EPTOriginalName x1
Looney Lynching Mini Mafia - Page 2
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Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
OriginalName x1 | ||
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Hopeless1der
United States5836 Posts
On October 12 2012 10:56 Djodref wrote: Hello guys ! I finally got away from the meeting ^^ I just have caught up with the thread on my phone. First I would like to say that the predictions were a (failed) attempt to make my comments look like a starcraft MU preview. Thank you Kush for understanding me and believing in me  Just a quick post about the people who are going to advance:
...ON is advancing, what does your last point have to do with that? You're up against ET. | ||
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Hopeless1der
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Who out of myself and OriginalName do you think is more likely to be scum and why? How do you plan on voting today? | ||
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Hopeless1der
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On October 12 2012 23:56 EchelonTee wrote: WTF, 1der ninja unvoted and we haven't been making a big hullabaloo about it? ??? Just woke up. I'm too scummy, so no one wants to touch me with a 10 foot pole. Going to explain why I'm voting sandroba shortly, then address djodref's case on me. I'll also start going through the rest of the playerbase and lay out my thoughts and suspicions more clearly (i.e. at all). Do you need me to re-visit my unvote explanation ET? | ||
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Hopeless1der
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On October 10 2012 21:07 sandroba wrote: I'm mad when I can't distiguish between someone being crazy or trying to make a fake contribution. You can vote for whoever you like as long as your explanation doesn't stink. And as long as the person can even get votes, which ET can't even get this round. Better luck reading the game and the thread next time. Make your votes and Explain your votes. Okay. On October 11 2012 10:36 sandroba wrote: Yo. I want da0ud to go to the next round. I have a hunch and those have been pretty good historically. Not only is that not an explanation, sandroba doesn't even comment on the fact that thrawn tried to start a pissing contest with him. He definitely had the time and opportunity to comment on why thrawn was yanking his chain but just glossed over the issue. On October 11 2012 20:49 sandroba wrote: Yes I'm was not explaining anything because nothing was solid yet. I rather let people talk then to post a ton. da0ud and thrawn are flooding the thread a lot, so I'm pretty pleased with how it turned out, even if he didn't make it through. That is because I would expect him to post way less had him gotten a pass as scum. Right now I'm pretty sure ON is scum. There was no reason to throw those 2 random votes and freak out a ton if you had not read the thread. Voting isn't even mandatory. The only explanation is someone informing him erroneously that he would be modkilled due to the cohost pointing out in the thread he had not voted and since on his mind he had to throw some votes somewhere he just used the opportunity to push some agenda that is yet to be seen by voting the most controversial match up. No reason for him to vote that match up at all if he was town and had no info, since he doesn't even know those players, and I would expect him to throw one vote on someone he knew if he didn't have any agenda. His afterthought is that da0ud ended up continuing to post, so he's probably townie...and he wasn't explaining because things weren't solid yet. Why is it that he is exempt from needing to explain anything he did? That so-called hunch should have been based on something, shouldnt it? On October 12 2012 05:17 sandroba wrote: That's pretty ridiculous comment prpl. And I known for my manners or my detailed explanation of my actions? No. Have there been any flips so far? No. Look at the cases people posted, which is the strongest? Definetely the case on ON. How can you ever say that I'm not trying to get scum lynched or that my play has been uninspired? You can't. This is currently the last post of his filter. It contains a large number of passive-aggressive questions that find flaw in items not discussed in prplhz's quote. Things like ON's case is the strongest (have you seen...me?) or the fact that there are no flips (Whether or not someone is flipped has no impact on you reading them as scum the way prplhz described). prpl is quoted as saying sandroba "can do magic" as town, but so far he has not seen that "magic". This type of response from sandroba reads as scummy to me because he's not answering for the things he's done, he's saying that's the way it is and screw you guys for calling him scum over it. He promptly disappears. That response, combined with ET's "meta read" On October 12 2012 02:41 EchelonTee wrote: Sandroba vs. Kush I have a strong feeling that sandroba is town, which unfortunately is a feeling that is 75% meta and only 25% in thread. Sandroba is one of those super strong town players who is comparatively abysmal as a mafia player. When he's mafia, his lack of effort and interest becomes abundantly clear very quickly, sort of like Palmar but even moreso, IMO. Therefore, when he plays mafia I find that he runs active disruption to try and make as much chaos as possible until he inevitably gets shot/lynched. His posts have been been both interested in setup discussion (a common sandroba town tell) and reasonable tempered, compared to how belligerent he can be. I do not want sandroba killed today, but if his activity/interest/track record take a nose dive he should be murdered. Quote me on this if sandroba begins derping. Kush is a tough read for me and I'm pretty much null on him, but I don't want sandroba to advance. You wanted it quoted, so there it is ET. I think there's been plenty of time for sandroba to be useful, and he's been as bad, if not worse than me in terms of helping the town scumhunt. The only proper information/explanation he's provided is why he voted for ON (the strongest case in the game by his own admission) sandroba will get as many of my votes as it takes to move him forward on the chance that ON advances instead of me. If it looks like I''ll be moving forward, he'll get them all. | ||
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Hopeless1der
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On October 13 2012 00:38 prplhz wrote: @Hopeless1der Why did you vote Djodref over EchelonTee? I'll do this before I address his case. Djodref was tunneling me at the time and no one else was committed to lighting a fire under me. My play has been admittedly lackluster, and yet everyone is content to just brush me off as scum with little to no discussion. Djodref sums things up nicely in his predictions post (Thrawn good, Hopeless bad), but note the bolded part regarding Hiro-vs-ON + Show Spoiler + On October 12 2012 00:38 Djodref wrote: Day 1 Round 2 Preview Hopeless/Thrawn It's kind of night and day. Thrawn is active in the thread, gives good contributions and points out what is weird in other players posts. So far I have a slight town read on him. I would expect very good reasons for anyone wanting him to advance. Hopeless on the opposite has almost contributed nothing. He also seems strangely obsessed with people being around at deadline or not. Which is even stranger when you consider that it seems ok for him to unvote everything without warning just before the deadline. I'll develop later on Hopeless, hopefully with some insight from his side, but I would go as far as saying that he is my top scumread at the moment. Prediction: Hopeless advances to the Ro4 3-0 HiroPro/OriginalName At first glance this MU looks easy but it could be more interesting that it looks like. Once thing I have learned in my previous game is that obvious scum players are usually town (Kush being an exception of this rule^^). We could all agree that ON looks bad, like very very bad. Casting last minute panic votes (on me on top of that) after zero posts and not even properly explaining his motives is scummy as hell. But thinking about it, I cannot imagine any mafia player being this obvious. So I want to give him a second chance for today and see if he can make it up before the deadline. HiroPro hasn't posting that much and I didn't like his post encouraging people to share their thoughts and plans about the lynch mechanics. Right now, I would vote him over ON but I don't want to spend more than 3 votes on this (I didn't keep my 10 votes like, let's say, Hopeless). Prediction: ON advaces against my will to the Round 4 5-3 Basically, I'm too scummy to be scum. And yeah, that's a stretch, but read my filter for the level of evasiveness and unproductive behavior. I actively avoided discussion and existed in my own little world of deadlines and schedules, all of which came up in djodref's case against me. I wanted djodref to advance because I felt I'd have a better chance at getting this case made against me and seeing if anyone bites onto it. So far, the responses have not been too supportive of his case, despite the fact that it makes sense, doesn't misrepresent me or what I did, and has clear and well thought out reasons for his vote against me. Djodref has been very consistent and open in his read of me AND of his stance of ON's lurking not being that scummy. For this, I now think he's town. I voted him to advance because I wanted to ensure I could the case on me made (knowing I looked scummy as shit) to see how his reads would or would not change. I feel that if I had advanced ET, he would not have been pressured into making the case. In addition, it demonstrates that djodref can and does provide his reads to the town and is an asset worth having around. | ||
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Hopeless1der
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Please don't kill me Mementoss Dropping sandroba x3 for now. I doubt it takes that many anyways. | ||
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Hopeless1der
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On October 13 2012 02:33 thrawn2112 wrote: That's what I'm getting but I'm still trying to work through the logic of it...like I just don't see how it makes sense I know I'm town. Scum also knows I'm town. Despite the fact that I look like shit, the only player to properly address my play so far has been djodref. No one batted an eyelash when I advanced over mementoss or thrawn. There's been no redirection involving my matchups. I've been the clear forerunner the entire time, the easiest, biggest target there is, and NO ONE WANTS TO TAKE A SWING? I'll bet every town player in this game has been nursing suspicions on me since day 1. No one wants to be implicated in any connection to me. I needed the case on me to actually be built. My alignment is the only thing I know right now, its the only thing that I can manipulate to get information from other people. I felt that djodref was the strongest candidate to push for this case based on his existing assertions that I was scummy. Now that its out in the open, people need to take a stance on whether or not my actions appeared too planned, too scummy, too crafted to make sense from a scum perspective, and they absolutely could, but I'm saying that I did it on purpose and that I'm town. On October 13 2012 00:38 EchelonTee wrote: No. You unvoted to preserve votes, but the manner in which you did it is shady. If you don't enjoy policy lynches, you shouldn't pull stunts like that. I'll pull stunts like this if they work. Like you said, it was shady. Of course it was. That's been my whole point. On October 13 2012 02:31 EchelonTee wrote: The more I think about this the more it doesn't make sense. What would you have done if I had put a big fat case on you? I've had my eye on you for ages; maybe if you had advanced me instead I would've done that case. What that make me townie? What you yourself acknowledge is that you look scummy and that you have played bad; how the hell are we supposed to know if you're town? Usually I lynch scummy people because by definition of the adjective, they are most likely to be scum. I pretty much would have OMGUS'd you to see how angry you got and gauge your reaction afterwards. You've already chewed out Mementoss and OriginalName for casting 'aspersions' on you. Reading you as town would have depended on how hard you derailed the thread being angry with me, not just calling me scum. It is never just what you do, its how you do it. | ||
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Hopeless1der
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On October 13 2012 03:17 thrawn2112 wrote: OK so you pushe ddjodref though to get a read on his alignment... by way of seeing if he were to make a case against you after he moved forwards. So that means at the time you voted djod you knew that you already looked scummy? Had you been playing intentionally scummy from the start as part of a gambit? I Ninja Unvoted + Show Spoiler + On October 12 2012 03:56 Hopeless1der wrote: Addressing more of this: IF you make any statement towards being inactive at the deadline (like mementoss has) then if you do anything around the deadline you're instantly suspicious. You will be scrutinized and the town will have a greater ability to control the lynch because everyone will know that certain votes are completely locked in place and are not subject to change. I'm getting some flak for my ##Unvote All, part of which is I gave no notice that I was doing anything. However, I had already posted that I was going to be available during the deadline, which no one cared about, and the end result is almost exactly the same. The exception is that you, kush, advanced as a result, BUT Hiro was under the impression that you would have gone through without my 'assistance'. My activity during the deadline had a significant impact, which I would rather people be aware of so that no one is blindsided. You say I'm feigning activity. My activity is poor, and as close to trivial as it gets, but my actions have clear motive in terms of how people have advanced each round. You claim I'm not scumhunting. No, not in the conventional sense, I'm not. There are now 4 players completely out of the running for todays' lynch, but for all I know, all the scum are in those players. I have no flips and very limited information. I realize I'm not giving people much to work with, but I'll deal with that later. I'd rather not give scumreads because of both the short length of the game so far and the lynch mechanics. I will go through the matchups and give my thoughts on those. Hiro vs ON is already done. Explicitly NOT giving a proper read on kush in the spoilered post above, despite causing him to advance in his bracket. I basically gave a summary of what happened with my votes without giving any solid input concerning my reads. I also posted this in the spoiler: On October 12 2012 03:56 Hopeless1der wrote: I realize I'm not giving people much to work with, but I'll deal with that later. And my general insistence on deadlines and schedules earlier on in the game, instead of scumhunting or engaging in ANY productive discussion whatsoever. Working on my response to djodref's case. | ||
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Hopeless1der
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On October 12 2012 03:56 Hopeless1der wrote: I realize I'm not giving people much to work with, but I'll deal with that later. Is me pointing it out earlier that I know I was being useless. | ||
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Hopeless1der
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On October 12 2012 18:06 Djodref wrote: As promised, I would like to present you my case against Hopeless. My main points against him are:
Lack of scumhunting + Show Spoiler + He admits it himself in this post in response to Kush On October 12 2012 03:56 Hopeless1der wrote: Addressing more of this: /snip You say I'm feigning activity. My activity is poor, and as close to trivial as it gets, but my actions have clear motive in terms of how people have advanced each round. You claim I'm not scumhunting. No, not in the conventional sense, I'm not. There are now 4 players completely out of the running for todays' lynch, but for all I know, all the scum are in those players. I have no flips and very limited information. I realize I'm not giving people much to work with, but I'll deal with that later. I'd rather not give scumreads because of both the short length of the game so far and the lynch mechanics. I will go through the matchups and give my thoughts on those. Hiro vs ON is already done. Please note also how he implies that we are going to mislynch (all the scum already out comment). This is not scummy but it is at least not good town mentality. On top of that he refuses to give his scumreads invoking bad excuses (what are the lynch mechanics doing here ?) and for this, I clearly don't see any town motivation. No one asked me to clarify what I meant by "conventional". My implication that we'd mislynch was to point out that there are potential scum that cannot be lynched this round and to try and find them would not be productive this cycle. As it turns out, many disagree and feel that I need to at least make my reads on players known. That way I can put up a nice, townie face so that THEY can read ME better. This has not been articulated well, but I get the point. Suspicious unvotes at deadline + Show Spoiler + I don't know if you have noticed it but his unannounced unvote at round 1 deadline had a influence on the kush/prplhz match-up. He let Kush advanced over Prplhz. Look at the way he presents it On October 12 2012 03:56 Hopeless1der wrote: /snip I'm getting some flak for my ##Unvote All, part of which is I gave no notice that I was doing anything. However, I had already posted that I was going to be available during the deadline, which no one cared about, and the end result is almost exactly the same. The exception is that you, kush, advanced as a result, BUT Hiro was under the impression that you would have gone through without my 'assistance'. My activity during the deadline had a significant impact, which I would rather people be aware of so that no one is blindsided. /snip I'm not accepting his excuse for this. Should I state that I'm going to be present for deadline tomorrow and happily reverse the result of a matchup ? Is this ok ? I don't like the way he presents it, stating that it almost exactly the same, when his actions led to an opposite results for one match-up. He has no choice but to admit it but the fact he has doing it passively (by unvoting) and shifting the focus on Hiro helped him to make Kush advance (or should I say eliminate prplhz from the competition?) quite unnoticed. First, Don't make connection theories until someone has flipped. If you wanted my read of Kush/prplhz, ask for it. Second, I read kush as scummier than prplhz in that instance, Hiro wanted him to advance but the Higher Seed rule was not going to apply. I also was reading Hiro as town at the time. At least, I didn't catch up at first. If you guys have all seen this then I'm sorry for bringing this up. What makes it even more suspicious is the global picture:
I would say that Hopeless doesn't really care about who is going to advance in this bracket. And the question I really would like him to answer is what he is planning to do with all the votes that he has carefully saved ? Of course I care, that's why I made Kush go through instead of prplhz. The rest of my reads went through. The fact that I used no votes to do it is weird, but not scummy. I very clearly understood and you could say abused the lynch mechanics, but my unvoting was extremely deliberate. At present, I hope not to advance to the next round because I don't think you're going to get votes and mine will be useless if I advance. I think you're town, so if I have to, they're all going onto sandroba. Contradicts himself + Show Spoiler + Firstly he did contradict himself while speaking about letting kush advance. I'm sorry but it not exactly the same when you reverse the issue of a matchup. And here is the second contradiction: I didn't understand why he was so obsessed with people present at deadline and I called him for it. Here is the post he gave me in response On October 11 2012 23:55 Hopeless1der wrote: There is usually a panic towards the end of a day to consolidate votes and have crazy things happen during the final hours. With this lynch mechanic, there isn't enough time to properly consolidate and I think knowing who is willing and able to be active during the deadline is very beneficial to town. Case in point, go look at the way I voted and my concern makes much more sense. I asked for people's deadline schedules again because 7 out of 11 players (not counting myself) posted without acknowledging the question. There seems to be a severe lack of reading comprehension going on in this thread. da0ud is evidently foreign enough that he gets a pass. The rest of you bastards, not so much. What I'm trying to achieve is using my votes in the most efficient way possible to maximize town's advantage this cycle. This, of course, assumes I'm town. I'll explain my reasoning later if necessary. Mementoss, I get that you're suspicious of people having all their votes, but can you look over how I (un)voted and tell me if you think I'm scummy because of it? OriginalName, you still havent addressed why you felt you needed two votes on djodref, ESPECIALLY when he was already leading his matchup. You were literally throwing away votes. What I understood from this answer is that knowing who is present at deadline prevents crazy things from happening. I think that the simplest way from preventing crazy thing to happen is to use your votes and sticking to them. Unvoting like you do results in more possibilities for outcome of MUs to change, something you want to prevent by asking everybody if they are going to be present at deadline or not. I think you want to give yourself some presence in the thread by asking everybody if they are here for deadline or not. In reality you just want to know if you can safely do you unvoting cuisine. I changed 1 matchup and left 2 unchanged. In doing so, I was able to preserve all of my votes. Because my strongest tool is my ability to vote, I reviewed the votecount at deadline and determined that 2 of my votes were not required to get the players that I wanted to advance. I agreed with Hiro's suspicions on kush and I needed to at least remove my vote from prplhz in order to advance kush. If I was going to be more explicit about it, I could have used a vote on kush, but that was not necessary due to the lynch mechanics. My droning on about the deadlines was me intentionally being unproductive. My "unvoting cuisine" occurred again at the end of round 2 when I reduced my votes so as to not waste them. This is not inherently scummy behavior in my opinion. With all this I'm pretty sure that Hopeless is [red]scum. I'm going to go full force in him this round against him because I really want him to get lynched today and I may not be able to use my votes on the next round. I'm also interested to see who is going to vote for his concurrent, the Great Lurker, I named OriginalName. Please be aware that I'm not forgiving ON in any way with this post. Right now, I really find Hopeless to be the scummiest among us. Prplhz is also looking scummy in my eyes. I'll develop on this later but I would like first to have some feedback on this case, especially from Hopeless. Hopeless x6 As I noted earlier, don't go looking at prplhz just because you think I've saved him, especially in the event that I don't flip today. Also, if you get the chance, I don't think you'll need to use all your votes. Just saying... | ||
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Hopeless1der
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On October 13 2012 03:43 thrawn2112 wrote: You want us to lynch sandroba and you have somewhat of a town read on djo correct? And disregarding your situation what are your thoughts about lynching ON? Correct about wanting to lynch sandroba and a townread on djodref. I'm unsure about OriginalName. We're still technically on Day 1, and there is no explicit modkill rule plus you don't have to vote. I don't know what the deal is, he hasn't given us any input on why he's been so inactive aside from "my phone died". His excuses for his djodref x2 vote are extremely flimsy. He was around for a half hour after the lynch, and then returned almost halfway into Round 2 to say he panicked because of a "Y U No Post" PM from Kita. There had been multiple instances of people questioning his motives and he ignored all of it. His attempted last minute vote ended up counting towards the Day 2 votecount, which it seems that many were unaware of, myself included. If he doesn't return soon, or doesn't give us any indication that he gives a shit upon his return, I would heavily consider his lynch over sandroba's. For now, I'm operating under the assumption that he's got some serious IRL issues going on. | ||
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Hopeless1der
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I'm currently going through filters for proper scumreads. | ||
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I wanted to try to be scummy beforehand, so I was going to try to ninja vote, which I did, and be generally unhelpful to see who bites. I felt I was kind of screwed and needed someone to make a case on me, but no one needed to because my matchups were so one sided. I voted djodref mainly because I needed that case made, but also yes, to see his read/consistency. I'll try to be back within an hour @Kush: + Show Spoiler + On October 13 2012 03:28 Hopeless1der wrote: I Ninja Unvoted + Show Spoiler + On October 12 2012 03:56 Hopeless1der wrote: Addressing more of this: IF you make any statement towards being inactive at the deadline (like mementoss has) then if you do anything around the deadline you're instantly suspicious. You will be scrutinized and the town will have a greater ability to control the lynch because everyone will know that certain votes are completely locked in place and are not subject to change. I'm getting some flak for my ##Unvote All, part of which is I gave no notice that I was doing anything. However, I had already posted that I was going to be available during the deadline, which no one cared about, and the end result is almost exactly the same. The exception is that you, kush, advanced as a result, BUT Hiro was under the impression that you would have gone through without my 'assistance'. My activity during the deadline had a significant impact, which I would rather people be aware of so that no one is blindsided. You say I'm feigning activity. My activity is poor, and as close to trivial as it gets, but my actions have clear motive in terms of how people have advanced each round. You claim I'm not scumhunting. No, not in the conventional sense, I'm not. There are now 4 players completely out of the running for todays' lynch, but for all I know, all the scum are in those players. I have no flips and very limited information. I realize I'm not giving people much to work with, but I'll deal with that later. I'd rather not give scumreads because of both the short length of the game so far and the lynch mechanics. I will go through the matchups and give my thoughts on those. Hiro vs ON is already done. Explicitly NOT giving a proper read on kush in the spoilered post above, despite causing him to advance in his bracket. I basically gave a summary of what happened with my votes without giving any solid input concerning my reads. I also posted this in the spoiler: And my general insistence on deadlines and schedules earlier on in the game, instead of scumhunting or engaging in ANY productive discussion whatsoever. Working on my response to djodref's case. | ||
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That would perhaps have generated discussion, but in a much more chaotic manner than would be that useful. Kush, you trying to tell me you had a town read on me but since I made this shit up I'm now lying scum? | ||
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On October 13 2012 09:15 austinmcc wrote: If these were brackets today and you had to vote in them: (1) Who would you vote for in each matchup? (2) Why? (3) Would you use mass votes to ensure they pass on? Mementoss v. HiroPro Kush v. da0ud me v. prplhz I would probably neglect to vote on mmt vs Hiro, I'm reading null on them both. Since you say I have to vote, I guess MMT? I'd vote Kush over da0ud. Kush's filter is more spammy, I have a more clear town read on da0ud from his OP and reactions to people thinking he was being disruptive because of it. I would not mass vote as I'm currently reading kush as town as well. Kush's high activity makes me think it would be better for town if he were to advance because it would lead to better discussion. I would definitely vote prplhz over you. Going through your filter, I didn't really find anything that rubbed me the wrong way. Your posts are usually open. Only the last couple hours have you been reserved and I think you're saving some walls for us. I hope I'm right. Prplhz's recent activity has not been strong to me, and his lack of effort strikes me as scummy. He says he has specific reads on people but they aren't explained, or they're actually false (mistaking me and hiro). He also asks a lot of questions but I feel he's not very focused on them, just picking away for information without providing any himself. I would use a sizable number of votes if necessary. | ||
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Hopeless1der
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On October 13 2012 09:39 thrawn2112 wrote: austin was there a point to that other than asking for reads? Perhaps we'll never know.... Anyways, my time filters has given me a scumish read of prplhz and a wtf read of ET. Prplhz for pretty much what I outlined for austin in my last post. On ET, he made his townread of sandroba clear, and now that sandroba isn't living up to expectations, he's not really doing anything about it. He also made a big stink about associative tells saying if sandroba flips scum he should be held accountable. That goes the other way too I think. He's been around, focused mainly on my bracket. I think its bad form that his filter directly implicates him but he hasn't had much presence on sandroba's bracket. I don't get why he's mostly ignoring it. | ||
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Hopeless1der
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sandroba x6 | ||
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