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@ Hapa
To be fair, here is my view about the lack of NK. But first, let's assume that jay is scum, which is rather safe at that point.
Given what happened yesterday and last night, jay was doomed. There was no way he could escape his lynch today. The mafia knows it and town knows it as well. So the general activity for today was naturally going to drop, especially if the town feels safe, which happened thanks to the lack of KP.
Marv, if he is town, is not going to change totally the outcome of the game today. Mafia can totally wait to kill him and another guy for the next night. I guess that the KP automatically stacks, so it doesn't even matter if it was intentional or not. This game is not going to play out today, but tomorrow, when we have to find the last scum. And tomorrow, we are going to miss 2 town players, for the time when it really matters.
So, yeah, as a town player, I don't really give a fuck about the lack of KP.
On the other hand, mafia can hope to achieve the following objectives:
- Creating confusing in the town if people take the bait, get town players into spirals of useless WIFOM
- Getting players like Vivax into "Marv, Y U NO DIE ?" mode, stating that marv town meta is to die N1 (lol)
- Allowing the remaining scum to use mafia KP speculation to serve his interest
Who is interested in why there was no KP tonight ? Hapa
Can I respectfully ask you to concede ?
We have another game to play and I go back to France soon, I want this game to end <3
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@ marv
I know it is not totally respectful but for me it is also part of the game. Let's just say that it is psychological warfare ^^
If the remaining scum is effectively among BL and Hapa, I'm just that they already feel defeated. And that's going to be transparent in their posts, whenever they concede or not...
Also you can expect different reactions to this kind of stuff from a town player and a mafia player.
Regarding the night actions, yeah, I may be speculating, but the truth is that I don't really give a fuck.
On the other hand, the fact that Hapa latest post had a big focus on night actions is scummy. And that's basically my point.
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And, if you died last night, I don't think that it would have change my view of this game so much. I would just know for sure your alignment 
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@ marv
Let's assume that jay is 100% going to flip scum for one moment.
In this case, what happened exactly during D1 ? The lynch candidates were Adam and jay and maybe Tunkeg a little. It means that mafia got totally rolled over the first day. I don't see scum Z-Bo or scum grush let that happen without at least trying to create interferences. Grush gave Adam away pretty early. I need to review Z-bo during D1 but I don't remember him pushing my lynch so hard.
Scum BL or scum Munk-E could totally explain this failure of the scumteam right off the start. Because they were not active enough to derail the town. Not to mention the activity of the town, and the fact that Palmar and you are imb4
I'm planning on reading the whole game again when jay flips. I think that we could get good info from D1 only if it was indeed a choice between scum and scum...
And the Munk-E case is damning in my view. There is enough in his filter to justify a lynch on Hapa.
I don't remember what you think of Munk-E. Could you humor me please ?
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lol
You say this and I was just thinking that I would lynch myself for my opening post only, if I was an objective observer.
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wow, I really sound mad at the beginning ^^
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I have grush as town for this post
On December 11 2012 05:44 grush57 wrote:
Also Adam is reminding me of his scum play.
At that point, nobody cared about Adam anymore, and the scumteam (VE and jay) were pushing a lynch on Vivax.
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I really think that the scumteam wanted to push Vivax for their mislynch for D1...
On December 11 2012 10:27 HiroPro wrote:Day 1 Vote Count thrawn2112 (2): Djodref, grush57, wherebugsgo marvellosity (0): VisceraEyeswherebugsgo (1): thrawn2112 debears (1): Adam4167 jaybrundage (4): Clarity_nl, Djodref, Bluelightz, Vivax Adam4167 (1): debears Vivax (2): VisceraEyes, jaybrundageTunkeg (1) marvellosity No one currently set to be lynched. Deadline in 23.5 hours at 01:00 GMT (+00:00).
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And at that moment, Adam was taking some fire from debears and Palmar
jaybrundage was taking a lot of pressure
So, if Z-Bo was scum, it would have been a bad timing to post his case against me, or maybe just to divert the attention...
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I think that they tried to go for Vivax at one point.
Z-Bo was mainly interested in Tunkeg and me. He ignores the other situations. So yeah, I don't think he is scum, given his day 1 play, or he was totally not reading the scumQT.
So far, if we count jay as scum (VE and Adam and him going after Vivax), day 1 actions exonerate Vivax and Grush. BlueLightz really looks town at that point as well.
Munk-E is just like super scummy.
We really have to lynch Hapa first imo, if jay flips scum.
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On December 21 2012 04:31 Hapahauli wrote:Eh. You mind if I just play the demotivated card and not post? Seems like defending myself is literally a waste of time at this point. Show nested quote +On December 20 2012 19:05 thrawn2112 wrote:On December 20 2012 18:23 Hapahauli wrote:On December 20 2012 18:21 thrawn2112 wrote:
well, i'm pretty certain about jay being scum. his lynch has been the talk of the thread almost since right before ve got lynched. so it's not like scum would be able to prevent a jay lynch by withholding kp.
for example, they could just withhold kp last night, knowing jay will get lynched but hoping to wifom the thread into a mislynch later on... as I suspect you are doing. I realize you have respect for my scumplay, but show me one of my games where I attempt something even resembling a WIFOM play. Hell there's no incentive for a WIFOM play. If I was scum, it would be 10000000x more beneficial to shoot marv, or even you, rather than risk all this shit. On December 20 2012 18:30 Hapahauli wrote:
Honestly, it's somewhat insulting that you think I'm capable of doing something that stupid. hmm? Seeing stuff like the above should alert you to how much confirmation bias is involved in all of this.
@ Hapa
Could you read again D1 assuming Jay is going to flip scum and tell me who is likely to be in the team, given what happened during that day ?
Just based on D1 and assuming Jay is going to flip scum, tell me who is scum, ok ?
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No, I don't agree on your view on the lack of KP.
The scumteam certainly didn't forget to send the KP. And they could have done it to make Vivax go crazy about marv.
Honestly, it doesn't really matter, because today is pretty straightforward. It doesn't change anything from my point of view, Jay is scum, and nothing would have changed if one player was missing...
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@ Hapa
I forgot to add something regarding what happened during D1...
Please explain me how BL fits as a member of the scum team during D1.
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On December 21 2012 04:46 Hapahauli wrote:
Riddle me this Djo:
Why do you support my lynch against someone who's openly not giving a shit about the thread (Bluelightz)?
Because you didn't defend me yesterday when I was a great mislynch potential.
Because of Munk-E.
Because of your attitude towards VE fakeclaim and jay during VE lynch.
And because I don't see BlueLightz as part of the scumteam when I go back reading D1, especially if I assume that jay is scum.
And also, I prefer to lynch you before BL, because it's less risky from my point of view.
And I have to lynch you by elimination.
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Because of your attitude towards VE fakeclaim and jay during VE lynch.
On December 18 2012 07:38 Hapahauli wrote:
interesting. I'll have to think about whether it's true or not. If no one counterclaims, I could get behind a Jay lynch. His tunnel on Djo felt really forced all through today.
I'm ready to trust VE and lynch Jay.
On December 18 2012 08:08 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On December 18 2012 08:05 thrawn2112 wrote:
i dont like ve's claim, it seems too easy to pull off Well it is rather risky given he's one counter-claim away from an insta-lynch. I wouldn't dismiss his claim as an outright lie until I see some more from him.
I'm really ready to trust VE, I'm just waiting so I can see what you guys decide
On December 18 2012 08:15 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On December 18 2012 08:11 thrawn2112 wrote:On December 18 2012 08:08 Hapahauli wrote:On December 18 2012 08:05 thrawn2112 wrote:
i dont like ve's claim, it seems too easy to pull off Well it is rather risky given he's one counter-claim away from an insta-lynch. I wouldn't dismiss his claim as an outright lie until I see some more from him. scum already tried to claim vigi This is true. Also Djo brought up the point that VE never attempted to defend him (Djo) the entire day. I'm not sure if that's due to VE being afk or just lurking though.
I really would like to believe this guy
On December 18 2012 09:38 Hapahauli wrote:
I can't figure out a player that I'd feel comfortable switching onto.
Jay's reactions so far don't seem scummy. He's setting himself up to draw alot of attention to himself regardless of how VE flips. Even Z-Bo seems alright.
...and who else? Bluelightz? Seems like a coin-flip.
Ok, look ! jay is pants on head. I don't want to lynch him anymore. He is going to look good when VE is gonna flip (red)
I'm sorry if you are town, but this is how I interpret your posts at that time...
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On December 21 2012 04:53 jaybrundage wrote:
I gots an idea guys what if we lynch hapa or zboson instead of me cause im town :D
The more we are waiting for this Z-Bo case, the more likely you are to flip mafia ^^
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On December 21 2012 05:10 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +I'm sorry if you are town, but this is how I interpret your posts at that time... These aren't reasonable interpretations of my posts. This is you trying to read between the lines and act as if I'm implying a thousand things that I'm not.
In my opinion, you gave VE too much of BOTD.
VE was really scummy, my case against him was good enough to convince that he was scum, I would say.
Not to mention the fact that WBG, Tunkeg and Palmar wanted to lynch him. When a guy like this comes to the thread when he is going to get lynched with a claim without breadcrumbs, with 3 blues already in the graveyard, he is most likely to fakeclaim, regardless of if there is a counter claim or not.
And yeah, wanted to switch and jay makes sense, you could 'confirm' VE as a cop and gain town credit in the operation.
Also, I don't understand how you could come from 'let's switch to jay' to go to 'him going totally nuts about VE is a town trait'
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@ Hapa
This is because I hold your town play in a very high standard. Don't take it wrong, but you are maybe getting mislynched because people are expecting you to play perfectly.
I would expect town Hapa to directly ring to FakeClaim Alert Bell
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On December 21 2012 05:29 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On December 21 2012 05:21 Djodref wrote:@ HapaThis is because I hold your town play in a very high standard. Don't take it wrong, but you are maybe getting mislynched because people are expecting you to play perfectly. I would expect town Hapa to directly ring to FakeClaim Alert Bell Good lord. The "Fake claim alert bell" isn't about "ZOMG HE'S FAKE CLAIMING LYNCH HIM NOWWWW!" It's about being willing to consider the options in a claiming situation. When someone claims cop, you have to consider the options. You can't tunnel lynch him, because not all last-minute cop claims are mafia. Also I'm surprised you draw so much of this advice from the Dandel Ion fake-claim in that newbie game when the situations were completely different. I was on you guys for not considering the claim since Dandel... 1) Claimed town roleblocker (lol) 2) He was the 4th claimed blue in a 13 player game 3) He had scumslipped several times in his filter 4) The entire town didn't even question his claim
1) VE claimed cop and his checks were weird, plus he had no breadcrumbs
2) 4th blue in a 16 players game, Cop being usually take more slots than other roles
3) VE was scummy enough
4) I did question his claim, but I didn't voice my concerns enough
But, yeah, I'm being unfair, you were not the only one.
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Save VE, lynch jay, getting VE confirmed and you town cred. Then, victory could be achieved.
But it didn't happen like so,
VE gets obviously lynched, ask jay to go pants on head, and you try to make him look town for being that obvious.
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EPT
