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Fuck it. I've reread strongandbig's filter and I think he's scum.
Name claiming
Lets start with the whole Clarity thing. I didn't like how it got blown up into a giant problem, but didn't really think much of it. However, rereading it seems somewhat scummy to nameclaim like that. Scum (at least some of them) have townie names, as evidenced by Yamato flipping Doran Martell. If, at the start of the game, you can gain some town credit by nameclaiming, this seems like a pretty good idea. If scum have some kind of KP that relies on nameclaiming, then it makes it a fucking excellent idea.
This was the reason I was a bit suspicious of johnnywup at the start of the game. Nameclaiming is simply not a townie thing to do when you have zero knowledge about the setup. He subsequently made a big stink about how Clarity sent the message on to Oatsmaster, and I found Oats' behaviour in the whole ordeal really fucking scummy, so forgot about SnB's nameclaim starting the whole thing off. But I want some answers:
SnB: why did you ignore all the risks of nameclaiming if you're town. Johnnywup, when I pressed him, claimed ignorance. You, however, are not a newbie and have played in at least 2 games I can think of where nameclaiming could get you killed (and in fact, in CT you had the very role to kill nameclaimers unless I am mistaking things). Additionally you claim it's a townie thing to do and should get you elected. You KNOW this is false. Why the lies?
Worthless reads as a lord
As a lord, we get this:
On August 10 2013 01:20 strongandbig wrote:
Hey guys
On phone today so I'll be less active in pms than I was for the past several days.
I want my house to pm me though and explain who they want me to vote for and why.
Currently I'm not liking clarity as a lynch target anymore. I also don't want to lynch oatsmaster. It looks like the sol case is winding down a bit but I will retread those parts before the lynch.
More later
Distancing himself from his own vote.
On August 10 2013 06:06 strongandbig wrote:
i also wouldn't mind lynching acro for playing in character.
Test balloon: lets see if we can get a decent town player lynched on a ridiculous pretext. If people wagon, then awesome, otherwise no harm no foul.
Then his vote ends up on Onegu:
On August 10 2013 06:13 strongandbig wrote:
Right now I think I want to lynch onegu the most. I thought the pressure on him at the start was for a bad reason, but he didn't really do anything at all in the way of scumhunting when the pressure was taken off of him.
So ##vote: onegu
This is one of the shoddiest votes I have ever seen, especially as the earlier posts were him actually defending Onegu:
On August 09 2013 00:24 strongandbig wrote:Show nested quote +On August 09 2013 00:06 raynpelikoneet wrote:
lol Oberyn, did you even read my post?
Onegu is giving yamato town credit from an action he considers to be anti-town.. not a huge problem, his logic makes sense. he's saying it's poor play for a townie to take that action, but it doesn't make sense for a scum member to take it so it's more likely coming from a bad townie than from scum.
So what made Onegu a worse lurker than jrkirby, FirmTofu, gumshoe, or really any of the other useless lurkers.
Nothing. Onegu was, in fact, a less useless lurker. But he needed to toss his vote without letting it be accountable at all.
Active when pressured
Then on D2 when he is no longer lord, and just as people are starting to think seriously of shooting him dead at night, he comes in to save his ass with the case on Risen.
His reason for not wanting to be lord is fucking phoney as hell: he wanted to reclaim his townie status, but did absolutely NOTHING towards that. Resulting in him basically disqualifying himself from the lord position, where he would not be able to lurk as much.
Most of this has already been discussed, so I'll leave it at this.
The Yamato connection
Yamato on SnB:
On August 10 2013 04:57 yamato77 wrote:Are we lynching this guy? We totally should.
On August 10 2013 05:51 yamato77 wrote:
Most of SNB's contribution to the game consists of making a big deal out of some rolename controversy within his own house on N0. Aside from complaining that Clarity unwittingly ruined some sort of plan (lolwhatever), there's almost nothing of substance in his filter aside from a townread on Dandel (like that means anything).
His activity also fits in with his scum meta-activity as evidenced by the same sort of lurky and somewhat disinterested play he exhibited in Sicilian. He's set himself up so that he is voting for who his house wants to vote for, conveniently absolving himself of any true scumhunting in-thread.
Neither of these seem like sincere efforts to push a lynch on SnB, and particularly the second one is complete nonsense: half a meta read because it IGNORES the fact that SnB's latest town games have been lurky sacks of uselessness as well. He was endgamed and ignored by scum in NWM, and modkilled for inactivity in PTP. Hardly a shining record to contrast with his lurky inactive scumgame. This read was easily discredited, but notice that SnB has no real interaction with yamato, despite SnB being yamato's main scumread. He just ignores it, because he knows yamato will never push the read.
What we do have, is this:
On August 10 2013 06:04 strongandbig wrote:Show nested quote +On August 10 2013 05:58 yamato77 wrote:On August 10 2013 05:55 Acrofales wrote:On August 10 2013 05:51 yamato77 wrote:
Most of SNB's contribution to the game consists of making a big deal out of some rolename controversy within his own house on N0. Aside from complaining that Clarity unwittingly ruined some sort of plan (lolwhatever), there's almost nothing of substance in his filter aside from a townread on Dandel (like that means anything).
His activity also fits in with his scum meta-activity as evidenced by the same sort of lurky and somewhat disinterested play he exhibited in Sicilian. He's set himself up so that he is voting for who his house wants to vote for, conveniently absolving himself of any true scumhunting in-thread. In a previous encounter, a jousting match at Castle PTP, he was largely unavailable and never contributed anything of value, yet was town. Not to say that I encourage that behaviour, but I'm not sure it's sufficient for murdering him. So how do you advise we treat the SnB situation, then, Acro? Let him lurk into LYLO? It's not like he's an incompetent town player. If he's town, he's good enough to show it. idiot i'm busier today than i was yesterday. that doesn't mean im lurking. i just coutned, i have sent 123 PMs this game. so fuck you saying i'm scum for inactivity. also you should know better than this. my activity is just as bad when i'm town as it is when i'm scum. if not worse. you are making up things to suit your agenda and i woudl be down to lynch or vig you.
2 minutes later comes the test balloon of lynching me for roleplaying, and another 5 minutes later his vote is on Onegu with NO explanation worth speaking of (except, he's lurking). What happened to this will to lynch Yamato? It vanished in thin air... in about 5 minutes flat.
On D2 you'd think he'd have something to say about the red check on Yamato when he was so happy to report he had caught up on the thread, but no. He spouted off some nothingness that said very little in very many words. Avoid the contaminated scumbuddy like the plague!
@all lords: please lynch.
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So me, Onegu, Clarity and s0Lstice have agreed to kill 1) Kush 2) johnnywup. Sharrant disagreed heavily with this (waiting for explanations) and Risen hasn't commented on them. Kush should die with just us four hopefully, but it'd be nice to hear Sharrant's and Risen's stances on a kill list.
1-5 EDT Xatalos
5-9 EDT
9-13 EDT
13-17 EDT
17-21 EDT
21-1 EDT
Pick your times...
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Im ok with 5-9 or 21 - 1. 21-1 is most likely better.
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Sharrant is the dumbest person on the planet. Like the dumbest.
The fact that nobody in the thread said this before me, proves that I will be lynched pretty soon or when it is needed for scum.
gg I tried. I can't be arsed after reading that piece of garbage. Like seriously. Everything is wrong. Every assumption he makes is wrong. Hilarious.
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1-5 EDT Xatalos
5-9 EDT Clarity?
9-13 EDT Clarity?
13-17 EDT Clarity?
17-21 EDT
21-1 EDT Onegu
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If Vivax flips scum you're dead Acro
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1-5 EDT Xatalos
5-9 EDT
9-13 EDT s0Lstice
13-17 EDT
17-21 EDT
21-1 EDT Onegu
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Less discussing slots, more voting for SnB...
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ninjad
1-5 EDT Xatalos
5-9 EDT Clarity?
9-13 EDT s0lstice
13-17 EDT Clarity?
17-21 EDT
21-1 EDT Onegu
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Decide Clarity 
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On August 16 2013 04:52 s0Lstice wrote:
If Vivax flips scum you're dead Acro
Will be reading Vivax after Koshi. Explain yourself.
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Clarity?
I'll take either one is my point. So whoever wants one of those two just take it put me in the other.
Acro's case is reasonable, I'm fine with keeping my vote on snb, it is the wagon of justice after all.
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On August 16 2013 04:54 Acrofales wrote:Will be reading Vivax after Koshi. Explain yourself.
I think he refers to you trying to derail the Vivax Wagon. Please do comment on Vivax as well.
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On August 16 2013 04:40 s0Lstice wrote:Chrom, I was trying to think back on what I remember about Risen. Have a look at this filter: clickIt's from SSB-64. He moves around a lot and changes his opinions at a breakneck speed. It can often look like he has no conviction behind his original thought because he so quickly moves on to something else. The context was the same for the s&b vote this game. He settled on the s&b vote, and then quickly moved on to the dialogue with him and not wanting to vote him. Kinda makes sense with the way s&b was here and defending himself with vigor while simultaneously pushing his favored lynch. I originally thought you had a good point with the s&b thing, but in light of this, I don't think it's really alignment indicative.
That's a good point. I was noticing how much Risen was moving his vote around to thread sentiment this game, so that might not be alignment-indicative. There is this post, though:
On August 15 2013 05:24 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On August 15 2013 05:21 Xatalos wrote:On August 15 2013 05:18 Risen wrote:On August 15 2013 05:13 Xatalos wrote:On August 15 2013 05:12 strongandbig wrote:On August 15 2013 05:09 Xatalos wrote:On August 15 2013 05:00 raynpelikoneet wrote:On August 15 2013 04:54 Xatalos wrote:On August 15 2013 04:52 raynpelikoneet wrote:On August 15 2013 04:45 Xatalos wrote:
[quote]
I think it's pretty null to make such a stupid mistake. How would scum benefit from doing that on purpose? It looked more like he was overjoyed about finding a scumslip and went with it, not like he tried to justify a scumread on me or anything like that. It was so sudden and weird. Could still be scum motivated, just seemed more like null or even townish to do that.
I think you're just not reading the thread. My suspicions for Risen had already started before I noticed his inconsistent thought process. Then he posted that he had only suspected DI because of his connection to me. That's just 100% false.
1) It was the other way around, a big part of his case of his case on me was based on my connection to DI.
2) Even if it wasn't the other way around, it wasn't possibly ONLY because of DI's connection to me. There were many other reasons but nothing about a connection.
It made me think his original case was all made up, since he couldn't even grasp the logic of his own case HIMSELF. What town would decide their reads, then justify them with bad logic, then not even understand the logic behind their reads? That's right, only scum would do that. (After witnessing Risen's total failure in thinking on several occasions, I've had to admit that maybe he's just incapable of logic altogether.)
[quote]
I still suspected Acro somewhat when I was arguing with him, and I still do have some very slight suspicion. But iamperfection's strong belief in Acro being town and the townish feeling of the argument between us made me stop pursuing him as potential scum. If he's still alive at LYLO, there would be reason to revisit him.
I think you misread his post. He had several points for Sharrant being town or for being scum. He said something like "Sharrant isn't playing his town meta, but he's been AFK so that might explain it. Overall leaning town". Just reread it with an objective mind.
The rolename thing = the "forced aggression". At least I think so, you should go ask him. I can't know what he's thinking. I was just trying to say that he's not necessarily scum and he's not a good lynch for today. Maybe for later, but not at the moment. I'm not going to restart the argument about the rolenames, it already buried countless pages for no gain. And it wasn't the only thing I mentioned, I also mentioned that you had apparently wasted iamperfection's time with pointless questions and had tons of useless filler one-liner posts. where have i wasted iamps time with pointless questions? your other answers fall into the category: You are calling me scum for things you don't even know what they mean. Do you see how retarded that is? From iamperfection's last will: "Asked some pointless questions to me wasting time and therefore posting without a point would still guess he is town though." I'm not even calling you scum. Just that you're scum much more likely than in NWM and more likely than Acro. So do you know what these pointless questions are? Because i sure do not. Why are you bringing them up if you don't? To me it seems like you are trying to throw shit on someone who a now confirmed town was suspicious about. And to strengthen your D2 read, which was full of shit. Why did you say i "was focusing on wrong things"? You have never explained that. I guess he means Lord PM's. Impossible to prove that though. I won't make the mistake of "confirming" someone and let them do whatever they want. I did that with Ace and Koshi in NWM, for example, and it was ugly. If there's reason for doubt, I will point it out. Have you considered that "wrong things" might mean things such as the rolename spam, pointless one-liners and whatever iamperfection meant? I find it pretty damning that all of snb's contributions come under pressure. His play is completely reactive and passive. It's time to increase the pressure. ##Vote strongandbig seriously? what do you want from me? should i ignore the fact that people are calling for me to be killed? You could start scumhunting instead of finding reasons for why you could be town. Though to be fair this is an actual point that might make sense if you hadn't just posted a case. He only repeated his earlier weak case and said Vivax was scum for no reason. Why are you soft defending him while voting for him? Wait what? My vote is on SnB. Show nested quote +On August 15 2013 05:21 strongandbig wrote:On August 15 2013 05:13 Xatalos wrote:On August 15 2013 05:12 strongandbig wrote:On August 15 2013 05:09 Xatalos wrote:On August 15 2013 05:00 raynpelikoneet wrote:On August 15 2013 04:54 Xatalos wrote:On August 15 2013 04:52 raynpelikoneet wrote:On August 15 2013 04:45 Xatalos wrote:On August 15 2013 03:42 Vivax wrote:
Look, Xatalos. My question regarding your (suddenly not any more?) scumread, of which you fail to understand why he would attack you like that (although he's your scumread you don't see scummy intentions?).
Can you answer this or will you post some more insults, lols and rofls, great lord of house shitvotes?
[quote]
I think it's pretty null to make such a stupid mistake. How would scum benefit from doing that on purpose? It looked more like he was overjoyed about finding a scumslip and went with it, not like he tried to justify a scumread on me or anything like that. It was so sudden and weird. Could still be scum motivated, just seemed more like null or even townish to do that. I think you're just not reading the thread. My suspicions for Risen had already started before I noticed his inconsistent thought process. Then he posted that he had only suspected DI because of his connection to me. That's just 100% false. 1) It was the other way around, a big part of his case of his case on me was based on my connection to DI. 2) Even if it wasn't the other way around, it wasn't possibly ONLY because of DI's connection to me. There were many other reasons but nothing about a connection. It made me think his original case was all made up, since he couldn't even grasp the logic of his own case HIMSELF. What town would decide their reads, then justify them with bad logic, then not even understand the logic behind their reads? That's right, only scum would do that. (After witnessing Risen's total failure in thinking on several occasions, I've had to admit that maybe he's just incapable of logic altogether.) On August 15 2013 02:45 raynpelikoneet wrote:
[quote]
- Your posts before Acro's case imply that he is your scumread. Tell me when did you drop your suspicion on him.
- Explain this: "He didn't say "Sharrant isn't playing his town meta and thus is town", he said several points and counter-points and concluded town... " because that's exactly what Mocsta said. If not, why did you not say this in the first place?
- About the rolename thing (is this all you are going to bring up - i thought you had more things as you implied so). I talked about it with Solstice, i do not agree with him, and i think it's not alignment indicative. I am not calling johnny scum because of it, I AM SAYING HE IS NOT TOWN BECAUSE OF IT!!!! wtf?
- You didn't explain the "forced aggression", where is it? Gimme quotes?
You are calling me scum for things you don't even know what they mean. Do you see how retarded that is? I still suspected Acro somewhat when I was arguing with him, and I still do have some very slight suspicion. But iamperfection's strong belief in Acro being town and the townish feeling of the argument between us made me stop pursuing him as potential scum. If he's still alive at LYLO, there would be reason to revisit him. I think you misread his post. He had several points for Sharrant being town or for being scum. He said something like "Sharrant isn't playing his town meta, but he's been AFK so that might explain it. Overall leaning town". Just reread it with an objective mind. The rolename thing = the "forced aggression". At least I think so, you should go ask him. I can't know what he's thinking. I was just trying to say that he's not necessarily scum and he's not a good lynch for today. Maybe for later, but not at the moment. I'm not going to restart the argument about the rolenames, it already buried countless pages for no gain. And it wasn't the only thing I mentioned, I also mentioned that you had apparently wasted iamperfection's time with pointless questions and had tons of useless filler one-liner posts. where have i wasted iamps time with pointless questions? your other answers fall into the category: You are calling me scum for things you don't even know what they mean. Do you see how retarded that is? From iamperfection's last will: "Asked some pointless questions to me wasting time and therefore posting without a point would still guess he is town though." I'm not even calling you scum. Just that you're scum much more likely than in NWM and more likely than Acro. So do you know what these pointless questions are? Because i sure do not. Why are you bringing them up if you don't? To me it seems like you are trying to throw shit on someone who a now confirmed town was suspicious about. And to strengthen your D2 read, which was full of shit. Why did you say i "was focusing on wrong things"? You have never explained that. I guess he means Lord PM's. Impossible to prove that though. I won't make the mistake of "confirming" someone and let them do whatever they want. I did that with Ace and Koshi in NWM, for example, and it was ugly. If there's reason for doubt, I will point it out. Have you considered that "wrong things" might mean things such as the rolename spam, pointless one-liners and whatever iamperfection meant? I find it pretty damning that all of snb's contributions come under pressure. His play is completely reactive and passive. It's time to increase the pressure. ##Vote strongandbig seriously? what do you want from me? should i ignore the fact that people are calling for me to be killed? You could start scumhunting instead of finding reasons for why you could be town. (1) I already have a scumread that I want people to lynch. no one is engaging my case. I'm not sure how you think I could be more effective just saying the same things about Risen that I've already said. (2) how can i start scumhunting if people are assuming i'm scum, they're not going to listen to anything i say or else will say "i'm just attacking someone else to defend myself." (3) everyone so far has been ignoring everything i've said about risen and just used it as reasons to find me scummy (4) i honestly believe that it is more important as a townie not to get lynched than it is to find scum. I have consistently said this both in and out of games for the past year. I am not going to ignore the fact that I am the number one lynch candidate and that people are voting me for bad reasons, if I can show them why their reasons are bad and persuade them not to vote me then that is way more important to me than persuading them to vote for someone else. So tell me. What do you think about the "reasons why I could be town." Care to tell me why you think I'm scum despite the reasons given being all either based on activity or untrue? Why you suddenly decide that I'm the number one person who should be killed? oh also HOW ARE MY ATTACKS ON RISEN OR VIVAX REACTIVE OR PASSIVE? YOU ARE MAKING SHIT UP!!!!! I hate people ignoring my case so please link me to or write out exactly what you want answered and I will do so.
This is pretty soon after he votes SnB. He makes it clear that he thinks SnB is scum at the beginning, but then cares about SnB's opinion in the second half. It doesn't have the same caring tone that the other post had, but he clearly cared about SnB's opinion while he had a strong scumread on him.
It's not as strong, true, but then there's still the other stuff.
On August 16 2013 04:41 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2013 04:37 Chromatically wrote:On August 16 2013 04:23 Xatalos wrote:On August 16 2013 04:21 Chromatically wrote:On August 16 2013 04:19 Xatalos wrote:On August 16 2013 04:13 Chromatically wrote:
What townie reads this and thinks this is a scumslip? NO ONE. Maybe in a newbie game this is okay, but there is no way anyone who knows how to play this game (as Risen clearly does) would think this is a scumslip.
Sadly this is where I'm stuck at with him................. Exactly. We're talking about someone who said this: On August 15 2013 11:47 Risen wrote:On August 15 2013 11:33 Chromatically wrote:On August 15 2013 11:06 Risen wrote:
And Chrom your version falls apart when you realize Sharrant gave Acro the option of Yamato and kush. He wasn't hoping for anything. Nice try? It doesn't matter? You're saying that scum Sharrant asked for advice on who to check from town Acro when he was always going to check kush? How does that make SO MUCH more sense than what you posted, so that Sharrant is almost confirmed scum? On August 15 2013 11:16 Risen wrote:On August 15 2013 11:13 s0Lstice wrote:
yea nope
you were concerned with his read on you, not your read on him.
two veeeery different things They're the same thing. You're reading too much into this and obs is laughing at you. Are you seriously threatening people with the OBS QT??? Really? And Sol is exactly right about this. If you believed SnB to be scum, you wouldn't give two shits what his "read" was on you, because it was manufactured anyway. The fact that you cared about his read on you means that you thought he was town, while your vote was on him. Scum reads do not equal confirmed scum. You don't seem to agree with this, and I'm going to say you're a bad player because of it. Until you realize the two are different, you'll always be bad. End of story. and yet doesn't know the basics of what makes someone scum? I cannot believe that. Unless you mean you think he's town for it? I mean it's hard for me to determine if he's the worst townie I've ever seen or a chaotic scum. Look at what his read on Vivax was originally based off of: "He's giving townreads too easily and was noncommittal about the lynch." Which is a good heuristic for finding scum. That shows that Risen does know how to play this game. I cannot believe that someone who has at least a basic knowledge of scumhunting can do something like the Xatalos "scumslip" thing. The same can be said for most of his doings so far (his fail Sharrant case, fail first casepost etc.). Occasionally he lectures people on how to play yet continues to play terribly. It looks like he knows how to play in theory but never applies it to his own play. I agree, it sounds scummy. Intentional? On the other hand, I do remember him playing terribly in the previous GOT themed Mafia as town. It was a long time ago though. We're back to the main question: too stupid to be scum or not?
I'm at the other end: too stupid to be town. There's no thought process that results in his thinking what you said is a scumslip. The only explanation is that he's trying to fake finding one.
Look at how he backs off of the scumslip. He never realizes, "oh, there's nothing alignment indicative in there at all, I guess that's not a scumslip". He realizes that he misread the original post. That way, he can back off of the "slip" without actually having to explain his thought process (because it doesn't exist).
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Ok then, Risen and Sharrant choose your picks. After commenting on the kill list of course.
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On August 16 2013 04:55 Xatalos wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2013 04:54 Acrofales wrote:On August 16 2013 04:52 s0Lstice wrote:
If Vivax flips scum you're dead Acro Will be reading Vivax after Koshi. Explain yourself. I think he refers to you trying to derail the Vivax Wagon. Please do comment on Vivax as well.
yea exactly this Acro
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On August 16 2013 04:56 Chromatically wrote:Show nested quote +On August 16 2013 04:40 s0Lstice wrote:Chrom, I was trying to think back on what I remember about Risen. Have a look at this filter: clickIt's from SSB-64. He moves around a lot and changes his opinions at a breakneck speed. It can often look like he has no conviction behind his original thought because he so quickly moves on to something else. The context was the same for the s&b vote this game. He settled on the s&b vote, and then quickly moved on to the dialogue with him and not wanting to vote him. Kinda makes sense with the way s&b was here and defending himself with vigor while simultaneously pushing his favored lynch. I originally thought you had a good point with the s&b thing, but in light of this, I don't think it's really alignment indicative. That's a good point. I was noticing how much Risen was moving his vote around to thread sentiment this game, so that might not be alignment-indicative. There is this post, though: Show nested quote +On August 15 2013 05:24 Risen wrote:On August 15 2013 05:21 Xatalos wrote:On August 15 2013 05:18 Risen wrote:On August 15 2013 05:13 Xatalos wrote:On August 15 2013 05:12 strongandbig wrote:On August 15 2013 05:09 Xatalos wrote:On August 15 2013 05:00 raynpelikoneet wrote:On August 15 2013 04:54 Xatalos wrote:On August 15 2013 04:52 raynpelikoneet wrote:
[quote]
where have i wasted iamps time with pointless questions?
your other answers fall into the category:
[quote] From iamperfection's last will: "Asked some pointless questions to me wasting time and therefore posting without a point would still guess he is town though." I'm not even calling you scum. Just that you're scum much more likely than in NWM and more likely than Acro. So do you know what these pointless questions are? Because i sure do not. Why are you bringing them up if you don't? To me it seems like you are trying to throw shit on someone who a now confirmed town was suspicious about. And to strengthen your D2 read, which was full of shit. Why did you say i "was focusing on wrong things"? You have never explained that. I guess he means Lord PM's. Impossible to prove that though. I won't make the mistake of "confirming" someone and let them do whatever they want. I did that with Ace and Koshi in NWM, for example, and it was ugly. If there's reason for doubt, I will point it out. Have you considered that "wrong things" might mean things such as the rolename spam, pointless one-liners and whatever iamperfection meant? I find it pretty damning that all of snb's contributions come under pressure. His play is completely reactive and passive. It's time to increase the pressure. ##Vote strongandbig seriously? what do you want from me? should i ignore the fact that people are calling for me to be killed? You could start scumhunting instead of finding reasons for why you could be town. Though to be fair this is an actual point that might make sense if you hadn't just posted a case. He only repeated his earlier weak case and said Vivax was scum for no reason. Why are you soft defending him while voting for him? Wait what? My vote is on SnB. On August 15 2013 05:21 strongandbig wrote:On August 15 2013 05:13 Xatalos wrote:On August 15 2013 05:12 strongandbig wrote:On August 15 2013 05:09 Xatalos wrote:On August 15 2013 05:00 raynpelikoneet wrote:On August 15 2013 04:54 Xatalos wrote:On August 15 2013 04:52 raynpelikoneet wrote:On August 15 2013 04:45 Xatalos wrote:
[quote]
I think it's pretty null to make such a stupid mistake. How would scum benefit from doing that on purpose? It looked more like he was overjoyed about finding a scumslip and went with it, not like he tried to justify a scumread on me or anything like that. It was so sudden and weird. Could still be scum motivated, just seemed more like null or even townish to do that.
I think you're just not reading the thread. My suspicions for Risen had already started before I noticed his inconsistent thought process. Then he posted that he had only suspected DI because of his connection to me. That's just 100% false.
1) It was the other way around, a big part of his case of his case on me was based on my connection to DI.
2) Even if it wasn't the other way around, it wasn't possibly ONLY because of DI's connection to me. There were many other reasons but nothing about a connection.
It made me think his original case was all made up, since he couldn't even grasp the logic of his own case HIMSELF. What town would decide their reads, then justify them with bad logic, then not even understand the logic behind their reads? That's right, only scum would do that. (After witnessing Risen's total failure in thinking on several occasions, I've had to admit that maybe he's just incapable of logic altogether.)
[quote]
I still suspected Acro somewhat when I was arguing with him, and I still do have some very slight suspicion. But iamperfection's strong belief in Acro being town and the townish feeling of the argument between us made me stop pursuing him as potential scum. If he's still alive at LYLO, there would be reason to revisit him.
I think you misread his post. He had several points for Sharrant being town or for being scum. He said something like "Sharrant isn't playing his town meta, but he's been AFK so that might explain it. Overall leaning town". Just reread it with an objective mind.
The rolename thing = the "forced aggression". At least I think so, you should go ask him. I can't know what he's thinking. I was just trying to say that he's not necessarily scum and he's not a good lynch for today. Maybe for later, but not at the moment. I'm not going to restart the argument about the rolenames, it already buried countless pages for no gain. And it wasn't the only thing I mentioned, I also mentioned that you had apparently wasted iamperfection's time with pointless questions and had tons of useless filler one-liner posts. where have i wasted iamps time with pointless questions? your other answers fall into the category: You are calling me scum for things you don't even know what they mean. Do you see how retarded that is? From iamperfection's last will: "Asked some pointless questions to me wasting time and therefore posting without a point would still guess he is town though." I'm not even calling you scum. Just that you're scum much more likely than in NWM and more likely than Acro. So do you know what these pointless questions are? Because i sure do not. Why are you bringing them up if you don't? To me it seems like you are trying to throw shit on someone who a now confirmed town was suspicious about. And to strengthen your D2 read, which was full of shit. Why did you say i "was focusing on wrong things"? You have never explained that. I guess he means Lord PM's. Impossible to prove that though. I won't make the mistake of "confirming" someone and let them do whatever they want. I did that with Ace and Koshi in NWM, for example, and it was ugly. If there's reason for doubt, I will point it out. Have you considered that "wrong things" might mean things such as the rolename spam, pointless one-liners and whatever iamperfection meant? I find it pretty damning that all of snb's contributions come under pressure. His play is completely reactive and passive. It's time to increase the pressure. ##Vote strongandbig seriously? what do you want from me? should i ignore the fact that people are calling for me to be killed? You could start scumhunting instead of finding reasons for why you could be town. (1) I already have a scumread that I want people to lynch. no one is engaging my case. I'm not sure how you think I could be more effective just saying the same things about Risen that I've already said. (2) how can i start scumhunting if people are assuming i'm scum, they're not going to listen to anything i say or else will say "i'm just attacking someone else to defend myself." (3) everyone so far has been ignoring everything i've said about risen and just used it as reasons to find me scummy (4) i honestly believe that it is more important as a townie not to get lynched than it is to find scum. I have consistently said this both in and out of games for the past year. I am not going to ignore the fact that I am the number one lynch candidate and that people are voting me for bad reasons, if I can show them why their reasons are bad and persuade them not to vote me then that is way more important to me than persuading them to vote for someone else. So tell me. What do you think about the "reasons why I could be town." Care to tell me why you think I'm scum despite the reasons given being all either based on activity or untrue? Why you suddenly decide that I'm the number one person who should be killed? oh also HOW ARE MY ATTACKS ON RISEN OR VIVAX REACTIVE OR PASSIVE? YOU ARE MAKING SHIT UP!!!!! I hate people ignoring my case so please link me to or write out exactly what you want answered and I will do so. This is pretty soon after he votes SnB. He makes it clear that he thinks SnB is scum at the beginning, but then cares about SnB's opinion in the second half. It doesn't have the same caring tone that the other post had, but he clearly cared about SnB's opinion while he had a strong scumread on him. It's not as strong, true, but then there's still the other stuff. Show nested quote +On August 16 2013 04:41 Xatalos wrote:On August 16 2013 04:37 Chromatically wrote:On August 16 2013 04:23 Xatalos wrote:On August 16 2013 04:21 Chromatically wrote:On August 16 2013 04:19 Xatalos wrote:On August 16 2013 04:13 Chromatically wrote:
What townie reads this and thinks this is a scumslip? NO ONE. Maybe in a newbie game this is okay, but there is no way anyone who knows how to play this game (as Risen clearly does) would think this is a scumslip.
Sadly this is where I'm stuck at with him................. Exactly. We're talking about someone who said this: On August 15 2013 11:47 Risen wrote:On August 15 2013 11:33 Chromatically wrote:On August 15 2013 11:06 Risen wrote:
And Chrom your version falls apart when you realize Sharrant gave Acro the option of Yamato and kush. He wasn't hoping for anything. Nice try? It doesn't matter? You're saying that scum Sharrant asked for advice on who to check from town Acro when he was always going to check kush? How does that make SO MUCH more sense than what you posted, so that Sharrant is almost confirmed scum? On August 15 2013 11:16 Risen wrote:On August 15 2013 11:13 s0Lstice wrote:
yea nope
you were concerned with his read on you, not your read on him.
two veeeery different things They're the same thing. You're reading too much into this and obs is laughing at you. Are you seriously threatening people with the OBS QT??? Really? And Sol is exactly right about this. If you believed SnB to be scum, you wouldn't give two shits what his "read" was on you, because it was manufactured anyway. The fact that you cared about his read on you means that you thought he was town, while your vote was on him. Scum reads do not equal confirmed scum. You don't seem to agree with this, and I'm going to say you're a bad player because of it. Until you realize the two are different, you'll always be bad. End of story. and yet doesn't know the basics of what makes someone scum? I cannot believe that. Unless you mean you think he's town for it? I mean it's hard for me to determine if he's the worst townie I've ever seen or a chaotic scum. Look at what his read on Vivax was originally based off of: "He's giving townreads too easily and was noncommittal about the lynch." Which is a good heuristic for finding scum. That shows that Risen does know how to play this game. I cannot believe that someone who has at least a basic knowledge of scumhunting can do something like the Xatalos "scumslip" thing. The same can be said for most of his doings so far (his fail Sharrant case, fail first casepost etc.). Occasionally he lectures people on how to play yet continues to play terribly. It looks like he knows how to play in theory but never applies it to his own play. I agree, it sounds scummy. Intentional? On the other hand, I do remember him playing terribly in the previous GOT themed Mafia as town. It was a long time ago though. We're back to the main question: too stupid to be scum or not? I'm at the other end: too stupid to be town. There's no thought process that results in his thinking what you said is a scumslip. The only explanation is that he's trying to fake finding one. Look at how he backs off of the scumslip. He never realizes, "oh, there's nothing alignment indicative in there at all, I guess that's not a scumslip". He realizes that he misread the original post. That way, he can back off of the "slip" without actually having to explain his thought process (because it doesn't exist).
Hmm. In any case I want to see Vivax hanged more than ever right now. I'm somewhat 50/50 on Risen, but he can be dealt with after Vivax IMO.
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I'll take the 13-17 slot actually
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1-5 EDT Xatalos
5-9 EDT FREE
9-13 EDT s0lstice
13-17 EDT Clarity
17-21 EDT FREE
21-1 EDT Onegu
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EPT
