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[Patch 1.0.0.152: Preseason 3] General Discussion - Page 21

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Nos-
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Canada12016 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-04 22:39:21
December 04 2012 22:38 GMT
#401
Not sure if this has been discussed, but do you guys feel the changes made for S3 are warranted at all? I personally feel the changes are a little too drastic and too dense for just one patch, it is quite literally like learning a new game (minus the mechanics i suppose). I would have liked it better if they doled out all of these changes over a longer period instead of all at once, to make sure items aren't breaking things and to give people time to adjust.
Bronze player stuck in platinum
ManyCookies
Profile Joined December 2010
1164 Posts
December 04 2012 22:38 GMT
#402
He went through Tribunal SEVEN times. I mean god damn, that seems like it'd be sufficient warning.
Serpico
Profile Joined May 2010
4285 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-04 22:39:04
December 04 2012 22:38 GMT
#403
On December 05 2012 07:36 BlackPaladin wrote:
Why are you making shitty basketball comparisons. If you get banned from playing basketball you can still pratice and stay in shape. You aren't barred from improving so when your suspension from playing official games is up you can come back even stronger than before. Additionally the punishments are rarely if ever so severely long. IWD now can not only not play in competitive league, but by being banned he can't even practice his mechanics or play at all. His career in LoL is literally gone because he raged in solo q. That's just fucked up.

Riot should have just suspeded him for a few months at max. :/

I hate ragers but it's ridic what riot is doing.

Or do the smart thing and make sure he can never play with randoms, but only his team. So he can actually ONLY be a pro player. If he's toxic to the community (lol) then keep away from it and only let him play against other pros.
3 Lions
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States3705 Posts
December 04 2012 22:39 GMT
#404
Just tried Runaan's Hurricane on Caitlyn, I had Nunu support. The game reached late-game, but I had difficulty getting a solid 6-item build with Hurricane in it. Do you guys have any suggestions?
The items I ended up having were Merc-treads (furor), BT, LW, IE, Hurricane, PD (no defense items #1 l0l0l)

Do you guys think it's actually viable to build hurricane? After that game I feel that sacrificing lifesteal, armor pen, MS, or crit aren't worth it
Serpico
Profile Joined May 2010
4285 Posts
December 04 2012 22:40 GMT
#405
On December 05 2012 07:38 ManyCookies wrote:
He went through Tribunal SEVEN times. I mean god damn, that seems like it'd be sufficient warning.

No, not really. If you don't actually tell people what the punishments may be for things you're being incredibly unfair. Nowhere has riot drawn the line and said after this many times you're gone forever. They need to actually be clear and have a structured set of rules so people can understand the consequences.
PrinceXizor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States17713 Posts
December 04 2012 22:40 GMT
#406
On December 05 2012 07:38 ManyCookies wrote:
He went through Tribunal SEVEN times. I mean god damn, that seems like it'd be sufficient warning.

going through the tribunal 7 times isn't exactly hard. especially if he went through when they were giving ip out. all it takes is 1 person reporting you every game (for taking their role, not holding their hand, pointing out a mistake) ect. and the tribunal sheep early on tended to spam vote yes for ip and bans.
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
December 04 2012 22:41 GMT
#407
How good is Lautemortis? Maybe he will have a shot with Dignitas....
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
TwoToneTerran
Profile Joined March 2009
United States8841 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-04 22:42:24
December 04 2012 22:41 GMT
#408
On December 05 2012 07:40 Serpico wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 05 2012 07:38 ManyCookies wrote:
He went through Tribunal SEVEN times. I mean god damn, that seems like it'd be sufficient warning.

No, not really. If you don't actually tell people what the punishments may be for things you're being incredibly unfair. Nowhere has riot drawn the line and said after this many times you're gone forever. They need to actually be clear and have a structured set of rules so people can understand the consequences.


How do you know Riot hadn't contacted him before? I'm not assuming that they did or didn't, just that either way it's well within their rights to do this and they're not wrong for doing it.
Remember Violet.
JBright
Profile Joined September 2010
Vancouver14381 Posts
December 04 2012 22:42 GMT
#409
On December 05 2012 07:34 overt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 05 2012 07:30 onlywonderboy wrote:
On December 05 2012 07:29 Sufficiency wrote:
On December 05 2012 07:28 onlywonderboy wrote:
On December 05 2012 07:24 thenexusp wrote:
Riot has said that IWD was 300% more toxic than the next pro.

Also, those of you who want dig to defend IWD will probably be disappointed:
Today i was informed by riot that I will be suspended for 1 year of the Season 3 Championship Series. Although the ruling is extremely tough, I agree with riot that player sportsmanship is a serious matter and i want to apologize to anyone that i've offended in game and my fans. I fully understand that pro players are viewed as role models and should act accordingly. I'd like to thank my teammates and the whole Dignitas organization for the amazing year that i have spent with them and wish the team the best of luck going into season 3. Personally I will not let this end my dreams of being a professional league of legends player. During my suspension I intend to keep my mechanics in top form and remain a competitive jungler. After my suspension i hope to rejoin the championship series and once again compete at the highest level. League of Legends is my life, and i will do everything in my power to play as long as possible.

Source: http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/14a5ms/iwilldominate_banned_from_league_of_legends/c7b8mmq

None of us have defended IWD's behavior, just the way Riot handled it all, so this doesn't really change much.


Didn't Riot block a player (from Elo Hell or some other European team) because he was temp-banned for 2 weeks or something?

I believe it was a one tournament suspension and I think his account might have been perma-banned as well. I'm trying to look up the details. That is the only precedent for this beforehand.

Edit:Confirmed, Riot issued a one tournament ban for a permabanned account.



Wait. So Riot's rulings aren't even consistent? Like, this guy gets perm banned and gets a one tournament ban. IWD gets perm banned and gets a one year ban?


There is a difference though. All the teams playing in Season 3 will be contracted by Riot, which will undoubtedly include clauses where they will be punished for being banned by the tribunal. Season 2 was mainly a mesh of tournaments leading up to the big World Championships so Riot can at most ban him for the remainder of the season (August to October). iirc, Season 3 has it such that a few teams will go through relegation every 6 months so Riot essentially suspended IWD for 2 6 month "tournaments." I think a 6 month suspension should be good enough and it would be consistent with the Elohell guy suspension.
ModeratorThe good and the wise lead quiet lives. Neo's #1 Frenemy and nightmare.
SnK-Arcbound
Profile Joined March 2005
United States4423 Posts
December 04 2012 22:42 GMT
#410
IWD is a salaried player, who used his companies product to harass people. I would like someone here to insult people at the company they work at enough that they could be brought to the attention of their superiors 8 times and not get fired but only suspended without pay.
Seuss
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States10536 Posts
December 04 2012 22:43 GMT
#411
On December 05 2012 07:40 PrinceXizor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 05 2012 07:38 ManyCookies wrote:
He went through Tribunal SEVEN times. I mean god damn, that seems like it'd be sufficient warning.

going through the tribunal 7 times isn't exactly hard. especially if he went through when they were giving ip out. all it takes is 1 person reporting you every game (for taking their role, not holding their hand, pointing out a mistake) ect. and the tribunal sheep early on tended to spam vote yes for ip and bans.


I've taken people's roles, pointed out mistakes, etc. for hundreds of games. It's entirely possible to do these things and not ever see a single email or peep out of the Tribunal.
"I am not able to carry all this people alone, for they are too heavy for me." -Moses (Numbers 11:14)
Serpico
Profile Joined May 2010
4285 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-04 22:44:35
December 04 2012 22:44 GMT
#412
On December 05 2012 07:41 TwoToneTerran wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 05 2012 07:40 Serpico wrote:
On December 05 2012 07:38 ManyCookies wrote:
He went through Tribunal SEVEN times. I mean god damn, that seems like it'd be sufficient warning.

No, not really. If you don't actually tell people what the punishments may be for things you're being incredibly unfair. Nowhere has riot drawn the line and said after this many times you're gone forever. They need to actually be clear and have a structured set of rules so people can understand the consequences.


How do you know Riot hadn't contacted him before? I'm not assuming that they did or didn't, just that either way it's well within their rights to do this and they're not wrong for doing it.

Because not making their system public so everyone can know where they stand in regards to punishments/rules etc is incredibly odd. Why only tell people privately?
c.Deadly
Profile Joined March 2010
United States545 Posts
December 04 2012 22:44 GMT
#413
On December 05 2012 07:40 PrinceXizor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 05 2012 07:38 ManyCookies wrote:
He went through Tribunal SEVEN times. I mean god damn, that seems like it'd be sufficient warning.

going through the tribunal 7 times isn't exactly hard. especially if he went through when they were giving ip out. all it takes is 1 person reporting you every game (for taking their role, not holding their hand, pointing out a mistake) ect. and the tribunal sheep early on tended to spam vote yes for ip and bans.


It's actually a rarity to be banned multiple times from the tribunal - Riot released some statistics awhile ago and less than 1% of players are banned multiple times by the tribunal.

http://riot-web-static.s3.amazonaws.com/images/news/December_2011/2011_12_16_tribunal/Infographic_Tribunal.jpg

Honestly if you even make the tribunal at all you're a toxic player imo - I've done my fair share of raging but haven't received as much as a warning for it. I can't imagine how much unbridled rage you'd have to make your team mates endure to even show up in the tribunal, let alone be banned.
Serpico
Profile Joined May 2010
4285 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-04 22:45:21
December 04 2012 22:45 GMT
#414
On December 05 2012 07:44 c.Deadly wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 05 2012 07:40 PrinceXizor wrote:
On December 05 2012 07:38 ManyCookies wrote:
He went through Tribunal SEVEN times. I mean god damn, that seems like it'd be sufficient warning.

going through the tribunal 7 times isn't exactly hard. especially if he went through when they were giving ip out. all it takes is 1 person reporting you every game (for taking their role, not holding their hand, pointing out a mistake) ect. and the tribunal sheep early on tended to spam vote yes for ip and bans.


It's actually a rarity to be banned multiple times from the tribunal - Riot released some statistics awhile ago and less than 1% of players are banned multiple times by the tribunal.

http://riot-web-static.s3.amazonaws.com/images/news/December_2011/2011_12_16_tribunal/Infographic_Tribunal.jpg

Honestly if you even make the tribunal at all you're a toxic player imo - I've done my fair share of raging but haven't received as much as a warning for it. I can't imagine how much unbridled rage you'd have to make your team mates endure to even show up in the tribunal, let alone be banned.

You're not a visible pro player though. Raging on a stream where more people can see you hurts riot more than you. Which is why punishments wouldn't be equal for you as opposed to him.
PrinceXizor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States17713 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-04 22:48:54
December 04 2012 22:46 GMT
#415
On December 05 2012 07:43 Seuss wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 05 2012 07:40 PrinceXizor wrote:
On December 05 2012 07:38 ManyCookies wrote:
He went through Tribunal SEVEN times. I mean god damn, that seems like it'd be sufficient warning.

going through the tribunal 7 times isn't exactly hard. especially if he went through when they were giving ip out. all it takes is 1 person reporting you every game (for taking their role, not holding their hand, pointing out a mistake) ect. and the tribunal sheep early on tended to spam vote yes for ip and bans.


I've taken people's roles, pointed out mistakes, etc. for hundreds of games. It's entirely possible to do these things and not ever see a single email or peep out of the Tribunal.

you weren't in a game with an entitled brat then. he could have been, you don't really know. I've been told i've been reported for "not helping in a team fight and assisting enemy team" by a jungler when i was protecting the carry the whole fight. so if i get queued up with the same guy multiple times and he reports me multiple times out of vengeance i have a shot at being on the tribunal. through no fault of anyone. it would be obvious now that people would vote against punishment in these cases, however why go through work when you get free ip for clicking punish.
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
December 04 2012 22:48 GMT
#416
On December 05 2012 07:45 Serpico wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 05 2012 07:44 c.Deadly wrote:
On December 05 2012 07:40 PrinceXizor wrote:
On December 05 2012 07:38 ManyCookies wrote:
He went through Tribunal SEVEN times. I mean god damn, that seems like it'd be sufficient warning.

going through the tribunal 7 times isn't exactly hard. especially if he went through when they were giving ip out. all it takes is 1 person reporting you every game (for taking their role, not holding their hand, pointing out a mistake) ect. and the tribunal sheep early on tended to spam vote yes for ip and bans.


It's actually a rarity to be banned multiple times from the tribunal - Riot released some statistics awhile ago and less than 1% of players are banned multiple times by the tribunal.

http://riot-web-static.s3.amazonaws.com/images/news/December_2011/2011_12_16_tribunal/Infographic_Tribunal.jpg

Honestly if you even make the tribunal at all you're a toxic player imo - I've done my fair share of raging but haven't received as much as a warning for it. I can't imagine how much unbridled rage you'd have to make your team mates endure to even show up in the tribunal, let alone be banned.

You're not a visible pro player though. Raging on a stream where more people can see you hurts riot more than you. Which is why punishments wouldn't be equal for you as opposed to him.


If I am playing with regi and he rages on stream about me being a nub, at least I won't see it in game.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
c.Deadly
Profile Joined March 2010
United States545 Posts
December 04 2012 22:49 GMT
#417
On December 05 2012 07:45 Serpico wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 05 2012 07:44 c.Deadly wrote:
On December 05 2012 07:40 PrinceXizor wrote:
On December 05 2012 07:38 ManyCookies wrote:
He went through Tribunal SEVEN times. I mean god damn, that seems like it'd be sufficient warning.

going through the tribunal 7 times isn't exactly hard. especially if he went through when they were giving ip out. all it takes is 1 person reporting you every game (for taking their role, not holding their hand, pointing out a mistake) ect. and the tribunal sheep early on tended to spam vote yes for ip and bans.


It's actually a rarity to be banned multiple times from the tribunal - Riot released some statistics awhile ago and less than 1% of players are banned multiple times by the tribunal.

http://riot-web-static.s3.amazonaws.com/images/news/December_2011/2011_12_16_tribunal/Infographic_Tribunal.jpg

Honestly if you even make the tribunal at all you're a toxic player imo - I've done my fair share of raging but haven't received as much as a warning for it. I can't imagine how much unbridled rage you'd have to make your team mates endure to even show up in the tribunal, let alone be banned.

You're not a visible pro player though. Raging on a stream where more people can see you hurts riot more than you. Which is why punishments wouldn't be equal for you as opposed to him.


I don't follow this logic at all - Riot said in their statement that IWD made the tribunal and was punished 8 times, the fact that he's a pro player has nothing to do with that. Are you saying that people report him more often because he's a visible pro?
PrinceXizor
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States17713 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-12-04 22:50:20
December 04 2012 22:49 GMT
#418
On December 05 2012 07:48 Sufficiency wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 05 2012 07:45 Serpico wrote:
On December 05 2012 07:44 c.Deadly wrote:
On December 05 2012 07:40 PrinceXizor wrote:
On December 05 2012 07:38 ManyCookies wrote:
He went through Tribunal SEVEN times. I mean god damn, that seems like it'd be sufficient warning.

going through the tribunal 7 times isn't exactly hard. especially if he went through when they were giving ip out. all it takes is 1 person reporting you every game (for taking their role, not holding their hand, pointing out a mistake) ect. and the tribunal sheep early on tended to spam vote yes for ip and bans.


It's actually a rarity to be banned multiple times from the tribunal - Riot released some statistics awhile ago and less than 1% of players are banned multiple times by the tribunal.

http://riot-web-static.s3.amazonaws.com/images/news/December_2011/2011_12_16_tribunal/Infographic_Tribunal.jpg

Honestly if you even make the tribunal at all you're a toxic player imo - I've done my fair share of raging but haven't received as much as a warning for it. I can't imagine how much unbridled rage you'd have to make your team mates endure to even show up in the tribunal, let alone be banned.

You're not a visible pro player though. Raging on a stream where more people can see you hurts riot more than you. Which is why punishments wouldn't be equal for you as opposed to him.


If I am playing with regi and he rages on stream about me being a nub, at least I won't see it in game.

likewise if you play with regi and he calls you noob in game, you can mute him or accept that you are a noob. reporting someone is just a way of being justified in your wrong viewpoints or justify flamebaiting.
overt
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States9006 Posts
December 04 2012 22:49 GMT
#419
On December 05 2012 07:42 JBright wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 05 2012 07:34 overt wrote:
On December 05 2012 07:30 onlywonderboy wrote:
On December 05 2012 07:29 Sufficiency wrote:
On December 05 2012 07:28 onlywonderboy wrote:
On December 05 2012 07:24 thenexusp wrote:
Riot has said that IWD was 300% more toxic than the next pro.

Also, those of you who want dig to defend IWD will probably be disappointed:
Today i was informed by riot that I will be suspended for 1 year of the Season 3 Championship Series. Although the ruling is extremely tough, I agree with riot that player sportsmanship is a serious matter and i want to apologize to anyone that i've offended in game and my fans. I fully understand that pro players are viewed as role models and should act accordingly. I'd like to thank my teammates and the whole Dignitas organization for the amazing year that i have spent with them and wish the team the best of luck going into season 3. Personally I will not let this end my dreams of being a professional league of legends player. During my suspension I intend to keep my mechanics in top form and remain a competitive jungler. After my suspension i hope to rejoin the championship series and once again compete at the highest level. League of Legends is my life, and i will do everything in my power to play as long as possible.

Source: http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/14a5ms/iwilldominate_banned_from_league_of_legends/c7b8mmq

None of us have defended IWD's behavior, just the way Riot handled it all, so this doesn't really change much.


Didn't Riot block a player (from Elo Hell or some other European team) because he was temp-banned for 2 weeks or something?

I believe it was a one tournament suspension and I think his account might have been perma-banned as well. I'm trying to look up the details. That is the only precedent for this beforehand.

Edit:Confirmed, Riot issued a one tournament ban for a permabanned account.



Wait. So Riot's rulings aren't even consistent? Like, this guy gets perm banned and gets a one tournament ban. IWD gets perm banned and gets a one year ban?


There is a difference though. All the teams playing in Season 3 will be contracted by Riot, which will undoubtedly include clauses where they will be punished for being banned by the tribunal. Season 2 was mainly a mesh of tournaments leading up to the big World Championships so Riot can at most ban him for the remainder of the season (August to October). iirc, Season 3 has it such that a few teams will go through relegation every 6 months so Riot essentially suspended IWD for 2 6 month "tournaments." I think a 6 month suspension should be good enough and it would be consistent with the Elohell guy suspension.


I'd be fine with that if IWD signed his contract already and his contract outline that this was a possibility. Riot needs to have detailed expectations and explain the consequences of breaching them. It looks more like they decided, "hey instead of giving this guy a contract let's just ruin his career." Hosan got banned from regionals but had his team still somehow placed top three without him Riot would've either been forced to increase his ban or make him a salaried player. It's still an inconsistent ruling unless IWD was already making his Riot salary and had signed his contract.

As far as I know the contracts for Season 3 haven't been signed yet. So they just threw him under the bus to avoid having to contract him at all.
JonnyLaw
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States3482 Posts
December 04 2012 22:51 GMT
#420
How is everyone ignoring this line from the riot forum post?

There also have been repeated incidents of similar behavior outside the game.


Does this mean the game lobby, tournaments, hotels or what?

Seriously, you have to consider that this player represents AND is paid by Riot. All of these other games referenced here mean nothing. The NBA doesn't pay the players, the teams do.

This is like showing up to fan charity events, saying I hope you all know you suck and leaving because the fans who clearly don't play as much of that sport as you do not play well enough. Going AFK in games brings a lot of displeasure, ruining people's experiences should not be tolerated. If it's not tolerated then why would you allow that same person to take a paycheck from you?

Would you hire an extremely talented employee who came to work and harassed the other less talented employees then quit projects whenever he desired? Of course not.

Seriously, screw that guy. Grow up a bit or don't get involved with a company who wants to protect their PR.
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