[N] Sicilian Mafia Style
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raynpelikoneet
Finland42137 Posts
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raynpelikoneet
Finland42137 Posts
FT, VE and Sloosh to some extent look bad to me atm. | ||
raynpelikoneet
Finland42137 Posts
The pardoning can be done vai PM's to the hosts, i don't need to announce it in thread. There is nothing good coming out from me using it, only confusion and distraction, so i will not use my power ever. This makes me think scum have one too. | ||
raynpelikoneet
Finland42137 Posts
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raynpelikoneet
Finland42137 Posts
On July 16 2013 13:48 slOosh wrote: Hey guys. If people are unsure about how to mason, they should just avoid using it. Worst thing we can do is have all the discussion going on in PM land and nothing to go off of someone's alignment other than their mason's read on them. While Vayne made a personal choice not to mason, you seem to be directing people to avoid using it. Do you have an inherent motivation to discourage people from masoning? A discussion in "PM land" doesn't prevent discussions from happening in thread. I can't see why you would recommend people not to mason at all. I actually second this. Sloosh answer. This is really stupid, everyone should mason. There is no reason not to. Why do you think there is? ##Vote: slOosh As for Hapa's questions: + Show Spoiler + On July 16 2013 13:17 Hapahauli wrote: Hey all! Regarding PM usage, I think a very good early use of PM's is to try and establish the alignment of someone you know very well. For instance, I already used my first mason on Yamato77, who I'm very adept at reading and is a pretty good town player. Through these efforts I will slowly build a scum-hunting circle of awesomeness. I'll admit I'm a tad worried about the post-count restriction and our ability to jumpstart Day 1 reliably, especially if spammy players are concerned about the post-limit. As a result, perhaps a good 'ol fashioned questionnaire might be best to kick things off! 1) What are your views on PM usage? How and when should they be used? 2) Are there any policy lynches around the posting-limit we should consider? (i.e. if someone doesn't use all their posts, they get lynched, etc) 3) Who are players you feel you can read very well and reliably in this game? 1) To find scum. Not going to be more specific, but i want to know why are you so eager to know this from all the players? 2) No, lurkers should be vigged asap. If someone wastes their posts on bullshit we lynch them. 3) Oats. Vayne. Both town. DrH, please if you are town. Do not waste your posts arguing with Vayne. His argument is more likely to come from a townie than from mafia, and you are just wasting posts into that. Vayne will prove his alignment later for sure, but he is probably town. FirmTofu, What was the purpose of your first post? You yourself said "it should not be considered alignment indicative", and basically everything you said i disagree with, or the statements / "advice" is obvious. Why would you make a post that does not help us finding scum or figuring out your alignment? VE, explain your vote on DrH, how does that make him scum? Do you think he is intentionally wasting his posts? Malongo, yes i'm a Finn. Now do something that finds us mafia? | ||
raynpelikoneet
Finland42137 Posts
On July 16 2013 21:29 kholly wrote: Don't believe this guy. I read the Nuclear Winter Mafia game. Does this make me mafia somehow and if it does, how exactly? So you are voting for DrH because he is telling people to tell the thread who are they masoned with? If that's true, what do you think of other people who agree with this idea. Me & Hapa mainly? yamato, why are you not voting for VE if you think he is scum? MZ, does yamatos "horrible post" make him mafia? What exactly is horrible in that post? | ||
raynpelikoneet
Finland42137 Posts
On July 16 2013 20:24 raynpelikoneet wrote: I actually second this. Sloosh answer. This is really stupid, everyone should mason. There is no reason not to. Why do you think there is? ##Vote: slOosh Show me where I said no one should mason. [/QUOTE] I meant you are discouraging people to mason if they are unsure of what to do with PM's. That's dumb. Why are you telling people they don't need to mason anyone if they do not want to? Of course they do, because it helps town. If you are unsure of what to do with your PM's and therefore do not mason, don't listen to slOosh, he should know better. Mason me and i'll tell you what to do. FFS you can ask your mason partner how you should use your PM's, and tell the thread what he said. Be creative and not fall into this dumb "i'm so bad in off-thread comm, i ignore it" bullshit. I will lynch you if you ignore it, because off thread comm helps town more than it helps mafia. It gives the town opportunity to make plans and catch scum in different ways. And don't give that bullshit "what if you mason mafia or are wrong about your read". That'll come clear eventually, or you out your logs and someone else might be able to see it. TLDR; Everyone needs to mason 2 people, not necessarily at the start of the game. If you dont know what to do with PM's, mason me. gumshoe explain to me how you reached your conclusion in the DrH/FirmTofu exchange? | ||
raynpelikoneet
Finland42137 Posts
1) How do you magically know DrH "backed off". Because i happen to know that's not true. He just didn't post any more. 2) Explain this: Your first post contains this: The only threat of being open is mafia disrupting pm relationships. This is actually a bit of a problem seeing as we only get one pm, which is why I suggest not mass masoning D.H or someone else, if you must pm an intermediatery you trust. Later: I hate to waste your posts but sorry I'm as thick as a castle wall XD I assume scum can mason 2 people as well, I dont know why they wouldn't be able to seeing as that would be a cheap way to distinguish town from scum, basically scum have all the mechanical tools to look like town is my assumption. Regarding some other matters. Now why the sudden change of mind. Did you only get one mason to use? 3) Who have twisted my words and how? | ||
raynpelikoneet
Finland42137 Posts
@FirmTofu - I think your defense seems very legitimate and natural, you're off my scumdar. However, it's not that you drew attention to the existence of the traitor, just the fact that it seemed to be at the top of your mind is off. Which is why I wanted you to clarify how you approach mafia in general, it makes perfect sense that the numerically/setup minded type of townies would be fixated on that from the beginning. An LSB/sandro type of player are the kinds of people who I wouldn't raise an eyebrow at for talking traitor, so thanks for that. [16:07:44] <raynpelikoneet> have you talked a lot with DrH? [16:07:53] <Oatsmaster> somewhat [16:07:59] <Oatsmaster> quite a lot i guess [16:07:31] <raynpelikoneet> does he have any good points? [16:07:37] <Oatsmaster> hmm [16:07:04] <Oatsmaster> well he doesnt know how hapa and vayne play [16:07:12] <Oatsmaster> and he thinks FT is confirmed scum DrH explain, what's going on here? | ||
raynpelikoneet
Finland42137 Posts
On July 17 2013 03:53 slOosh wrote: I never said they shouldn't mason if they don't want to, stop putting words in my mouth. There's a handful of players who have yet to post in the thread, and who could have masoned up with each other. How do you propose to differentiate between them? How is making everyone splurge out their PM chains into thread helpful, when it defeats the point of PMs, which is to avoid / prevent thread clutter and get direct information? How is my plan to have unsure people just post normally in thread detrimental? You are pressuring people to use their PMs quickly, with only vague notions of how it's beneficial for everyone. Why have you totally ignored / dismissed the idea of organizing PM circles for maximum effectiveness? Where does he say he thinks FT is confirmed scum? You are saying "i never said people should not use their masons. Then what's this: "If people are unsure about how to mason, they should just avoid using it."?? Nowhere am i saying people should mason other people asap. Actually i adviced to not use at least both of your masons yet. PM circles will usually fall apart when scum get into them. I don't like that. I like it better that people mason whoever they want to, because that also tells about them (who they masoned. why?). DrH's post says he has no longer a scumread on FT. After that i asked Oats if DrH has had anything to say. He said DrH thinks FT is confirmed scum. Why the fuck is this so hard for you to read? It's pretty simple imo. | ||
raynpelikoneet
Finland42137 Posts
On July 17 2013 05:22 Hapahauli wrote: @ Rayn I really hate this post. You're voting SloOsh entirely because you disagree with him and not because you think his behavior is scummy. I can see see some rationale behind what sloOsh is suggesting (its better to be cautious about PM's since they are a limited resource). You're voting him for what I consider to be a fairly reasonable attitude. I have given clear reasons why i am voting for Sloosh. I do disagree with him yes, do you think people should not use their mason-ability to the fullest based on "idk what to do with PM's"? I think that's very scummy thing to say and there is not much other things Sloosh has said, certainly nothing that helps us find scum. On July 17 2013 05:30 Hapahauli wrote: @ Rayn This is not how analysis works. You don't find something in DrH's filter saying he doesn't suspect FT, then take Oats talk as the word of gospel. Where does DrH ever say that he thinks FT is confirmed scum? I have no idea where on earth you gleaned that information from, much less why you trust Oats so much this early in the game? Yes it is. Oats is probably sleeping atm, and someone is lying unless i have missed something. It's either; 1) DrH is scum and fucked up 2) Oats is lying 3) Something i have missed Why the fuck should i not question stuff like this? I see a fucking contradiction here. Either DrH will call Oats a liar or he will provide the logs that explain the situation. Or he'll say nothing in which case he is probably scum. Or then it's something else. Tell me how am i supposed to find mafia if i can't question people for stuff like this? I thought this should be brought up in thread so all of you can see it. If DrH/Oats/both are mafia it's possible for them to fool me if i don't bring this up. Someone else could however see through this. This is btw not analysis, this is questioning. Why are you saying it's analysis when it's clear it's not? Ans i trust Oats because it's pretty clear he is town. You should see that too. In other news, gumshoe is town and Koshi is dumb. | ||
raynpelikoneet
Finland42137 Posts
I am (was) in PM contact with Oats. gumshoe chose to mason me. Logs will be provided no later than N1. Both of gumshoe and Oats are town for sure, so is DrH. | ||
raynpelikoneet
Finland42137 Posts
Logs with Oats: IRC logs after that: + Show Spoiler + <Oatsmaster> duude <Oatsmaster> why is irc not blocked at work [16:07:43] <raynpelikoneet> :D [16:07:05] <Oatsmaster> lucky you [16:07:11] <Oatsmaster> webchat sucks [16:07:16] <raynpelikoneet> i will keep this open. i gotta get back to work in ~15min, but i'll have another pause in ~2h [16:07:22] <Oatsmaster> anyway, wtf is with all these weird people playing mafia laterly? [16:07:27] <raynpelikoneet> i have no idea [16:07:33] <raynpelikoneet> i think they are all too bad to be scum [16:07:55] <Oatsmaster> yeah kholly is definetely too bad to be scum [16:07:01] <Oatsmaster> manglo dude i dunno though [16:07:01] <raynpelikoneet> kholly/malongo [16:07:19] <Oatsmaster> i mean, that vote was really bad [16:07:50] <Oatsmaster> what was kholly refering to when he said he didnt believe your claim and referenced nucear? [16:07:31] <raynpelikoneet> i dunno, he just said he doesn't believe me, whatever he means with that :E [16:07:14] <raynpelikoneet> i think he means Nuclear N1 [16:07:28] <raynpelikoneet> when i said i nuked MZ [16:07:15] <raynpelikoneet> i don't really think why he thinks that claim makes me mafia if that's what he means [16:07:17] <Oatsmaster> at least you claimed if scum has a similar role and uses it [16:07:28] <Oatsmaster> no other benefits directly [16:07:29] <raynpelikoneet> btw [16:07:32] <Oatsmaster> benefits as scum to claim [16:07:40] <raynpelikoneet> i'm gonna mason my strongest scumread on N! start [16:07:46] <Oatsmaster> you are looked as somewhat town due to above reasoning [16:07:47] <Oatsmaster> the thing is [16:07:00] <Oatsmaster> pardernor is an amazing scum role [16:07:04] <raynpelikoneet> i know [16:07:13] <raynpelikoneet> at least if silent [16:07:22] <Oatsmaster> so I dont see why if you can anonomously stop the lynch on a scum buddy [16:07:34] <Oatsmaster> you would claim [16:07:39] <raynpelikoneet> no i wouldn't [16:07:17] <Oatsmaster> well [16:07:19] <Oatsmaster> wifom [16:07:34] <Oatsmaster> but yeah I think its too powerful for marginal benefits [16:07:54] <raynpelikoneet> yeah well it kinda is, but anyways that was teh best thing i could think of doing (masoning a strong town read and claiming instantly) [16:07:06] <raynpelikoneet> above for the wifom thing [16:07:16] <raynpelikoneet> tbh i wanted to mason 2 scumreads [16:07:25] <raynpelikoneet> and out the logs at the end of N1 [16:07:35] <raynpelikoneet> but now it's better [16:07:40] <Oatsmaster> why do you feel you had to mason a townread to claim? [16:07:43] <raynpelikoneet> i can mason one and give you the logs instead. :D [16:07:46] <Oatsmaster> like why not just claim in thread [16:07:05] <raynpelikoneet> because at that time i was not sure if that role could be used somehow to our advantage [16:07:24] <Oatsmaster> nah [16:07:29] <raynpelikoneet> i tried to think about it but i couldn't really find anything that would make me think so [16:07:34] <Oatsmaster> pardoner only creates mass confusion [16:07:37] <raynpelikoneet> yeah [16:07:44] <raynpelikoneet> that's the conclusion i got to :D [16:07:06] <Oatsmaster> like mostly if you are town, you would want the lynch to go through cause you somewhat agree with it or dont want to fuck over town anyway [16:07:20] <raynpelikoneet> yeah [16:07:35] <raynpelikoneet> there is also the worst case scenario that i am wrong and the town is right [16:07:49] <Oatsmaster> yeah, i doubt you will ever have a strong townread that town wants to lynch [16:07:05] <Oatsmaster> this game feels like a mini man [16:07:06] <raynpelikoneet> then we might nolynch + mislynch me before the scumlynch. :/ [16:07:14] <Oatsmaster> haha [16:07:33] <raynpelikoneet> i actually have a strong townread on vayne atm too [16:07:37] <raynpelikoneet> what do you think about him? [16:07:43] <Oatsmaster> yeah me too [16:07:03] <Oatsmaster> seems similar to the other games ive played in, namely catch 22 [16:07:11] <raynpelikoneet> he usually picks the game at some point and gives reasonable reads [16:07:15] <Oatsmaster> i didnt read Les Mafia though, how did he play there? [16:07:26] <raynpelikoneet> i think he was mafia in that game if i remember correctly [16:07:30] <raynpelikoneet> or was it CCM? [16:07:39] <Oatsmaster> yeah it was LeS [16:07:43] <Oatsmaster> CCM he was town [16:07:58] <Oatsmaster> did you read it/ [16:07:19] <raynpelikoneet> i don't remember him in Les (i played both). I was too fixated in lynching BH because of his claim. :/ [16:07:31] <Oatsmaster> haha [16:07:05] <raynpelikoneet> basically [16:07:15] <raynpelikoneet> i think vayne is mafia if he does not have strong opinions [16:07:29] <Oatsmaster> ok [16:07:33] <raynpelikoneet> he looks more like a normal player would look as town :D [16:07:36] <raynpelikoneet> when he's mafia [16:07:42] <Oatsmaster> and he has strong reads this game [16:07:44] <Oatsmaster> game too ez [16:07:16] <Oatsmaster> 11 players have not started to play the game [16:07:20] <raynpelikoneet> mm [16:07:22] <Oatsmaster> about 10 hours in [16:07:28] <raynpelikoneet> i hope Vivax is sane if he's town this game [16:07:30] <Oatsmaster> man I have half my post count used already [16:07:34] <raynpelikoneet> rofl [16:07:37] <raynpelikoneet> me too basically [16:07:40] <Oatsmaster> I really hope Vivax doesnt go full Vivax [16:07:50] <Oatsmaster> this game doesnt have marv though, should be good [16:07:57] <raynpelikoneet> omfg he destroyed Basterd game [16:07:11] <Oatsmaster> yeah [16:07:12] <Oatsmaster> so salty [16:07:20] <Oatsmaster> cause he didnt vote [16:07:23] <raynpelikoneet> when WoS told scum/survivor had fakeclaims [16:07:47] <raynpelikoneet> i was sure of the mafiateam (well had JarJar/Solstice as "idk which one") [16:07:56] <raynpelikoneet> but fuba + stutters [16:07:00] <raynpelikoneet> were clearly mafia [16:07:13] <Oatsmaster> yeah [16:07:27] <raynpelikoneet> also i was a bit mad for iGrok [16:07:34] <Oatsmaster> 2 mislynches is way too harsh for a 14 player game [16:07:41] <Oatsmaster> im a bit mad at iGrok [16:07:45] <Oatsmaster> well a lot mad [16:07:48] <raynpelikoneet> because my play on D1 was based purely on that scum do not have fakeclaims [16:07:02] <Oatsmaster> scum got fakeclaims at the start of the game [16:07:09] <Oatsmaster> the pause hat nothing to do with it [16:07:14] <raynpelikoneet> mm [16:07:18] <Oatsmaster> and our blues decided claiming was awesome [16:07:29] <Oatsmaster> so at least we got fuba for easy kill [16:07:43] <Oatsmaster> dont you have to go back to work? [16:07:04] <raynpelikoneet> still got a cup of coffee in front of me :D [16:07:21] <Oatsmaster> lol [16:07:27] <Oatsmaster> i guess that works [16:07:44] <raynpelikoneet> have you talked a lot with DrH? [16:07:53] <Oatsmaster> somewhat [16:07:59] <Oatsmaster> quite a lot i guess [16:07:31] <raynpelikoneet> does he have any good points? [16:07:37] <Oatsmaster> hmm [16:07:04] <Oatsmaster> well he doesnt know how hapa and vayne play [16:07:12] <Oatsmaster> and he thinks FT is confirmed scum [16:07:31] <raynpelikoneet> show him the part of this convo, where i describe vayne's playstyle (if you have not told him yet). I don't want him to waste all of his posts on nonsense with vayne on D1 [16:07:37] <Oatsmaster> cause basically his post is really agressive for no reason [16:07:53] <raynpelikoneet> hapa is weird [16:07:58] <Oatsmaster> yeah I explained how vayne plays which is basically be an egotistical farthead [16:07:59] <raynpelikoneet> i think his questions are bullshit [16:07:03] <Oatsmaster> yeah me too [16:07:08] <Oatsmaster> i like the rest of his posting though [16:07:16] <raynpelikoneet> yeah [16:07:19] <raynpelikoneet> but especially [16:07:57] <raynpelikoneet> 1) "Hi, i wanna know what are you going to do with your pm's, so i can get a fuckton of info when you tell the thread who you masoned" [16:07:02] <raynpelikoneet> like [16:07:16] <Oatsmaster> huh? [16:07:42] <raynpelikoneet> i say i mason Syllo -> i have answered Hapa "i wanna mason my townreads, to discuss stuff with them" -> Hapa knows i think Syllo is town [16:07:47] <raynpelikoneet> even without asking [16:07:28] <raynpelikoneet> if Syllo is in fact town, and we agree with each other, it's basically 1+1 = we are each other's townreads. Dangerous for mafia. [16:07:30] <Oatsmaster> I dunno man [16:07:50] <raynpelikoneet> i think we should not [16:07:00] <raynpelikoneet> i think we should not tell why we mason people we do [16:07:12] <Oatsmaster> i think its obvious by the thread who we think is town or scum [16:07:36] <raynpelikoneet> oh yeah, that's true [16:07:38] <raynpelikoneet> but [16:07:43] <raynpelikoneet> when i mason my scumread [16:07:47] <raynpelikoneet> i hope they think i am town [16:07:21] <raynpelikoneet> to have a false "good feeling" about talking with me [16:07:30] <Oatsmaster> lol trye [16:07:31] <Oatsmaster> true [16:07:34] <raynpelikoneet> more likely to say stuff they would not say normally [16:07:42] <Oatsmaster> yeah I guess [16:07:51] <Oatsmaster> so who are you looking at masoning? [16:07:07] <raynpelikoneet> okay [16:07:11] <raynpelikoneet> i gotta get back to work [16:07:15] <Oatsmaster> kk [16:07:15] <raynpelikoneet> i'll keep this open [16:07:20] <raynpelikoneet> in case you want to say something [16:07:21] <Oatsmaster> ill still be here i think [16:07:29] <Oatsmaster> in like 1 and a half hours [16:07:18] <Oatsmaster> well Ill probably not say anyhting unless someone posts Oats dropped at some point, this is the other stuff in between somewhere [16:07:54] <Oatsmast_> lol [16:07:54] <Oatsmast_> opps [16:07:57] <Oatsmast_> sorry internet was weird [16:07:06] <Oatsmast_> can you post everything past this [16:07:10] <Oatsmast_> 1) "Hi, i wanna know what are you going to do with your pm's, so i can get a fuckton of info when you tell the thread who you masoned" [16:07:12] <raynpelikoneet> k [16:07:27] <raynpelikoneet> [16:07:02] <raynpelikoneet> like [16:07:27] <raynpelikoneet> [16:07:16] <Oatsmaster> huh? [16:07:27] <raynpelikoneet> [16:07:42] <raynpelikoneet> i say i mason Syllo -> i have answered Hapa "i wanna mason my townreads, to discuss stuff with them" -> Hapa knows i think Syllo is town [16:07:27] <raynpelikoneet> [16:07:47] <raynpelikoneet> even without asking [16:07:27] <raynpelikoneet> [16:07:28] <raynpelikoneet> if Syllo is in fact town, and we agree with each other, it's basically 1+1 = we are each other's townreads. Dangerous for mafia. [16:07:12] <Oatsmast_> right [16:07:25] <Oatsmast_> so we should conceal our pm targets [16:07:29] <raynpelikoneet> no [16:07:32] <raynpelikoneet> we should not [16:07:32] No such nick [16:07:42] <Oatsmast_> I really wish I got more posts [16:07:51] <Oatsmast_> but gumshoe is wrong about the DrH thing [16:07:53] <Oatsmast_> he might be scum Timestamps are fucked up because the minutes don't show up correctly for some reason. Logs with gumshoe: + Show Spoiler + Sorry i was at work. Just got off. I PM the hosts ##Pardon: Playername. If they have the most votes at the end of the day, the day ends in no-lynch instead of that players lynch. The power is one-shot. I'm not really sure about Sloosh. I think he is not doing much and focusing on stupid things atm. I also find Hapa's questions to me odd and kinda dumb. I gotta question him in thread. Original Message From gumshoe: Hide nested quote - Original Message From raynpelikoneet: I think VE might be scum, his vote on DrH is quite horrible. I think DrH is town, but i still want him to explain this weird stuff, you can't just ignore that. Mafia is more likely to slip up by not keeping their story straight in PM's <-> thread. Original Message From gumshoe: taaaaaalk to me T_T in regards to the DH, theres a few possibilitys, DH is scum, he lied in thread but then why would he tell the truth to Oats or vice versa? Also perhaps Oat's pm was based on an earlier read of DH's? Like wise Oats could be lying, I dont think theyre both scum though, why would they waste a pm on another (they wouldn't actually be wasting a pm, but they would have to lie about they're pm targets if one of them was scum leaving them open to attack). What do you think of Ve? You dont find it weird how easy this Sloosh wagon is forming? Also would you mind clarifying how exactly your role works? I might be willing to do like wise. + Show Spoiler + Original Message From gumshoe: Hide nested quote - Original Message From raynpelikoneet: I think you should let go of Oats. He is as close as town Oats can be. :D I don't trust you yet, but you masoning me makes me feel better about you. You definitely can get to Oats & DrH through me. I'd advice not to use your second mason yet. There are still a lot of people who have not posted. Are you thinking of masoning scum / town as your other mason? Why? I talked about kholly with Oats, here: [16:07:22] <Oatsmaster> anyway, wtf is with all these weird people playing mafia laterly? [16:07:27] <raynpelikoneet> i have no idea [16:07:33] <raynpelikoneet> i think they are all too bad to be scum [16:07:55] <Oatsmaster> yeah kholly is definetely too bad to be scum [16:07:01] <Oatsmaster> manglo dude i dunno though [16:07:01] <raynpelikoneet> kholly/malongo [16:07:19] <Oatsmaster> i mean, that vote was really bad [16:07:50] <Oatsmaster> what was kholly refering to when he said he didnt believe your claim and referenced nucear? [16:07:31] <raynpelikoneet> i dunno, he just said he doesn't believe me, whatever he means with that :E [16:07:14] <raynpelikoneet> i think he means Nuclear N1 [16:07:28] <raynpelikoneet> when i said i nuked MZ [16:07:15] <raynpelikoneet> i don't really think why he thinks that claim makes me mafia if that's what he means Original Message From gumshoe: Hey, you seem to have a grip on the game and I can get to Oats through you and DH through you/Oats. Do you have any questions for me? Do you trust me? What do you think about what I've said about Oats and Knoly? Do you think Knoly is traitor or scum based off his answers? Should I pm him? I wanted answers out of Knolly which he hasn't been willing to give me in thread, I asked him to pm me, he didn't bother replying, I asked him if I pmed him would he be willing to talk to me? He didn't bother replying. So yeah, he has me worried with his cryptic talk, I'll drop Oats for the moment, can you ask him why he thinks I'm confirmed scum? XD If he doesn't wanna tell me thats fine, it's also annoying how small his posts are and how fast hes going through his filter and his encouraging of others to burn through posts but whatever, that infos not going anywhere and I wont get anything else by pressing him. Oh did he think I was scum because of his convos with Dh? That makes sense if so. Who do you think we should lynch? I can ask. The bolded part is a trademark of Oats townplay. :D I dunno yet, i sill want to pressure Sloosh, Hapa is now fucking weird. Might be because he is right about the fact that my scumplay is pretty good and he is being paranoid but still. He is questioning stupid stuff. VE looks better. DrH almost obviously town. Oats town, Vayne town. Who else, Kholly seems too bad to be mafia. :D Koshi is dumb, i dunno what that makes him. He's voting me because i claimed pardoner, rofl. + Show Spoiler + Original Message From gumshoe: Hide nested quote - Original Message From raynpelikoneet: I think VE might be scum, his vote on DrH is quite horrible. I think DrH is town, but i still want him to explain this weird stuff, you can't just ignore that. Mafia is more likely to slip up by not keeping their story straight in PM's <-> thread. Original Message From gumshoe: taaaaaalk to me T_T in regards to the DH, theres a few possibilitys, DH is scum, he lied in thread but then why would he tell the truth to Oats or vice versa? Also perhaps Oat's pm was based on an earlier read of DH's? Like wise Oats could be lying, I dont think theyre both scum though, why would they waste a pm on another (they wouldn't actually be wasting a pm, but they would have to lie about they're pm targets if one of them was scum leaving them open to attack). What do you think of Ve? Agreed, I get a bit of a scummy vibe off the way he sorta attacks DH's character as opposed to his posting, but Ve is a pretty aggressive player as I understand it so null on him for now, how do you feel about Vayne piggy backing off your Sloosh read? Personally I'm null on Sloosh, He advocates caution which is fine, people are kinda blowing the whole thing out of proportion in my opinion. Blind pms are actually pretty dumb, I wouldn't have pmed you if I wasn't pretty certain of your alignment. But the more posts he spends defending himself the more it seems that hes just trying trying to create an excuse for not making meaningful arguments. Another reason why i am keeping my vote on him. Fuck the formatting on gumshoe PM's. It's because TL apparently does not have fwd option in PM system.. :/ | ||
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+ Show Spoiler + Original Message From Oatsmaster: Well there could be gfs and framers and sanities so its not like cop check is 100%. People scared of posting lol. | ||
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FT, here: I PM the hosts ##Pardon: Playername. If they have the most votes at the end of the day, the day ends in no-lynch instead of that players lynch. The power is one-shot. Also how did Sloosh answer your question? I still don't anything from him that says "people should not avoid to use their mason ability" as your original argument was. Also your points against DrH are dumb. DrH is there anything else you see Oats is scummy for? Have you played with him before? If you compare your logs with him and my logs with him, any contradictions? Or rather, can you just post the logs in thread so i can look at them aswell. Koshi do you still think i am scum? Why? Why not? | ||
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Did you or did you not read them before posting after that? If you did not, why? | ||
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Also yeah DrH, Oats is not scum, at least from what you called him out of. Also also, if some is willing to donate me posts i would be grateful, i'm running out of them soon, and i can't even fucking PM. I dunno about VE, his explanation on his DrH stuff seems fine to me. I still think Sloosh is useless and town!Sloosh is not useless. Nothing he has said can be considered scumhunting. Kholly, malongo, Koshi probably just bad. I would not vote for either of them for now. vayne town. DrH town. yamato leaning town on, would like him to post more. Hapa is a Q-mark, i don't follow his thought process. FT could go either way, i wanna see how he responds to me/DrH. Vivax is just meh.. I don't like "cryptic" posts, as i have limited time and i don't like to double-think what i am even reading. Who else.. I have nothing to say about Wiggles/Kush, MZ, blah, just pops out, calls yamato out and disappears. Could lynch him. SnB seems fine to me, layabout has posted right? Fuck this is retarded when there are no filters in OP. That's all. Could you add filters in OP??? | ||
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DoctorHelvetica - proactive and has good points. Definitely town Oatsmaster - he's a reactionary dude rather than making posts that are well thought out. I see nothing that points him being scum since he explained stuff to DrH. I agree with it. Yamato77 - Has good posts that make sense. Is trying to push lynches (on people who i think are scum). FirmTofu - I tried to bait FT into saying he has read my logs. I dunno if he would have lied to have done so as mafia, but nevermind. His play actually makes sense from town PoV and his push on DrH seems genuine and i don't think he would do that as mafia. gumshoe - PM'd me and tried his best to get me to answer him when i was at work. Wanted to claim to me after i explain how my role works to him. A strong towntell. kholly - His posting seems genuine, and he is new. The post especially where he throws out DoctorHelvetica, VayneAuthority, Hapahauli, gumshoe as his scumreads. strongandbig - Has good points regarding VE/Sloosh. One thing i don't understand is that he asks Wiggles if he agrees with him why he thinks Oats is scum. He has never said he thinks Oats is scum. What's up with that SnB? Koshi - Get's straight into scumhunting without stupid fillers. Good case against VE, i agree with it. VayneAuthority - What i said in my logs with Oats. In addition to that he is a "setup guy" and begins to work better at the end of D1 / N1. Also calls Hapa out for stuff i find important. Null - soft scumreads: Vivax - I don't like his vote on SnB. And that's his only fucking post. Kushm4sta - Useless, completely. I dunno what that means. layabout - Only one post, setup talk and an unjustified read on vayne. Useless town or scum. Hapahauli - I don't have a strong town feeling from Hapa atm. He concerns me a lot. I think he is asking bad questions and calls out stuff that should not be called out. Malongo - Completely useless. I don't know what to think of him, i remember reading some of the earliest games in TL-mafia, and people seemed to do a lot of lists. Usually they were scum. Leaning on scum, but not sure. Scum: VisceraEyes - Useless VE is scum. Here VE is nothing but useless wasting his posts. Mr.Wiggles - He thinks Hapa is suspicious, but is not doing anything about it. Actually he is not trying to pursue any of his reads further, nothing ends in a solid conclusion. Meapak_Ziphh - Horrible comment about yamato's being horrible. And that's it. Suddenly wanted to mason me when i got PM-blocked. I dunno what that means he needed to waste a post pointing that out.. slOosh - Still has not answered to me. And nothing in his posts is pointing towards him wanting to find scum. Nothing to see here: Ace Altairius sandroba Node HiroPro yamato, what have you talked about with Hapa? Has he brought up anything that can be considered a town tell from him? SnB, why did you ask Wiggles if he agrees with your read on Oats? A read that you have never told in thread. MZ, why did you feel the need to waste a post in telling how you think i am confirmed town and that you wanted to mason me when it's not possible? Everyone who is useless atm, start doing stuff and do it quick, you can't all be mafia. | ||
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Why is nobody willing to give me posts? After all i am as close confirmed as you can be without modconfirmation? I have a lot to say, but i need to spare posts for tonight. Okay marv, welcome. Give us some scumreads as soon as possible plese. | ||
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Ace your posts so far are horrible. Can you read the thread and give your opinion on things? We have 20 posts/person/dayphase, do not waste them with useless stuff. | ||
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On July 18 2013 03:53 layabout wrote: rayne have you considered that Ace may not have done his reading and notes and shit? or that gumshoe appearing to trust you isn't alignment indicative but that trying to win your trust (claiming to you) it not necessarily the townie thing to do? also if i thought you were scum then i would push to l_ _ _h you. you can fill in the blanks yourself strong i think VE needs to explain why he thinkskholly is mafia. Yeah but the first thing when you replace into a game / when a game starts is to read OP. Not to ask "wtf should i do".. Yes i have considered the gumshoe thing and came into conclusion that it's far more likely that he is town. If you read the logs between us and come to a different conclusion or if there is something that supports him being mafia i'll reconsider. We have a postlimit this game, why are you questioning me and not your scumreads? That's kinda what you should be doing if you are town and think i am town. I think we should lynch into Sloosh/VE. I don't even know which one to prefer to be honest. Let's see who of those two can make better posts with the remaining time. | ||
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On July 18 2013 04:30 yamato77 wrote: Rayn, talk to me about Sloosh. Generally when I've played with Sloosh and he's scum, he goes into afk lurker mode and never posts. Seeing as that hasn't happened yet, I'm generally not thrilled with the idea of lynching him. What makes him a better lynch than VE? What has Sloosh actually done that's more than VE? Talked about setup and defended himself. I would not call that as effort. As i said earlier i'm not sure which one of those two i want to lynch, VE looks equally bad. There are questions asked from both of them and i'm waiting for them to answer. As for sloosh lurker moda, this is pretty close to lurker mode... | ||
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Can you post some compilation or even full logs? | ||
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I dunno what do you mean about layabout. What should i look for? I see gumshoe asking questions from him. Possibly thinks he is scum, at least not a townread for him. I don't know what's wrong with that. | ||
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gumshoe why did you mason kholly? | ||
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I'm not as sure about the Sloosh lynch. He hasn't done too much, but having a couple posts defending himself is not so bad in my opinion, simply because he was attacked by several people for his opinion on PMs. Yeah and he could have said "i didn't mean that but this" when people attacked him if we were incorrect. Intentionally getting into an argument and play "i'm too stupid to understand" is a good way to avoid doing anything else. That's what it looks like. Vivax's points on Layabout are good, that's the impression i got from his posts when i read them again. I still want to lynch Sloosh though. | ||
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And why the fuck would anyone vote VE AFTER he claimed? All of these people need to explain. | ||
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Explain this post from scum!rayn PoV: [b]Also, fwiw: Rayn posts end at ~4, and then posts at 6:58, RoL posts event at 7:04, Rayn jumps in at 7:12 going HEY GUYS LOOK AT ME IM TOWN AND HERE ARE PEOPLE I CLEARED. That certainly can line up with Rayn gets online, tells RoL to silence himself, and then goes all LOLOLOL LOOK IM TOWN. given that; 1) I insta-claimed pardoner to Oats who was my first town read 2) I told Oats that i would tell him if i got any claims 3) Gumshoe promised to claim to me before i got silenced 4) I got silenced How do my actions make sense from scum pov, if you are assuming i silenced myself? Or are you assuming that?[/quote] | ||
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@Ace Wtf Ace I don't get it. I never really got you, you made weird decisions before when we played and I'm too lazy to check if you were town or mafia then. I agree claiming is stupid, but VE at least has a provable claim whereas rayn just looks like way too many coincidences. Why did you vote for VE after he claimed America? Especially emphasizing that if he claimed dayvig we should lynch him. tbh i would have totally pardoned VE if i was not asleep. just saying. | ||
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On July 18 2013 18:52 Korynne wrote: rayne: So you publicly say you're going to mason someone. Immediately claim to them with your oh so amazing townread on them, and then claim to town with no provocation whatsoever 30min afterwards. I don't see the point of doing that. You just made the most useless claim possible because you can't prove it. I can prove my claim if needed. Why are you saying it can't be proved? Why would i need provocation to claim an anti-town role in thread as town? Assume for a second i am town, do you think it was wise for me to claim or not? Did you read the part in me/Oats logs where i said "if i hadn't claimed a possible rolecop + scum pardoner will fuck me up". Also none of your actions clear you. It's not like gumshoe is now not going to claim to you because you got silenced. You did something that delays you getting information at worst, and makes you look very clean at best. If you're mafia and gumshoe claims something important to you, killing him still draws suspicion to you, and not killing him means knowingly leaving a strong role around. At best the rest of the mafia has to push for his lynch, because you sure as hell can't with that oh so amazing townread on him. But no, if you got silenced, there's no possible way you betrayed gum, you're so town, it must be because the mafia was suspicious of gum being important after you publicly told everyone that gum is going to claim to you. Oh and gumshoe wasn't exactly happy you painted a giant target on his head, was that intentional too? "less thanks for mentioning the claim stuff...that was kinda private." Of course nothing clears anyone totally. Hell if i led a lynch on scum for the first 10 days that does not make me definitely town. But, if i was mafia, why would i claim pardoner (unless our team didn't have that role at all - in that case i can understand the motive)? When i claimed i just became a target of discussion. Why would i want unnecessary attention as scum (don't get me wrong, i love attention as scum - but not unnecessary attention). Why would i tell Oats i will share all claims with him? Why would i PM-block myself when gumshoe wants to claim to me? How does this make sense? I just prevented myself from having at least one claim, and there is a possibility of via some chain Oats would hear about me having claims if i lied about them to him. I also used a really good power to achieve nothing. PM's favor town far more than scum, if i was scum i would definitely not block myself, maybe my teammate but definitely not me. Almost all the games i have played (that are not on this site) are off-thread comm games, i can deal with PM-shenanigans as town/mafia. In my logs with Oats is an example of one game if you want to look more into my playstyle/capabilities. Btw, holy fuck. I just realized something. Sorry gumshoe. I didn't even understand what i did until now. fml-. :E Oh, how convenient, you were asleep. You saying you would've totally pardoned VE doesn't mean shit and you acknowledge that right? Because at lease VE acknowledged that hey, role != alignment and you're being all just saying, I would've pardoned him, give me townie points for something that has absolutely no value. You are right, that was purely a reactinoary post when i finished reading the thread, believe it or not. At this point my read on you is basically that you are a cocky person (oh look at all these reads I /totally/ know and all these snap decisions I instantly made), you're either really smart or you're just doing random dumb shit as overeager town. At this point I would like to hear from players who have played with rayn in the past re: whether you think rayn is capable of that. And if rayn is not, is it likely for someone else to be smart enough to orchestrate that as mafia and have rayne carry it out like that. If you guys believe it's highly unlikely, then okay, you're just an overeager townie and I'll keep that in mind when reading your posts. =P I am a cocky asshole truth to be told. ;D I use certainties in my reads even if i am not certain, because i hate people saying "this might be that, but then again... idk". What's the purpose of saying so? If you seem like you can't convince yourself you sure as hell will convince others right? I don't consider myself "good" but "decent" as either alignment and yes, i could do that as scum, but i wouldn't. I don't make stupid things that i benefit nothing from as mafia. Who do you think is mafia btw? You gave a long analysis on VE -voters and me and asked some questions from couple of other people. Are they your scumreads atm? | ||
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My pardoner claim really did throw unnecessary attention on me if i was mafia. If people find me suspicious, i can't be lynched, because i obviously will pardon myself. This means i am a vigi target if i am suspicious for people. I have bad experiences regarding this as mafia. In Catch 22 basically everyone thought i was town on N1, except for Coagulation. Too bad he happened to be a vigilante and you can probably put the pieces together in what happened. Oh no, you're so good at PM style games and then make such a huge slip on gumshoe? Do you usually just get all omg let's post everything in the thread especially if you think the people you are talking to are town? Ther reason behind posting the logs was that everyone else could aswell see why gumshoe/Oats are likely town. Or if i am wrong someone could see there is a reason to look for more into them. I honestly was somehow under the impression that everyone is blue in this game, otherwise i had never posted the gumshoe logs. I make mistakes too. In other news, i think MZ, layabout and Sloosh still look bad. When Sloosh/VE both posted their defences at the end of D1 VE came out much better from that. Can someone explain to me what makes Sloosh town? Also Ace, can you start playing for real, please? | ||
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Could everyone who were in PM-contact with yamato post their logs? | ||
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I suggest that if there is a day vigilante alive, they shoot FT so we resolve the situation between him and Ace. It's weird what Ace did and i could see him do that as both alignments tbh. I can also see FT being mafia, but why would mafia not nk DrH in that situation? Afraid of him being medic protted would be my guess. Sloosh, Layabout, MZ: - what are your opinions of the happenings on N1? Mainly the flips and Ace's cop & guilty claim. Vivax: Why are you voting for kholly? Do you think FT / Ace are both town, why? kush: can you post the PM's with marv? ##Vote: FirmTofu I'm rolling with this one. There is DrH's case that i agree with it (the latter part). I can't see why Ace would fakeclaim . The timing of his claim is weird and the fact that he got not killed is even weirder but if FT somehow turns up town we vig/lynch Ace. | ||
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You are half right. I read too. So you didn't investigate FT? | ||
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On July 20 2013 00:53 VayneAuthority wrote: You are confirmed rayn because no sane scumteam would think their silencer is going to die at the first night. There is no way you and him set that up to make you look clear. use logic and it's obvious you are town As for this Ace claim I ain't believing shit after roulette, just gonna keep playing this day normally like it didn't happen. Keep hunting scum and don't just end discussion for the day like it always does It has already pointed out by Korynne why this is not 100% true. You were talking about my claim, what does that have to do with anything (it's what i asked you about in the first place)? Do you think FT / Ace / both are scum? Also lol, my logic is that i am town as my role-PM says so. :D | ||
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[17:07:52] <Oatsmaster> can you look through gumshoe's filter and see if he breadcrumbed anything about his defence? [17:07:00] <Oatsmaster> cause that guy is confirmed town [17:07:17] <raynpelik0neet> what do you mean by "his defence"? [17:07:30] <Oatsmaster> like bodyguard shit [17:07:33] <Oatsmaster> i think its marv [17:07:35] <Oatsmaster> but I dunno [17:07:27] <raynpelik0neet> what, i don't follow [17:07:33] <raynpelik0neet> can you walk me through it [17:07:40] <Oatsmaster> gumshoe is a bodyguard [17:07:43] <raynpelik0neet> yeah and died [17:07:53] <Oatsmaster> he protected someone which means he gets killed if the dude he is protecting is shot [17:07:05] <Oatsmaster> which means the dude he is protecting is confirmed town [18:11] <raynpelik0neet> Oats [18:12] <raynpelik0neet> how do you know gumshoe actually protected someone? Usually BG's do not get notification as they die. How would gumshoe know he protected someone succesfully? Do you know mafia hit someone else than gumshoe? [18:15] <Oatsmaster> lol easy game [18:15] <Oatsmaster> cause he said he did his job [18:15] <raynpelik0neet> .. [18:15] <Oatsmaster> ? [18:15] <raynpelik0neet> why would he know about a succesful protection? [18:16] <Oatsmaster> ah [18:16] <Oatsmaster> true [18:16] <Oatsmaster> but i dunno why gumshoe and not like 3 other dudes more townie [18:16] <raynpelik0neet> because blue? [18:16] <Oatsmaster> anyway it doesnt really matter [18:16] <raynpelik0neet> ofc it does [18:16] <Oatsmaster> cause I dunno who he protected [18:17] <raynpelik0neet> you said mafia hit someone else [18:17] <Oatsmaster> it matters if we know [18:17] <raynpelik0neet> when gumshoe can't know that [18:17] <Oatsmaster> we dont know [18:17] <Oatsmaster> oh the extra info [18:17] <Oatsmaster> right [18:17] <Oatsmaster> i would know who is confirmed town then wouldnt i [18:19] <raynpelik0neet> you kinda said [18:19] <raynpelik0neet> marv is [18:24] <Oatsmaster> i did [18:25] <Oatsmaster> but now I dont [18:25] <Oatsmaster> because no actual evidence [18:25] <Oatsmaster> just speculation Oats was sure gumshoe protected marv. Oats can't know if gumshoe in fact protected anyone and was not hit instead (remember, he was kinda known to be blue) unless he knows he protected someone. And suddenly it's not marv anymore. rofl. Oats is mafia. ##Unvote: ##Vote: Oatsmaster | ||
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On July 20 2013 02:06 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Ace fake claimed cop with a red check on FT because he don't give a fuck. I don't know what game you are reading MZ, but at least not all of the people are not referring to Ace's cop claim. Why are you spreading lies? Also why not vote for Oats? FT: Wanna lynch Oats? | ||
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On July 20 2013 02:53 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Rayn explain the oats case to me like I'm five because I just went through his filter and didn't see anything particularly bad. I just made a fucking case? | ||
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He's town. | ||
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On July 20 2013 04:45 Koshi wrote: Like I said, the guy is just afk-ish. You can blame him for not caring about this game and pressure vote him. I decided to do that with kholly because if oats deserve your vote, kholly deserves a couple as well. And the whole thing with you blaming oats for assuming that gumshoe did not defend somebody is just as simple by you as by Oats. Pure mathematically: Is it not more likely that Gumshoe picked the right target to defend than that he was targeted by scum? Add the fact that Gumshoe kinda claimed himself that he protected the right target... Don't know why you don't consider that, but go so harshly on Oats for making a wrong assumption. As i said: 1) How would gumshoe know he was not hit and protected someone? 2) gumshoe was claimed blue, is that not a good reason to hit someone? | ||
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##Unvote: ##Vote: Meapak_Ziphh | ||
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For example, see how he answers the Oats case. He is not even looking at the case but instead saying "i don't see anything scummy in his filter". He hasn't done anything that helps town and MZ is not that bad. Kholly is second on my list. Yo lurkers, if you are town gimme some posts as you cleraly don't need them. I do. | ||
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marv, why give kush posts and not me. | ||
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To: slOosh [ Profile | Buddy | Report ] Subject: Re: Sicilian mafia mason Date: 7/20/13 19:11 The Oats case was a fabricated one. After tha chat log Oats explained better why he said what he did. We were trying to bait scum into voting for him. Idk if anyone took the bait (Vivax?), and that's a null point unless FT was mafia. So no scummy reactions from that one. :/ Yeah i had voted back to FT, that's why the "180". I thought he was scum until he claimed. I asked him to mason me and was hoping to talk with him more today, but then he broke rules and i did not have time to talk with him yet. I basically asked him when he is able to get on IRC and that's it. SnB looks pretty much worse after the shot. Ace's behaviour didn't point towards him being mafia. The shot was really bad and i could see mafia justifying the shot. I think kush is town, basically when he's bad he's town, and he is useless. I dunno what to think of layabout, could very well be mafia. kholly the same, although i am more sure of him being mafia than laya. What do you think of MZ? Atm he is my top scumread. Original Message From slOosh: Makes sense. - Who are your current scumreads? layabout, kholly, kushm4sta, SnB - What do you think about FT/Ace situation? leaning town on Ace, because his actions forced discussion on FT. I've had FT down as terrible town since this post, http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=414884¤tpage=31#619 but still haven't had time to properly read the newer stuff - What do you think about my case on Oats? Seems like a misinterpretation - he said "i think its marv" & "but i dunno why gumshoe and not like 3 other dudes more townie" which is totally fine since no-one looking at gumshoe hiropro yamato flips can look at that and say, yep that's normal. Your turn: - If you think that Oats is scum for your case, the only reason to do that is if marv was scum buddy who wanted confirmed town status. Agree / disagree, and what is your read on marv? - Why the 180 off FT? Do you still think he is scum and that Oats is more scum? Hide nested quote - Original Message From raynpelikoneet: Hey, i wanted to mason you, because i want to talk to you and not waste all my posts if we don't understand each other. So: - Who are your current scumreads? - What do you think about FT/Ace situation? - What do you think about my case on Oats? And that's it. What gives? ##Unvote: ##Vote: slOosh Should have lynched him already on D1.. | ||
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I ran out of posts afaik. someone gimme soem! | ||
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That makes your first conclusion fluff in my eyes. But i understand the mason thingy, that's what i thought it most likely was. I'm okay with killing kholly if needed to consolidate, would prefer Sloosh though. | ||
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Lynch Sloosh. Everyone knows why. Look at his D1 and D2. Think about the fact that he is masonedwith SnB, has him as a scumread and does nothing to push him. + every other things.. too tired to write. Lynch Sloosh. | ||
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On July 21 2013 13:06 Oatsmaster wrote: Well. Rayn wtf was that? Well. Oats are you dumb? If there are vigis alive you know what to do. | ||
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On July 21 2013 18:19 Vivax wrote: Well I'll be dead by tomorrow. You know what to do. Rayn, you claim you still have your power left right? | ||
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Sloosh being pardoned is sole proof that he is scum. MAfia would be stupid to pardon a townie, when they can just let them die and pardon one of their own when needed. Kill Sloosh. Period. | ||
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On July 22 2013 06:45 kushm4sta wrote: Thanks Rayne! Thanks for telling everyone some obvious shit that they already knew. I think literally every player wants to kill sloosh already. 8====> Apparently people do not know this. Look at Koshi/Malongo/VA for example. Solid case bro! Would you mind explaining how it makes sense for town to have a pardoner role? marv has been useless since the game begun. marv is not useless as town. He was also trying to divert people from lynching Sloosh for no fucking reason ("Chezinu is not helping" - makes him scum right?). He has done absolutely nothing to help the town. Therefore he is scum. I can't explain why town has a pardoner role. My best guess would be because of Ver. | ||
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Are you scum? | ||
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On July 22 2013 07:32 VayneAuthority wrote: Because a scum pardoner is the dumbest fucking thing ive ever heard of. rofl note that i wasted my last post on this because this is one of the most dumbest things i have ever heard when playing mafia. just rofl- | ||
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On July 22 2013 07:32 VayneAuthority wrote: Because a scum pardoner is the dumbest fucking thing ive ever heard of. Okay, this is completely wrong, but: On July 22 2013 07:34 VayneAuthority wrote: Also the fact that you are so sure it was scum who pardoned him is sketchy as hell. We don't even know if he's town or scum yet. Something is up with you claiming that early in the game... Did yamato silence you to get towncred and you are actually a scum pardoner? LMFAO if thats what you did. It will become obvious soon enough when you arent dead. 2 minutes ago vayne could not see why there CAN POSSIBLY BE A SCUM PARDONER! Now, he is saying i am one. Note that this all "fuck im confused, town pardoner claim" has been going on since all N2, to protect Sloosh, the mafia guy who got pardoned by his scummates, which vayne could not understand in the first place at all. But suddenly i am the scum pardoner, which was not possible in the first place. Look at this guy's posts, rofl. Sloosh is mafia, vayne is mafia, snb is mafia. marv is probably mafia. Kill sloosh first, because he is 100% mafia. | ||
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On July 22 2013 08:10 VayneAuthority wrote: Another preflip association. IMPORTANT: IF SLOOSH IS SCUM RAYN IS AS WELL, DO NOT FORGET THIS. I'm going to take a 5 post penalty just to point this out. See the bolded parts and laugh. gl guys, ima go to bed. | ||
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Also: marvellosity SnB VayneAuthority (or really fucking dumb) Meapak_Ziphh or layabout Thank you, vote for slOosh. Should have had lynched him every day. | ||
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I think you have been no help this game and that's not characteristic for you marv. That's why i believe you are mafia. It's been two cycles and you have basically wanted to lynch kholly with shitty reasons, and who btw is probably town. | ||
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On July 22 2013 20:37 kushm4sta wrote: for end of game bragging rights: 3 scum left, 1 sk left (unclaimed shot on yamato) drh kholly rayne ? some other random person First of all you are wrong probably on everyone in your list. Do you think Sloosh is town as you seem like? Explain the pardoning on Sloosh. On July 22 2013 20:46 kushm4sta wrote: @vayne how many pardons do you have? could you pardon yourself? I am assuming you mean me? I have one, as i have had whole game. I have not asked if i can pardon myself but i would assume yes. | ||
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Your theory is that i claimed a pardoner, one of the best scum roles at the start of the game. Then my team silenced me right after gumshoe told me he is going to claim to me because apparently for scum!rayn it's better that he claimed to marv instead. I have bussed slOosh the whole game as i was the first one to votefor him and i was actively trying to got people to vote for him. - There is no reason why i should/would have claimed pardoner as mafia. The thing that everyone now knows there actually is a pardoner in the game speaks in favor of that, because the only situation where it would be beneficial for scum (if i was scum) would be that there is not actually a pardoner at all. - There is no reason why i would have myself silenced over some active townie if i was mafia. D1 was fucking inactive and if i silenced myself as mafia gains me nothing. Actually it does the opposite as gumshoe is about to claim to me. - There is no reason i should have pushed slOosh the entire game as mafia, there have been other targets (like half of the players on D1). The only time i let go of sloosh for a while was when he masoned me. That was because i wanted to give him a chance to prove his towniness. Why would i not tell sloosh to even try to make some good shit up if i was mafia? We could have easily made him look better. None of the actions you think i am scum for do make sense from scum!rayn pov. There would be no reason for me to claim pardoner if i was mafia. There was no benefit in silencing myself if i was mafia, actually it would only hurt my team (we lose a claim + power, for nothing). There is no reason i would have bussed sloosh for the entire game when there were like 10 other targets at that time. Can you please try to understand why you are wrong on this, and can you please look for actual mafia if you are town? thanks. | ||
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Otherwise i am masoned with townies and useless idk-what-alignment.Oats. | ||
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- If i am town pardoner i am telling the truth which means mafia pardoned Sloosh which means he is scum. - If i am scum pardoner i am probably lying about not pardoning Sloosh which means he is scum. How can you reason voting me over Sloosh? Also kush: On July 23 2013 06:49 raynpelikoneet wrote: I asked my scumread to mason me and it did strengthen the read. Otherwise i am masoned with townies and useless idk-what-alignment.Oats. How is this post "useless spam"? I just stated i have a townread on people i am masoned with, other than Oats. You on the other hand are voting for me over near confirmed scum Sloosh and you are calling my posts useless spam. Seriously fuck you. Same can be said about layabout who has done shit. I would quadruble vig you if i had shots because you guys are so fucking bad. | ||
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On July 23 2013 09:22 VayneAuthority wrote: Alright I'll try to go through this. I know you think it's silly but you can't pretend like you couldn't pull this off. It's not that pretentious. 1. The bussing thing is irrelevant since if I am scum like you say I am, then what is the difference between us there? 2. You don't need the claim from gumshoe, the fact that he wanted to claim to you is enough to let you know its something fairly important. Also note that he died the first night...doesn't exactly help your case since you were masoned with him. I thought the silencing thing didn't make sense at first but lets be real it's not that great of a role. Why risk confirming some one as town when you can just silence a teammate? It reduces the effort they have to put in and makes them more townie. Its a win/win. 3. If you are a scum-sided pardoner then your best bet is to immediately claim and use your pardon without admitting it so that you can fuck with the town. If you don't claim then you are a lot less immune proof and you definitely don't get masoned by so many people. It allows you to be behind the scenes and manipulate people as a result of your claim. 4. just a repeat of 2 5. just a repeat of 1 The one thing you have going for you here that you didn't mention for whatever reason is that I don't think you are dumb enough to do the fake claim and then @ late game obviously everyone will wonder wtf you are still alive. That fact alone is making me re-think that you are scum, but the rest of the stuff you just said? Doesn't really change anything about the theory. Being alive does not make me mafia, and you didn't comment on the "bussing Sloosh" part at all. But yeah, i can see your thought process behind the other stuff. I just don't think i need to use mafia powers in order to "confirm" me, i can handle shit otherwise as scum. In rebuttal What is the difference between us when it comes to sloosh that you are trying to misrepresent/pounce on me for? Why are you letting up now that its apparent that only MZ shares your interests (who I believe is scum for sure btw) And as an aside, why do you think marv is so happy go lucky in this game? If we compare this game to the new game that just started where he's hydra'ed with VE, he is getting into some crazy arguments and being pretty confrontational. Here he's settling fights and just doing some basic analyzation but not really pushing for anything. If we cross analyze that with his "I don't get into fights as scum" thing I find it hard to believe he is town this game, but he doesn't feel like scum either. 3rd party marv? - I am not trying to misrepresent you. I was just saying D2 votes on Sloosh do not mean much. I actually think you are town as yu are trying to figure out stuff and i don't think mafia would call me out for the pardoning. I just got mad at you because i didn't understand how someone could think what you thought. - What do you mean by letting up? You mean giving up? It's all emotional and i dealt with it already. I am gonna play the game, and yes, i could see MZ as scum too. - The thing that bothers me about marv is that he was masoned with Vivax for a long time and they didn't get anything done besides votes on kholly. ´We know Vivax flipped town, so i dunno. marv could go either way but i have some serious doubts on him. He had a good post in analyzing the voting patterns but that's pretty much it. All in all i would kill at least Sloosh / SnB before either one of marv/MZ. | ||
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@marv what do you mean it doesn't make sense for town to shoot ace. He was actively refusing to engage in any way that could either help find scum or show us he's town. And he was actively disrupting and confusing the thread and advancing the scum agenda. I know how hard it is to get ace lunched, and I had a bullet, so I shot him. Plus I got to shoot ace. Right in the face. The bolded parts interestingly fit into your play perfectly SnB. Plus you shot Ace, who was not scummy as you claim. | ||
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I have information about a parity cop check that is Meapak - marv "different". Given what Sloosh said this gonna be something to discuss. | ||
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On July 24 2013 07:34 kushm4sta wrote: wait rayne you have 2 blue roles wtf Having information does not mean i am a cop. | ||
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This includes a lot of people. I am protecting their identity and you need to tell me who is scum and why: There is a person X who is masoned with a Z. Z claims parity cop to X (this is not confirmed), and claims they have a "different" check on marv-meapak. X is masoned with Y. They tell Y this (not confirmed) and tell them to share that information with someone to tell that in thread. Y is masoned with me, tells me about this and asks if it's wise to say that in thread. Here is my response to them: There is no reason to out the check before the deadline. It'll only cause possible chaos and people can be dumb enough to do something stupid instead of lynching Sloosh. I don't know if it's wise to out the info even on the night phase, as if the cop is alive they can just out the check results in D4. If not, we can tell that info in thread, as me & you know about that. After this i share that information i have about X, Y and Z with W. I give them all the names too. After this happens the Sloosh - marv chat (i think? - marv, when did you talk with Sloosh?). Now who is most likely to be scum? | ||
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On July 24 2013 09:16 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Do see sk on the role list? I sure don't. That's where my whole "check" on ace came from. I see it as much more likely scum are trying to get marv "confirmed" as sloosh goes down. You are right. Also Oats is probably scum. | ||
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2. Kushm4sta - mostly because of voting patterns 4. layabout (possibly) - hasn't done anything but fishy stuff 5. Mr Wiggles (no idea) - what are you doing? 6. strongandbig - obviously 7. raynpelikoneet - pardon me! 8. Meapak_Ziphh (slight possibility of him being scum/SK over marv but i doubt it) 11. VayneAuthority - voting patterns 12. kholly - inclined to think so 13. Korynne - is making sense 17. Adam4167 - agreed, silent...too silent lately... 18. Koshi - inclined to think so 19. Oatsmaster - hasn't done anything to help finding mafia, also completely absent in PM's lately 21. Marvellosity (or meapak) - what you doing? inclined to think he is SK/scum over Meapak because of responses to the parity cop thing. | ||
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The person who told me about the cop check was not supposed to reveal their identity. They however did. When i told the other person about the check, the cop went "RAYN TOLD THEM ABOUT IT?????". They had no intention to question the person who told me about the check and was supposed to hide their identity. That's fucking fishy. They also wanted me to out the check in thread. I have no fucking idea why. Why not the first person who they did tell about it? What's the point in passing the information over and over again in case it comes to scum hands if you want to out it in thread? Note that the "cop" i am talking about might not be the actual cop but a proxy to them. | ||
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On July 25 2013 11:21 kushm4sta wrote: @rayne who did you tell about layabout being parity cop? I didn't tell anyone because i did not know he was the cop (although i assumed so). But i told Oats. Also Korynne and Koshi knew. | ||
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On July 25 2013 11:48 Oatsmaster wrote: Im guessing the layabout was a blue snipe or there is scum in the chain of PM people. yeah, you. | ||
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Also MZ looks way better than marv and we are not lynching him. Vivax was suspicious of marv. Wtf has SK been doing since N1, shooting same targets than mafia? marv has been very bad, hell he didn't want to lynch sloosh on D2 when it was obvious he was scum (i don't mean the end of the day, he should have figured it out earlier). MZ on the other hand was the first to call yamato out, was one of the first people to vote for sloosh in D1, and his reaction to the check was WAY more townie than marv's. marv is either SK or mafia, and we need to kill him asap. ##Vote: marvellosity | ||
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On July 25 2013 18:42 Oatsmaster wrote: Ok guys, 1 job. Read MZ's and Marv's filter. Vote for the scummiest one. Thats an interesting theory Korynne. Rayn has also stopped talking to me, less than 1 pm a day so its not like Im not responding to him and I dont understand how his read on me changed. Yeah, i have tried to contact you in irc many times. I also have not had anything useful to say, and when i have, i have PM'd you. Is it only my job to start discussions between us? Okay, go ahead and read marv/MZ filters. Especially marv's. Tell me what he has done besides pushed for kholly lynch "because Chezinu"? | ||
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Riggghhhhht. You want people to find the mole when you should be convincing us that MZ is scum/SK, AS YOU CAN BE SURE OF IT IF YOU ARE TOWN. But no.. | ||
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[14:32] <Oatsmaster> http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=414884¤tpage=58#1160 [14:32] <Oatsmaster> so marv scum or town [14:33] <raynpelikoneet> i don't understand [14:33] <raynpelikoneet> why is he not trying to convince us MZ is not town? [14:33] <raynpelikoneet> why the fuck would you not do that if you are town? [14:36] <Oatsmaster> why the fuck would you not do that if you are scum? [14:41] <raynpelikoneet> to buy time [14:41] <raynpelikoneet> he is trying to get us to find the mole [14:41] <Oatsmaster> buy what time? [14:41] <raynpelikoneet> which we don't even know exists for sure [14:41] <Oatsmaster> oh [14:41] <Oatsmaster> like not lynch MZ [14:41] <raynpelikoneet> yeah [14:41] <raynpelikoneet> so that there is uncertainty [14:41] <raynpelikoneet> if we are looking for non-existent mole [14:42] <raynpelikoneet> it is possible laya was masoned with scum, say wiggles [14:42] <Oatsmaster> yeah [14:42] <raynpelikoneet> and people are trying to find the mole in you/me/Koshi/Korynne [14:42] <Oatsmaster> go and post that | ||
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##Vote: Strongandbig That post like any other of his post is full of shit. | ||
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+ Show Spoiler + You probably should, because regardless of your alignment the way you are playing is gonna get you killed. :D Original Message From Meapak_Ziphh: lol yeah I guess you can. That means I'll have to start tryharding in the thread -_- | ||
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You seem to want to lynch into them, at least tell which one them. And what makes that person not town. | ||
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Oats will die tonight if he is a real cop. That'll confirm us many peeps in a direction or another and it's good. If he is alive at the day start we got another check or "check". That's also good. I'm starting to lean on mafia on Korynne. If Meapak is in fact town Wiggles is most likely scum. One of MZ/marv has to be at least anti-town. I don't buy the framer shit. I gotta reread a couple of filters when this shit workday is over. Oats / Korynne / Koshi / MZ: I'm home probably in ~10-12 hours. Can you guys get on irc then? If you can't, please PM me your thoughts on remaining scum. I would also like to hear from marv & kush in thread. If you have discussed the game via PM's please post them in thread. We need as much content as possible now, so we can figure this shit out. I'm especially interested in hearing from marv, now is your time to step up. You won't die for sure if you are town because that would pretty much confirm MZ as anti-town. I would like to discuss the game with you, because we have not been able to do so this game and you have been mostly working on PM's. | ||
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Now we are lynching Meapak who is either mafia or SK. ##Vote: Meapak_Ziphh Cheks don't lie. | ||
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You really do not vote for a guy who has a non-town check on him from confirmed cops? wtf is wrong with this game. | ||
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Although i fucking know mafia has 2 pardoners or Korynne's role PM was faked somehow. Meapak's post is full of shit (the one where he does accuse me of pardoning Sloosh). | ||
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On July 29 2013 08:14 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: FT was green. You and FT are Same. You and I are different. I know I am green. The only way for you to be scum is if you're a gf and I got framed or I'm a miller. Fuckit you're right that's too implausible. Let's just lynch me today so we can stop arguing and then lynch wiggles tomorrow. Ahh so not lynch marv any more? gg, you scum. | ||
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On July 29 2013 08:18 marvellosity wrote: You could be miller, either of us could have been framed night 2, and with basic logic with my logs with flipped mafia and the lynch yesterday, it's practically impossible I'm mafia. You should be able to see that. Checks aren't always flawless especially when they're split over various players over various nights. In fact if I'm godfather and you're town, then the checks on us would have returned SAME right, not different? So I don't understand what your angle is there. You should stop martyring yourself because if you're town then lynching you achieves very little because your flip doesn't confirm anything to anyone. See what I'm saying? Spot on there. What do you think of Vayne based on that? I was purposely agreeing with him on the GF thing as it is completely wrong, to see if people figure that shit out. | ||
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On July 29 2013 09:53 VayneAuthority wrote: actually im sorry but you are the one that is wrong here rayn if you were truly trying to trick me. the scenario was marv being GF and meapak being miller. They would be of different alignments. You think it's a fair scenario that marv is a GF and Meapak is a miller? huh, you are assuming a lot. Why can't Wiggles just be really really busy and not be able to post much? Because to me that sounds like a better assumption than that GF-miller stuff you are consipracing on. Am i mafia pardoner too? Why are you not voting for me, fuck, that's like the easiest thing to assume yet you did call me confirmed town because of my role... scum. | ||
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On July 29 2013 10:37 VayneAuthority wrote: and yea I'm sure wiggles has been busy for like 2 weeks now or whatever it is but conveniently has had time to vote for every cycle xD any1 else find that post rayn just made weird? You, of all the guys do not trust night checks / kills. You, the same guy who says "i don't do shit on D1 because of no information from night phase" is now ignoring the night actions. You push on some retarded conspiracy theories over a confirmed cop checks assuming a godfather AND a miller AND they happened to be checked the same night by 2 different confirmed parity cops? I think you are trying to look better when Wiggles turns up scum, because SK!meapak now if alive has to help mafia, because you are in a fucking bad spot. | ||
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On July 29 2013 10:56 VayneAuthority wrote: A few things here I'm not ignoring the night actions. In fact due to the night actions and how wiggles has acted it makes him more scummy. I pushed a "retarded conspiracy theory" yesterday for my vote on marv. Why the sudden change in attitude over one that is wayyy less farfetched? IM NOT ASSUMING A GODFATHER FOR THE LAST TIME. I know its tough to read since I fail at it a lot too but you seriously need to re-read. I ONLY THINK MEAPAK IS MILLER. NOWHERE DO I THINK MARV IS GODFATHER. MEAPAK THINKS MARV IS GODFATHER. ok now that you hopefully understand that. Yea I'm bussing my last partner for cred when I can get shot at by SK at any moment and lose the game there. When I refused to bus my other teammate SnB at a way more convienent time. That makes so much fucking sense how did I not see that! Please think logically about what I just said and realize that just as I was wrong about you, you are wrong about me here. Its borderline retarded. Then why are you not voting for Meapak because there is the "same" check on marv - FT? | ||
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Meapak thinks marv is GF, he is miller -> cop has "different" check on them. MAKES SENSE! Why again are you not voting for Meapak? | ||
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MZ is probably SK but Wiggles and VA are pretty damn sure the last scum remaining. | ||
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##Vote: Mr.Wiggles | ||
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Who is willing to vote for MZ? Or rather, if you are not, why? Look at the fucking checks people.-- | ||
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On July 30 2013 04:33 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: Yeah kill kush after wiggles if you lynch me. So marv is not scum any more? | ||
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Wiggles wtf were you doing the whole game?? | ||
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rofl. This is gonna be fun. Me and Koshi are town. If Koshi is SK he deserves to win and if i am alive and someone tries to lynch him i will pardon him. ^_^ Let´s make the game interesting. kush is probably town, MZ is probably the SK. He is acting kinda dumb but he is not dumb. marv is probably mafia, his play is so ridiculously i really can´t believe he is town. I´d say he is the GF. Another mafia is one of vayne/Mocsta. Mocsta´s posting seemed okay, but on the other hand Adam´s didn´t. Vayne looks really bad from every direction, but his D1 voite on Sloosh speaks in his favour. I´d say MZ is the SK, marv & Mocsta scum. Act accordingly. | ||
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On July 31 2013 00:22 Koshi wrote: Also, rayn just killed one of us. lol No, mafia & SK need to shoot each other. If one of them does and another one doesn´t they gonna lose. :D I think mafia has a good grasp on who the SK is, and vice versa. It´s the best chance for them to win, funnily enough it´s the best chance for town to win too. :D | ||
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SK needs to shoot mafia because if he doesn´t mafia will lynch him and wins in 2-2-1 situation the next day. Because SK shoots mafia, mafia needs to shoot SK in case SK misses and accidently shoots town. SK is a liability to them and they need to get rid of them, the later the SK is alive the less chances mafia has in winning this. All of this helps town too. This gonna be really cool! ^_^ | ||
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On July 31 2013 00:49 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: I actually still think kush could be scum. EVERYONE except for him was sure wiggles was scum, and yet somehow kush had this magical epiphany where wiggles wasn't scum. Despite this he doesn't actually try that hard to prevent wiggles from getting lynched and lynching me instead. Other than worthless oneliners saying things like "lynch the red check" he does nothing to prevent wiggles from getting lynched but it put in a perfect position to say "I told you so" and claim town cred which is precisely what he did. You should probably shoot him then. I would prefer you shooting Mocsta/marv though. | ||
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SK shoot Mocsta. | ||
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Why the fuck should/can i give 3 reasons why he is town if i think he is scum? | ||
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tbh i didn´t give much shit if wh lynched MZ or Wiggles last day because people were already piled up on Wiggles. There is no way to convince these idiots because marv has some invisible credit to say what to do even when he is scum and even when he is not saying anything... i really don´t care. i hope Koshi is the SK so i can pardon him tomorrow and he wins. | ||
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Original Message From Mocsta: really given up this game? so what if ppl day2 thought u was scum, they have all flipped. what's important is that *I* think you are town. if u still give two shits, lemme know so I can run some stuff past ya One hour until the flip. Seems like trying to buy town credit to me. | ||
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Never vote for kush, Koshi & Vayne. They are not mafia for sure. | ||
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Sorry for missing kush being obvscum and i probably should have figured out Koshi was the SK. I mainly didn´t because it was me & Koshi in our PM´s who started suspecting Korynne at the same time (i dunno if Koshi had her as a suspect earlier). Should have been obvious that he was the SK, but i somehow thought someone else could have figuredd the same stuff and let that slide. :/ | ||
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raynpelikoneet
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On August 03 2013 20:48 marvellosity wrote: Should have masoned me babe x I kinda wanted to but Oats was an obv-pick because he was obv-town and i needed to talk with someone about when/how to claim. I also wanted to mason Sloosh cause i wanted to figure out his scumbuddies but that didn´t obviously work out. :/ | ||
raynpelikoneet
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raynpelikoneet
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Ver could you explain me why you came into conclusion that my claim + being silenced did not make me town considering this: 1) If i was mafia pardoner i would have totally made one of the best mafia roles useless for my team. 2) I would have used another very strong power (silence) on myself, when i have established a very good PM network with Gumshoe, Oats, and DrH, Vivax, marv (by proxy). Gumshoe has promised to claim his role to me (that one i majorly fucked up, i somehow thought everyone was blue in this game and that it was somehow known :/ ). I would have wasted 1/3 mafia powers on D1 on something that does not make me confirmed town and definitely does not put my team into better position considering the other options. | ||
raynpelikoneet
Finland42137 Posts
Only thing that can happen if i do not claim is that i pretty much get insta-lynched if there is a rolecop who cops me. EDIT: You have a fair point in the copycat role. Role-vig is gonna shoot someone anyways, i would accept myself as a mafia shot as it removes the doubt on my role/alignment. | ||
raynpelikoneet
Finland42137 Posts
EDIT: tbh i don´t think i would have ever figured out vayne. wp dude. | ||
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raynpelikoneet
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Whatever i swear might not hold ;D EDIT: I would not even care if i got lynched as you had a KP that could kill mafia. | ||
raynpelikoneet
Finland42137 Posts
If the SK is not however competent, scum lose pretty quick. Look at the game. Town mislynched once before D4. And that was because of VE´s derp. You still had the game "maybe won" if you could kill THE KOSHI!! PM´s can also help mafia, you just need to use them with a different mindset (ie. fishing for powers (see gumshoe, rofl me), figure out SK, push your agenda). | ||
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