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Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
On August 05 2014 09:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote: I wanted to know how much I agreed with your WoS case and that argument didn't make sense to me, so I needed clarification. but that argument didn't have anything to do with why Wave is scum it was a tangential discussion on why I felt Haru was town | ||
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Artanis[Xp]
Netherlands12968 Posts
On August 05 2014 09:19 Eden1892 wrote: but that argument didn't have anything to do with why Wave is scum it was a tangential discussion on why I felt Haru was town Wait, you're right. I seem to be terrible this game. This is annoying. | ||
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Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/WLhrT40.gif) | ||
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Artanis[Xp]
Netherlands12968 Posts
On August 05 2014 09:22 Eden1892 wrote: No, this is more accurate. ![[image loading]](http://www.pictureshack.us/images/46435_1349308312152.gif) | ||
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Eden1892
United States5866 Posts
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goodkarma
United States1067 Posts
I don't like lynching Haru anymore. And given Obi has recently posted semi-respectable non-troll posts, I'd like to give him a chance. WoS/Poofter still look like good lynches. Both have promised posts soon. Feel free to ask me anything, but I'm waiting on these too to deliver said promised posts. | ||
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goodkarma
United States1067 Posts
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Vivax
21965 Posts
On August 05 2014 09:35 goodkarma wrote: A couple people in my absence mentioned it was odd to them I wasn't present. Well, I'm back. I know this is hard to believe, but I'm not available to play this game with you every moment of the day. I don't like lynching Haru anymore. And given Obi has recently posted semi-respectable non-troll posts, I'd like to give him a chance. WoS/Poofter still look like good lynches. Both have promised posts soon. Feel free to ask me anything, but I'm waiting on these too to deliver said promised posts. Yeah gimme a rundown of what changed your mind and how you feel about HF being so stubborn on Haru. I found his post I quoted to be quite the stretch since I was able to find a couple of reads in Haru's filter. I admit not much but it still didn't warrant HF saying that the guy hasn't been doing anything. | ||
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goodkarma
United States1067 Posts
On August 05 2014 09:49 Vivax wrote: Yeah gimme a rundown of what changed your mind and how you feel about HF being so stubborn on Haru. I found his post I quoted to be quite the stretch since I was able to find a couple of reads in Haru's filter. I admit not much but it still didn't warrant HF saying that the guy hasn't been doing anything. The way Haru's recently reacted to HF's tunnel has looked towny to me. And the fact that Haru super-easily could have made up some kind of scumread and attracted way way less attention as scum. HF being stubborn on Haru isn't really alignment indicative to me. Haru has done super-scummy stuff, and it makes sense to me how he'd still be on him. That being said we've had similar thoughts/reads for most of the game so the guy's probably town. As for Haru not doing anything, he really hasn't said "I suspect person X as scum." He's been using some weird kind of heuristic crutch that doesn't really make any logical sense. His posts have been substanceless, and I can't understand why you'd think otherwise. The most substanceful post he's made ironically is the post ordering Eden's list, which isn't even his own... | ||
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goodkarma
United States1067 Posts
Who do you prefer to lynch today and why? | ||
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Vivax
21965 Posts
As for you, I have a hard time telling if you're just saying stuff to keep your story straight, you seem to try kinda hard to stay very consistent in your play but I'm not sure if it's me being tunneled or a fact. Hence it would be helpful for me to know how you want to read Haru if you feel that he's super scummy on one and townie on the other hand. How do you get to the conclusion that his reaction was townie, for example? | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31494 Posts
On August 05 2014 08:57 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Wave, you mentioned you thought I was townie in the start. You haven't really mentioned that since other than telling Marv that you don't think I'm happening today. What's your read on me and why? Alright I'm back for a while. Is there a reason I should have mentioned you in between? I seem to remember your scumplay being tantamount to rolling over and dying for no good reason (though why I think this I'll admit I don't rightly know and am too lazy to go check right now). Even were this not the case, your play simply doesn't seem scummy to me--- I just don't see a scum Artanis calling me confirmed town all game and spouting nothing but carefree oneliners in the face of making other people suspicious. Or maybe you simply bought me with your outright defenses. Does this mean I'm not confirmed town any more, arty? + Show Spoiler + Sorry, but Eden's ascii fist made me lol | ||
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Vivax
21965 Posts
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WaveofShadow
Canada31494 Posts
On August 05 2014 10:25 Vivax wrote: WoS still have to see you act up on that sort of FoS you placed on GK early. How do you read him currently. Writing up on haru atm Give me a bit plz | ||
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goodkarma
United States1067 Posts
On August 05 2014 10:19 Vivax wrote: Not sure yet, waiting for Wave to deliver something more substantial at the moment. As for you, I have a hard time telling if you're just saying stuff to keep your story straight, you seem to try kinda hard to stay very consistent in your play but I'm not sure if it's me being tunneled or a fact. Hence it would be helpful for me to know how you want to read Haru if you feel that he's super scummy on one and townie on the other hand. How do you get to the conclusion that his reaction was townie, for example? I actually can't recall a game where you haven't thought I'm scum. You must really really hate my playstyle... I've told you exactly how I've read Haru. How a person comes off towny is a semi-subjective thing. Generally when a person curses and screams at their tunneler in the way Haru did it's a town response. It's not a foolproof read by any means, but reads of this ilk have historically served me well. If you're a skeptic, just go with my latter reason (he easily could have just made a scumread up). It's totally valid here. Haru isn't a good lynch today. And saying you don't know who you want to lynch when the thread's already ~40 pages, and the day's half gone is pretty weak. If you were forced to choose now, who would it be? This question really isn't that hard. | ||
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Vivax
21965 Posts
On August 05 2014 10:32 goodkarma wrote: I actually can't recall a game where you haven't thought I'm scum. You must really really hate my playstyle... I've told you exactly how I've read Haru. How a person comes off towny is a semi-subjective thing. Generally when a person curses and screams at their tunneler in the way Haru did it's a town response. It's not a foolproof read by any means, but reads of this ilk have historically served me well. If you're a skeptic, just go with my latter reason (he easily could have just made a scumread up). It's totally valid here. Haru isn't a good lynch today. And saying you don't know who you want to lynch when the thread's already ~40 pages, and the day's half gone is pretty weak. If you were forced to choose now, who would it be? This question really isn't that hard. I would be lying if I said I had no scumreads. I'm simply not confident into them yet. Still in the process of deciding on you and WoS, and that's evident, so don't call my play "weak" just cause I don't go guns blazing on you guys, which is something you should actually value if you are town, since I give myself space for reconsideration. Implying I'm doing something scummy with what I'm doing in your regards isn't something I would expect from a townie in your position to be honest. You see this guy talking to his persons of interest, but not dead set on lynching them, and the first thing coming to your mind is that the play is "weak"? | ||
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Vivax
21965 Posts
Not really a post where you showcase A to B how what he was doing was super scummy so if you really feel that way it might be a good time to display what it is. | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31494 Posts
HaruRH: On August 04 2014 09:26 HaruRH wrote: Anyway, I am null on this read on wos. His meta read could probably be thrown away after him not playing for months - I would certainly change a lot in 3 months. However, that 'stiffness' in his long ass posts can definitely be seen. So its a +1 -1=0. First relevant post is here. It makes sense superficially, though I absolutely hate that 'stiffness' horseshit, which I suppose I can get into with Eden or whoever still believes that later. There's not much here in the end which is fine, but it becomes a problem below: On August 04 2014 09:52 HaruRH wrote: Why am I trying to defend this wos guy when I don't even remember where I saw him? Yea, you might be right. I certainly won't be happy rolling scum on my first game after 3 months. This is where I first drew issue with him in the first place. The soft defense he used above is based on my meta changing after 3 months (and note that it is a SOFT defense as he does not call me town or stand up for me in any way) but here he treats it as if it is more than that. In the exact same first post he gives me both a '+1' and '-1' and yet his reaction is as if he has been called out for a hard defense. Then, IMMEDIATELY he is sure to discount his own '+1 defense' by agreeing that I shouldn't be happy about rolling scum (which I've already shown to be untrue, though this is irrelevant). Now the first thing that pops into my head is mafia with a guilty conscience, and the reasoning should be obvious (if it isn't, it's in my filter). Vivax believes that it is simply Haru rethinking his argument out loud, btu I disagree and this is why: On August 04 2014 13:01 HaruRH wrote: Idk, if I was scum I would definitely sit back and think of how to play this game. So I would wanna check how these people who never posted yet on how they open up. Too stiff = skummer. On August 04 2014 13:52 HaruRH wrote: You still sound angsty. What? I said, I'm waiting to see if the lurkers are posting stiffly so that I can group them up with wave. No. 1 scum in 3 people = all others are town? How did you even come to this conclusion? I still don't have a prime suspect. You probably have not played with me before but I don't do reads d1 (at least not the first half) until everyone turns up and I get to inspect and see how they are linked. Call it bad or w/e, this is how I roll. Lack of experience isn't an excuse, but expectations will be my worry. I am expecting 1 out of 3 of these boogers to be skum and the remaining few skums to be in the rest. If those who post 'stiffly' are scum and he's waiting to group them up with me, what does that mean about what he thinks of me? When exactly did he go from null to scummy on me? I just don't see the towny though process, hell ANY thought process at all, it looks more like 'Oh, I was given an out to join the anti-Wave bandwagon, so here I go.' It honestly feels like he simply name-dropped me above to make himself look better. I don't believe that 'waiting for lurkers to post' is a valid towny technique here either, it reads much more like an excuse and an easy way to avoid content. On August 04 2014 23:36 HaruRH wrote: Problem is, what constitutes looking really townie? What heuristics do you use to judge? For example, the way you judge town is probably going to be different from pooft, who plays tons of video mafia, and different from me, who plays tons of game mafia (sc2/wc3). Also, what is really townie looking? To artanis, wos is his really townie guy despite many objections and scumreads on wos. Explain to me, marv. This looks like a scummer who has gained confidence by people getting off his ass and shifted attention over to a bandwagon that isn't him. Note the 'wos' namedropping again. Now his return: I was going to agree with Obiwan on the odd use of self-meta but I've done it myself before and as I mentioned earlier in my filter his reasoning feels like frustrated towny more so than caught scum so I'm in more of a conundrum here. The problem with it is I'm known to be wrong with that kind of read so I have to take it with a grain of salt. The confidence is still there which is fine, hell even a towny who gets negative attention on himself dropped will gain confidence, but his list of scummers also rubs me the wrong way. Aside from myself being up there, the other two are people who attacked him previously (discounting HF who imo looks towny enough that it might be dangerous for a lower-confidence scummer to attack by way of OMGUS)...it realy doesn't seem as though any thought besides that was put in. Ultimately I am still scummy on Haru because in rereading I have gone through and I don't see the towny perspective being stronger than a scum-aligned one for his actions. Vivax you're welcome to show me the error of my ways here if you still think I'm not considering important things here. ##Vote: HaruRH | ||
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WaveofShadow
Canada31494 Posts
On August 05 2014 10:25 Vivax wrote: WoS still have to see you act up on that sort of FoS you placed on GK early. How do you read him currently. I'm not sure how calling him null was a FoS, I just said some of his posting made me feel all wonky about him. I think I'm used to playing games with him when he's always under the gun so to see him posting in a different way now (though still spr srs) gives me pause. Ultimately he recently liked the same thing I did in regards to Haru's reaction to HF (though we've obviously come to different conclusions about it) though maybe GK you can go into a little more detail as to what about Haru's reaction you liked? I'd give GK slightly towny side of null for now---if there were a good way to pressure GK (that I wouldn't feel guilty about) to make him post similar to what I'm used to in many games I'd do it. | ||
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Tehpoofter
United States2911 Posts
On August 04 2014 18:57 marvellosity wrote: Poofter might be mafia according to my heuristic that I'm not telling any of you about right now. I'd probably kill both Artanis and Poofter right now. Wave hasn't showed me anything in particular that I want to lynch, other than what I mentioned. Most of the arguments levelled against him I've seen levelled against him on more than one occasion as town, they're just not very interesting to me yet. He's just null ##Vote: Artanis gobbledy actually said the basic reason for Artanis to be mafia. Very low contributions so far despite posting some. I've not made proper reads yet and I've probably contributed more than he has. I also think given the preamble, Artanis would at least try to play a decent game as town. Let's see. Has anyone else seen marv vote this early in a game?? Like I feel like the last couple times I was town with him he was reserved the first 24 horus and waited... this is his fourth post.. like wtf | ||
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