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MidnightGladius
China1214 Posts
On April 25 2012 05:19 ghost_403 wrote: Sentinel has two votes. I vote we lynch him today and Ottoxlol tomorrow. Sound good? Well, that's that. Nice knowing you, scum. ##Unvote: johnnywup ##Vote: ghost_403 | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36156 Posts
On April 25 2012 05:19 ghost_403 wrote: Sentinel has two votes. I vote we lynch him today and Ottoxlol tomorrow. Sound good? I would definitely prefer a Zephirdd lynch. | ||
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MidnightGladius
China1214 Posts
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layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On April 24 2012 21:15 ghost_403 wrote: + Show Spoiler [snip] + Another thing that I was going to note last night was the fact that Sentinel has been lurking like a bawse through this whole game. If you take a look at what he wrote last night, he more or less claimed that he was onboard the VE lynch, and that's it. Sentinel is afraid of posting in this thread, because he's afraid he'll do something to out his scumbuddies. I thought he was scum yesterday, our townie friend sloosh thought he was scum before Sentinel killed him, and I think we should be lynching him today. I'm guessing that he rolled goon, which is why he's so afraid to get caught. Scum KP should drop to 1 after we lynch Sentinel. Let's look at Sentinel's posts from last night! Poast 1 "I was totally onboard for the VE lynch before VE was". Who cares? What does this add to the thread? How does this help us hunt scum? MG's idea that the scum voted to lynch VE before the townies is flawed to begin with, and now he somehow wants more credit for it? On April 24 2012 09:05 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Wait... how the hell do you brand Risen green because of "town meta"? I think his aggressive-defensive bipolarity kinda ruined that aspect. If anything makes him green is that he backed VE till the end. Scum love making townie reads, because it saves them the trouble of scum hunting. You have nothing to say about the fact that Mattchew thinks you're scum? I'd be pissed if I ended up red on that list. On April 24 2012 09:26 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: I'm in Star Battle so I won't make the deadline. I'll probably post some once I'm done, closer to 14:00 GMT (+00:00) "I'm going to give myself an excuse not to post so I can avoid scumslipping." On April 24 2012 10:41 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: Fuck, have to push back my reply to tomorrow early morning. See above. On April 24 2012 10:43 [UoN]Sentinel wrote: I'm posting exactly seven hours from now. I think I'll make it. See above. There's no reason for a townie to have this little content in the game. One post with a decent thought is all I ask for. Just one. One post where I can look back and agree or disagree with what you have to say. Instead, this. Nothing of content. The lack of content from Sentinel is due to the fact that's he's terrified of being caught. That's 'cause Sentinel rolled scum. ##vote [UoN]Sentinel If the crux of your case is his lack of a contribution then i must inform you that, that is typical of him. his past games | ||
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Mattchew
United States5684 Posts
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36156 Posts
On April 25 2012 05:23 MidnightGladius wrote: Marv, all I can say is that you're exaggerating how shocked I was at VE's flip. Can you think of any reason why ghost's suggestion makes sense from a town perspective? Ok. I may or may not be overthinking it, but I'm just not quite... comfortable with how it read. Re: ghost. He's made a case against Sentinel and he thinks he's scum which is fair enough. But his last comment on Ottoxol is that he thinks he's newb town. Has your opinion changed on that, ghost? | ||
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ghost_403
United States1825 Posts
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MidnightGladius
China1214 Posts
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Ottoxlol
735 Posts
On April 25 2012 03:10 ghost_403 wrote: @MIxMasterToss: I could see that. Alright, let's lynch Sentinel today, and Ottoxlol tomorrow. Sound good? On April 25 2012 05:19 ghost_403 wrote: Sentinel has two votes. I vote we lynch him today and Ottoxlol tomorrow. Sound good? Sorry ghost I didn't get it, who do you want to get lynched today and tomorrow? | ||
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ghost_403
United States1825 Posts
On April 25 2012 03:10 ghost_403 wrote: @MIxMasterToss: I could see that. Alright, let's lynch Sentinel today, and Ottoxlol tomorrow. Sound good? which is the first time that I began to push for an Ottoxlol lynch. | ||
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layabout
United Kingdom2600 Posts
On April 25 2012 05:17 MidnightGladius wrote: Are you arguing that I should have been more convinced of VE's innocence, despite his scummy play, and pushed people off of his lynch? Perhaps I could have, but hindsight is cruel, and I would have not wanted to have been led to a no-lynch. Like I said in the post you only partially quoted, I highly doubt that I could have convinced the people voting for VE to move off of him. Would I have liked to have been perfectly certain and pulled a ton of pressure to move votes off of VE? Sure. Did I think it was the right, or feasible, idea at the time? No. A no-lynch A lynch on a player that you beleive is the town Jailed keeper Which is better if you are a)Town? or b)Mafia? | ||
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ghost_403
United States1825 Posts
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Mattchew
United States5684 Posts
On April 25 2012 05:28 Ottoxlol wrote: Sorry ghost I didn't get it, who do you want to get lynched today and tomorrow? why are you worried its you? | ||
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MidnightGladius
China1214 Posts
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Mattchew
United States5684 Posts
On April 25 2012 05:21 MidnightGladius wrote: Well, that's that. Nice knowing you, scum. ##Unvote: johnnywup ##Vote: ghost_403 literally nothing scummy about that considering the context of the game. Why do you think its scummy? | ||
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MidnightGladius
China1214 Posts
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[UoN]Sentinel
United States11320 Posts
+ Show Spoiler [My defense vs. Gonzaw] + On April 24 2012 12:18 gonzaw wrote: Is it against the rules to talk in this time?  No, but thanks for helping me read less text. Anyways, I seem to be falling into the red again, so let's get to business. On April 24 2012 09:16 gonzaw wrote: Sentinel I think he's scum. Here is his first "important" post: (All the ones before that one were just useless filler.) <<My first important post>> He just posts this to defend himself. All the 1st points of this posts are him making excuses and defending himself against accusations. Can't argue with that. That's actually the reason I came out of the woodwork in the first place. He suspects sloosh for some arbitrary reason (sloosh saying "I like Ottoxlul"). Notice how he never mentions his thoughts about sloosh again in the whole game This is my thought process at the time: 1. Read filters, including sloosh's. 2. Observe that sloosh's is starting out bad because post is scummy. 3. Sloosh makes pretty good argument vs. VE. I buy it and not care about sloosh again. His next point is an OMGUS against ghost. His reasoning for voting ghost is that ghost thinks he's scum and didn't post "reasoning" behind it, which is bogus since ghost did offer some reasoning behind it here: <<reasoning behind it here>> You know what else happens in that post? Just like I told many other players, he completely ignores the current discussion at hand He ignores everything about VE, the cases made against him, or the discussion about my "scumslip" and shit. He ignores the Mattchew vs Paqman deal, and he ignores the BH vs marv deal as well. His only motivation for making that post is to: -Defend himself -Offer a shitty vote on a player that has NOTHING to do with the current discussion You call that reasoning? I call it a pretty stupid idea to lynch me. I didn't think enough of VE to address him. All I said is that sloosh's case looks pretty good. Marv (and St. Dan and Brood) I actually get to. And of course I'm going to defend myself, because that's what you're supposed to do when you're under suspicion. His post only serves to disrupt, misdirect discussion and respond to accusations so he's not in the spotlight. His next posts are filler too, he doesn't contribute anything worthwhile. He then starts arguing with ghost, yet he never states if he thinks ghost is scum or not in those posts He just argues against ghost for the sake of arguing and defending himself, he's not scumhunting AT ALL, not even against those that he supposedly thinks is scum. (For example, these posts: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=329128¤tpage=23#443 http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=329128¤tpage=23#454 ) At that point I was more pissed off at ghost than willing to support the town. Otherwise I can't argue with that. This is the FIRST post in the whole game where he actually discusses the current events: Is wishy washy regarding marv, and here is where the fun begins: In the next few posts, Sentinel starts into a "suspicion-spree", spouting names of players and players and how he finds them slightly suspicious or is wishy washy regarding them Here are the posts: BH: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=329128¤tpage=23#457 Daniel: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=329128¤tpage=23#459 Brood: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=329128¤tpage=23#460 Dan and Brood had shit posts but I gave them the benefit of the doubt since they had so little, and by calling them out for that I would be a hypocrite. Red but redeemable. He's wishy washy about them or suspicious about them, but doesn't mention them at all later (he only mentions Daniel and Brood one more time, nothing else), or pressure them, or discuss them, or posting more thoughts about them. He just soughts suspicion on those players and then forgets about them. His initial suspicion of sloosh falls in this category as well. Erm, sloosh was in my first post? I actually mentioned them again in my vote on VE: Now comes his vote on VE: Really? Here is his reasoning for voting VE: Notice how this is the first time in the game he mentions VE He never mentioned when VE called me out and started his "lynch gonzaw!" crusades, I wasn't here for that and skimmed the thread nor mentioned him when I and sloosh posted cases against him, I wasn't here for that and skimmed the thread or when other people mentioned him. He mentions him only after he claims, and what does he say? Almost nothing. His "What the hell is a..." statement is useless since it doesn't state anything about his opinion on the matter. I thought it was pretty obvious that I was indignant at his claim and didn't believe it. His "Coupled with......" statement is just very vague and doesn't really say anything about VE's alignment. Apart from that he doesn't say anything else about VE, he doesn't post more thoughts about VE, or about other current discussions about VE either. You can bust me for lack of content but I think the message was pretty clear. "Bullshit, you're scum and I'm voting you for it. Do I really need to work on my word choice that much? Oh, yeah he also mentioned my case about Risen a little bit: ...but is completely wishy washy about it, fails to make an actual opinion on it, and only serves to "ask" about Risen's past games. Then when layabout actually goes through the effort of linking to said games, Sentinel doesn't mention it at all nor mentions Risen at all. Do you want me to start posting "Oh. Ok. Yeah, that make sense, carry on." every time I've felt that way in the thread? Because really on a lot of things, all I can really start saying is "Yeah, I agree with this." because they've pretty much got the whole subject covered. Conclusion: [list] [*]Sentinel is just posting to avoid the spotlight. When he posts he either just defends himself against accusations, he posts fluff and filler about useless things (like that "QT=/=PM" post), or posts wishy-washy stances on other players Yeah, I'm guilty of doing that. Can't say anything about that. [*]He ignores all current discussions and posts things that are irrelevant to them. He talks about players that have nothing to do with the discussion (and like said before in a wishy-washy manner), he talks about current events way too late and doesn't provide any new (or even remotely useful) content regarding it [*]Starts fighting with ghost to disrupt the thread, starts FoSing him but after they keep fighting he fails to take a stance on the ghost subject, he just argues with him for the sake of arguing. Again, I was pissed. If I was scum I wouldn't be pissed because ghost would be telling the truth and I would be only bullshitting. [*]He is "suspicious" and wishy washy about a lot of players and never makes the effort of mentioning them again or contributing more thoughts about them. My total was three? [*]He votes VE without any reasoning and only based on VE "trying to sway townies", and nothing else Yadda yadda yadda end of argument Now that I've done my defense post, time to make arguing. I've read through a lot of filters and I have the easiest time seeing Otto as scum. His first two pages are semi-solid (lots of one-liners but some of them actually move the thread along), but when suspicion starts crawling his way his posts degenerate into retarded one-liners: On April 24 2012 22:34 Ottoxlol wrote: So your case is that I can't make a case? Please make a case before calling me out. So let's look at one of his remaining solid posts in this part of the filter: On April 24 2012 22:21 Ottoxlol wrote: I believe that there is at least one scum on that list, I read them all. I couldn't come up with a case that's strong. Bm contributed zero, it is really hard to analyse someone with zero posts. Marvellosity been attacked d1 with a very weak case, I did not find anything suspicious there layabout he was on my d1 list because I felt his opinion switches were a bit suspicious but d2 he's been posting some very good things, i think he's town Sentinel wasn't too involved in the debates, the case against him is semi decent, but if we punish someone because he did not got involved it should be the one with the least contribution Zephridd's defense is that he was afk too. We have 3 players who did some afking Sent BM Zeph from the VE crowd, Sentinel and Zeph tried contributing so I would vote rather BM then those other 2. He's getting votes and called out why don't he post and he's still just lurking around. BM please get into the game and show us you are town, or else I feel you'll get lynched. Back up Zeph and Sent? I'd actually say this is bad reasoning Otto. Your main analyses consist of people who are lurkers and "I didn't find things suspicious so I'm not voting these people." It seems like you convince yourself tentatively that BM is scum. Also, when VE died you had some weird pointers as to who to investigate. So I'm going to chalk it all up to fluff. They lurk too, but less then BM. I'm fine with any of them lynched. And thus your last solid position disappears. And more fluff. And one liners. You have an awful lot of them. On April 25 2012 03:15 Ottoxlol wrote: @mattchew My first bigger post about VE http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=329128¤tpage=18#343 My vote http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=14438199 After that I engaged with the debate, see my filter @ghost I am getting frustrated, you accuse me, I respond, you do not read my posts. shall I start making up cases too? This is ok. clear reasoning, but all the other accusations has been answered already. Get off my back and read my posts. I did read your posts. I think that you've got nothing to contribute but you don't want to get caught with your pants down and have to defend yourself. Conclusion: Your posts are one liners with quotes. Sometimes you put the quote and then put a one-line response in another post. The first page was decent, and you could have passed for an affable newbie, but then you lost it and now you have no argument. And when you do make arguments they have the consistency of water. I want two things from you: A) A solid case on someone we should lynch. And use your own information this time. 2) A good defense on why you shouldn't be lynched. Until then, ##Vote: Ottoxlol | ||
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Mementoss
Canada2595 Posts
On April 25 2012 05:31 MidnightGladius wrote: layabout, I'm personally of the opinion that a no-lynch is never good unless the town is at MYLO, or the lynch target is confirmed town to you. Every game I've played with a Day 1 no lynch fell into chaos on Day 2. You realize its pluarity which means there would never be a chance of No Lynch>? | ||
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MidnightGladius
China1214 Posts
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Ottoxlol
735 Posts
Pressuring me to take a stand, then when i say i have no strong reads so right now I would lynch lurkers. And thats scummy because I dont take a stand. Or I dont have strong reads. Oh wait thats impossible, we have so good cases everyone rallied to lynch the scum of the day. | ||
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