|
I'm Elrond, the Lord of Rivendell. yes I'm the second medic. I protected jcarl first night. I protected Drazerk's ass every subsequent night except for last night where I protected Trancestorm.
Also, Drazerk was shot under my protection. So I know for sure he's not mafia.
|
On October 02 2011 22:31 kitaman27 wrote:I've got a couple questions for you heist. Yesterday, you were pushing Trace for the lynch. You said you were almost positive that there would be a second mafia on this lynch. Does this mean you've changed your mind on trance? If so, what made you switch to cheese? + Show Spoiler +On September 30 2011 10:20 heist wrote:
Actually, I'll be changing my vote to trancestorm.
Final Vote Count for the Jackal Lynch that saved iGrok day 2:
Greymist
chaoser
Radfield
Drazerk
raynpelikoneet
jcarlsoniv
TranceStorm
OriginalName
I'm almost positive there's at least one more mafia in here. On October 01 2011 06:23 heist wrote:TranceStorm Again, I looked at interactions with confirmed mafia. Show nested quote +On September 17 2011 14:36 TranceStorm wrote:
Debating about who should get the ring and what each role can or cannot do at the moment is pointless at the current time. However, I do like one of the plans that was proposed by a few people: having the person who successfully passed on the ring claim themselves. This way, we can enable a 'chain' to be made - i.e. the first player can confirm the second player once the second player has passed on the ring themselves. This is all dependent on the assumption that evil players cannot pass the ring themselves which as Radfield pointed out, is probably a true assumption.
Given this, however, this plan would probably only be effective for the first few 'passes' and perhaps near the end of the game when town circles become more clear. The risk after the first few days that the person holding the ring is killed, or has the ring stolen (which is a possible role according to the OP) makes the plan ineffective.
Therefore, I think that such a plan should work for the first 2 or 3 days to confirm at least one or two people. Any thoughts or ideas about this? I haven't fully fleshed this out yet (i.e. the possibility of fake claims is strong), but its probably a better discussion than the arbitrary finger-pointing going on at the moment. Bad plan. Whatever. Either you are a townie posting your plan with maybe a higher purpose of discussion (which he tries to defend himself as doing when everyone shits on his plan) OR you are mafia trying to slip in a bad plan for town to follow and derail discussion on a ill-formed plan. Null-tell. But what is interesting, is you start off your posts with an automatic belief in Radfield's assumptions. You trust him. Pretty harmless at first but let's look further. Show nested quote +On September 17 2011 14:58 TranceStorm wrote:On September 17 2011 13:37 chaos13 wrote:On September 17 2011 10:35 xtfftc wrote:On September 17 2011 09:32 Radfield wrote:
Posts like this(mine) should not be given consideration when you are trying to determine a players alignment. They definitely should be. Nope. The entire content of his post was all based on game mechanics. Game mechanics reveal zero about a player's alignment, so if you give people town cred for posting that, the whole mafia team is going to do it and pretty soon you're completely fucked. ... Anymore discussion about this is wasted. Starting now look at some of the posts people have made, try to figure out what the intent of them is. Ask people questions. Scum hate being asked what they think of the alignment of their scumbuddies, they want to keep to the shadows. Let's not give them what they want. You make a fair point about how Radfield's post was more based upon game mechanics than any actual analysis. However, you follow this up with a summary of some rather obvious conclusions derived from the thread and some generic advice of your own! I would love to see you 'ask people questions' and figure out the intent of their posts as well. Yes, yes "fair point" but then you proceed to soft defend Radfield by attacking chaos' post. Show nested quote +On September 22 2011 06:03 TranceStorm wrote:On September 22 2011 05:42 Radfield wrote:On September 22 2011 05:29 TranceStorm wrote:On September 22 2011 05:26 Radfield wrote:
If iGrok is scum, then he'll be confirmed scum by tomorrow and we lynch him then.
How do we will he be confirmed scum? If he is scum he needs to follow through with the shot we direct in order to stay clean for tomorrow. If he does not, then he gets lynched. If he claims he was 'roleblocked' then he gets lynched. If for any reason his target does not die, he gets lynched. If the target we choose is a townie, and scum kill him, AND his flavour comes up with 'consumed by shadow and flame etc" then so be it, as we are successfully directing scum's targets. If scum want to act as a double lynch for us, so much the better. If anyone else ever dies by the same flavour, or if the KP isn't matching up, we lynch him. It's like in PYP1/2 when scum got the compvig. IT DOESN"T MATTER AS LONG AS WE ARE DIRECTING THE SHOTS. Well that sounds reasonable. I am concerned about how the town is supposed to direct iGrok's night kill when we are divided as is though. Nevertheless, I'll look between Jackal and Palmar now. Is now taking complete guidance from Radfield. His votes are being informed entirely by Radfield. He has moves off iGrok and is ready to switch last minute onto a bandwagon of Radfield's choosing. **As a side note, Radfield I have to applaud you for how well you (mis)led the town.Show nested quote +On September 18 2011 01:18 Radfield wrote:On September 17 2011 15:36 Cyber_Cheese wrote:On September 17 2011 15:03 TranceStorm wrote:On September 17 2011 14:57 Cyber_Cheese wrote:On September 17 2011 14:36 TranceStorm wrote:
Debating about who should get the ring and what each role can or cannot do at the moment is pointless at the current time. However, I do like one of the plans that was proposed by a few people: having the person who successfully passed on the ring claim themselves. This way, we can enable a 'chain' to be made - i.e. the first player can confirm the second player once the second player has passed on the ring themselves. This is all dependent on the assumption that evil players cannot pass the ring themselves which as Radfield pointed out, is probably a true assumption.
Given this, however, this plan would probably only be effective for the first few 'passes' and perhaps near the end of the game when town circles become more clear. The risk after the first few days that the person holding the ring is killed, or has the ring stolen (which is a possible role according to the OP) makes the plan ineffective.
Therefore, I think that such a plan should work for the first 2 or 3 days to confirm at least one or two people. Any thoughts or ideas about this? I haven't fully fleshed this out yet (i.e. the possibility of fake claims is strong), but its probably a better discussion than the arbitrary finger-pointing going on at the moment. I'm not sure if you realise it or not but that plan sounds awfully anti-town. How do we guarantee that even those 1-3 people can pass the ring in the first place? And even if they can, how does that confirm anybody? In this game, only people with roles that relate to the ring should bother searching for it secretly, and if the ring is passed it will either be the fruits of their efforts or a complete accident. As for the effects of the ring, there is no real way to find out, the only people that know are the ring bearers and mentioning that you have it/explaining what it does is virtually ensuring you get killed overnight in the hopes that you can't pass it. First, if the players in question cannot pass the ring, then the plan does not go into effect. A player only announces that they had the ring in the previous turn. If they can't pass it on, they stay silent and we are none the wiser. Second, given Radfield's argument that evil players probably don't have the mechanic to pass the ring (otherwise they would pass it amongst themselves), if we can get two successive passes, that would confirm at least one player. The danger of course is passing to a mafia player, but that probability initially is small. At any rate, I think it is pretty likely that the ring will worm into non-town hands (whether 3rd party or mafia) given that non-town players will constantly search and probe every turn. There's no way to comprehensively prevent them from getting the ring, therefore, why not get some benefit to it. Finally, another point that can be made is that the player who passes on the ring and reveals themselves can also reveal what the ring does. Given that every player already covets it, it would be nice to at least have that information. So basically you want people to say "I had the ring guys, I managed to pass it off, but I'm not saying to who" and maybe list it's effects? We can't be sure evil players can't pass the ring, and if the person who claimed to have got rid of it was telling the truth or not. There is way too much uncertainty, and I believe only a non-town party would be trying to push a bad plan to get the ring Unless you can come up with a really good reason you care so much about the ring bearer ##Vote TranceStorm This is a bunk vote. Bad plans are pushed all the time, mostly by townies as scum generally have very little motivation to push a bad plan. Bad plans need refinement, not votes. Fact is, if the player who has the ring DOES pass it, he should likely claim. Either he is counterclaimed later when frodo/bilbo actually passes it, or he is confirmed. It doesn't help us immensely, but it certainly doesn't hinder. Radfield returns the favor defending TranceStorm. No one look at Trancestorm, he's just a bad townie with a bad plan. Show nested quote +On September 17 2011 15:27 TranceStorm wrote:
@DrH. Fine, those are valid points. I didn't fully flesh out my plan as well as I imagined it would be and underestimated the risks.
But, wouldn't it be a good idea to set the rule that if a player does ever pass on the ring, they reveal its powers? We already know that everyone wants the ring (both town and non-town) so I think it would be beneficial to town discussion to know the ring powers. (if they don't change like you fear they might). Many people criticize his plan. Trancestorm makes an effort to address everything thrown at him and when it seems like he's failing to convince people he adds the customary "at least I'm generating discussion which is TOWN". But to DrH, it's simply: You're right. I made a bad plan and you, and only you, get the credit for correcting me. Good job. Only DrH gets him to see the error of his plan when other people have already chimed in with what is essentially the same arguments. Show nested quote +On September 19 2011 04:25 TranceStorm wrote:On September 19 2011 04:20 prplhz wrote:
in case i didn't make it clear i thought that drh could do better and he was acting weird, that's why i voted him first. when that didn't catch on too well i switched to jack, another person who i thought should be doing a lot better. think it's too late for me to move my vote so i doubt i'm gonna do that.
i have attacked just about 1 guy and only said that 3 people were scummy, i'm sure you can find other people who have thrown more accusations around 'cause that's not really too bad. i think most of all this voting me is because cyriander suddenly came out of nowhere and said i was a good guy and apparently i'm his pal or something, but you should really be questioning him instead 'cause that's very weird day1 after a couple of posts from me that i agree could be interpreted as scummy ... but this is too late and something that can be done tomorrow. i think people should switch their votes to wbg me and jack.
i also want to tell sandroba and palmar that i have the eru-iluvatar-given ability to instantly kill them at my will if they don't start posting. You made a long analysis to justify why you voted for Dr. H. Then you changed to Jackal (after he had already received a couple of votes) saying that you wanted to pressure him. There is still no justification at all for you vote. Considering that you had already shown that you were willing to give analysis on other people, I find your vote super suspicious hence my vote. Now you say that it's too late for you to move your vote. You still haven't justified your vote at all, and are basically admitting that you didn't have one in the first place. End of the day, he votes for the candidate who makes an analysis attacking DrH. ----- Now what else do we have: - The late bandwagons and his voting patterns. - Really anti-iGrok, but who wasn't? (oh yeah me). Attacking cyber_cheese primarily for his votes and for defending iGrok. Rayn is right. This little interaction between the two of them is a little weird. I have no idea what to make of it but at best, only one of the town is mafia. Am I entirely convinced? Not completely. Radfield did a really good job of getting townies to do what he wanted. ON had many of the same mistakes and he flipped town. The late bandwagons are iffy at best as tells for alignment, and Cyber and TS can just be two townies who can't stop tunneling each other. TS was simply the better alternative to Cyber at the time. Show nested quote +On October 02 2011 18:48 heist wrote:
If it really comes down to the wire I have an iron claim. Imagine a LOTR character that HAS to be in this game simply for their importance. That's me. mr bigshsot. so ya no use voting for me. oh ya whos the other medic? confirmed townie foor sure.
Mig I wish you the best in all your endeavors.
It's LYLO so you might as well claim. I find it curious that you are trying to making yourself a confirmed town based on the fact that you have to be in the game, yet you're willing to vote Merry in an instant.
Yes I've changed my mind on TS. Looking over his history, I realized a lot of my suspicions were based on TS being led by Radfield. I already made the mistake with ON, every other vibe about TS is telling me town.
Also, Merry's got nothing on Elrond.
|
I'm actually a little bothered that you aren't dead. Why haven't mafia RBed Drazerk and killed you Kita?
At this point, Drazerk and Chaoser are confirmed non-mafia.
Everyone else:
Cyber_cheese
GGQ
TS
Kita (iffy I know)
Depending on the number of mafia left, that's who I'd kill in order.
|
Also, do we not have a Gimli?
|
GGQ, cyber_cheese. either is fine for me.
|
Only a very very minor one. You won't think it's much of a breadcrumb tbh.
On September 28 2011 07:11 heist wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2011 07:08 Drazerk wrote:On September 28 2011 07:08 heist wrote:
Drazerk, do you honestly believe chaoser or kita will flip mafia? No which is why I am not voting for either at the moment I think you and I are in the same boat, contrary to the confidence Palmar has.
Same boat. We're the same role. Also, if things get ugly, I get a free boat ride outta here, exclusive only to elves.
|
On October 03 2011 04:42 chaoser wrote:lol, that's not even a breadcrumb. You're not even talking about the same thing. Since the beginning of the game you've only ever defended people. The only person you try to make a case on is Drazerk. Show nested quote +On September 23 2011 08:45 heist wrote:
First of all, if radfield didn't use his ability, then mafia can claim safely. It's a possibility so no, no one is confirmed townie.
What i want to know. Who killed Radfield? If what kita said is true, which, his logs seem to match, then not only did heist try to stop kita from claiming here but also bluefished for who killed Radfield. Kita, you previously only posted part of your logs with the time stamp, can you post the rest of it?
On October 03 2011 04:53 chaoser wrote:Also, you post this: Show nested quote +On September 23 2011 21:15 heist wrote:
Also, Archon you aren't getting by with self-proclaimed sheep vote. Assume iGrok is 3rd party. Who would be your lynch? Even if iGrok flips mafia, does that tell you anything about the other players? What are thoughts on the people on the Jackal lynch? Basically I want more than what you are giving. Archon never responds back to you on that and posts: Show nested quote +On September 24 2011 22:34 Archon_Toilet wrote:
GOT SOMETHING STICKING IN MY EYYYYYYYYYYYYYYE spam for the next few posts and yet you moved on to ON, never to look back on Archon again. Also why do you think TS is no longer mafia?
1. Archon's been doing stuff like that all game. I was just annoyed at him for being useless, not for surefire scumminess.
2. If you look through, you'll realize Drazerk is certainly not the only person I try to make a case on.
3. So... at that point in the game, we should have automatically believed any claim of secret communication with Radfield? Nothing wrong with my logic there.
4. All of the TS stuff hinges on TS and Radfield deliberately working together as a mafia team. When in actuality, it's much more plausible he just followed him because he seemed like such a good townie.
|
I was getting tired of protecting Drazerk night in, night out. Mafia were avoiding Drazerk like the plague. I decided to protect someone whom I thought town to try and get another confirmed townie.
|
Why do people believe there are still 3 mafia left?
And guys I am confirmed town. I don't know why I'm even up for debate...
Kita answer me this. In your best guess, why haven't mafia RBed Drazerk and killed you?
|
Why would 3 mafia have 2 KP? Doesn't it round down? But anyways, irrelevant. I'll be keeping my vote on cyber_cheese.
|
Let's assume you have this power. Why the hell have you been using it every night? I'm not gonna lie, this is a terrible power you revealed.
Either you have a 50% chance to die for nothing if you hide behind mafia
or
You throw someone else in front of you (someone who could actually have blue powers) just to save yourself.
|
So you choose someone to hide behind. You get targetted. And instead of that person taking the hit for you, you come out and save the two of you?
What's with this "if", won't you live regardless of being targeted if you are hiding?
|
|
|
Lemme get this straight:
1. Any attacks on you will miss.
2. The only way to kill you at night (assuming you target a townie) is if your target gets hit. The hit will apply to both of you.
3. Yet you can also protect your target?
wtf?
|
On October 03 2011 13:16 Cyber_Cheese wrote:Show nested quote +On October 03 2011 13:10 heist wrote:
Let's assume you have this power. Why the hell have you been using it every night? I'm not gonna lie, this is a terrible power you revealed.
Either you have a 50% chance to die for nothing if you hide behind mafia
or
You throw someone else in front of you (someone who could actually have blue powers) just to save yourself.
Because then if I survive I can protect the person I was behind.
Explain.
|
Well I'm done for the night. Your claim isn't really backed by anything. So either we believe you or we don't.
|
ok Drazerk. you and me. hero medic time.
|
Of course.
I think it's about a 50/50 toss-up between TS and Kita. I find it extremely suspicious Kita wasn't killed off. If it comes down to the two of them, I'll probably lean toward Kita as the last mafia unless something happens that really changes my mind.
|
Drazerk nooooo! I shall avenge you, my daughter(?)
sry i got roleblocked.
|
don't even say roleblocked. who'd you track?
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
