|
On December 06 2012 12:07 iamperfection wrote:Show nested quote +On December 06 2012 09:07 Promethelax wrote:
we're ~20 pages from beating the longest ever game on tl. It had 180 players.
i have just added this as a win condition for myself so we need a topics to discuss while we twiddle are thumbs waiting for risk.nuke to amaze us tomorrow. 1. Who thinks the need a heal the most and why. (By the way i cant heal myself  ) 2. Look real closely at your role do you think their is a possibility of you getting stronger? (i mainly think i can because i have numbers next to my abilities) 3.Talk about iamperfection in general in how great he his and why you could all be a little better if you were even just 1% more like him. 4. Lavos preparation. Hypothetically we dont lynch scum and have to select a party again does anyone feel in particular that they want to be on the party? (i do because i think i can get stronger and because i want to. discuss
1.) I got hit for 75 damage. I don't necessarily need a heal, there are better targets. However, if I get healed this night, i can heal someone too next night.
2.) No.
4.) Lavos Preparation: Well, if we would want everyone on high HP against Lavos, then healing me would help as it would duplicate this heal for town.
Party: I don't gain anything being in the party, and I don't have any info that the party would benefit from me besides me being town. => I'm VT in regards to the party.
|
So be it then.
first letter of the words:
On November 23 2012 02:56 phagga wrote:
Kush is now on my "never-play-with-him-again"-list.
@CaveJohnson I'm confused, are you Drazerk and your role name is The Chef or is your role name Drazerk?
First letter of the n-th word in the n-th sentence in each paragraph:
On November 23 2012 06:52 phagga wrote:
I went through Syllos filter. I agree that he looks very townie indeed. Before I make a final decision where my vote stands, though, I want to hear from Kita again.
Kita, are you still running with the same team? Or is it possible you'll switch someone out?
Now, I finally need to drive home, it's almost 11pm and I'm still at work. I ought to be home in about 30 minutes, will therefore be online again before deadline if nothing crazy happens.
I am Kino.
|
I just did not want to reveal information unnecessary. It was already incredibly stupid how I revealed my ability.
Also, I think I never said I do not want to claim, I just asked kita why he wants me to claim, and he never answered.
|
About Hopeless:
I looked back through his filter and made notes of all the stuff that stood out in one way or the other. I'd like to shortly discuss a few points:
D1: His play started with an attempt to setup speculate, followed by a lot of one liners, which leaves a negative impression. He does pick it up a bit later on, but generally his D1 play does not look that nice. There is some softdefending of syllo, which could be done as either alignement. What is bothering me a bit is that he is voting Sandroba, stating that Sand is a strong town player, but then admits that he does not have a strong town read on him.
Toads: He votes Toad when everyone wants to lynch Toad, thus avoiding the self-claimed 500 damage that Toad might have taken. There is no real town motivation for this. His explanation why he did it is just really bad, and gets worse if I read it in context and remember where town stood at that point.
He also starts making theories about Toad being Town where there are 2 redchecks on him. He then defends this theorie until toads dies. I was screaming "scum!" for this originally, but in hindsight I don't see how scum would have benefited from such behaviour. He might have derailed the thread a bit, but that's it. I don't really see any other benefit, as he even said himself that Toad needs to be lynched in any case after 2 red checks. He did bring himself into the spotlight with this and was heavily scrutinized, I don't think that he would have wanted that as mafia for practically zero benefit. Also, he is stubborn on the topic, which is under this circumstances rather a town tell than a scum tell.
Downplaying his own play: On D2/D3 he repeatedly laments that he will get mislynched anyway because his play is so scummy. This sounds like he wants to get compassion for his play, which looks inherently scummy. I never really liked that at all.
Recent play: Somewhere around the Toad lynch is play has improved. He looks interested what's going on. he still has content-less one-liners, but at the same time there are posts like this that show his invested in the game in a townie way. He has a nice case on z-boson, followed by a short interaction with Hapa about it that both feel rather genuine.
Especially considering his later game, I no longer see Hope as scum. I am still wary of him for his early play, but I think there are far better lynch candidates than him.
|
About risk.nuke
For him it is pretty much the opposite of Hope. I liked his early play as I explained earlier.
However, for almost a week now he has gone silent. It was pointed out that he has not called a person scum or made a case. I asked him several times for his read on hapa and never got an answer. His recent play is worrying. He promised a defense and a case, and now, less than two hours before deadline, he has not posted it. I therefore assume he is not playing in towns interest, which warrants a lynch.
About goodkarma:
I wanted to update my read on him too, but did not find the time. I will do so in the next cycle, I should have a lot of time on my hand from tomorrow evening on (wife and kids are gone for a week). Since I seem to be the only one still having him marked as scum, i give him the benefit of the doubt until I have been able to go through his filter again.
About the Epoch:
I am happy following the majority again regarding the time we travel to.
##Unvote Lynch: Goodkarma
##Lynch: risk.nuke
##Epoch: Middle Ages
And with this I'm off to bed. See you guys tomorrow.
|
On December 07 2012 07:21 Promethelax wrote:
Phagga: why did you filter dive Hopeless over GK?
I've started with it on Tuesday (ironically shortly before GK asked me to do a case on Hope), so it was something I had been working on for a while already. Back then, I did not see the need yet to question my read on GK.
|
On December 07 2012 12:18 kitaman27 wrote:
Could we get a roleclaim from phagga?
If he really can absorb abilities, it would seem quite imbalanced for town if he just claimed and gained heals/clarity's reset/investigative powers/cave's nuke. He hasn't really shown that he's trying to abuse his role if this is how it works.
I am Kino. I am from 65,000,000 BC. My flavor says that kino is good at stealing and getting to places undetected. Therefore, from all the abilities used on me one night, one is chosen randomly and given to me for usage next night. Unfortunately, I am not told what that ability does, what it's name is, or anything. I am just told that I have a night ability, and that's it.
That is the reason why I worded the following post this way:
On December 03 2012 08:00 phagga wrote:Show nested quote +On December 01 2012 10:25 phagga wrote:
I took 75 damage. Strange. I can only assume it was a scum shot as a town shot would be pretty stupid.
Using my Night Action on Goodkarma.
Because I assumed I would hit GK with 75 damage. If someone however had also used a DT check on me the night I got damaged for 75 HP, it would have been possible that I would use the DT check on GK instead of the damage.
If we are in 65,000,000 BC, I get more information about the ability I can use.
However, as in pretty much every game I play, I am to uninteresting for either Town or Mafia to use their abilities on me, and therefore, I have only been targeted once.
|
On December 07 2012 10:57 goodkarma wrote:
Quick question:
As best I can tell from the spreadsheet, no one has an ability that does 75 damage directly to a target (the closest I can find is 75 indirect damage as effect of Hapa's claimed "flamethrower" ability. So exactly whose ability could phagga have "copied" when he shot me?
That is a pretty good question I've asked myself. I imagine there are two reasons why someone would shoot me:
- Someone wanted to test if I told the truth about my ability or not. This could have been town or scum.
- Someone wanted to deal damage. In this case I assume it was not a town player because that would be incredibly stupid (If he thought I'm town, he damages a town. If he thought I'm scum, he gives me the possibility to shoot back). If it was scum, then here is some WIFOM: If they knew that I was attacking GK, and GK is town, then why would scum not keep up shooting me? This would have doubled the damage they did to town.
All this can be cleared up rather nicely, however: Can the person damaging me for 75 HP please claim?.
|
On December 07 2012 17:26 Hapahauli wrote:
@ Phagga
What's your current stance on GK?
Running out of time. Not sure why people think GK is confirmed town only because he was in the tent, but probably need to reread risks flip info. Have not done reevaluation of my read on GK yet, therefore still think he is scum and risk used the ability on him to make him look townier. More on this later.
|
On December 08 2012 04:25 austinmcc wrote:
Then phagga, who claimed to copy random abilities. This is another ability that we could test, but it seems like ALL the abilities are testable at this point, to some extent. Just right off the bat though, this feels like the weakest of the claims to me because of the variety of roles we have. I'd like to hear more about his copy abilities. If kita uses something on phagga, does phagga copy it despite not having MP? If snb attacked phagga, does phagga have to guess someone's name or not (and if he does, then he not only copies abilities but also has the potential to learn the restrictions of any ability used on him, which feels odd)? If phagga is the secondary or tertiary target of flamethrower, does he still get to copy that, since it wasn't used ON him?
Perhaps I was unclear about that, so let me say it like this: If only one ability is used on me, I get that very ability to use, and none else. The whole "random" thing only comes into play if more than one ability in the same night is used on me. And even than its only random between all abilities that were used on me that one night.
Also, I am always told the targeting requirements. So if I have to guess the rolename correct, i would asume that I am told that, as it is part of the targeting requirement.
When I was excited about CJs ability (what was its name? turducken?), I actually asked greymist beforehand if I would get the ability even if I was only target A. He confirmed. That leads me to believe that I will get any skill as long as I am in some way targeted.
The only skill I am unsure about right now is Flamethrower, since its user would not target me at all. I'll ask GM what it would do if I was only the secondary target. Keep in mind though, that I have to be the target of another ability if I am also supposed to be the secondary (or tertiary) target of flamethrower,
I don't know what you think is not "well thought through" about my claim. If any of you has questions about my claim yet unanswered, ask me, i can ask Greymist if it should indeed be something that I do not already know.
finally, keep in mind that I got to use my night ability only once, and that was a simple damaging ability. If I would get to use a more complex ability, i'd sure to ask questoin. Therefore, comparing me with snb is completely wrong, as he claimed to have an ability of which he had no clue what it would do, but still used it without asking questions.
|
On December 07 2012 21:49 Acrofales wrote:
GK - was in the tent, all scum tried to get him killed (except risk)
could you please elaborate on that? i don't see anything in Toads or Sandros filter that they tried to kill GK, and your spreadsheet does not point to this either.
|
On December 08 2012 06:07 Hapahauli wrote:Show nested quote +On December 08 2012 06:03 phagga wrote:On December 07 2012 21:49 Acrofales wrote:
GK - was in the tent, all scum tried to get him killed (except risk)
could you please elaborate on that? i don't see anything in Toads or Sandros filter that they tried to kill GK, and your spreadsheet does not point to this either. Toad and Sandro no, but both VE and SnB tried pretty hard to kill him. Seems sufficient enough to label GK as town.
VE made a case on him after several other people had made a case on him. That's pretty much the only time he mentions GK. That's hardly "tried pretty hard to kill him", that could as well be a buss. The only one who could qualify for really trying to kill GK is snb, and I agree that this makes GK less likely scum.
On December 08 2012 06:29 austinmcc wrote:
The fact that GK claims to be responsible for otherwise-unclaimed damage on Drazerk, on a cycle where we have unclaimed damage on a dead townie, makes it very unlikely he's the remaining scum.
Ok, so this is what I must have been missing on the whole "GK is almost confirmed town" thing. Thanks.
|
On December 08 2012 04:25 austinmcc wrote:
If phagga is the secondary or tertiary target of flamethrower, does he still get to copy that, since it wasn't used ON him?
Yes, I have a chance to get flamethrower in that situation, GM confirmed it.
|
Ok, i have spent a lot of time now going through GKs stuff and what others talked about him etc. When i see how he built a case on me, how he was misrepresenting my words and actions, I just get pissed again. I just cannot see the town motivation behind his behaviour towards me.
I also finally read the excerpt from the tent QT. I get rather town vibes from that.
I understand that the latest night actions rather speak for a town GK.
I need to sleep over this. I'm really quite confused right now.
|
+ Show Spoiler +On December 08 2012 11:51 austinmcc wrote:Okay. I've taken the time to read over Phagga's filter. This is a bit bass-ackwards, because I'm already looking at him to be the scum in our unclaimed group, and so reading his early game is shaded by that. But what I get from his filter is...that he thinks goodkarma is scum. Sometimes. Most times. For a little while no, then yes again, and now no. Other than that...I pick up a couple things that should be pointed out. (1) Phagga wants scumhunting. He does not want townhunting. + Show Spoiler +On November 21 2012 16:54 phagga wrote:Show nested quote +On November 21 2012 16:35 goodkarma wrote:On November 21 2012 16:12 phagga wrote:
I like Sandroba's plan, his logic is sound. However, I find it dangerous to derive a town read from it, nothing is stopping scum to put up this plan to get themselfes elected.
Why is everyone asking for town reads? I understand that the mechanics are working differently, but everyone just spreading their townreads like the flu will only make it easier for scum to decide who to shoot at night. People like Keirathi and me who have no desire in being elected D1 should not be giving out any townreads, instead we can actually scum hunt in the traditional way and establish ourselfes as town this way. I even think that most candidates should not be throwing out their town reads unless they seem to be a serious candidate (meaning several people have voiced interest in voting that person). The reason we're not doing traditional scumhunting is because we don't have the power to lynch scum. Our time is best used determining who is most likely town, as we're (hopefully) voting for townies as party leader. I've touched on this a few times. Hopefully this is the last time clarification is needed. This game isn't about scumhunting. Rather, it revolves around townhunting. Ok, looks like I need to clarify myself. Townhunting is stupid. Do you know why? Because scum can fake it to no end, since they know who is not scum. Talking about who is townie makes it much easier for scum to blend in, which then makes it much harder for town to choose the right people for their teams. Yes, there may be multiple factions in this game. Still, if we force scum to scumhunt they are more likely to trip as if they can just give their townreads out. So, no, I disagree that this game revolves around townhunting. We find out who is townie by scumhunting, not by townhunting. . It's not saying much, but at least it's a strong stance - hunt scum good. Don't hunt scum bad. Phagga proceeds to spend the game...not doing much scumhunting. Acro picked up on this early, but at least within Phagga's filter I don't see much of him responding to this line of questioning being continued. Show nested quote +On November 22 2012 05:29 phagga wrote:On November 21 2012 21:23 Acrofales wrote:
@syllo and phagga: you advocate a policy of scumhunting, yet are doing no scumhunting. People who seem to be clearly focused on scumhunting so far: clarity and toad. Why are you not in that list?
Syllo at least is giving a running commentary of the game. Phagga just posted the policy of scumhunting and went away.
Phagga, why are you not practicing what you preach? I was busy (2) A list of phagga's scum reads (I'm going to leave out a bunch of links, but there are very few "x is scum" and a tremendous amount of wishywashy "x might be scum, might not be scum, just saying' " posts): Drazerk, GK (but hasn't gone through filter), BioSC (based on someone else's comment it seems) - + Show Spoiler +On November 23 2012 18:05 phagga wrote:
My list with reads on everyone has one person painted in bright red: CaveJohnson. That's were my vote goes for now.
However, my list is not up to date. I will try to go through several filters and update it, so I might make a more definite vote before Kita has to make his prediction.
People who are also red in my list:
- Goodkarma, although I REALLY have to go through his filter now. Have not done that yet.
- BioSC, lurking hardcore although he was very excited pregame, as someone mentioned
Other people I want to look into/know more about:
- Sandroba, I read his filter yesterday. I want to hear more from him and what he says about the current accusations
- Hopeless1der, I have "looks shady, check filter" note on him, but I don't know why anymore. Will clear this up.
##Vote CaveJohnson Then GK definitely, after reading filter. Then GK isn't scum - + Show Spoiler +On November 26 2012 07:27 phagga wrote:
Ok, I've updated my read on GK and I would no longer lynch him. When the D2 lynch came to a close, he asked people to consolidate on either sandroba or Toad. He tried to shut down any discussion that would bring in new candidates. considering that Sandro is confirmed scum and Toad is very very likely scum, I don't see the mafia motivation behind is behaviour.
also, the way he acts D3 seems more pro-town than on the first day. All in all, I put GK on null for the moment. Then GK still not scum, but phagga angry with him - + Show Spoiler +On November 28 2012 20:32 phagga wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2012 06:37 goodkarma wrote:On November 28 2012 06:25 Dienosore wrote:On November 28 2012 06:11 Promethelax wrote:On November 28 2012 06:09 Dienosore wrote:
Fuck, I keep forgetting Oats can't be in it... I remember now that I said TheChronicler earlier, but honestly I'm open to all suggestions. well stop being open to suggestions. Scum must have some influence on this game. Get your butt in gear and make one town read on your own. Unless I hear the majority of people telling me to change my vote, I have chosen TheChronicler based on my town read. Why are you insisting that scum must have some influence? Are you perhaps threatened by the fact that you don't think your viewpoints aren't being heard or agreed on by the general populace? Enough so, that it makes you want to reinforce to the admitted new guy that scum are constantly lurking around, so you can verify to yourself that what you are doing is actually working? You should really stop making your anger at me because I just wont fucking die so obvious. So you're saying you don't trust your own reads, and consider scum (who you've gone to no lengths to spot) are automatically a non-threat? Please play some newbie games after you're done here, so a coach can teach you how to play...As for electing you leader I've been thinking that having a heavily HP-damaged town get a item would make him a strong mafia target, and by electing you we'd lose the item and a "confirmed town." But then I remembered that there are several "confirmed town" 10X more useful than you. It won't be an easy decision for scum to kill you, and I actually would rather have you die than them. To that end anything that could make you a stronger target than someone such as Syllo or Keir is something I'm completely for. ##Unvote
##Vote: DeinoHowever incompetent I think you are, I also have a town read on TC, and am confident that the party you've proposed will succeed. You have some nerve. I have not seen a single case of you this game, your filter is almost completely devoid of any scumhunting, and you go and lecture dieno on how to play? Dieno achieved something in this game that you have not yet done, he has established himself as town. That is already worth a lot for town. You may not agree with his methods of doing it, but he was one of the fastest established townies in this game. But you come in the thread regularly and have nothing better to do than to mock him. Do you think this is creating the kind of town atmosphere we need to win this game? What is the benefit for town of you calling him incompetent, bad and mocking his playstile? I don't see one. Show nested quote +On November 28 2012 08:51 goodkarma wrote:
I'll make a definitive case on you yet today. Just don't lurk too hard in the meantime. Ah, finally you make a case! Show nested quote +On November 28 2012 09:57 goodkarma wrote:
My strongandbig read was in fact in large part due to activity, in addition to the incomplete cases / reads he was bringing up. I was unaware, however, of the severe lack of internet he was experiencing, and will back off of him for now...
In its place I provide a mafia (the game) favorite, a scum suspect shortlist:
1) Iamp - I have a good "gut feel" about this guy I guess you could say. But he still has yet to contribute anything meaningful, which earns him a spot here. Would be willing to give him more time to see if his roleclaim checks out.
2) VE - Shoot him dead. I actually think he might be more likely to be town than scum given his enthusiasm for playing scum. But if an elimination-based approach for finding scum is to work, he has to go. He has not posted enough to make a meaningful read...
3) phagga - Need to reread his filter at some point (but not something I'm focusing on today). He has been pro-town in his contributions, but I can't help but feel he is also "playing it safe" and doing what he can to fly under the radar...
4) Adam - lurker who might need to be shot too.
5) Kita - I'm inclined to believe Marv's read of 3rd party
6) Cave - This guy won't be figured out without getting vigi killed. Shoot first, ask questions later...
7) Z-boson - From my experience with him, he likes to play pretty safe as scum, whereas as town he is rather reckless to the point of being pretty easy to mislynch. He definitely is making his own reads and contributing to thread, but all his reads I would call "safe" ones in that he is targeting almost exclusively lurkers... Null read atm, even after looking into filter.
8) Prox - Tbh I don't know what to do with him. Syllo's input is definitely appreciated, but I don't see him as a strong scum read (closer to null...).
9) Strong - I had a strong scum read based both off meta and on filter. However, with meta differences explained, I'm inclined to give him more of a chance to establish himself as town before coming to conclusions.
10) Toad - Scum
11) Hopeless (maybe) - clearly anti-town, but I'm still not convinced that he's scum. Would even go so far as to say slight town read... Oh noes, you couldn't be arsed to make a case, instead you throw out this worthless list where you throw some dirt around with barely any explanation. Show nested quote +On November 28 2012 10:25 goodkarma wrote:
Correction: I'm a good town player when I don't drink while playing. I'm going to take a break from thread, and play damage control tomorrow. Like I care. If you are too drunk to play, don't play. If you play, I don't care about your state, i will hold you responsible for your actions. This is weird. At this point, phagga has put forth 2 scumreads. (1) GK, which he has retracted. (2) Drazerk, who he didn't push, and hasn't mentioned really at all since initially saying he found Drazerk scummy. phagga is getting on GK's case about creating a good town atmosphere and about a lack of scumhunting, when he's retracted 1/2 his scumhunting and isn't doing anything with the other half Back to GK being scum, along with hopeless1der - + Show Spoiler +On November 29 2012 01:32 phagga wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2012 22:23 strongandbig wrote:
Now, phagga I have a couple of questions for you:
1. As far as I can tell, you changed your mind on your scumread on goodkarma because of the timing of his vote on Sandroba. Could you update that read for us? Given that Sandroba never really responded to Syllo's case or made a real effort to not get himself lynched, I'm hesitant to draw any conclusions from who voted for him when. It's definitely possible that his teammates knew he wasn't going to try very hard, and started bussing him very early. So if you ignore gk's vote on sandro, do you still think he's town or do you want to lynch him again.
2. You said you object to hopeless being in the party. do you think he's scum? What do you think of my stuff on his behavior since the check on him and acro?
3. What is kitaman's alignment and why do you think that?
1. After his behaviour today I'm rather leaning scum on him again. Reason is that his behaviour was rather disruptive imho, and that is rather scum motivated. Also, z-boson made me rethink the whole bussing-situation, and I don't feel as sure about my conclusion from last time anymore. So, leaning scum on GK. Pre-Edit: What also really bothered me was that GK was posting this huge list with 11 people on it. That's half of the remaining player base. The problem is, people are slightly bored in this game, they try too hard to find scum and start to misinterpret situations because of confirmation bias. The want to find scum so hard that they scum where none is. Syllo actually pointed this out a few pages ago, and took this as a reason to take a break IIRC. Looking at GKs list from that point of view shows how counterproductive it is to towns interest. You don't want half of the town chasing the other half of the town. You want people trying to make proper cases of one or two other people, and show how the actions of their suspects fit a mafia agenda (or how they don't). Those cases don't have to be long, but they should have a clear focus and a proper analysis. Then others can discuss it and agree or disagree, which will lead most of the times on a reasonable result. GKs list mainly spreads distrust and is therefore counterproductive. 2. I remember going over Hopeless' filter a few days ago and setting him null on my list. Then Hope came up with this strange theorie about what if Toad flips town, followed by TC saying that Acro and Hope are of opposite alignement. Then he wanted to be part of the party to show that he is town, which was a red flag for me. Since then he is marked as scum. Regarding your post, I like the point about his sentence that he will not bring any last minute shenanigans. I mean, this is what everyone expects, why does he feel he has to announce this? seems like he is missing a townie mindest. The "Bring it, bitches" is interesting because he first takes a defensive stance in his answers to TCs case, but then tries to look aggressive with that last sentence. It does not seem authentic, but I don't think it's alignement indicative. 3. I'm running out of time  I want to go through Kita's filter again, I don't like to just make comments about a person without some facts behind it. I hope to give you answer until the deadline. Which reminds me, I haven't voted yet. BRB with vote. Note that phagga never puts forth "Scummy on GK again" on his own. He's asked what he's thinking about GK after that last post, he responds that he's changed his mind and GK is scummy. BTW, hopeless1der is now scummy too, just out of nowhere He gets called out for not following-up Drazerk read, responds - + Show Spoiler +On November 30 2012 08:14 phagga wrote:Show nested quote +On November 30 2012 08:08 Hapahauli wrote:I mean really, just look at his D2 play: My list with reads on everyone has one person painted in bright red: CaveJohnson. That's were my vote goes for now. My vote is currently on CaveJohnson. Not finished with reading everything. Not feeling sure enough with Toad yet. I can agree to a Sandro lynch. His reluctance to defend himself, the way he talked about his scumreads (only mentioning names, barely any reasoning) and his lurking when under pressure are enough reasons for me to justify a vote. And even then this could be excusable... but he never mentions CaveJohnson as a scumread ever again in his filter. He's scum that forgot about one of his suspicions. In fact, the next time he metnions him, he's cooperative towards him: On November 29 2012 07:38 phagga wrote:
CaveJohnson, I have 600 max HP, if you use me as Target A, I will be able to use this skill next night as well. Your action goes through normally, I get the same skill to use next night. If you trust me to be town, make me Target A instead of Acro. He improved. There was no need push him anymore on D3. Also, i was absent of the thread for most of D2 (which I announced beforehand). Regarding the last post, yes, I was pretty sure at that point that he is at least not scum. However, i was overeager when I wrote that post, I should have gone into this more cautiously, not revealing that much about me. Says risk "sounds like scum," but nothing more - + Show Spoiler +On December 03 2012 17:18 phagga wrote:Show nested quote +On December 03 2012 17:00 risk.nuke wrote:
##Vote strongandbig
Hapas first ability sound like bogus. The second sound like scum. That post sounds like scum. you have posted almost nothing in the last 72 hours, and all you do is trying to judge a player on is claimed abilities. Hapa has posted a lot in the last few hours, why don't you comment on that? Now strongandbig scum based on syllo's tracking - + Show Spoiler +On December 03 2012 20:33 phagga wrote:
@risk.nuke I also still would like to know what you think of hapa.
Regarding SnB: Having two damaging abilities, him visiting Djo who is in the party is damning in any case. However, I am also confident in my scum read on Goodkarma, so I am happy to lynch either of them. For now, my vote stays on GK. Note: First time he's called out snb, really mentioned snb at all recently risk sounds like scum? So...scum, right? Nope. - + Show Spoiler +On December 04 2012 01:33 phagga wrote:z-boson/austin: I noticed that z-boson made several unclear statetements which he had to rectract later. I personally already thought that it was probably only a problem of him being busy and working in haste, which resulted in those errors. Nevertheless, I asked him about this because I wanted to see his reaction. He never replied and got replaced shortly after, which seems to confirm that he was just to busy to formulate properly, and that there is no deeper meaning to this. Austins post on risk.nuke pretty much mirrors my thoughts. I agree with his analysis that risk was playing rather protown D1, but since then his activity has gone down badly. I would like to see more from Austin to get a better picture of his alignemnet, but currently I do not think he is scum. risk.nuke: As said, his early play looks slightly townie, however recently his activity dropped hard. I would really like to hear from him why this is the case. Also, I would like to hear from him what he thinks of Hapa.@Syllo, is risk more active in the mason circle? My scum reads are snb and GK. Regarding hopeless (who I have still marked as scum): I was also looking at a series of posts that discussed Hopeless' night actions and if they add up, but I'm currently unable to find it. If anyone knows where it is, a friendly pointer would be very nice. @Acro for your spreadsheet, I was the one dealing damage to Goodkarma last night. First mention of VE in a while - + Show Spoiler +On December 04 2012 17:29 phagga wrote:
Regarding VE: Being inactive on the verge of a modkill does not really say anything about his alignement. If it turns out that he is just going to post again this circle to not get modkilled, then he is mainly vigi-stuff. If he still wants to participate in this game properly, I expect him to step up his game drastically. risk scum for inactivity, 1:30 til deadline - + Show Spoiler +On December 07 2012 06:29 phagga wrote:
About risk.nuke
For him it is pretty much the opposite of Hope. I liked his early play as I explained earlier.
However, for almost a week now he has gone silent. It was pointed out that he has not called a person scum or made a case. I asked him several times for his read on hapa and never got an answer. His recent play is worrying. He promised a defense and a case, and now, less than two hours before deadline, he has not posted it. I therefore assume he is not playing in towns interest, which warrants a lynch.
About goodkarma:
I wanted to update my read on him too, but did not find the time. I will do so in the next cycle, I should have a lot of time on my hand from tomorrow evening on (wife and kids are gone for a week). Since I seem to be the only one still having him marked as scum, i give him the benefit of the doubt until I have been able to go through his filter again.
About the Epoch:
I am happy following the majority again regarding the time we travel to.
##Unvote Lynch: Goodkarma
##Lynch: risk.nuke
##Epoch: Middle Ages
And with this I'm off to bed. See you guys tomorrow. (3) His votes on confirmed scum Sandroba - + Show Spoiler +On November 25 2012 07:53 phagga wrote:
Not finished with reading everything. Not feeling sure enough with Toad yet. I can agree to a Sandro lynch. His reluctance to defend himself, the way he talked about his scumreads (only mentioning names, barely any reasoning) and his lurking when under pressure are enough reasons for me to justify a vote.
##Unvote
##Vote Sandroba
***Quote tag messing up and can't seem to fix. Rest is editorializing by me***
Right before deadline. Hasn't read, sidesteps talking about toad. Is okay lynching Sandroba, but hasn't mentioned Sandroba as scum before. - + Show Spoiler +On November 29 2012 09:17 phagga wrote:
##Vote Toadesstern
He has mentioned toad ONCE I believe at this point. Not as scum. I know you guys had like...matching checks on him, but at this point, phagga just hasn't talked about toad AT ALL, hasn't interacted, hasn't read him, doesn't touch him
***Quote tag messing up and can't seem to fix. Rest is editorializing by me***
He has mentioned toad ONCE I believe at this point. Not as scum. I know you guys had like...matching checks on him, but at this point, phagga just hasn't talked about toad AT ALL, hasn't interacted, hasn't read him, doesn't touch him Did not vote snb risk.nuke - + Show Spoiler +On December 07 2012 06:29 phagga wrote:
About risk.nuke
For him it is pretty much the opposite of Hope. I liked his early play as I explained earlier.
However, for almost a week now he has gone silent. It was pointed out that he has not called a person scum or made a case. I asked him several times for his read on hapa and never got an answer. His recent play is worrying. He promised a defense and a case, and now, less than two hours before deadline, he has not posted it. I therefore assume he is not playing in towns interest, which warrants a lynch.
About goodkarma:
I wanted to update my read on him too, but did not find the time. I will do so in the next cycle, I should have a lot of time on my hand from tomorrow evening on (wife and kids are gone for a week). Since I seem to be the only one still having him marked as scum, i give him the benefit of the doubt until I have been able to go through his filter again.
About the Epoch:
I am happy following the majority again regarding the time we travel to.
##Unvote Lynch: Goodkarma
##Lynch: risk.nuke
##Epoch: Middle Ages
And with this I'm off to bed. See you guys tomorrow.
My overall takeaway is that for someone who D1 was guns blazing "Don't townhunt, gotta scumhunt," phagga has not made good on that. In some odd ways. (1) His scumreads pop in and out of nowhere. Drazerk was scum, then he wasn't. No update, no nothing, and more or less no discussion of Drazerk for the rest of the game. GK is scum, not scum, scum. Never gives a scumread on Sandroba, just agrees and drops a vote. Never gives a scumread OR MENTIONS Toad, drops the vote. Never drops a scumread on snb. Drops a scumread on risk during the last day, prior to that one of phagga's only interactions with risk was to say a post of risk's sounded scummy but risk was town. Which is fine, that happens. But it's curious when it's basically the limit of your interaction with confirmed scum. Again, I'm coming for a point of thinking he's the scum in the group, but the malleability of his scumreads lets him do whatever he wants. Add onto that that he never seems to volunteer a read. There's always a request, and he notes that some read has changed, without ever having thought he might want to note that before needing to be asked. (2) His votes on scum as a whole lack reasoning and are almost always 11th hour. Sandroba vote is 7 minutes before deadline, and he says he hasn't read everything, seems to just be jumping on board. Toad vote is just a toad vote, nothing more, but then he backs off later in the day, worried about a pardoner. No vote on snb risk.nuke vote is 1:30 until deadline, after he was townie on risk earlier I secretly like the pardoner stuff, because I loves me some paranoia, but...his votes ALWAYS limp in on scum, bar Toad who was checked. They limp in right at deadline. There's rarely a mention of the suspect before the vote, and in risk's case, the mention was that he "sounded like scum" but was townie. So, for now : ##vote phaggaWe have unexplained damage. He fits the do-er of that damage better than others for me. We have very little scumhunting. We have very odd interactions with confirmed scum, and...curious votes.
One thing I want to bring up though is the waiting is odd. He posts on GK all day every day, and waits to vote scum until last-minute. But he doesn't...he's not trying to save them much. Apart from risk, he's not going around calling the others townie (He had a weird spat with someone who called snb scum, saying we didn't know snb scum, but ... that whole exchange was funky and I left it out). That's the one thing I'm puzzled by, is why is he waiting until last minute but not trying to save these guys. He can't be waiting on anyone else, so I don't get the delay and the odd votes. THAT Oatsmaster, is more like a wall of text.
Regarding GK: I got my doubts yesterday of him being scum because several people suddenly saw him as strong town. I tried to figure out why, and ended up confused. I never said I no longer think he is scum. My problem additionally was that I barely have any other scum read. I already said how I think about hope and you earlier. so I was sitting there, looking at the list of the remaining players and thought: "if GK is not scum, who is it then?". I did not find an answer.
Regarding Toad: That guy had 2 red checks on him for over 4 real time days. Why would I want to interact with him? Why is it wrong to vote him without further reasoning when HE HAS 2 RED CHECKS ON HIM!?
Regarding Sandro: I said I wanted to look into him, it was on the weekends. I wrote about my weekends, I'm sure you read that since you claim to have read my filter. I really have no interest to go back to that topic again.
Regarding Risk: I said his early game looked rather townie, but in the same sentence voiced my concerns that his activity dropped off. I never called him town.
Add onto that that he never seems to volunteer a read. There's always a request, and he notes that some read has changed, without ever having thought he might want to note that before needing to be asked.
This is just plain wrong. Update on VE, here another update, Here why I thought prom or hope should not be on the party. There are others, you may find them in my filter if you care.
|
On December 07 2012 10:40 goodkarma wrote:
For what it's worth, I helped with CJ's demise too...
How much damage did you do to CJ?
|
since I have obviously been doing a bad job of putting all my relevant thoughts into the thread, let's try this differently.
I got a bunch of people where I am pretty sure that they are town or playing in towns interest so far (Acro). Here are the ones that are left over:
- Goodkarma
- Hopeless1der
- Austinmcc
- Adam
- Hapa (From all listed here, he is the least probably scum)
Now, the point is, if GK is not scum (which I am slowly starting to think because of his night actions and behaviour around them, as well as the convo in the tent), then who else is? Hapa probably not, on Hope I just made an update that shows that I doubt he is scum. That leaves Adam and Austin. These are therefore the guys I am concentrating on next, so you will get more what I think of them before the deadline.
|
On December 08 2012 22:03 syllogism wrote:
Only goodkarma and risk claimed and goodkarma didn't claim his name. Even if he had, SnB could only target one person per cycle and there were higher priority targets
he did claim his name in the tent:
85
goodkarma
11-28-2012
02:53 PM ET (US)
I've got stuff to do now, but to quickly address your questions:
I am a minor character by the name of Fiona. I have forest critters that gather around my target (up to three stacks) and attack on my command...
If they were to be bussed, I wouldn't know what to expect the outcome to be. I was thinking at the time that it meant 150 damage to my target, and just assumed the damage would be transferred. But now that I think about it, it could be that the damage could not be done to anyone other than CJ.
Also:
If you doubt I'm town, tell me who to shoot, and in three turns you'll have confirmation (two if we're talking about suboptimal dps...). That's really the only thing I can do for you here, other than asking you to go through my filter and compare it to my other games...
|
On December 08 2012 23:04 kitaman27 wrote:
Phagga, could you walk me through why you never tried to abuse this role, through a claim?
With a parity check, we could have cleared 4 players instead of two. You could have asked to be targeted by S&B to confirm his role. You could have increased our healing output by having someone heal yourself and then healing someone else the next cycle.
What was your thought process on how you should use your role?
When I got my role I asked myself if I should claim immediatly or not. However, the problem is that scum could easily mess with me as long as we are not in 65,000,000 BC. Imagine that someone is healing me. At the same time, I get damaged by scum. Now I have no clue which ability I am going to use next night, and it gets worthless as I risk either healing scum or damaging town. And even this only works if town actually believes my claim.
Also, I guess you are aware what people normally ask for parity checks on themself, right? (In case you don't: godfathers).
Also, of what use is it if I am being healed when already at full health? It makes no difference long term. Once I was damaged I did indeed propose that I get healed, but obviously I don't have enough town cred.
Generally, most skills would be a waste if used on me only to copy them. A heal makes sense when I am damaged (which I was not until N4 or 5), a DT check once would work too. Damage is a waste as town, Roleblock is a waste. This is one of the reason why I was so excited about Turducken: A spell that would Target me just for comparison, and that I would get to use the next night. I could immediatly double the damage (which was potentially huge) with no downside.
So, yeah, I decided to not claim D1 and see how it works out. Unfortunately I was never targeted with anything except for Oats 75 damage, so i barely got to use my ability.
|
On December 08 2012 23:30 austinmcc wrote:
Seems more likely that the Kino thing is a fakeclaim. All we have is claimed flavor and a crumb of Kino.
Lots of night actions unaccounted for, which makes me think that both golrm fits better AND could.have some base attack + the copycat bit.
If.nothing else, kita's questions are good. How do you haves copy role and not use it? It looks more like he's sat back, avoided any situation that could test him or force him to use pro-towj abilities.
Scum would barely use their abilities on me if I was scum only to copy them, which would mean that a lot more town abilities would have had to be used on me. Noone has claimed that, though, so your theorie is off.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
