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I think we might have someone with Erandorr.
Someone already pointed out his style is very mich the same as the last game. He's not contributing at all, if someone calls him out he gets in here, does one bigger post and keeps lurkering / onlines until the next guy calls him out. The very same thing happened last game.
Look at his filter last game: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=285690&user=117613 and start on page 2 (his mayor-campaign-post), everything before that was before the game started.
Called out by ss: klick me
Erandorr steps in the thread, does one normal post, proceeds to lurk.
I made a case on him as well: Klick me Same as above as frankly, both happened abot the same time, so yeah erandorr get in the thread and starts doing some real posts. That's page 63.
From page 64 again he's back to one-liners only.
Massive vote-rigging:: Klick me! Erandorr joins the discussion to get one bigger post to get some town-cred and proceeds to lurk / do one-liners. I mean there where people claiming mafia, no need to not bus them for town-cred.
That's how he played mafia last game. Now let's look at what erandorr is doing this game, shall we?
That's his filter: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=291212&user=117613
He did some posts on day1 tha are no one-lines, those howeve are just fluff without content, telling rad to take a stand without actually doing something on his own.
EVERYTHING ELSE is a one-liner. Next thing that's going to happen: Erandorr will come here, make a big post to look town again, telling you that something is wrong and some way more obvious target should be lynched first and will proceed lurking / doing one-liners afterwards.
We can't let that happen again. He completly ignored those people who called him out last game, did one post that made him look okayish and went lurking again.
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On December 08 2011 06:53 Erandorr wrote:Show nested quote +On December 08 2011 06:44 Toadesstern wrote:I think we might have someone with Erandorr. Someone already pointed out his style is very mich the same as the last game. He's not contributing at all, if someone calls him out he gets in here, does one bigger post and keeps lurkering / onlines until the next guy calls him out. The very same thing happened last game. Look at his filter last game: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=285690&user=117613 and start on page 2 (his mayor-campaign-post), everything before that was before the game started. Called out by ss: klick meErandorr steps in the thread, does one normal post, proceeds to lurk. I made a case on him as well: Klick me Same as above as frankly, both happened abot the same time, so yeah erandorr get in the thread and starts doing some real posts. That's page 63. From page 64 again he's back to one-liners only. Massive vote-rigging:: Klick me! Erandorr joins the discussion to get one bigger post to get some town-cred and proceeds to lurk / do one-liners. I mean there where people claiming mafia, no need to not bus them for town-cred. That's how he played mafia last game. Now let's look at what erandorr is doing this game, shall we? That's his filter: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=291212&user=117613He did some posts on day1 tha are no one-lines, those howeve are just fluff without content, telling rad to take a stand without actually doing something on his own. EVERYTHING ELSE is a one-liner. Next thing that's going to happen: Erandorr will come here, make a big post to look town again, telling you that something is wrong and some way more obvious target should be lynched first and will proceed lurking / doing one-liners afterwards. We can't let that happen again. He completly ignored those people who called him out last game, did one post that made him look okayish and went lurking again. Yeah its not like I wrote a giant case on someone that I am convinced is scum, right? No, that just can't be true!
First of all: I was right wasn't I?
Next thing that's going to happen: Erandorr will come here, make a big post to look town again, telling you that something is wrong and some way more obvious target should be lynched first and will proceed lurking / doing one-liners afterwards.
Next thing that happened: You did a post that was decent. Next thing that happened: You did a one-liner (that pic), Next thing that happened: You did a oneliner (this very post I'm quoting). Q.E.D.
On your case: It's not that I said you're only doing onelines, it's that you're doing onelines as long as you're fine and once you're not you'll start doing real posts when you're scum. That's my point and I think I'm right here.
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EBWOP: Actually one detail was wrong. The pic-post was from RedFF, however the next post from erandorr was the thing I quoted, a one-liner again.
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On December 08 2011 07:18 Erandorr wrote:
[...] I actually don't want to fuck town over, so if you have questions that will help you determine my alignment then just ask away and I will give you long answers for once.
I hope that I will stay active after that, but at this point I can't really promise you anything.
Ok what's the reason for that one:
On December 08 2011 00:26 Erandorr wrote:
##Vote: Annul
!
To me it looks like you're just blindly following palmar. I know he's a vet but given what he did on day1 I don't want anyone to follow him unless you come to the same conclusion as he does on your own or he somehow proves that he's back to normal.
Right now I don't know what to think of Palmar. Yes I still think he's looking slightly town or even more. But I don't want him to ruin day2 like he did with day1, he's not a god that wondrously is right with everything he says and I don't like the fact that he tells people to rush like that.
So imo what you're doing is either sheeping palmar which I can't understand based off day1 or it's a vote of yourself without a reason.
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On December 08 2011 09:36 Radfield wrote:
Solid Town
Palmar
vaderseven
Zephirdd
Toadesstern
Hyshes
Maybe Town
Truthbringer
Visceraeyes
Annul
Lanaia?
Risen?
Prob Scum
kingjames01?
Erandorr
Sandro?
prplhz?
Drazerk?
Changed it to what I think is true. What's in <b> is what I changed. I also deleted some people from the list because I have no idea what to think about them yet. The biggest difference are our thoughts on hyshes I guess.
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On December 08 2011 09:51 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On December 08 2011 09:36 Radfield wrote:
Solid Town
Palmar
vaderseven
Zephirdd
Toadesstern
Hyshes
Maybe Town
Truthbringer
Visceraeyes
Annul
Lanaia?
Risen?
Prob Scum
kingjames01?
Erandorr
Sandro?
prplhz?
Drazerk?
Changed it to what I think is true. What's in <b> is what I changed. I also deleted some people from the list because I have no idea what to think about them yet. The biggest difference are our thoughts on hyshes I guess.
Oh btw, I obviously missed Radfield in the solid town section as I figured he put himself as town as well :p
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On December 08 2011 11:12 Zephirdd wrote:I feel slightly uncomfortable when Radfield's list of "probably" town Includes both the players that caused/are causing a ruckus on the thread, the completely inconsistent and useless town that can't even create a decent case without having his argument blown away by one sentence, and the player that has yet to provide any scum tell other than Erandorr(which, by the way, feels scummy to me, but a feeling isn't anything when you can't freaking argue properly against it) Then his "maybe" town is Which are basically only the null players in the game. I don't have anything wrong with this list, but why am I over it, I have no idea. His prob scum list: Erandorr, the one Toadesstern made a case of; kingjames, the one that made a case of Radfield(when many people had already said he was weird, but nobody had the guts to actually go that far). Then a bunch of interrogation marks over Sandro, who if anything should NOT have an interrogation mark(not based on his meta from last game at least), hyshes who... did nothing the whole game(seriously where is him), and prplhz who is surprisingly much more useful than usual(see Steamship Liquidia). Then, we get Toadesstern's list where he puts Hyshes out of anybody else as "probably" town, and Drazerk as scum. There is something off about these two. What about other players? Why bother mentioning Lanaia or Refallen or Hyshes, but not Corrupt(where is he btw?), Mattchew(who I think is town) or Jackal58(who has been away due to RL stuff)? Why are they so... synchronized? Yet both have a few valid points, but as much as prplhz and Erandorr may feel off, their play hasn't ringed me anything wrong. In fact, purpleHaze seems much more town oriented than the other game I played with him. Erandorr just looks like someone who is busy with something else(I think Palmar mentioned he is playing Dota2? he also said he was a bit sick), and seems just a null tell at best, not scum. Am I paranoid here? They don't seem weird, they don't seem anti-town, yet I have this feeling telling me there is something wrong. Am I the only one on this?
I'll just explain my feelings on hyshes and drazerk as those seem to be weird for you. I think everything else is pretty self-explanatory? If it's not please feel free to ask specifically about who you want an explanation.
Hyshes:
I already explained my read on hyshes a lot. Take a look at my filter, it's not something that came up out of nowhere. I've stated multiple times that I think hyshes is town. He's the only one is this game I have some games I played with him. Actually this is my 4th game and 3 of them I played with hyshes. So far everything that looked weird to most people is EXACTLY what he did the last 2 games and he was town those 2 games. I think the chances of him being mafia just tiny, unbelievably tiny to be honest.
Drazerk:
I'm just still not believing a word he said about his claim. If annuls claim is right that means we got 2 different types of medics in this game:
1) a super-medic that HAS TO claim he's medic but is therefore Roleblock immune
2) a normal medic or at least a medic that does NOT have to claim
I find that to be unbelievable. I think Incog would give us 2 medics of the same type but surely not 2 different types of medics. What would be the reason behind that? Drazerk claimed he protected V7 n1 so there is no way he was the medic that protected annul.
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EBWOP: Oh and about the part asking why we're so synchronised about who we do mention and who's a no-mention. I figured it's obvious I only took his list and changed it according to how I see it. So yes I only got people on the list that he got as well unless I am pretty sure about what I think about someone to add him.
To make it short: I was lazy, saw that list and imo it had flaws (like hyshes and drazerk) so I changed it according to what I think is right. It's not something I came up with. If you want me to do a list of my own I'm happy to do so tomorrow. I bet that won't overlap with the one rad did because I won't just copy & past & edit it.
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I am not assuming normal setups. I am assuming incog won't put 2 different variations of the same role in this game. That's my point. Therefore I'm calling drazerk a liar and therefore he's slighty on the scummy side for me (that's why he got a '?' on my list).
I'm saying he's either a VT or VET trying to catch bullets or a mafia that has something else on his mind like being scared or whatever. I'm not going to push for him yet I'm just calling him a liar yet.
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anyways I'm off to bed, will catch up tomorrow and respond to anything about that matter.
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I still like my Erandorr case way more for the same reasons I already said yesterday. Those people on Annul right now are just not the most confirmed townies around to put it that way. That wagon formed so fast although it came to a halt that I just got a bad feeling of mafia influence here. I mean I got a case on erandorr and he's on Annul. That's not a good sign for me. Drazerk who's still a liar to me until he gets a confirmed save is not exactly the kind of guy I'd like on a bus as well.
Just look at erandorr for a second palmar. That guy did everything I expected, did a bigger post to protect himself and started one-liners right afterwards. I called him out for this behaviour, he made a bigger post in which he admits that his filter looks pretty damning but finishes along the lines "well but I'm a townie and I am really sorry I'm screwing town right now! I am willing to help you guys no matter what just shoot me a question". So people came along hugging him like a little baby that's told that it's not his fault and that everything's going to be okay.
Guess what? I asked him a simple question straight away after his post. He still hasn't answered, still somehow people think he's looking more town now with his most recent post because I guess people feel sorry for him. This is a cheap trick.
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On December 08 2011 22:50 Palmar wrote:Show nested quote +On December 08 2011 22:42 Toadesstern wrote:
I still like my Erandorr case way more for the same reasons I already said yesterday. Those people on Annul right now are just not the most confirmed townies around to put it that way. That wagon formed so fast although it came to a halt that I just got a bad feeling of mafia influence here. I mean I got a case on erandorr and he's on Annul. That's not a good sign for me. Drazerk who's still a liar to me until he gets a confirmed save is not exactly the kind of guy I'd like on a bus as well.
Just look at erandorr for a second palmar. That guy did everything I expected, did a bigger post to protect himself and started one-liners right afterwards. I called him out for this behaviour, he made a bigger post in which he admits that his filter looks pretty damning but finishes along the lines "well but I'm a townie and I am really sorry I'm screwing town right now! I am willing to help you guys no matter what just shoot me a question". So people came along hugging him like a little baby that's told that it's not his fault and that everything's going to be okay.
Guess what? I asked him a simple question straight away after his post. He still hasn't answered, still somehow people think he's looking more town now with his most recent post because I guess people feel sorry for him. This is a cheap trick. The people on Annul's wagon have nothing to do with whether or not you should be supporting it. You should simply look at the strength of the case and determine for yourself if it's valid enough to earn him your vote. If you always consider who else shares your opinion you'll never get anywhere because nothing stops mafia from bussing teammates. I have looked at Errandor. There is nothing about his play that conclusively puts him down as scum. Sure, there are questionable things in there, but that's not a reason to lynch him today. I'm offering you a good opportunity to gauge his alignment by lynching annul. Lynching Errandor will not solve anything that's going on in town now. It's basically an excuse for lynching a scummy lurker. That was for day 1, today we're going after mafia. And I just gave you mafia.
there's nothing about his play that puts him down as mafia? Have you read my case? Even erandorr agrees that it's a good one which is the reason people feel sorry for him.
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On December 08 2011 22:50 Palmar wrote:Show nested quote +On December 08 2011 22:42 Toadesstern wrote:
I still like my Erandorr case way more for the same reasons I already said yesterday. Those people on Annul right now are just not the most confirmed townies around to put it that way. That wagon formed so fast although it came to a halt that I just got a bad feeling of mafia influence here. I mean I got a case on erandorr and he's on Annul. That's not a good sign for me. Drazerk who's still a liar to me until he gets a confirmed save is not exactly the kind of guy I'd like on a bus as well.
Just look at erandorr for a second palmar. That guy did everything I expected, did a bigger post to protect himself and started one-liners right afterwards. I called him out for this behaviour, he made a bigger post in which he admits that his filter looks pretty damning but finishes along the lines "well but I'm a townie and I am really sorry I'm screwing town right now! I am willing to help you guys no matter what just shoot me a question". So people came along hugging him like a little baby that's told that it's not his fault and that everything's going to be okay.
Guess what? I asked him a simple question straight away after his post. He still hasn't answered, still somehow people think he's looking more town now with his most recent post because I guess people feel sorry for him. This is a cheap trick. The people on Annul's wagon have nothing to do with whether or not you should be supporting it. You should simply look at the strength of the case and determine for yourself if it's valid enough to earn him your vote. If you always consider who else shares your opinion you'll never get anywhere because nothing stops mafia from bussing teammates. I have looked at Errandor. There is nothing about his play that conclusively puts him down as scum. Sure, there are questionable things in there, but that's not a reason to lynch him today. I'm offering you a good opportunity to gauge his alignment by lynching annul. Lynching Errandor will not solve anything that's going on in town now. It's basically an excuse for lynching a scummy lurker. That was for day 1, today we're going after mafia. And I just gave you mafia.
EBWOP: You're even contradicting yourself wtf.
So you're saying when it's not okay to not lynch annul because of what other people think about him but it's okay to do so with erandorr after a lynch?
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I think the case I got on erandorr is the best we got so far. And yes I did not integrate mini mafia X because I was not playing in that game. I know you guys love to read old games to study someones meta but I'm not going to read 100 pages of a game to get a proper read on ONE guy in this game and I'm not going to do that with multiple people. Actually rad mentioned mini mafia X and said erandorrs style in miniX was completly different to what he's doing now. So idk.
Yes it is mostly what I've seen him do in that 80-player-game and this one. It's just that it's completly the same thing. Exactly the same pattern/style. On top of that I think his style got flaws and it's shaky this game.
Take redFF for example. It's my first game with him or I don't remember him from a previous game. Therefore I have 0 meta on him. What he's doing so far is scummy as hell, still I don't think he's mafia right now because his style looks consistent. Either that guy is a really good mafia player that he's able to fake a style like this or he's just used to playing that way as both mafia and town imo. So that's why I'm not all over redFF although I think his actions look scummy. I just don't see that in Erandorrs posts.
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On December 08 2011 23:16 Mattchew wrote:Show nested quote +On December 08 2011 18:58 Lanaia wrote:I'm sorry. I know I said I would post, but I literally just spent 14 hours on my project and am almost done. It's now bedtime. I didn't realize it would take so long. I will post first thing in the morning. On December 08 2011 15:14 Mattchew wrote:On December 08 2011 12:27 redFF wrote:
scumteam atm is palmar, prplhz, zephirdd mattchew and then someone else i dunno maybe rad? I'd be surprised if anyone on this list was mafia sorry I'm not sorry for being honest (or it might turn out I'm just stupid) Can you at the very least explain why you'd be surprised? I would be surprised because zeph and rad I read into as definitive town. Rad for contributing and building a good town atmosphere and zeph has literally nothing suspicous about his posts. prplhz has been pushing at guys which can be read as scummy but I think that his pushing for answers has been pretty pro-town thus far. Palmar is by far the sketchiest on this list imo. His tunneling on annul screams "misleading town away from voting a mafia member to get lynched" but it could just be his ego on his read convincing him he is right. Plus I am town, so 4 out of 5 would really surprise me and Palmar I am questionable on.
yes I think your right with the bolded part. Palmar is the kind of guy that loves to be in contorl so first of all he wants to lead town (last game he even was mayor) and secondly he obviously thinks very highly about himself and most people agree on the second one. However, he's not a semi-god who's right with every call he makes so I think we should question his vote instead of just sheeping. If he manages to explain it so that I come to the same conclusion it's fine with me but I'm not going to sheep him just because he's good.
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On December 08 2011 23:28 Palmar wrote:Show nested quote +On December 08 2011 23:19 Mattchew wrote:On December 08 2011 23:12 Palmar wrote:On December 08 2011 22:59 Toadesstern wrote:On December 08 2011 22:50 Palmar wrote:On December 08 2011 22:42 Toadesstern wrote:
I still like my Erandorr case way more for the same reasons I already said yesterday. Those people on Annul right now are just not the most confirmed townies around to put it that way. That wagon formed so fast although it came to a halt that I just got a bad feeling of mafia influence here. I mean I got a case on erandorr and he's on Annul. That's not a good sign for me. Drazerk who's still a liar to me until he gets a confirmed save is not exactly the kind of guy I'd like on a bus as well.
Just look at erandorr for a second palmar. That guy did everything I expected, did a bigger post to protect himself and started one-liners right afterwards. I called him out for this behaviour, he made a bigger post in which he admits that his filter looks pretty damning but finishes along the lines "well but I'm a townie and I am really sorry I'm screwing town right now! I am willing to help you guys no matter what just shoot me a question". So people came along hugging him like a little baby that's told that it's not his fault and that everything's going to be okay.
Guess what? I asked him a simple question straight away after his post. He still hasn't answered, still somehow people think he's looking more town now with his most recent post because I guess people feel sorry for him. This is a cheap trick. The people on Annul's wagon have nothing to do with whether or not you should be supporting it. You should simply look at the strength of the case and determine for yourself if it's valid enough to earn him your vote. If you always consider who else shares your opinion you'll never get anywhere because nothing stops mafia from bussing teammates. I have looked at Errandor. There is nothing about his play that conclusively puts him down as scum. Sure, there are questionable things in there, but that's not a reason to lynch him today. I'm offering you a good opportunity to gauge his alignment by lynching annul. Lynching Errandor will not solve anything that's going on in town now. It's basically an excuse for lynching a scummy lurker. That was for day 1, today we're going after mafia. And I just gave you mafia. EBWOP: You're even contradicting yourself wtf. So you're saying when it's not okay to not lynch annul because of what other people think about him but it's okay to do so with erandorr after a lynch? Woah, are you intentionally being thick? There is no way to tell anything about the alignment of a person being bandwagoned or followed by looking at the people following them. This is because you cannot scumhunt against player a based on the actions of player b. Thus you cannot deduce annul's alignment by looking at who's voting for him. However, you can deduce a player's alignment by looking at whom he's voting for. Because in that scenario you're evaluating player a's alignment based on the actions of player a. To make it simple: Annul is not responsible for the people voting him, and I'm not responsible for the people sheeping my case (which everyone should be doing). Thus: The people on Annul's wagon have nothing to do with whether or not you should be supporting it.Errandor is however responsible for his own vote, and his own decision for following me, thus: I'm offering you a good opportunity to gauge his [Errandor's] alignment by lynching annul.If you fail to see the difference of people being responsible for their own actions, and people being responsible for other's actions, I'm not sure I can help you. Woah, are you intentionally being thick? He's saying that you cant say "don't look at who votes annul" followed by "watch how erandorr votes" Why not? If toad thinks Erandorr is mafia, and Erandorr votes for annul, that should have no impact on whether or not the case against annul is valid, because Erandorr isn't annul, they're seperate people. Toad could be wrong about Erandorr, I could be wrong about annul, and Erandorr could be bussing annul. You cannot read anything about whether or not the annul wagon is valid based on who is on it. However, while the fact Erandorr votes for annul says nothing about annul, it does say a lot about Erandorr, because... Erandorr is Erandorr. I don't get what's complicated about this.
First of all, you just said it. Even if you're right and annul is mafia there's no new read on erandorr. The guy voted for annul after something like 4 votes were on him after an incredible fast time? If you're right this could be a bus and this gives me 0 information about erandorr. How am I supposed to to gauge erandorrs alignment based on the flip? This is incredible wifom to the max.
Erandorr could be a townie sheeping you if annul is red. (or he came to the same conclusion without telling us)
Erandorr could be a townie sheeping you if annul is green. (or he came to the same conclusion without telling us)
Erandorr could be a mafia bussing annul if annul is red.
Erandorr could be a mafia getting a green-lynch if annul is green.
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On December 08 2011 23:41 Palmar wrote:Show nested quote +On December 08 2011 23:38 Toadesstern wrote:On December 08 2011 23:28 Palmar wrote:On December 08 2011 23:19 Mattchew wrote:On December 08 2011 23:12 Palmar wrote:On December 08 2011 22:59 Toadesstern wrote:On December 08 2011 22:50 Palmar wrote:On December 08 2011 22:42 Toadesstern wrote:
I still like my Erandorr case way more for the same reasons I already said yesterday. Those people on Annul right now are just not the most confirmed townies around to put it that way. That wagon formed so fast although it came to a halt that I just got a bad feeling of mafia influence here. I mean I got a case on erandorr and he's on Annul. That's not a good sign for me. Drazerk who's still a liar to me until he gets a confirmed save is not exactly the kind of guy I'd like on a bus as well.
Just look at erandorr for a second palmar. That guy did everything I expected, did a bigger post to protect himself and started one-liners right afterwards. I called him out for this behaviour, he made a bigger post in which he admits that his filter looks pretty damning but finishes along the lines "well but I'm a townie and I am really sorry I'm screwing town right now! I am willing to help you guys no matter what just shoot me a question". So people came along hugging him like a little baby that's told that it's not his fault and that everything's going to be okay.
Guess what? I asked him a simple question straight away after his post. He still hasn't answered, still somehow people think he's looking more town now with his most recent post because I guess people feel sorry for him. This is a cheap trick. The people on Annul's wagon have nothing to do with whether or not you should be supporting it. You should simply look at the strength of the case and determine for yourself if it's valid enough to earn him your vote. If you always consider who else shares your opinion you'll never get anywhere because nothing stops mafia from bussing teammates. I have looked at Errandor. There is nothing about his play that conclusively puts him down as scum. Sure, there are questionable things in there, but that's not a reason to lynch him today. I'm offering you a good opportunity to gauge his alignment by lynching annul. Lynching Errandor will not solve anything that's going on in town now. It's basically an excuse for lynching a scummy lurker. That was for day 1, today we're going after mafia. And I just gave you mafia. EBWOP: You're even contradicting yourself wtf. So you're saying when it's not okay to not lynch annul because of what other people think about him but it's okay to do so with erandorr after a lynch? Woah, are you intentionally being thick? There is no way to tell anything about the alignment of a person being bandwagoned or followed by looking at the people following them. This is because you cannot scumhunt against player a based on the actions of player b. Thus you cannot deduce annul's alignment by looking at who's voting for him. However, you can deduce a player's alignment by looking at whom he's voting for. Because in that scenario you're evaluating player a's alignment based on the actions of player a. To make it simple: Annul is not responsible for the people voting him, and I'm not responsible for the people sheeping my case (which everyone should be doing). Thus: The people on Annul's wagon have nothing to do with whether or not you should be supporting it.Errandor is however responsible for his own vote, and his own decision for following me, thus: I'm offering you a good opportunity to gauge his [Errandor's] alignment by lynching annul.If you fail to see the difference of people being responsible for their own actions, and people being responsible for other's actions, I'm not sure I can help you. Woah, are you intentionally being thick? He's saying that you cant say "don't look at who votes annul" followed by "watch how erandorr votes" Why not? If toad thinks Erandorr is mafia, and Erandorr votes for annul, that should have no impact on whether or not the case against annul is valid, because Erandorr isn't annul, they're seperate people. Toad could be wrong about Erandorr, I could be wrong about annul, and Erandorr could be bussing annul. You cannot read anything about whether or not the annul wagon is valid based on who is on it. However, while the fact Erandorr votes for annul says nothing about annul, it does say a lot about Erandorr, because... Erandorr is Erandorr. I don't get what's complicated about this. First of all, you just said it. Even if you're right and annul is mafia there's no new read on erandorr. The guy voted for annul after something like 4 votes were on him after an incredible fast time? If you're right this could be a bus and this gives me 0 information about erandorr. How am I supposed to to gauge erandorrs alignment based on the flip? This is incredible wifom to the max. Erandorr could be a townie sheeping you if annul is red. (or he came to the same conclusion without telling us) Erandorr could be a townie sheeping you if annul is green. (or he came to the same conclusion without telling us) Erandorr could be a mafia bussing annul if annul is red. Erandorr could be a mafia getting a green-lynch if annul is green. That's when you apply the "it's not what people do, but how they do it, that should be looked at" rule. If you're town, please come back and re-read this entire thing because you're being so wrong and bad at the moment that if you somehow justify your arguments to yourself, you will never improve.
okay give it a try, enlighten me and explain me where I'm wrong here becaue I can't see it.
I'd say all 4 make sense because "how" erandorr was doing it was " ! Vote" and that's it. That's why I put sheeping in the top 2 ones instead of what I have in brackets. However the same thing could happen when bussing or trying to get a green-lynch because this is, again, wifom.
I'm standing by my point that there's no informationgain on erandorr, at all.
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On December 08 2011 23:55 Mattchew wrote:
Palmar, would you go Lynch for Lynch with Annul. If he flips town you get lynched next?
please stop these things I know palmar is confident in his own and might be willing to do such a thing but it's NOT going to help town, it's just a tool to make a case look stronger "see I even would agree to that deal, np ezpz".
NOONE should agree to that kind of deal unless he's 100% certain his target is scum. There is no 100% chance to know someones alignment in this game unless you're mafia and know it. Therefore it's at max something like 99%.
Even if you somehow got a 99% clear case which I doubt we have here (neither annul nore erandorr) there is 99 cases in which town won't get an advantage because palmar was right and 1 case in which we're just fucked because palmar's the next guy who's getting lynched because he was wrong although he believes in his case.
So unless you think yourself that palmar is 100% scum there's no reason to suggest such a thing because that "bad" case isn't a bad case if we lynch a mafia. Therefore, stop it.
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On December 09 2011 00:04 Mattchew wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2011 00:01 Toadesstern wrote:On December 08 2011 23:55 Mattchew wrote:
Palmar, would you go Lynch for Lynch with Annul. If he flips town you get lynched next? please stop these things I know palmar is confident in his own and might be willing to do such a thing but it's NOT going to help town, it's just a tool to make a case look stronger "see I even would agree to that deal, np ezpz". NOONE should agree to that kind of deal unless he's 100% certain his target is scum. There is no 100% chance to know someones alignment in this game unless you're mafia and know it. Therefore it's at max something like 99%. Even if you somehow got a 99% clear case which I doubt we have here (neither annul nore erandorr) there is 99 cases in which town won't get an advantage because palmar was right and 1 case in which we're just fucked because palmar's the next guy who's getting lynched because he was wrong although he believes in his case. So unless you think yourself that palmar is 100% scum there's no reason to suggest such a thing because that "bad" case isn't a bad case if we lynch a mafia. Therefore, stop it. In no way, shape or form, did I intend that to be an honest plan. I realize its stupid I just like hearing and reading peoples responses to it. (I wanted to wait for annul to respond to this but I have a feeling he would hop on what you just said)
I am totally aware that it wasn't your intention, still it's a bad thing to do because it's at best no gain for town and at worst we're screwed. I don't want these things to happen, period
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On December 09 2011 00:12 Mattchew wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2011 00:10 hyshes wrote:On December 09 2011 00:09 hyshes wrote:On December 09 2011 00:07 Mattchew wrote:On December 09 2011 00:03 hyshes wrote:On December 08 2011 23:59 Mattchew wrote:On December 08 2011 23:55 Palmar wrote:On December 08 2011 23:55 Mattchew wrote:
Palmar, would you go Lynch for Lynch with Annul. If he flips town you get lynched next? Yes. you realize last time you did this... ace flipped town and you backed out He can't back out if we force it on him. If we are with 16 who support this 100% (so me +15, palmar not included) i'm willing to do this. lol what? Please explain to me why you are actually willing to do this. bc i'm not letting palmar have free townkills And 1 for 1 trades are good for town so can you explain why you think annul is scum and why you think palmar is scum. and why they cant be 2 townies bumping heads.
I think he said he thinks palmar is scum and therefore annul has to be town.
I am still miracously on a town-read on palmar so I got to disagree here. I think he's just an overconfident guy who hates it when he's not in controle. He screwed day1 and lost controle of this game, he started playing more serious and did a lot of lurking. He's probably stubborn enoug to tell himself something along the lines "well I'm going to show them that they SHOULD trust me and will deliver a mafia" to get back in controle / be confirmed townie so that people are listening to what he says because that's what he wants. He wants to be in charge and lead the investigation. That's why I think he might be tunneling (because he thinks he needs to find a mafia right now) and I don't think his case on annul is better than my case on erandorr.
Might be wrong with my analysis of palmar though.
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EPT
