EPTNewbie Mini Mafia XXXVII - Page 2
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geript
10024 Posts
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geript
10024 Posts
@Mcosta please reread my post. I did not say it was a majority at all, just that it was enough to negate any perceived value of RNG. | ||
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geript
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geript
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My WB vote is just an opening I wanted to try out that got outpaced by RNG. I for one am fine with addition by subtraction as a policy as I feel it is the basis for both the Lynch All Lurkers policy--in that lurkers add little to nothing-- and is the basis of scum hunting--in that they tend to actively try to detract from discussion through inaction, burying and misdirection. | ||
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geript
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## change vote unvote | ||
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On February 11 2013 13:54 warbaby wrote: Since we've both posted plenty, how about we not post for a while? more as trying to get the town as a whole involved rather than have Mcosta posting incessantly as he has been. While I agree on point 3, that warbaby hasn't really partaken in scum hunting, I don't think that this is a good measure of town v scum 6 hours into D1. To be honest, your case feels more like a gag. My concern would moreso be Mocsta. 1. He seems unconcerned as to who to throw towards the vote While some may read it as him aggressively trying to test the town, I read his posts and various switches and tests as just trying to see where he can gain traction. As well, he jumps on the first person having any real traction. 2. He doesn't even read his own posts First, he calls Warbaby's generic opening scummy when it's null at best. Next he tacks on his own important notes, and finally he calls Warbaby's initial post null. 3. He has diarrhea of the keyboard On February 11 2013 09:55 Mocsta wrote: Post consolidation definitely important. No need to hear every thought. But this is no excuse for lurking either. Additionally, he brings ups the post consolidation point which he actively avoids. On February 11 2013 09:52 Mocsta wrote: Did not realise 4 people represented a majority in this game. Why dont you give others a chance to post their own thoughts instead of trying to forcefully influence them before they have spoken. Are you trying for a dictatorship here or something? Here he's accusing me, in effect, of running for mayor all while pushing his RNG agenda heavily. On February 11 2013 11:36 Mocsta wrote: See you guys in 12 hours. On February 11 2013 14:15 Mocsta wrote:\ I thought you said you were going to take a break from posting anyways.... Blames warbaby for coming back to post 2 times after 'taking a break' when Mocsta has posted 8. At best, all this comes off as unintentional bad play. At worst it's an overexcited scum player. I find the latter more believable and either way I feel better about lynching him currently than lynching a lurker. | ||
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geript
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geript
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On February 12 2013 02:21 Sn0_Man wrote:+ Show Spoiler [Geript's big post] + On February 12 2013 01:11 geript wrote: I do think warbaby is town. On points 1 and 2: While this is a newbie game, I don't think that taking his townie claim or referencing 36 as anything other than a null read. Sorry, but I'm not seeing the point you're making in 4 either. As I read: more as trying to get the town as a whole involved rather than have Mcosta posting incessantly as he has been. While I agree on point 3, that warbaby hasn't really partaken in scum hunting, I don't think that this is a good measure of town v scum 6 hours into D1. To be honest, your case feels more like a gag. My concern would moreso be Mocsta. 1. He seems unconcerned as to who to throw towards the vote While some may read it as him aggressively trying to test the town, I read his posts and various switches and tests as just trying to see where he can gain traction. As well, he jumps on the first person having any real traction. 2. He doesn't even read his own posts First, he calls Warbaby's generic opening scummy when it's null at best. Next he tacks on his own important notes, and finally he calls Warbaby's initial post null. 3. He has diarrhea of the keyboard Additionally, he brings ups the post consolidation point which he actively avoids. Here he's accusing me, in effect, of running for mayor all while pushing his RNG agenda heavily. Blames warbaby for coming back to post 2 times after 'taking a break' when Mocsta has posted 8. At best, all this comes off as unintentional bad play. At worst it's an overexcited scum player. I find the latter more believable and either way I feel better about lynching him currently than lynching a lurker. A few things to highlight in the post above: 1) A town read on warbaby. While he gives OK reasons for a null read, I didn't really see any justification for "I do think warbaby is town". 2) A target that is distinctly not "addition by subtraction" based. Mocsta isn't a low-content poster. Sure most of his posts are bleh but at least he is making them. 3) Most of geript's points are based on ad-hominem attacks on mocsta and his style rather than on his play and contributions. I mean, I don't like Mocsta or his style either, but I think this game he has begun making real contributions to town. Rather than outline stuff that is scummy, geript is focusing on more peripheral stuff. First thing to realize is that was a post I had typed up as of Cora's following post on p21. I wanted to reread and edit it after getting up to make sure I was making sense and posting effectively. + Show Spoiler + On February 11 2013 14:46 cDgCorazon wrote: ##Vote: Warbaby Congratulations WB, it's been 5 hours and I already think you are scum. I'm going to break this down into a few points: 1. Your "I'm not Mafia rofl" claim. The biggest problem is that you have claimed town within the first 4 hours. You not only claimed town, but you're basically waving a giant sign that says "HEY LOOK EVERYONE, I'M TOWN". The nature of your claim is ridiculous, almost too much. Examples: You're coming on way too strong with this claim for me to believe it. 2. Continuing to play the victim from the mislynch in NMM 36. Examples: It's another part in trying to associate yourself too hard with being townie. You need to get it through your head that this isn't XXXVI anymore. We're all sorry for the mislynch last game, but you need to come in here and forget about it. It's a whole different game with different players. Stop trying to stay in the past. 3. Your lack of scumhunting. Goes without saying, you've done none of it yet. All the jabs you made at Mocsta have been points that myself and other people have discussed to death already. Bring something new to the table. 4. Trying to change the subject when the pressure is on you. This is the scummiest part. If you are town, you should be trying to prove that your claim is true, and not kill discussion right when it starts to pick up. For these reasons, you are getting my vote for the time being. If you are really town, you should have no trouble proving your innocence. 1. I don't have great reasons that I can point to for warbaby being town. My read is/was that he's just a VT/veterant that was trying to pull an attack his way. As his other posts have made him a more reasonable sounding lynch/mislynch target for which a case could be made against, I think he negated the attack pull. If you want a more concrete case/reasons, then I'm sorry I can't oblige there. 2. I disagree fully. Take for example the following: + Show Spoiler + On February 12 2013 00:52 Mocsta wrote: Guys im going to bed. zarepath, I am not sure if the start of your post was addressed to me? If so, I had mandalor as null read; he said a few things but until he follows through its all NON-alignment indicative. btw, quite a few decent points in that case; I think some are educated assumptions, and others are really contradictory to ideal town play. Will wait and see what wave has to say for himself before proceeding further. Is there any actual content in this post? This post specifically states that he his posting simply for the sake of posting. "A few decent points..." Ok, fine which ones and why; expand the case. "Some educated assumptions..." = "adlkjfa;ldhfaldha;fl. "Others are really contradictory ideal town play..." then point it out. "Will wait and see..." sounds more like bandwagoning or sheeping. Considering his other activity (jumping on warbaby early after my opening attempt and again after following Cora's post) to willfully follow instead of lead, he looks far more like scum than actually and actively dig/hunt for his own ideas or espouse his own concepts. But when it looks like he's been trying to run for mayor, to switch gears into following others lead instead of espousing his own looks suspicious to me. 3. I think there's enough content in this post and the previous to realize that I'm not just making ad homenim attacks. ##vote mocsta @sn0_man What do you think are Mocsta's town contributions? What are the 'scummy things' Mocsta has done that you think I'm avoiding? | ||
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geript
10024 Posts
Second post: + Show Spoiler + On February 11 2013 11:21 WaveofShadow wrote: As far as I'm concerned, early game banter based on taking offense to others cheap shots or picking apart grammar is useless and should just be ignored. I'm fairly sure at this point enough people have declined the RNG vote so the topic should be dropped by everyone. Can the scumhunting begin now? Your other points are valid in that none if his posts have been effective. In context, his third post seems worse to me than anything else as Mocsta asks him to "Lead the way" and he takes a reasonably impassioned LAL stance which is unlikely to draw any attention. You do miss a post re: filter burying of which the highlight is On February 11 2013 11:35 WaveofShadow wrote: (@Mocsta)You talk a lot, and it's not always useful. While he returns to lurking after that, it's a valid point that has been brought up a few times now but started, imo, with Sno's earlier post: On February 11 2013 10:35 Sn0_Man wrote: I have no interest in reading more from Mocsta tonight. I await contributions from the as-yet silent members of our game. His last post is more of the same. While I still don't like Mocsta so far, your case is better and his last post nails it in for me. On February 12 2013 05:31 WaveofShadow wrote: Now as far as I'm concerned, LAL. Glurio basically fitting to his MO from last game rings alarm bells for me much more strongly than a 9-bit or Macheji lynch, I must admit. There are others however, who have not even done the bare minimum in my eyes, namely Sylencia who jump on the warbaby train and disappears, and Sevryn who has contributed nothing worthy of note so far. In my LAL spirit though, until I see something, I'm going to stick with it. Ummm what? So, you're seeing alarm bells and aren't interested in putting pressure on them. Instead you're more interested in deflecting towards anyone else? You have clearly no interest in trying to make a case whatsoever or in doing any analysis. ##change vote waveofshadow | ||
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geript
10024 Posts
1. Geript is familiar with TLmafia board play 2. Geript is familiar with TLmafia newbie players 3. Geript follows usual TLmafia board play While I have read a few games here and skimmed others, where I am used to playing openings are different and people are more liberal with their use of votes (in general) but especially so in early game As for getting on Mocsta for being Mocsta, I am new here and as such am unfamiliar with everyone's general play (in the current game). Where I'm from I'm not one of the better players, I am here to get better. In general because of various gaming history, I have found that group think--where people bounce ideas off of one another--is the analysis method that works best for me to synthesize correct information. Thus, why you are reading jabs without an uppercut follow through. While I do try and shoot from the hip as best I can, I prefer to have time to allow thoughts to ruminate before making a decision. | ||
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geript
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On February 12 2013 05:59 cDgCorazon wrote: He then goes and says that he thinks Warbaby is town (after voting him): Either he is scum trying to defend a townie (if he is scum he would know WB is town or not) to get towncred, defending his scum buddy, or I can't take him seriously. Could you please explain this more to me? I feel like I'm missing something. | ||
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geript
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On February 11 2013 21:22 warbaby wrote:If you're upset that I'm giving up this early, I would consider requesting a replacement. Just let me know if you'd prefer to shit all over someone other than me. Which reads to me as, "Don't look at me." In context, I think it's more of a wanting to catch his breath between arguments. If you want to make a case against Warbaby, then do that. My question to you is why are you guys so interested in having me waste time talking about a town read rather than actually going back and evaluating who is likely scum? On the chainsaw defense: If you read my post on 24: + Show Spoiler + On February 12 2013 01:11 geript wrote: I do think warbaby is town. On points 1 and 2: While this is a newbie game, I don't think that taking his townie claim or referencing 36 as anything other than a null read. Sorry, but I'm not seeing the point you're making in 4 either. As I read: more as trying to get the town as a whole involved rather than have Mcosta posting incessantly as he has been. While I agree on point 3, that warbaby hasn't really partaken in scum hunting, I don't think that this is a good measure of town v scum 6 hours into D1. To be honest, your case feels more like a gag. My concern would moreso be Mocsta. 1. He seems unconcerned as to who to throw towards the vote While some may read it as him aggressively trying to test the town, I read his posts and various switches and tests as just trying to see where he can gain traction. As well, he jumps on the first person having any real traction. 2. He doesn't even read his own posts First, he calls Warbaby's generic opening scummy when it's null at best. Next he tacks on his own important notes, and finally he calls Warbaby's initial post null. 3. He has diarrhea of the keyboard Additionally, he brings ups the post consolidation point which he actively avoids. Here he's accusing me, in effect, of running for mayor all while pushing his RNG agenda heavily. Blames warbaby for coming back to post 2 times after 'taking a break' when Mocsta has posted 8. At best, all this comes off as unintentional bad play. At worst it's an overexcited scum player. I find the latter more believable and either way I feel better about lynching him currently than lynching a lurker. in light of Cora's post on 21 + Show Spoiler + On February 11 2013 14:46 cDgCorazon wrote: ##Vote: Warbaby Congratulations WB, it's been 5 hours and I already think you are scum. I'm going to break this down into a few points: 1. Your "I'm not Mafia rofl" claim. The biggest problem is that you have claimed town within the first 4 hours. You not only claimed town, but you're basically waving a giant sign that says "HEY LOOK EVERYONE, I'M TOWN". The nature of your claim is ridiculous, almost too much. Examples: You're coming on way too strong with this claim for me to believe it. 2. Continuing to play the victim from the mislynch in NMM 36. Examples: It's another part in trying to associate yourself too hard with being townie. You need to get it through your head that this isn't XXXVI anymore. We're all sorry for the mislynch last game, but you need to come in here and forget about it. It's a whole different game with different players. Stop trying to stay in the past. 3. Your lack of scumhunting. Goes without saying, you've done none of it yet. All the jabs you made at Mocsta have been points that myself and other people have discussed to death already. Bring something new to the table. 4. Trying to change the subject when the pressure is on you. This is the scummiest part. If you are town, you should be trying to prove that your claim is true, and not kill discussion right when it starts to pick up. For these reasons, you are getting my vote for the time being. If you are really town, you should have no trouble proving your innocence. Then you'll see that I address his points as he presented them. I didn't claim warbaby as town; I stated I think he's town. There's a big difference between the two. As for attacking you, if you call me saying you have taken a wet watery crap all over your filter attacking you, then I'm guilty. But hey, I'm not the only person who's "attacked" you by commenting on your style. As for Cora's problem with me throwing jabs, he's wrong. I work best as part of group think being able to bounce ideas off of people. I enjoy figuring out the positioning and the setup far more than the finish; plus it's what I'm good at. If you don't like it, then either deal with it (as you do with Mocsta and his 'style') or vote me off the island. back to rereading | ||
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geript
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On February 12 2013 14:53 Mocsta wrote: Evaluating day1 play is scum hunting too in my mind because its about discussng refinement AND is an opportuntiny for those less confident in making cases to chip in and start thinking logically. As long as evaluation doesnt stop pressure from occuring. Thumbs up from me Considering your and Cora's attitudes, I don't think either of you believe that at all. | ||
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On February 12 2013 15:15 WaveofShadow wrote: Care to address this? Sure. I got back to rereading and still thought Cora and Mocsta are getting away with bs and stopped. I haven't gone back and reworked the read so it's staying there. On February 12 2013 15:16 Mocsta wrote: Umm.. how about instead of making witty quips; you expound on what you think is the issue at hand. The attitude you are taking, serves nothing but to incite emotions. Attitude I'm espousing? If you and Cora can't realize how you two have essentially been "My way or the highway" this whole game, then you have no idea how to promote healthy conversation. I'd even go so far as you're not even actually interested in having conversation period; my read of you is that you're more interested in having people reflect back to you what you're already saying in one term or another. IE: I'm happy to have people improve my cases but not anyone else's. But for me to start a case looking for help and feedback is a bad thing, but for you it's peachy keen. That's just a bunch of bung. I'll give you credit for both having an agenda to push, but I'm not sold that it's in the towns favor in the slightest. Quite frankly, I have no interest in playing with either of you again and am far more interested in being replaced than finishing this game out. | ||
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On February 11 2013 18:41 Sylencia wrote: I got up to here on the bus, and spent a bit of time working out the reasoning behind this blue claim so early on: If he's scum, a way to extend his life through the chance he is telling the truth. Problem is the plan is spoiled when he doesn't die on night 1 - since he would be a prime candidate for a kill. If he's actually blue, dumb move unless he plans to Vig shot someone on night 1 and hoping for a 1:1 trade? Alternatively if he's a vet aiming to prolong the life of the town - but even then that's a questionable move. Being the SK with bulletproof wouldn't help too much since he will still end up suffering the same fate as the Vig of being shot over 2 nights. Helps town more than scum. VT taking a bullet for the team is also a possibility here, but I don't understand why such a seed needs to be planted to early on. Basically, I'm leaning towards either scum or vig on warbaby. No more defense, you want that then read my previous posts that you likely ignored. Time to go back on the attack. The main thing I hate about this post is that it makes no sense to me. For warbaby to be soft-claiming a role, and presumably soft-claiming blue, on day 1 makes no sense as a scum. Hard or soft claiming blue will attract undue attention for which one has to either start down the web of lies or backpedal from unnecessarily. While I could see soft claim on blue (as scum) later on when there's actual pressure on instead of the general D1 crap that happens, doing it D1 while under no real pressure is inconceivable to me. Even if you try to factor in the 36 meta where he got lynched after roleclaiming, then that's a pretty weak case as there's literally no value in any claim over trying to defend/deflect first. Even as a panicking player, from warbaby I would expect more inward retreat/turtling or voracious exposition. SK is in the same boat as scum so that make equally little sense. The question then is blue or green for me which is a pretty simple answer: the only thing worse than scum claiming D1 in that situation is blue claiming D1 in that situation. Voila: Warbaby is most likely green. Even if you factor in the Vigilante idea, planning to fire before what ~8 hours into D1; that's unthinkable to me. I play poker aggressively and that's even too gambly for my blood. Additionally, nothing I have read from warbaby's posts leads to an emotional state outside of my standard expectations if he were vanilla. I read frustration far more than panic or desperation and after having read his filter multiple times in context I'm not seeing your guys cases whatsoever. Therefore, when I see people attacking a person that, even if not amazing, is far more likely to be town in my eyes than not, then I see no reason not to defend that person as sometimes you just need someone in your corner rooting for you to be your best. So Cora and Mocsta, why didn't you read this post and come to the same conclusion? Why haven't you attacked Sylencia for bad logic, low count and miminal (if any) content? Rather, Cora hounded warbaby on why Sylencia in specific. Read the thread, look at it in context, pull it apart, reread it. You guys wanted a bone. Fine, ball's back in your court now. I'll try to post more on this tomorrow but will likely be spending time with my nieces instead. | ||
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On February 12 2013 12:51 WaveofShadow wrote: On other news, geript's last post was a thorough defense of himself from Mocsta's assault, yet he has said nothing more regarding his vote on me. The last things he pointed out regarding me were weak affirmations of everything zarepath already pointed out, and his only original point was On February 12 2013 15:53 geript wrote: Sure. I got back to rereading and still thought Cora and Mocsta are getting away with bs and stopped. I haven't gone back and reworked the read so it's staying there. But hey, just for you I went back and reread everything again. So let's cover it then. Your defense was really nothing but fumbling over yourself. Then you admit that your defense was bad. Plus make some worthless comment about Sylencia's RNG voicing. Next you essentially ask, "What do you want me to do to get you to remove your vote from me?" Fluff Random worthless stuff re: Glurio. Then you ask about policy lynches (posting lurker v 0 post lurker). fluff correction Wishwashing on low content v 0 post Agreeing that another person isn't posting anything Then you make your best post + Show Spoiler + On February 12 2013 08:58 WaveofShadow wrote: Honestly glurio, I don't think your case really holds water, I appreciate the analysis though. You talk about how it's the easiest think in the world to point to a low or no-post lurker but you make a case about how only 5 of Sn0's posts are useful? Wouldn't that make him an active lurker? Then you accuse him of WIFOM, and frankly I'm ready to just ignore all WIFOM cases brought up because it really gets us nowhere. More likely in this case to be a factor of bad town than scum (see my case as example). It looks as though his WIFOM was on accident and was really just looking for a way to paint you as scummy. This is null. As for his lurker posts, maybe I'm biased because I agree with him somewhat, but I don't see how bringing up points about low post count lurkers is not contributing. If anything massive wall-of-text posts drawing attention away from important targets and baseless accusations are more likely to be distractions since they are more difficult to follow and require much more analysis. In short, I don't see anything overly scummy about Sn0's play so far, though I appreciate the effort. As this to me seems like a pretty weak case (didn't detect TOO much OMGUS but I guess it's a possibility?) I expect more from you, and preferably something a little more valuable. With your claims that posting about lurkers are useless, will you be lynching an active poster today? But even with your best post you really pick your own thoughts. Most importantly is an odd little line I bolded, "I expect more from you." There's still nothing here that says, "I'm interested in scum hunting." At best, this post reads, "Softball evaded." Then back to the usual, other people aren't posting enough. Then you ask a question that I believe Cora had asked a few times. Next you have what I consider to be an absolutely awful post: On February 12 2013 11:18 WaveofShadow wrote: Problem with this is, warbaby, is you're really just echoing exactly what I and other members have been saying for hours already. You have contributed nothing new to the thread and upon viewing your filter, you jump on whatever bandwagon seems best to you at the time. Zarepath makes a case on me? FoS. (Then you go on to talk about 'false dichotomies' and I don't even know what you were talking about. You either think I'm suspicious or you don't.) LA comes up? Vote 9-bit. Except of course you contradict yourself right after: I want to see a case from you; at the very least something more concrete then following everything everyone else has already laid the groundwork for. Be your own man! Note that I'm pressuring you because I want to see something positive come out of you; I'm inclined to agree with Mocsta's analysis of bad town. Stop focusing on defending yourself because you only make yourself look worse. Notice the trend. Still interested in having everyone else present the case and you evaluate them. Do your own legwork. fluff correction Pressure post to try and move my vote off of you I could go on and continue to summarize why your filter is bad but people should read it themselves | ||
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