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On December 08 2012 23:19 Promethelax wrote:
nope. but you feel most wrong.
what rolename do you think makes most sense for Phagga and why?
Just went and looked at Kino and golem.
The ability fits golem.better. he attacks the party with whatever element was used on him last, and only the last one. Kino didn't have boatloads on him, but the flavor that phagga claimed fits kinos flavor.
Seems more likely that the Kino thing is a fakeclaim. All we have is claimed flavor and a crumb of Kino.
Lots of night actions unaccounted for, which makes me think that both golrm fits better AND could.have some base attack + the copycat bit.
If.nothing else, kita's questions are good. How do you haves copy role and not use it? It looks more like he's sat back, avoided any situation that could test him or force him to use pro-towj abilities.
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so why did he claim at CJ to the whole thread?
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Actually austin, if Golem is his real role name, then he is definately scum.
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On December 08 2012 23:33 Promethelax wrote:
so why did he claim at CJ to the whole thread?
Easiest answer is he didn't think it through, that we could then force him.to use protown night actions.
I mean, we seem to have ALL missed out on that, nobody picked up that we could try and use the copying to our advantage.
It's also not a giant advantage now that I think about it. Town healer heals him Nx. He has a heal for Nx+1, as does the healer. End result, 1 heal on him, 2 heals on town. Which is BETTER for him that just town healer healing on Nx and x+1. It actually works out well for him almost no matter what,.because the town actor "wastes" a protown action one night. I'm on phone, but if the cycle he claimed was one where scum tried to take out someone highly visible (syllo, dinosaurs) then he could have been attempting to get heals away from.them for that night
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On December 08 2012 23:41 Oatsmaster wrote:
Actually austin, if Golem is his real role name, then he is definately scum.
The ability sounds almost exactly like what the golems do in game. It does fit.
Prom did you go look the claimed roles up for their in game actions? It's not 100%, but its worth considering along with the other stuff.
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I can't make any sense of some of these night actions/claimed damages unless more than one people is lying, there are some hidden mechanics or there have been a bunch of mod errors. If austinmcc isn't lying about shielding hapa/keirathi, when and how did they take 75 extra damage?
Why did me and Prom take 420 shared damage (420-250 = 170, which is a strange number)? Why did it take greymist multiple attempts to get the number right?
Why did Prom take 25 damage instead of 75 when I shot him?
Why did mafia shoot hapa on n2 for 100 (or 175?) damage?
Why/how did I take 50 damage on n1, since Prom was seed shielding me? Did mafia use 50 factional KP for fun or was Kita's shot on Drazerk randomly reflected onto me?
How did Clarity take ~400 damage (if he started with 900 hp) last night even though it should have been less than that due to risk being dead? Is it because we were in a different time period?
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Phagga having an ability that targets two players (players A and B) and makes him use a random ability that player A has on player B could explain some of the strange things, maybe
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On December 08 2012 23:04 kitaman27 wrote:
Phagga, could you walk me through why you never tried to abuse this role, through a claim?
With a parity check, we could have cleared 4 players instead of two. You could have asked to be targeted by S&B to confirm his role. You could have increased our healing output by having someone heal yourself and then healing someone else the next cycle.
What was your thought process on how you should use your role?
When I got my role I asked myself if I should claim immediatly or not. However, the problem is that scum could easily mess with me as long as we are not in 65,000,000 BC. Imagine that someone is healing me. At the same time, I get damaged by scum. Now I have no clue which ability I am going to use next night, and it gets worthless as I risk either healing scum or damaging town. And even this only works if town actually believes my claim.
Also, I guess you are aware what people normally ask for parity checks on themself, right? (In case you don't: godfathers).
Also, of what use is it if I am being healed when already at full health? It makes no difference long term. Once I was damaged I did indeed propose that I get healed, but obviously I don't have enough town cred.
Generally, most skills would be a waste if used on me only to copy them. A heal makes sense when I am damaged (which I was not until N4 or 5), a DT check once would work too. Damage is a waste as town, Roleblock is a waste. This is one of the reason why I was so excited about Turducken: A spell that would Target me just for comparison, and that I would get to use the next night. I could immediatly double the damage (which was potentially huge) with no downside.
So, yeah, I decided to not claim D1 and see how it works out. Unfortunately I was never targeted with anything except for Oats 75 damage, so i barely got to use my ability.
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Trying to figure out all the night actions is just doing my head in. Instead I decided to reread day 1:
What I find telling is that Phagga seems to be trying to decide if hes going to vote either Syllo or Kita. If they're both town, which seems most probable at this point, then why would a scum Phagga hear each one out, vote for Kita first, then switch to Syllo after Kita goes AWOL and doesn't answer his questions. That seems like a lot of unnecessary effort to offload your vote because your scum candidate (sandroba) bombed.
In contrast, Z-BosoN was pushing Sandroba's candidacy with some flimsy reasoning (which I've already touched on previously). He didn't even vote sandroba until an hour before the deadline, that strikes me as supremely odd for someone that apparently never considered anyone else for the entirety of D1 (at least in the thread).
I reaffirm, Phagga is town. Austinmcc is scum.
I'm going to bed now, I'd really like to wake up to us squaring off with Lavos.
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On December 08 2012 23:30 austinmcc wrote:
Seems more likely that the Kino thing is a fakeclaim. All we have is claimed flavor and a crumb of Kino.
Lots of night actions unaccounted for, which makes me think that both golrm fits better AND could.have some base attack + the copycat bit.
If.nothing else, kita's questions are good. How do you haves copy role and not use it? It looks more like he's sat back, avoided any situation that could test him or force him to use pro-towj abilities.
Scum would barely use their abilities on me if I was scum only to copy them, which would mean that a lot more town abilities would have had to be used on me. Noone has claimed that, though, so your theorie is off.
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On December 09 2012 00:18 syllogism wrote:
Phagga having an ability that targets two players (players A and B) and makes him use a random ability that player A has on player B could explain some of the strange things, maybe
Yeah right and perhaps you know your hidden modifier is actually positive although you are mafia and you therefore have some sort of godfather-role for party events, and are actually the last scum. (no, I do not mean that serious).
Speculating about how my ability could actually work because you do not want to trust me/think I am lying is the worst way to try to find scum, just saying. You can make up any fantasy ability that fits the holes with the night actions, and assign it to me, but that does not make it real.
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On December 09 2012 01:28 phagga wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2012 00:18 syllogism wrote:
Phagga having an ability that targets two players (players A and B) and makes him use a random ability that player A has on player B could explain some of the strange things, maybe Yeah right and perhaps you know your hidden modifier is actually positive although you are mafia and you therefore have some sort of godfather-role for party events, and are actually the last scum. (no, I do not mean that serious). Speculating about how my ability could actually work because you do not want to trust me/think I am lying is the worst way to try to find scum, just saying. You can make up any fantasy ability that fits the holes with the night actions, and assign it to me, but that does not make it real.
My vote is on austin and it's unlikely to move. I'm just trying to make sense of the actions and game purely based on the claims. I would like to solve the game based on claimed night actions alone, but it doesn't seem possible even though it should be.
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On December 08 2012 23:47 austinmcc wrote:Show nested quote +On December 08 2012 23:33 Promethelax wrote:
so why did he claim at CJ to the whole thread? Easiest answer is he didn't think it through, that we could then force him.to use protown night actions. I mean, we seem to have ALL missed out on that, nobody picked up that we could try and use the copying to our advantage. It's also not a giant advantage now that I think about it. Town healer heals him Nx. He has a heal for Nx+1, as does the healer. End result, 1 heal on him, 2 heals on town. Which is BETTER for him that just town healer healing on Nx and x+1. It actually works out well for him almost no matter what, .because the town actor "wastes" a protown action one night.
you have just successfully described the town reason not to straight away claim my ability. good job.
I'm on phone, but if the cycle he claimed was one where scum tried to take out someone highly visible (syllo, dinosaurs) then he could have been attempting to get heals away from.them for that night
I tried to get turducken, and only as comparitive target. Toads would still have taken damage, but I would have had the chance to inflict damage the next night.
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On December 08 2012 23:04 kitaman27 wrote:
Keirathi, as you were in two parties, what was your second ability? Are these abilities one use?
Its strange that his role is so nerfed compared to everyone else. He also has the failed event to take into account.
I'm a JOAT of sorts.
I have a track (1), jk (2), 200 hp vig (3), and an alignment check (4). The numbers inside the parentheses are how many "points" the ability costs for me to use it. I get one point for being in a party, or two points for being the party leader. If the time period is 600AD, those points are doubled (So I got 2 points for the day 1 party, letting me using a jail, etc).
The second time I was in the party, I tracked Hapa. It was the same night Syllo tracked him though, and my result was that Hapa didn't target anyone.
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Open question why would scum austin heal me?
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On December 09 2012 02:55 iamperfection wrote:
Open question why would scum austin heal me?
If he would not have healed a townie today, he would have been a sure lynch. I had no other choice.
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How do you propose mafia <person> could win the game no matter what he does?
Actually I think you were a weird target for a town healer because you were essentially at full health already and main healers were instructed to heal me. Healing Clarity would have been townier because he had taken a lot of damage recently.
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by the way with my upgrade i can heal anyone now it doesn't matter if their full health or not it would still be good
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bah i will think about this more when i get home from work.
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On December 09 2012 03:04 phagga wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2012 02:55 iamperfection wrote:
Open question why would scum austin heal me? If he would not have healed a townie today, he would have been a sure lynch. I had no other choice.
If I were scum, I seemed to already be on the chopping block.
Why would I heal town in order to push back another cycle?
Based on toads machine, scum wants to summon lavos early, so why would I not just die?
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EPT
