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Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 07 2013 15:59 GMT
#563
Because in the town game of him that I read up on, he didn't play jovial at all, Hapa, but rather played confrontational. In the scum game I linked, he was excited and posted as such. If you have meta on him to suggest differently feel free to share, I've linked mine.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 07 2013 16:14 GMT
#572
On March 08 2013 01:06 Vivax wrote:
Artanis I would want you to favour a thrawn over a cheesecake lynch, I would also like to add that I didn't like that you spent more time explaining townreads than reasoning over the scumreads.

You started by posting meta arguments about thrawn and then quoted some stuff about CC and rushed to the conclusion of favouring him over thrawn which doesn't make much sense from my perspective.

Based on what you wrote about your scumreads I would have expected you to favour thrawn over CC also considering that you seem to have put more effort into reading thrawn's meta than CC's, and if you put more effort into something then it means you would have had a stronger suspicion of thrawn beforehand, which you didn't so it looks to me like you just dug up some stuff and then decided to vote CC cause you don't really care who of them gets lynched.

Just based on the investment you made into digging up thrawn's meta it would be more logical for you to favour his lynch from a dissonance PoV.

That said, know I'm still watching you and you are my #1 scumread. I also didn't like how you just unlurked to answer a question but don't push for the lynches when you knew I was in the thread.

Hapa asked me to post reads on everyone. My reads were developing as I looked into people. I spent two hours looking through filters. I put more energy into you and Prome than the others after which I wasn't particularly feeling like doing more but I couldn't just post two town reads and keep it at that. I know I'm town, yet I didn't have a strong scumread on anyone anymore after my read on you updated. I hadn't looked much into Dandel, Thrawn or CC much because I was too busy tunneling you and Prome. I initially had a town read on everyone when I made the meta analysis and Thrawn was the last person I analyzed, so I was more thorough with him but didn't find it convincing, so I went back and gave CC another look.

I unlurked because I woke up. I went to bed before the daypost came up.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 07 2013 16:27 GMT
#577
On March 08 2013 01:25 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2013 01:21 Vivax wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:18 Hapahauli wrote:
Also CC, I really hate "OMG SCUMSLIP" arguments. They're terrible and unreliable.

You seem to think Prome is scum. What other rationale do you have for it?


So is Prom's reasoning that sheeping weak townreads gives strong town vibes.

Artanis I appreciated your last answer frankly I don't think CC is scum I think we should be looking at Dandel, thrawn and Prom today.

Dandel cause I just skimmed the filter and he's been behaving scummy and chaotic regarding jay but actually kept pushing my lynch despite saying that me and jay are dumb and thus scumteam.

His preference of lynch choice is scummy cause it doesn't coincide with what other people thought would be the more likely to be scum, pretty obviously I think it's cause he didn't want to lynch his scumbuddy over me.


Proms comment was a joke, but it calls me a 'town player' which I find weird as fuck.

My vote on Dandel was 100% super serious except the expound part.

Why do you make a post that doesn't mention Dandel at all then vote him without an explanation?
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 07 2013 16:29 GMT
#584
On March 08 2013 01:27 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2013 01:14 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
On March 08 2013 01:06 Vivax wrote:
Artanis I would want you to favour a thrawn over a cheesecake lynch, I would also like to add that I didn't like that you spent more time explaining townreads than reasoning over the scumreads.

You started by posting meta arguments about thrawn and then quoted some stuff about CC and rushed to the conclusion of favouring him over thrawn which doesn't make much sense from my perspective.

Based on what you wrote about your scumreads I would have expected you to favour thrawn over CC also considering that you seem to have put more effort into reading thrawn's meta than CC's, and if you put more effort into something then it means you would have had a stronger suspicion of thrawn beforehand, which you didn't so it looks to me like you just dug up some stuff and then decided to vote CC cause you don't really care who of them gets lynched.

Just based on the investment you made into digging up thrawn's meta it would be more logical for you to favour his lynch from a dissonance PoV.

That said, know I'm still watching you and you are my #1 scumread. I also didn't like how you just unlurked to answer a question but don't push for the lynches when you knew I was in the thread.

Hapa asked me to post reads on everyone. My reads were developing as I looked into people. I spent two hours looking through filters. I put more energy into you and Prome than the others after which I wasn't particularly feeling like doing more but I couldn't just post two town reads and keep it at that. I know I'm town, yet I didn't have a strong scumread on anyone anymore after my read on you updated. I hadn't looked much into Dandel, Thrawn or CC much because I was too busy tunneling you and Prome. I initially had a town read on everyone when I made the meta analysis and Thrawn was the last person I analyzed, so I was more thorough with him but didn't find it convincing, so I went back and gave CC another look.

I unlurked because I woke up. I went to bed before the daypost came up.


What?

After I read the posts up until that point and went through the filters the first time I didn't have anyone marked as scum or scummy, so I went through your filter again.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 07 2013 16:55 GMT
#593
On March 08 2013 01:48 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
What did Artanis do the entirety of D1? Tunnel Vivax. Scum love to do this -- See: DYH (Witchcraft), Snarfs (Nomination). They focus on one person to divert the attention away from their scumbuddy. Morning arrives and he posts this:

So Hapa accuses me of not pushing my reads and you accuse me of tunneling. You two should discuss which one it is.

Show nested quote +
On March 06 2013 17:51 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Morning.

Jay looks awful. It makes little sense that he'd resign this easily while contributing absolutely nothing. Since there's no vigi possible in any of the setups and we can be pretty sure scum won't shoot him when he isn't scum we'd have this question roaming around town until we decide to lynch him. I want to give Jay one last chance to come up with his own reads before anyone hammers him though. The lynch is going very easily, but it could be a bus so eh.

Regarding Vivax:
I still think the post I made on him regarding the FoS thing is strong, and it's still a cause for concern. However, his posting as of late has been good and that can't be overlooked. I'm not willing to lynch him right now after the interactions he's had with Promethelax especially, in which I'd say the latter didn't look as good. He seems suspicious of everyone, is throwing his votes around and commenting on a lot of things. If he's scum, I should be able to find something other than the nugget I had. I haven't yet. Prome's case on him feels weak.

Regarding his case on me:
He keeps stressing the point about me calling out Hapa on his town reads and calling it buddying. I found it suspicious that he was happy to call people townie for such little reason, which presumed me to believe he was trying to gain favour from people. Furthermore, I hadn't even read my role yet so there was little reason for me to pursue scum agenda there. I didn't even make reads on the guys he called green yet, I just saw that post, had read the posts before and thought "what, how can you say that after this little content" after which I posted the comment I did.

Regarding Helvetica's post:
His vote post is so wishy washy that it's obviously just a pressure vote rather than actually suspecting me. His main argument is that I'm noncommital; I'm always noncommital. I'm an honest person in character and find it difficult to overexaggerate things or try to mislead people, so I don't do those things. I push people as strong as my case is, and my case on Vivax rested on the meta argument I provided before. I don't pretend to be more confident then I am. As for the argument that Prome is playing different from his meta: I haven't digged into it yet. You can't expect me to meta read every single player in the game before making statements about them.

Tl;dr I'm not willing to lynch Vivax anymore until I get more evidence that he is scum and I'm good with a jay lynch unless he suddenly improves strongly. I still want to give him a chance to reply though.
## Unvote


Show nested quote +
He really doesn't want to lynch Jay, at all. I can picutre him in the QT going "Dude, I'm buying you time just post shit" and then it all falling apart when Thrawn hammers.

What? I wanted to give him a chance to speak. What is the town agenda behind lynching someone before he gets a chance to retaliate?

Show nested quote +
On March 06 2013 18:01 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
I want to lynch Jay if he doesn't strongly up his game. Prome is my second suspect but I still need to do more research for that which I'm too lazy to do right now but will get to later.


Show nested quote +
"I don't want to lynch Jay" How much would you have bet Jay was writing a case on someone or something, and Artanis was just trying to buy him time? Jay pops in a little "better play" and Artanis goes 'HEY GUYS, NVM DONT VOTE HIM KILL PROM/VIVAX/W.E

Wifom, but it's sexy good looking wifom.

See above.

On March 07 2013 18:52 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 07 2013 09:02 Vivax wrote:
I just read jay's filter it makes me confident in Artanis being scum and Prom actually town. This isn't definite but I'm willing to lynch Artanis over Prom currently.

No mentioning of Artanis whatsoever except for once where he called me scummy for attacking Artanis and then backing off him.

Prom say goodbye to your relationship and be prepared for my ranting about you attacking me in such scummy and dishonest ways if you are indeed town.

##Unvote
##Vote Artanis

I think Vivax is town now.. At this point, people were suspecting Prome a bit but no one was really questioning me. Given Prome's tunneling on Vivax he could easily have gotten away with continued tunneling on Prome, yet he didn't and changed his opinion, albeit on something retarded.

Jay didn't mention me, no. He didn't even answer the question I asked him. Why would a scum master plan include an unanswered question? He also never discussed me because by the time there was actually some suspicion on me not from you, he already went into resignation mode. All he did until then was answer about whatever was the town's main suspect. He has almost no content in his filter about anything else. I've already commented on the rest of your reasons for calling me scum. As to anyone calling me scum for not being super duper convinced about people: Check my meta. I never am. I'm also not a veteran, I've just been around for a long time. That doesn't mean I've played a lot of games.
Regarding the town PM claim thingy; I made sure to check the OP to see if it's in there before I said anything as I didn't want to cheat.

Just checked out Promethelax' meta. Unfortunately it's inconclusive as the last scum game he's played has been a while ago. In this game, he's sheeped my opinions at the start, also commenting on Hapa calling other people town quickly, though he stepped off of it about as quickly as I did. His interactions seem to be suspicious of everyone, but overly so. Vivax indicated that he didn't like both my, your and Jay's posting. Continuously going on about the order of it feels disgenuine. He calls Vivax scum for not actually wanting to get his scumreads lynched despite the fact that he's been hammering on me all game for a 180 when he asked me to lynch you. I've finally decided that I lean town on that; it feels too ballsy and spontaneous for scum. The rest of Prome's filter focuses nearly entirely on Vivax, calling him scum with nigh every post. Fuck, despite that some things feel off in his filter I can't reconcile this idea with Prome being scum. If he is indeed scum and gets Vivax lynched as green, he'd look terrible and definitely not survive two more lynches. He also looks to be genuinely wanting a Vivax lynch.

With Hapa claiming to be the other named VT, he's obviously town but I already felt that way about him. That leaves Dandel Ion, Thrawn, and Mr. Cheesecake . Dandel Ion seems to be a massive troll that likes posting a bunch of oneliners that mean nothing. In his scum game though he was a lot more serious, as was the case in his first scum game. Even in his accusatory posts as town, he's more jovial than as scum. His current game fits his meta as town.

Thrawn has played a mildly active game at best. In his most recent scum game he got caught on day 1. The other scumgame he played he also had a short 8-page filter in a 200 page game. In this town needs guns, he was more active, though still not as much as others. Thrawn has been more active this game. His hammer of Jay felt premature but I don't think it's a scumtell.
Cheesecake's activity has been depressingly low and his filter is awful. He's doing nothing, but it doesn't line up with both his town and scum meta so it's not alignment revealing. In his godfather scum game he played a very pandering game, trying to stay on everyone's good side. The scum game's a few months back so it could be that he's learned from then. Cheesecake's played a poor game so far. What's weird is how he formulated his reads. First he said he wants to lynch Vivax/Jay/Prome with me as a maybe, then he indicates I'm now his main suspect with Promethelax and Vivax also being good candidates. His hammering on Jay could be a bus, and it's the only serious pressure he's given anyone. Also.
Show nested quote +
On March 06 2013 02:13 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
Just to give a scummy little list here I think Hapa, Dr.H, Dandel, Artanis and myself are town. Thrawn kinda null but he's cool atm.
I'll lynch me a Vivax, Prom, or Jay today. I'll throw a dart at a board and see which one I hit.

Show nested quote +
On March 06 2013 13:37 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
I'll be happy with any lynch that is Vivax / Jay / Artanis (maybe?) / Prom. Basically half the thread, which is cool. Jay is the optimal starting point.

Show nested quote +
On March 07 2013 10:29 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
Artanis has a good chance to flip scum imo. I also think prom and vivax are good candidates for today.

What's changed in these times? You've made a full 180 and you haven't said why. You haven't contributed to town other than telling your reads when prompted, you've been a lot less active than you have in your previous games, and your filter is pretty bad. Given I don't see scum elsewhere Cheesecake is my current top suspect. No reasoning for read changes, and is playing a jovial game which contradicts his recent town game.

##Vote: Mr. Cheesecake


What is Artanis doing with this post?

A) Picking on weak players. This would be myself admittedly, Dandel, and somewhat Thrawn. <--- Scum agenda

I only called one person scum in this post and that's you. I even explicitly said I think Dandel matches his town meta.

B) Says I hammered Jay. What?

I think you need to learn some reading comprehension. I said Thrawn hammered Jay.

C) Plays the "I'm not a vet so I'm not right all the time" card.

I also have the luxury of knowing he is voting for town.

Yes, I'm playing that card because people push me into the role of being a vet when I'm not. Read Hapa's post about it, that's why I brought it up.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 07 2013 16:57 GMT
#595
On March 08 2013 01:54 Vivax wrote:
Dandel is actually probably town for something jay said under the assumption that he played scum conservatively not attracting attention to his teammates.

Jay's filter leaves Artanis and thrawn as options.

How does Jay's filter exempt Cheesecake in any way?
On March 05 2013 19:31 jaybrundage wrote:
Meh, don't like that we already have an outed blue already. But whatever, no reason crying over spilled claims. Not sure what I think about the early votes. Its prolly people fooling around OR SCUM TRYING TO GET AN EASY LYNCH o.o
Buuuuut prolly za jokes.

Show nested quote +
On March 05 2013 10:30 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
On March 05 2013 10:28 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
And the problem with claiming that is what? HoP has no powers, mafia has no increased incentive to hit me that they wouldn't normally have. We can strike setup A off the list of possible setups.

You can't throw 3 joke votes down in a game like this. With a scumteam of 2, they can swoop in and force an instant mislynch. In the ensuing chaos it wouldn't be terribly difficult to swing suspicion onto one of the initial voters. However, I don't think any serious townie wouldn't have realized that. At least 1 scum I would imagine has already voted me.

##Vote: Mr. Cheesecake


You really think scum would hammer a random vote like that? That's recipe for getting owned the next day.


Also scum Yamato did this last game. And he got away with it D:

Show nested quote +
On March 05 2013 16:32 Vivax wrote:
It's abut 8:30 AM here and I'm about to move out. I support a jay lynch for the time being until I see something that convinces me otherwise.

##Vote jaybrundage

Best mislynch NA

YOU KNOW THIS AND STILL VOTE ME QQ


This is the only time Jay even mentions him.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 07 2013 16:59 GMT
#597
Yes, and I'm not the one building my case on someone being scum because another scum doesn't mention him.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 07 2013 17:04 GMT
#604
On March 08 2013 02:01 Mr. Cheesecake wrote:
if he's scum I want him to win because his play is brilliantly terrible. Don't lynch Dandel.

BH did you secretly put a jester in this game?
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 07 2013 17:12 GMT
#606
Cheese why did you unvote me if you still think I'm likely scum? Also, why do you think Vivax is scum? You've never explained your reads other than on me just now which you unvoted as soon as I replied to it.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 07 2013 17:17 GMT
#608
Oh right, I just saw the unvote and presumed it.
Still, answer the other questions.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 07 2013 17:21 GMT
#610
Vivax, I'm trying to get something out of my main scumread who isn't saying anything. If that makes me scum then I question your logic.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 07 2013 17:29 GMT
#620
Fuck it WE'LL DO IT LIVE. I'm tired of Vivax yelling at me. And I want my initial read on him to be right.
##unvote
##Vote: Vivax
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 07 2013 17:33 GMT
#629
I'm fairly sure he's hammered guys.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 07 2013 17:33 GMT
#632
There's 7 alive Hapa.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 08 2013 09:05 GMT
#650
Can someone tell me in what world what I did would be a good idea for scum to live through two more lynches? And don't give me wifom crap because there's a very good chance Vivax would get lynched regardless of my vote, and I'd come out looking a lot better than I do now.

The reason I decided to hammer Vivax was because my read on him changed from how he posted since my post saying he was town, but it was not long enough ago to make credible. Prome's post was decent and despite saying I had a town read on Vivax now, the initial idea I had about him being scum in the start of the game still nagged at me in my head. It was also somewhat of an OMGUS since Vivax has been at my throat all game, I will admit. But tell me, how does my action make sense as a scum that actually wants to win?

Also, kill anyone that decides to hammer me early. Even if this defence isn't satisfactory I'd like to at least give out some reads before I die.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 08 2013 09:08 GMT
#651
Also thrawn, your reasons for calling Mr. CC and Dandel Ion town are extremely weak and it makes me suspicious of you. Saying "it's not these guys" implies a degree of certainty for which those things are too easy to fake, especially Dandel's comment. That was just a comment to support fairness in the game which I considered making myself but decided not to. Your post makes me suspicious.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 08 2013 09:27 GMT
#654
On March 08 2013 18:10 thrawn2112 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2013 18:05 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Can someone tell me in what world what I did would be a good idea for scum to live through two more lynches? And don't give me wifom crap because there's a very good chance Vivax would get lynched regardless of my vote, and I'd come out looking a lot better than I do now.

The reason I decided to hammer Vivax was because my read on him changed from how he posted since my post saying he was town, but it was not long enough ago to make credible. Prome's post was decent and despite saying I had a town read on Vivax now, the initial idea I had about him being scum in the start of the game still nagged at me in my head. It was also somewhat of an OMGUS since Vivax has been at my throat all game, I will admit. But tell me, how does my action make sense as a scum that actually wants to win?

Also, kill anyone that decides to hammer me early. Even if this defence isn't satisfactory I'd like to at least give out some reads before I die.


I disagree. There was no way that either hapa or myself would have lynched vivax. And idk why it would have made sense for you to do that as scum. You shouldn't have done it/

If it doesn't make sense for me to do as scum, then think harder goddamnit. It was actually Promethelax' post that convinced me in the end. I still had doubts regarding Vivax but found him likely to be town, then he pushed me some more with a strange post that seemed a bit wishy washy.
Artanis, look at Vivax's interactions with you. Look at the way he has twice now called you his biggest scum read while trying to direct your vote elsewhere. Vivax is scum. It should be more obvious to you than anyone else. Vote with me. Lynch scum. Help town win this game.

He appealed to my emotions hard as fuck. Made me think "fuck, what if he IS scum and he's been playing on my exact thought process all along. What if what I think he's town for is all calculated?" and I thought back to the original point I made about the FoS which sealed the vote.

As for reads, I'll post them later this afternoon. Gotta go to uni in a bit. If you'll all post a link to your latest scumgame and town game it'd make things easier for me as apparently the database isn't always accurate.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 08 2013 09:27 GMT
#655
On March 08 2013 18:11 thrawn2112 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2013 18:08 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also thrawn, your reasons for calling Mr. CC and Dandel Ion town are extremely weak and it makes me suspicious of you. Saying "it's not these guys" implies a degree of certainty for which those things are too easy to fake, especially Dandel's comment. That was just a comment to support fairness in the game which I considered making myself but decided not to. Your post makes me suspicious.


well those aren't the entirety of my reasoning for thinking their town

but whatever, i'm more interested in who you want to lynch

Then explain to me why you think they're town in more words, there's no word limit on your posts you know.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 08 2013 09:55 GMT
#658
On March 08 2013 18:27 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 08 2013 18:11 thrawn2112 wrote:
On March 08 2013 18:08 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also thrawn, your reasons for calling Mr. CC and Dandel Ion town are extremely weak and it makes me suspicious of you. Saying "it's not these guys" implies a degree of certainty for which those things are too easy to fake, especially Dandel's comment. That was just a comment to support fairness in the game which I considered making myself but decided not to. Your post makes me suspicious.


well those aren't the entirety of my reasoning for thinking their town

but whatever, i'm more interested in who you want to lynch

Then explain to me why you think they're town in more words, there's no word limit on your posts you know.

On March 08 2013 18:27 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
If you'll all post a link to your latest scumgame and town game it'd make things easier for me as apparently the database isn't always accurate.
Artanis[Xp]
Profile Blog Joined December 2005
Netherlands12970 Posts
March 08 2013 10:16 GMT
#660
Finger of strong annoyance: Thrawn
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