EPTI Swear This Is Normal Mini Mafia 2 - Page 17
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Rainbows
Germany1217 Posts
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Dandel Ion
Austria17960 Posts
On July 25 2013 06:30 Rainbows wrote: And yes im scum EZ | ||
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Rainbows
Germany1217 Posts
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Dandel Ion
Austria17960 Posts
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Rainbows
Germany1217 Posts
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Lazermonkey
Sweden2176 Posts
On July 25 2013 05:44 raynpelikoneet wrote: That and that the fact that he is was actively ignoring any form of scum hunting.So your only reason for Stuytters being more scummy than Sylencia is because Sylencia is more of a lynchbait than Stutters? | ||
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Lazermonkey
Sweden2176 Posts
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
When i asked for your scumreads why did you feel the need to say "i don't think i want to lynch Stutters"? Lazer: I already asked this, but. How is Stutters ignoring any form of scumhunting but Sylencia is not? | ||
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Lazermonkey
Sweden2176 Posts
Koshi, if Rayn and Malango really are scum, why don't you try to convince us that they are? | ||
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FirmTofu
United States1956 Posts
I'm going to explain exactly why I didn't like ShiaoPi's VT claim. You can decide whether my reasoning is scummy but don't give me this bullshit "Kenpachi rule" to justify your suspicions. Why Claiming VT As Town Is Bad Alright, so we are assuming the claimer is town. Great. Why is this bad play? Let me explain. There are two situations possible if you are town. You are either: 1) Blue claiming VT 2) VT claiming VT 1-> I think we can all agree that blue claiming VT is a terrible idea. It introduces unnecessary confusion in the town and serves no purpose. 2-> This is a little more debatable. Let's assume for a second that claiming VT as VT is a good play. If it was good, then everyone should agree that all VTs should claim VT, right? Okay, let's play out what happens when all VT's claim VT. Assuming some sort of balance with 6VT, 3Blue, 3Scum... we will have 6 VT claiming VT. However, this forces scum into a decision point. Do they claim VT or remain unclaimed? If they choose to remain unclaimed, they would be associating themselves with the 3 blues. If they claim VT, they would be associating themselves with the VTs. Town would be subject to a mass roleclaim and it would be impossible to discern alignments because scum could have just as easily fakeclaimed into either grouping. Town learns absolutely nothing and scum would easily be able to pick out the blues one by one while hiding in a sea of VTs barring fake roleclaims from town. If you agree with this scenario, you must agree that claiming VT as VT is not good town play. | ||
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Stutters695
2610 Posts
On July 25 2013 03:53 Lazermonkey wrote: And Malago's play is scum indicative because...? I agree his early play was WIERD. But why the actual fuck would he do stuff like that if he would be scum? It would be even wierder. And bolded part: how do you know this was not the case? This is the only time you've ever scum hunted despite having several posts where you discuss policy/setup/defending random dudes/fluff. I'm not impressed at all. I'm assuming this is what you say I'm ignoring. The bolded part: If true then he lied about sending a PM to kill someone then sending another to cancel it. This isn't likely at all from either perspective as it creates a lie that is easily verifiable and would cause his lynch/mislynch over nothing. Thus I assume he actually did send the PM. Why would he send that PM as either alignment? Town: He's taking a shot on the 3/11 probability of hitting scum. Unlikely without some other plan. It certainly wasn't to pressure a lurker since the game had been only going for a couple hours. Scum: He thinks it's a good idea to take the free KP before town uses it. Sends in the PM and tells his scum buddies. They flip their shit since their KP probably drops to 1 at 2 scum and we'd lynch him for a clearly retarded shot and they would actually lose KP so he reneged on his shot. I don't see any town explanation that comes even close to the scum one so I think he's scum unless he has a damn good reason for it | ||
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raynpelikoneet
Finland43270 Posts
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Lazermonkey
Sweden2176 Posts
On July 25 2013 06:44 raynpelikoneet wrote:SNIP I was about to write some stuff but realized my argument was really bad. You are correct in that they are both ignoring scum hunting. Still, I would be more comfortable with killing Stutters.Lazer: I already asked this, but. How is Stutters ignoring any form of scumhunting but Sylencia is not? | ||
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FirmTofu
United States1956 Posts
On July 25 2013 06:48 raynpelikoneet wrote: FT why di you not say this in the first place? Why would I need to say it? I thought it was common knowledge that claiming VT is a terrible idea. In bluelightz, everyone agreed that TG claiming VT was scummy. It should be considered scummy here as well. | ||
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Artanis[Xp]
Netherlands12970 Posts
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Lazermonkey
Sweden2176 Posts
On July 25 2013 06:47 Stutters695 wrote: Yhea, I can come up with a 2 really good reasons.I'm assuming this is what you say I'm ignoring. The bolded part: If true then he lied about sending a PM to kill someone then sending another to cancel it. This isn't likely at all from either perspective as it creates a lie that is easily verifiable and would cause his lynch/mislynch over nothing. Thus I assume he actually did send the PM. Why would he send that PM as either alignment? Town: He's taking a shot on the 3/11 probability of hitting scum. Unlikely without some other plan. It certainly wasn't to pressure a lurker since the game had been only going for a couple hours. Scum: He thinks it's a good idea to take the free KP before town uses it. Sends in the PM and tells his scum buddies. They flip their shit since their KP probably drops to 1 at 2 scum and we'd lynch him for a clearly retarded shot and they would actually lose KP so he reneged on his shot. I don't see any town explanation that comes even close to the scum one so I think he's scum unless he has a damn good reason for it 1. It forces Rayn in a wierd spot. If he was to be scum he might panic and actually belive he will get shot. In that case he might stop posting completely (something rayn did not do) to avoid giving unnecesary information to town. 2. It creates discussion at a point where too much effort was spent on pointless policy discussions. Also, regarding the PM thing. Sure it would create a lie that we could verify but why the fuck should we lynch him for that? He could at any time claim that he lied and there would be no big deal about it. Also, you say that from an optimal pov town shouldn't do this, and even if assume that that IS the optimal play, there is nothing that would guarantee that he would do that. Town are, in my experience, much more inclined to do random "dumb" stuff like this without thinking it through 100% because they aren't so afraid of getting lynched as scum are. | ||
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Lazermonkey
Sweden2176 Posts
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Koshi
Belgium38799 Posts
On July 25 2013 06:45 Lazermonkey wrote: Ow, and Koshi's play is really random. Could very well be scum also. All his reads are bonkers (though I don't put too much weigh in that) but he doesn't actually spend any time at all pushing them. Both his scum reads, rayn and Malango, he just dropped a quick post saying why he thought they were scum and then nothing. But it's not like he is afk or anything. We still had a chat in our QT for some time. Koshi, if Rayn and Malango really are scum, why don't you try to convince us that they are? Shooting an unknown is pretty strange for town to do. Canceling your shot because you found out you shot Rayn is strange as well. Who did Malongo think he was shooting? Would Malongo have not canceled if it was somebody else? Malongo should explain his action when he comes back. For a brief second I thought Rayn and Malongo were both scum. I looked into rayn and made a "case". It was terrible and that's that. | ||
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FirmTofu
United States1956 Posts
On July 25 2013 07:01 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Tofu, do you think claiming VT makes Shiao more likely to be scum? No. If I had to guess his role, it would be VT. He's just stupid to accuse me based on how I responded. | ||
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FirmTofu
United States1956 Posts
On July 25 2013 07:10 Lazermonkey wrote: Tofu you are correct in that claiming VT is bad. But he didn't really CLAIM VT. And that type of theory crafting is only really relevant when you know what roles there are in the and how many of them there are. Everyone in this game could be VT except for scum. We don't know because the setup is closed. On July 24 2013 13:33 ShiaoPi wrote: sup guys. I'm a vt phoneposting btw On July 24 2013 19:44 ShiaoPi wrote: So I am back home. Reasons for claiming vt: First off it's true lol, more importantly however I wanted to get some juicy reactions and I got some noteworthy already. the thing is the claim itself is entirely not indicative of alignment and in my opinion town should just take a note on it and move on. Sure you can't prove anything at this stage, but does it matter? You should be scumhunting not harping around a non-alignment indicative behavior. So let me summarize some reactions to it. Z-boson is doing the right thing, just noting it and moving on as seen here: + Show Spoiler + On July 24 2013 15:21 Z-BosoN wrote: Its a pointless claim no matter what alignment he is. However, I dislike the fact that he just waltzed into the thread with that pointless post and has not posted anything since... FirmTofu and rayn however strike me as incredibly scummy right now. Lazer already pointed out the thing that stands out about FirmTofu's behavior, so no need for me to elaborate on him. On Rayn however: Do you see the blatant contradiction? His first reaction is just a wtf, which is okayish to me, but a bit on the scummy side. Then he says that it is "pointless" and either "stupid or scum". Saying that there is no reason for me to do it: + Show Spoiler + On July 24 2013 15:24 raynpelikoneet wrote: That's my point. There is no reason he should do that as town whether or not he actually is a vt. As Z boson points out however that it is simply not alignment indicative rayn goes to this position: + Show Spoiler + On July 24 2013 16:29 raynpelikoneet wrote: That's the only thing ShiaoPi has posted, how could anything else be an issue with him? I know the claim is not alignment indicative in itself, but ShiaoPi's reasons sure are. There is a reason he said what he did, and i want to know what his reasons were. Sylencia asks people about if mason-partners should reveal their identity to each other. However he himself seems to have no stance on that. That's what caught my attention. Sylencia: Do you think mason partners should reveal their identity to each other? Why/why not? So let me summarize: -WTF --> Stupid or Scum --> He has a plan!!!! I don't apprehend how you can go through these stages based on logic. It is much more likely he tried to paint me in a bad manner, then saw that it did not quite work out and reverted course. I mean in the beginning he does not even entertain the notion of my claim being part of a plan, he just says stupid/scum. Anyway since he apparently got killed already not much more to say about him. ##Vote: FirmTofu See bold. It's relevant. Are you seriously telling me that ShiaoPi is lying? Are you saying SP lying is more likely than not lying? Why the fuck do you think I'm the best lynch target if you think SP is lying? LM is one scummy SOB. | ||
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