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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
On December 07 2013 00:02 Risen wrote: I swear you were just saying I was capable of crazy shenans and now you're saying VE is incapable of them. You scam bref? I think he's saying it's less likely that me+VE are in cahoots than you soon sneaky things | ||
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kushm4sta
United States8878 Posts
On December 06 2013 23:37 Mocsta wrote: hes talking about lynching MZ, and associates Rean in the same sentence. Clearly, from what I wrote above, he was stating a waivering read with Rean. How is that a misinterpretation, let alone scummy Kush. HE didn't say anything about wanting to lynch rean/mz/ OR roffles. It was simply a statement about connections and whatnot. OFC his read is wavering on rean. Rean is behaving very anti town. And all of a sudden in your mind he is lining up lynches??? Scumaustin would know he wasn't in a position to line up shit. | ||
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Mocsta
Australia9388 Posts
On December 07 2013 00:02 Risen wrote: I swear you were just saying I was capable of crazy shenans and now you're saying VE is incapable of them. You scam bref? lol I'm saying he needs to get a check off and reassess from there I dunnon why u r talking about shennanies. Austin raised that. | ||
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austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
On December 06 2013 23:52 Mocsta wrote: I don't see boatloads in roffles D1 filter. There's a small amount of reads though, and that's what there is to go on. hmmm. still reads as a -> b -> c to me but ok. look I get the change in stance in rean. completely acceptable. its why i was surprised u still talked a out him flipping scum. if its not a then b then c what scenario does it make sense for a riffles flip? If he's only posting about like 3-4 people, I wouldn't think he's posting about scumbuddies. And he leans decent on MZ, brings him up a bunch. MZ, jay, and gtrsrs are the folks he talks about. If MZ is mafia, I don't THINK that out of a tiny tiny subset of people, roffles brings MZ up that much and calls him scummy. Side not that, in his reasons for MZ being mafia, it's partially because people got suspicious of MZ and MZ got hostile. From a dude who...seems to be universally known as pretty hostile. That makes it seem, to me, like a legit read, because I don't think you call someone scummy for a characteristic you're known for if you're mafia? But if MZ town, then the not talking about scumbuddies argument is weaker. Rean isn't in roffles's filter, but seemed legitimately upset at roffles's kill yourself post. Just gut, that was not a scum on scum reaction, you don't even halfway try to get your scumbuddy banned. You may chew them out in QT, tell them to knock it off before you lose a scum to modkill, but I don't think you go in thread that hard half-asking for a scumbuddy to get disciplined. That's also ALL of rean's personal interaction for D1 basically, he doesn't give much, if anything, in the way of commentary on anyone else. Again, odd if scumbuddies. So I think a roffles flip makes sense if...probably neither of rean/MZ are scum. You don't immediately flip him, but there are these connections that I draw to roffles based on his filter and rean's reaction. Otherwise, his filter is pretty bare and limited in scope, he has an iffy defense of gtrsrs (doesn't give a crap cuz he didn't get kha'zix, entirely speculative but also feels maybe right), etc. TL;DR ---- Roffles's filter doesn't give me super happy thoughts. BUT I draw connections to MZ and Rean off his filter. If either of those is scum, I don't think he's likely to be scum because of the interplay between them. It's mostly that, the...negative side of things? If either of those two is scum, he's unlikely scum. If neither of them is scum, then I don't love his filter and he's lost the connections that might make him town for me. | ||
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Mocsta
Australia9388 Posts
On December 07 2013 00:03 kushm4sta wrote: HE didn't say anything about wanting to lynch rean/mz/ OR roffles. It was simply a statement about connections and whatnot. OFC his read is wavering on rean. Rean is behaving very anti town. And all of a sudden in your mind he is lining up lynches??? Scumaustin would know he wasn't in a position to line up shit. you are guilty of reading literally how else are those players in question going to flip? by suggesting that, it implies a sequence. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
On December 06 2013 23:58 Mocsta wrote: ve is not getting lynched hes lux ffs the parity cop His role does not make him town. Picking parity cop as scum is good because you deny a strong town role (inv), there is a hidden ability in the role so you are not useless and you gain town credit because of your pick in the first place. The thing is Koshi is gonna invent an item that publicly outs all reports on D3 (tracker/watcher/cop/etc.) and it proves VE has actually copped people and not done something else. If he has not copped people then he is scum, if he has he is town. | ||
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austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
On December 07 2013 00:03 kushm4sta wrote: +1 and +1 Scumaustin would know he wasn't in a position to line up shit.  Yes mocsta, it implies I would be looking at roffles for a lynch in that case. But right now, you're speculating that, essentially, I would take a stance on D2 based on some connections, and then would just hammer it through after AT LEAST 2 flips. If rean and MZ both ever flip, and both flip town, and I post nothing but Roffles's D1 filter and say he should be lynched, then 10000% kill me. If I'm trying to railroad someone that far down the line by pointing out early stuff, sure, I'm mafia trying to set up mislynches. But holy balls. It feels like you're both speculating that I'm saying "No matter what ever happens, I'm lynching this dude if x occurs." Maybe he actually posts. Maybe he's got a champ that semi-clears him. Who knows? We'll find out later. All I can say is his posting so far doesn't do much for me, but I don't think he's mafia if either of those two are. At the very least, how do you feel about how I'm drawing connections? You okay with the logic behind why I think he's not scum if either of them are? | ||
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Mocsta
Australia9388 Posts
On December 07 2013 00:06 austinmcc wrote: hmmm thats actually reasonable.I don't see boatloads in roffles D1 filter. There's a small amount of reads though, and that's what there is to go on. If he's only posting about like 3-4 people, I wouldn't think he's posting about scumbuddies. And he leans decent on MZ, brings him up a bunch. MZ, jay, and gtrsrs are the folks he talks about. If MZ is mafia, I don't THINK that out of a tiny tiny subset of people, roffles brings MZ up that much and calls him scummy. Side not that, in his reasons for MZ being mafia, it's partially because people got suspicious of MZ and MZ got hostile. From a dude who...seems to be universally known as pretty hostile. That makes it seem, to me, like a legit read, because I don't think you call someone scummy for a characteristic you're known for if you're mafia? But if MZ town, then the not talking about scumbuddies argument is weaker. Rean isn't in roffles's filter, but seemed legitimately upset at roffles's kill yourself post. Just gut, that was not a scum on scum reaction, you don't even halfway try to get your scumbuddy banned. You may chew them out in QT, tell them to knock it off before you lose a scum to modkill, but I don't think you go in thread that hard half-asking for a scumbuddy to get disciplined. That's also ALL of rean's personal interaction for D1 basically, he doesn't give much, if anything, in the way of commentary on anyone else. Again, odd if scumbuddies. So I think a roffles flip makes sense if...probably neither of rean/MZ are scum. You don't immediately flip him, but there are these connections that I draw to roffles based on his filter and rean's reaction. Otherwise, his filter is pretty bare and limited in scope, he has an iffy defense of gtrsrs (doesn't give a crap cuz he didn't get kha'zix, entirely speculative but also feels maybe right), etc. TL;DR ---- Roffles's filter doesn't give me super happy thoughts. BUT I draw connections to MZ and Rean off his filter. If either of those is scum, I don't think he's likely to be scum because of the interplay between them. It's mostly that, the...negative side of things? If either of those two is scum, he's unlikely scum. If neither of them is scum, then I don't love his filter and he's lost the connections that might make him town for me. and also clarifies that summary post I held in question what do u make of mz response about koshi. he seems to be the core of all your reads. does that response change anything? | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
Now we got Fuba who apparently hasn't even got an idea that there is a mfia game he should be playing.. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On December 07 2013 00:09 raynpelikoneet wrote: His role does not make him town. Picking parity cop as scum is good because you deny a strong town role (inv), there is a hidden ability in the role so you are not useless and you gain town credit because of your pick in the first place. The thing is Koshi is gonna invent an item that publicly outs all reports on D3 (tracker/watcher/cop/etc.) and it proves VE has actually copped people and not done something else. If he has not copped people then he is scum, if he has he is town. Well, it's possible for him to use his check both nights to cover bases (his other role is claimed to be a laser snipe, so he wouldn't be using that as far as we know) and still be scum. Is such an item from Koshi allowed by the mods? (do we know this?) | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
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Mocsta
Australia9388 Posts
On December 07 2013 00:12 austinmcc wrote: +1 and +1 Yes mocsta, it implies I would be looking at roffles for a lynch in that case. But right now, you're speculating that, essentially, I would take a stance on D2 based on some connections, and then would just hammer it through after AT LEAST 2 flips. If rean and MZ both ever flip, and both flip town, and I post nothing but Roffles's D1 filter and say he should be lynched, then 10000% kill me. If I'm trying to railroad someone that far down the line by pointing out early stuff, sure, I'm mafia trying to set up mislynches. But holy balls. It feels like you're both speculating that I'm saying "No matter what ever happens, I'm lynching this dude if x occurs." Maybe he actually posts. Maybe he's got a champ that semi-clears him. Who knows? We'll find out later. All I can say is his posting so far doesn't do much for me, but I don't think he's mafia if either of those two are. At the very least, how do you feel about how I'm drawing connections? You okay with the logic behind why I think he's not scum if either of them are? yes the connectiions are ok as per the previous post in responded my mind doesn't work that way when discussing reads hence my misinterpretation. please continue | ||
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austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
He might be trying to determine Koshi's alignment, but so what? He's barely talking to anyone else at that point. If he really thinks Koshi ain't getting lynched, why is Koshi's alignment the #1 priority and not.....anyone else who might be scum/lynched? I think there's some merit to the fact that he doesn't PUSH anyone either. Again, look at all his posts on LSB. He does sort of the same thing as with Koshi, except LSB isn't unlynchable. Just a lot of picking and calling things scummy, but there's never really that final conclusion where you feel comfortable someone has a scumread and wants to lynch it. Look at sandro trying to lynch me, maybe onegu on Odin. Even if both are wrong, they're finding someone, writing cases-ish, and pushing that guy. Asking for comment, seeking consensus. MZ is wasting his time on Koshi because he's not going to do any of that if Koshi ain't lynchable. geript also found MZ scummy for other reasons, would be interested to see MZ's thoughts on that. Overall, no. His hopping in, defending self a little, and then dipping out doesn't really move my needle. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On December 07 2013 00:17 raynpelikoneet wrote: No jcarl, it's not possible. It's dumb and VE is not dumb. Lol why is it not possible? I agree that VE isn't dumb, and that's exactly why I would expect something like that if he were a scum parity cop. Scum have yet to lose a member, so it would be incredibly easy to bus one (especially a lurker one) to gain town cred. | ||
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Mocsta
Australia9388 Posts
does the above apply because itsnscummy, ornbecause mz knows better? out of the above, I find the LSB stuff quite damning I admit. I still think the koshi stuff is ok | ||
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austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
And while he says My interactions with him are not about randomly shitting on him, they were trying to get him to help us. Like if you look at it that's primarily what I'm after. I don't think I agree with that?On December 05 2013 01:08 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Starts off okay with killing koshi.you know what, fuck your role I am absolutely ok with killing koshi right now. Seriously how hard is it to do ANYTHING AT ALL TO HELP THE FUCKING TOWN? Like if you're not gonna play then why join the game. On December 05 2013 02:19 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: So the content of what he posted doesn't matter, only that he posted? Well broadcast the fucking message to the scum team, all you guys need to do is post a halfassed analysis and koshi will call you town. KOSHI GIVES A READ ON JAY, i.e. is playing the game and giving reads, and MZ dumps on it. MZ says he wants koshi to help us, but the moment koshi DOES give a read, dump dump. On December 05 2013 02:25 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Wat? Your first paragraph literally makes no sense.] And now you think he's town? Your paragraph makes no sense. Not "what are you saying here", not really specifically questioning and trying to figure out what koshi is saying. Just "you make no sense and I'm going to implicitly mock your read" On December 05 2013 02:28 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: It's not about what jay wrote, it's how koshi responded. You actually thought about what jay wrote and considered the point he was making in the scope of the game. koshi couldn't be assed to do anything like that. I am incredibly frustrated and fed up with koshi right now. Frustrated and fed up. During the time he was talking to koshi, he went from WOULD LYNCH to FRUSTRATED AND FED UP. At no point do I read him really trying to get Koshi involved and doing townie stuff. (Side note: MZ does poke at kush a little bit during the koshi thing, it's not 100% koshi interaction, but he's asking kush why kush thinks kurumi is mafia given that kurumi asked to be deadified. That's a fine, but SUPER EASY, question to ask) | ||
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Mocsta
Australia9388 Posts
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austinmcc
United States6737 Posts
On December 07 2013 00:24 Mocsta wrote: It applies because active and townie into do-nothing is something that I see from a lot of players that get scrutiny. You come out the gate townie, play a lot of D1 looking town, and then you start to trail off, because you really just needed the initial town reads on you.Austin does the above apply because itsnscummy, ornbecause mz knows better? out of the above, I find the LSB stuff quite damning I admit. I still think the koshi stuff is ok It's a piece of a pattern, where he comes out with a gtrsrs discussion case, gets some stuff rolling, is chatty and whatnot. Then he just kind of pokes around VE being town and LSB being scum, but without those same A TOWNIE IS DOING THIS feels. Then he pokes at koshi. Then he doesn't really do anything. It's not just inactivity, I can't call anyone out on that, but it's a pattern from a townie-looking start into just tailing off. I find that progression scummy in a veteran player, because I've seen it a couple times. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On December 07 2013 00:20 jcarlsoniv wrote: Lol why is it not possible? I agree that VE isn't dumb, and that's exactly why I would expect something like that if he were a scum parity cop. Scum have yet to lose a member, so it would be incredibly easy to bus one (especially a lurker one) to gain town cred. Or even better: If Koshi makes the item you expect, a scum parity VE could check you (since you're essentially confirmed town), and some town lurker (or otherwise questionable town player). He would know who to look at, he would get his parity check off, and gain town cred. But there's a problem. He's charging his laser, aiming at lurkers, and his trigger finger is getting itchy. How long are we able to rely on him using his parity check before he blows his laser and shoots some bitches? If he's town, he has to keep using that parity check. It's the only thing we can rely on for information that we know of. (or at least, that I know of) | ||
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Mocsta
Australia9388 Posts
the point about mz dumping on koshi was actually in directed to kush??? koshi interjected I'm heavily leaning back to voting Jonny | ||
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