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On February 27 2014 07:06 Blazinghand wrote:
If a VT dies N0 the cop should claim if he thinks it's a good idea. I'd say if he has a greencheck on the dead VT, then he shouldn't claim unless scum is fakeclaiming, because otherwise why bother right
Well we'll be @ mylo. So I think cop claims. Then after the inevitable counter we vote no-lynch. Then @ night we can all vote on 1 player for both cops to check (and for the doctor to heal). This does 1 of several things:
- If they both say scum then no prob, we lynch scum
- If they both say town then we have a confirmed town that we'll never lynch. And it's gonna be someone that people are likely suspicious of
- If they disagree and the person is scum, the real cop now knows the whole scumteam
- If they disagree and the person is town, that person now knows which cop is legit
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Blazinghand
United States25560 Posts
On February 27 2014 07:13 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On February 27 2014 07:08 Blazinghand wrote:On February 27 2014 07:06 Xatalos wrote:On February 27 2014 07:05 JarJarDrinks wrote:
If VT dies N0:
- Cop should claim
elseif Doc dies N0:
- Cop should claim ONLY if he has a redcheck
elseif Cop dies N0:
- Maybe Doc should claim. Gonna give this some more thought
Why should Doc claim in any situation...? JJD actually probably isn't scum, because scum would know that Doc wouldn't ever claim cause that wouldn't really do anything to hurt scum. Scum would be aware of what tactics blues can use on them because scum has been hanging out chatting for a day now about the setup and claims. Unless JJD is doing a really good job of playing dumb, or he actually is dumb (he isn't), he's town. He clearly hasn't thought this true which is, (sigh), a townie trait. Yeah, I have a hard time seeing such a blunder from scum. Too stupid to be scum prevails.
Really what it comes down to is that even if JJD were the kind of guy to not think of this thing as scum, he also has a partner and he's been discussing with his partner for almost 24 hours. Scum NEEDS to fakeclaim in this setup. Whoever our 2 scummers are, they've been thinking about fakeclaiming for almost a day now; how to claim, when to claim, who will counterclaim, and what to claim. They know that Doctor shouldn't just claim willy-nilly. The only situations where that makes sense (ie doctor saves someone N1 and it's D2 and he wants to claim it or something) don't apply during D1 when the claims happen. JJD as scum would have thought this through. He would be trying to amass towncred by making good suggestions, and talking about "maybe the doc should claim if the cop dies n0" really makes no sense. Scum wouldn't even consider it as a threat to deal with.
It's mostly not about "too stupid to be scum" which is false (since a stupid player can of course roll scum) but that scum in this setup almost necessarily already know everything about claiming, and JJD clearly does not. He couldn't have known I'd latch onto this and call him town for it; in fact, an ineffective statement like that is more likely to draw fire than praise, so as scum he'd try to only make true statements rather than things that don't make sense.
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Blazinghand
United States25560 Posts
On February 27 2014 07:14 JarJarDrinks wrote:Show nested quote +On February 27 2014 07:06 Blazinghand wrote:
If a VT dies N0 the cop should claim if he thinks it's a good idea. I'd say if he has a greencheck on the dead VT, then he shouldn't claim unless scum is fakeclaiming, because otherwise why bother right Well we'll be @ mylo. So I think cop claims. Then after the inevitable counter we vote no-lynch. Then @ night we can all vote on 1 player for both cops to check (and for the doctor to heal). This does 1 of several things: - If they both say scum then no prob, we lynch scum - If they both say town then we have a confirmed town that we'll never lynch. And it's gonna be someone that people are likely suspicious of - If they disagree and the person is scum, the real cop now knows the whole scumteam - If they disagree and the person is town, that person now knows which cop is legit
The scumteam just shoots the real cop in this situation. The fake cop is just very quiet and doesn't say anything as he gets lynched D2. Then the last scum goes into 2-1 LYLO and fakeclaims doctor (or doesn't) and either way has a 50% chance of winning. This might sound silly but I'm just pointing out your plan isn't foolproof. Dirkzor and I as scum last time had a plan like this to subvert a plan like yours.
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If doc claims and isn't countered then we have confirmed town. Seems good if we're planning on lynching day 1 since we'll be @ mylo.
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We covered this pregame. Scum not counter-claiming is simply too close to a concession unless doc dies n0.
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On February 27 2014 07:18 Blazinghand wrote:Show nested quote +On February 27 2014 07:13 Xatalos wrote:On February 27 2014 07:08 Blazinghand wrote:On February 27 2014 07:06 Xatalos wrote:On February 27 2014 07:05 JarJarDrinks wrote:
If VT dies N0:
- Cop should claim
elseif Doc dies N0:
- Cop should claim ONLY if he has a redcheck
elseif Cop dies N0:
- Maybe Doc should claim. Gonna give this some more thought
Why should Doc claim in any situation...? JJD actually probably isn't scum, because scum would know that Doc wouldn't ever claim cause that wouldn't really do anything to hurt scum. Scum would be aware of what tactics blues can use on them because scum has been hanging out chatting for a day now about the setup and claims. Unless JJD is doing a really good job of playing dumb, or he actually is dumb (he isn't), he's town. He clearly hasn't thought this true which is, (sigh), a townie trait. Yeah, I have a hard time seeing such a blunder from scum. Too stupid to be scum prevails. Really what it comes down to is that even if JJD were the kind of guy to not think of this thing as scum, he also has a partner and he's been discussing with his partner for almost 24 hours. Scum NEEDS to fakeclaim in this setup. Whoever our 2 scummers are, they've been thinking about fakeclaiming for almost a day now; how to claim, when to claim, who will counterclaim, and what to claim. They know that Doctor shouldn't just claim willy-nilly. The only situations where that makes sense (ie doctor saves someone N1 and it's D2 and he wants to claim it or something) don't apply during D1 when the claims happen. JJD as scum would have thought this through. He would be trying to amass towncred by making good suggestions, and talking about "maybe the doc should claim if the cop dies n0" really makes no sense. Scum wouldn't even consider it as a threat to deal with. It's mostly not about "too stupid to be scum" which is false (since a stupid player can of course roll scum) but that scum in this setup almost necessarily already know everything about claiming, and JJD clearly does not. He couldn't have known I'd latch onto this and call him town for it; in fact, an ineffective statement like that is more likely to draw fire than praise, so as scum he'd try to only make true statements rather than things that don't make sense.
I was referring to the fact that it would be too stupid to make a suggestion like that as scum after discussing strategy for 24 hours.
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JJD's plan makes a certain amount of sense. It'll depend a lot on the situation though (it might be a useful idea if Mafia hit a VT and it's hard to tell which of the claimers is lying).
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Where's the other 3 clowns?
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Here's the other thing w/ the cop dying N0.
If we are about to lynch scum, there WILL be a doc claim. Then the real doc counters and we end up w/ the claim anyway. @ least if we force the claim early, we're making scum commit to their lie before the fact.
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Btw Sn0_Man, you think BH's early tryhard makes him scum or that was just a joke?
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On February 27 2014 07:38 Xatalos wrote:
Btw Sn0_Man, you think BH's early tryhard makes him scum or that was just a joke?
If I was serious about my scumread I'd be making a case duh.
On February 27 2014 07:38 JarJarDrinks wrote:
Here's the other thing w/ the cop dying N0.
If we are about to lynch scum, there WILL be a doc claim. Then the real doc counters and we end up w/ the claim anyway. @ least if we force the claim early, we're making scum commit to their lie before the fact.
Okay did u confuse doc and cop too?
I r confuse
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On February 27 2014 07:38 JarJarDrinks wrote:
Here's the other thing w/ the cop dying N0.
If we are about to lynch scum, there WILL be a doc claim. Then the real doc counters and we end up w/ the claim anyway. @ least if we force the claim early, we're making scum commit to their lie before the fact.
There's merit in forcing scum to act without knowledge of the power roles though. If Cop/Doc just claim right away, scum can plan accordingly and keep their stories straight more easily.
Not to mention that it's wasteful to get a Doc killed for no clear reason.
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Blazinghand
United States25560 Posts
On February 27 2014 07:38 JarJarDrinks wrote:
Here's the other thing w/ the cop dying N0.
If we are about to lynch scum, there WILL be a doc claim. Then the real doc counters and we end up w/ the claim anyway. @ least if we force the claim early, we're making scum commit to their lie before the fact.
or, we mislynch and go into N1 with zero chance of survival because scum will just shoot the doctor -.-
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OH
ic.
Doc claiming is bad mcbadbad.
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oke jjd is actively promoting ways for town to lose tho wtf
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Blazinghand
United States25560 Posts
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I don't really think there is any good situation for a Doc to claim unless it's to clearly save himself or another townie (that was NK'd earlier, for example).
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On February 27 2014 07:02 Blazinghand wrote:
actually yeah let me add to this: don't fakeclaim doctor or cop if you are not the doctor or cop. This will only go poorly.
Aww I kinda thought about this 
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Blazinghand
United States25560 Posts
On February 27 2014 07:45 Artanis[Xp] wrote:Show nested quote +On February 27 2014 07:02 Blazinghand wrote:
actually yeah let me add to this: don't fakeclaim doctor or cop if you are not the doctor or cop. This will only go poorly. Aww I kinda thought about this
ALSO DON'T CLAIM VT CAUSE IT MAKES IT EASIER FOR SCUM TO SHOOT THE COP/DOC.
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On February 27 2014 07:45 Blazinghand wrote:Show nested quote +On February 27 2014 07:45 Artanis[Xp] wrote:On February 27 2014 07:02 Blazinghand wrote:
actually yeah let me add to this: don't fakeclaim doctor or cop if you are not the doctor or cop. This will only go poorly. Aww I kinda thought about this ALSO DON'T CLAIM VT CAUSE IT MAKES IT EASIER FOR SCUM TO SHOOT THE COP/DOC.
WHERES MY CAPTAIN OBVIOUS IMAGE MACRO
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EPT
