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On March 31 2014 17:55 Djodref wrote:
I don't like JarJar at the moment. His analysis of poof is misinterpreting what really happened.
The so-called "slip" of poof is totally reasonable because rayn was pushing slam lynch while using "we should lynch the survivor" argument the most. The way rayn is bringing this up, poof has totally the right to call him "the guy wanting to kill not mafia". He is not speaking about Slam here, but about his perception of rayn's play. OK, maybe I missed where rayn says that "we should lynch the survivor". What rayn says is we should lynch slam because he CLAIMED survivor. You put that in quotes like it really represents rayns PoV but it doesn't. In fact he specifically says that slam could be scum:On March 30 2014 19:08 raynpelikoneet wrote:
You also claimed VT so there is a little chance you are mafia. On March 30 2014 23:54 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I am now telling everyone that survivor claims should always be lynched unless there is 100% scum because:
1) they can also be mafia fakeclaiming
2) they NEVER work for the town, they are basically +1 mafia even if they look like they are "helping"
And that's my exact thinking as well. And I think that should be poofs thinking as well, especially since he had to @ least somewhat think that slam was scum since he was votign for him. Look @ this post., he's not saying that that it's because rayn thinks he's survivor. He's saying that slam IS survivor:On March 31 2014 03:02 Tehpoofter wrote:
I don't think rayn is town he is playing completely different to the game I play with him before. He was aggressive but I feel like his push on Slam is an easy low hanging fruit type push. Survivor might not be town but its not mafia finding mafia > lynching the survivor. Rayn also should know that we need to look outside of just Slam either way we have to deduce how people are acting today because in an alignment swapping type setup the way you act day to day flip flopping on reads and stuff can give town good information.
On March 31 2014 17:55 Djodref wrote:
On top of that, JarJar is nitpicking poof filter to point out some contradiction, but the post is quoted is one of the first posts made into this game and is hardly irrelevant. I assume you mean hardly relevant. And why isn't it relevent? Do you think that wasn't a real vote?
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Next time you roll Serial Killer or any other third faction just claim to kush, he will understand you and will never lynch you.
Maybe you can talk about some smart things too...
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On March 31 2014 18:18 Tehpoofter wrote:
I stated my reasons for thinking it was scummy of rayn to want to auto lynch the survivor when looking for scum should be priority day 1 and survivor isn't technically scum. You took that quote out of context...
How is it out of context? You're basically doing the same thing here. You're posting as if you know for a fact that slam isn't scum.
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
On raynpelikoneet
So here is what I was doing at the start of this game. I was actually trying to accomplish something with my play. I was reproducing my behavior to a tee from the recent shadow mini mafia game.
+ Show Spoiler +On January 21 2014 09:31 kitaman27 wrote:
##Vote Sandroba On January 21 2014 11:28 kitaman27 wrote:
I'm not voting him as a joke. I think he is a great vote. We should lynch him today. On January 21 2014 10:46 kitaman27 wrote:
Wanna vote sandroba with me? He may or may not be scummy. On January 21 2014 10:34 kitaman27 wrote:
Do you think I'm trying to paint sandroba in a bad light using my "scummy thought process" like you mentioned or do you think that it was a random vote with little thought?
I random voted moments into the game, I refused to provide an explanation when asked, I requested that someone vote with me without details, I asked a similar question when prompted, and I moved off the random vote shortly after.
The goal here was to prompt someone to question my behavior and see if they attempt to make the connection or if they simply pass off my play as scummy. rayn mentioned that he observed shadow and toad and austin played in it, so even if they don't remember the random vote, it would likely be the first place to look as it was my most recent town game. It's important to note that I'm not trying to say that me emulating my shadow mafia play makes me town. I'm saying that the connection is there for anyone interested in finding it.
On March 30 2014 14:57 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Picture 2: Here is how kitaman does it. He makes an unclear argument and when people question him about it he does not answer but instead makes another unclear argument about the question. Repeat until noone can remember what was the original point and what the fuck we are even arguing about. Then he might posts some conclusions, a day or so later
I've seen a couple of mafia players do this and it works really well because most of the players tire out and just stop arguing because it's so annoying and in the end you can't make anything out of it anyways because it takes about 5 hours to get an answer to a simple question.
I was pretty happy that rayn had suggested that was was going to do some research and pushed him in the right direction several times as you can see below.
+ Show Spoiler +On March 30 2014 15:54 kitaman27 wrote:
As for your "web of disruption" post, it has a catchy name, but I'll respond once you come to an actual conclusion. On March 30 2014 16:23 kitaman27 wrote:
Well I'm going to bed now. When I wake up, can you provide a follow up to the "web of disruption" post? On March 31 2014 01:06 kitaman27 wrote:
rayn, have you finished your research yet?
On multiple occasions, rayn confirms that he will do the work to back up his initial suspicions.
+ Show Spoiler +On March 30 2014 14:57 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Now i gotta figure out if kita does this only as mafia or does he do this as town too (or maybe only as town?) On March 30 2014 16:25 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Yes. I'll watch the Formula 1 race that starts in ~30min and i'll do my research after that.
On March 31 2014 01:08 raynpelikoneet wrote:
not gonna do it. 90% i will find nothing useful and i don't care about this game enough to test if the 10% gives me something.
Yet when push comes to shove, he decides not to put the effort in. He spends the time into coming up with his thesis that I'm creating a "web of disruption", yet has no interest in backing it up. If he is going to call me scummy, when does he have no interest in catching me?
On March 30 2014 17:44 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Yeah i don't really carew about this game because i don't fee llike agruing with stupidity.
I might post something at some point, probably to tell who is scum, but don't expect me to explain anything.
I don't really feel like this game is gonna be fun so idontjustcare.
On March 31 2014 01:16 raynpelikoneet wrote:
The point was at that time i cared. After Toad's post i didn't.
On March 31 2014 16:25 raynpelikoneet wrote:
so kita and tehpoofer are most likely scum. maybe gumshoe.
Now there are three possible explanations:
1) He dropped the ball as town, attacking me without putting in the effort
2) He did the research as mafia, didn't like what he found, and dropped the case to avoid calling me town
3) He is a lazy scum player who didn't want to go after me at a point where several players are calling me town
If rayn thought that I was looking decently townie otherwise, then maybe I'd consider number one. The biggest issue that I have right now is that as far as I can tell, I am rayn's number one scum suspect. He is pushing slam for being anti-town and shows that he may have reconsidered his read on tehpoofer, yet not a word about myself.
On March 30 2014 14:57 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Picture 1: Here is how townies do the "make other people think and see if you can catch lazy people because they are more likely to be mafia and draw retarded conclusions" thingy (at least how i do it).
On March 30 2014 15:06 raynpelikoneet wrote:
In case it's unclear. It's like normally people give you a puzzle to solve and slowly give you pieces to the puzzle along the way. Then they assume townies complete the puzzle and mafia tries to force the pieces in wrong order.
rayn describes his play best. I don't think you can argue that he isn't being lazy here. rayn was given the pieces of the puzzle to solve and he chose not to because he "doesn't care".
On March 30 2014 15:45 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Not because i necessarily trust your read but because i trust Foolishness' read. *sigh*
On March 30 2014 15:52 raynpelikoneet wrote:
So if you are town we have a scumread on Hopeless from confirmed town good player Foolishness.
On March 30 2014 16:11 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I trust Foolishness the most atm.
##unvote
##vote Hopeless1der
This line of thought is pretty terrible. He explains his willingness to vote for hopelessness over a minor observation about hope a few hours into the game. Not only does he not consider that foolishness could be wrong, he is using the justification for the vote because he respects foolishness as a player, not because he thinks its a valid argument. He even goes as far as dropping his suspicion of myself due to my interaction with hope.
rayn states that he has done the most scum hunting in the game hands down, he suggests that I am his number one scum read, and he hasn't showed any attempt to figure out my alignment. As he mentioned earlier, he is trying to force the pieces in the wrong order.
The one thing holding me up is
1) His mass claim policy is consistent with his previous behavior as town
2) Slam is one of the most anti-town players in recent memory
Right now I'd probably be leaning towards a rayn lynch and hopefully having a vig take care of slam so he is removed as a discussion topic. I would like to look at a few more individuals before I finalize my vote.
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@ JarJar
On March 30 2014 12:20 Tehpoofter wrote:
So Things I know about Alakaslam:
1) He says he loves being mafia errr cyberman.
2) Based on the huge sample size of 1 game I've played with Slam he posted never as town.
He seems happy and has posted more in 14 pages than he did in 200+ pages last game as town.
Clear mafia here!!! WE GOT EM BOYS!!!
## Vote: Alakaslam
On March 30 2014 12:33 Tehpoofter wrote:
@Thrawn why vote slam? I mean I did pretty much make the best case that has ever or will ever be created in the history of man but you didn't even quote it here to praise me for my amazingness..... Please explain.
Doesn't look like a real vote to me... Just look at how he described his case himself after voting.
The other thing is that poof came back to the thread and then changed his approach of the game (i.e the focus on rayn). It's reasonable to change your target while the thread is evolving, so I think your point against poof is not valid.
Regarding the slip, I've read it again and yeah, my bad, it could be seen as a slip. But I don't think poof is mafia...
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
Djo, what are your current thoughts on rayn?
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yes kitaman is mafia.
I am so sure of it i can lynch him over Slam. If i am wrong you can lynch me next.
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
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I don't want to lynch either of you for the moment, could we all have a reasonable discussion so we can sort things out.
For example, can we try to avoid this kind of posts
On March 31 2014 23:20 raynpelikoneet wrote:
yes kitaman is mafia.
I am so sure of it i can lynch him over Slam. If i am wrong you can lynch me next.
I like the point kita just mentioned, but it's not enough to be sure rayn is mafia... Also I need to check his filter again to see if it's not far-fetched.
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
I'd actually like you to commit to town/mafia/null reads on each of us djo after you've taken a look.
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For kitaman's caliber of player that case is absolutely terrible. He focuses on totally unimportant things and refuses to even consider my explanations from town perspective. He hasn't focused on anything but those unimportant things in this game.
He has voted for thrawn -> apparently that dodn't go anywhere.
He has considered Hopeless scum -> never gave any conclusions but apparently now Hopeless is not scum any more because he wants to lynch the dude who agreed with him on Hopeless.
He has asked some useless questions -> no conclusion.
He wanted Slam to claim and never commented on anything people said on Slam.
He has done absolutely nothing in this game, has not tried to solve anything and i am the only lynch he can get.
##unvote
##vote kitaman27
i promise you he will flip mafia.
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There, i found my mafia on D1. 
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On March 31 2014 23:31 raynpelikoneet wrote:
He has done absolutely nothing in this game, has not tried to solve anything and i am the only lynch he can get.
He literally just analyzed your play and asserted that you are scummy by working through your motives related to "web of disruption" and lack of followup. In what universe is that "doing nothing" or "not trying to solve"? He could just as easily coast along on the slam lynch.
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On March 30 2014 23:54 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I am now telling everyone that survivor claims should always be lynched unless there is 100% scum because:
1) they can also be mafia fakeclaiming
2) they NEVER work for the town, they are basically +1 mafia even if they look like they are "helping"
Anyone who does not understand this is just plain out dumb or mafia. Period. Case closed. So um... WTF are you doing rayn?
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
On March 31 2014 23:31 raynpelikoneet wrote:
For kitaman's caliber of player that case is absolutely terrible. He focuses on totally unimportant things and refuses to even consider my explanations from town perspective. He hasn't focused on anything but those unimportant things in this game.
So what is your explanation from a town perspective?
The single largest post you've made this game suggests that I was creating a web of disruption without making a statement in regards to my alignment. You stated twice that you would put in the work to come to a conclusion about your observation. I asked three times for you to do the research. You explained that you weren't going to because you don't care. You post that I'm you're number one scum read, yet you still don't make any attempt to go after me. I then create a case against you and suddenly you want to change your vote?
You yourself said that when a town player creates a line of reasoning they expect a player to follow, a town player will try to figure something out and a mafia player will be lazy and create conclusions that are convenient to them, without a logical explanation.
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
So rayn, are you suggesting that I set up this trap as mafia, knowing that you would jump on it and call the behavior weird without calling me scum, knowing that you would refuse to put in the effort like you promised after pushing you in the direction three times, just so I could create a case against you?
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I am not elaborating further. kitaman is mafia. I have explained why i did what i did he does not refer to my reasoning but the actions instead. I have already explained them. I promise you all he is mafia.
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On March 31 2014 23:35 Hopeless1der wrote:Show nested quote +On March 31 2014 23:31 raynpelikoneet wrote:
He has done absolutely nothing in this game, has not tried to solve anything and i am the only lynch he can get.
He literally just analyzed your play and asserted that you are scummy by working through your motives related to "web of disruption" and lack of followup. In what universe is that "doing nothing" or "not trying to solve"? He could just as easily coast along on the slam lynch.
That's incorrect. Yes he did analyse those things but i have explained them and as i just said he does not look into conclsuions and how do they make / not make sense. That's what a townie would do.
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
On March 31 2014 23:31 raynpelikoneet wrote:
He has voted for thrawn -> apparently that dodn't go anywhere.
Correct, my read on thrawn shifted to town and I saw no reason to follow up. I states as much.
On March 31 2014 23:31 raynpelikoneet wrote:
He has considered Hopeless scum -> never gave any conclusions but apparently now Hopeless is not scum any more because he wants to lynch the dude who agreed with him on Hopeless.
Are you putting words in my mouth now? For someone who is promising that I a scum, you seem to be making up reasons. I haven't mentioned hopeless at all recently. He is actually one of the players I'm looking at right now.
On March 31 2014 23:31 raynpelikoneet wrote:
He wanted Slam to claim and never commented on anything people said on Slam.
Have you read my posts? I called him one of the most anti-tonw players in recent memory and requested a vig shot on slam.
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If rayn thought that I was looking decently townie otherwise, then maybe I'd consider number one. The biggest issue that I have right now is that as far as I can tell, I am rayn's number one scum suspect. He is pushing slam for being anti-town and shows that he may have reconsidered his read on tehpoofer, yet not a word about myself.
Anyone who has any brain left in this game this part by kitaman's post should be considered a scumclaim.
Read it please. "I wouldn't lynch this guy but he thinks i am mafia"
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EPT
