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/obs
MY GAME FILTER BEGINS DIRECTLY ON PAGE 3!!!!!!!!!!! IF YOU ARE FILTER DIVING SKIP TO PG 3 MY GAME FILTER BEGINS DIRECTLY ON PAGE 3!!!!!!!!!!! IF YOU ARE FILTER DIVING SKIP TO PG 3 MY GAME FILTER BEGINS DIRECTLY ON PAGE 3!!!!!!!!!!! IF YOU ARE FILTER DIVING SKIP TO PG 3
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Dang i was about to in too i have no interest in that LoL one haha
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All playing in that PYP LoL game.
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Alright well i'm back in action soon so
/in
Obzy, OdinOfPergo, cakemanofdoom you guys should all in, storr and jonny too! gogo. This is my last newbie game
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Cmon yall! Let's get this game started gogogo /in gogogoog
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On December 18 2013 18:05 OdinOfPergo wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2013 03:56 Balla24 wrote: Alright well i'm back in action soon so
/in
Obzy, OdinOfPergo, cakemanofdoom you guys should all in, storr and jonny too! gogo. This is my last newbie game WOS PYP was technically my 4'th game. So I don't qualify for these anymore!
(
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I'm not even sure half the people who inn'ed would still be around now though
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I like smaller games better anyways :D
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On December 23 2013 16:31 JonnyLaw wrote: /in
I thought this would have started by now. Should let Odin play. He mod killed himself after two days in his fourth game anyway.
YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
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ohh Odin is banned for a game cause of pyp TT
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On December 26 2013 04:35 onlywonderboy wrote: /obs if possible. NOOO IN IN IN
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On January 02 2014 03:26 suki wrote: Hmm.. against my better judgement I think I'll sign up for this one :D
I've played in two newbie mafia's so I should be good.
YESSSSS!! (Suki from exegst by any chance?)
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Haha yeah well eXe is now dead so there's that. I just remember you cause you played my girlfriend and let her stay in the game for a looong time which was fun stuff :D
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Honestly that's better than i thought at this point though since this game took so long to fill up
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Who are we waiting on just curious
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Wow i just wanna know who i can bitch at for not being here even though they confirmed recently ^_^ pls guys
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wow such scum plan
##vote suki
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my filter is gonna reach 2 pgs before the game even starts at this point ttttttt
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Make sure to take cakeman off the obs list before game starts since he's a replacement now.
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gogo cakemanofdoom /in and onlywonderboy /in
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On January 04 2014 10:02 nyxnyxnyx wrote: wait so /replace doesn't work?
You are banned for a game for getting modkilled in PYP, see here:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=427933¤tpage=18#344
You need to /sitout on a game before you can join (/replace or /in) any game. Once you /sitout in a game that hasn't started (which you need to confirm with host and Gmarshal) then you can join or replace a new game AFTER the game you have sat out is finished.
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On January 04 2014 08:01 LoneMeow wrote: Still 11/13 confirmed.
Signups are open again, the unconfirmed players will be replaced on a first come, first served basis.
Game will start Sunday, Jan 05 10:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00) (in ) with whatever players we have at that point (setup will be modified as necessary).
Can you please take off the unconfirmed players on the signup list? If people see the thread that's most likely where they will look to see if the game is open or not, and won't bother to check later in the thread (especially considering how long it is).
If they comeback they will see the pms anyways.
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On January 04 2014 13:11 nyxnyxnyx wrote: wat how did I get an inactivity ban when I didn't even play PYP o_o I never accepted / confirmed
Dunno, take it up with WoS and GMarshal and co in the Ban List thread. Maybe we can get this started faster if you get cleared ^_^.
EDIT: Here is the banthread: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=427933
On September 04 2013 04:42 GMarshal wrote:How to get removed from the Ban List+ Show Spoiler + If you are semi-permanently banned, post here and your ban will be discussed.
If you are not semi-permanently banned, you must sit out a number of games equal to your Banned Game Count. You may sit out any game which is hosted on this forum unless the host of that game says otherwise (which usually happens in games which are over very quickly). Not playing in a game is not the same as sitting it out.
To sit out a game, you must do these two things during the signups of that game (assuming you are not currently sitting out a different game and the game in which you were banned has finished): 1. PM the host of the game you are sitting out saying you are sitting out that game. 2. Post here that you are sitting out that game. If you cannot point me to a post or PM clearly stating "I am sitting out XYZ Mafia," you are not sitting out that game.
I will note that you are sitting out that game once it starts. At the end of that game, your Banned Game Count will be reduced by 1 and you will be removed if if is 0. You cannot sit out two games which run concurrently. Your name will be added to the "People taken off the list" category so I can keep track of you in case you are banned again in the future. You cannot play in other games which follow the Ban List until the last game in which you are sitting out has finished.
PM Me when the game you are sitting out is over so I can remove the ban
What to do if you have a problem with your banFirst talk to the moderator who modkilled you and asked for a ban in the first place. Try to explain to them why the punishment is incorrect in your situation. If that does not work, post the situation here. I will not make decisions about bans by other hosts via PM. Anyone can give their opinion in these situations. + Show Spoiler +What to do if there is a mistake on the listIf I forget to update that you are sitting out a game or if I forget to remove you from the list, or if I make any other mistake regarding this list, please send me a PM or post here and I will fix the situation as soon as possible. My apologies in advance if this happens. My roleI am an arbitrator and mediator. I keep track of the collective decisions of the mafia forum members in general and the hosts of the game in particular. This is an open environment moderation-wise. I will post my opinions on most issues, but what I say is not the final word. Feel free to chime in and give your opinion. Please PM me or post your problem here so everyone can discuss it. In the end, I will try to honor what the host decides, if it is within reason. However if I make a "final call" it is final, please appeal final calls through PMs. It is within my power to deny any ban. The final goal being to create a community where everyone can enjoy mafia,. Rules for this threadIf you are not a host or cohost, please do not request bans for anyone without PMing me first. If you are a host requesting bans, PM me to let me know you've requested bans so I don't neglect to notice for a week or something. If I tell you to stop discussing a topic in a ban discussion, you drop it. I don't care what your opinion on the relevance of the subject is, you drop it. Similarly, if I tell you to stop spamming the ban list thread, you stop. This is hollowed ground gentelmen and ladies, you will not flame you will not shit post and you will not misbehave. TL Bans *will* result if necessary. Final noteThe host of your game has the first say on what happens in your game. If you have a problem with how your game is being run or how another player is treating you in that game, talk to the host first. You should only come here if you cannot resolve the situation by talking to the host of your game. + Show Spoiler [Complete Ban List] + pharcyd3 myRZeth. goodkarma hermeane cephiro hzflank Stutters695 Oatsmaster VayneAuthority Kurumi OdinofPergo geript (3) nyxnyxnyx Storrzerg Kenpachi Bill Murray gtrsrs Onegu Roffles.
+ Show Spoiler [Semi-permanent bans] + Zorkmid Scaramanga Jugan Showtime! aka Best[alive] Attackzerg more_minerals aka triflejack laguerta aka dessx FourFace
+ Show Spoiler [People taken off the list] ++ Show Spoiler [Warnings] + Lord Velocity Hopeless1der debears DarthPunk istandwithmitt StorrZerg Mattchew
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On January 04 2014 13:23 nyxnyxnyx wrote: oh, so i was considered in right after /in because the game didn't use confirmations. well that's new, didn't know that would happen. woulda been down to play it too, if they didnt have to delay the start so long cos of thanksgiving and people whining
off-topic, why would games NOT use confirmation PMs? isn't it great to weed out inactives right at the start?
No confirmation = less waiting... If i were you i would pm WoS and see if its negotiable since its reasonable that you are new and didn't expect that. I wouldn't change it if I were him but it's worth a shot, plus it would get this game going faster which would make me happy ^_^ Regardless, you should definitely /sitout this game in the meantime.
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Like I said, you should /sitout at least. That way you can play future games.
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BUMP:
THIS GAME IS STILL OPEN FOR A BUNCH MORE HOURS. NEED 1-2 SIGNUPS.
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I've got a possible in at the last second from someone, he said if we still need people by the deadline he'll in. Hopefully he does it soon :D
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This means i'm confirmed town right? Yay ^_^
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Yes type /in ! (Make sure you read all the OP though, rules are important and you must make sure you can be active in the game ^_^ :D:D)
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On January 06 2014 05:22 nyxnyxnyx wrote: From: GMarshal TL Staff [ 21335 posts | Profile | Buddy ] Subject: Re: TL Mafia Ban Date: 1/6/14 04:22 You basically need to talk with the host of whatever game you got banned for, if they're amenable to removing you, I'll do it ^_^
nooo, don't start!
Told you to pm WoS AND gmarshal silly..
in any case: /SITOUT before the game starts. (Hopefully you can get your ban overturned and then you can be /replace, cause im pretty confident we're gonna have a modkill in this game unfortunately)
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And we're full ^_^ HYPE~~~~~~
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Interesting so suki is confirmed mafia for only being town in her dreams~
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I would like to nominate myself for longest pre-game filter of 2014...
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Eeek you're gonna have to change that in this game if you wanna keep up
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On January 06 2014 06:12 chinstrap wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2014 06:08 Balla24 wrote: I would like to nominate myself for longest pre-game filter of 2014... A couple more and you'l be at 3 pages!
I planned these last few posts so that i'll my game filter will start on pg 3, to make it easier for people to just skip all this pregame crap ^_^
This will be my last pregame post~ :D
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Innocent child games 3x in a row... wow haha i find that funny but i guess its not all that rare...
Hi guys!
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Who's gonna help me create a tough environment for mafia to hide in & help me lynch some mafia? If so, how do you suggest we proceed in day 1?
My top priorities are
- to start the game at a very high pace, to make sure that lurking is not only discouraged but also easy to spot and call out. - immediately start some conversation by having some arguments (this is where its a bit tricky), we need people to fos right away when they feel off about somebody so that we can start reading each other.
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@Asuna Hihi~
Considering you are a new comer, what is your experience with this game? Is this your first time, how did you get into it etc..
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So like, have you played a lot or have you watched/read any games before this?
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On January 06 2014 07:38 onlywonderboy wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2014 07:34 chinstrap wrote:On January 06 2014 07:29 Balla24 wrote: Who's gonna help me create a tough environment for mafia to hide in & help me lynch some mafia? If so, how do you suggest we proceed in day 1?
My top priorities are
- to start the game at a very high pace, to make sure that lurking is not only discouraged but also easy to spot and call out. - immediately start some conversation by having some arguments (this is where its a bit tricky), we need people to fos right away when they feel off about somebody so that we can start reading each other. Sounds like overeager towncred grabbing scum play to me. ##Vote: Balla24 I think you might be jumping the gun a little bit on this one. Don't get me wrong, Balla plays a scary mafia because he looks town almost the entire game, but in the game he was town he was very active and led the town by making lots and lots of posts. So his MO is always being active regardless of alignment.
I appreciate the defense but... he's IC he can do whatever he wants including mess around... Instead of trying to pocket me let's hear how you're gonna help me achieve my goals of catching scum
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@Asuna how do you feel about TheChyz's entry post?
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You must of misunderstood me... "my goals of catching scum" not specifically my OWN priorities. I'm fine with others having their own priorities, but overall this game is about catching scum.
Another point, i'm not active in lynching lurkers, that's not what he said and its not what I said. My goal is to create an environment where it's HARD to survive as a lurker, that is, a very active game where the lurker #s are down very very low and are easy to single out. If it comes to the point where i have to lynch a lurker because there's no better lynch I will but that is not my priority.
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On January 06 2014 07:55 Asuna wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2014 07:44 Balla24 wrote: @Asuna how do you feel about TheChyz's entry post? If you mean the one that's basically kill the quiet people, sounds like every mafia game I've ever played.
I'm just trying to gauge how people play... it's certainly pretty generic and you can't read to deep into it. But some people would analyze it very hard.
For example: He seems to be agreeing with something that nobody said, which hints that he wasn't carefully reading ("I agree with lurking to be discouraged by just lynching them for the most part")
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On January 06 2014 07:47 TheChyz wrote: Also having people fight can cause confusion in the town.
What did you mean by this?
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"By just lynching them" that's the important part.
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offtopic
+ Show Spoiler +Here we go with this Bella stuff again ^_^, it's Balla and I am male, let's nip that right in the butt
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Let's hear some opinions on some people. Sidesprang what do you think of OWB and thechyz so far? etc etc
Be analytical. I'm already feeling a bit weird with thechyz but it's preliminary obviously and i'm waiting for him to post some more.
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Thread is dying fast... need backup ASAP.
I also am not too fond of Asuna's entry, but there's nothing really scummy about it. I just feel you have opportunities to enlighten me about yourself and your opinions but you are hiding behind one liners for some reason.
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On Thechyz: The contradiction point is interesting.... I would actually attribute that more to genuinely wanting to start some conversation by having some contradiction early on. Not sure if that was his intention though. We'll see.
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Playing IRL with friends is going to be a lot of different than this game. Just saying.
Why do you think my "accusations" are random?
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So who are you referring to when you say "random accusations"
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In the meantime, while waiting for something else to happen in regards to Chyz..
##vote JonnyLaw
I would have expected you to enter the thread already. If you're here, let's get the chemistry we had last game going. The game start time has been known for a while and i believe you're generally active during this time. If not, then get here!
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On January 06 2014 10:02 theDragoon wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2014 09:59 Balla24 wrote: Playing IRL with friends is going to be a lot of different than this game. Just saying.
Why do you think my "accusations" are random? I didn't call you out for random accusations, I was referring to being very vocal and trying to take control right at the start, something the bad guys tend to do, in my experience.
Would you prefer not to have any type of vocal person? I'm sorry but how do you expect to win this game unless the town is vocal? Sure you still can't trust me but would you rather i just sit back and not try to get any reads on people?
At least you can read me... since i'm being vocal I have to constantly give reasonings for not only my actions but my reads. From there you can see whether or not it makes sense from a town perspective or from a mafia POV and that's up to you. That is completely UN-indicative of alignment.
So let's talk about why you're seemingly trying to shut me up or discredit me right off the bat? Am i leading us in a bad direction?
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What's up with people posting and dis-appearing right after? Having conversations in this game is the best way to get reads off people and move in a proper direction. Please make time to actually sit in the thread and talk to people.
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I disagree. For the most part, my questions are relatively simple.
Do you think these really need time to formulate responses to?
On January 06 2014 10:03 Balla24 wrote: So who are you referring to when you say "random accusations"
On January 06 2014 08:06 Balla24 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2014 07:47 TheChyz wrote: Also having people fight can cause confusion in the town. What did you mean by this?
I mean I totally understand having to go away from the thread, that's fine. I'm just pushing for these conversations to last a little longer. I'm not frustrated, don't take it the wrong way. Just trying to set a standard... eventually it'll be clear whether people can adhere or not to it, but I think you'll agree with me that a high standard is important (albeit the game can still be won without it).
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Suki, what do you think of OWB so far... he's kind of a meta read for me since he's played in all my games so far. So he's hard to read fmpov. Not too happy with his thread entrance since it looks like he was trying to pocket me (i don't see how you could actually see chinstrap's joke vote as a threat that early in the game)...
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Ok, seems reasonable that i'm overthinking it and it's not an attempt to pocket me but more him actually being disappointed with the IC's play so far.
Anyways, him attempting to pocket me isn't really something i see him doing from my experience with him.
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Meh, not really ok with me since you're not really pointing out anything specific. If you think i'm clogging up the thread then tell me with what or I can't change it. It's not like i'm spamming or rambling to myself. It's all useful posts.
Sure some of the comments about people dissapearing and what not can be seen as unhelpful (and thus clogging up the thread) to experienced players. But there are clearly some new forum mafia players in this game that we will need to bring up to speed.
You might say this conversation itself is clogging up the thread (which I do deem it so, to an extent, but it needs to be had if you're going to continue to disagree with me on this), but I find it really weird that you are trying to make me lower my activity. If there's something specific that's "clogging up the thread" then let me know and i'll stop.
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Sure. I'm a big proponent of small posts > large long posts as again, it gets the conversation going and puts scum on their toes as they have to think and act faster. Having a large post style isn't bad though. However, I want to caution you AND others against this list style. You gave a decent amount of reasoning in them which is good BUT in my experience these list style posts are VERY easy for scum to hide behind and create false relationships with people by calling them scum/town without much reasoning. So I would avoid that in the future and stick to the most important reads (your top scum reads/defending your town reads)
Onto what you actually said:
On January 06 2014 11:33 Day_Walker wrote:
I didn't like this post at first, because trying to manufacture arguments for their own sake seems like a good way to get townies to fight each other.
What do you mean by this, similar to what I asked thechyz, can you elaborate? I find it interesting cause you seemingly said a very similar thing to chyz but are suspicious of him for not answering my question about it...
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EBWOP: What I mean by defending your town reads is, if you have a town read on someone and they are being attacked to defend them if necessary. That's a priority over stating you have a town read on someone completely inconsequential to the conversation at hand.
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Suki would you mind linking to your previous games?
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Sorry, I'm not really following what you were saying in the beginning? Are you saying you were purposefully being contradictory to try to get people to bandwagon on you?
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Can you respond to suki's post then here:
On January 06 2014 10:15 suki wrote:Hi everyone, let me just get right into this. Show nested quote +On January 06 2014 07:47 TheChyz wrote: Why so eager to have people help you achieve your goals? Maybe they don't agree with them. If onlywonderboy is right, then your rules help you if you are scum as well since you seem to be very active in which lynching lurkers would help your cause of staying alive. Also having people fight can cause confusion in the town. So I don't see a reason why people should just help you achieve your goals. Let me get this straight. TheChyz is implying that Balla, by promoting an active town and "lynching" lurkers, helps Balla if he's scum. What? I want to point out that nobody said anything about lynching lurkers at this point except TheChyz himself, who seems to be putting the words in Balla's mouth. Discouraging lurking is not scum play. It is a good idea to let everybody know from the start that lurking will be considered suspicious behaviour, because whether or not they are ultimately lynched for it, lurking is not helpful to town. I find TheChyz's logic flawed, and I really don't like the way he misrepresented what Balla said and then accused him of scum motivations for that misrepresentation. TheChyz please explain to us why discouraging (or even lynching) lurkers is beneficial to a scum Balla but not a townie Balla. ##vote TheChyz
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Why did you react like this:
On January 06 2014 08:08 TheChyz wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2014 07:29 Balla24 wrote: - to start the game at a very high pace, to make sure that lurking is not only discouraged but also easy to spot and call out.
Show nested quote +On January 06 2014 07:35 TheChyz wrote: I agree with lurking to be discouraged by just lynching them for the most part. If they are scum then that's an easy kill, if they are town they provide nothing helpful and might cause some confusion in finding actual scum.
Hi "nobody", I'm TheChyz.
To
On January 06 2014 08:02 Balla24 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2014 07:55 Asuna wrote:On January 06 2014 07:44 Balla24 wrote: @Asuna how do you feel about TheChyz's entry post? If you mean the one that's basically kill the quiet people, sounds like every mafia game I've ever played. I'm just trying to gauge how people play... it's certainly pretty generic and you can't read to deep into it. But some people would analyze it very hard. For example: He seems to be agreeing with something that nobody said, which hints that he wasn't carefully reading ("I agree with lurking to be discouraged by just lynching them for the most part")
Then. I find it hard to believe that you that you purposefully were misreading what I was saying and, as suki said "putting words into my mouth".
Seems like you're trying to backtrack.
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And again, I want to clarify that this: by just lynching them for the most part is the part i was concerned about.
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Leaning scum. Like I said I don't like the type of post he made, and even though its not inherently scummy, it's anti-town. However, I don't like how he picks on you for not answering my question. That's really easy to pick on, since it's REALLY common for people to miss questions.
I also don't like his reasoning for the town read on dragoon...
On January 06 2014 11:33 Day_Walker wrote:
Not afraid of get into disagreements, and willing to stand up to the people he accuses (at least until he left the thread. Hmm) . Doesn't seem like cautious scum play.
Of course you're going to stand up to the people you accuse... this seems REALLY forced. "Doesn't seem like cautious scum play", what does this even mean?
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@Day_Walker: Why did you leave suki off your list? You clearly included her in some of the reasoning, but didn't post a section for her....
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On January 06 2014 14:16 Asuna wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2014 08:38 Balla24 wrote: Thread is dying fast... need backup ASAP.
I also am not too fond of Asuna's entry, but there's nothing really scummy about it. I just feel you have opportunities to enlighten me about yourself and your opinions but you are hiding behind one liners for some reason. I'm just concise with my answers. I was asked pretty direct and narrowish questions so I gave pretty direct and narrowish answers. Also keeping track of everything in forum mafia is surprisingly different, so hopefully I didn't miss anything I'm supposed to be replying to from the last couple of pages. Basically I've played a bit of mafia, am probably terrible at reading people, but TheChyz does seem a bit fishy for the reasons Day_Walker said. Might be too early to tell though.
So what's your take on TheChyz's claim that he was purposefully acting scummy to find people who would bandwagon on him? Do you believe it, why or why not?
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Gotta agree with that,it definitely fogs thing up, but it also gives us something to talk about.
However, let's think about it from both perspectives... From a scum perspective, 2 options: 1. You accidentally got yourself in a hard to get out of situation, so instead of trying to reason your way out of it you call it fake to backtrack. 2. You are deliberately putting yourself under suspicion to ultimately gain weak town cred.
From town perspective: You are deliberately putting yourself under suspicion to scumhunt.
Both scum situations seem really weird to do... #1 because it should be really easy to reason your way out of the situation he is as scum (at least imo) or at least backtrack by admitting fault etc.. #2 just seems weird... it's like..."ima be scummy so that i can try to discredit a townie and by doing so become more townie myself"
Town perspective also seems weird... for me, the small amount of scumhunting he's done to follow it up (so far) makes me lean more towards scum on him rather than town, but we'll have to see how he follows it up more. For example though, I have no real idea why you chose Day_walker to go after rather than the other's who went after you, like suki, myself, sidesprang etc...
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@theDragoon: What do you think about Day_walker's reads, particularly his read on you
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On January 06 2014 09:55 theDragoon wrote: Guys, this is very difficult compared to mafia IRL. But if I'm to go with my experience playing with friends, the most vocal people at the start who try to take control of the game tend to be mafia. Random accusations seem suspicious as well, so based on what's been posted so far, my eye is on Balla24, sidesprang and TheChyz.
Also, I still want to know who you were referring to when you said "Random accusations seem suspicious as well".
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damn it Jonny I just turned off my computer haha
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I would feel really bad lynching owb day 1 tt... I'm the one who urged him to play... but I think he'll shape up this game after how last game turned out, and it still seems like he genuinely wants to improve.
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On January 06 2014 15:13 theDragoon wrote: @Balla24
About the random accusation thing, a bunch of people started ##voting random people. It's my first time playing this so I'm assuming doing that in the thread that early in the game just seems really random to me when there isn't much information to go on. I assume that by ##voting that they are serious with those accusations, so excuse me if doing that randomly in the thread is something that's very common and isn't meant to be taken 100% serious.
Also, on Day_Walker he seems to have good intentions.Calling out TheChyz as the only possible scum on the list seems like a bandwagon hop to me but TheChyz has been suspicious so it's something I agree with. His read on me I find is a bit unnecessary and does not really prove that I am a townie. I'm sure everyone playing this game is not afraid to disagree and standing up for yourself is something everyone does. He might just be including me on the list because I've posted a bit but his reasoning behind me as a townie really has no foundation.
Your vote IS serious. But I really don't see why you were calling it random at point.... you yourself were already suspicious of him (on my tablet so not gonna quote) . basically what I'm saying is you seem to be down playing the suspicions on him for some reason until you read daywalkers read on him(which just reiterated what everyone else said)
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idk... not necessarily alignment indicative but definately worth noting for the future once people start flipping and relationships start forming
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On January 06 2014 15:30 JonnyLaw wrote:I'll be on tomorrow at a more reasonable time. At this point we have three players who've posted nothing. Fine, we have 30+ hours till day ends. I hate this post and generally everything in Asuna's filter. Show nested quote +On January 06 2014 14:16 Asuna wrote:On January 06 2014 08:38 Balla24 wrote: Thread is dying fast... need backup ASAP.
I also am not too fond of Asuna's entry, but there's nothing really scummy about it. I just feel you have opportunities to enlighten me about yourself and your opinions but you are hiding behind one liners for some reason. I'm just concise with my answers. I was asked pretty direct and narrowish questions so I gave pretty direct and narrowish answers. Also keeping track of everything in forum mafia is surprisingly different, so hopefully I didn't miss anything I'm supposed to be replying to from the last couple of pages. Basically I've played a bit of mafia, am probably terrible at reading people, but TheChyz does seem a bit fishy for the reasons Day_Walker said. Might be too early to tell though. Excuses, bandwagoning and self doubt in one line. I'm down to lynch Asuna or OWB at this point. Dragoon and Chyz read more as if they're trying but misguided.
I agree with pushing these for a bit at least. OWB seemed to perform better in that first game we played with him when he had some pressure on him. Down to see where this takes us, since right now I'm reading him very neutral.
##unvote ##vote Onlywonderboy
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Well then, who would you lynch at this point? At least 2 people.
There's very little information out at the moment.
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For me... I'm happy to lynch daywalker, dragoon and owb.... maybe asuna.
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Gooood gooood let the hate flow through you... hehe, loving the turn this game took since I climbed in bed.
The people who are here right now: go top 2 lynches.
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ebwop and by that I mean just who are ur top 2
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I did, few posts back right after I asked dragoon.
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@Asuna think about WHY Johnny is doing the things he did. Why did he pressure you and OWB specifically? Its un alignment indicative for jonny BUT look at the reaction he got out of you... just read ur filter before and after he did that, so much more can be said about you now... reactions like that are great for reading people and having material to go off of
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On January 06 2014 16:15 TheChyz wrote: well, ok... Although you kinda did 3-4 but w/e I rank owb/dragoon higher then the others ATM, speaking on who I'd like to lynch
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Woah jonny... Take a step back. Didnt you learn from last game about not being abrasively aggrssive like this.. Also...Thats not the reasoning i thouggt you would use at all for justifying writing of chyz either..
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The situation with chyz is super wifomy, circular logic stuff that is better to avoid rather than to dwell on. that's the reasoning I expected you to use... you can't easily come up with a conclusion around it so why bother... until something more conclusive comes up surrounding him he is best left at a neutral read...
why do you dislike his vote on day walker? his reasoning? the omgus?
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On January 06 2014 16:10 theDragoon wrote: dynarri and Derrida since they've posted nothing so far. /notserious
why did you dodge twice...
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yeah I had the same problems with that too... going to sleep though... I think ppl have a LOT to talk about so hoping to see lots when I wake up
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Nice, lots of activity. However, there's also a LOT of fluff. Rehashing old topics (particularly derrida) and reasoning etc. Try to make your posts more succint.
@Day_Walker
On January 06 2014 19:32 Day_Walker wrote:
Onlywonderboy because I reread his filter from the scum perspective, and I could see it making sense as scum play.
What do you mean by this? What specifically was your thinking here when you wrote this... I want to see what you came up with "onlywonderboy's" scum perspective...
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EBWOP: Not Derrida, the other one./..dnyaryi or whatever haha
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On January 07 2014 00:43 Day_Walker wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2014 00:05 suki wrote:On January 06 2014 15:49 theDragoon wrote:On January 06 2014 15:30 JonnyLaw wrote:
Excuses, bandwagoning and self doubt in one line.
I'm down to lynch Asuna or OWB at this point.
Dragoon and Chyz read more as if they're trying but misguided.
That's enough of a reason to lynch Asuna? I don't see that as good enough to suspect Asuna of being mafia, unless you know more than what you've said there. Those 3 things you listed there is just a sign of an inexperienced player, it has nothing to do with being a scum. Here, Dragoon defends Asuna by hinting that Jonny knows more than what he's said. I think this is a possible scum slip, as only mafia are really ever thinking about hiding information. Hmm. Jonny himself brings up the possibility that he is holding back information, but does so after theDragoon does: Show nested quote +On January 06 2014 16:56 JonnyLaw wrote: Chyz has 5 real posts. I'm not laying my entire thought process out there unless it's needed to secure a lynch. Why telegraph your hunting for scum to adapt?
His quick daywalker vote is the only part that strikes me as being off.
Hmm.. This one's interesting to me. I'm a big proponent of looking for the presence of information bias or LACK of information bias to make reads. So I don't necessarily think that what thedragoon did was inherently a scum slip. However, in that context I totally do agree with you suki...
He's saying "unless you know more than what you've said there" in regards to lynching Asuna... If jonny was mafia how would he know more about a reason to lynch Asuna at this point? I'd like you to explain that theDragoon.
One more thing that i want to correct: Jonny is clearly speaking about his reads here, whereas theDragoon was speaking about "information bias" about knowing who is town and who is not.
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I'm really not too fond of dnyarri atm..they just came into the thread, found the 2 most suspicious people and rehashed why they are suspicious without saying anything about anything else... It makes this game really hard now because there are so many suspicious people FMPOV, and they are all on similar levels. I can agree with almost every case out there... EVERYBODY is fluffing it up.
So Dnyarri, why do you think dragoon is sketchier than some other people in the game.. what do you think of suki/jonny/me etc etc etc...
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On January 06 2014 22:12 BigDad wrote:
I'm looking to hear from Balla, Suki and see what Jonny makes of my explanations before I finalise my vote in the morning. However my suspicions are still clear in the above posts and I'll probably stick with them rather than jump on a bandwagon.
I've already stated pretty much all of what you said in regards to day_walker/dragoon... as far as Asuna.
Yeah, I agree, totally feasible defensive townie. Only reason I included him in my "would lynch" list is because Jonny was currently pressuring them and I didn't want to undermine that by saying I actually think his reaction was townie... (which I did), so I acted like it wasn't really swaying me.
What I think of dragoon's soft defense of Asuna? It's difficult to come to conclusions about it until dragoon flips, and flips scum... otherwise there's really nothing to glean from it. I do find day_walker's post about it weird, where he lays out the 2 situations seemingly assuming Asuna is town 100%... Why can't it be that they are both scum? At least it fits with his big post where he basically calls everyone town (which in itself is weird... you should be suspicious of everyone early not so easily dismissive of small posts as townie plays)..
Anyways, since we have a huge timezone gap for some people, we need to consolidate on a few lynch targets TODAY, so that the people who can't be around here for the deadline will be able to hopefully make their votes meaningful. This means I want everyone's votes out on someone by the end of the day, obviously not final. My reasoning is, if we aren't doing this, people like BigDad might just put their vote on someone that is completely irrelevant by the end of the day, which is soooooo unhelpful in finding out his alignment.
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Woah woah what... Daywalker: wow, some really good reads by this guy. Certainly gave me a lot of insight and I can clearly follow his line of thinking and argumentation, no bullshit so far. Still, I might be susceptible to manipulation due to my inexperience. Alert level: GREEN
Are you serious with this? He literally just sheeped on everybody, especially in his first post...
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I can't find the difference in which you call people's arguments SOLID vs NOT SOLID... IE, Suki's cases on BigDad and Dragoon (You called them NOT SOLID) versus Daywalker's reads on people (SOLID).......
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On January 07 2014 03:11 Derrida wrote: What do you mean by "sheeped"?
Just reiterated what people said. "I agree with this, therefore I also think this is scummy" etc
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Why did you feel the need to post a list AGAIN when people have already expressed their dislike of those posts.
I find it REALLY REALLY weird that Day_walker is your top town read, and that dragoon is null for you even though you were able to come up with reads on people with much less content (sidesprang, OWB)
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On January 07 2014 03:07 Derrida wrote: TheChyz: responded exactly the way I would to Balla's initial aggressively-active attitude, so he didn't ring any alarm bells for me. Came through as a skeptic that got bandwagoned really hard for no tangible reason. Alert level: GREEN
So what do you make of his claims that it was a ploy to catch band-wagoners? He responded exactly the way you would you say, which:
1. He has since retracted those statements against me saying he was trying to say something "trolly" 2. Lots of people have already called that initial response SCUMMY, which is why he was getting bandwagoned in the first place, so I ask you, whats your reasoning behind thinking that way?
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On January 07 2014 03:07 Derrida wrote:
Balla24: initially looked suspiciously scummy with what I thought to be an over-the-top aggressive style that tries to win credibility. So far only suggested cracking down on lurkers, which is not necessarily an anti-scum policy as far as I understand. Looks like much talk no action to me, high activity does not presuppose him being a townie. Alert level: ORANGE
Ugh. Really sorry to keep harping on your post, but there are a LOT of holes, IMO.
First off, you're doing the same thing Chyz was doing by putting words in my mouth (which again, he has since "retracted"). I didn't suggest cracking down on lurkers at all, I said I want to create an ENVIRONMENT where lurking is NOT a good strategy for scum, which I feel I have succeeded for the most part, that's why I keep insisting on having conversations etc...
Secondly: You're really trying to say that's the ONLY thing I have done? Do you disagree with all my analysis of people or something which makes you write it off as fluff? I don't get it.
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On January 07 2014 03:31 Derrida wrote:Well I don't really care if people dislike lists, it's a method with which I feel comfortable expressing myself in a concise manner, and I think it's a good way of firstposting. Other issues: On my re-read of the thread, my thinking/reads were really parallel with Daywalker's initial reads, that's why I enjoyed reading his what I thought to be a rather detailed analysis of the posts so far. Perhaps solid is not the best choice of word indeed. On the issue of coming up with reads on less content, I don't see the problem with this. With TheDragoon, I couldn't get any negative or positive vibes despite his post quantity. Onlyboywonder is pretty self-explanatory I think; he says he will be very active but is not. For sidesprang, I guess you could call it a hunch, it's just that his posts are without any content but he posts away anyway. somewhat offtopic: + Show Spoiler +is there a easy way of accessing people's filters, like i always go to some random page to find someones post and click his filter before I write anything, which is time consuming
It's just weird that for OWB/Sidesprang which most others have been calling null you come up with something, but for dragoon (who most people are NOT null on) you call null. Do you disagree with people's reads on dragoon (Suki's, Mine, BigDads etc)
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@Dragoon
Yeah but why or HOW would scum have any extra knowledge about Asuna, besides Asuna being scum with them? Are you suggesting that Jonnylaw might be preparing for a buss? Are you saying you think JonnyLaw has a blue read on Asuna (Be very careful answering this question)?
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On January 07 2014 03:40 chinstrap wrote: And since we're porbably waiting for Suki as well...
@Derrida The reason lists can be distracting is because you can spark discussion around neutral people that just wastes time as there is no case there in the first place. As you came in late and read the thread in its current entirety (I assume) you have a slightly different view point to everyone else. Could you please expand on WHO you think we SHOULD lynch today and why?
On top of this, I said it before and I said it again: ITS SO EASY FOR SCUM TO HIDE BEHIND. It lets people get away with very weak reasoning by just listing their fake reads.. it's literally the easiest thing to do as scum. Focusing on your most important reads makes your read and reasoning more clear because you can be more detailed.
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On January 07 2014 03:58 theDragoon wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2014 03:41 Balla24 wrote: @Dragoon
Yeah but why or HOW would scum have any extra knowledge about Asuna, besides Asuna being scum with them? Are you suggesting that Jonnylaw might be preparing for a buss? Are you saying you think JonnyLaw has a blue read on Asuna (Be very careful answering this question)? Like I said in my previous post, I don't know whether or not he has extra knowledge on Asuna, I just don't buy his reason to lynch Asuna. If his reason to lynch Asuna isn't solid, then why would he choose to lynch Asuna? I don't know what a buss is, sorry. I'm not saying JonnyLaw has a blue read on Asuna. If he did, then why would he want to lynch Asuna?
Buss = "Throwing somebody under the buss" = When a mafia player attacks their teammate in order to gain town cred...
To your last sentence: Because a scum would want to kill blues.
Anyways, since this isn't going anywhere.. why did you dodge the "top 2 scum" earlier?
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[QUOTE]On January 07 2014 03:58 theDragoon wrote: [QUOTE]On January 07 2014 03:41 Balla24 wrote:
I'm not saying JonnyLaw has a blue read on Asuna. If he did, then why would he want to lynch Asuna? [/QUOTE]
Actually, now that I think about it. This seems like a slip to me....
You've been implying that you think Jonny is scum, yet you very seemingly call him town here and don't even consider it from a scum perspective.
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EBWOP: Screwed that up.
On January 07 2014 03:58 theDragoon wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2014 03:41 Balla24 wrote:
I'm not saying JonnyLaw has a blue read on Asuna. If he did, then why would he want to lynch Asuna?
Actually, now that I think about it. This seems like a slip to me....
You've been implying that you think Jonny is scum, yet you very seemingly call him town here and don't even consider it from a scum perspective.
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He dodged me asking for his top scum reads twice now, and if he doesn't answer this time it's gonna be a third time ^_^ That's pretty scummy to me. Shows that he's afraid to make even the weakest commitments to his reads.
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On January 07 2014 04:14 Derrida wrote: @Balla,
Balla's read: You first pressure Dragoon about his usage of "random accusations," which I interpret as a tactic of making him talk more. I am not the type of person that dwells on specific usage of words or concepts as long as I can get a feel of the general argument. Therefore, your pressuring of Dragoon on his word choices seemed unnecessary to me. I don't think you have any other reads than this unless I'm missing something?
You correctly say that it's a tactic to make him talk more, but it's also just trying to keep people in check for things they say. He said something about random accusations, which I did not see.. therefore we had a differing opinion and he clearly disagreed with some of the accusations put out, I wanted him to come forth with his reasoning as to why he claimed there were random accusations going about.
I don't see how that's unnecessary?
But no, sorry you're right. I thought I had written a more comprehensive post about him last night which I will do now
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On theDragoon:
On January 06 2014 14:45 theDragoon wrote: Acting scummy on purpose is a bit of a stupid plan for a townie, all it does is put a target on your back and force you to defend yourself early, you might get a little insight into how people are reacting to it but it's a really risky move. A risk that a regular townie with no powers should be willing to make.
A mafia putting his name out there this early is a bad plan if enough people jump on the bandwagon. I'm conflicted, all TheChyz has done is create confusion. If enough people get off the bandwagon and he turns out to be a mafia, then he's won and the risk he took with putting his name out there would be totally worth it.
Whether or not it's true that TheChyz was telling the truth about the whole act like a scum thing, all it's really done is create confusion among the town.
##Vote: TheChyz
I thought this end was pretty scummy. He admits that he can't decide whether or not he was telling the truth or not, and basically says "man even if this guy is town I would still lynch him".
On January 06 2014 15:49 theDragoon wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2014 15:30 JonnyLaw wrote:
Excuses, bandwagoning and self doubt in one line.
I'm down to lynch Asuna or OWB at this point.
Dragoon and Chyz read more as if they're trying but misguided.
That's enough of a reason to lynch Asuna? I don't see that as good enough to suspect Asuna of being mafia, unless you know more than what you've said there. Those 3 things you listed there is just a sign of an inexperienced player, it has nothing to do with being a scum.
This post was odd for me... to me Jonny was pretty clearly trying to pressure both Asuna and OWB and dragoon undermines that pressure by defending Asuna already. He goes off on Jonny for having weak reasons to lynch someone, so I asked him who HIS top scum reads are, because there isn't really much reasoning out there. He dodges. I ask again later, and he dodges again. That's REALLY odd. If you're going to call someone out for not having good reasons to lynch someone, then you need to provide a counter...
It's pretty clear that AT THAT POINT in jonny's thinking, that's who he wanted to lynch, not who he will lynch at the end of the day.
Couple that with the possible slip that I just pointed out, and I think he's scum:
##unvote ##vote theDragoon
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Alright, well a lot has happened since then clearly, so let's hear your top scums now? Or are you still unwilling to because you're still not sure?
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@dnyarii ATM, without re-reading... I really do like suki's case on him... BUT I am cautiously giving him an unconfident town read atm... would not lynch.
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Just a note for everyone: suki is a she
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But Dragoon, other than her dissapearing after the "let's get back to scumhunting" what is wrong with her FMYPOV?
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That's exactly how i was thinking OWB... however i'm trying to avoid thinking about scum pairs atm, as it IS day 1 and we have no confirmed scum yet. It is good to note though.
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How do you like Jonny so far?
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hahahahahah JonnyLax hahahahahahahaha holy shit that was good
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Uhm... how does the timeline say anything? To me its exactly the same thing when i read it backwards or when i read it in the order he posted.
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I honestly think that we caught 2 scum here hehe
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Would totally lynch sidesprang for lurking if I didn't feel like i had some good scum reads btw, just as a backup..
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@Dragoon What do you think of Derrida
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On January 07 2014 06:20 chinstrap wrote: So @balla24, how do you feel about my town reads?
I mean they are mostly useless information from you haha, especially since none of those people are under the gun atm, and they arent numerous enough to work backwards and find scum by process of elimination.
JonnyLax (heuehu) is very consistent with his town meta atm. Aggressive, abrasive, and general cockiness early game indicate that, especially if you read his last two newbie games (here is one: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=433102¤tpage=88)
I'm really neutral on suki... she makes good decent cases that I agree with for the most part, and I do trust her scum radar from speaking to her in other obs game and reading her previous games. And I totally can see from those why she was so adamant about the "cluttering" subject. I don't really view what she did as scummy last night, when she just left after we traded previous games as the other guys do... so there's that..
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Also in regards to Chyz: not really suspicious of him anymore, especially after i get past the WIFOM of his opening play. He seems to be genuinely worried about how some people (derrida) reacted to it so that's good.
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So you don't find it suspicious that he was so enamored with Day_walker and that he came up with a NULL read on you?
What about his read on me, you're becoming more suspicious of me so is what he said aligned with your thinking?
@OWB: Was Day_walker/Dragoon the only connection you found? Let's hear anything else in regards to connections like that since that was how you seemed to be hunting. I found a few more weak connections, but i'd like you to prove that you were actually hunting and you didn't just find ONE thing to latch onto.
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On January 07 2014 06:38 chinstrap wrote: Are you you want to be putting cards like that on the table now?
You mean in regards to my q towards @OWB?
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On January 07 2014 06:39 chinstrap wrote: Yes
It's already out there tbh. If they weren't already adapting they are now. It may have been a bit early to bring it out but hey, if that's how someone is going to scumhunt i'm not goign to stop them.
I want OWB to prove that he's doing what he says he is. He's notorious for not being confident and hiding his thoughts as town, and as scum he barely put any effort into scum hunting. He can be very good at being analytical but he needs a push.
I don't mind having them adapt to mistakes they might have made atm... but yeah, normally I wouldn't bring this kind of analysis out until AFTER we have a scum flip, but it's kinda too late for that haha.
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On January 07 2014 06:44 Derrida wrote: @Balla, could you expand on: "not really suspicious of him anymore, especially after i get past the WIFOM of his opening play. He seems to be genuinely worried about how some people (derrida) reacted to it so that's good," especially with regards to what part you thought of his opening was WIFOM and why being worried about other people's reactions is an indicator.
I've been asked both by TheChyz and Balla about why I thought TheChyz was not scummy. I just re-read through his filter, I still don't think he is scummy. It is a tough question to disprove him not being a scum though, isn't it? Not fair.
Sure, but first off i don't remember asking you why you thought Chyz was not scummy? Can't really find it in my filter either haha i'm lunching T_T...
Refer to my analysis of the Chyz opener here: + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2014 14:39 Balla24 wrote: Gotta agree with that,it definitely fogs thing up, but it also gives us something to talk about.
However, let's think about it from both perspectives... From a scum perspective, 2 options: 1. You accidentally got yourself in a hard to get out of situation, so instead of trying to reason your way out of it you call it fake to backtrack. 2. You are deliberately putting yourself under suspicion to ultimately gain weak town cred.
From town perspective: You are deliberately putting yourself under suspicion to scumhunt.
Both scum situations seem really weird to do... #1 because it should be really easy to reason your way out of the situation he is as scum (at least imo) or at least backtrack by admitting fault etc.. #2 just seems weird... it's like..."ima be scummy so that i can try to discredit a townie and by doing so become more townie myself"
Town perspective also seems weird... for me, the small amount of scumhunting he's done to follow it up (so far) makes me lean more towards scum on him rather than town, but we'll have to see how he follows it up more. For example though, I have no real idea why you chose Day_walker to go after rather than the other's who went after you, like suki, myself, sidesprang etc...
On January 06 2014 17:18 Balla24 wrote: The situation with chyz is super wifomy, circular logic stuff that is better to avoid rather than to dwell on. that's the reasoning I expected you to use... you can't easily come up with a conclusion around it so why bother... until something more conclusive comes up surrounding him he is best left at a neutral read...
why do you dislike his vote on day walker? his reasoning? the omgus?
It's WIFOM because there's no 100% way we can confirm whether or not he was lying. So if we think too hard about it we end up just going in circles. Might not exactly be the definition of WIFOM, but it's the kind of situation where you want to just AVOID thinking about it because it's too hard to come to a conclusion about it.
As far as him being worried about people's reactions... sorry I don't really get what you mean here? It's just basic scum hunting.
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People like bigdad = people in different timezones who aren't going to be around for the deadline... he's in australia so that's kind of a large time difference. I think 5pm est is 7am Australia time so yeah...
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On January 07 2014 06:52 theDragoon wrote: /offtopic: I know this is a newbie game but a lot of people here seem to have a lot of experience playing the game. JonnyLaw in particular seems to hate the "I'm new to this" type of post. And I think the more experienced players here are looking far too deep into what some of the newer players are posting.
It's what this game is all about. The more experienced players will quickly want to get rid of the "noob card" for people to play, because it's annoying to think about.
I mean just try it lol... whenever somebody says "well i'm new to this so i'm not sure about: xxxxx" like what are you supposed to think? "Dang this guy's new so i better cut him some slack for having no confidence...?" No we can't do that... because that allows mafia players to play that card...
Basically, it's similar to lists, similar to lurking, similar to using RL excuses: The noob card is not something you want to play as town BECAUSE it sets a standard for mafia to be able to use it and then from there it's circular logic. Just nip it in the butt.
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Maybe I shouldn't have use the term WIFOMy cause you're right, it's not actually WIFOM, but I would handle this situation similarly to how i would handle real wifom, by just thinking about it a little bit and then ignoring it if i cant conclude anything from it.
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Eh, you are misjudging us if you think we're experienced players... we are just experienced with noob games
But rest assured, if you're new we are and SHOULD be taking it into account... but explicitly stating "I AM NEW PLS DONT LYNCH ME MY READS MIGHT BE BAD" is NOT helpful whatsoever. Catch my drift?
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It's pretty awful... really wasn't expecting that, especially this early T_T I was just pressuring... I need some fresh opinions on this though cause I don't know what to think.
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BigDad, i'm curious as to why you keep asking people who you think are town (I THINK) for their opinions on your cases... How does that help your case besides trying to get people who you deem town behind it and gain traction that way? Why not point your questions at your suspects?
Correct me if i'm wrong though, but that's just the impression i got... you might not actually town read them haha
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On January 06 2014 22:12 BigDad wrote: I'm looking to hear from Balla, Suki and see what Jonny makes of my explanations before I finalise my vote in the morning. However my suspicions are still clear in the above posts and I'll probably stick with them rather than jump on a bandwagon.
This is another time you did it that i'm talking about.
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On January 07 2014 08:05 Derrida wrote: @Day_walker, what do you think about OWB right now? He was one of your two lynch candidates after you figured out chinstrap was IC, and I thought your justification was really superficial for arguing in favor of lynching OWB:
"Onlywonderboy because I reread his filter from the scum perspective, and I could see it making sense as scum play."
Yep:
+ Show Spoiler +On January 07 2014 01:27 Balla24 wrote:Nice, lots of activity. However, there's also a LOT of fluff. Rehashing old topics (particularly derrida) and reasoning etc. Try to make your posts more succint. @Day_Walker Show nested quote +On January 06 2014 19:32 Day_Walker wrote:
Onlywonderboy because I reread his filter from the scum perspective, and I could see it making sense as scum play.
What do you mean by this? What specifically was your thinking here when you wrote this... I want to see what you came up with "onlywonderboy's" scum perspective...
He should be back soon. So definitely want some clarification/answers.
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Jonny, what? I didn't understand that post except for the last sentence haha...
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On January 07 2014 08:09 BigDad wrote: @Balla24
As far as I understand the best two ways to generate discussion early game are:
a) Ask people their opinions so we can cross reference them throughout the game. b) Do what TheChyz did and bluff people onto bandwagons
I don't have a solid read on Suki yet, i need to have another look at her feed. I was responding to her questioning and subsequent vote.
I simply asked JonnyLaw for his opinion because my post was actually in response to something he asked earlier.
K. Well in that case, the earlier post i quoted regarding it is a little fishy to me then. It's like you're asking your town reads for approval.
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On January 07 2014 08:16 JonnyLaw wrote: I'm saying I don't care about day walker for now.
Dragoon's martying and playing just as scummy.
Bigdad's focusing on the second player in an accused "scum buddy" team. No matter what dragoon flips he benefits from voting daywalker instead of dragoon. Makes him look good if dragoon is town and says nothing if he's scum.
I want focus here.
I see. I don't necessarily agree with your logic but I don't want to say more since i'd be giving away how scum should play lol.
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On January 07 2014 08:23 Derrida wrote: I don't think it's necessarily against his win condition unless Dragoon gets lynched and he turns out to be a townie; he might just be bluffing/baiting. I think an imploding townie act would be a great bait to shift away the focus from a scum teammate.
Let's see your vote.
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Because I haven't seen any commitment to your scum reads at this point.
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Voting is a record. It shows who you wanted to lynch at any current moment in the game very visibly and clearly.
The sheer fact that you don't want to vote prematurely PROVES that voting is commitment.
and remember:
On January 07 2014 06:51 Derrida wrote:
By the way, I would like to re-iterate this point by Balla: "Anyways, since we have a huge timezone gap for some people, we need to consolidate on a few lynch targets TODAY, so that the people who can't be around here for the deadline will be able to hopefully make their votes meaningful. This means I want everyone's votes out on someone by the end of the day, obviously not final." While I do not like the attitude, I do like the idea. When would a tentative deadline be, for example? Oh and Balla, what do you mean by "people like BigDad"?
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it's been 4 hrs...
what kind of fake contribution post is this bigdad?
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On January 07 2014 08:44 BigDad wrote: I was looking through everyones feeds and saw that, i thought it was notable considering the early (and large) play by him - then the hasty retreat from play with an easy vote on a Lurker. What is your analysis on him so far?
Let's start with your analysis on the current target: theDragoon (there's what... 4 or 5 votes on him atm?)... it's like you're completely avoiding him.
What I think of Chyz atm is irrelevant, I've already hashed out what I think about him multiple times. Plus, he's afk right now.
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Actually, sorry, you obviously didn't ignore him as he was your target early on... but i still want to know, what do you think of his play since you re-entered the thread, since there was a LOT of new stuff. You're ignoring the new stuff.
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It's fine you still answered how i wanted ^_^ that's my bad anyways..
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There was 40 minutes to deadline anyways...
I don't see how you're speeding things up at all, we still would have had to wait your flip anyways. Only way you could have sped it up was by admitting you're mafia
Looking forward to when you get back.
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I hardly call that rejuvenated...
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i guess i'll wait and see what he says
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Hmmmm... alright i *think* there are 8 votes on dragoon... obviously that's a bit worrisome since there's only 13 players... but I really do think dragoon is scum, and if it wasn't for his recent play i'd be pretty confident in this.
The people who are still NOT voting for him:
Why not?
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I can't believe how some of you guys are so confident about how dragoon will flip scum. Suki, Jonny specifically..
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On January 07 2014 15:17 LoneMeow wrote: Day 1 vote count:
Day_Walker (1): TheChyz, BigDad theDragoon (9): dnyarri, Balla24, onlywonderboy, chinstrap, theDragoon, JonnyLaw, Derrida, suki, sidesprang
Not voting (3): Asuna, Day_Walker, TheChyz
Currently, theDragoon is set to be lynched. Deadline is Tuesday, Jan 07 10:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00) (in ). Voting is mandatory!
If there are errors, please let us know.
This is the most one sided lynch ever. I'm sorry but this should seriously be making you weary (suki/jonnylaw). The people who are not voting seem to also be tentatively saying that they are ok with the lynch if it were to happen now, besides Day_walker who probably is thinking along the same lines of this tbh.
I'm searching for a new target. I really don't like how hard you lurked today sidesprang, so I'd lynch you just based on that, but other than that, I find Derrida pretty scummy.
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Ugh it's just so hard because I totally can see how scum would buss their teammate in this current situation. It's different than other one-sided lynches in the previous games because of how dragoon shut-down. Like I would totally buss him..
If I were scum, I would probably begin to buss him after he self-voted, so i'd look @ Derrida, suki and sidesprang (if im jsut looking at it chronologically, jonnylaw too)
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On January 07 2014 15:16 JonnyLaw wrote: I'm more confident in lynching him than other players.
If you want to lynch dnyarri I'm down for that one as well. Otherwise TD stayign at the top of my list. Who do you think should be lynched today then ballaman? Maybe I'm just being lazy. I'll reread the filters.
Dang... dnyarri is lurking like shit..... I wrote them off early I think because I liked the response here:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=434723¤tpage=22#426
There's a lot of critical thinking there. But still... so little. Not sure i'd lynch.. gotta think about it. I'm having trouble figuring out what to do which is super weird for me T_T...
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Wait no fuck that that post sucked... god i hate that post...on the contrary to what I said there is NO critical thinking beyond the weak hypothesis he posed about BigDad/Dragoon pair. I just realized the guy literally has 3 posts in this game. Would lynch.
I think I need sleep but fuck that...
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@jonnylaw on the same note though... he has a LOT of pressure on him, keeping him around will keep everyone who is currently voting him honest, they will have to continue to pressure him... and continue to have solid reasoning surrounding him.
I mean, let's be honest, there is 100% for sure scum in the people who already voted him. Having them have a forced hand on what they think about him might be a good thing. It's gonna be a weight on EVERYONE's back, not just towns.
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newbies are way too nice... im starting to see the merit to your style of play jonny
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yeah me neither, although fwiw i'm leaning more town on him for the content of his posts this time
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i couldn't really keep up with the part where you were alive in that game haha but i did read the end of it.....
i think i just need somebody to call me fucking awful or some shit to spark me...
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one thing about dynarri that i noticed in that big post:
read suki as town because they were both doing a lot of the same stuff...
My opinions about suki are based on the simple reason that suki has suspected the same players as I have, TheChyz and TheDragoon. Suki also unvoted TheChyz, like I did.
feels weird that he specifically points out that last part... why does that matter...? FEELS ODD MAN
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so you agree that there's mafia in the current vote right?
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On January 07 2014 17:33 Day_Walker wrote:Ok Dragoon seems more or less done talking, and I want to hear Balla's take on my thoughts. Let's talk about lurkers. dnyarri+ Show Spoiler +Three total posts. I flagged his first post as potentially scum, and given his follpw-up it looks even worse to me now than it did then. His second post switches his lynch vote from TheChyz to Dragoon: On January 06 2014 23:43 dnyarri wrote:Actually I have changed my primary target of suspicion from TheChyz to TheDragoon mainly because of this post: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=434723¤tpage=16#316TheDragoon stated that Day_Walker seemed like innocent even though Day_Walker had only posted one list and nothing else. Day_Walker's only vote is against TheChyz which doesn't mean much since TheChyz is easy bandwagoning target. TheDragoon's post give me the impression that he wants to slow voting down by defending (random) people while going to TheChyz-bandwagon and attacking nobody else. TheChyz is confusing but I'm not sure if it's carelessness or risk taking. My logic for calling him scum was somewhat faulted too I think. ##unvote ##vote: TheDragoon This feels like rather weak reasoning to me, and I'm not sure the part I bolded - which seems to be sharing his thought process from evidence to vote - even makes sense. On one hand, it's hard to call him a bandwagoner because he placed to first vote on Dragoon. On the other hand, between dnyarri's first and second post we had the IC retract his Chyz vote, and BigDad label me and Dragoon as scummy. The wind was definitely blowing away from Chyz and towards Dragoon before dnyarri changed his vote. Dnyarri's last post is fine, and I agree with a lot of the content, but it was prompted by an accusation by Balla of rehashing and not talking about enough people. A fine post, but one that was prompted, rather than spontaneous. sidesprang+ Show Spoiler +Three posts the first day. Two of them are spent agreeing with Balla, the last one gives the consensus view of OWB and Chyz. Comes in late on the second day and drops this: On January 07 2014 10:44 sidesprang wrote:Been away most of the day sry. Skimming through the thread now. Came to this. Voting for yourself make it an autovote for me. If you are town please fight for your life, we have everything to gain. If town we will hopefully see it, if scum we will hopefully be more sure you are scum after your defence. ##Vote theDragoonShow nested quote +On January 07 2014 07:21 theDragoon wrote:On January 07 2014 07:11 Balla24 wrote:Eh, you are misjudging us if you think we're experienced players... we are just experienced with noob games But rest assured, if you're new we are and SHOULD be taking it into account... but explicitly stating "I AM NEW PLS DONT LYNCH ME MY READS MIGHT BE BAD" is NOT helpful whatsoever. Catch my drift? /offtopic:Yea i get it. I just felt like a lot of people look into my posts too much thinking there's some sort of link or slip or whatever when in reality i just don't know WTF I'm doing. /ontopic: I'm gonna ##Unvote onlywonderboy and ##Vote theDragoon. There's no way to get out of this mess, you're all really looking at the wrong guy. I guess without me fucking things up for the town, you'd be better off but this is going to be 2 down for mafia after the first night. I have to head out, I'll be on later. I'll be catching up for a bit, if anyone have any questions feel free to ask I'll be around for a bit. But gonna use some time catching up as a lot have been posted. What's this? An autovote that absolves him of any need to justify hopping on carriage #9 of the lynch train? How convenient. Any desire to make a substantive comment on the day that he missed? Apparently not. onlywonderboy+ Show Spoiler +Here is my last post on him: On January 07 2014 11:41 Day_Walker wrote: @Suki @Balla24
Here is my line of thinking on OBW: After day 1, his filter had three posts. One cautionary comment about reading Balla, one good point about the IC and a promise to be a good townie, and one question about policy debates and scum hunting.
All fine things to post, and he gets some good feedback (e.g. my list). But these are also very safe posts, and that's all we get for the first 24 hours. I can read this as a scum thinking "great, said some things, got people to like me, now I can let them argue about Chyz for a day". This was the point at which I suggested OBW as a possible lynch target.
His posting for the next day starts with the first big reaction to the me + Dragoon scum pair idea that BigDad brought up, and then he basically rides that idea for the rest of the day.
So the meat of his contribution over the last two days is one read which I know (although Town doesn't) to be false, and it's a read that came served on a platter. From my perspective, OBW's actions makes a lot of sense as scum. I'll just add to this by noting that OWB placed vote #3 on Dragoon. I've said nothing about Dragoon's behavior. I don't think I have to. Based on the actions of other players, I'm fairly confident that we just saw the mafia run a bandwagon. I'm not dismissing the reads of suki and Jonny (the only two people who have made substantial arguments for lynching Dragoon). But if Dragoon is scum, we can get him later. He is at least willing to be around and talk with the Town. And most importantly, we have better lynch targets. I ordered the lurkers from most to least scummy, and I think that either dnyarri or sidesprang would make a solid lynch. ## Vote dnyarri
I'm still not sure whether I actually want to lynch a lurker tomorrow or not. But hopefully this conversation can help me decide.
What annoys me the most out of dnyarri is straight up the lack of posting and sense, i just straight up can't read them well because of it. I think that's what you're getting at too. So yeah, totally agree. For sidesprang, i keep flip flopping on him... but it's kind of similar to OWB's scum last game where he clearly says he's gonna do stuff like catch up but yet doesn't post any thoughts about it later.
For OWB, I think I just posted something about him, but I'm reading him more townie mostly because of my meta with him. He's committing more, and minimally talking about policy and theorycrafting compared to his scumgame where that was almost all he talked about.
"I'm fairly confident that we just saw the mafia run a bandwagon." - I don't really understand why you're going after the lurkers then? Why not directly go after the people with cases on dragoon (me, suki, jonnylaw)?
Why are you specifically asking me for a response here as well? What is your read on me? Scum or town, i can't tell. Seems like you're accusing me.
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Gonna go cuddle up in my bed, still gonna be around... ^_^
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On January 07 2014 18:35 TheChyz wrote: The only problem I have with an dnyarri vote is that it won't really tell us much apart from what HIS alignment is, however somebody else as a lynch (like Dragoon for example), will help us gain some information on other players regardless of alignment.
that's a trade off we have to take if we decide to policy lynch
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@bigdad Mafia also benefits from lurkers in the fact that it gives them a super easy target to push to a mislynch, don't forget that... I did it in my first game as scum in fact.
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On January 07 2014 18:41 JonnyLaw wrote: Balla, I'm not accusing you of anything. You could be scum but I don't care today. You'll be active enough I can find out.
I really want to know if you want to lynch lurkers. I'm no topposed because you know that feeling the next day when it seems to late to start lynching lurkers?
Yeah, I hate it.
well whole reason I'm taking my time is because you told me to sleep on it... but yeah I am growing more worried about running out of time too which is leading me to stand firm on lynching someone active... we'll learn more about ppl and that's the way I like to play the game, with relationships
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Johnny can you answer the q I asked at the bottomish of last PG pls? Mafia in vote q..
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On January 07 2014 18:46 JonnyLaw wrote: That's what I've always said in the newb games as well. It worked. We caught the lurkers later. you have certainly taught me well.
these lurkers aren't even half as bad as we had in that first game either... I guess I shouldn't be worried about it... especially since sidesprang is definitely making enough of a contribution to read him
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the question I'm reffering to
On January 07 2014 17:51 Balla24 wrote: so you agree that there's mafia in the current vote right?
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I had a lot of problems with your entry, which you can and should reread on pg20 since there is 1 or 2 posts I made that we forgot about in our discussion... and i also found it really annoying that you were saving your vote for no reason, let me reread what else I was thinking in regards to you.
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Gah, time zones suck. I wish I could discuss with you Derrida but I'm falling asleep TT...
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On January 07 2014 19:33 Derrida wrote: @Anyone online, what do you think about Asuna, TheChyz, and BigDad not having an active vote?
Asuna has stated shed be fine lynching dragoon, so i count that as a vote. Chyz seems to be the only one weary of voting dragoon. BigDad also has been projecting his intention to lynch dragoon same as asuna I think.
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@DW you specifically said something like 'I believe we saw Mafia run a bandwagon' so by that you meant they hopped on the bandwagon and not that they led the bandwagon?
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On January 07 2014 15:41 Day_Walker wrote: I don't like the lynch on theDragoon.
I'll give my reasoning in a bit, but I want hear more from Dragoon first.
Please explain more. You have since said you don't think you need to but I didn't really understand that. You are very adamant that dragoon is going to flip town, why? What has he done that makes him so town to you?
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On January 07 2014 19:48 Derrida wrote:@Balla, once again, ya I'll be here hopefully long before that
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Derrida I think you may have missed me asking for you to go back and read my posts on pg20 (your grand entrance), because you did not post responses to some of the concerns I brought up, I will quote them, hold on... shit is too hard on mobile
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On January 07 2014 03:20 Balla24 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2014 03:07 Derrida wrote: TheChyz: responded exactly the way I would to Balla's initial aggressively-active attitude, so he didn't ring any alarm bells for me. Came through as a skeptic that got bandwagoned really hard for no tangible reason. Alert level: GREEN
So what do you make of his claims that it was a ploy to catch band-wagoners? He responded exactly the way you would you say, which: 1. He has since retracted those statements against me saying he was trying to say something "trolly" 2. Lots of people have already called that initial response SCUMMY, which is why he was getting bandwagoned in the first place, so I ask you, whats your reasoning behind thinking that way?
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On January 07 2014 03:32 Balla24 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2014 03:07 Derrida wrote:
Balla24: initially looked suspiciously scummy with what I thought to be an over-the-top aggressive style that tries to win credibility. So far only suggested cracking down on lurkers, which is not necessarily an anti-scum policy as far as I understand. Looks like much talk no action to me, high activity does not presuppose him being a townie. Alert level: ORANGE
Ugh. Really sorry to keep harping on your post, but there are a LOT of holes, IMO. First off, you're doing the same thing Chyz was doing by putting words in my mouth (which again, he has since "retracted"). I didn't suggest cracking down on lurkers at all, I said I want to create an ENVIRONMENT where lurking is NOT a good strategy for scum, which I feel I have succeeded for the most part, that's why I keep insisting on having conversations etc... Secondly: You're really trying to say that's the ONLY thing I have done? Do you disagree with all my analysis of people or something which makes you write it off as fluff? I don't get it.
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and with that, goodnight!!! <3
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Back... first let me answer everything that was levied directly at me:
@Suki: Yes and no, for the most part no i dont disagree, BUT... you are overlooking a lot of things that come with a lynch... do we have future targets? Do we gain information if he happens to flip town? Etc etc.. Is he already pressured enough that we will be able to catch him in the future?
My opinion on dragoon is still the same, I want to lynch him. I'm not sure if I consider him the scummiest, he's still scummy... Regardless I want to see this lynch through, there's plenty to gain from it on both sides of the flip. FTR though suki, this question was really loaded...
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On January 08 2014 04:30 theDragoon wrote: It's not the act of self voting I'm questioning. It's the intention. Would mafia do that, 4 votes in?
Would town?
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Dat policy discussion insight from OWB...
Why oh why did you feel the need to answer for Chyz there?
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Of course it matters... the answer coming from you is scummy, the answer coming from Chyz forces him to actually have an opinion on why it might be a good or bad strategy for mafia or anybody or whatever. All he's said is it's bad and mafia would do it.
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It's scummy from you because that's literally all you did last game.
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You don't follow ^_^. I'm speaking about "policy discussion", that's pretty much all you posted about. You can move on though, no reason to dwell on this.
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Does anybody see this lynch not going through atm? Only way I see it is if someone slips majorly. With that said, does anybody mind if i start bringing up different shit that I was waiting for the conversation to die down for? It's pretty much completely unrelated to dragoon...
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That's a weird question, considering you're going to die haha... once you're dead you can't talk anyways... but yeah, everyone can still talk in this thread at night.
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On January 07 2014 19:42 chinstrap wrote: I think we have the correct Day 1 lynch, I also think that everything that has been posted about the lynch since ~martyr post has been completely superfluous and should not be read into regardless of what colour theDragoon flips. The day basically ends there in my mind.
^
The problem I have with daywalker is he waited so freaking long to start defending dragoon... and then suddenly he's like "meh i don't think i need to defend him anymore" just cause dragoon posted. Only after I prompted him to ACTUALLY defend him did he post this:
On January 07 2014 21:20 Day_Walker wrote:@Balla's second question: Show nested quote +On January 07 2014 19:52 Balla24 wrote:On January 07 2014 15:41 Day_Walker wrote: I don't like the lynch on theDragoon.
I'll give my reasoning in a bit, but I want hear more from Dragoon first. Please explain more. You have since said you don't think you need to but I didn't really understand that. You are very adamant that dragoon is going to flip town, why? What has he done that makes him so town to you? Judging by his actions, I don't have a strong read on Dragoon The evidence against Dragoon looked very different to me than the rest of town. When people were talking about me and Dragoon as scum buddies, and then accusing us of trying to distance ourselves, I was the only townie who could read those posts and say "lol no". When Dragoon was defending himself against these accusation, I was the only townie who could read those posts and say "yup, this is 100% a guy defending himself against some false accusations". I think this in turn affected the weight I gave to other accusations against him. For example, I think most other people saw his snap OWB vote as scummy. Since I knew that OWB's scum-buddy accusation was false, I thought "well, I can't really tell if this is a frustrated townie lashing out or a cornered scum lashing out". The way Town has interacted with Dragoon over the last day has made it difficult for me to get a good read on him, because I'm not sure how to tell the difference between frustrated townie and cornered scum. Judging by the entire game, I lean town for Dragoon.This most heavily rests on my scum read for dnyarri, and the fact that dnyarri placed the very first for Dragoon. Based on the vote, I think it unlikely that both dnyarri AND Dragoon are scum, and this turns my scum read for dnyarri into a town read for Dragoon. And for the reasons I just gave, this sounds a lot more plausible to me than to any other townie. @Balla's first question: Show nested quote +On January 07 2014 19:46 Balla24 wrote: @DW you specifically said something like 'I believe we saw Mafia run a bandwagon' so by that you meant they hopped on the bandwagon and not that they led the bandwagon? Let me try that again. I saw two people that I suspect as scum, dnyarri and OWB, contribute early on in the Dragoon lynch (votes 1 and 3) for reasons that didn't look strong to me (again my take is different here, since I'm the only town who knows OWB's accusation was completely untrue). The Town was already suspicious of Dragoon, the lynch took off, and sidesprang capped it off with another scummy-feeling vote. To summarize:I am not adamant that Dragoon is town, although I suspect he is. I am adamant that dnyarri is a better lynch target. I my read on Dragoon and the situation in general has been influenced by information available only to scum, me, and Dragoon, and I understand that the rest of Town may not share my views.
Where most of his defense relied on his POV about the "dragoon/DW" relationship... Definitely have to agree with chinstrap... the timing of all this makes it so that I think i'm going to have to ignore everything in regards to DW at least out the window after dragoon martyred
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Both cases ends up relatively ambiguous if the lynch target flips town... I don't see the benefit of one over the other.
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That's fine lol, doesn't make it more or less ambiguous... FWIW your logic is 100% sound... it's just that i'm not one to come to a decision about situations like that as fast as you clearly.
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Anyways yeah, dragoon's posts haven't really instilled anymore confidence in me since the martyr that he is town... in fact in the opposite direction. I'm joining the confident people. Go go die scum..
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Who knows what will happen tonight... 72 hours is a long time... plus we're gonna have all the juicy night actions to talk about.
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But anyways:
On January 08 2014 06:20 LoneMeow wrote: Currently, theDragoon is set to be lynched.
Hheuehuheu
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Woah fuck that jonny what????????
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Pulling a Balla's first game as scum move there....
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How the fuck is dnyarri's vote even relevant?
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Not only that, but him being the first vote was pointed out many many times. How the fuck did you NOT notice..,.
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Exactly. Which makes Jonny's voteswap with no explanation even more fucking weird... Jonny is NOT one to pussy out like that.
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It doesn't matter because nobody even payed attention to his vote post... there were what 8 votes without him? All the sudden he is your scummiest person?
It was pointed out last night while we were discussing switching to lynching a lurker IIRC... and even if it wasnt, we were discussing the lurkers, you have no excuse for NOT filter diving them last night..
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On January 08 2014 06:52 JonnyLaw wrote: @balla the more I think about this vote the more I remember you claiming to not like it but never bringing up another candidate. Hmmm....I'll be back in a few mins.
Oh come the fuck on... I was stating I was weary because of the # of votes. I brought up derrida as another lynch but most people ignored me. You dodged my question about if the mafia were in the vote or not twice too, still dont understand why you didnt answer that.
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No we're not certain about shit, and completely impossible to switch.
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is it most recent max or earliest max gets lynched?
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Alright well fuck that shit that just went down... obviously you were right but come on, that's so fucking weird for you.
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We could have switched but that was bullshit come on, jonny explain why DYNARRI is scum to you so fuucking suddenly and dragoon was NOT scum.
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So suddenly the lurker which you gave 0 thought into is scum? Was it because you think he was scum or because he was lurking...
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actions happen at the end of the night
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On January 08 2014 07:11 onlywonderboy wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2014 07:09 chinstrap wrote: I didnt necessarily agree with the dnyarri lynch but theDragonn was 110% town after his final post I'm pretty much in this camp as well. Was putting a lot of faith in Jonny's word but it was the only chance of getting the vote off of Dragoon.
I'm not in this camp... wtf? Posts right before you get lynched are totally WIFOM... mafia always does that, so does town clearly... the only thing thats different is he listed in order people from scummy to least scummy. But beyond that? Nah cmon...
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On January 08 2014 07:12 JonnyLaw wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2014 15:16 JonnyLaw wrote: I'm more confident in lynching him than other players.
If you want to lynch dnyarri I'm down for that one as well. Otherwise TD stayign at the top of my list. Who do you think should be lynched today then ballaman? Maybe I'm just being lazy. I'll reread the filters. Context?
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On January 08 2014 07:15 JonnyLaw wrote: I'll give it to you, dnyarri could be town. Doubtful but possible. As owb and chin pointed out it's the only possible candidate to get off td.
This wasn't the worst lynch that could have happened but I let us down getting here too late today.
yeah you're right, he was the only candidate... so that's fine
but seriously after TD's last post how could you not be thinking "god damnit i need him to die now to know" like i was... i just cant see how hes so suddenly town... its similar to what poofter did last game obviously
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I have to cool off a bit, i'll be back later. I'm heated. T_T
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Alright here's my problem with how the voting went down last minute there:
Suddenly out of the blue we start switching to dynarri. What's wrong with that as town is as we started switching was that if dragoon HAD BEEN SCUM it would have been so easy to save him. Nobody was really giving a real reason AT DEADLINE to switch to him, which would have made it SOOO freaking easy to save dragoon. That's why I was freaking out.
Now after the lynch.. to me it was fucking sketchy that people tried to do that. Could be trying to appear better by using information bias to your advantage. Most likely not though, since it wasn't very calculated, sudden and from those player's POV it doesn't really make sense for them as scum... nobody was calling them out too hard for pushing dragoon so don't really see why they would want to grab towncred.
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Sure and i understand that... But that was not my reaction... It was still a good 20 mins to lynch. Anyways its moot since thats clearly not what happened.
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Sure that makes sense.
Look, we basically all agreed that there was scum in the vote already. Just because someone was voting for dragoon wasn't alignment indicative at that point. So dnyarri's vote specifically being the first didn't mean anything to me, especially since it was off of a crappy case.
Again though, I was heated already at that point. There's definitely some dumb shit i said at the deadline...
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On January 07 2014 22:34 Derrida wrote: @Balla I will not go back to page 20 to discuss what you think are 'loopholes' in my rhetoric, do keep in mind that it is the very first post of my very first mafia game. I do have somewhat different reads on many participants as of right now.
Derrida: FUCK THIS.
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If you have different reads then explain what changed... You can't just NOT answer stuff because you don't feel like it. You can shut it down because you feel like it's an anti-town question but there is absolutely no reason to not explain reasoning when you are asked. This whole game is about finding "loopholes in your rhetoric".
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I thought Derrida was scum yesterday and still do.
On January 07 2014 19:48 Derrida wrote:@Balla, once again,
Because I said I'm falling asleep, even though I was still conversing with everyone. He doesn't seem particularly worried about who I'm going to vote for but just says it for the sake of saying it. I don't get why he was so pushy about getting an answer. Pretty weak attack obviously though. Noted.
On January 08 2014 04:40 Derrida wrote: Quite the change of heart from bold "lynch me and you will see Suki as scum" to "I'm thinking she is town as well."
This is his last post before deadline... around 2 hrs before it. At this point it was pretty clear that dragoon was going to get lynched. But I do find it super weird that he hasn't even said anything about what went down at lynch time since then. Not to mention this post here isn't helpful and doesn't leave room for Dragoon to try to explain his reasoning more.
On January 07 2014 06:44 Derrida wrote: I've been asked both by TheChyz and Balla about why I thought TheChyz was not scummy. I just re-read through his filter, I still don't think he is scummy. It is a tough question to disprove him not being a scum though, isn't it? Not fair.
This is part of why i'm so annoyed that he doesn't answer two of the points I brought up on pg20. In his first reads, he claims TheChyz is town because he initially reacted to ME the same way, which means he claims he thought I was scummy for being super active and "controlling".
TheChyz got a fair bit of suspicion on him because of that, and ended up retracting and coming up with the "i was just trying to start a bandwagon on myself" argument... yet Derrida has NO OPINION on that whatsoever and town reads thechyz for what everyone else was calling scummy... yet dragoon who did relatively the same thing was NULL for him. There's just so many inconsistencies in his first list post and he has yet to address them all.
I shouldn't have let it go so easily.
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Last thing on the vote switch: I agree with suki, it looks townie... but I think it ends up being pretty non-indicative of alignment until we get a flip on dynyarri and he flips scum. If he flips scum then it is totally town-indicative, if not then it's totally non-indicative.
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Let's stop these personal attacks before they go too far pls. They're hard to read and they're obviously hurtful. It'll just make things emotional.
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Definitely realized that when it happened haha...
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Man I hate that post... so contrived... I would understand if you came up with a scum read on me for not switching if you 100% thought dragoon was town after his final post and don't see how I didn't... but Jonny too basically because of me? I hard it really hard to believe that that's what you came up with right after all this....
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On January 09 2014 02:31 Derrida wrote: Of course you would hate that post because it points to two scums as two scums for the first time in the game. The only two things that do not make sense in that lynch for me are Jonny's switch and your reaction.
And what of OWB's switch?
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And chinstrap switch?
I'm sorry but it's so contrived because that's like the riskiest scum move ever... unless all 3 scum were involved I don't see how you could expect a swing that hard to happen..
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You rely on other townies suddenly changing their opinions for very little for that
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Nope... it was me 1 shot vig
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Im sad jonny is dead i luv u man ride or die
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I really don't get why they killed Jonny after Derrida put out the Me/Jonny scumteam... doesn't make sense...
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Was anybody role blocked?
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If you were just say you were RB'ed and that's it. You should 100% say that if you were RB'ed, there's no reason to hide it and it gives us more information about the setup.
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Why did you think he was bad town? You didn't really say..
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Look @ who he mentions as "tentative townie" or who he does not even mention or make reads on.
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I'm trying to wrap my head around why they would kill Jonny after Derrida made the case vs me and jonny... maybe they knew it was doomed from the start I guess.
So who did Jonny push?
#1 Asuna, #2 Dragoon, #3 Dyrrida (from memory)
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EBWOP dynarri lol... names are too similar
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On January 09 2014 07:53 chinstrap wrote: Also please note that these are the only remaining possible setups:
TTTTT = Goon + Godfather, Serial Killer (Investigation Immune OR 1-Shot Bulletproof) TTTT = 2 Goons + Roleblocker TTT = 2 Goons + Roleblocker, Serial Killer (Investigation Immune OR 1-Shot Bulletproof) TT = Goon + Roleblocker + Godfather T = Goon + Roleblocker + Godfather, Serial Killer (Investigation Immune OR 1-Shot Bulletproof)
Due to the presence of (confirmed) 1xVT, 1xIC, and 1xballa
Well we can't rule out 0Ts. Just cause we have VTs flip doesn't mean that. But ruling out 6T and 7T yeah
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##Vote: Dynarri
This is a policy lynch for me. Play the game or get out~
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4 posts over almost 35 pages is unacceptable
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On January 09 2014 08:05 BigDad wrote: Seriously though where is Dynarri. I'd usually be reluctant to join a vote so early for fear of a bandwagon, but you're both confirmed town in my eyes so..
##Vote: Dynarri
Just curious: why are you here atm? Isn't the deadline at like 7am in Australia?
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@BigDad: Why do you think scum killed Jonny?
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Maybe Derrida knew his case wasn't going to gain any traction so he decided he would drop it and killed him since he made a case on him... probably one of the best cases too..
Unfortunately if Jonny's death had anything to do with Derrida then that helps scum since they don't have to avoid the fact that the death was due to his case on Derrida. Not sure we can gain much more from this nk information wise.
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Other than that it doesn't look like they were trying to frame anybody so I don't think we have to worry about that. Maybe trying to frame dynarri OR try to stop jonny from pushing dynarri. But obviously dynarri is a hot topic atm so everyone is talking about him, so it probably has nothing to do with that.
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On January 09 2014 08:03 chinstrap wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2014 07:58 Balla24 wrote:On January 09 2014 07:53 chinstrap wrote: Also please note that these are the only remaining possible setups:
TTTTT = Goon + Godfather, Serial Killer (Investigation Immune OR 1-Shot Bulletproof) TTTT = 2 Goons + Roleblocker TTT = 2 Goons + Roleblocker, Serial Killer (Investigation Immune OR 1-Shot Bulletproof) TT = Goon + Roleblocker + Godfather T = Goon + Roleblocker + Godfather, Serial Killer (Investigation Immune OR 1-Shot Bulletproof)
Due to the presence of (confirmed) 1xVT, 1xIC, and 1xballa Well we can't rule out 0Ts. Just cause we have VTs flip doesn't mean that. But ruling out 6T and 7T yeah I am terribly sorry. Correction: TTTTT = Goon + Godfather, Serial Killer (Investigation Immune OR 1-Shot Bulletproof) TTTT = 2 Goons + Roleblocker TTT = 2 Goons + Roleblocker, Serial Killer (Investigation Immune OR 1-Shot Bulletproof) TT = Goon + Roleblocker + Godfather T = Goon + Roleblocker + Godfather, Serial Killer (Investigation Immune OR 1-Shot Bulletproof) 0 Ts = Goon + Roleblocker + Godfather
Which from that, we now 100% know that there were 3 scum. So it's 8 to 2 atm haha. We have 2 whole mislynches now until we get to MYLO.
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Just a note: cop doesn't have a shot...
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On January 09 2014 09:37 Balla24 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2014 08:03 chinstrap wrote:On January 09 2014 07:58 Balla24 wrote:On January 09 2014 07:53 chinstrap wrote: Also please note that these are the only remaining possible setups:
TTTTT = Goon + Godfather, Serial Killer (Investigation Immune OR 1-Shot Bulletproof) TTTT = 2 Goons + Roleblocker TTT = 2 Goons + Roleblocker, Serial Killer (Investigation Immune OR 1-Shot Bulletproof) TT = Goon + Roleblocker + Godfather T = Goon + Roleblocker + Godfather, Serial Killer (Investigation Immune OR 1-Shot Bulletproof)
Due to the presence of (confirmed) 1xVT, 1xIC, and 1xballa Well we can't rule out 0Ts. Just cause we have VTs flip doesn't mean that. But ruling out 6T and 7T yeah I am terribly sorry. Correction: TTTTT = Goon + Godfather, Serial Killer (Investigation Immune OR 1-Shot Bulletproof) TTTT = 2 Goons + Roleblocker TTT = 2 Goons + Roleblocker, Serial Killer (Investigation Immune OR 1-Shot Bulletproof) TT = Goon + Roleblocker + Godfather T = Goon + Roleblocker + Godfather, Serial Killer (Investigation Immune OR 1-Shot Bulletproof) 0 Ts = Goon + Roleblocker + Godfather Which from that, we now 100% know that there were 3 scum. So it's 8 to 2 atm haha. We have 2 whole mislynches now until we get to MYLO.
Eish this also means there MUST be a mafia roleblocker or there is 100% a serial killer so the above mislynch scenarios would be false. Who got roleblocked???????? Speak up! You get the message whether you have a role or not so do not worry about outing that you have a role.
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Why would Asuna point out that Derrida's list was missing her if she was scum with him? To gain town cred for the offchance that Derrida flips?
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BigDad I think you can come up with your own analysis on that, what do YOU think?
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On January 09 2014 12:32 BigDad wrote: @balla Currently asking Day_Walker to further back the reasoning on his accusation.
And I'm saying it's pretty clear from his post what he thinks. The whole accusation is founded on the relationship between them and derrida. So it's a weird question...
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So you're not asking about that post specifically but more about his general feeling? Cause it's pretty clear from that case he just posted that it is 100% dependent on Derrida's relationship with them and I don't see how you are missing that.
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Went through everybody's filter here are my notes on who I would write off due to their interactions with derrida. Obviously this is not anything super concrete, but it's a start. I'm not confirming anybody in my mind as town or mafia, because its relatively easy for scum to fake interactions with their partners, but it's also NOT something they think about too hard when its their first scum game.
Some of these might be really weak connections or non-connections, so ask me if you come to a different conclusion and I'll try to clarify.
would not write off: -owb -day_walker -bigdad -dynyarri
people I would write as town due to their interaction with derrida: -chyz -sidesprang -suki
plus conf towns (asuna is subject to change based on if anybody brings up new night action details) - asuna - chinstrap - me
VOTES derrida stayed on dragoon the entire time -owb swapped to DNYARRI -day_walker never got onto dragoon, voted for DNYARRI -bigdad swapped to DAY_WALKER -dnyarri stayed
Therefore, my top suspects atm are dnyarri and bigdad. Looking more into bigdad now since I'm policy lynching dnyarri.
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Comrades! Just because we have found one white conspirator infiltrators does not mean can become complacent! Must still be vigilante in order to wipe out white conspirators within ranks! Have to report here all rumors and concerns as much as possible to find rest. (read in whitera voice)
Seriously where my town at?
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Asuna is confirmed town to me FOR NOW... if she was town RB'ed then the town RB knows she is not confirmed at all and that's fine. But it is highly likely that someone else would claim the scum RB in that case (unless both scum and town RB'ed the same person).
I'm just going with the simplest answer atm, Occam's Razor. I also find it very very unlikely that if scum have an RB they didn't use it unless they have a super competent coach and had no blue reads. That's fine. We will find out. For the meantime, I'm considering Asuna conf. town.
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I think if dnyarri is scum then that is alignment indicative of OWB; he almost got him lynched!
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Nope. But right now we're playing under the assumption that there is no SK.
OWB doesn't play risky, you said it yourself, he's being very careful.
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I made a mistake in my larger post last night: Big_Dad never got on dragoon, he swapped from DAY_WALKER to DNYARRI. That changes things for me a little bit. That means that if all scum are in my top4 then they had a really uncoordinated effort with derrida... it also means that they were voting for dnyarri..
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Obviously the implication is that dnyarri will flip town.
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Yeah, sidesprang was one of my weaker relationships. Sidesprang never mentioned derrida once in his entire time until he died. That indicates there IS a relationship. Derrida was relatively hard on Sidesprang the entire game, BUT it was very easy to fake, especially in his first post where he gives him red...
He never really acts on it. Definitely probably not worth writing off.
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Day_walker, who do you want to lynch today other than dnyarri?
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Note though that sidestrap is voting dnyarri RIGHT NOW:
On January 09 2014 22:21 sidesprang wrote:K, thanks. Then we should be in a very good position imo. I'm trying to read into Derrida's filter, and I think Day_Walker also comes out more town from it. I doubt a he would buddy up like he did in the first post if Day_Walker was scum. I think it would be more an attempt to pocket him than anything else. Also when reading Derrida's first post, he fails to mention both Asuna and Dnyarri. I have only read up on Dnyarri atm, but I really can not understand how you can fail to mention Dnyarri in a list like he made. He had only posted two post by that time. + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2014 20:05 dnyarri wrote: I think TheChyz is suspicious. First he says (s)he wants so lynch lurkers anyway. When people started to suspect him/her (s)he said that (s)he did it on purpose to catch bandwagoners. Bandwagons however give lurkers easy targets which seems contradicts his/her original agenda of lynching lurkers.
Also, TheChyz has only brought confusion and only potentially useful analysis (s)he has brought to table is against Day_Walker who was attacking TheChyz with the list. It appears more like TheChyz is trying to save his/her skin. Though I think Day_Walker is suspicious because of the list, I find TheChyz more suspicious and I don't believe that as a scum Day_Walker would attack another scums this early.
##Vote: TheChyz + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2014 23:43 dnyarri wrote:Actually I have changed my primary target of suspicion from TheChyz to TheDragoon mainly because of this post: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=434723¤tpage=16#316TheDragoon stated that Day_Walker seemed like innocent even though Day_Walker had only posted one list and nothing else. Day_Walker's only vote is against TheChyz which doesn't mean much since TheChyz is easy bandwagoning target. TheDragoon's post give me the impression that he wants to slow voting down by defending (random) people while going to TheChyz-bandwagon and attacking nobody else. TheChyz is confusing but I'm not sure if it's carelessness or risk taking. My logic for calling him scum was somewhat faulted too I think. ##unvote ##vote: TheDragoon In two posts, Dnyari votes for two different people. And his posts looks rather fishy to me. With posts like those two how can you not mention Dnyarri in a list like that. Unless you had a reason not to. That coupled with derrida trying to prevent us from lynching lurkers, and in essence to save dnyarri makes me believe there is a high chance dnyarri is scum. ##Vote Dnyarri
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Basically, all my scum reads have voted for or are pushing dnyarri... that's a pretty big tell that dnyarri will flip town.
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On January 07 2014 18:36 BigDad wrote:Albeit reluctantly I'm liking Day_Walker's stance on lurkers. It's obvious that only Mafia and Serial Killers benefit from lurkers. I've re-read his filter and am now having doubts about stance on him. Day_Walker has started contributing more in the content of his posts than when I made my first accusations. In this post he highlights the benefits for the group of targeting an obvious, yet relatively untouched group of people who have contributed a grand total of essentially nothing. We stand to lose nothing, yet potentially gain from challenging them out of their silence. My reads for suspicious player currently stand against Dnyarri and theDragoon with less doubt on Day_Walker for his pro-town stance on lynching those who aren't contributing. ##Unvote: Day_Walker(Explanation above; also, I don't want to waste a vote on him if we decide to kill of the Anti-Town lurkers or that theDragoon is scummy.)
On January 07 2014 20:30 BigDad wrote: Im off too bed also, I'm going to have to go with either theDragoon or dnyarri.
I may not be awake when the lynch occurs, but if in the next few hours you guys decide to choose a lurker over theDragoon i'll place my vote on dnyarri so that it may be easier to secure a majority. Im happy for either of them to go as one looks scummy and the other isn't adding much at all.
##Vote: dnyrarri
BigDad retreats off of his case for Day_Walker really fast after his "stance" on lurkers and then votes directly on his previous scum read's target without hesitation. This is seriously suspicious. Especially considering he said this about Chyz earlier in the day:
[B]On January 07 2014 08:44 BigDad wrote: I was looking through everyones feeds and saw that, i thought it was notable considering the early (and large) play by him - then the hasty retreat from play with an easy vote on a Lurker. What is your analysis on him so far?
(Context is he's calling out thechyz for making an "easy vote" on dnyarri and then saying he has to go afk)
BigDad, you did EXACTLY the same thing as Chyz later on. That's really weird.
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On January 10 2014 07:25 dnyarri wrote:
I'd probably save chinstrap. chinstrap is IC and very active. Since nobody here is attacking chinstrap, chinstraps death wouldn't give useful information. It would be purely loss for town.
IC means they are 100% confirmed town by moderator.
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On January 10 2014 07:20 onlywonderboy wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2014 02:12 Balla24 wrote: Yeah, sidesprang was one of my weaker relationships. Sidesprang never mentioned derrida once in his entire time until he died. That indicates there IS a relationship. Derrida was relatively hard on Sidesprang the entire game, BUT it was very easy to fake, especially in his first post where he gives him red...
He never really acts on it. Definitely probably not worth writing off. I read that more as Derrida trying to push a case on a semi-lurker that he could justify as a reasonable read when he flipped town. It seemed like he was posturing himself for Day 2 and of course didn't expect to die. I'm still getting a scum vibe from Day_Walker. There are his interactions with Derrida prior to his flip Show nested quote +On January 09 2014 02:15 Day_Walker wrote: I don't like Derrida's post, and I'm going to bed. Show nested quote +On January 09 2014 02:33 Day_Walker wrote:On January 09 2014 02:31 Derrida wrote: Of course you would hate that post because it points to two scums as two scums for the first time in the game. The only two things that do not make sense in that lynch for me are Jonny's switch and your reaction. Also because it is full of statements which are factually incorrect. You have not read the thread carefully. While this is a negative statement against Derrida it's hardly pushing him very hard. Could easily be a weak read to just to build cred if Derrida ever flipped scum (although I doubt the scum team expected it to come so soon) I also don't think his main theory of Asuna/dnyarri/Derrida is super solid. It revolves heavily around the idea of Derrida leaving out Asuana and dnyarri from his initial reads. I just can't imagine a scum player purposely leaving BOTH of his partners off of a list. It's so suspicious and something people could easily find. If that's what actually happened that might be the worst mafia play I've seen in all my newb games. If we are less certain about dnyarri being scum I'm fine with finding a new target, but at this point even if we lynch him we find out a lot of information regardless of how he flips.
I agree with the fact that dynarri/asuna/derrida is pretty unlikely because he left them both off. But it's pretty weak connection. I'd rather find something more concrete. And anyways, asuna is confirmed atm.
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On January 10 2014 07:20 onlywonderboy wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2014 02:12 Balla24 wrote: Yeah, sidesprang was one of my weaker relationships. Sidesprang never mentioned derrida once in his entire time until he died. That indicates there IS a relationship. Derrida was relatively hard on Sidesprang the entire game, BUT it was very easy to fake, especially in his first post where he gives him red...
He never really acts on it. Definitely probably not worth writing off. I read that more as Derrida trying to push a case on a semi-lurker that he could justify as a reasonable read when he flipped town. It seemed like he was posturing himself for Day 2 and of course didn't expect to die.
Yep, that's why I wrote him off initially. But it's probably wrong to write him off for just that, as I said, it's very easy to fake push someone but then pussy out when it comes to lynching them.
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I don't think the Jonnylaw night kill makes sense for a derrida/dnyarri/sidesprang scumteam.
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On January 10 2014 08:28 chinstrap wrote: We need to explain why Derrida chose to defend dynarri immediately after the lynch was almost switched to him.
Because it added to his Jonnylaw/Balla case IMO. He wasn't necessarily defending him but moreso calling Jonny out for something he said.
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Please do point out something scummy in every single post.
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On January 10 2014 07:45 Balla24 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2014 07:25 dnyarri wrote:
I'd probably save chinstrap. chinstrap is IC and very active. Since nobody here is attacking chinstrap, chinstraps death wouldn't give useful information. It would be purely loss for town.
IC means they are 100% confirmed town by moderator.
Sorry, misread the Q. But, Mafia isn't looking to kill for information... they are looking to kill to win the game. Why would chinstrap's death not give useful information? Anybody dying would give useful information unless Mafia is doing it for literally no reason other than killing someone.
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Because there was only 1 non town KP obviously.
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Do you know something that we don't? At this point in town as town we assume that there is no SK, that's all there is to it. The only way you would know if there was an SK at this point is:
1. You are the SK. 2. You are mafia and your KP got blocked but SK's went through.
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This is the assumption that we play at AT THIS CURRENT MOMENT.
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There is no evidence pointing to an SK, so I find it really really weird that you are even considering it at this point.
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Especially cause:
1. We've already discussed it. 2. It's pretty obvious.
I almost view that as a slip.
There's always 50% chance AT the beginning of the game. Right now there is way less chance.
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Eish... this was bad play by me. Sorry if i just fucked up like i think I did.
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Ok, doesn't seem like what I thought i just did. Regardless, this is pointless to even bring up right now. Yo usaid it yourself, scum lynching is more important than sk lynching.
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On January 10 2014 14:33 Day_Walker wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2014 14:29 Balla24 wrote: Eish... this was bad play by me. Sorry if i just fucked up like i think I did. Well ... I don't see it myself :/
Good, cause the 3rd reason that I forgot to mention is:
You are a town role that knows something is up with the KP because you interfered with it. That's obviously not the case though ^_^
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Who would you lynch other than dnyarri
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How could you miss that bigdad also has a vote on dnyarri..
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Like both of your scum reads other than dnyarri have a vote on dynarri. You cancel out OWB as scum because his vote on dynarri yet you don't cancel out Bigdad..
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On January 10 2014 14:43 Day_Walker wrote:OK About your previous question, I think the only two people who don't look better after the night are OWB and BigDad. I reread both of their filters, and the only thing that really pops out is that OWB keeps going after what in my read is a confirmed town (aka me). [/b]
Also, I'm confused about this. How is this scummy at all by OWB? How is he supposed to know you're town? It's also weird that you find the need to even include this since the rest of your post you cancel out OWB as a scum....
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I like that logic for the Jonny NK. Only thing that actually makes sense to me...
In summary:
1. Lazy scumhunting 2. Strange wording when discussing dnyarri. Disappears for the rest of the day as if the lynch was in the bag. 3. No defense. 4. Weak defense of Derrida last night, seemed a bit surprised that he died.
##unvote ##vote Onlywonderboy
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This definitely resembles his scum game more. We'll see how he reacts under pressure. Last game he completely crumpled and just lurked until he got lynched. He's obviously not going to do that here, but we'll see.
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On January 10 2014 16:46 Day_Walker wrote:Show nested quote +On January 10 2014 14:44 Balla24 wrote: How could you miss that bigdad also has a vote on dnyarri.. Oh somehow I had it in my mind that BigDad voted for Dragoon first lynch. My bad. Since dnyarri has such a big target painted on him today, I wasn't putting much weight on the fact that BigDad has his vote on dnyarri right now. Show nested quote +On January 10 2014 14:57 Balla24 wrote: Also, I'm confused about this. How is this scummy at all by OWB? How is he supposed to know you're town? Right now I expect scum would be trying to put some of the heat on townies. Right now from my point of view, OWB is doing this. He is doing something that would make sense for scum to do. Of course it is totally possible that OWB it town, and its not a particularly strong argument for OWB scum even from my perspective. Show nested quote +On January 10 2014 14:57 Balla24 wrote: It's also weird that you find the need to even include this since the rest of your post you cancel out OWB as a scum.... It's weird that when I share my thoughts about someone, I include both sides I see, even the side that I ultimately disfavor?
Day_walker I really don't understand this and your following posts. OWB is very clearly scum in your eyes, yet somehow you decide to vote DNYARRI still even though OWB is voting for him. Then in your following post you take the exact same position as OWB and even point out how uneasy it makes you. Yet you do it anyways.
It's also really annoying that you didn't vote last night, definitely should have showed your vote.
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EBWOP: Cross that last sentence rofl...
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@Dnyarri what do you think about BigDad?
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@OWB how do you justify having DW as a scum read yet you continue to vote dnyarri even though DW wanted dnyarri lynched yesterday?
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On January 11 2014 03:48 onlywonderboy wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2014 02:58 Balla24 wrote: @OWB how do you justify having DW as a scum read yet you continue to vote dnyarri even though DW wanted dnyarri lynched yesterday? I haven't voted yet. I said I was okay with the dnyarri vote but I hadn't committed to it because I wasn't convinced it was completely the right lynch. As I said my suspicion lies on vote: Day_Walker Sadly these accusations come at a bad time as I am at work and don't have the time to come up with a concrete defense. I know Balla will say this is like the last game I was scum and I must say the parallels are quite unfortunate. Sorry that my play was wishy washy, it's just the way a play and I realize it's actually poorly suited for wwinning games.
The problem is you could have answered some of Suki's concerns about you last night or beforehand. You didn't so now you can't defend yourself. Gah.
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On January 11 2014 04:07 Day_Walker wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2014 03:49 dnyarri wrote: About his comment on death of JonnyLaw, BigDad said this:
<quote> He facilitated discussion through his aggressive play. Day one for JonnyLaw was pretty full on, check it out. He went after TheChyz, theDragoon, BigDad, Asuna and OWB. </quote>
I looked at JonnyLaw's filter and it's clear that JonnyLaw was actively going after BigDad too until theDragoon and later I got all the attention. Yet BigDad didn't mention that. Did he try to hide the fact that he was suspicious too? I would have expected "transparency" from BigDad since he was supposedly promoting it. JonnyLaw's death is easily explained if BigDad is scum. BigDad did mention it?
My problem with what bigdad said there was that he didn't conclude anything from Jonnylaw's death. He gave a general statement. He didn't even come up with the fact that mafia might be trying to frame him by killing Jonnylaw. Just cause he mentioned that jonny went after him doesn't mean he's being transparent.
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@OWB, if you're still around and you can't defend yourself, can you at least give your 5 sec read on BigDad?
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You too Day_Walker. Why or why not BigDad = scum? Since you have more time apparently.
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@Dnyarri, what is your opinion on sidesprang?
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Need answers. Lynching scum depends on it.
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No because this time I am specifically asking them questions and for some reason they are not here.
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This is what happens when we spend the beginning of the day discussing the lurker and nothing else. Scum gets to lurk themselves because everybody wants to kill the lurker.
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Ok:
Here are my possible scumpairs at this very moment:
1. BigDad/OWB 2. BigDad/Day_Walker 3. Sidesprang/Dnyarri 4. Sidesprang/OWB
I townread OWB for his recent post, but overall his D2 was pretty lackluster. His soft defenses of derrida and sidesprang were pretty bad. What bothers me is nobody is coming to his defense. Sidesprang and Bigdad are both afk, the people I think he is scum with. I had day_walker/owb as a high priorty scumpair, but bussing your teammate when it's 8 to 2 is a pretty bad idea since it gives us even MORE mislynches which will just make this game so easy.
If we are hitting scum right now in OWB: why is nobody coming to his defense? If we properly lynch today it's essentially game over for scum.
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On January 11 2014 01:21 sidesprang wrote: I've actually been looking into OWB the last hour. I really dislike the lack of activity atm, and its making me paranoid.
I also took note of the post you are refering to, and find it somewhat wierd. Tho my thoughts where more that why would he say those things about Derrida if town allready moved past ? Unless he knew derrida was scum and he went overly defensive about it.
I read up on a few of his old games:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=433102&user=onlywonderboy¤tpage=3 http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=430766&user=onlywonderboy
I do feel his scumgame resembles this game more than his towngame. Tho I might just see what I want to see, so if someone else can also take a look at it, that would be nice. Also you played with him before Balla could you give some more insight since you were in those games.
I feel he is more passive and talks about non reads stuff in his scum game, which I also feel he has been doing to some extent here. And in his town game he seems to be tring a lot more to find scum.
Also if you check his profile you can see he is active here on TL.net. So why is he not posting more ?
Sidesprang. You had this to say about OWB. Yet now you don't want to lynch him? Who do you think is scum with dnyarri if you think dnyarri is so scummy?
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Sidesprang has these posts about Dnyarri:
On January 07 2014 21:55 sidesprang wrote: Regarding dnyarri i'm not sold on him being mafia, and not on him being a better lynch either. His first two post were questionable at best, but his third one I really liked.
There are only two reasons to lynch a lurker as I see it.
1. There are no clear active mafia candidate 2. You will never be able to read the lurker.
I think when he posts some more we will be able to get a read on him, its not like he is posting one liners.
On January 09 2014 00:07 sidesprang wrote: Hmm, so trying to read into the stuff that happend after I left yesterday and up to the vote.
It might just be because I know now that theDragoon is town. But his posts in the end is actually a really good and convincing defence. Like I dont think he would have done that as scum. And I would say atleast johnny and OWB are more town for doing that voteswitch.
Reason being:
If we actually lynched dnyarri and he came up town, they kinda stuck their neck out for nothing. The way they changed vote without any explanation and kinda out of the blue would have been hard to explain. Especially with a green lynch on their vote swap. I don't think scum would have taken that risk.
On the other hand, seeing how it went down. I can't fault others for not following, especially since I can only now read theDragoons post while knowing he is town. Its a bit hard for me to judge how much towny he looked before the vote.
I think we should spend some more energy on looking at the votes. I'll try to see if I can find something. And we also need to get dynarri to talk more. Atm he is the only one that is not contributing enough to be able to read properly. I thought / hoped he would be more active than this.
So Dnyarri: What are your current reads, and what do you think about the vote swaps onto you yesterday?
Then after day2 starts and our policy lynch bandwagon starts on him he votes him, sudden change of opinion even though dnyarri didn't say anything to THIS:
On January 09 2014 22:21 sidesprang wrote:K, thanks. Then we should be in a very good position imo. I'm trying to read into Derrida's filter, and I think Day_Walker also comes out more town from it. I doubt a he would buddy up like he did in the first post if Day_Walker was scum. I think it would be more an attempt to pocket him than anything else. Also when reading Derrida's first post, he fails to mention both Asuna and Dnyarri. I have only read up on Dnyarri atm, but I really can not understand how you can fail to mention Dnyarri in a list like he made. He had only posted two post by that time. + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2014 20:05 dnyarri wrote: I think TheChyz is suspicious. First he says (s)he wants so lynch lurkers anyway. When people started to suspect him/her (s)he said that (s)he did it on purpose to catch bandwagoners. Bandwagons however give lurkers easy targets which seems contradicts his/her original agenda of lynching lurkers.
Also, TheChyz has only brought confusion and only potentially useful analysis (s)he has brought to table is against Day_Walker who was attacking TheChyz with the list. It appears more like TheChyz is trying to save his/her skin. Though I think Day_Walker is suspicious because of the list, I find TheChyz more suspicious and I don't believe that as a scum Day_Walker would attack another scums this early.
##Vote: TheChyz + Show Spoiler +On January 06 2014 23:43 dnyarri wrote:Actually I have changed my primary target of suspicion from TheChyz to TheDragoon mainly because of this post: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=434723¤tpage=16#316TheDragoon stated that Day_Walker seemed like innocent even though Day_Walker had only posted one list and nothing else. Day_Walker's only vote is against TheChyz which doesn't mean much since TheChyz is easy bandwagoning target. TheDragoon's post give me the impression that he wants to slow voting down by defending (random) people while going to TheChyz-bandwagon and attacking nobody else. TheChyz is confusing but I'm not sure if it's carelessness or risk taking. My logic for calling him scum was somewhat faulted too I think. ##unvote ##vote: TheDragoon In two posts, Dnyari votes for two different people. And his posts looks rather fishy to me. With posts like those two how can you not mention Dnyarri in a list like that. Unless you had a reason not to. That coupled with derrida trying to prevent us from lynching lurkers, and in essence to save dnyarri makes me believe there is a high chance dnyarri is scum. ##Vote Dnyarri
"His posts look rather fishy" to you? Why weren't they fishy before? I don't get that. YOU ALSO tried to prevent us from lynching lurkers in the first post i quoted, yet you point out that derrida was also trying to prevent us to not lynch lurkers.
Also, this post here:
On January 09 2014 20:40 sidesprang wrote: I think Balla just assumed the roleblocker had to be mafia, but town can have one aswell. So that should not make you confirmed.
But atleast, If there are a town roleblocker I think you should roleblock Asuna again just on the odd chance he is SK.
Is super fishy to me. Of course I assume the roleblocker is mafia. Asuna wasn't giving out any super scummy feeling, I don't see why a town RB'er would RB Asuna first off. And secondly, I was fishing for scum RB target claims. No town RB has claimed it yet so I'm still assuming that. I understand that there is the possibility of a town RB keeping it under wraps and that is fine.
Sidesprang trying to keep the fact that it could be a town RB out there is really weird to me.
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On January 11 2014 06:35 sidesprang wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2014 06:24 Balla24 wrote:On January 11 2014 01:21 sidesprang wrote: I've actually been looking into OWB the last hour. I really dislike the lack of activity atm, and its making me paranoid.
I also took note of the post you are refering to, and find it somewhat wierd. Tho my thoughts where more that why would he say those things about Derrida if town allready moved past ? Unless he knew derrida was scum and he went overly defensive about it.
I read up on a few of his old games:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=433102&user=onlywonderboy¤tpage=3 http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=430766&user=onlywonderboy
I do feel his scumgame resembles this game more than his towngame. Tho I might just see what I want to see, so if someone else can also take a look at it, that would be nice. Also you played with him before Balla could you give some more insight since you were in those games.
I feel he is more passive and talks about non reads stuff in his scum game, which I also feel he has been doing to some extent here. And in his town game he seems to be tring a lot more to find scum.
Also if you check his profile you can see he is active here on TL.net. So why is he not posting more ? Sidesprang. You had this to say about OWB. Yet now you don't want to lynch him? Who do you think is scum with dnyarri if you think dnyarri is so scummy? ¨ Because I think its more likely that dnyarri is scum ? I posted what I did because I was unsure about OWB, and wanted more input. And also wanted to provide the things I found to the town. As then others might see something I don't. Atm I think its more likely and more rewarding to lynch dynarri. I see no strong cases for OWB, and feel we might just go away from dynarri because it felt to easy. So I would rather stick with my original read. Then please explain why you flip flopped on dnyarri from D1 to D2.
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A note on my town RB point. If there was a town RB there should have been 2 RB claims. One from scum and one from town. If you are town RB and you DID RB asuna then that means you pretty much have a confirmed SK.
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On January 11 2014 06:44 Asuna wrote: Hmm, well OWB it is o.o
##Vote: onlywonderboy
No STOP please think critically. Biggest bullshit vote ever.
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Chyz, 5 sec feelings on sidesprang?
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Lightning posting guys we need it.. only 13 minutes left and we might be mislynching here.
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I think sidesprang has a larger chance to flip scum than OWB at this point.
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On January 11 2014 06:48 TheChyz wrote: ##Unvote ##Vote: Asuna
No reasoning, lurking until deadline, probably hoping to just live till next day.
This is terrible. Asuna is confirmed town until a town RB unconfirms her.
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Derrida's interactions with sidesprang is the only thing that makes me worried.
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BigDad is probably more likely too.
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On January 11 2014 06:53 sidesprang wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2014 06:52 Balla24 wrote: Derrida's interactions with sidesprang is the only thing that makes me worried. Because he said "i felt scummy" ? And for some reason I never found that attack worth defending ?
No dude that was a positive point for you...
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Sidesprang would u lynch bigdad?
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Im saying thats the only reason I wouldn't lynch you..
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Cool. This turned out well I think.
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OWB flipping is going to be good for us regardless.
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We gain a lot of info here.
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Day 3 is going to be fun if what i'm thinking is happening. Will post about it later.
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No BigDad. It's not because he's the "less scummy option". Literally everyone wanted to lynch him, all my scum reads. OWB, You, Day_walker, Sidesprang... that makes him not scum.
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WITH THAT SAID. Sidesprang and Dnyarri scumteam is still possible in my opinion, and yesterday's events puts them in a great position if they are a team because evidence points away from that team. I'm wrestling with a few ideas in my head and i'll post them when I get time.
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^ Yep.
I'm super frustrated because it seems like all the townies in the pool of players that I deem possibly scum ARE NOT TRYING TO SOLVE THE GAME. I can't do much with the info you guys are giving me. The last hour of the day was the only time where we had anything going. That was a terrible day on the part of this town. Good thing there's leeway with Derrida's death.
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@BigDad... i don't care if you still think dnyarri is mafia. You're tunneling like a mad man. If dnyarri is so mafia, who is his second mafia?
If you say Chyz...
-How do you justify their interactions with each other on Day1 (they attacked each other's arguments and cross voted each other in an OMGUS style early on)? -And how do you justify Chyz and Derrida's interactions on day1? (I'll admit when I re-look, I probably jumped the gun on this one)
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(note that I'm not saying it's not possible... I just want to see you do some work)
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@TheChyz
Your top scumreads atm are ?????... you seemed to have also tunneled on Dnyarri and OWB yesterday. Towards the end of the day you seemed convinced by me that OWB was going to flip town... why?
Why was DW not a target for you on D2 at all? You seemingly went from super scummy n1 on him to NULL on day 2? What happened?
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On January 11 2014 07:06 TheChyz wrote: Gotta go for a few hours, will be back afterwards. This vote kinda sucks but I think there is quite a wealth of information that can be garnered from it.
What info can be garnered from it? Want your analysis before night ends!
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On January 09 2014 22:21 sidesprang wrote: K, thanks. Then we should be in a very good position imo.
I'm trying to read into Derrida's filter, and I think Day_Walker also comes out more town from it. I doubt a he would buddy up like he did in the first post if Day_Walker was scum. I think it would be more an attempt to pocket him than anything else.
@Sidesprang How is this good logic for saying Day_walker comes out more town from it? It's terrible logic actually. You have no idea if he would buddy up like that or not. None whatsoever. I think it's VERY likely he buddied up to one of his teammates and started bussing the other (while not pushing too hard).
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On January 11 2014 04:07 Day_Walker wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2014 03:49 dnyarri wrote: About his comment on death of JonnyLaw, BigDad said this:
<quote> He facilitated discussion through his aggressive play. Day one for JonnyLaw was pretty full on, check it out. He went after TheChyz, theDragoon, BigDad, Asuna and OWB. </quote>
I looked at JonnyLaw's filter and it's clear that JonnyLaw was actively going after BigDad too until theDragoon and later I got all the attention. Yet BigDad didn't mention that. Did he try to hide the fact that he was suspicious too? I would have expected "transparency" from BigDad since he was supposedly promoting it. JonnyLaw's death is easily explained if BigDad is scum. BigDad did mention it?
Why is this your last post in the thread till lynch. There was a large amount of time till lynch time, we were actively having a conversation. We were curious about your real thoughts on BigDad since you semeed to have considered him as scum, wrote him off for some unknown reason to us. Proceeded to soft-defend him and then disappear.
For some reason you were wrestling with a dnyarri lynch versus BigDad/OWB and then as soon as you switch to OWB you disappear? That's weird. Very weird. It seemed like it was such a tough choice for you, why did you not follow up??
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On January 12 2014 03:37 sidesprang wrote:Show nested quote +On January 12 2014 03:22 Balla24 wrote:On January 09 2014 22:21 sidesprang wrote: K, thanks. Then we should be in a very good position imo.
I'm trying to read into Derrida's filter, and I think Day_Walker also comes out more town from it. I doubt a he would buddy up like he did in the first post if Day_Walker was scum. I think it would be more an attempt to pocket him than anything else.
@Sidesprang How is this good logic for saying Day_walker comes out more town from it? It's terrible logic actually. You have no idea if he would buddy up like that or not. None whatsoever. I think it's VERY likely he buddied up to one of his teammates and started bussing the other (while not pushing too hard). @Balla And I do not think it's likely. And your logic about this point is very bad. Your point against me is that I have no idea if he would buddy up or not. But you know what you dont either. It's all speculation at this point anyhow, but I think it's less likely that he would do that to a scumbuddy than not. simple as that.
My problem is that you seemingly used it to write Day_walker off. You posted this about Day_walker the night before
On January 08 2014 03:20 sidesprang wrote:
Day_Walker
When I read his filter I see a possibility for him being scum, however I think its way more likely for him to be scum if theDragoon is scum.
I feel he gave him a weak townread in the start with his list. And when BigDad says he find Day_Walker and theDragon both became overly defensive about it.
And also as chinstrap pointed out making a scumcase for the lurkers and a towncase for theDragoon, is something that very well can be done as scum regardless of theDragoon's allignment. And the more I think about it, I think it's more likely to be done if he is scum.
If he makes a case for theDragoon is town then if he flips town he gets cred. If he flips scum then he tried to save his buddy.
I do however feel this is very circumstantial and I would not feel comfortable lynching him, but this is what I read when I tried to view him as scum.
So for me, saying that Derrida marked him as town is the ONLY reasoning I see for you giving Day_walker a pass on day2. Is there more that you didn't post?
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For @Dnyarri:
Now that OWB has flipped town... I can assume that your targets are Day_Walker and BigDad.
- BigDad pushed for a Day_Walker lynch on D1. What do you make of this? Who is your backup scum pick for each team in the case that you think it makes them NOT a scumteam? IE, Day_walker + ___ and BigDad + _______
- Can you reiterate why Day_Walker was NOT a better lynch than OWB?
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That's not what I meant about OWB: I meant you seemed convinced by me that OWB was going to flip town. You were very antsy to find a different target. Why? What was it that made you not happy with the lynch PRE-FLIP.
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Also: there's 3 hours left, if I were going to post it I would have plenty of time to post it. I lost faith in the theory anyways.
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On January 12 2014 03:59 sidesprang wrote: After reading that post did you expect me to go after Day_Walker?
D1 after doing some analysis -> I'm not comfortable lynching him. D2 getting townread from flipped scum -> less inclined to lynch him.
No but I didn't expect you to completely give him a free pass because it's definitely NOT enough to give him a free pass for it.
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Note: "I'm not comfortable lynching him" does not mean "I don't feel scummy on him" you very clearly felt scummy on him D1.
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On January 12 2014 04:03 TheChyz wrote: And Balla, thats a bullshit reason not to make your post. You said "Day 3 is going to be fun if what i'm thinking is happening. Will post about it later" and since you keep pestering others to explain their thoughts, I expect you to do the same.
NO fuck that that's so scummy. It's pretty obvious what I had to say was due to night actions. You're pretty silly if you can't see that. So why would I post it 3 HOURS before the night is over and let mafia plan around that.
MOST IMPORTANTLY THOUGH: Why are you pushing me so hard for it? I'm clearly active. This is SO fricking scummy from you Chyz. Do you need it to make a decision on what to do with your scum buddy?
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On January 12 2014 04:06 dnyarri wrote:@Balla I'm having problem understanding your first questions last part: Show nested quote +Who is your backup scum pick for each team in the case that you think it makes them NOT a scumteam? IE, Day_walker + ___ and BigDad + _______ Could you clarify your question?
Sure. I'm ASSUMING that your scum reads now that OWB has flipped are Day_walker and BigDad (correct me if I'm wrong) based on what you have said. The question revolves around the first sentence of that bullet-
"BigDad pushed for a Day_Walker lynch on D1...."
To me this indicates that Day_Walker is not scum with BigDad. I'm asking if you agree. If you DO agree, then who is your OTHER scum pick for each team consisting of your two scum reads?
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On January 12 2014 04:09 sidesprang wrote:Show nested quote +On January 12 2014 04:01 Balla24 wrote: Note: "I'm not comfortable lynching him" does not mean "I don't feel scummy on him" you very clearly felt scummy on him D1. I feel you are really bad at reading my posts. I state the reason for me doing that analysis is that he was one of the two possible lynch candidates at that time. And since I was going out and would not be there for the last hours I felt I should atleast look into them both. I said it could be possible that he was scum, but mostly if theDragoon also was scum. But I also said I felt that theory was very circumstantial. So how you get that post to be "you very clearly felt scummy on him D1" I dont even know....
Good answer. Sorry if I misread or whatever but the activity level is abysmal atm. I don't want to leave the thread in a state like this if I die. So i'm pushing all the people who are possibly scum:
It's very clear that you are not ALL scum, but the way you guys are playing are making it very hard to narrow it down. As you can see I can easily find things to poke at for everyone, which not only makes it easy for scum to do so as well but thats what makes it so hard for town to narrow it down.
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On January 12 2014 04:22 TheChyz wrote: @Balla What is so scummy about it, your doing the exact same thing from everybody else and forcing them to explain things, what makes you such a special case that whenever you say something we should just let you pass cause your active? Jonny (i think) said that you are active both scum and town so I find no reason why you felt that posting that you will post your thoughts later and then now not wanting to is scummy from me. Seems like your being very defensive. And you don't have to post now, just before night ends (even if its 1 sec before)
Are you not paying attention? I'm confirmed vig AKA town, I shot derrida last night.
It's scummy because you're pushing me for information that will help scum determine their night actions. Simple as that.
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On January 12 2014 04:30 dnyarri wrote: @Balla
Ok that certainly clarified. Your question. Currently I suspect BigDad most, but I'm not sure who would be second most suspicious. Since onlywonderboy turned out to be townie, I'm suspecting sidesprang again. sidesprang's filter has only one mention of BigDad. sidesprang said they would look into BigDad but hasn't said anything yet. I'm somewhat suspicious of Day_Walker, but Day_Walker doesn't seem very probable scum buddy for BigDad.
So quick analysis tells me that BigDad and sidesprang might be in scum team.
I'll look through some filters and give you more detailed answer and anwer the other question. Meanwhile, I'll ask question of my own. I need to learn more about sidesprang.
@sidesprang What is your read on BigDad? Who would be his scum buddy if he was scum?
Day_Walker doesn't seem probable scum buddy with BigDad yes. But just because he's not BigDad's scum buddy does not mean he's not scum. This is why I asked it from both ways. Who would Day_Walker's partner be? Why?
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On January 12 2014 03:14 Balla24 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 11 2014 07:06 TheChyz wrote: Gotta go for a few hours, will be back afterwards. This vote kinda sucks but I think there is quite a wealth of information that can be garnered from it. What info can be garnered from it? Want your analysis before night ends!
Chyz you skipped this too.
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Here are my reads in case I'm dead in a few minutes:
Dnyarri - Town: Was pushed by almost anybody. Once was threatened to be lynch started actually being really helpful, especially on n2. Just poke this guy a lot if you need him to be active and it looks like he will be.
Suki - Town: Some may disagree with this but I've been considering her confirmed town for her interactions with Derrida on N1. She was seriously gonna push him 100% genuine case on him. If there turns out to be an SK, you may want to reconsider.
TheChyz - Scummy: I was town reading him on day 1 and for the most part of day2... but his play recently is really questionable. This is one person where a Dnyarri pair with him kind of makes sense so look out for that. Seems unlikely but still a possibility IMO.
BigDad - Scummy: Doesn't defend himself against any accusations and just calls it wrong without even giving it a second thought. AFK all of the important time during day2 after leaving his vote on Dnyarri. Barely responds to anything. Could be just frustrated that we didn't lynch dnyarri twice in a row though.
sidesprang - Neutral/Scummy: Even though I had issue with his d2, I like how he responds to all my pressure. Seems relatively townie other than that. Only thing I have a problem with him is that he doesn't give his opinions on everybody, only his target and people. Be VERY weary of a day_walker/sidesprang team.
Day_walker- SCUMMY: Where is this guy?? Don't have much to say off the top of my head except he's scummy.
I think that's everybody. Hopefully I don't die and I can elaborate a bit on some things.
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GG, sorry for my poor performance. Feel really bad about this game tbh.
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Well played Suki, not sure I would have been able to read you had I not died... your n1 was really good though. After I died though I knew instantly after Chyz did his weird "roleclaim" play... you went along with it for some reason im surprised nobody caught that .
EDIT: Thanks a lot for hosting LoneMeow and also to the coaches! Onto the big leagues :D
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She said he was town because of his analysis and then went for it anyways.
EDIT: Not his analysis, HER analysis, called him his last play a bad town play.
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My coaching QT with Bumatlarge btw:
http://www.quicktopic.com/50/H/knfcKBg5R7AaV
I felt really bad about my d1 and d2 reads, but really good about my activity and obviously I shot a scum which is awesome. I guess i'm one of those slow starters but throughout the rest of the game after I died my reads obviously got better since I pegged you guys right after suki made her "chyz is town" spiel. Town was really in a bad shape after I died, I'm wondering if I was a little too active and demotivated a lot of them? Unfortunately we let them lurk after I died, which just made it so easy for THEM to push the lurkers. Day_walker was a REALLY REALLY easy lynch.
Sidesprang specifically you should have been able to see that Day_walker was not the right lynch, since your other choices for scum were on him.
Also I'm really surprised that we didn't switch off of OWB, that's something I felt I did really wrong and didn't defend him enough. It was clearly not the right lynch, along with dnyarri. But I didn't have the power to force a switch, not to mention the AFKness of the town at that point, but it wasn't obvious that it was a bad lynch until 1 or 2 hours to go till deadline.
Oh and another thing!!!! If you're confirmed town do not announce you're going to be gone for a few days, even though mafia already wanted to NK me based on their QT, it just made their choice SO easy. The easiest thing ever. Well chinstrap just said he would be afk for a few days so no reason to worry about him lets kill the other confirmed town. Gah.
Salty bout dat almost 3/3 wins T_T
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On January 17 2014 07:42 LoneMeow wrote:Show nested quote +He obviously refuses to get modkilled by continuing to play the game. That in itself is a scumtell, but whatever doesn't matter. This is not true. As either alignment, if you can not be replaced but are busy you play the best you can. Strategic modkills are explicitly disallowed in the rules.
Hey that was me! Mostly an emotional post tbh. I was annoyed at the level of activity from some players specifically. At that point i thought Dnyarri was scummy for his content but NOT scummy for the way the game was going so I was really in a tough spot with him, especially considering he hadn't stepped up his game yet (WHICH HE DID!). After d2 though Dnyarri was much better, just not enough to get over the hump. He was pretty clearly town though.
On January 17 2014 07:38 suki wrote: I was really hoping I could fool the obsQT up until this final day. =]
Also I signed up for that shadow mafia thing cuz I saw you (Balla) and Jonny are in it.. But in the meantime are either of you playing in another game?
I'm just playing Voice mafia every once in a while, while waiting for the Shadow mafia game to get going ^_^. If there's another mini that pops up before the shadower game gets going (which won't be for a while) i'll join that so keep an eye out.
Otherwise definitely hop in voice! It's fun and not as stressful since we play smaller games that go a lot faster and often play silly setups!
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On January 17 2014 07:51 marvellosity wrote: Disregarding everything else in the game, BigDad should have been lynched simply for his totally unnatural read(s) on dinyarri.
A townie simply does not look at dinyarri this way, the way the game went down.
Don't really know about anything else.
Also how he interacted with his town reads! He consistently asked his town reads for confirmation on his cases instead of asking his case target stuff. Luckily, Suki did a good job deflecting the lynch off him many times ^_^
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On January 17 2014 07:56 suki wrote: @Balla : I don't think I could do voice mafia :> The only reason I can maintain my composure in these mafia games is because I have 2 hours to think on everything I say before I say it.
I'd be the most obvious scum in the world if I had to react to everything live.
So am I!!! Just ask rayn lol... It's a good place to improve since it's so fast paced!
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OH AND KUSH IS SUCH A GOOD COACH! WOW!!!
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On January 17 2014 08:02 LoneMeow wrote:Show nested quote +On January 17 2014 07:59 Balla24 wrote:On January 17 2014 07:56 suki wrote: @Balla : I don't think I could do voice mafia :> The only reason I can maintain my composure in these mafia games is because I have 2 hours to think on everything I say before I say it.
I'd be the most obvious scum in the world if I had to react to everything live. So am I!!! Just ask rayn lol... It's a good place to improve since it's so fast paced! It's a completely different game, though, so it doesn't teach much about forum play (disclaimer: I haven't played with the TL crowd).
Ehh... I kinda disagree. It 100% helps overall mafia skills, and DEFINITELY helps for fast paced style forum play that is very popular on this forum.
Plus we play with a similar setup style to how the forum is played, where you have flips and the voting style etc. The only thing that is super different is you can base a lot of your reads on voice tells.
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On January 17 2014 07:20 onlywonderboy wrote: I'll probably never play forum mafia again, but it sure was a hell of a ride. These newbie games were fun, glad I at least got to experience it for several games.
Makes me sad I enjoyed playing with you and thanks for filling the game up :D but yeah if you don't enjoy it no reason to play it ^_^
Have a good one OWB you'll be missed.
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On that note: for the rest of the newbies here! If you enjoyed it make sure to keep an eye out for the next newbie game should be going up soon, not sure who is hosting, or try your hand at one of the other games. There's a mini that's looking for players and a large PM game (25 players) as well. Also feel free to /obs any game that you don't want to play in to participate in the observer QT where often times skilled players are giving their thoughts on the game as it goes on.
Enjoy!
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Shouldn't have gotten yourself lynched P
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On January 17 2014 14:16 JonnyLaw wrote:Suki you played well. Balla's better than me at making cases by the way. Much better. I get a feeling but don't relate it to other people well enough. And again, suki you crushed this game. From 1-14 obs qt
explain why you always get killed faster than me then
edit: die first*
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On January 18 2014 01:04 suki wrote: I've noticed I have this ability to make cases on people and be completely ignored. It happened in my previous game as VT trying to push miltonkram and it happened in this game as BigDad lol
T_T happens to me too. But tbh you made a lot of consecutive cases most of the time, so its easy to ignore some and look at others.
Half the game though I was looking at people's posts and yelling at myself "WHAT THE HELL GUYS THAT WAS ME NOT JONNY" or "WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT I'VE DONE PLENTY OF CASES" haha so I feel you!
It's just our posting style. I tend to make my cases in shorter posts during conversation, so they are naturally forgettable. For you, you tend to make longer cases but also post 3 or 4 consecutively so it's more information overload.
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On January 18 2014 01:23 LoneMeow wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2014 01:04 suki wrote: I've noticed I have this ability to make cases on people and be completely ignored. It happened in my previous game as VT trying to push miltonkram and it happened in this game as BigDad lol I think most of your cases gave the feel that you weren't really trying to push for the lynch. They were all decent cases and explained why you voted for someone, but the follow-up push to get others on the wagon seemed to be missing.
It was also to push for ANY lynch since there were a LOT of scummy townies, just look at how many targets we had on d2. I did the same thing. T_T
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On January 18 2014 01:22 JonnyLaw wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2014 01:17 suki wrote:On January 18 2014 01:11 Balla24 wrote: It's just our posting style. I tend to make my cases in shorter posts during conversation, so they are naturally forgettable. For you, you tend to make longer cases but also post 3 or 4 consecutively so it's more information overload. With our powers combined...!!! You'll confuse everyone. I demand more anger.
Yeah newbies are way too nice
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No you wouldn't have cause I shot Derrida.
I knew i was in pretty bad shape with the town post dragoon lynch so that's one of the reasons i felt pressure to shoot that night. In hindsight, it probably would have been better to just push a Derrida lynch instead of shooting him, and shooting BigDad the next night. One day is not enough to fully examine scum/scum interaction which is what I based my reads on in day2.
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