EPTOn May 29 2014 04:11 Chromatically wrote:
Can you explain your read on jabber and also your top scumreads?
Can you explain your read on jabber and also your top scumreads?
Jabber - scum, but he might not be.
Top scumreads:
jwz
palmar
Detention Mafia - Page 26
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sqrtofneg1
Canada1159 Posts
Jabber - scum, but he might not be. Top scumreads: jwz palmar | ||
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sqrtofneg1
Canada1159 Posts
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Amiko
United States1725 Posts
Currently have a townread on Palmar. This is mostly based on Palmar’s interactions re: jabberwockzerg case. (I also feel like Meapak-sqrt is a little less likely to be a scumteam, but that is a weak read.) SUMMARY - Palmar raises points by other people, but doesn’t try to take credit for those points. - Palmar pushes on JWZ and other players. - Palmar does not seem certain JWZ is scum, but seems to feel it is the best lynch (currently agree). His early vote on ninjabunnies and his interaction with Meapak don’t mean much to me. I feel he is slightly more likely to be town based on suspicion from sqrt/jabberwockzerg who feel suspicious to me right now, but I might reasses when I go through sqrt more fully. ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ----------------------------------------------------------------------- DETAILS / BASIS Palmar - 27ninjabunnies Early D1, Palmar votes on 27ninjabunnies. This vote means pretty much nothing to me. It looked like a joke to me, and even if he raised points explaining this vote later, he didn’t do it then or push it then. I think I will probably ignore it. Palmar - Jabberwockzerg A little later, Palmar starts to sheep the case on Jabberwockzerg. His posts sort of repeat posts by other players. Initially this seemed like it may be scummy (backpacking other players’ reads), but after reading more, I don’t think so. + Show Spoiler + On May 27 2014 21:28 Palmar wrote: Okay I'll be a good sheep. ##vote jabberwockzerg To put in clear terms what the problem I, and clearly others, have is: The point isn't that you screwed it up. The point is that you brought up an argument that you already know is invalid. I don't see any motivation for someone who is town to do that. Unless you can explain why as town it makes sense for you to throw something you know will not help solve the issue at hand into the mix, we're going to have to lynch you. I'm fine with not doing anything else today. This is better than most day 1 lynch opportunities we get. @jabberwockzerg: if you're somehow town, now is your time to step up. - (1) Palmar states he is sheeping, so I don’t see this as an attempt to get credit for another player’s ideas. He credits Chrome as well in his next post (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/451317-detention-mafia?page=10#188). - (2) Palmar follows up his thoughts in later posts (ex: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/451317-detention-mafia?page=10#196, http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/451317-detention-mafia?page=10#199). - (3) Palmar argues with JWZ and asks people who are not voting JWZ to vote for JWZ (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/451317-detention-mafia?page=16#312). To me, this is a really natural reaction and consistent with town play. It is possible Palmar is opportunistic scum trying to secure a mislynch, but I don’t feel he would push as much as he did when other players seemed to be agreeing. Further, although I don’t put a ton of credit in associative reads, suspicion of Palmar from sqrt and jabberwockzerg make Palmar seem a little more town to me. I can’t say Palmar is obviously town, but I feel the case on him (voting ninjabunnies d1) just seems so weak that it would “fit” if they are trying to get Palmar as an alternate lynch. Palmar - Meapak_Ziphhh I don’t conclude very much from interactions between Palmar and Meapak_Ziphh… Meapak’s comments on sqrt’s posting style are fair; I like sqrt and have a general sense of his play, but I feel he has been suspected in almost every game for his posting style (maybe in Golden Sun it was for posting frequency, I forget). So, Meapak’s comment on his posting style seems fine to me. This does suggests to me that Meapak-sqrt is a little less likely to be a scum team. Basically, I just feel scum would tend to give each other tips on play in their QT, so they might be less likely to do so in the actual game. I feel like it’s a pretty weak read and it’s not that useful to talk about more now, anyway. Anyway, since I feel like Meapak’s comments on sqrt are fine, I don’t have a read on Meapak from it and don’t agree or disagree with Palmar’s push there. | ||
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Amiko
United States1725 Posts
Fuba I initially liked his point on jabberwockzerg, but looking back it seems like a point that would only get raised by me or a mafia. I don’t know though… his return to voting jabberwock for JWZ’s followup posts seems reasonable to me. He hasn’t talked too much. I am not sure on him. I initially liked fuba’s point on jabberwock quite a bit (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/451317-detention-mafia?page=9#162). But, looking back I am a little confused by it. So, I am in a unique position compared to every other town in this game (because I know I am town) when it comes to jabberwock. Usually, knowing your own alignment is not particularly helpful. However, as someone who was rolled scum last game, I can call out JWZ on who he lists as scum. I know for a certainty JWZ’s post is weak coming from scum because he would know a town player (me) would be able to call him out on it. For everyone else, you don’t know if we might be on the same team. This makes fuba’s comment a little weird to me when I revisit it: it seems like a point that only would get made by me or a mafia. I am not sure, though… he may have (like initially I did) thought Epishade, who rolled scum last game, was still in this game; It seems really unlikely that we’d have 3/3 same people, but 2/2 doesn’t feel so rare. And, I sort of agree with his switch back onto jabberwock because I feel like jabber’s subsequent posts really looked bad to me. I think I detailed it in an earlier post, but it sort of feels like JWZ gave up or admitted he had been caught. Basically, uncertain on fuba for now. My preference was to get more comments and revisit him. | ||
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sqrtofneg1
Canada1159 Posts
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Amiko
United States1725 Posts
Can you read through my comments on Palmar and let me know what you think? I feel your suspicion of him based on his vote for bunnies is super weak... | ||
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27ninjabunnies
United States2486 Posts
On May 29 2014 04:27 sqrtofneg1 wrote: It might be beneficial if I didn't say this, but I think haru's blue. Why? | ||
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sqrtofneg1
Canada1159 Posts
Mostly the setup question. | ||
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Meapak_Ziphh
United States6786 Posts
##Vote: jabberwockzerg Thought there was a voting thread lol | ||
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Meapak_Ziphh
United States6786 Posts
More importantly, why even reveal you think that if you're town -_- | ||
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sqrtofneg1
Canada1159 Posts
On May 29 2014 04:34 Amiko wrote: @sqrt: Can you read through my comments on Palmar and let me know what you think? I feel your suspicion of him based on his vote for bunnies is super weak... Hmmm.. I guess you may be right. I still want palmar to be more active, he's the 'vet' here. | ||
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Amiko
United States1725 Posts
On May 29 2014 04:34 sqrtofneg1 wrote: Amiko, what do you think of haru? I posted on him just a bit ago and I think you read it...? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/451317-detention-mafia?page=25#499 I think HaruRH is scummy. I am not sure re: jabberwockzerg vs HaruRH... I didn't realize deadline was when it was, so I feel like there may not be time for Haru to respond to my points, whereas jabberwock has had time to respond and responded poorly. That's one reason I want to see more talk on Haru. | ||
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sqrtofneg1
Canada1159 Posts
On May 29 2014 04:37 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: More importantly, why even reveal you think that if you're town -_- ??? | ||
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Chromatically
United States1700 Posts
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sqrtofneg1
Canada1159 Posts
On May 29 2014 04:38 Amiko wrote: I posted on him just a bit ago and I think you read it...? http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/451317-detention-mafia?page=25#499 I think HaruRH is scummy. I am not sure re: jabberwockzerg vs HaruRH... I didn't realize deadline was when it was, so I feel like there may not be time for Haru to respond to my points, whereas jabberwock has had time to respond and responded poorly. That's one reason I want to see more talk on Haru. I did read it. I should have phrased my question in a different way. Do you think it's possible that haru's blue? | ||
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Chromatically
United States1700 Posts
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Amiko
United States1725 Posts
On May 29 2014 04:36 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: hmm I'm a bit suspect of people trying to develop a second wagon at the same time as they're voting JWZ. Either say you've changed your mind about jwz and explain why or start developing reads for tomorrow. ##Vote: jabberwockzerg Thought there was a voting thread lol I think this is a fair point and I feel okay with a JWZ lynch, so I'll place my vote on him. ##Vote: jabberwockzerg However, please comment on HaruRH now. Just because we are okay with a JWZ lynch doesn't mean we can't talk about other possibilities, and this will help me get reads. I am open to moving to HaruRH, and it's fine with me if we talk about him as a potential suspect for tomorrow, too. | ||
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27ninjabunnies
United States2486 Posts
You said he's blue...as in a pr... Why would you out something like that | ||
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Amiko
United States1725 Posts
On May 29 2014 04:38 Chromatically wrote: Amiko, I'm most interested in who you want to lynch today. JWZ over HaruRH, but partially because I feel HaruRH may not have time to respond. I am a little loathe to vote JWZ (if I vote HaruRH or don't vote, it puts more pressure on him to answer) but I think timing just doesn't permit that. | ||
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Chromatically
United States1700 Posts
On May 29 2014 04:26 sqrtofneg1 wrote: Jabber - scum, but he might not be. Top scumreads: jwz palmar So why is it that you're not pushing either of these top scumreads? You have put your vote on both of them at points and then backed off very easily after their defense. It looks like you don't actually think they're scum, you're just going through the motions of accusing them and then accepting their defenses. | ||
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