EPTwho knows if he is scum, i sure don't. I don't think he's a priority though. but either way, no matter his alignment, it's best for town if he posts his own stuff instead of writing non conclusive essays about every big case that comes up
Doctor Who Mafia 2 - Page 122
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thrawn2112
United States6918 Posts
who knows if he is scum, i sure don't. I don't think he's a priority though. but either way, no matter his alignment, it's best for town if he posts his own stuff instead of writing non conclusive essays about every big case that comes up | ||
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Amiko
United States1725 Posts
@Austinmcc: I liked your case and have a few other things to add that I thought contributed to your case when I reread kush. You focus primarily on kush’s early game, but I think there’s some recent comments that look bad, too. In this post on d3, kush comments on kita’s d2 case on Vivax. For context, kush voted on vivax d2. On April 05 2014 18:50 kushm4sta wrote: this is his only scumhunting post after d1. long but scummy. it's not good that all his effort is concentrated in one place. also not good that he wants to lynch vivax for reasons that boil down to pretty much "i dont really like his choice of nuke". even though I thought vivax gave an excellent reason to lynch alakaslam. Here, kush’s comments are weird for a couple of reasons. For one, the tone here seems to imply that kush doesn’t feel vivax is a good lynch… but kush voted for vivax n2. He also indicated multiple times through the game he felt vivax was a good lynch (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/445571-doctor-who-mafia-2?page=78#1541 for one example) Second, “it's not good that all his effort is concentrated in one place.” doesn’t make sense to me in context –what is kita focusing all of his effort into? It seems sensible that if kita is posting a case on vivax, it should focus on vivax. This could be explained by kush trying to distance himself from kita as a scumpartner. His read on Vivax also changes with very little prompting. After the linked post above (where Vivax is obviously scum), kush votes vivax (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=21114553). Then, kush moves vivax from “obvious scum” to “probably town” On April 04 2014 07:18 kushm4sta wrote: im reading his filter from today and it's like so engaged and shit. Dont remember him playing so enthusiastically as scum. I think i just overestimated what his town game looks like something. On April 04 2014 07:19 kushm4sta wrote: austinmcc - hella town kitaman27 - hella town Hopeless1der - probably town thrawn2112 - possible scum JarJarDrinks -possible scum Vivax - probably town Djodref - possible scum Amiko - possible scum Tehpoofter - possible scum The grounding feels very weak to me. Moreover, it feels kind of the opposite of what you’d expect. Like, let’s say I play a game with someone and say “He’s scum because he isn’t being silly!” then the person starts acting silly. If I really believed what I said earlier, I think my response should be “He’s just trying to be silly to pass it off” not “Oh, he’s being silly now, he must be town.” Regarding the “Too much information” On March 31 2014 22:08 kushm4sta wrote: I think there is evidence that kita has too much information. On April 02 2014 13:40 kushm4sta wrote: im kind of busy with shit now so I'm not going to filter dive at this second, which is what I really need to do. about kita having too much information.. since then i pretty much 180ed on that. It was how he said this game only has 1 or 2 scum, when i was approaching the game thinking there were 3 or 4. But in actuality, if kita were scum, he probably wouldn't have said that at all because he would be extra careful not to reveal he has too much information. Austin makes the point, which I think is pretty good, that the second post doesn’t make sense. Kush is saying, kita can’t be scum because he said something scummy. I agree with Austin but would actually take it a step further. Kush’s first post there is D1. The second post is D2. His 180 on kita could be a result of a conversion n1 (either kush converting kita, or kita converting kush). More to say in a few minutes | ||
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thrawn2112
United States6918 Posts
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
For all I care you can nuke hopeless. You should cause I won't be following kita's plan and lose the last chance to see if I can offensive jail. Kita's plan is useless anyway cause if one of us is scum he simply doesn't follow it and next day scum has won.[QUOTE] That doesn't make sense. If one of us is scum, they would be roleblocked by the other town player and unable to follow through with their protect anyways. | ||
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Amiko
United States1725 Posts
So earlier I posted this On April 06 2014 02:12 Amiko wrote: Thoughts on Nuke Targets > If the scumcheck isn't instant, I do not feel it makes sense to nuke kushm4sta because it would deny town the result of his check on kita. > If the scumcheck isn't instant, I do not feel it makes sense to nuke kita because kush will provide a check on him which is some information, even if it may be a lie. > I feel pretty good about austin as town, his play feels townie, his comments feel townie, and Vivax has claimed to have protected/roleblocked him both nights making it less likely he delivered KP or was converted. - I feel somewhat good about Vivax. If I jailed austin n1 and there was no kill, I think I also would have jailed austin n2. There's no guarantee he is actually a jailer, but his actions do feel consistent at least. He's currently low on my nuke list. When I posted this, kush had indicated his check may not be instant. Part of the reason I put the comments on kita and kush first was because I wanted to draw more attention to them. My thought was, scum!kushm4sta would have incentive to not reveal his check because I have indicated I want to use my nuke today. However, I indicated that I wouldn’t want to nuke kita/kush if the check was outstanding. In other words, if kush is scum, he had a strong incentive to claim that scumchecker didn’t work right away, or only worked at night. Then, it would be likely I would nuke into someone else, ensuring scum survive and potentially winning the game if they can convert. However, kush did state that he got a towncheck on kita. So, I feel a little less certain that they are a scumteam. | ||
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Vivax
21978 Posts
On April 06 2014 15:21 thrawn2112 wrote: i want him to post something that will move the thread along. what he's doing isn't who knows if he is scum, i sure don't. I don't think he's a priority though. but either way, no matter his alignment, it's best for town if he posts his own stuff instead of writing non conclusive essays about every big case that comes up Don't you think he's town for going for wrong speculation on my role when scum should know my claim is true? He suggested it couldn't be based on some false information. Also thrawn, there's this post from D1 that kinda raises questions: On April 01 2014 04:31 thrawn2112 wrote: i will also lynch slam over gumshoe in order to not lynch rayn but i will not like it. Afterwards you said slam can stay, yes. But at that particular time, why slam over gumshoe? It's not like gum did anything to clear himself at that point. | ||
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thrawn2112
United States6918 Posts
i wanted to lynch gumshoe i was meh about slam. it was starting to look like lymching slam would be the only way I could save rayn so I caved in and wrote that post. the "i will not like it" part specifically refers to me having to concede my gumshoe lynch, and lynch slam, who i didn';t care to lynch, in order to save rayn | ||
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Vivax
21978 Posts
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thrawn2112
United States6918 Posts
so it's based on past experience. i basically just gave up and decided that scummy hopeless doesn't equal a scum hopeless... which is a lesson i've had to learn over and over again. and I was sheeping rayn a little | ||
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thrawn2112
United States6918 Posts
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Amiko
United States1725 Posts
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Vivax
21978 Posts
On April 06 2014 15:54 Amiko wrote: Kita I started on your case and rereading but I'm too tired to gofurther tonight. I'll aim to do it first thing tomorrow. I'll hold the nuke until night phase, hopefully that won't screw us over. Nah it won't. It can't be roleblocked cause there's the announcement before phase end and it goes through vet and med protection. | ||
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Vivax
21978 Posts
Not gonna let you off the hook that quickly but you gain some townpoints for now. Will ask you some other stuff later. | ||
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Xatalos
Finland9675 Posts
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Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
I need to give thrawn a proper reread, but my PoE for scum are poof thrawn kush. | ||
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Xatalos
Finland9675 Posts
kushm4sta (1) - thrawn2112 Not Voting (7) - lots of people Currently kushm4sta is set to be lynched! The lynch will happen in at 21:00 GMT (+00:00). | ||
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austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
Kita --> thoughts on kush Everyone --> we should look at hopeless And as pointed out, given that rayn could use a night action to block conversions, it's unlikely that conversions happen any time, and much more likely it's a night action. | ||
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
On day one, he seems fairly townie to me. He pushes against the slam d1 lynch before the rayn lynch has been established and seems to be looking for scum slips. Once day two arrives, I start to have more issues. He starts defending me as if he knows that I'm town. On April 02 2014 13:49 kushm4sta wrote: 2 if you look at kita's case, he is quite open about having doubts that rayn is scum, and he points out things about rayn that look townie. This post seems scummy to me, because while it's true that I shared doubts about rayn, he automatically assumes that its for townie reasons, rather than me simply trying to hedge my bets and look better when rayn flips town. Take a look at how his views on Vivax evolve: On April 04 2014 01:32 kushm4sta wrote: ##Vote Vivax ^that's what i think about your defense. On April 04 2014 01:36 kushm4sta wrote: Vivax you have been subtly pushing the idea that I'm scum for a very long time. Also the idea that I will probably become scum in the future. Here you are trying to discredit my claim in a way that makes absolutely no sense. On April 04 2014 07:12 kushm4sta wrote: austin you have a townread on vivax? On April 04 2014 07:19 kushm4sta wrote: Vivax - probably town He goes from wanting to lynch Vivax on day two because of a bad defense, to asking austin about the read, to suddenly going to probably town because he "overestimated what his town games look like". What happened to the "terrible" defense that Vivax gave on day two that caused kush to vote him? He uses a minor point, while ignoring the bigger one, to justify a huge swing in reads, which seems scummy to me. On April 06 2014 10:02 kushm4sta wrote: also you realize im mother fucking river song right? This post is pretty scummy as well. When austin posts his case, rather than responding to anything he posts, he pushes the idea that a town sounding role can't possibly be mafia. On April 06 2014 10:59 kushm4sta wrote: i feel like half of this game has already been converted and everyone is mafia conspiring against me. He then posts a 1 liner about the case and then this, after which he disappears from the thread. He has a green check on me, yet he puts absolutely no effort into commenting on my case or even acknowledging that it exists. If I had a player I knew for a fact was town, I'd at least listen to what he has to say. Finally, his justification to waste the dt check on me is incredibly scummy. On April 05 2014 18:37 kushm4sta wrote: he says townie shit d1. he doesn't say townie shit for the rest of the game. He says that his read on me has changed from d1, yet on night two I'm "hella town". There isn't any indication that he is suspicious of me prior to changing his read. On April 02 2014 13:40 kushm4sta wrote: But in actuality, if kita were scum, he probably wouldn't have said that at all because he would be extra careful not to reveal he has too much information. On April 05 2014 18:45 kushm4sta wrote: cause rayn had a power role directly relating to conversions. So does kita probably since he mentioned conversions d1. One of the reasons he justifies checking me is my knowledge of conversions. On day one he mentioned that I would be careful to not reveal the setup and now on day three he wants to check because because I have setup knowledge again? If he is refering to the fact that I'm a likely conversion target and not the setup knowledge, how could he possibly think that? rayn martyred himself to ensure my death and 75% of the players have a scum read on me going into day three. How could he possibly justify that I've been converted over the players that everyone thought I was town? If he thought I was mafia from the start, that would be one thing, but the number one conversion target makes no sense. On April 04 2014 07:19 kushm4sta wrote: kitaman27 - hella town thrawn2112 - possible scum Amiko - possible scum Tehpoofter - possible scum On April 05 2014 18:23 kushm4sta wrote: ok so i just read kita. d1 is really townie but then his activity falls off a lot. I wasn't really thinking about scum that could have been converted but yeah both kita and tehpoof look like possible conversions. I'm checking kita. The people on this list are who would I would be especially suspicious of if we were to lynch him and he flipped mafia. Originally, I assumed kush was probably town for just town checking me to save me from a lynch. What I'm thinking now is that he didn't have a choice with the nuke in play. If he fake claimed and had a red check, then he would essentially be trading himself 1 for 1 with me at night and confirming amiko as town for nuking him. It's possible that someone like thrawn or tehpoof is his scum buddy and checking them would force him to either lie about the check or bus a scum buddy. This is especially dangerous in a situation with a nuke. If his check is ever revealed to be false, both himself and his check go down together. I think kush may have been a possible conversion target. He is never shot by mafia and usually makes it pretty far because people just ignore him. Scum may have wanted to acquire his day vig ability, not realizing that it was 1-shot on night two. I need to look if a kush/vivax pair makes sense. If it does, then we might have a chance this game after all. If the pair doesn't make sense and I had to choose between the two, I'm not sure who I would go with yet. At least Vivax has the fact that he is active and cares about the game going for him. kush on the other hand is just observing at this point. | ||
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kitaman27
United States9245 Posts
On April 03 2014 04:37 Vivax wrote: Kush just to be sure, do you think revealing the details of your role could benefit scum? If not, please post details. On April 03 2014 05:03 Vivax wrote: Fuck's sake. Kush, is it a 1-shot-ability? On April 03 2014 05:06 Vivax wrote: Kush u genius say it's one-shot -.- This exchange seems really natural. I don't think this is something that you rehearse in the qt, because kush seems that he doesn't have a clue what Vivax is getting at. On April 03 2014 08:14 Vivax wrote: Or maybe kush stole his vote. He also doesn't seem to have knowledge of kush's role here. On April 04 2014 01:32 kushm4sta wrote: ##vote vivax On April 04 2014 01:32 kushm4sta wrote: ^that's what i think about your defense. I know kush likes to bus scum buddies, but his vote really opened the opportunity for a lynch if people agreed with my original case. The one thing that I do think is fishy is his sudden change of read on Vivax from scum -> town without a real explanation. Today he hasn't even really considered him at a point that could possibly be LYLO. Based on my gut and that first exchange between the two, I'd say they probably aren't scum buddies together. Bah, gotta think about this now. I guess I'll try to see who would be likely kush buddies and likely vivax buddies and then go with whatever group seems more likely. I still want to read hope one more time because he is definitely being overlooked right now. | ||
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austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
You were supposed to say they were scumbuddies. I have a post in another window about the Kush/Vivax interactions on Kush's ability being one or multi shot. You were going to slip up and be lazy. I was going to post that and go AHA! And then we were going to lynch Kush and yourself and declare glorious town victory. | ||
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