think Elvis is scum? I like this post from Sentinel as much as I dislike Serejai's post he quoted. Which is a lot. Serejai's post rephrased: "I wanna vote on someone who isn't mafia and who noone can fault me for voting. Also I really really don't want to die." I get disgusted by the idea of rather voting for someone noone has a read on and who is gonna get modkilled/replaced rather than for someone you think is mafia. Then shortly after this post by sentinel serejai makes a really weak case of Immaterial. I will rephrase that one as well: "I think he's a noob. He pulls the newbie card a couple of times and then makes a long post. This totally indicates mafai! Thus he must be mafai!" Obviously Immaterial is the perfect target since noone has much of an idea of his alignment, he isn't crazily active and noone will fault you for seeing sketchy play in a newcomer (except me, because of your situation). Note that this is not a comment on Immaterial or his post. (!!!) Serejai, please elaborate why making a big post "without much content" (which you say yourself(!!!)) takes a lot more "skill" than pulling the newbie card. Everyone can make big posts. A lot of his post isn't work someone who plays mafia for longer than you think he does. Of course this can be WIFOM and the mafia can tell him to make it look newbie big post if we wanna go by your weird theory. But in no way is this a scum indicator. this is purely you trying to "seem legitimate" by "making a case" after you have been pressured by Sentinel to do so. A townie doesn't care about getting lynched. I know tunneling isn't a good thing and I've been talking a lot about how scum Serejai is, but this really sounds like a last ditch effort to not get lynched. Also: I've posted my insight into most people very recently. Since I'm confident with my push I obviously posted more about that, than about persons I think are null/town. I don't think posting about who is town in big detail is useful. So I instead only post about scum, and since there's a lot to say about Serejai, I post a lot about him. Why I like Sentinels post here? He reflects my idea of solely focussing on finding scum and posting about them. He pushes Jeresai to make uncomfortable statements, which are statements we can read a lot from. | ||
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After the first one exposes himself deeper and deeper with more lies and weird posts, the second just takes the comfortable route and votes for someone noone has a read of. This makes so much sense as townie. ... ... ... ... not. | ||
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Right now I give Serejai a little more scum points than lightning. Would totally be up to just kill Serejai tomorrow then. | ||
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[B] ##Unvote ##Vote LightningStrike [B/] | ||
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##Unvote ##Vote LightningStrike | ||
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##Vote Serejai The wagon seems good, but I can't leave my gut feeling with Sere at this point. Let's get this wagon to go on him instead. I will still start a wagon on Lightning as soon as this day ends, I promise. We will get him lynched eventually | ||
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First OMGUS now fake-claim. | ||
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From Mafiascum wiki The Tracker learns who a player targeted, but not what action that player performed. The Watcher learns who targeted a player, but not what actions were performed on them. There is a difference. Stop arguing about what role is which, he claimed and we have some lynch targets. It's EoD, talk about why people are scum and not the setup | ||
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So we have Serejai - caught a lot of times for lying etc. - anyone can read my posts on him. I'm still confident he's scum. Lightning - is being ridiculous and also lied quite some. He seems really confused and newbie. Most likely donkey scum. Sentinel - is being up and down with his posts, I don't know right now tbh. Would rather lynch someone who I'm sure about, which is why I have my vote on Serejai. Kush - was absent and now is being weird. And calling stuff out. Immaterial - just voted on someone even though he says he hasn't read thread. | ||
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http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/469857-campus-mafia-new-newish-players-welcome?page=22#439 http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/469857-campus-mafia-new-newish-players-welcome?page=26#513 | ||
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A lot of people said earlier they were up for a Serejai lynch or liked it in some way. Since the LS cop thing can be discussed for hours and apparently people aren't sure of him, I'm hereby telling people to vote for whom they think are scum. Leave the thread for 5 minutes, turn the music off, think in silence and come back with a proper idea. Atm people are just going ham about the cop claim, I don't like it. If he is the real cop (which I don't think so) this is still just WIFOM. There is no proper answer to the dilemma guys. | ||
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Guys vote for scum, don't fucking go ham about the cop thing we can't solve it now! We can later!! Focus on EoD, everyone, not the cop-WIFOM-Claim-Counterclaim-Dilemma | ||
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Why are we not talking about lynching scum?! | ||
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Also your playstyle throughout all of the ay wasn't townie at all, so why would people believe you. | ||
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Why, world, why do get people that don't post more than 3 lines a power role. | ||
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Bresh has similair feelings about me in that game prolly. | ||
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This is a desaster. | ||
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For all of the game he didn't look like a powerrole at all, so I don't think things like "I told you guys he's not scum" are relevant. | ||
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Also, how did the cop thing influence much he didn't have any reasonable reads or anything. How is it important that he was cop before we actually knew anything? It crazily much sounded like a last-minute-I-don't-wanna-die fakeclaim. | ||
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"You've got my vote regardless of what happens" so in 72 hours there is nothing that can change his mind. This is about as un-townie and lying as you can get. | ||
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On November 05 2014 08:17 sicklucker wrote: Your right I made a mistake thought both you and bats changed your votes to Serejai after KelsierSC shenanigans. Your off my scum list im taking in alot of info in a short time my bad. still not quite right, I was the one to make a push on Serejai and I kept it for a loooong time, only went for LS for 5 minutes, then went back. | ||
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Thank you for this post. There's so much chaos and seriously there has been more talk just on EoD than anything at all before which is just ridiculous. Plus most of this talk has been chaotic, non-analytic, liwurhgoaiefgzazbgoazerg7ang7z kind of spammy talk, which is not the talk I excel in at all. But back to your actual follow-up to the question: First of all, I don't know if I can recall my mindset correctly since now my mind is just full of shit of counter-claiming shenanigans before EoD and wtf. But as far as I recall I thought Sentinel was being weird in general (don't know anymore exactly why I'm sorry) and I found it weird that he didn't take back his vote after people started to do so (before superbia's post). This is just for the sake of answering your question though, since my read as example on sentinel is really unclear now, as I need to try and filter what all of this chaos on EoD was all about. I seriously barely have any idea where anyone stands after that shitfest. People who were really confident in their drawn-out reads of before suddenly started going on stuff that doesn't make sense, noone tells people why they are doing stuff, noone proves anything, I don't even know if I can take most of it seriously. | ||
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Before his claim this LS guy was someone noone really trusted/supported and he was bringing a lot of ridiculous stuff to get people not to vote him. Suddenly he claims and all of a sudden, people who had an agenda against him suddenly believe him / vote on him more and fucking counterclaim. There was no reasoning at all to believe him in the first place as most of the stuff he posted before were chaotic, non-townie things, even lying here and there. But masses start believing and now they claim they knew he's right without any base at all to do so . Please people give me reasons based on LS posts before his claim why you believed his claim / are defending him etc. . Obviously his claim was right, but that wasn't even remotely understandable at that point. We really need to sort out this chaos, I think talking about why people believed LS is a good start. | ||
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I just thought of it to be a last ditch effort to not get lynched. All of you see this very technical with needing a counter-claim, but why couldn't someone just fakeclaim being cop? Why does the real cop need to out himself or anyone? Why can people not be like "well, I don't think he's cop, so his claiming is irrelevant. Like he suddenly went from someone noone believed to a fuckin saint by claiming. Claiming! Someone who posted actual lies repeatedly before and never contributed anything of worth! Why did people believe his claim? | ||
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Obviously he was right, but I don't see anyone having any actually good information about why his claim would be correct. | ||
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On November 05 2014 09:34 Grackaroni wrote: I believed LS prior to even learning about a claim because he was eager to share his opinion despite the fact that people were burying him for writing posts that don't make sense. I could see that he was actually trying to give his opinion; it's just that his opinion was always a summary of what somebody else had posted. I feel Mafia would try to blend more - which is why I think Immaterial would have been a better lynch. I didn't like Immaterial's initial vote and after that he wrote out a long post with no real content in it and disappeared. In that long post Immaterial seemed more interested in showing to everybody that he was thinking about the game (he included all of his thought processes for each of his reads even when they led to no conclusion whatsoever) while LS just said whatever he was thinking at the time. How can you blend in more than posting stuff other people posted? | ||
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On November 05 2014 09:52 Fecalfeast wrote: A mafia who claims cop literally puts themselves on a death clock I don't think so. Why would it come out that he's not the real cop? There can always be docs / roleblockers messing up actually confirming someone town. Educate me why it's like apparently impossible to fakeclaim cop in your opinion, even though it's a thing mafia are usually known to do every now and then | ||
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On November 05 2014 09:53 Grackaroni wrote: that was his thought process though. People called him out for his posts and he kept doing the same thing. Just look at the frequency he posted compared to Immaterial. He seemed eager to give his opinion while Immaterial did not. This was his thought process is just being WIFOM. You can't know.Keeping to do the same worthless 3-4 liners is not town behaviour. You can't be serious and say he tried just because he had many posts, his posts were reposts and short and without any proof and like holy fuck how can you defend that. Why are you defending him so much? | ||
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On November 05 2014 10:28 Grackaroni wrote: This is a townie post. A lot of his posts are quite townie really. Don't lynch this guy. This is a trolly post. How is this alignment indicative. Why are you being so weird. Maybe we'll lynch this guy? | ||
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I don't like how you discredit my whole post to "one post at the beginning" . The post mostly wasn't even about something at the beginning, but about his reaction and lies. My vote was on serejai since he was the guy I thought to be scum, which I thought was pretty obvious. Also people were switching left right and center and not much before EoD people were all up for lynching him. Didn't see a reason to vote for the others instead, since at that point I thought ok one guy is fakeclaiming and another guy is suddenly being pushed based on a not well funded push that I don't support that much. Why would I change in that case? It didn't need many to change to what I thought was a better case. Why am I asking why he's defending? Since this guy flipped town now everyone is sheeping everything he has ever done. I don't get this at all. About LS: Please, someone be reasonable and actually post stuff he made that wasn't null or scum. Please, someone be reasonable and actually post more information on why he couldn't have just fakeclaimed. At this point the only reason I see is that he might come in a weird situation in lylo if all our powerroles play well and a lot of stuff happens that isn't forced to happen. Imagine this: He would have been scum, faceclaimed, we would have lynched someone else, everyone would have sheeped him like they did and how they are now (why wouldn't they), scum would, since town is reacting in this way, basically have a confirmed townie among their lines. Even if people wouldn't have sheeped him as much as they are now this would be a desaster for town and really good for scum. Why are scenarios like this less possible than the other ones. I'm not convinced at all about all the things people are saying about LS. People kept pointing out all his mistakes and scummy posts before and now he's suddenly considered a god amongst people. I only see a lot of people that could be scum earn town cred right nowfor sheeping him and talking about how he was town, why we shouldn't have voted for him and so on. No risk, easy town points for our opponents. I don't have a good feeling about this. On immaterial: Breshke, I posted my opinion about him not much before the lynch. Also: At the moment most my reads are thrown around by the shitpile of 20 pages of EoD posts which are chaotic as fuck since people just posted impulsive and wanting to convince people, posted stuff about if detective is cop and so on. There is a lot to read and a lot fewer that has reasonable content. I'll try to go through this tomorrow and find what I think of it. Then Chelseas actual CC: I agree it's a measure that can be done and it's ok and everything but there is no reason to pull back so late. Also you can't really fault batsnacks for not switching in these 3 minutes, since he was playing on a phone. I have played mafia on a phone before and it's a desaster, stuff takes ages to load and post and go through pages (which were plenty). Keeping up with the time and what everyone is posting is really fuckin shit on such a device. You did say it wasn't optimal tho so I guess it's fine. Saying you're doing it beause of shenanigans makes it kinda weird and I don't know why someone would be serious about CCing and then say it's shenanigans and confuse people in such a time but I guess that's Chelsea? Will look into him at some point, atm he's null for me. As example the CC would also have been a really good scum strat, since it puts attention back to the first person claiming and would have made lynching him easier. Pulling back a CC only 3 minutes before the countdown seems quite the perfect time to go and say it's not real, since if he would have pulled through and the guy flips cop this looks really scummy. Well played, Chelsea scum or weirdly played out, weird town Chelsea? I don't know at this point. | ||
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I don't give a shit if we lynched all our power roles by the end as long as we lynch more scum by doing so. There is only 3 scum to kill, we will get a huge amount of information out of killing scum and a million more reasons to risk a lot to kill scum. We have to risk a lot to kill scum, but that's fine. I just don't think any power role can ever outweight potentially lynching scum. | ||
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On November 05 2014 09:34 Elvis! wrote: Anyone could just claim anything! Obviously he was right, but I don't see anyone having any actually good information about why his claim would be correct. I did state that I know now that was was indeed cop Breshke. | ||
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I know that you were one of the people who believed him beforehand. As I stated I don't think your reasoning you had is valid at all, since his actions have never been townie or helped town in any way, since he never put much effort into them, making a lot of 3-4 liners is not difficult, doesn't show someone being active or trying. So I'm accusing you less of defending him now (still a bit since you stick to your read and defended a bit more) and more of defending him in the first place. His play didn't warrant him being rated anything better than null | ||
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On November 05 2014 12:50 Elvis! wrote: And an actual lynch is what we're hitting for in this game. We're not hitting for trying to avoid hitting townies, we're hunting scum. I don't think you're scum by this post but your opinion on what to lynch is really strange to me. I don't give a shit if we lynched all our power roles by the end as long as we lynch more scum by doing so. There is only 3 scum to kill, we will get a huge amount of information out of killing scum and a million more reasons to risk a lot to kill scum. We have to risk a lot to kill scum, but that's fine. I just don't think any power role can ever outweight potentially lynching scum. EBWOP We're not hitting for trying to avoid power roles. | ||
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Why would people believe someone they think of as being scum or at most null? In a normal situation, with a normal player, yes, maybe mislynching a not-cc'd cop is terrible and not a risk I would take. You are right on that and also thank you for actually making a good post about it that helped me understand more why it's important Grack. Since you (now sicklucker) emphasized how this is your first game, (to be disregarded by everyone except sicklucker since it's unnecesarry information for you) + Show Spoiler + this is my second one and on my first one I only survived one day since town mislynched me for reasons they themselves called not valid afterwards, while my coach said I was playing well and acting really townie. It's not like I've had this situation before, only read a lot about mafia and in this case of LS I don't see his cop-claim being something we should trust and not a good plan for scum, see reasons above. | ||
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[B]On November 05 2014 12:36 Elvis! wrote: Also you can't really fault batsnacks for not switching in these 3 minutes, since he was playing on a phone. I have played mafia on a phone before and it's a desaster, stuff takes ages to load and post and go through pages (which were plenty). Keeping up with the time and what everyone is posting is really fuckin shit on such a device. Please, if you quote me and try to point out things, quote me correctly. Yes, he did change his vote, but as he already said, he didn't know the vote count at that time, since it's terrible finding something like this if there's like 10 posts per minute and you're on a phone. Scumslips don't happen, don't try to force them you keep pointing out that your list from the very start was right. This isn't any good in mafia, since you want to be flexible and view everyone as possible scum/town, which you're not doing. You are just relying on your list and you try hard to find andthing scummy within it . I don't think this is a good way to play this game, especially after so much has been going on recently. So, please also post your opinions on others AFTER this whole desaster, since there is a lot to read into. | ||
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Like I know it's difficult to keep up with a phone and I know stuff was really chaotic at the time with votes being thrown around. I don't really think he's to blame for LS dieing since there were a lot of people who could have turned things, not only him, while some people like me didn't even have the same grasp of LS having to be saved at the time, since everyone was going ham. I like that people are trying to figure out who new scum teams are tho, but so far it's only wild speculation. Will join in on all of this later when I have more time, gotta do some uni-work now. This will likely not be much before EoN. | ||
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Why blame people who stayed on the vote etc. and not kelsier for making people change their vote back to the cop? He is the one conceiving people here, let's blame the conceiver and not the conceived. These posts by Serejai would make a lot of sense if he and Kelsier would be a scum team. Kelsier making people vote on the cop, not retrieving his CC in time and having a shitty excuse, Serejai blaming people who followed him but kinda sheeping Kelsier even though his actions were easily a lot more controversial. | ||
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Also as an example his list: On November 06 2014 08:13 Serejai wrote: Immaterial - My choice for a lynch today because of what played out last night and his general scummy behavior prior to that. I feel that we will learn the most from lynching him. Elvis - Scum, but lynching him wouldn't really give any clues as to who the other scum are. Batsnacks - Same as Elvis. Fecal - Still leaning scum, but far less than I was yesterday. Immaterial has taken over his spot for me. kush - Still leaning scum, but he's at the bottom of my list and has been AFK so much there's really no good way to read him. Bresh - Formerly town, now I'm null on him. sicklucker - null, but leaning slightly town. Hasn't been here long enough to really get a good read. Kelsier - was null, now leaning scum. His fake CC last night could very easily have been a scum move. Once Lightning claimed cop and votes started moving off him, Kelsier could have really wanted the cop dead and as such used a fake CC to get votes back on Lightning. After all, Lightning was kind of bumbling around already so it wouldn't have been hard to paint him as a liar. Then, at the last minute Keslier rescinds his fake CC. Cop still gets lynched and Kelsier is cleared of any wrongdoing. As scum, this would actually have been a pretty safe play for him; he would know Lightning was telling the truth so there would be nobody to dispute his fake CC. Superbia - With Grack gone, this is my only real town read at the moment and I'm not sure how strong it is since he's not overly active in the thread. Sentinel - Thought he was town at first, then he started acting scummy... now I feel like he's null but leaning town, and the reason he seems scummy is because he's just a bad player. Seems like scum wanting to look productive. Look at each and every one of his posts. Non are commital, non are new, none have proof and the only one that is a little bit bigger and more legit is the one at kelsier - the person he really doesn't want to lynch and keeps sheeping/ignoring in his recent posts. Also his post on kelsier is pretty much copy-pasted from posts people have made about kelsier previously. Mafia loves making these lists as mentioned in multiple mafia guides etc. and this is a prime example for a mafia list. All the points are wishy-washy and there is not use for town on this list. For now: ##Vote Serejai Of course this vote is subject to change, a lot of people have barely posted since the EoD. To these people: please post your opinions on: Kelsier and his weird late CC-pullback Serejai and his posts about who he thinks is mafia and his sheeping of Kelsier. How much connection there is between the two. Sicklucker and his post about it should have been him or Grack that should have been killed. A little idea about him I have that this is not coincidence and he might be mafai. only minor lean tho so far. Kush and his hiding. Wether or not you think Immaterial is scum. I know it's a big list, but people haven't talked! Let's discuss and find scum, town! | ||
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You posted about how Immaterial might not be at fault and I mistakenly put you in the wrong basket. | ||
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Kush has been really non-posting for almost all of the game, he has barely any and as he said has a vote he didn't evne really warrant for. Also that post by sicklucker is like wtf are you doing there randomly claiming people are scummy based on single posts. | ||
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01:10 Sicklucker: Thinks very highly of himself since he posts multiple times that he is the one that should be NK. Posts he wouldn't lynch Kelsier even if he knew 100% he was scum. Defends Kelsiers CC and late pullback. He gives really wishy-washy reasons to why he thinks Kelsier is town. Kelsier and Sicklucker mafia together? He pushes on Sentinel for (his own reasoning) posting a lot earlier and not anymore. That's not a mafia indicator, that's just him not posting, like kush and immaterial and a lot others. He also defends kush later for not posting, which makes no sense since for him it's a scumtell. He says him and Sentinel are not aligned because Sentinel could just have relied on him getting modkilled. That's nothing you can rely on. He supports his vote on Sentinel because Sentinel and him are on his weak theory " like 0% aligned". He even mentions that Sentinel might be going under the radar because he's a role. So he wants to lynch a possible role? He wants to rather vote on inactives than people he thinks are mafia, because he thinks there's a "higher rng" to kill them then to kill people he thinks are mafia. Why not make a proper case on somebody and convince people of his vote? If he just goes after the inactive we can only lose since there's a lot of them. We don't have many jokers left since we lost 2 town already. So it's very important to get scum and not just get to lynch basically anyone. He wants to lynch the people where he can get a push through, not mafia. He reads Breshke(?) scum because of tunneling someone who the person thinks is scum. If as town you are convinced of your vote, sticking with it and wanting to convince people of it isn't wrong. This is how you pressure scum and maybe get a scum lynch. How else is it supposed to be? He has a good find on Grack--> kush at the end where grack says sometimes kush doesn't do much as town, too. I generally don't like him and Serejai being so focused on single things of people. They keep posting about things that have already been explained and are of no use to elaborate further upon, e.g. : Batsnacks and the phone-posting-revoting-dilemma. Me voting on the guy I find scummy: Serejai. Serejai says I'm still tunneling when he proudly keeps saying every couple of posts how good he is for still having the same scum targets as he had from the beginning. Why am I scummy/wrong for this? Serejai also never answers my posts about him seriously. When I point out his lies/misconceptions he just ignores it and so do a lot of people. Then I get discredited for things I didn't say, blamed for having the same opinion about you, sicklucker, as a person you think is scummy (which totally makes me scum - not) and you just disregard everything I post because you disagree with it. Then Serejai calls me scummy for not posting things of worth. Well I guess if you disregard everything I post about you, the lynch, the cop-cc-dilemma, Kelsier, Immaterial, sicklucker and you, well there's not much left. Then if you look, there is 4 people who are riding a similair wagon at the moment - KSC, Breshke, sicklucker and Serejai- I think either KSC or Breshke (more likely Breshke) is the deceived and the other 3 are scum, since these 4 people are constantly posting how right each other is, pushing the same targets, defending the same people (as example KSC and Kush being defended for no reason). They want town to think that these are not only the popular but the right opinions - which lots of them have been unproven, false, not logical and weird. Kush isn't looking townie, Kelsiers late un-cc is in no way reasonable or good for town, it's not logical just lynching people because of RNG on AFKers and it isn't warrantable to just hide lies people posted by overposting on different stuff. Look at them only pointing out very few mistakes of each other, only pushing very slighty and really making pushes on other persons 24/7. Also mostly the same persons. They just jump on anything these persons post and somehow try reading something scummy into it. A point I would like to raise is that they kept talking about some problems for ages even though they were answered and blame people adressing something else for more than a couple of posts. This is applying double standards in no reasonable way at all. Of course some points apply more to certain persons than to others. As a prime example of this I see Breshke posting he agrees 100% with sicklucker about a post that mostly (as sicklucker later admitted) consisted of misconseptions and wrong facts. This is blind obedience in my eyes. He didn't even really read what sicklucker was writing and sicklucker wasn't really researching what he was posting about. Mafia chat (possibly): "Hey, I'll make a post about why elvis and breshke are scum with something I can find that lines them up so that town follows me and we can maybe mislynch one of them. Just agree to it and make me look townie." Breshke - someone I had a townie view on before, now he leans scum - as example posted that bats and I "could have saved the cop but didn't" and then defends that Immaterial didn't change his vote, because that's difficult in the heat of the moment. Oh town really wasn't in the heat of the moment WITH A BIT MORE THAN 2 MINUTES LEFT IF YOU REFRESHED THE PAGE AT THE RIGHT TIME. That just doesn't make sense and is again applying double standards to people scum wants to mislynch and people they don't care about. Then Breshke defends KSC by saying "the same play I was gonna make". Except you didn't. Defending him like you did is just very weird because there is no other reason to defend him than him being your scumbuddy. There is nothing excusable about only pulling the cc back so late. Also this group uses Grack's posts sometimes similair as the Jehova's witnesses use the bible. "It is written here so it must be right". Not talking about religion here, but Grack sureley could have made misreads or mistakes. They just weren't scum-manipulated. Then Breshke's post that could really be both - he points out that people have been talking too much about the vote and not the surroundings - which is a good thing - if he wasn't talking all about the vote himself before that, mainly posting "everyone who didn't vote to save the cop are to blame" and sheeping KSC. Then mafia agreed to blame kush a bit, since he is an easy target once again, yes he hasn't posted in a long while, but that could be: A townie being afk because of real life issues. A scum being afk for the same reasons. A role not posting much to not get nightkilled. A scum not posting much, because scum hides. At that last point - wouldn't the other scum tell him to post so he doesn't look like that? I don't think it's a scumtell if someone doesn't post at all, scum knows what they wanna look like. This just turns it into WIFOM, which isn't a good reason to lynch someone, since he hasn't been posting scummy (since he hasn't been posting). Then Breshke keeps focusing on how KSC fake-ccing as scum would be terrible because they could just take care of the guy in night. Well or he's scum and has his scumbuddy's sheeping him the day after so they can get the town kill and someone else without any blame to put on anyone since the guy to blame is being sheeped by so many persons. If he didn't do it, who would be to blame/to mislynch on Day2? There would have been like 7 votes on LS, people would just agree that LS was donkey cop and noone would be to blame. Here they have the prime mislynch targets presented on the table. Easily to blame since they didn't pull back, no scum to identify since KSC "did pull back" and gets sheeped. Then Breshke all of a sudden blames sicklucker for something. What?! Oh wait it's just a number being 2 instead of 3 and this is a good opportunity to have people not think you're aligned with each other since you're not really blaming him and rather correcting him. Then Breshke says sicklucker shouldn't read kush town, for what reasons? Oh right he barely posts any. He only again mentions that kush doesn't do townie things, so for you he's scum. So if according to your arguments he's null (and you even mention why to you he could be town) and according to sicklucker he maybe is town, there's this much of a difference and that worries you that much? This again is either deceived/confused Breshke or manipulated-in-mafia-chat-Breshke. He also again applies double standards, I'm getting sick of this, Superbia is not to blame because his vote was seconds from counting. Oh bats was also for the same reason. You never mention that. Tunnel view/mislynch target much? Then Breshke repeats how Kush has done nothing for town and thus is scum. There still are the same amount of reasons for this as for others. Lynching someone who's null isn't a good thing, especially if we already lost 2 town. I know I'm applying double standards for the bats-me situation and the 4-people-3-scum situation as well, the reason being that I think they are connected in a much more scummy way (see above) and much less individual. I really don't know for sure about Breshke at this point since I tried reading his post town-aligned and mafia-aligned and kinda both make sense. Oh god I just looked at the current thread again and sicklucker - 21 before gametime already wants people to focus on one of 2 wagons? This is the time where we wanna think about everyone as possible scum or town. This is the time where we pressure people we think are scum for information. This is not the time where we vote on final stuff. This is really really weird. Like he posts that some vote has no chance of getting through even though we're still 21 hours off the time where it matters, or at least 20 until it's worth discussing. I realise that at the time of posting this one hour has passed. And ist 19/20. Still a terrible idea of him to do and reinforces my scumread on him. At the moment I read him scummier than Serejai and I will ##Unvote ##Vote sicklucker | ||
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I wrote it down in Onenote on my laptop and copy-pasted it. Also yes this is a long post, please take your time everyone and try reading it and understanding my point of view. As I said this is still early into the day and we have time to discuss. | ||
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On November 07 2014 11:12 sicklucker wrote: elvis writes "As a prime example of this I see Breshke posting he agrees 100% with sicklucker about a post that mostly (as sicklucker later admitted) consisted of misconseptions and wrong facts. This is blind obedience in my eyes. He didn't even really read what sicklucker was writing and sicklucker wasn't really researching what he was posting about" I got confused on this. I changed my train of thought twice. At first I came up with a line of thought. then I retracted It I thought I had it reversed. Then last I said nope my first one was correct. breshke agreed with my first post not my second or third so are logic was both right but I can see why your confused. My next post after that was something like "lol im a horrible town" Which very well maybe true because I confused the shit out of you. I think its funny you think me and Breshke are aligned we just went back and forth for the last 4 hours disagreeing with each other and if you click on my filter read my first post. Wow. This is a prime example of you not researching. Breshke was not agreeing on the post you're talking about but on the post you said about bats and me being aligned. | ||
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On November 05 2014 13:15 Breshke wrote: I agree 100% with sicklucker. I find the way sicklucker has enterd the game has been very good. I think if he was mafia coming into this game he wouldn't be so quick to give reads like this Sicklucker how many mafia do you think are in the final votes on LS? This post. | ||
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For now I'm staying on this. Let's see how this develops, she still is my place 2. | ||
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I'm just gonna try to avoid that you voted without having posted in an eternity <3 . | ||
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Kush come on get yourself to do something, please at least make town not waste time on voting/arguing about someone they have no read on like you. | ||
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I already posted it?! | ||
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So I'm scummy for aligning with people but I can't apply that to others? | ||
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Of course you're not being a obvious idiot and agreeing on everything how stupid do you think I think you are. | ||
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On November 07 2014 12:05 Elvis! wrote: "Anyway elvis heres where im at with you. Im trying so hard to see you as town but you seem to be aligning yourself with more scummy people then townie." So I'm scummy for aligning with people but I can't apply that to others? As example. This one is more for sicklucker. | ||
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On November 07 2014 10:47 Elvis! wrote: Freitag, 7. November 2014 01:10 Sicklucker: Thinks very highly of himself since he posts multiple times that he is the one that should be NK. Posts he wouldn't lynch Kelsier even if he knew 100% he was scum. Defends Kelsiers CC and late pullback. He gives really wishy-washy reasons to why he thinks Kelsier is town. Kelsier and Sicklucker mafia together? He pushes on Sentinel for (his own reasoning) posting a lot earlier and not anymore. That's not a mafia indicator, that's just him not posting, like kush and immaterial and a lot others. He also defends kush later for not posting, which makes no sense since for him it's a scumtell. He says him and Sentinel are not aligned because Sentinel could just have relied on him getting modkilled. That's nothing you can rely on. He supports his vote on Sentinel because Sentinel and him are on his weak theory " like 0% aligned". He even mentions that Sentinel might be going under the radar because he's a role. So he wants to lynch a possible role? He wants to rather vote on inactives than people he thinks are mafia, because he thinks there's a "higher rng" to kill them then to kill people he thinks are mafia. Why not make a proper case on somebody and convince people of his vote? If he just goes after the inactive we can only lose since there's a lot of them. We don't have many jokers left since we lost 2 town already. So it's very important to get scum and not just get to lynch basically anyone. He wants to lynch the people where he can get a push through, not mafia. "make more than one point" | ||
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Why don't you start the tons of questions hidden in this beginning? | ||
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Some things are because you align to them, some things are weird, some things mildly scummy and some of the alignment just fits too well. Also I post multiple times that you might just be confused/misguided/deceived town and that you just fit too well in with defending people I would not have thought you would defend. | ||
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First, you collect information, then you sum it up and post it to make it a case. This is one of the reasons I don't see you town, you don't make a big commited case on anyone. Besides that, I post about a lot of people in one post. Only asking questions doesn't lead to lynching scum . You can't make a proper case without a reasonably big post (of course it doesn't have to be as big as this one), because you need to tell exaclty why you think people are scummy and if possible support that with other postss/people and quotes. Have you read the XXX team liquid mafia game analysis that's really famous? It takes hours to read that, because he goes into detail. Going into detail is never a bad thing in my idea, because if you go into detail you're sure, you can proof things and you're not scared of people pointing bad things out. I don't make cases of people because of low amounts of reasons like as example a lot of people have done since Night one. Also don't pull the newbie card, this is a mostly newbie game and I have played only one more game than you. So have a lot of people here. Of course not all bad play is mafia play, but that's why there is lots of other things to show like connection between players and so on. What do you think the perfect pre-vote post looks like? What is in it, what is not? | ||
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If you are town it should be absolutely no problem to A talk about this and B at least answer the questions (you can look for questions marks) . | ||
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Town doesn't need to not answer questions, there is no valid reason not to if you're town, since there's nothing to hide. | ||
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At some point in day one it was basically LS, Serejai's push on me or me. I know I tunneled Breshke terribly bad that game we had, but I think this is different. At the moment I think I included everyone in my post that posted more than a couple of posts since the lynch. I will still of course go on tomorrow. I wanna mention you're not the only one I'm accusing and that I have 4, maybe even 5 people (the 3 that I have at null contest for another spot possibly) that are possibly scum for me. atm you are at 95%, serejai at like 80%, Kelsier at like 40% sureness and the other ones at like 15-30%. I lean town on bats, even though he is very impulsive, I read all of his filter and don't really see him being mafia. Sentinel hasn't posted in a while, I was reading him lean scum the last time I read him but that's some time ago. Kush is really weird for me but for reasons I mentioned already he's null for me. Immaterial is prolly donkey town, though I hold the option open to go more into him. Fecalfeast and Superbia both lean town, but I wanna see more of them, which since I played with them already I expect soon-ish, since last time they were more active / ff was scum and quite clever with it. But of course most people here didn't post much recently and I will filter-dive them once they posted a bit more and once I have time again, which will likely, but not surely to all extent (filter-diving them and analysing everything) be before EoD, I don't wanna make a promise if I can do it on all of them, since I too I do have stuff to do. | ||
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Will read on him tomorrow, I'm fucking tired. | ||
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I would just rather lynch him tomorrow since atm I think I have a really good case against sicklucker and kush is "only" - you say it - not doing anything. I know mafia wants to hide but I would like you to take a look at what I presented about him. (Of course I'm always keeping in mind that he could have just posted information why he isn't) He could be mafia with real life problems. He could be town with real life problems. He could be a role trying to not get nightkilled and get active after night 2 when he has proper information. He could be mafia hiding in a way that's just straight up terrible. So this is my proposition: We lynch sicklucker today and if kush still doesn't post anything until tomorrow he's an easy mafia lynch that people can't stop. We will get a lot more information by lynching mafia sicklucker than by lynching mafia kush and there is no way kush is gonna survive the day tomorrow if he doesn't step up his play. This way we don't lose a 10% power role, lynch 2 mafia in two days after each other and quickly have a lot of information on the third. Is this a plan that fits you? | ||
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On November 08 2014 01:21 sicklucker wrote: another reason why im not in a scum team with serjai if that isint already obvious for elvis. So elvis I think its safe to say your wrong on one of us and have to completely reevaluate your game. I think at the end of this game we might be talking about how your crazy assumption on me set up a nice trap tho =] I don't have to reevaluate anything until one of you flips town, which isn't gonna happen. Posting a vote ages before EoD, even saying you don't even think the person if mafia, and then even voting on someone else already is not indicative of you not being a scum couple at all and at this point his best bet is probably to bus you so that kinda is expected. | ||
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This isn't townie, townie would try and prove a push they do until like 2 hours before EoD if they are confident in it. He is yet to do that. It's also really usual for mafia to change votes just like that. Not saying he's mafia just for these vote changes but they surely don't indicate him being town or not aligned with you. Oh and bussing someone who you really don't wanna be aligned with isn't a thing mafia do? What? | ||
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Please show me where or be town and do a post about someone that will help town. But that's not gonna happen you will just OMGUS more and keep defending yourself. If you haven't noticed, if you wanna defend yourself as town you disprove the push on you by being townie, not by OMGUS "your post is bad and people once called me townie". You're not helping town at all at the moment. | ||
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If you wanna be read townie, do townie things. Since my post the only thing you did is call my post bullshit without saying anything about the content of it or without doing anything townie at all. When was the last townie thing you did? Can someone else answer this question for him please? Can anyone fuckin else be here? This is gonna be a desaster like day one where during the day noone is here and then at EoD everyone goes ham and posts weird stuff because they don't know stuff. Superbia, kush, sentinel, immaterial where the fuck are you?! | ||
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On November 08 2014 01:55 sicklucker wrote: Are you serious right now? I talked for like 1 or 2 hours about your post how is that not townie Let me rephrase that for you "I defended myself by OMGUS and saying your post is bad for like 1 or 2 hours how is that possibly townie?" You're not hunting scum. You're not asking questions that lead to finding scum. You're not helping to get information by -pushing someone -making plans -somehow getting people in uncomfortable situations so they post alignment-indicative stuff -making cases You're only defending yourself. How does that help town at all, I don't get it. As ff said if you are sure about yourself being townie you could have just made one post in which you adressed the reasons why I cald you mafia - atm you maybe responded to 10% - and you would have been good. Then you could have gone on to be productive and thus prove yourself as town. You haven't done either, made a huge amount of posts since my case on you which none of them do anything to help town or paint you in a townie way. Help me out here why anyone should consider that behaviour townie. There is absolutely no need to not just make a easy post why my reasons are not valid and prove yourself townie otherwise. Why don't you ask people difficult questions. Why do you respond at all if all you're saying is "your posts are bad and noone should believe you". | ||
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There is nothing we lose if we do that and if kush flips town which sadly enough is possible we're in a shitty spot. Will still defo go for him tomorrow if he doesn't out a role tomorrow (which is the only potentially legit reason to lurk like that). Also I get his argument about not internet a bit. My last mafia game a mate came over for the weekend as a surprise and I had no way of playing mafia, so I got replaced Day2. Kush isn't a good target today. Let's see if he's scummy tomorrow and lynch scum sicklucker today. | ||
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He's not damaging town today and not disturbing us. Let's kill him later and he'll be a easy correct lynch. Let's lynch the guy who is spamming the thread with nonsense instead. | ||
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Why not lynch him later, we can't lynch them all at once? Also what do you think about his excuse OR him being lazy town OR him being lurking town OR him being lazy PR OR him being lurking PR. Don't you feel the possibility of a mislynch is too high? | ||
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If we get scum today, which I think we will, we're even further away from it. Please give reasoning why based on his play apart from the lynch he is mafia. Also give reasoning why sicklucker will fuck us up less, since he's fucking us up massively at the moment | ||
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Both your targets have barely posted. Both of them are easy lynches later on. Both of them don't hurt town atm and are less likely to hurt town than sicklucker. Please let us lynch sicklucker, a person where you should look at his filter again, try to find out his alignment and then decide. We can discuss in which order we lynch KSC/kush tomorrow and see if they were just lurking. | ||
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If you wanna read this game you can see my play not being influenced by his at all. | ||
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I won't have his posts influence my vote. If he wants to bus his teammate, he can. So atm I read him leaning scum. | ||
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Lynch scum. | ||
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You are mafia! You are mafia! Everybody is mafia! | ||
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On November 08 2014 05:56 sicklucker wrote: ITS CALLED TRYING TO PEICE THE PUZZLE TOGETHER Oh isn't that what you're blaming me for? Making groups of people that are potentially mafia together? You just have double standards on so many levels | ||
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For him it's basically about not giving out more information on his team and about maybe trying to divert attention unto others. | ||
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Do you want this guy to be alive at LYLO/MYLO, let alone at any point in the game? Is he not distracting everyone? Is he not seething chaos? Is he helping town? | ||
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On November 08 2014 05:57 sicklucker wrote: Superbia and breske if you cant work with me im so afk. these guys are dumb afk or scrum "Triggering discussion" | ||
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Have fun | ||
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He's annoying but most of his posts are weird and not to be looked at in great detail. Meanwhile sicklucker's post have to like 80-90% been only him defending himself by saying other people are stupid and now he says he's gonna be afk. About the bussing: Serejai was focused for a long time on everything but sicklucker. Then things went downhill quick for sicklucker. Then he voted on him, voted around a couple of times and now votes on him again, without giving many reasons. Now recently he's just bashing sicklucker and not being very useful. He still leans scum to me and since he was looking scum on Day1, in the phase before my post on sicklucker agreeing with him and having similair reads and now he's going after him by just bashing him into eternity? Not much townie play seen. I especially refer to the point in time where he switched: On November 07 2014 07:10 Serejai wrote: People who have seemingly disappeared from the thread since we lynched the cop: kush Sentinel Elvis Immaterial kush - Has been afk pretty much all game anyway, so his activity has not really changed. Sentinel - His activity in this thread has dropped noticeably since the lynching. Elvis - His activity has steadily declined all game. He started off being one of the most active players, then threw a vote on me... and ever since he hasn't really contributed anything at all to the game. He's made like three posts since the lynch; two of them were fluff posts that were made to look like he was active but didn't actually contain anything, and the third was him tunneling me as usual. If he's not scum then he's the least helpful townie possible - even less helpful than kush. At least when kush posts it's usually about someone different each time. 99% of Elvis' posts are just tunneling me and not benefiting town in any way. Lots of words with nothing being said. Immaterial - Disappeared after lynching the cop and claiming he had a good reason for it that he would provide shortly. 48 hours later and he still hasn't posted again. In essence all four of these players have been doing nothing at all to help town. I'm actually going to change my vote back to Elvis for what I mentioned above, because he's actually the least consistent of those four. A very close second would be Sentinel, who was active at the start and then tapered off quickly. I think I would be happy to lynch either of those two today, over Immaterial or kush. My vote will stay on Elvis for the time being, though. ##unvote ##vote Elvis On November 07 2014 07:54 Serejai wrote: And basically, with kush... what Grack said about his mafia play and being idle is a great reason to lynch him. It's just that, in my opinion, Elvis, Sentinel, and Immaterial all have equally good reasons to lynch, and more of them. On November 07 2014 07:54 Serejai wrote: I would be happy lynching any one of those four today, though. On November 07 2014 11:05 Serejai wrote: ##unvote ##vote sickcricket On November 07 2014 11:12 Serejai wrote: Guilty until proven innocent. Wagons are fun. On November 07 2014 11:28 Serejai wrote: ##unvote ##vote elvis On November 07 2014 11:39 Serejai wrote: ##unvote ##vote Immaterial On November 07 2014 20:52 Serejai wrote: Obligatory vote for his scum slip about there being a doctor. On November 07 2014 22:40 Serejai wrote: ##unvote ##vote sickcricket Current vote count: Vote Count sicklucker (2): Elvis!, Serejai kushm4sta (3): Breshke, batsnacks, FecalFeast [UoN]Sentinel (2): sicklucker, kushm4sta Not Voting (3): KelsierSC, Superbia, [UoN]Sentinel | ||
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This is the most obvious of scenarios | ||
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He just hasn't even posted or voted so I don't think it's useful to vote for him | ||
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He hasn't posted in ages, so he basically is in this thread as long as sicklucker. | ||
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I don't get your guys reasoning at all, please elaborate we have enough time. The case on him is legit but there's no posts of him in a very long time. He might just get modkilled for not voting. Not wanting to rely on that but I don't think we're sure lynching scum because of one (quite huge) error he made. Meanwhile sicklucker is trying to stir this up and disturb our voting decision | ||
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in mylo if you vote on not-lynching, you get to lylo. You lose if you don't lynch in lylo | ||
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this minus that post is what town wouldn't say. | ||
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On November 08 2014 06:54 batsnacks wrote: Some other people should vote KSC. If he flips scum we can be sure FF is mafia. I don't think we can | ||
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On November 08 2014 06:55 Fecalfeast wrote: I honestly think lickitysplit is scummier but why wont kelly be modkilled? Exactly, no point killing him he didn't vote | ||
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Lynch sicklucker | ||
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This is so good. | ||
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Apart from there being only 2 to go, which is amazing, this is really good for us. | ||
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Why would the role claim/why would the role counterclaim? It'll just get him shot. So I'm 100% the person who claims isn't the powerrole and is either a VT trying to take a shot or scum trying to be confirmed town. | ||
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He wasn't the only person posting reads on the last 36 hours. Not saying it's me, since IF it would be Serejai or sicklucker one of them would basically be confirmed scum. Still this isn't obvious. I want Sentinel to post more on recent things, which he is gonna do after his hangover I guess? Don't see him as a sure mafia as of now, even though he does, and for most of the game did On November 09 2014 05:40 sicklucker wrote: elvis (sure sicklucker thank you for pointing out you dislike me by saying I don't see him scum, even though I posted a case about him already)(making a person you think is town look bad is exactly what we want). like at this point I just see him as either donkey scum or town, this sicklucker guy. But I'm not the only one at that so it's okay. I just don't like him making people ignore everything I say because I made a push on him. Also I dislike the fact that people seem to blindly believe rayn at times, like for me he's null at this point and he's replacing someone with basically no filter. Just because he's more experienced doesn't make him a saint or something. Maybe that's just people jumping on every "new" idea or rather rephrasing they see, but that's just me. On November 09 2014 05:59 Fecalfeast wrote: WIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMM Also people please please stop talking about "but that wouldn't be a good play as scum". 90% of these things are WIFOM. Like "it would be terrible play for kelsier to cc and reclaim, because as mafia that would kill him instantly". Well, he isn't dead, so apparently not. | ||
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Why the fuck are you hunting blues? Like there is 0 reason for that and plus that it helps mafia in obvious ways?! Like if town spends time figuring blues out they only help mafia and only waste time for town hunting for scum. These are reasons why I call this guy donkey town/scum. | ||
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Apparently I'm maifa. What. On November 09 2014 21:46 Serejai wrote: True. They both seem to want our medic dead, but there's a difference. Sicklucker wants our medic to reveal and has been blue hunting all game. He goes for the medic directly. Elvis goes for me all game - keeping in mind that scum thought I was the doctor - and only switched to sicklucker after he started talking about the medic so much. Elvis is going after the player he thinks is the medic and hasn't contributed anything else to the thread all game. He kept his vote on me D1 for no reason in order to stay under the radar when cop was lynched. He stayed out of voting for kush yesterday even though he thought kush was scum. One of those seems scum. The other seems naive town. Uhm why would scum have thought you are the doctor? Uhm I started going on sicklucker way before he talked about the medic at all. I had some people consider changing to you on day1, which is why I stuck with my vote of who I thought was mafia. I posted multiple times that I don't think kush is a good lynch. Like I was about to be reading you null or even leaning town since your posts were a lot more productive recently but why are you saying you caught scum when you didn't even correctly read my filter? I'll just pretend that didn't happen I guess? On November 09 2014 20:01 raynpelikoneet wrote: [/red]Elvis you need to explain this. Here's what you say on N1 start: Here's one of your D2 posts: From what i gather your D2 posts you had sicklucker and Kelsier as scum. You didn't want to vote for Kelsier because he was going to get modkilled in your mind. Now what exactly made you change your mind from N1? You made a big fucking post on KSC which ended up you analyzing him as "i don't know if he is town or mafia", yet on D2 you say "this is the ONLY thing he has done that's scummy and i think it makes him mafia". So again, how did the null-tell become a massive scumtell? Uhm if you read the bigger of those two quotes of mine it says that I'm unsure if he's either weird scum or weird town. Then in the small quote I said that outside of his one really scummy action (which I pointed out earlier and on which I commented on earlier with the big quote) I don't see him being scummy. Please also consider the context in which this was written. People were on sicklucker and then they wanted to switch to KSC for just that, which I don't think is enough of a reasoning. Also you can't convince people of your case unless you tell them that their case is ok, but yours is better for reasons. If you just tell them their case sucks they'll just feel offended and not consider changing. This was pre everyone-goes-on-kush. People, especially Breshke, were considering Kush but not many at that point. | ||
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Well that's a huge change! | ||
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On November 10 2014 02:21 Serejai wrote: The fact that you still think I'm scum says volumes about how useless you are if you were actually town. You also only ever post in the thread when people call you scum. Quick yo defend but when you're not being accused you just afk from the thread. Why not help the town instead? Uhm I didn't call you scum. Read my posts before you judge me being useless? | ||
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On November 10 2014 02:19 raynpelikoneet wrote: Where do you say the action is scummy in the first post because apparently i am missing it. You lay out the possibilities and say you do not know if it's scummy or not. What am i missing? I said that he's either clever scum or weird town. In the next post I repeat that this one thing of him was very scummy but that I'm not sure about him. Why is me rephrasing the same thing with a slightly different thought process and in a completely different surrounding something of big importance? | ||
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I was sure the act is scummy. I didn't know if he is scum because of it or weird town (because weird town can make scummy actions) | ||
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I always thought the act was scummy. I just didn't, and still don't know if there was mafia motivation behind it. Also, a lot of people asked KSC why he did it already at that point. No need to repeat that once more. | ||
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I'm sorry for phrasing it weirdly. | ||
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I call something scummy if it hurts town, is not reasonable in any way and if it's likely to have scum motivation. For me, bad/weird/horrible/misguided town can make scummy things. Normal town doesn't, but KSC wasn't ever considered normal town. About Serejai. Yes, a part of my push on him was connected with Kelsier. To make it clear, the scumteams I formed were never the primary focus. The primary focus on my pushes was always, that these people had a couple of scummy (see above) actions to their name and namely sicklucker didn't respond to questions I found easy to answer if he was town. I never "dropped the whole thing and ended up on sicklucker". Well guess what sicklucker wasn't there at the beginning when I pushed Serejai the most, and he came in with a billion posts that I consider scummy and not much that helps town. Then I push him and he doesn't answer my/serejais/batsnacks/ffs questions and just dodges them, which I considered scummy behaviour because, as ff stated it, if he would be town it wouldn't be a problem to answer them. Instead he called my push bad/bullshit and so on without reasoning and just told people they should ignore me because of it. I never in that said that KSC is town / Serejai is town. The only thing I posted since on the matter is that I was about to consider Serejai townie because of her recent posts and since she wasn't doing many scummy things for some time. Then she started posting badly researched (see my post like a couple of hours ago) things that paint me scummy and useless once more. So to sum it up: I still believe KSC's actions on EoD1 were scummy, but since he stopped posting after and had townie behaviour during Day1 I didn't vote him or push him a ton. He still fitted into a scum team, but it was more the other person being scum and KSC fitting in. Now KSC obviously got replaced. I voted for Serejai since I considered my scumread on her the strongest. The sicklucker became apparent and I was really sure about him being mafia (still not happy with his posts, but since he isn't getting pressured anymore the shit coming out of his mouth got less. Like his filter before and in the time after my push on him was ridiculous). Again, my case on Serejai was mostly not about KSC. I hope this explains what happened at the time. | ||
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He was way too obvious being terrible/high, like why would people not bus him if they are scum. Easy towncred, potential to actually win. Like imagine if sicklucker was scum and he would have defended him. Game would be lost for mafia. Also this makes even more sense if he is getting wagon'd. Rayn why do you think it doesn't make sense for him to bus kush if kush wasn't even trying? to your previous question: At the moment I stand here: I still think there is no reason not to call SL mafia. I still stand to my case on him, since there is nothing that nullifies it and he has done so many scummy and unexcusable things, as example what ff posted very recently. I already said what I think of Serejai atm in my recent posts. KSC is being played by someone else, so: I'm waiting for Obi to fully catch up and post stuff of worth, then I can decide how he might be aligned. | ||
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On November 10 2014 06:03 raynpelikoneet wrote: I don't believe Elvis to be mafia. While he seems inconsistent at times he shows he has some sort of thought process that he can actually argue for and he does it. Cava fucking off from the game totally doesn't really make him look townie. I liked Kelsier but then again he is not new because he is capable of very skilled play, at least as town. I would think he could do that as mafia aswell. My problem is the targets Superbia is proposing look really fucking good for me but otherwise his posting and activity -- compared to his earlier scum/town games does look way way way more like his scumplay. It's like he is more cocky and doesn't give any fucks about how he looks as town and in this game he seems more interested in how other people view him rather than convincing people his targets are mafia. I support this, he usually is way more in-your-face | ||
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Do you want my huge case that's still undisputed and was only answered by him going OMGUS and "this is a terrible case ignore everything elvis says"? | ||
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Superbia for being unlike his usual townie play and rather like his mafia play (which we just talked about) Serejai for as example not reading a lot of what people post / not researching well and more reasons that are just not non-town but actually scummy (look at my filter, if you can't find it I'll elaborate once I have more time) Sentinel for the reasons people call him scum (but for me he only leans scum since he's not posting anything basically so maybe it's unintentional - but I was wrong about that with kush) KSC/Obi if he does sketchy things in the future. ff, bats and you lean town to me, | ||
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WIFOM (!!!). Noone is 100% confirmed town until they died. There is a lot of scenarios where non-cc'd stuff still isn't town. Obviously it's an indicator, but never confirmed. ffs | ||
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Like there is so much WIFOM why mafia could post that stuff and claim/counterclaim. | ||
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Both could be scum? | ||
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well you said if people fake-claim they die, but you, replacing a fake-claimer who thus killed the cop, live. Is that not against the logic? | ||
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Since the medic did his magic N2, he wasn't blocked both times, so IF Serejai isn't lieing he's not the medic. That's all we know | ||
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On November 10 2014 07:35 ObiWanShinobi wrote: Most claims are taken dead seriously. I'm surprised people saw through KSC's awful play and let this slot live, but I wouldn't be surprised if this slot got lynched for it eventually. In short: general advice is to take it as seriously as possible and lynch both claims if one flips blue. Well this game has been full of lies and terrible play. But I'll try and take them more seriously. | ||
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On November 10 2014 07:39 Serejai wrote: Well no shit I'm not the medic. What is with you thinking I'm still null and making these really dumb posts lately? Are you even following this game? I just pointed out that in no way we know anyone is confirmed yet. That includes that if you're not lieing you're not the medic. You could still lie and be the medic, like this is all WIFOM, sooo give me good reason to not read you null and maybe answer to the things I said about your push at me post something why you think I'm totally scum that's not untrue or badly researched? | ||
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Give me a good reason to believe him, he's around null for me atm. | ||
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Since they don't want a confirmed townie, they blocked someone else the second night, thus his claim is wrong. They blocked themselves 2 times which you already pointed out. Since a lot of people (me included) haven't been particularily clever this game, someone might not out themselves being blocked in fear of getting lynched. As Serejai posted they could have not shot for whatever reason. So medic could have been blocked, and medic doesn't wanna out before lategame because he's gonna get killed if he does. This is the same reason why I think bats outing of being medic is either really stupid or wrong (could still be town or mafia). Like if he's mafia, the real medic wouldn't cc, since claiming medic is retarded before endgame. I'm not saying this is a lot of propability. But it's not 100% and there could be mafia strategy behind it. | ||
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He's now "confirmed townie" for not shooting one night? Isn't that a trade mafia would make? | ||
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Still not byting bats and rayn being confirmed. What if bats lied? Would the real medic cc? No, because he's maybe not stupid. | ||
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I don't see medic ccing. | ||
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Night one, mafia blocks serejai and someone else kills grack, the medic tried saving someone else. Night two, mafia blocks serejai who was gonna perform a kill. Now the mafia serejai would be confirmed town and isn't gonna die like... ever? They lose a kill and gain at least one confirmed town. Now a different one: bats is mafia and claims doctor. Mafia roleblocks them selves night two. The doctor doesn't cc, since if he cc's later he can save people first and still kill a confirmed mafia later, when maybe there is only 1 mafia left. Meanwhile, mafia has a confirmed town all the while and might convince people that the cc at the end isn't correct. both these scenarios aren't likely, but they can be true and would be a strategy mafia could do. Obviously there is a lot of WIFOM in this. This just justifies why people aren't 100% confirmed for me, since I want people to take me seriously because what I'm posting isn't stupid, it's just scenarios that prove they're not 100%. In my mind, getting a confirmed town as mafia is a thing they really really want to have. | ||
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Like I don't think he's mafia atm, but he could be. Don't blindly obey experienced people | ||
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To me they are only confirmed when they die or in some weird scenarios. Like one of the biggest things why I'm not sure about bats is that I don't see a reason for him to claim this early. It just gets our doctor killed for him being confirmed townie for one day. Thus I'm not sure about people blindly following others. | ||
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So if we "blindly" follow rayn since he's apparently confirmed town and apparently he always talks the truth and knows everything because he played more? I don't think so. He's just a possible townie like everyone else. | ||
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...? | ||
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We know rayn, bats and serejai are town if they didn't lie, let's move on and focus on scum. I know people have posted about this before, but please everyone give a read on why exactly you think sentinel is scum over everyone else. | ||
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On November 10 2014 10:47 Serejai wrote: Judging by the way you've posted all game I agree. Psychopath it is. For once I agree with Serejai I mean you said you are one or the other. Since you're saying you're disregarding a lot of stuff, you're obviously not 100% open-minded. By definition: Psychopath. | ||
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##Vote [UoN]Sentinel | ||
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On November 11 2014 06:23 batsnacks wrote: I was actually wondering when the real doctor would claim, if ever. Please don't be serious. I barely accepted the fact that people call each other confirmed, if you were fake-claiming, die in hell | ||
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I mean to say: "Let's do this, I guess tomorrow is the day sicklucker dies." | ||
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0 pages since yesterday. Really, town? | ||
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If he disappears, he might A very well be mafia. Read his filter and say why you think he's not and why he always dodges questions and why that's not mafia if you don't think so B if he's not he will be forced to stop confusing everyone with posting "townie" impulsive posts, that are more often than not unresearched, wrong and basically never helpful. Obi/KSC looks a bit sketchy, but I would be surprised if all 3 mafia have similair posting manner. That would basically mean they never had any strategy starting from Night1. | ||
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Serejai why did you softclaim doctor? Sicklucker why did you shoot batsnacks? | ||
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On November 12 2014 18:19 Breshke wrote: What do you think of this. So Elvis thinks that serejai has been soft claiming doctor. I'm not sure when Elvis is reffering too and if he could clarify that could be great. Serejai has however said random stuff like This could be what he is talking about. So whatever post he is referring to you have to assume that he believes serejai was soft claiming because why else would he ask this question. Serejai was role blocked twice because the mafia believed she was the medic. No one else has shown any indication that they believed serejai to be the medic until Elvis with that post. Also if we look at Elvis's vote on D1 i believe it also indicates that elvis is mafia This is the D1 vote. We now know that the two main wagons LS and Immaterial(rayn) are both town. Mafia had no need to push either of these wagons because they were both town. I think that a majority of mafia is more likely to vote outside of the wagons as no matter which person gets lynched they can not be blamed for lynching a town. ##Unvote ##Vote:Elvis! I really think this game ends with superbia or elvis i just keep flipping between who I want first. Is this not a softclaim? I called it soft since he didn't stick with it, but he did say he is the doctor, which I don't see a reason why at this point. Also Breshke you yourself repeatedly say people shouldn't go off vote logic and your major point for killing me is me voting Serejai on day 1? On day 1, where barely anyone had an idea what they were lynching? Then again, sicklucker tries way too hard to paint himself town, saying he answererd to our questions which isn't even remotely true, we asked him like 20-30 questions he never answered for no reason whatsoever except saying our push on him is bad, even though as a lot of other people are pointing out all he posted was WIFOM "pushes", him in a WIFOM way posting that vote count that strongly indicates he's mafia, Then he says "no I posted it myself it's not mafia" which is WIFOM once again. He's barely been useful at all and posted so much useless stuff in this thread, I can't even remotely relate to that amount. Him going WIFOM and OMGUS all over the place and saying people are tunneling and not open minded when he himself just calls peoples posts bullshit because he doesn't like their previous post is really scummy. He tries to paint himself town way too hard, tries pocketing people way too hard, ignores everything negative about him way too hard, doesn't answer questions way too much and posts useless/WIFOM stuff way too much. He's our last mafia here, let's get 3 in a row. ##Vote sicklucker | ||
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And our actually confirmed town bats was pushing SL as well. These aren't huge reasons, but well have a look yourself when shit went down | ||
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I even told you which pages to look. | ||
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He hasn't changed much yet and a lot of his posts are similair. Obviously not everything and obviously not everything I posted in that post is like 100% scummy. Though you must agree the things I posted about him don't paint him in good light. If you then consider his filter afterwards, which I did tell people to, he's dodging questions and since has mostly tried to: Make people read him town and try to confirm himself town so hard I can't even remotely understand . Like a third of his posts in the last days has basically been "I am confirmed town because A, I am confirmed town because B, this paints me town" and then his favourite "I did this, so therefore I cannot be scum". Like not only has he posted so much stuff that doesn't help town at all, he also with all that stuff spammed the thread, tried pocketing people which in you he apparently has, like why would he care, over a houndred hours before potential lylo, to have people read him town so much? Why would he not make proper cases? Why don't you make proper cases but instead blame people for all kinds of shit? Why haven't you made a case you are confident of on anyone? Also please, if you blame people so much, please tell me after reading his filter in an unbiased way, how you think he's not mafia. Put quotes, prove your points and so on. Or, if that's impossible to you I'd have you make a proper case on someone else. Yes, we have 3 lynches to place, but people are talking about who they are gonna pick for reasons displayed in like 5-10 lines, only very roughly scratching at the person. (irony on) We're not gonna find scum after 20 lynches this way I don't think. (irony off) Even if claims have been going on and stuff, I atm barely see anyone who I'd put in a town circle in this game and whose reads I'd trust to be decent, since noone is deeply looking at something since days. Will not change my vote if you don't give me good reason. Look at this guys filter. I don't have a lynching order, I'll lynch sicklucker, get convinced by someone else making a legitimate case, or die trying to lynch sicklucker. | ||
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EZ GAME EZ LYFE | ||
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This is how bad this is going. | ||
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After I would have calmed down, I would try and investigate people again and look who's the second most scummy. Since atm as I said noone looks townie or nearly as scummy as sicklucker, this would be difficult because I won't really be able to let others influence me too much since most people are possible scum atm. The thing we do have going for us, and what I would base my opinion tomorrow on if there is a tomorrow, is how people reacted around the recent lynch, since the last lynch was basically no discussion, since everyone just agreed on sent. No, I'm not trying to go off vote logic, but what the discussion I hope will happen will bring up. | ||
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You said I should have been more reevaluating, while you are pushing someone for something someone else did and even state that nothing happened ever since. Meanwhile, Sicklucker has been proving my points I made about him over and over, hunting blues n that. He's been proving my case, why would I not go for him? I even reread his entire filter trying to find potentially townie things and most of them were noncommital and WIFOM. I tried >.< but this guy is just too terrible. Since when is Breshke confirmed, am I missing something? I think he's being townie and meta-reading him he's similair to last time. Out of you, obi and ff? I'd maybe choose you, since ff's barely posting and Obi isn't either. But that's exaclty where you see why I'm saying there's nothing to read of. Like give me the estimated amount of posts with value out of the last 10 pages. Also, since you brought it up, bring me the seriously estimated amount of posts with value from the beginning. | ||
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Also, I didn't buy his fake roleblock. Who got blocked? Fuck that person so much. | ||
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Hidden third party detected. | ||
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You didn't. You still think your reads were good and that you solved the game. Gratz, you pushed an afk mafia. | ||
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On November 13 2014 10:26 sicklucker wrote: Except at the time I forgot how he pocketed you. But I will give you props for tunneling 1 of 2 correct people congrats. Serejai played you like a fiddle. The only reason you stayed on serejai is because you didnt understand wtf a role block was more then reads lets be honest. You almost lost this for town. If im mislynched and kush and sent stick around longer serejais fake roleblock woulda won him the game. Woah calm down. Serejai didn't pocket me, I never called him anything better than null. But since noone cc'd in days I would've gotten lynched if I pushed him more since everyone considered him confirmed town. Also there wasn't a point indicating me not knowing what a role block was, I don't get where you got that from. I also don't get how I remotely made town lose this game. Like I'm not gonna go in depth with this post. Holy fucking shit calm down. | ||
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As indicated by my posts, I thought this game was over, since it's not unlikely for scum to concede at this point. It's not like the atmosphere in this town wasn't terrible already. Now things are even more fucked up. | ||
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Look how many of his posts are "I'm town because", "I'm definitely not scum because [WIFOM]". Also, where did I ignore questions directed at me? Did you see what the questions directed at him tried to do and how he just said they're all terrible and he doesn't even wanna read it? Ignoring negative things said about him, well he ignores anything that's said about him. If he's scum, these questions are difficult to answer, if these he's scum he could expose information if he answers them. If he's town, there's nothing to lose when answering them. So as a conclusion, the only reason to ignore these questions is because you feel uncomfortable answering them or at most are lazy town. Being lazy and not reading/researching meanwhile is what he's done all game. He posts a lot of stuff, but these aren't researched things. These are impulsive ideas that most of the time don't get us anywhere. He posted so many plain wrong things, misconceptions and similair things that are just not acceptable as town. Then please show me where he made a serious case where he pushed someone because of a good amount of arguments and proof. He hasn't. None of his cases are reliable. He is very active in the thread but tell me where he's been useful. You say he isn't, but with what reasoning? You say you want examples of where he's pocketing people. Well, look at yourself. On the basis of what do you read him town? You never explained this is great detail, but him posting a lot and seeming active and talking about scenarios where he "must be townie" made you think so. Again I ask you: for what reasoning? There are a lot of reasons to believe he is scum and they line up well. He seems to have a strategy how to look town and follows that through. Looking from a perspective where he is mafia, what's his only aim at this point? Look townie. He tries a LOT to look townie. Looking from a perspective where he is townie, what's his aim at this point? Collect information and call out scum for good evidence. He has collected information, but has he called out scum with good evidence? I don't see it. Still voting him and since noone is posting cases it looks like I'm going to stick with it. Saying "I think this person is mafia, please vote for him" with a couple of "proofs" that aren't more than wild guesses "the person is mafia, because [insert WIFOM argument here]" isn't making a case. A last argument I want to make is how many of his arguments he constantly pulls back. "Medic should claim" "i guess he shouldn't". "This person is scummy" someone posts something different "i guess he isn't". Also, a lot of his lynch reasoning is who is possible to be lynched today, especially already very early in the day. Mafia likes voting on the easy targets, he loves it. Also talking shit (and I'm not exaggerating) about people because they made a post about him and pleading that people should ignore it? The people can think for themselves, they can decide if it's bad or worthy, if he thinks it's not dangerous for him why does he care? So many things he posts are not only non-townie but very likely to have scum motivation behind them. Also, look like he points out how serejai "pocketed" me, even though in his world she's town? Logic please? I never even said she's town? Also why me over everyone else? She didn't agree more to my posts about you than a couple of others. You're trying to make connections that don't exist. If I believe anyone to be town here it's probably Breshke. | ||
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You disprove yourself being pocketed how? By thinking he's townie (which is you getting pocketed) and saying he didn't try to convince you not to lynch sentinel? Have you read the day posts when sent got lynched? Saying anything against a lynch this prominent, especially since it was so likely to go through, would have been his death sentence today! Like he couldn't have done anything more stupid than that wild scenario. Also this is the essence of what WIFOM means. Like what's this post. | ||
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He makes you believe he is townie, so that you defend him when shit hits the fan and that you disregard his scummy posts. That's exactly what's happening | ||
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When participating in this game he recently doesn't seem scummy to me. He also yes, isn't the most useful recently but that's not my only point on sicklucker and since I'm sure about my case, why would I go for something I deem weaker? | ||
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On November 14 2014 03:20 raynpelikoneet wrote: Again this doesn't make anyone mafia. I do that a lot. Like REALLY A LOT... as town. If you make it that doesn't make it townie play. Also, WIFOM. You can't be serious? I JUST re-asked the question,. I even UNDERLINED the part!!! There was one request you did not even a day ago. Calm down. Could you re-ask the questions? I do not see myself lynching him but still. There is not much to talk about apparently so let's make him answer them if they exist. I'm not reasking all the like 30 questions that were directed and ignored by him to ask them again. There's no point if he doesn't feel like answering questions by certain people he won't change that judging on his play so far and him calling me shit literally a couple of pages ago. Not really. I do ignore a lot that's been asked from me as town because it doesn't help me/anyone find mafia and wastes my time (especially if i think the questions are stupid). So as i said, can you re-ask the questions so i can also evaluate if they are good or not, worth answering in other words. Questions weren't stupid. If you could just look at the pages I proposed yesterday and the following 10 you can see them. Not necessarily a scum trait, in fact being impulsive is way more likely to be a town trait. I disagree with the last sentence. For example he was one of the first people to actually do something about "Sentinel is mafia". This is about the most important thing that has happened in this game for the town. Why is being impulsive a town trait? WIFOM and can easily be planned. Like why wouldn't scum do that to appear townie. EZSCUMGAMEEZLYFE. Also, yeah making a push on someone who has been pushed before (he just picked up ideas of other people - look at the times he posted it and what happened before that) isn't that great of a deal. Considering he's been changing who he thinks is scum like his underwear and basically considers most people scum this isn't a thing. Please show me where anyone (except you) has made a case that's "decent" by your standards? People have earlier in the game. Noone has recently, which is why I say that this town atmosphere is terrible. In other games this is a thing that happens, not here. He was one of the main people pushing Sentinel. One could argue that's more "good for town" than you have done... In fact i am just arguing that. WIFOM and pushing a dead horse isn't incredible play. Like look at how kush and sent played, they gave up instantly. I JUST GAVE THE REASONING!!! DID YOU EVEN READ MY POST?!?!?!? Not in the least sufficient for me. I chronologically went through it as you can see, so obviously I read it, no need to go ham. No there aren't. They are and why aren't they? All of this has been discussed in this same post before so i won't answer it multiple times. So you don't wanna talk about how he hasn't done really townie things and how he tries confirming himself 24/7. Hm, I guess that falls under the category "disregard the scummy deeds". You have called both flipped scum "possibly town" for WIFOM arguments and you are really arguing this? oh my gosh.  Obviously everyone is possible town at any point. No reason to post this. This is more likely to come from a townie. Scum like to stick with their opinions. True fact. No they don't. Scum like to switch around so they don't get blamed. also: WIFOM Yet he has voted for mafia on D2 and D3. Your "hard targets" were better? See? Like what the fuck is this argument? I don't even..... WIFOM. He always talks about which lynches can go through and since both his other scum gave up like 5 minutes into the game, he probably thought it's better to not rely on them and confirm himself town. Can you quote the post where he talks shit because i do not know what you are talking about. look at his filter and search "elvis" ...and you still do not elaborate on this further... again, which posts? and why? I did elaborate this further, but if you don't look at any of the examples I post, I can't help you. In case i am not mistaken that happened when Serejai claimed mafia, no? So that's only logical. she "gave up" and there was no end-of-game post yet and he read her town like for a long time. I'm mostly talking about him saying she pocketed me when there I wasn't ever agreeing to things she posted/protected her/ said she's even more than null. Good job for making the easiest read ever on Breshke. Except that if you do not think i am town you are mafia or delusional. You don't have to be town. There are scenarios where you're not, so you're not confirmed until you're dead since we don't have any more blues. I like how you never even comment on the "medic should claim". Like you just disregard all his scummy things. You sir, got pocketed. | ||
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There's only 1 mafia left and I'm pretty sure I caught one so what's the point? | ||
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I'm getting called scum for making logic. Cool stuff. | ||
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Worst shit ever. | ||
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[QUOTE]On November 14 2014 04:07 raynpelikoneet wrote: [QUOTE]On November 10 2014 08:07 Elvis! wrote: So there is a couple of cases where I don't agree: Since they don't want a confirmed townie, they blocked someone else the second night, thus his claim is wrong. They blocked themselves 2 times which you already pointed out. Since a lot of people (me included) haven't been particularily clever this game, someone might not out themselves being blocked in fear of getting lynched. As Serejai posted they could have not shot for whatever reason. So medic could have been blocked, and medic doesn't wanna out before lategame because he's gonna get killed if he does. This is the same reason why I think bats outing of being medic is either really stupid or wrong (could still be town or mafia). Like if he's mafia, the real medic wouldn't cc, since claiming medic is retarded before endgame. I'm not saying this is a lot of propability. But it's not 100% and there could be mafia strategy behind it.[/QUOTE] Elvis suggests the following: Argument: MAfia blocked someone else on N2 and they are "scared to claim because they could get lynched". Answer: Who cares, if there is a counter-claim town wins 100% by lynching both of the claims. Argument: Bats is not the necessarily the real medic. He could be mafia (or town) fakeclaiming. Answer: Who cares, if there is a counter-claim town wins 100% by lynching both of the claims (so bats cannot be mafia). Argument: Mafia could have not shot. Answer: Impossible because mafia must shoot every night. Argument: Medic doesn't wanna out because blablabla... Answer: See the second point. reasoning (blabla) is irrelevant. There is literally no intention behind this post other than trying to reduce the amount of confirmed people (which would be bats, me and to some extent Serejai). Townies do not dothat. Mafia does. Now let's kill Elvis![/QUOTE] Well, if bats didn't claim he wouldn't have died and we'd still have a doctor. If we weren't lucky and 2 of the mafia gave up so early this would maybe have lost us the game. mafia can roleblock themselves so they don't have to shoot. There still are scenarios where you're not confirmed, so can you stop being so bitchy about it? You're not confirmed until you're dead dude. Sorry to bust your bubble of confirmed-ness. Mafia can block themselves and some people (yes they do) sometimes claim stuff as town. | ||
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On November 14 2014 04:47 raynpelikoneet wrote: In real world i believe Sentinel would have never been lynched on D3 in case i was mafia. That's actually a fact because i do not buss. WIFOOOOOOOOM. | ||
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On November 14 2014 04:55 raynpelikoneet wrote: no you can't. we can discuss this tomorrow but i am really really sure Elvis is mafia. Gief scummy posts please. | ||
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On November 14 2014 05:06 Serejai wrote: Elvis you can just roll over and die now. We won't think less of you. WIFOM | ||
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It's cool how you're like "you can't lynch someone for playing bad" and then wanna lynch me for no scum reasons and only things you think are dumb. Like we had a person fake-counter-claim cop and rescind 3 minutes before deadline. Shit is possible apparently. Like even if all of town is confirmed I wouldn't believe people for sure since people make misconceptions. | ||
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Good thing after my death sicklucker is basically confirmed scum | ||
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On November 14 2014 05:17 Serejai wrote: Nonsense; sicklucker has already self-confirmed as town a dozen times. Oh I must have forgot. Thanks for reminding me sweetheart <3 | ||
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lol. | ||
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On November 14 2014 05:45 raynpelikoneet wrote: Don't use that dumb video mafia (and tbh other forum's mafia aswell) meta stuff they do in games. we have time. if we happen to miss we re-evaluate. we do not re-evaluate before the evidence is there. that's a really bad thing to do. that's a thing you called me scum for . Rayn confirmed scum | ||
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I only said it's still possible you're not confirmed, since mafia can not-kill by roleblocking. Breshke: Well I think sicklucker is the most likely lynch to be mafia for reasons already displayed. he caught rayn and rayn is continuing his fashion of shittalking me for no reasons. Still don't see where my play was as bad as people say, since people never point of stuff that's not a misconception or wrong. Since Serejai and rayn sadly most likely are townie and I read you townie, there are only 3 people left in case people keep on sheeping sicklucker for no apparent reason: ff obi Superbia All three of them are weird. Superbia is different than usual, which is WIFOM and I'm not sure what it means. ff doesn't post much, but tbf not many people are and because of this town I can see why he can't be arsed. Obi is really similair to ff/kush/sent, but since reason above that doesn't have to be indicative. Soooo I'm sorry Breshke to not present you a good alternative. rayn is making shit up but is confirmed so well, fuck. Serejai was annoying for some time but she's most likely confirmed, fuck. The three contestants all post little, but that's not much of an indicator and as I said I can feel why they're not. So at this point my best guess it to blame Obi for "killing the cop", since it's the "best evidence" there is on anyone. with an offchance of Sere or rayn fooling us a lot. Good luck Breshke, I hope town doesn't lynch wrong too often. | ||
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Elvis!
Germany396 Posts
This is becoming so ridiculous, but I guess that's rayn when he tunnels. I like how I get blamed for "ignoring evidence" and he's yet to comment on me asking him like 3 times what he thinks of sl wanting our doc to claim and how that's terrible. | ||
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Elvis!
Germany396 Posts
I'm sure at least 2 aren't correct or in the least scummy. | ||
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Elvis!
Germany396 Posts
And doing that ONLY exclusively hurts town and helps mafia since he's hunting blues. More explanation needed? This was already explained in great detail but I guess you don't notice negative things about your love of your life. Like how is that not obvious. I gave a reason already and I was at uni all day. I'm not researching why people are town, I don't care who's town. I care about the people that have reads I like and of course I research about these persons. I don't give a flying hoot about looking at why people are town when there's 6 left and I'm really sure about the mafia. Please post 5 things that are bad/scummy in my play. I promise some won't actually be scummy, will be uneeded, or misconceptions. | ||
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Elvis!
Germany396 Posts
Claiming medic is retarded before end of game since he'll just get nightkilled and we'll lose a pr. I always knew there is a medic in this game. They can fake-claim as mafia, did you see this game. Did you see KSC getting lynched for fake-claiming, which has been proven? Is he dead? Roleblock can be put on mafia, but again, fake-claims are a thing you ignore. Also as you know this is the first game for me with a lot of claims and I went from what I knew and saw scenarios where they aren't confirmed, so I posted my thoughts and posted the scenarios. Also, everyone at the time was posting much more wild scenarios that are untruths. Mine are at least in theory possible! This doesn't really hurt town or isn't mafia, since I didn't push anyone based on that more than "lean scum". I'm playing very similair to that game, but this time I have a lot more legit reasons for my push I think. Like how can you say it's impossible for me to be town when you have sicklucker posting like this in the game. A lot of people even agreed on that and he almost got lynched already. None of these are reasons that aren't WIFOM-could-be-town-could-be-mafia. This is the worst case you made in your mafia career rayn. | ||
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Elvis!
Germany396 Posts
I see some of your points, and I know I gotta improve, but the reasons I call this guy scum are what I think a lot more scummy than how I called you. Also, have you seen people recently? What do you think atm, what has been alignment-indicative the last 2 days. I really don't see much, maybe I'm blind and there is a lot of stuff going on IRL that's distracting me. I also like that I was right and 0 out of the reasons rayn posted aren't WIFOM-could-be-both. This is so sad and funny. | ||
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Elvis!
Germany396 Posts
On November 14 2014 06:32 raynpelikoneet wrote: I'll make this very easy for you: Answer right now: 1) Someone claims medic, 7town 1 scum left. What happens if the claim is town? 2) Someone claims medic, 7town 1 scum left. What happens if the claim is scum? Assuming this situation where we're not lynching scum anytime soon. Also, at the point of time there was more than 1 scum left since that's the point in time he was posting it. if scum: after that day/night there will most likely be a mislynch since the confirmed town-scum can lead a mislynch and there'll be a mislynch and the doctor dead. After the next day/night they will lynch the right guy and another guy gets night-killed. 4:1. only one mislynch from lylo. Not that terrible for scum since he's most likely almost confirmed since he bussed his friend. if town: after that day/night there might or might not be a correct lynch, and the doctor is dead after that night. Life goes on and nothing is gained, but a powerrole lost for having a confirmed town for 1 day. Best scenario ever for town. | ||
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Elvis!
Germany396 Posts
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Elvis!
Germany396 Posts
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Elvis!
Germany396 Posts
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Elvis!
Germany396 Posts
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Elvis!
Germany396 Posts
Not cool. | ||
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Elvis!
Germany396 Posts
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Elvis!
Germany396 Posts
On November 14 2014 06:58 Serejai wrote: I'm always serious. Those of us who are town never make jokes. Play to win or don't play at all. "I'm mafia I give up" | ||
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Elvis!
Germany396 Posts
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Elvis!
Germany396 Posts
Thank you. | ||
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Elvis!
Germany396 Posts
I just advise you to be less confusing as a town and to stop trying to confirm yourself through theories "why you can't be scum" instead of hunting scum. After like 5 people told you so you might wanna believe this to be true. Same thing about the sleeping. Do you not see how many people you got to think you were scum and how many people were confused about your actions? You're a new guy to this game just like me, just take advice from others, experience is the key to this game, not being right at all times. ffs. | ||
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