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suicideyear
Ivory Coast3016 Posts
On July 21 2016 01:31 GolemMadness wrote: I believe the current plan is for the new TL subs to be the next TLA if the current TLA qualifies for LCS. its frankly embarrassing that riot allows teams to do this "CS team makes LCS, sell team for $$$, buy a new cs team" rinse and repeat thing | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
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Redox
Germany24794 Posts
http://en.intelextrememasters.com/news/how-league-of-legends-teams-will-qualify-for-intelR-extreme-masters-season-11/ So it will be 3 NA, 3 KR and 2 EU teams participating in the first 2 IEM which are Katowice qualfiers. Sucks for EU fans. | ||
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Sent.
Poland9332 Posts
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
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Gahlo
United States35174 Posts
On August 18 2016 08:19 GrandInquisitor wrote: I'm mostly confused as to why 2017 IEM Katowice is going to be based off of 2016 Worlds seeding. That's a pretty long gap of time. Because unfortunately Worlds is the best metric that exists for regional strength. | ||
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
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Gahlo
United States35174 Posts
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Ansibled
United Kingdom9872 Posts
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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
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Gahlo
United States35174 Posts
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Letmelose
Korea (South)3227 Posts
As is mentioned in these various sources, much of this stems from the fact that everything Riot Games does with the e-Sports scene is to maximize the profits made from the game itself, and the actual well being of the competitive scene itself is a mere afterthought. Everything single decision they make is so obviously catered towards the casual playerbase in order to exploit them as much as humanely possible, and it's impossible to expect a change with their basic philosophy and the inevitable dire consequences from that, made worse by the fact that Riot Games has full control over every possible realm involving League of Legends. I really did want to like the League of Legends scene, but after a while, the sobering realization of the true state of things really does put a toll on your affection for the competitive scene despite the grandeur of it all. There's simply no substance. It's just Riot Games pulling all the strings, and at the base of it all, it doesn't feel like a legitimate e-Sports because of that. I want the genius players to mold the meta-game, not at the hands of the balance team, I want to see the evolution of great players as they gain experience and accrue every subtle nuansances of the game, not to hop through every new patch changes that provides sweat new timing windows for that lucrative skin sales. Even if it is all bullshit, I at least want the illusion that what the players fight for matters, that it has integrity, and has meaning beyond making the pockets of the higher ups a little bit fuller. Riot Games has failed miserably in that regard, and it seems to me that those familiar with other e-Sports scenes has to suffer through most pathetic rationalization Riot Games puts out to veil their true colors. At least be slick about it, please. It's such a shame because I don't think we've ever had a gaming title that gained such a following across all regions have its transition into the competitive scene so smoothly and be received so well across the globe, and this could have been the e-Sports scene that changed the landscape of mainstream culture. Instead, we have all the numbers, the hype, the drama, the revenue, and the fights for said revenue, but not much substance over actual game play that it is all supposed to revolve around. Where's the push to create a stable evolution of patches that adds depth and balance to the game, when we have glossing over glaring bugs and balance issues in order to churn out the next wave of changes that'll create money maker rolling? What's with the fixation on crowd interaction with the players, rather than bringing in sound-proof booths on a game that is based around hiding information and playing around the fog of war? What's with Riot Gaming being a control freak with every little thing out there when it has been proven time and time again that while they are superb at keeping that cash inflow going, they suck ass at running an awesome, legitimate e-Sports scene? | ||
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
All esports exist solely to "make the pockets of the higher ups a little bit fuller". You think TI6 exists because GabeN believes in the true eternal beauty of competition? TI6 exists because it makes Valve money. LCS exists because it makes Riot money. It's how the world works. | ||
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Frolossus
United States4779 Posts
On August 25 2016 07:03 GrandInquisitor wrote: lol dude, you are being a little dramatic. Chill out. All esports exist solely to "make the pockets of the higher ups a little bit fuller". You think TI6 exists because GabeN believes in the true eternal beauty of competition? TI6 exists because it makes Valve money. LCS exists because it makes Riot money. It's how the world works. melee sure as shit does not. in fact it's still pretty much the same grass roots scene it's been for over a decade nintendo didn't officially support the tournaments for at least a decade | ||
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
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Letmelose
Korea (South)3227 Posts
On August 25 2016 07:03 GrandInquisitor wrote: lol dude, you are being a little dramatic. Chill out. All esports exist solely to "make the pockets of the higher ups a little bit fuller". You think TI6 exists because GabeN believes in the true eternal beauty of competition? TI6 exists because it makes Valve money. LCS exists because it makes Riot money. It's how the world works. Although I am not familiar with the Dota 2 scene at all, the fact of the matter is that ultimately, their goals may be identical, but the surrounding circumstances and the approach may be entirely different. It could be possible that Riot Games has more of a monopoly over their competitive scene, and the end result is a scene that is a more tightly controlled, streamlined money making machine for the parent company (which often comes at the cost of a legitimate competitive scene that feels artificially managed for the benefit of the parent company). Of course everyone is out there to make most of their opportunity to rake in that sweet cash, but the question is how do we feel about the level to which they can act on that impulse. I think it's unfortunate that the parent company has the ability to dictate the landscape of its competitive scene to the level Riot Games has, given they are bound to abuse the hell out of it given their ulterior motives. Perhaps you are fine with the direction Riot Games has been taking , and the freedom with which they can impose their will. Yes, we'll never have a popular enough competitive scene without someone trying to monetize the hell out of it even the cost of compromising its integrity, but given enough restrictions, I believe it's possible to retain some semblance of integrity and retain some healthy balance to the overall scene. Right now, Riot Games has zero restrictions, are the gods of their own domain, and we are entirely at the mercy of their whims. And between me and you, I think they are doing a completely shit job from an e-Sports perspective, and I don't think it's dramatic of me to vocalize my frustrations. | ||
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On August 25 2016 05:02 Letmelose wrote: Everything single decision they make is so obviously catered towards the casual playerbase in order to exploit them as much as humanely possible Riot Games has failed miserably in that regard, and it seems to me that those familiar with other e-Sports scenes has to suffer through most pathetic rationalization Riot Games puts out to veil their true colors. At least be slick about it, please. What's with Riot Gaming being a control freak with every little thing out there when it has been proven time and time again that while they are superb at keeping that cash inflow going, they suck ass at running an awesome, legitimate e-Sports scene? I think it's unfortunate that the parent company has the ability to dictate the landscape of its competitive scene to the level Riot Games has, given they are bound to abuse the hell out of it given their ulterior motives. Right now, Riot Games has zero restrictions, are the gods of their own domain, and we are entirely at the mercy of their whims. I think they are doing a completely shit job from an e-Sports perspective I don't think it's dramatic of me to vocalize my frustrations. Yes, you're not being dramatic.  (I feel like this is why I end up being the Official Riot Apologist, because the Riot-haters are so dramatic in their vitriol and hatred it's just staggering. You don't really see Riot dicksuckers being so dramatic.) As an initial matter, it's hard for me to understand how "everything single decision they make is so obviously catered towards the casual playerbase in order to exploit them as much as humanely possible" [sic]. So when Riot updates Leona's passive "to display the damage text to Leona when her allies proc Sunlight", that's exploiting the casual playerbase? Or when Riot fixes Yasuo's R->Q bug, that's exploiting casuals? OK, I hear you saying. I obviously just meant BALANCE decisions, not stuff like that. Sure. Riot nerfing Ashe R damage, buffing Diana E, or any of these other balance changes - you call that exploitation? How is that different than what any other company does? OK, I hear you backtracking. I obviously just meant ESPORTS decisions. Sure. So when Riot determined Worlds seeding based on MSI results, that's exploiting casuals. When they shifted to a Bo2/3 system instead of Bo1. When they added mid lane streams. When they added analyst desk. All of that is exploiting casuals. Why? The fact of the matter is, SOME of Riot's decisions really are "exploiting" casuals (see, e.g., Hextech crafting), but it's so odd to frame it that way, because it's only true if you also accept that Riot's fundamental existence, and the existence of every other corporation on the face of the earth, is to "exploit" their customers. That's what capitalism is! People make amazing things and in return we pay them for it. I mean, sure, you can call buying a burrito to be "exploitation" by Chipotle, but people are gonna look at you pretty weird for saying that. That's the point I was trying to get at earlier. Yes, LCS "exploits casuals", but that is the point of LCS. LCS doesn't exist because Riot hates money and wants to give it to Asian nerds. LCS exists because it sells RP. Of course, that doesn't mean that Riot can totally abandon the ideals that you want Riot to uphold. If Riot rigged Worlds so that NA teams would always be in the finals, it's not going to be good for LCS. So there's a balance to be struck. Every decision has to consider both the "competitive integrity" side (for lack of a better word to describe what you're apparently seeking) and the profits side. Some decisions will come down on one side, some will come down on the other, and the vast majority are just totally irrelevant. But you can't just take every decision that comes down on the profits side and hold it up as proof that Riot "is abusing the hell out of it for ulterior motives", because if they actually did that, LCS would be donezo pretty quickly. At the end of the day, I think it's interesting that you assert that Riot does a "completely shit job" at esports. I think you feel the need to repeat this a lot because, rationally speaking, if you think Riot is doing a completely shit job, then just don't watch it. And if people all think that Riot is doing a completely shit job, then Riot isn't going to be making money off of LCS any more. But given how many people watch LCS, it seems like most people think they are doing a pretty good job. | ||
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Fildun
Netherlands4124 Posts
For me the main problem I have with Riot is that they constantly talk about a "healthy and sustainable ecosystem" for LoL but don't actually do much to make it happen. It's like they just expect the teams to do everything they want them to while for certain teams it might just be a much better decision to abandon LoL and invest heavily in other esports instead. The last good decision imo on that front was the minimum salary but that's 3 years ago. Are Riot doing badly right now? No, most certainly not. Could they be doing a lot better? Probably yes. | ||
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MuddyJam
535 Posts
that post is full of so much vanity and smugness its unreal. As a side note if Riot fixed worlds for audience, It would be Korea vs China every time. No esport is realistically going to match lol any time soon. Fighting games growing very slowily. SC is not growing and nobody is going to make a new RTS aimed at esports. Dota has been pushed into one central tournament to spike interest in that one month then keep a low profile. Other moba games have been created and all crashed. Being on weekly as the de facto epsort is very strong and pushed out competition. But as you learn more about the scene it becomes more of a scam (in some sense). People don't like how lol is at the highest level. The game is mostly about macro play and rotation. Instead we focus on jazzing up the champions/kills as its more about working as an advert for lol then about the game. Its about jayce getting buffed so people see him on screen and try him out. Maybe buy a skin, you are not going to be using that skin of the champ that is now out of the meta. With rapid patching the game becomes more about showcasing the latest game play then true matches of skill. So don't pretend its a great competition when its more of an entertainment show with stronger links to WWE than say the Olympics. | ||
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Zato-1
Chile4253 Posts
On August 26 2016 06:28 MuddyJam wrote: @GrandInquisitor that post is full of so much vanity and smugness its unreal. As a side note if Riot fixed worlds for audience, It would be Korea vs China every time. GrandInquisitor's post seems pretty sensible to me? I can see some people having a problem with the tone of it, but the message is spot-on. | ||
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