I just want to again emphasize that unless hosts are framing Holyflare, the polyjuice description confirms him as mafia. Yes, it says the person will only lose any magical powers, but it also says that squib is a vanilla townie or mafia goon. Ie. a person with no powers at all. A person with a hidden vote CAN NOT be a vanilla townie.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 29 2013 14:51 GMT

#4901

On October 29 2013 23:50 Mocsta wrote:

Show nested quote +

umm.

so this means Grack is scum too?

Why? Grack claimed a VT/Squib with no powers. Holyflare claimed squib with a hidden vote.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 29 2013 14:51 GMT

#4904

Read his filter, I confronted him about it. Got to go.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 29 2013 16:49 GMT

#4916

On October 30 2013 01:18 Holyflare wrote:

Show nested quote +

Highlighted for what I've said over and over again until you actually get it. Masons have powers becauae they can secretly communicate to another player. Other people were squibs with extra flavor attached too, i.e toad etc.

It says it will turn a person into A SQUIB and then says that this means the person will be a vanilla townie. There is no way way to argue your way out of this unless we get a host to confirm that this is an error.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 29 2013 16:52 GMT

#4919

On October 30 2013 01:51 Hopeless1der wrote:

Show nested quote +

I-Be-Pro as Gregory Goyle was sent to St. Mungos!
[spoiler]You are Gregory Goyle. Your parents sent you to Hogwarts to educate you into a proper wizard but it turns out you are a Squib. You and Crabbe are BFFs and therefore inseparable. If one of you dies, the other dies as well.
Do you think lovers are on par with a doublevote?

That's not a power and you can easily explain that by saying that is ET's power rather than Toad's.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 29 2013 16:56 GMT

#4921

If we lynch someone for being a liar based on a mod confirmation and that person flips town, then so be it. We can discuss the rationality and fairness of the host leaving such a mistake uncorrected.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 29 2013 17:00 GMT

#4924

All they have to do is state that state that the information provided is incorrect and a squib does not equal vanilla townie. If a host makes an error, the fair play is to correct said error even if that has implications on the alignment of a player. It is by far worse not to.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 29 2013 17:13 GMT

#4927

On October 30 2013 02:12 Holyflare wrote:

Show nested quote +

Thus essentially confirming a player as town........... You're kidding right?

Absolutely not, it confirms the player a squib with a power. Mafia could be a squib with power as well.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 29 2013 17:14 GMT

#4928

Also essentially confirming a player due to a host correcting an error has happened many, many times.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 29 2013 17:21 GMT

#4930

I'm done discussing this with you. Feel free to spend your time more productively, for instance by pleading to the host. You are right, there should be an apology if you flip town, but it should be from the hosts of the game to town collectively. I've made my issues known about your play previously and those things still largely stand.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 29 2013 17:29 GMT

#4931

Plus the way you are arguing about this essentially confirms you as mafia. I just said that hosts have corrected critical errors many times. You have no way of knowing whether what you are postulating about hosts not correcting errors is true. You already know that "the error" is not going to be corrected, because the only error here is yours.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 30 2013 06:01 GMT

#5011

On October 30 2013 10:23 justanothertownie wrote:
Hmm, syllo are you sure about this? I want to vote with my townreads but it really seems like the rolepm is the only strong point against holy at the moment. I don't know if I want to risk metagaming the hosts right now.
The "charm" explanation is at the very least possible somehow.
Apart from that Holy at least showed some investment in the game while BH, skanjabis, hopeless (and onegu to some extent) just don't give a fuck.
If you want my vote can you sum up your whole reasoning for a Holy lynch for me again?

Rayn really disappoints me btw. As soon as his lynch was off the table his announced great reread with scumreads was transformed into some underwhelming posting. Not that I did better but I didn't run around promising people to find scum. Maybe I will find a bit more time tomorrow.

It's not the only strong point against him. See e.g.

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=20022026
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=20022049

Whenever I read that day 1 post from him I keep concluding that there is no way a townie would make a post like that. Besides what I stated in those posts, look at what he is saying. He is suggesting that town is, 24 hours into day 1, lacking direction and he has to give it some. The direction he offers is 100% repackaged content and wants to lynch Palmar ridiculous reasons. Look at his "case" against Palmar - does it look like a lynch you should be "MOST comfortable with" and would that be the kind of direction town desperately needs. Nowhere does he even say that Palmar's play makes him mafia and in fact he suggests that Palmar playing more would help town.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 30 2013 06:09 GMT

#5013

That has come up already. No, it does not.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 30 2013 06:48 GMT

#5020

Can you stop the constant insults towards everyone? You have not been suspicious of a single flipped mafia and being mafia does not give you the license to insult other players.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 30 2013 06:48 GMT

#5021

In fact, if Koshi was modkilled for his post, I expect you to be modkilled as well.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 30 2013 06:57 GMT

#5023

I'm sorry, quoting my own posts is not repackaging and the context is not the same as all as you were claiming to be giving town direction it desperately needed when all you did it was repeat what had been said before and presented a policy or a lurker lynch as the road map to winning the game. Again, I'm not going to discuss this any further with you as I'm not trying to convince you of anything.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 30 2013 06:59 GMT

#5025

Yes we are lynching him after Holyflare flips. He didn't even bother answering my questions.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 30 2013 07:59 GMT

#5037

A VT with a power does not pass even a rudimentary "sour grapes" setup design test. The hosts have confirmed that squibs have no powers. They have been given an opportunity to issue a correction and have not done so. A one shot power is still a power and indeed we've had blues flip with one-shot powers (e.g palmar). You can not explain that away by saying "oh he is just a VT with a flavor based reason for this power not to be a power", especially due to what polyjuice's wording.

Holyflare not only has a role that would require hosts lying to us, but he has also lied to us about the role in a way that makes almost no sense to town. His attitude and approach for his defense is completely wrong. He never even once entertained the possibility of hosts issuing a correction, but immediately pushed the idea that they would never do that even though that is blatantly wrong. There's also the issue of town already having a flipped hidden voter. Having two town aligned hidden voters is by itself suspicious.

If we don't lynch him today we may actually lose because you people are going to keep refusing lynching him ever day and he is mafia.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 30 2013 08:08 GMT

#5041

I don't know, but rayn being mafia would require amazing play from both Koshi and Rayn. They have both seemed emotional and Koshi in particular seemed very invested in the game. Maybe they are worth a second look at some point, but I really don't think the game will ever reach a point where we can entertain lynching them over the alternatives.

syllogism

Finland5948 Posts

October 30 2013 08:19 GMT

#5049

To be specific, he said that he had an extra vote that he announces in the thread, not jus tthat he could make his vote count twice.