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kainzero
United States5211 Posts
On April 16 2013 09:44 onlywonderboy wrote: All I see is Elementz channeling his inner Xiaoxiao, I fail to see the problem. unless elementz zips up his pants after every game i refuse to believe this also, iirc xiaoxiao is the captain of his team | ||
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Neverhood
United States5388 Posts
On April 16 2013 09:59 Thermia wrote: Except he has been, all you have to do is look at his solo queue. It obviously isn't the end-all but a professional has no excuse to be in plat 4 in season 3 even as a support. He's been in my smurf's division all season for hundreds of games and I don't do anything on it but play bad champs in weird lanes and random things. I'm honestly amazed Curse has been doing as well as they have in LCS but I guess it's hard to get stomped in lane 2v1; it'd be much more obvious without laneswapping. Yea I completely agree. Everyone says soloq doesn't mean shit when it comes to competitive play and it's mostly true but there's obviously something wrong when you're at low plat after like 500 games | ||
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LaM
United States1321 Posts
On April 16 2013 09:50 onlywonderboy wrote: I think a lot of people are jumping on this hate on Elementz bandwagon a little bit too hard. How quick everyone is to forget how well he played in the first six weeks or so of the LCS. He's slumping, he needs to improve, but it's been a few weeks, it's not like he's been playing this poorly for months on end. Edit: That said if they replaced him with someone better I wouldn't mind. Honestly I'd be okay if they wanted to try out AtomicN since he was playing for Curse Academy (also his Sona was a beast). Not muffinqt though, that seems like a lateral movement I don't know man. You can only call so many people haters for so long before it becomes apparent Elementz has been a lackluster and unmotivated player for years, and is universally regarded by pros and pub players alike as incredibly sub par. He does not lane well, can not land Sona ults and other key abilities, is fucking PLATINUM in solo q and hasn't been near the top of the ladder as far back as I can remember (say what you will about solo q, this does matter, you can't be at sub 2k for months and months on end as a pro, that's embarrassing). It's a bandwagon again recently, but it's warranted. 12 straight losses in scrims to CLG where the Crs bot lane (and Cop takes blame here too) gets absolutely murdered 2v2 (and even performs poorly in team fights after 2v1s) is just the latest, most obvious thing people can speak to. Elementz isn't the worst player ever, but he shouldn't be the support for the best team in LCS. I'm not sure he should even be in LCS. And Saint might be an asshole, but he's honest. And if he's truthful about Elementz work ethic, (something that rings true to me) that should really be the final nail in the coffin. | ||
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DonKey_
Liechtenstein1356 Posts
On April 16 2013 09:50 onlywonderboy wrote: I think a lot of people are jumping on this hate on Elementz bandwagon a little bit too hard. How quick everyone is to forget how well he played in the first six weeks or so of the LCS. He's slumping, he needs to improve, but it's been a few weeks, it's not like he's been playing this poorly for months on end. Edit: That said if they replaced him with someone better I wouldn't mind. Honestly I'd be okay if they wanted to try out AtomicN since he was playing for Curse Academy (also his Sona was a beast). Not muffinqt though, that seems like a lateral movement I think the biggest problem is Elementz always loses 2v2 lanes. The beginning of LCS was the highlight of his career, most this can be attributed to curse always playing 2v1 tops too. I feel his "slump" now is basically how he's always was, and emphasizes how far behind he is as a support compared to everyone else. edit: I'm biased though, I admit this. I've disliked Elementz since CLG. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19573 Posts
There are plenty of 50 year olds who could get past plat 4 if it was their job. | ||
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zulu_nation8
China26351 Posts
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Artok
Netherlands2219 Posts
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JBright
Vancouver14381 Posts
On April 16 2013 10:06 zulu_nation8 wrote: if they wanna replace elementz they would need to poach an LCS support Trade deadline is over. Will need to get one of their subs. | ||
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Vlanitak
Norway3045 Posts
On April 16 2013 10:06 zulu_nation8 wrote: if they wanna replace elementz they would need to poach an LCS support Has happened before. If anything they wont bench or anything prior to the playoffs. Finding and practicing with a new support this close to playoffs is pretty much begging to have your bot lane ruined. They might be weak currently, but at least they know. They could grab rhux and try again | ||
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qanik
Denmark1899 Posts
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onlywonderboy
United States23745 Posts
On April 16 2013 10:03 LaM wrote: I don't know man. You can only call so many people haters for so long before it becomes apparent Elementz has been a lackluster and unmotivated player for years, and is universally regarded by pros and pub players alike as incredibly sub par. He does not lane well, can not land Sona ults and other key abilities, is fucking PLATINUM in solo q and hasn't been near the top of the ladder as far back as I can remember (say what you will about solo q, this does matter, you can't be at sub 2k for months and months on end as a pro, that's embarrassing). It's a bandwagon again recently, but it's warranted. 12 straight losses in scrims to CLG where the Crs bot lane (and Cop takes blame here too) gets absolutely murdered 2v2 (and even performs poorly in team fights after 2v1s) is just the latest, most obvious thing people can speak to. Elementz isn't the worst player ever, but he shouldn't be the support for the best team in LCS. I'm not sure he should even be in LCS. And Saint might be an asshole, but he's honest. And if he's truthful about Elementz work ethic, (something that rings true to me) that should really be the final nail in the coffin. That I wholeheartedly agree with. He had been getting the job done, but now teams are focusing Curse's Bot lane and he's becoming a liability. | ||
NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
On April 16 2013 10:22 onlywonderboy wrote: That I wholeheartedly agree with. He had been getting the job done, but now teams are focusing Curse's Bot lane and he's becoming a liability. Being a liability is the crux of the problem. You can't play a role and bring your team down as a result; at worst you need to be a neutral/slightly positive asset to team. Cop is also catching a lot of flak for Curse's abysmal bot lane but to be honest, it's ok for Cop to skirt by like he has all season long (hi Cop's KDA). He doesn't need to play brilliantly. Curse revolves heavily around their Top/Mid/Jungle, so as long as Cop afk farms until 40 minutes and comes out with 4+ items, he's doing his job as expected. That's the bottom line. The sad thing for Elementz is that he's a detriment and more often than not, he baits Cop into a bad position and severely hinders Cop's afk farm mode as a result. | ||
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Parnage
United States7414 Posts
Just because CLG(read: Doublelift) is making fun of him doesn't mean you all have to jump on and join the bandwagon. What I am trying to say is, I was disliking Elementz before it was cool and even I think people are going a tad too far. I'd like to hope he picks up his game soon because not many other choices for supports around. My dream is Chauster tired of being Hotshot's swapbitch will take a deal with Curse and turn Cop into Doublelift 2.0 only without the massive jerk ego. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
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Kenpark
Germany2350 Posts
Did these guys never play any sport or were in a team were you learn about teamspirit and stuff ? | ||
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NeoIllusions
United States37500 Posts
From how I feel, we (TL users) are just calling it as we see it. Even the diehard Curse fanboys we have here. @Kenpark: qft. You can think all you want about Ele but it should've been done privately. I honestly think Ele's confidence is utterly crushed after the past 48-72 hours. no kid. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
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LaNague
Germany9118 Posts
Either your work it out as a team or you cant take it anymore and replace. At least thats what i learned from water polo ^^ | ||
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red_
United States8474 Posts
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On April 16 2013 11:06 red_ wrote: I don't really care about how good or bad Elementz really is(for this discussion), Saint is in my opinion being an indefensible asshole about the whole thing. First and most obvious, he's handling it all 'in the media'(the esports equivalent). Secondly, what he is airing publicly is filled with some bullshit anyway. He spent like 3 minutes of his vlog talking about how Elementz is clearly bad because he wouldn't vote for himself as best in his position. Did Saint even look at the rest of those two all-star lists? Is every EU support and jungle bad because they voted for Edward and Diamond(insert every other position for similar rhetoric questioning)? I get that he said it in the context that Elementz is lacking confidence, but he framed the argument horribly. A player doesn't need Muhammad Ali confidence to be good, or even great. The whole vlog comes off as him trying to tear Elementz down passive aggressively so he doesn't have to actually confront him as a teammate(friend?). Elementz is absolutely right to call him out as a 'leader' when he acts like this. I think it was more elegant than that though. Saint pretty much said if you ain't the best, you best be improving. The problem is when you have stagnant players. It's okay if you have shit players, but if your not trying to be better then there's the issue. At this rate elementz gunna be benched for same reason Chaox was kicked off of TSM. a) for not trying b) not caring. | ||
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