EPTOn January 19 2013 01:12 GreYMisT wrote:
iGrok can we have a cool smurf name?
iGrok can we have a cool smurf name?
Though maybe this is a better one?
[T] MTG Mini Mafia II
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Aperture Science
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Though maybe this is a better one? | ||
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On January 29 2013 08:12 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Holy fuck I'm town finally! Okay, this game we WILL WIN IT. We won't derp like last game I'll make sure of that. I'll post the commandments of ThePoster in short time. Follow them and we'll win. Commandments? Ha! I demand to see your manager! | ||
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On January 29 2013 08:17 Clockwork Hydra wrote: Here are my policies to live by this game: blah blah blah ~both Acro and Dandel These lab boys just told me that I should probably stop making these frivolous posts. That gave me an idea: MAKE MORE FRIVOLOUS POSTS! I pay the bills here I can talk in character all damn day. | ||
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On January 29 2013 08:45 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Aperture, will you troll the whole game like this? If I want I could start fucking you up right now, I even have a card that can do it. BinOnFire, you there? Wanna post about something? I'm no psychiatrist, but coming from a bunch of egg heads who wouldn't recognize the thrill of danger if it walked up and snapped their little pink bras, that sounds like projection. | ||
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Scumhunting is in Flavor. Magic Discussion is not. | ||
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On January 29 2013 10:10 BinOnFire wrote: It's an investment for turn 3 - the details are on the last page, if you didn't catch them. What else would you be doing this turn, anyways? I'd be scumhunting. I don't want to draw 1/3 of my deck T1. Anyone running Mill is going to have a field day with the rest of us. (I'm not claiming MILLER - haha, get it?) | ||
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On January 29 2013 10:28 Clockwork Hydra wrote: Why so negative, igrok? I'm not being negative, I'm pointing out rather basic fatal flaws in people's thinking. There's some new players here, not everyone played Coldsnap. 1. Anybody running mill (or any other combo deck) in this setup must be fucking insane. Mill is terrible in general in multiplayer and even worse in this setup (unless it's some kind of infinite combo deal that can mill everybody, but that was explicitly forbidden). You're just wrong. There's a deck that could entirely mill out 2, maybe 3 players T2 or 3 if we each draw 18 cards. Brain Freeze + Mana-Instants/Phyrexian Mana cards. You all put down 10 lands turn 2, play 5 spells each, and he mills 200 cards. which kills 7 players. You want to do that? End the game on turn 2? I thought about playing it but I'd rather play mine because its more fun, hence my whole "lets play fun decks" campaign. 2. As MG stated: you draw a million cards this turn, hold onto your Darksteel Cololssus and your Eldrazi. Next turn you get all the lands in your deck. Turn 3, you just play them giant monsters out of your hand. Who cares about an 8/8 scum creature when there's enough stuff to blow everybody up a thousand times over? Read what I said above. But even if you go ahead and do cast voyage. Who the hell is running 10 BASIC lands when they can pull from ALL the Duals, Shocks, Fetches, Filters, Taps, and Checks? You realize its BASIC LANDS ONLY right? (That last part isn't for you, its for everyone else). Your instant negativity rubs me the wrong way. /Acro You assuming you've got MTG figured out rubs me the wrong way. But that doesn't mean I think you're scum. Odds are you're town, you just didn't think it through. You've gotta realize that in a game of no counters and where everyone shares a turn, busting out 10 lands for everyone is just asking for a storm deck to kill us all. | ||
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On January 29 2013 10:34 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Aperture Science: That "I'd scumhunt" thing seems like so bad. You don't say "Yeah, I'll scumhunt in the future...maybe", you do that shit right now. His early trolling style was null (like it should be), and although he may have a slight point about this strategy (discarding most cards), the way he's pushing it, specially with the "I'd scumhunt" comment is a little suspicious. /G They say great science is built on the shoulders of giants. Not here. At Aperture, we do all our science from scratch, no hand holding. Step aside, REAL SCIENCE coming through. | ||
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On January 29 2013 10:45 BinOnFire wrote: Okay, I have to go in 15 minutes, so here are my thoughts on what I've seen so far: 1) I'm going to cast Minds Aglow, tapping my Island and Forest. With no evidence for a mill deck, I would suggest that everyone voluntarily pay into it so that I can increase my odds of drawing Collective Voyage and thus setting everyone up for T3. 2) Otherwise, default to (DF)TP's plan, and I'd say that iGrok and Marv are the scummiest to me right now, because of iGrok's still-unresolved quip, and Marv's utter lack of thread presence. RockHydra and Stutters are null. So, iGrok, please answer the question. What else would you be casting today? "We're not going to release this stuff until it's good and darn ready, so as long as you keep yourself in top physical form, there will always be a limo waiting for you." | ||
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I'd forgotten about that one. | ||
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Someone can have 10+ Zombies out T1 if you play Mind's Aglow, and can swing with them T2, killing someone. At least one person is running Fatties. Honestly I'd be happier with Fatties than a dozen Zombies. @Zeb, Artanis might not have thought that someone would play mind's aglow for 10 T1. I know he's okay with being able to combo out one player by turn 2, which is what cheerio storm does - unless it draws a dozen extra cards, then it combos everyone. | ||
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I'm not the one going around telling everyone how they should play. I'm explaining various possibilities they need t obe aware of. From how many people asked for help building a deck, its obvious to me that not everyone has extensive mtg experience. Also, as I said above, townies have statistics on their side and thus less reason to be scared. This is a ridiculous statement. Town ALWAYS has statistics on their side. Actually, you've made a lot of ridiculous statements this game. Until I get a better idea of who is town, I'm not following anybody's plan. And unlike you, I can scumhunt without posting every thought that enters my head. God you're irritating. I'm going back to work | ||
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I will be able to post normally again in about 3 days. It's good to finally play a themed game again. -Grey | ||
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On January 30 2013 07:59 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: ApSci: I also want something from you guys, I have no idea who you think is scum or why. You will get that info in a bit. We have an opinion, but posting it is counterproductive at the moment. Yes, I can be obnoxious, arrogant, and hostile. These can be useful. I can also be fun, but you've got to be fun with me. To me, mafia is a game - if you aren't having fun while playing it you're doing it wrong. I'd rather have fun and lose than win by ruining the game for everyone. But if you ruin it for me, I'll do the same right back. I don't play like "Oh herp-dee-derp, let me tell everyone exactly what I feel like at all times." That just seems frivolous to me, and is the leading cause of why people like Gonzaw end up with 30-page filters. If I'm not sure about someone, I'm going to wait. Look at the best town players, they do the exact same thing. Foolishness, GGQ, Radfield - these guys don't talk 24/7. Besides, scumhunting takes content, and in the first 24hrs there is no content. Now that there is a bit (though not a ton), I can look back and actually form opinions. Those of you who've formed opinions already, congratulations! You're good at pulling things out of your ass. I'm willing to give this game a fresh start, and try to have fun. Final bit of MTG advice: Minds Aglow doesn't just affect whoever puts in mana. It makes EVERYONE draw those cards. Same with Collective Voyage. Whoever said "keep the players balanced" had the right idea. 20 Zombies isn't bad when everyone has them. They're bad when one player has them. This isn't a mayor game, lets not turn it into one. | ||
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Now you no longer have to worry about me in your attempts to plan out what everyone will play. | ||
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.,-:;//;:=, | ||
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All the hydras are scum! Everyone with a lowercase j in their name is town! ThePoster is scum because he asks questions and gives orders, and also uses literally 76 metric fuck-tons of "quotation marks"! | ||
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On January 30 2013 09:53 Stutters695 wrote: Or you could attack someone for being scum and play to win? Can't you read? I thought your head was less far up your ass than everyone else's. Oh well. | ||
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On January 30 2013 09:56 Clockwork Hydra wrote: Well good to see you're having "fun". ~dandel I have to have more filter than gonzaw. Apparently this makes you enjoy the game more? | ||
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On January 30 2013 10:15 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Oats, you are around. Cast the damn thing so we can move on with the scum hunt and away from the mtg. I'll bet you stand the most to gain from it. And as he said in nicer terms, you've got a whole lot of bullshit in your filter. | ||
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On January 30 2013 10:19 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: fuck stupid computer ate my post. Just me here but we're looking at Xfire and ApSci, Xfire entered the thread weirdly and hasn't added anything to discussion. ApSci is trolling and has responded to pressure by trolling more and raging about post count instead of being useful to town. He said something like "now there is some content I can scum hunt" and followed it up by yelling and trolling and yelling. p No shit, first thing after my post saying i'd give the game a second chance was a snarky little poke. | ||
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![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/oxDXv5z.jpg) | ||
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On January 30 2013 22:55 SuckMyTopdeck wrote: My/RH's point proven. Carry on. Also my point. | ||
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GreY sent me a message: So my vote for a strategy (and you can quote me on this): My idea is that our goal should be, as town, to make this game as normal as possible. Now aside from the MTG elements, what makes this game different is the way In Which we eliminate people. In this game we don't have the ability to "lynch" scum. The best way remedy this is to allow everyone the ability to utilize their decks. This will give the town more collective power than the scum, and allow us to "lunch" people. I therefore propose we try to avoid crippling blows early, and to save our power for later when it becomes important. I agree with this, and I think most of you do. What I'm worried about is that group hug boosters could destabilize the balance, which is why I favor a small MA or Voyage rather than a two-turn setup into "everyone has 15 lands" and has a 25 card deck remaining. Please stop tapping for join forces. Adding more to it won't help. Here's my analysis of Bin. tl;dr: Moderate Suspicion of Scumminess. Factors: 1). Flip Flopping: Bin changes his mind extremely often. Even within the same post. This means his mind is already made up as to his action, and he's just saying what he can to appear most townie. Class B Tell 2). Schizophrenic: Its really weird how Oats is this extremely hostile personality who apparently knows very little about magic, while MG is cool, calm, and collected. It lets him get away with more things than usual. If I were scum, this would be the perfect cover. Class D Tell 3). Derailing: Bin starts or prolongs many arguments. This ties in with the previous two factors in that he prolongs them well after he has stated that the arguments have been discussed enough. Class C Tell 4). Deck Lies: Death Grasp isn't a win condition unless you can get 20 lands out. Its a survival condition. It also works VERY well with the mafia creature. Which means either he's scum or is lying about his deck, which means he's scum. Class B Tell Yes, this is actually how I hunt. Yes, I do actually have a system of Tell Classes. Class A: Slips. Incontrovertible evidence of scumminess. Class B: Contradictions. Possibility of confused town. Class C: Behaviors. Possible town explanation, depending on player's methods. Class D: Win-mores. Tells which mean nothing unless other tells independently lead to a Scum conclusion. Class E: Nulls. Tells that mean nothing because they can have town or scum agendas. Suspicion Range: [Minor---Lesser---Moderate---Reasonable---Greater---Certain] P.S. I suspect marv is scum just to ruin his streak. | ||
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On January 30 2013 23:41 BinOnFire wrote: Missing some quotes there. Its really weird how Oats is this extremely hostile personality who apparently knows very little about magic, while MG is cool, calm, and collected. Umm ok? Different personalities maybe? Have you actually read any of our previous games. I assume you're oats? Several of MG, and i've never heard of you before this game. Look at the other hydras. They aren't as radically different as you are. Like I said, its only a class D tell, which means nothing until other tells have given a conclusion. | ||
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On January 30 2013 23:53 Aperture Science wrote: Also, I can tell that you didn't even open the analysis. This bumps me up to Reasonable Suspicion. | ||
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On January 31 2013 00:04 BinOnFire wrote: But it isnt fluff. More QQ was inappropriate and uncalled for and I am sorry for that /Oats Lying is also scummy behavior. Don't tell me you're sorry lol. A) I don't believe you and B) I don't care. | ||
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On January 31 2013 00:27 Clockwork Hydra wrote: + Show Spoiler + Seeing as pretty much all the tells come from Oats' behaviour, I have to tentatively disagree. If we tell you that Oats is rather newbie, does that change your verdict in any way? Some things you have down as strong tells I really don't agree with. + Show Spoiler + On January 29 2013 12:48 BinOnFire wrote: Did you not say that only scummy players contribute mana towards Minds Aglow? Then you said that it gives them a chance to look 'townie' Also, yes town can actually have some teeth, but this is also good for scum in the sense that a Vig is good for scum. More often than not, Vig's shoot town. Same with lynches. I would think that scum would want to get enough 'power' to 1 shot people as fast as possible to reduce the number of townies, thats why the card is also good for them /Oats You give them 7 scum points for this, yet I don't see anything except someone being wrong in a weird way. I do agree with you that it is weird that their whole deck idea is supposedly based around getting everybody up to speed fast, yet Oats is apparently totally not on-board with that plan. Did you guys not discuss the deck beforehand? But is this a scumtell? Or just someone not understanding what the deck is about? I personally didn't have Bin down as town yet, mainly because I feel he could not play his deck any other way and he doesn't done much in the scumhunting department, but I don't have a scum read on him for the things you bring up. There's a reason this post is scummy: "Did you not say that only scummy players contribute mana towards Minds Aglow? Then you said that it gives them a chance to look 'townie' Also, yes town can actually have some teeth, but this is also good for scum in the sense that a Vig is good for scum. More often than not, Vig's shoot town. Same with lynches. I would think that scum would want to get enough 'power' to 1 shot people as fast as possible to reduce the number of townies, thats why the card is also good for them /Oats" Translation:
And this is IMMEDIATELY after saying that MA is good. | ||
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On January 31 2013 00:38 BinOnFire wrote: So what do you think about it? And note that my response to the Strongest point, flip-flopping, is cause Im quoting another players words by bolding them Also Aperture, what do you have to say about that? Find me an example, or you've got nothing. And don't quote by bolding ever again, who taught you that awful habit... | ||
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On January 31 2013 00:44 BinOnFire wrote: + Show Spoiler + On January 29 2013 21:14 BinOnFire wrote: Well Crossfire's entrance is similar to marvs, I think this is weird though I only think a few mana total should be used on it because I don't think it is wise to discard so many cards because that's wasteful. And then he never mentions that again, even though I feel that its a good point if a bit vague, which means that he shouldve discussed it. I get generally noobness feel from him, not alignment indicative though On January 29 2013 13:59 BinOnFire wrote: Dude, did you even read my post? I don't mention zombies at all. In fact, I talk in general terms. Stronger everybody = good for town. Of course you dont want to say that you are a selfish bastard. I agree that the more cards you get, and the more mana you can play, the better it is for you. Also better for scum. Town getting stronger is better because scum already start with a big fat 8/8 monster. HOWEVER what I am saying is that its not objectively good for town. There are pro's and con's for playing that card and all you seem to be doing is saying how good it is for town. First one, you say that the bold is a good point. Second one now feels less flippy and more just like a parrot of what I and I think CH were saying earlier. | ||
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On January 31 2013 00:59 Clockwork Hydra wrote: Why the hell were you playing devil's advocate against something that was YOUR play to begin with. Here is the plan, as described by your hydra head: Picking option 1... and then: Now are you saying you were not on board with this plan? Or were you and you were just engaging in a pointless discussion with someone else (me) who was on board with the plan. I wrote it up to noobishness, but it turns out it was intentional play. Sorry, iGrok, you may be onto something. that's not the post i would have used to illustrate that, but yes. | ||
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On January 29 2013 11:56 BinOnFire wrote: Dont fear, it was his first post and he is leading into something, you seem AWFULLY quick to attack everybody. Yes I think that disscussion for Minds Aglow has run its course, but it wasnt all useless. /Oats Then you continued to bring it up. Note the time difference between that post and this one. | ||
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On January 31 2013 01:39 SuckMyTopdeck wrote: Do you think this is likely or possible? If it is, surely it would be blatantly anti-town and no-one would have agreed to it. Someone who's not Bin tell me if I have the wrong end of the stick about this. -still marvelbabe There's no way Artanis would allow a 3-turn clock deck. I asked. | ||
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On January 31 2013 03:58 Acrofales wrote: Alternative scenario is that scum proposed a plan which they thought would give lots of people lots of cards, which they figured they could deal with. Then they saw it would give one person lots of zombies instead. Panic into derp. Not saying this is what happened, but making up cute QT conversations is not very useful. Most likely is that there was no QT convo between MG and Oats on this. Here's how it goes from town: MG: K, I got a plan to win this as town. We play blablabla. Oats: ok, well, I'm not entirely sold on the idea because A, B, C. MG: counterarguments. Oats: well, I'm posting A, B and C in the thread anyway. This convo seems equally unlikely, so they probably never had any convos about it and any cutesy QT convos you invent are a figment of your imagination, no more, no less. However, I agree that the whole play was probably just not thought out at all, moving it back down to not indicative of alignment. I will reread Bin and see what I think. /Acro This is a really good point that I hadn't thought of. | ||
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On January 31 2013 06:38 SuckMyTopdeck wrote: i gots some mtg stuff given that people have been playing stuff: - the removal of mana burn is stupid. i will update my end-of-post quote as required. looking at you igrok. PS PLEASE TELL ME YOUR DECK IS MANABARBS that would be awesome. actually not because free kills for mafia but i would still give you hilarity points. - have ninja decks ever been good or is that just a "for fun" thing? You have no idea how much I wanted Manabarbs. However, that was not allowed -_- | ||
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Re: the non-hydras, Xfire and Nova both feel weird, but there's no way they are both scum. I'm not even sure that either is. I'll do analysis comparing them when I get off of work. | ||
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If he does 2 damage he's scum. If he doesn't, well, I'll have to run analysis tonight. | ||
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On January 31 2013 23:50 Clockwork Hydra wrote: I would value your opinion before the attack phase ends. So far you have said shit about Bin, which has not convinced me he's scum. Other than that, I know very little about what you think about anybody. Please do Xfire and/or Suck. /Acro I already said I'm going to do Xfire and Nova. But it will have to wait until I get home from work. Also, unrelated, GreY is almost back from Italy  | ||
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I've been working 12 hour shifts the last 3 days. Its tax season and everything was due today. If I'd known in advance, I wouldn't have signed up - I got this job a week ago. So yeah, I haven't been as active as I would have liked. I've been trying though, and doing what I can. You guys are so ridiculous. You claim to hunt based on meta, and then completely ignore mine. I always troll the first 24 hours if not more. I always respond poorly to pressure. And I always do a focused analysis of someone. I'm not good at pressuring, although for most of you that's all you are good at. After reading through today's stupid shit, and "randomly" discarding the only two cards in my hand of any value, I'm finding it very difficult to give a shit at all. In case it wasn't obvious, I'm running storm. But its a really weird Storm variant, and I literally can't do anything without the proper cards in my hand. And now I don't have them. Fuck me, right? Cross is scum. Thats pretty obvious. I feel like he doesn't have a very good deck at all, but he claimed scum so... yeah. Bin still feels off. Oats' shit just feels bad, and MG isn't playing like I know he can in a mason circle (which is what a Hydra is). MG in a Mason Circle always makes sure that his fellows know exactly what he is thinking, and makes sure they agree on everything. Check Aperture Mafia: LINK HERE, CLICK IT. Those are my picks, and what I've been up to. I'm extremely tired, a big part of which is that I'm physically exhausted. I'm sorry if I get snappy. I don't have any thoughts on the math behind combat, and I can't do anything with this ridiculous, BULLSHIT hand. | ||
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If you're both scum, he doesn't have to worry about doing 2 damage to you because you won't take a second hit from the mafia beast. By the way, if you have another mind's aglow or another join forces card, I'll put all of my mana into it. | ||
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So ok, I believe you are town. Fuck. | ||
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-GreYMisT | ||
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On February 01 2013 21:05 Clockwork Hydra wrote: Okay. Just wanted to know. I don't know how your deck was supposed to work, but I am going to guess that at the moment it just isn't working? I am honestly more worried about Aperture. He knew he'd have to discard, yet claims it was random (despite having 24 hours, and prior knowledge that he'd have 24 hours, to discard). All his antics about certain decks being ticking timebombs just waiting for the right combo pieces, seem to refer to his own deck. Additionally, both iGrok and Greymist know too much about MTG to make a combo deck that is completely defenseless until they throw down their combo. The whole thing smells of funk, especially when we already suspect him of being scum. iGrok: would I find stuff that could help us kill Xfire if I looked at your hand right now? You would indeed, but in order to use it I need someone else to cast a instant or sorcery that does damage. -GreY | ||
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On February 01 2013 22:18 RockHydra wrote: Could you provide more detail? gonzaw/prom are going to 3x Chain Lightning on Crossfire. What can you do with that? Reverberate | ||
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-GreY | ||
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On February 01 2013 22:30 Acrofales wrote: Lets hear from Stutters first. Both of us are boggling our minds at a bear deck that can't do anything with 2 mana, so we're not quite sure what to expect from Stutters' deck. But if the whole premise is cheap green creatures, we expect some serious pump cards too. /Acro With all of Cross's lands and 1 creature tapped, all we need to do is just attack him with 2 creatures with over 1 power and we have our 1 damage. With all his lands tapped there is virtually nothing he can do to prevent this from occurring. Or is your damage calculation also taking into account the attack phase and his goblin? | ||
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On February 01 2013 22:41 Acrofales wrote: The math is a few pages back: Rock can sac a walker to kill the gobbo. That leaves no blockers Rock attacks with a walker and does 2 damage with a Ninja. Acro attacks with everything and pumps Rootwalla: 11 damage. Prom attacks with his 1/1 and casts 3 Chain Lightnings: 10 damage. Ap: forks a Chain Lightning: 3 damage. Total: 26. We miss 1 damage. If Nova, Stutters and Suck together cannot find a way to do 1 damage I will be very disappointed. Ah alright. Of course it looks like all three are running green, so i guess its too much to hope for a lightening bolt. | ||
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-Grey | ||
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3) What he does has no impact on me. He has no reasons for absence as far as I can tell. I do. 2) I contributed what I could by trying to read and post during, which I wasn't supposed to do, ESPECIALLY not at this time of the year. I then got chewed out about it when my boss found out. I found it weird that everyone was jumping on Deathrite as a scumclaim, but not the mass zombies. The ability was the scumclaim. 3) K, noted. 4) I'm not nuking my braid. 5) Yeah, yeah it is. Like I said I like doing ridiculous combos so until that hits I can't really do much else besides copy things. I've got Fork and Reverberate I think (though this is the only copy in my hand). But this also means if I draw another one we can double a join forces card. | ||
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This is what I get for posting at work | ||
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On February 02 2013 04:06 Clockwork Hydra wrote: wat? You are aware the Zombies are feasting on red flesh? Or what the hell are you trying to say. Why would you copy a join forces card? what the hell is that supposed to accomplish? it's just a waste of mana, as you could just pay for the join forces instead... ~dandel Paying mana is a cost, if he doubles it after the mana is paid it would double the effect without having to pay twice the mana | ||
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On February 02 2013 04:38 Clockwork Hydra wrote: Hrmmm, fairly certain you're wrong (although I don't really want to shit up the thread with this). Here's the relevant ruling on Fork: My understanding is that Minds Aglow has to resolve before the Join Forces triggers, making it happen at resolution. If, for instance, Minds Aglow were countered, people would not have to choose how much to contribute. It doesn't have "as an additional cost to cast Minds Aglow do blablabla", the subsequent mana contribution is part of the resolution, not the casting. Hence this wouldn't work. /Acro I am not familiar with join forces, so I would take your word over mine then | ||
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Clockwork: me and iGrok are going to pick apart the thread when he gets home from work later tonight and we can talk on skype. That being said I have had time to catch up on the events of the thread, and though I dont have much actual things to go on I have found things that I see are weird. The Primary of this was some of stutters interactions with clockwork especially this post: On January 30 2013 09:14 Stutters695 wrote: Agreed with this actually. Why would you give me a free pass for a day? From your position I wouldn't consider me town yet. Why would you give me a free pass instead of questioning me to force more out of me. This post rubs me the wrong way though I cannot say why. The second is that he is obviously noncommittal on everything in the game. Even his "next biggest scumread" (me) is him saying the case on my is good but has problems. Now having null reads is not a scumtell, but he seems to be very noncommittal all game, something that I find is a scumtell. On the magic side of things he also really hasnt had incredibly strong opinions on his development in this game. I am speaking of this post: On February 02 2013 01:09 Stutters695 wrote: Basically I can drop a 2/2 today for some kp at the risk of developing even slower than I already am, or can be creatureless until t4 but help everyone develop. I really piloted this poorly t1 :/ While it might seem the "townie" thing to do, this information doesn't do us any good. We don't know how much we will hurt his development, what the risks are, what the reward is, or how vulnurable he will be. Only he knows this information for sure. The best thing for him to do in this situation would be to commit to something and say "this is the best option". Once again, this is an example of non committal behavior. Please read his filter and study him. beyond the standard policy discussion for his first few posts stutters has yet to actually take a real stance on anything, especially now with crossfire taking a lot of the attention of the day. | ||
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Btw start getting on skype so we can discuss my next game | ||
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On February 02 2013 05:24 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: @Grey: Your buddy seems to think a hydra scum is more likely, and most of us seemed to think that way as well. Is your "suspicion" on Stutters enough to overcome all that? This I don't know why Artanis would allow that kind of card, specially on SCUM. ...HGHHGHGHH ASDFASjidhakjsdhbakjhfbskjhLIDSANHLFKASDNFOKAJSDHLASJNLKASDFASFAS /G I fail to see why we are assuming that Artanis doesn't use anything but pure RNG. The second you start to assume stuff about a setup or host actions in a mafia game is the second you get trapped. | ||
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On February 02 2013 05:30 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: How the fuck should I know? He may have another of those "Syphon Soul" in his hand, thus he can play another Swamp tomorrow, cast it, and survive even longer. Guess what? If he gets ANOTHER Syphon Soul he can SURVIVE EVEN LONGER NICE. REAL FUCKING NICE True, but there is nothing we can do about it until then. I cannot sacrifice a permanent to kill a land even if I wanted to, and thats all that he has on the feild if I am reading the board thread right. I can't do anything more to crossfire with the cards I have. So no, him surviving another turn is not something I can control, and therefore I am focusing on other matters. | ||
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On February 02 2013 05:37 SuckMyTopdeck wrote: I was referring to this: They wanted me to sac braid to kill his goblin -GreY | ||
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On February 02 2013 05:37 Clockwork Hydra wrote: So you knew he'd go and sac his creatures, if i understand this correctly? Yes, go on. ~dandel I knew that I really like my braid of fire | ||
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On February 02 2013 05:41 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Yeah you guys think about that, I have to cool down a little bit I already said what cards I have in my hand. With 5 lands tomorrow I guess I can play a Zeldon Marauders, which will deal 1 damage. Then I play Reckless Abandon (sacrifice Zeldon Marauder), and deal 4 damage. Then I can play Unearth, bring back Zeldon Marauder, and do 1 more damage. If I have the mana, I can tap Grim Lavamancer and do 2 damage. I need 5 mana for all of that, which I'll have because of the lands I got from Bin's land (I think, I also have a Mountain in my hand) So I can do 8 damage next turn (can't attack with anything), and have GL and Zeldon Marauders in play. That's not taking into account which card I draw though (it may be Ball Lightning which may be sweet) /G Hate to admit it, but any damage I can do is dependent on what I draw. I've got nothing atm that can help. Anyway I'll brb for a bit. Please take a look at stutters. If we are not able to kill cross this turn we need to spend the rest of the day playing mafia. -GreY | ||
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I've got about an hour to do an analysis now, so I'm going to do it on Stutters. Then if I have time later before release, I'll check out someone else, have to talk to GreY about this. If I don't have time before release, I'll do the rest of you tomorrow - finally a day I have that is free. As far as our deck goes, I feel like I've revealed everything I need to. I told you the game is on a looong clock. Storm in this game doesn't count opponent's spells because Artanis is a meanie. This means I need to build up to a loooot of mana, and then I can combo, IF I have the right cards. If I'd thought about Voyage I would have included more basic lands  If you'd like to follow along with my analysis, feel free to watch @ THIS LINK RIGHT HERE. | ||
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The numbers don't mean anything to you, but they mean a lot to me. Just because you don't put your gut measurements to paper doesn't make them any more valid than mine. This is a way I can think clearly. Mafia isn't a game of precision, its a game of gut feeling. If my gut tells me "this is worth 7, that is worth -4, that is worth 1", then its the same gut making those calls, and thats what's important. I don't like making judgements until I'm done, but the main thing I picked up from stutters is that every single thing he posts just feels weird. Read it. It just gives a weird feeling. | ||
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4 Shocklands, Molten Primordial, 2 Legion Loyalist, Ogre Slumlord, Crypt Ghast, Simic Manipulator, Realmwright, 2 Gyre Sage, foil Skarrg Goliath, Blind Obedience, Angelic Skirmisher, Foundry Champion, Spark Trooper, Aurelia's Fury, Firemane Avenger, Boros Reckoner, Assemble the Legion, foil and non-foil Consuming Aberration, foil Nightveil Specter, Mind Grind, Mystic Genesis, Biovisionary, Prime Speaker Zegana, Biomass Mutation, Deathpact Angel, High Priest of Penance, Merciless Eviction, Alms Beast, Immortal Servitude, Treasury Thrull, foil and non-foil Signal the Clans, Rubblebelt Raiders, and Glaring Spotlight. :OOOOOO I won an 8-player EDH game where the prize was a Box of GTC. And I won it off of a Scrambleverse that gave me control of 5 commanders and basically everything useful on the field. I don't think I've ever been happier! Ok, I'm gonna go finish up my stutters analysis. ttys | ||
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Conclusions: Greater Suspicion of Scumminess. Factors: 1) Multiple Contradictions, often withing just a couple posts. 2x Class B 2) Soft defenses, particularly about Xfire. Class C 3) Deck Lies. There is no way that a Bears deck can't play with 5 mana. Just no way. Class B BBBC is pretty damning. This is my analysis, GreY's isn't quit finished but you can see most of it. | ||
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He's flopped on Crossfire whenever he was getting heavy pressure without being confirmed scum, and he flopped on Rock when someone else made a case on him Stutters thought he could push. That smells bad. In addition, just read his filter. It just reads really off for some reason. | ||
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"Lazy, yes. Scum, I'm not so sure." "Until it got explained and we're back to zero contribution towards finding scummers." "it'd be what he would say if he was town or scum", " was a decent post that I agreed with a lot of", " it appears he's in it for himself and is hiding something", " I'm not so sure of how scummy that is", "dropping his mana on two creatures worries me", "This feels incredibly different. " So he says a bunch of null statements, and mixed in are "it appears he's in it for himself" and "dropping creatures worries me". When mixed in with all the nulls, that is such a soft poke it's like getting with with cooked spaghetti. | ||
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On February 03 2013 02:08 Clockwork Hydra wrote: Why are you telling us to ignore his defense? You afraid we might disagree with you? /Acro No smartass, but he's had almost a full day to prepare a defense. | ||
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![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/Jgew3Va.jpg) | ||
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-GreY | ||
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If anyone has a hand flush, please use it. | ||
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![[image loading]](http://s.mtgprice.com/sets/Future_Sight/img/Jhoira%20of%20the%20Ghitu.full.jpg) And here's why: Partial Decklist ///////////////////// Scrambleverse Warp World Thieve's Auction Hive Mind Eye of the Storm Teferi's Realm Epic Experiment Counterflux (for the Hive Mind rofl) Redirect Acidic Soil Mana Barbs Hamletback Goliath Telemin Performance Leyline of Punishment Propaganda Chain of Vapor Blood Feud Acquire Reverbrate Infiltrate/Artful Dodge Omniscience Mind Crank Stranglehold Curse of Bloodletting Conjured Currency Worldslayer Taurean Mauler Jace's Archivist Spinerock Knoll | ||
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I have a hive mind and Teferi's Realm, so on my turn I name "Enchantments" - phasing out my Realm and Hive Mind, and then I cast Scrambleverse. I end up with 60 points of damage, and swing to kill both remaining players. gg | ||
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I still think stutters is suspicious, but after looking through his filter I am getting concered about rockhydra. I think one of the 2 of them is the final scum at this time. Rockhydra sets off warning bells for me because he does not seem to really focus on things. Its hard for me to explain, but I get a weird feeling reading his posts. As an example he seems to post things like This alot. He was asked his opinion of me, but never gave it. instead of just ignoring the question or waiting until he had looked more in depth, he didnt really give an answer at all, instead opting to respond to the question simply because it was asked. I would like to know people's opinions on Rockhydra and stutters. Don'tfear you are here and being active. What do you think? | ||
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On February 04 2013 09:31 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: If you think Rock is scum, do you think he and Xfire, as scum would: -Waste mana on T2 to cast Soul Warden, only to have Rock instantly destroy it? -Have Rock actively try to correct Artanis' mistake (that apparently nobody else figured out) and reduce Xfire's HP? Yes or no answer, that's it. With some justification if you want of course. Also what about Nova? /G Yes, though inefficient, I think it is possible. Nova is interesting, He is my 3rd pick for scum though I will admit I have not looked at him as much as I should have. 1 post I remember being weird that was recent is this one here: On February 03 2013 02:55 Nova_Terra wrote: Alright, im here. Sucks that we cant kill xfre today, but in a way im glad that the talk is off dealing damage to him, cause frankly i have nothing to add to that conversation in both conversation and damage ._. i'm quite unsure as to the 2nd scum. I will read through stutters filter as a response to the current case, which i dont find to be damning but does have some valid points, for instance his contradictions. For a hydra scum, i'd be somewhere between aperture and rock. I'll think about it and let you guys know. The weird thing about this post, to me, is that he says he is "Quite" unsure as to the 2nd scum, when he posted an unresolved case on suck, and earlier mentioned me as his second top read. Nothing really happened to change his mind that I can immediately recall, so sudennly becoming null on targets and instead trying to buy time strikes me as odd. What do you think dontfear? | ||
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On February 04 2013 09:32 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Also: You "got a weird feeling" from Stutters' posts as well. Why should we believe this "feeling" of yours has any meaning at all? /G Well at its core mafia is about finding people with another agenda. I "feel" that he has another agenda and is trying to fit in. | ||
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On February 04 2013 09:38 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Grey, I remember you in the last MTG game, you went full throttle against Zealos and wanted to kill him. In this game you just say "Stutters gives me weird feelings" then "Oh, now Rock gives me weird feelings". There's no aggressiveness Filter: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=345422&user=120900 There you were also WAY too chatty about setup and "finding the hidden alliance" and all that shit, here you don't interact with nobody at all unless it's about some off-topic stuff that has nothing to do with the game (or was that iGrok?) You are not actively discussing ways to take advantage of the MTG setup to kill Xfire or kill Stutters/Rock or anything. I think I'm comfortable killing you. Anyways, your "spell copier" can work. I can just use Reckless Abandon against you, and then you should copy it to use it against Xfire to kill him Sounds good? /G That was iGrok, and is xfires health correct? I'd really rather you not use reckless abandon on me, but if its the only way you will use it at all then yes, I will copy it and target crossfire. -GreY | ||
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On February 04 2013 09:41 Stutters695 wrote: Novas most recent posting stood out to me. He mentions he won't do more on the two he's already mentioned but his next dcumread is you, but instead of why, he just doesn't know how to feel about you. you as in AS. again were getting more skirtingthe questions. How do you feel about Nova and Rockhydra stutters? | ||
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On February 04 2013 09:44 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Oh you may be right Well Aperture, better get a creature out soon. Yea thats not going to happen soon | ||
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On February 04 2013 10:23 iGrok wrote: Braid's mana empties when the phase changes. This means I can only use it during the main phase, not the combat phase. But I can use it for anything. On February 04 2013 10:28 iGrok wrote: I'm too lazy to link, but I've been scum in LotR (Where I claimed Balrog) and there's one other one that I don't remember. On February 04 2013 10:30 iGrok wrote: I was town in Experiment II, as Pink2, Caller - Remove Incognito, and pretty much all the other games I've played in. I don't really keep track haha. On February 04 2013 10:33 iGrok wrote: Acro you realize that my posted decklist was totally unrelated to this game now right? On February 04 2013 10:42 iGrok wrote: I played scum the best in LotR. Before I even got my role pm I told Curu I was going to claim Balrog On February 04 2013 10:43 iGrok wrote: Where did you post that? I don't remember seeing it On February 04 2013 10:45 iGrok wrote: Yeah but I got medic protected and ate a vig shot rofl. Plus that game spawned my third favorite role of all time. Woops | ||
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On February 04 2013 11:11 SuckMyTopdeck wrote: iGrok looks pretty scummy, just browsing through his meta. iGrok tends not to do large, 'formalised' cases as town, as far as I can see. It's more shorter posts, interacting with town, being involved; the opposite of here. I came across one large, formal case, and it was in a game where iGrok was godfather. You should read Experiment II then rofl | ||
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On February 04 2013 10:37 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Sorry, but I really want you to focus most of your time in either establishing you are town or hunting the other scum. Okay, thus it's done: I will deal 1 damage to Xfire, and 4+1 damage to a guy (or 2). Aperture will fork my Reckless Abandon onto Xfire, getting him to 0 HP I'll have 3 mana left to do something later, depending on the circumstances. /G Aight, Just let me know | ||
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On February 04 2013 11:24 SuckMyTopdeck wrote: I couldn't work out who you were :p Pink2 | ||
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On February 04 2013 11:48 SuckMyTopdeck wrote: eh, you made a long analysis on someone to say they're town ;p you still think stutters is mafia? Yes. GreY and I both think he's scum. I don't really find Rock scummy, but GreY thinks its Stutters or Rock | ||
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On February 04 2013 12:03 SuckMyTopdeck wrote: so between you, you're calling stutters mafia (or rock) but you haven't bothered to get an opinion on someone else who it's quite possible is mafia yet? what the fuck? isn't that kind of important? I'm deciding whether to analyze him or rock next. I'll do him if you are convinced Stutters is town, but otherwise I'm going to do rock since GreY thinks he's scum. Can you rank these three people for me in order of scumminess?
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On February 05 2013 01:58 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: You are Prome's I just don't want to deal with you anymore. You could be scum you could be not, in different ways. It does make sense that everybody else has a "townie" thing to them, that makes you scum by process of elimination, and a LOT of stuff in your play makes it likely. Then again you are not playing "like scum" in certain manners (being this passive for instance), which make me doubt this. You don't defend yourself against my case so I can figure out exactly what made you act like you did if you were town, and you are not helping in any other way so my read on you basically can't improve. You are not helping me improve my read on you, well then I'm not helping you live... Anyways when I come home I'll reread some other players to see who else we can attack this cycle. Apparently many settled on Nova, which is interesting. /G Do you realize how long Rock's filter is? I can't whip up an analysis overnight (though I did start to try). But even though I've only gone through 1/4 of it, I can already tell that he is town for sure. He's the guy who really pushed the clockwork case among other things, and 99% of what he posts is townie (-1s and -2s). GreY agrees now. Anyways, Xfire is dead. Ding, dong! | ||
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On February 05 2013 06:01 RockHydra wrote: hmmm I disagree with this. You might be right about that it would actually be better to wait, but then why DIDN'T he wait? /zebezt His point is that GreY and I are good at MtG, therefore we would have told Xfire to wait. At least I think thats it | ||
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-GreY | ||
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I hate what my hand has become -_- ~grok | ||
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On February 06 2013 06:01 Nova_Terra wrote: Didnt notice this You should go choke on a large cryptoplasm Perhaps... THE MIMEOPLASM | ||
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Basically, I got like 1/3 through rock's filter and felt enough towniness to convince GreY. | ||
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Kill off suck and stutters, suck because theres a good case on him, and stutters because I still think he's scum and if he is, next turn he''ll be unkillable. | ||
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This is so dumb. It has been an honor, and a privilege. | ||
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On February 07 2013 01:01 SuckMyTopdeck wrote: given we're both deaded this turn, tell me straight. you mafia broski? Nope. ##"Accidentally" drop all cards in my hand to the table, revealing them iGrok reveals: Mountain Mountain Mountain Scalding Tarn Brightstone Ritual 4 lands and brightstone. I forgot GreY played a land this turn. | ||
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I read a lot of people say stutters was a town read, but I didn't really think there were convincing arguments for that. I still think he is on the FBI's Most Wanted list | ||
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On February 07 2013 01:27 SuckMyTopdeck wrote: And you're fairly sure Rock is town, right? Hasn't he gone with the flow in a very similar way to Stutters? This all kinda matters because if we both flip town and CH/DFTP are taking Stutters to be sure town when he isn't, then that really will be throwing away a won game. Rock felt extremely town for the first half of the game. I cannot imagine him being scum. | ||
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On February 07 2013 01:37 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: So you two, what about Nova? /G Nova is the kinda guy that everyone has found scummy but just keeps slipping down the priority list. | ||
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On February 07 2013 01:53 (DontFear)ThePoster wrote: Anyways, when Clock isn't around there seems to be quite civil conversations here lol. So Suck/Aperture, better post your reads/thoughts etc before they get here  I have a feeling both of you will flip town....but meh this still feels like the right choice (at least with what we have, i.e all the attacks already made, or at least when Clock made his initial attack) /G How is it the right choice when you think BOTH of us will flip town? Like, do what you think is right, but what? | ||
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That would have been game this turn. EE for 7, pulling Grapeshot, Grapeshot, Braid, Volcanic, Cascade, Psychic, Mind's Desire. Cast Braid, Grapeshot(3), Grapeshot(4), Psychic, Mind's Desire(6). Pull Mind's Desire, Empty the Warrens, Cunning Wish, Minds Desire, Braid, Psychic, Reverberate. Cast Cunning Wish (put Comet Storm in my hand), Braid, Psychic, Empty the Warrens(10), Mind's Desire(11) Pull Grapeshot, Cunning Wish, Cascade Bluffs, Brightstone Ritual, Grapeshot, Scalding Tarn, Brightstone Ritual, Cunning Wish, Braid of Fire, Empty the Warrens, Mind's Desire Cast Wish, Braid, Brightstone, Brightstone, Grapeshot(16), Empty the Warrens(17). Allow both Brightstones to resolve, generating 38 R mana. Cast Comet Storm from hand targeting all other players, deal 32 damage to each. GG. | ||
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On February 07 2013 03:07 Stutters695 wrote: My hand really was ass after I got those random discards going into t2 That really fucked my shit up. AS were you being honest about your hand or did you have some serious stuff up your sleeve if we didn't kill you? No my hand was shit because I randomly discarded Epic Experiment. Its the engine of my deck, without it this deck is worthless. And the reason i discarded it was because, as I said, I was working 12 hour days and thought I sent in the discards but didn't. So I blame this game loss on RNG and am extremely frustrated. | ||
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I know Artanis is a stickler when it comes to RNG. But there comes a point when as a host, you look at the RNGs and say, "This will completely ruin the game.", and re-roll. I do this all the time in my games. Yes, I had a really good combo deck. But I could do literally nothing except fork and reverberate until then. I traded any capability to defend myself for a game-ending combo (which isn't infinite - unless I allow the psychic spirals to resolve and build my storm count up to 60). I left myself WIDE OPEN to attack all game long. And to get fucked over by an RNG, right after coming home exhausted, really set me off. | ||
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On February 07 2013 03:17 MidnightGladius wrote: lol, I can't believe you were allowed to play an alignment-disregarding finisher in Comet Storm. I have no sympathy for you :3 Oh, so MTG should only cater to people who just want to play big monsters and swing? (Or lots of little ones I guess) | ||
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On February 07 2013 03:18 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Scum shouldn't have won this game. Artanis should've never allowed iGrok's deck because if Artanis actually paid attention and noticed the Collective Voyage things and paid greater attention to Braid of Fire earlier iGrok's deck would have never been in the game. Mafia wise, Town demolished Scum and deserves the victory. Horse-shit. Crossfire claimed scum, and I only died at the end because of momentum. The only person who had me as their #1 scumread was NOBODY. Clock -> Suck Stutters -> Nova DFTP -> no one. Nova -> Stutters | ||
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