EPTOr since his post you just kinda TLDR'd all of my posts? Be honest, really I don't care, just wanna know lol
Closed Casket Mafia - Page 58
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JeeJee
Canada5652 Posts
Or since his post you just kinda TLDR'd all of my posts? Be honest, really I don't care, just wanna know lol | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22631 Posts
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Palmar
Iceland22631 Posts
On July 09 2011 13:24 JeeJee wrote: Was my rebuttal of his argument not good enough? Or since his post you just kinda TLDR'd all of my posts? Be honest, really I don't care, just wanna know lol I did not, I actually went back and found some interesting bits on my own. Little things like Radfield not committing hard on the RoL lynch. this thing here: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewpost.php?post_id=10105934 And of course the fact that I wanted to kill him back on day one, but it never took off. I had Radfield on my shit-list all through the game. I just... also had ILJ on my shitlist, and everyone seemed to agree with me on that. | ||
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Incognito
United States2071 Posts
On July 09 2011 13:22 Palmar wrote: Nah, after Amber attacked you it was pretty much a sealed deal, I think I was never going to change my mind after that. On June 21 2011 16:11 Ver wrote: 2) When a townie gets lynched, go back and reread the game. Every single time a townie gets lynched. Go look at Incongito's posts day 1. Look at how dang wrong he was on almost everything. Effectively a daytime vigilante working for the mafia. Now look at his posts and actions on day 2. Nuking Chezinu, putting the noose all but around Ace, you'd think he's a different person! What happened here? Quite simply, after the day 1 disaster, Incognito realized he was looking in the wrong places and approaching the game from an incorrect viewpoint. So he shed all his former beliefs and took a fresh, objective look at the game without letting his emotions get in the way. Lo and behold, he suddenly had great insights and really put the mafia in a nasty position. 8) Even if you think someone is mafia, read their posts objectively!!! The most flagrant example of this was when Foolishness completely quit reading Incognito's posts when he started shaping up in day 2, completely missing the gamebreaking case on Ace. Many people also downplayed Dreamflower's major accusation on Ace because they were suspicious of her behavior from early on. Its usually a bad deal to stick to your guns so much that you start ignoring posts. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22631 Posts
On July 09 2011 07:22 JeeJee wrote: ILJ was wrong when he said he checked during night 0. also didn't help your case. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22631 Posts
I'll admit, I think you somewhere said that citi.zen wanted sandroba shot and not lynched, and that got me thinking... erm... what? Anyway, I'm not good enough at this game to make last-minute game-saving plays. If the derpfest that was town needed to hinge on me saving the game then I guess it was a lost case anyway. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22631 Posts
I have absolutely no faith in my scum-reads, which could be a really bad thing, but after repeatedly shooting cops in PTP I kind of stopped believing my self. If I voted citi.zen and lost, people would be like "you fucking idiot" and if I voted JeeJee and lost no one could say a thing because half the town said he was mafia anyway. I can admit that this really mattered. This is a stupid and shallow point of view, instead of playing to win, playing not to get blamed. I seriously need to work on my game, I get so much stuff wrong. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
With all the misinformation that was thrown around it is I guess, decent the Town made it to a 1 vs 2 situation. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22631 Posts
I think most everyone had RoL on their shortlist for scum, which was why it was so easy to turn around the lynch dt first policy when fishball claimed. | ||
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Palmar
Iceland22631 Posts
Basically asking how to improve. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
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Ver
United States2186 Posts
On July 09 2011 13:57 Palmar wrote: btw, I'm not asking "what was so bad" in the sense "why are you not saying I am good" but much more "why was the argument bad for town, and how should I have dealt with it" Basically asking how to improve. The main thing, aside from forming conclusions about people and then refusing to re-analyze them (i,e chez and jeejee), was not weighing certain things correctly. The thing is you saw Citizen's post about lynching Chez and vigi'ing Sandroba and had the knowledge that a hit on RoL was blocked by a mafia doctor that didn't get revealed. Literally that's all the evidence you need, bang, dead. There are certain things that just automatically confirm someone mafia, so once you have that, stick with it. There wasn't anything on Jeejee that made him mafia, just some suspicious things overall that could be explained in many ways from a townie perspective. Also, wow! On June 30 2011 06:07 Chezinu wrote: So is this what we have so far? RebirthOfLeGenD ilovejonn GMarshal sandroba Amber[LighT] LSB deconduo Caller Palmar BloodyC0bbler Fishball Radfield Chezinu VisceraEyes Scamp GGQ Jackal58 Kurumi | ||
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Chezinu
United States7432 Posts
On July 09 2011 12:42 Ace wrote: Also citi.zen made a great claim that was hard to deal with. He was an unconfirmed power role that made you guys believe he was confirmed and JeeJee was the only one to question it. Now I'm convinced that no one reads my posts.. Let me unbury | ||
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Chezinu
United States7432 Posts
On July 03 2011 05:35 Chezinu wrote: You think there are 3 remaining instead of 2? Radfield was acting strange the whole time he played. Then citi.zen posted a strange post when he joined. Plus: As for sand, he hasn't been nice to me all game. Plus: Then Jack thought my list wasn't pretty enough, so I made adjustment. Jackal still is not satisfied with me. Hasn't been ever since.. If I mistakenly accused a blue of being red on accident rather than on purpose to protect them, then: town list lovejonn sandroba Amber[LighT] LSB deconduo Caller Palmar citi.zen Chezinu Jackal58 Kurumi On July 03 2011 09:44 Chezinu wrote: self claims so far: Ilovejonn sandroba Amber[LighT] LSB Caller Palmar citi.zen Chezinu Jackal58 Kurumi I don't think it wise for medic to claim green.. I'm considering citi.zen as scum again. Either A) he has good insight into people's align or B) he knows people's align because he is mafia.. not quite sure.. he is a clever fellow.. but he made the judgments rather rashly.. hmm On July 03 2011 11:45 Chezinu wrote: Looks like only me and citi.zen saw through this,.. Seems he was telling the truth.. He really is a clever fellow! Too bad the rest of town killed in haste. On July 03 2011 11:48 Chezinu wrote: DIE citi.zen DIE!!!! Poor excuse for killing Caller when you previously stated that you thought both Fishball and Caller were innocent! Your no policy lyncher!! YOU THINK YOU CAN GET TOWN TO LYNCH ME??? DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE!!!!! On July 03 2011 11:50 Chezinu wrote: Serious Detective That's right! I'm not afraid of you!! citi.zen DIE DIE DIE I totally think that citi.zen is mafia! On July 03 2011 11:54 Chezinu wrote: Caller's role obv got flipped. So citi,zen why did you kill Caller -- why did you change your mind? On July 03 2011 12:15 Chezinu wrote: YOU MAFIAS ARE SO CRUEL! First you killed GGQ... THAT IS A MOVE I WOULD MAKE! I GOT YOUR MESSAGE! GG...YEAH WELL I HOPE YOUR HAPPY!!! Going for the blue roles...knowing full well that the begining posters had roles... THEN YOU KILLED MY TEAM MEMBERS!!! FIRST SUICIDAL SCAMP!!!! THEN LEGENDARY REBIRTHOFLEGEND!! YOU KILLED YOUR OWN KIND IN SPITE OF ME!!! THEN YOU KILLED FISHBALL, WHOM I SECRETLY LOVED DESPITE HIS STINCH!! BUT WORST OF ALL, YOU HAD TO KILL CALLER!!!!! WHO DO I HAVE LEFT!!! WHOO??? ARE YOU GOING TO KILL THEM TOO??? ARE YOU GOING TO USE MY INNOCENTS AGAINST ME??? ARE YOU GOING TO CALL ME A GODFATHER?? If you can make me godfather and let me join your team -- I surely will!  IF YOU KILL ME TONIGHT, KNOW THIS: YOU MAY MISS THE MOST EPIC MAFIA ENDING EVER!!! DON'T PRETEND YOU ARE SLEEPING AND CANT HEAR ME!! I KNOW YOUR AWAKE!!! YOUR GOING ABOUT THIS TOWN THIS VERY MOMENT TRYING TO KILL YOUR NEXT VICTIM!!! IF YOU DECIDE NOT TO KILL ANYONE TONIGHT JUST IN SPITE OF ME THEN GO AHEAD!!!! DO IT!!! I WANT YOU TOO!!!On July 07 2011 22:25 Chezinu wrote: ilovejonn's role supports LSB's role LSB says he rolechecked me and it came back vanilla townie LSB claims he shot RoL -- RoL said he was protected -- only medic claim was Kurumi -- Can you confirm this? Jackal58 confirms Amber -- jackal58 says Amber is innocent, never mentioned a possibility that Amber could be mafia citi.zen claims roles will be revealed with his role since he lived long enough (however this happened right after RoL, the Mafia Janitor died). Palmar claims he is a virgin. voting trends: ilovejonn votes with LSB innocent list: LSB -- if medic can confirm protecting him (both ilj and kurumi can't be mafia) Amber -- I guess all we can do is hope that Jackal58 new 100% that amber was innocent as explain in Amber's PMs. conclusion: If Kurumi says he did protect LSB then I will probably be inclined to look at Palmar and citi.zen. If Kurumi says he didn't protect LSB then I will probably be inclined to look at ilj and LSB Here are my thoughts from earlier that I didn't have time to explain: | ||
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citi.zen
2509 Posts
1. Rely on strong fundamentals, don't try to be a hero. Look at Fishball's play as town if you want a very good example of someone who thinks critically, calls nonsense when he sees it, and takes charge when activity is lagging. If other townies followed his lead and played a similar solid style instead of trying to set clever "traps" for each other, we'd be looking at a different outcome. 2. In 9 out of 10 cases, lying as town is a very bad idea. Even if you are an otherwise strong player, you should generally not do it. Town was at a huge advantage right after Fishball claimed DT - I thought the game was over and done. Then, out of the blue BOTH Caller and BC made up really fancy lies and gave the reds a slim chance to get back in it. 3. Play to your audience. I am sure in the past few days it became clear to many spectators I was red. I didn't care - I wasn't trying to fool them. I could have argued with JeeJee about the specifics of his argument and suggested he must in fact be the "missing" scum doctor based on voting records and the fact that his claimed role was never actually proven. Instead, I chose to bypass that entire argument and simply reinforce the remaining player's existing suspicions - because I knew they were there. 4. Don't give up! JeeJee did a terrific job piecing the entire puzzle together and argued it very well down to the very end. Conversely, as a red, don't "freeze" when you can't come up with an explanation of events that makes sense to you. Start with the conclusion that you are innocent, then change any assumption you need to. A real innocent like JeeJee will say: if the world you see does not make sense with my as an innocent, you are simply looking at it wrong; come see it from my angle. 5. Chez scares me more than anyone else when I am red and he is town. From the moment I joined it was my number one goal to get rid of him one way or another. His day 1 list of suspects is clear evidence he maphacks. He also immediately thought of questioning my role claim, or at least very clearly state that a role =/= alignment. Special credit goes to sandroba, because much of his activity was invisible to others. The role claim that ultimately won the game was his merit as much as mine, we discussed it on skype at length. He was also very quick to recognize when he had no way back into the game and took the initiative to pm me to buss him, instead of pouting and/or asking me to go down with him. I put down the very first vote on him and that went a long way to buying me credibility once he flipped red. That is what team play is about. Also, thanks Ace for hosting. It's always a pleasure. | ||
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Chezinu
United States7432 Posts
Just curious, was it your plan to paint me as godfather as I stated in the thread? That what it seemed like from my perspective. Every death seemed like a setup to get me lynched. | ||
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Chezinu
United States7432 Posts
On July 09 2011 15:12 citi.zen wrote: 5. Chez scares me more than anyone else when I am red and he is town. From the moment I joined it was my number one goal to get rid of him one way or another. His day 1 list of suspects is clear evidence he maphacks. He also immediately thought of questioning my role claim, or at least very clearly state that a role =/= alignment. I love taunting mafia, lol!!! But it does come with a price. It makes people suspicious of me. | ||
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citi.zen
2509 Posts
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Chezinu
United States7432 Posts
On July 09 2011 15:26 citi.zen wrote: Oh yeah, I even said as few times I thought you were GF. I wanted you either shot by LSB or lynched, so I tried to discredit you as much as I could. And I did notice the serious detective bread crumb - that unsettled me a bit :-) The mistake I made --> I should have listen to myself more. I find it hard for me to go with my instincts when I'm a vanilla townie. | ||
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sandroba
Canada4998 Posts
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