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On May 06 2011 20:05 EmeraldSparks wrote:
Maybe it's because of my heritage as a DotA player, but the idea that an ultimate is badly designed because it's point and click nuke or slow just doesn't make any sense to me. If you get into a position where Bane comes out of the woods, summons his necros, and has them beat the shit out of you while he ults and you stand there with a dumb look on your face, or you're farming and Lina and Lion unload a double combo on your head, nobody would ever think about saying "wow that's dumb I couldn't do anything about that," or "derp ults characters to easy to play" the problem is that you were in a situation where you let somebody freely unload a combo into your face.
the problem is that an ultimate that is point and click is just as strong as an ultimate that needs to be aimed, a lot of the time. Imagine if Lina's ultimate was a skill shot while Lion's wasn't. Would that be fair?
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Also the game has just a few globals, and they're relatively weak. Forever Furion would just be a super weak champion without his globals so it help balance him(instead of him being good without it and it making him even better), Zeus ulti is super weak in comparison to Karthus but balanced by it being a global, AAs ulti is really difficult to aim, etc.
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On May 06 2011 20:46 Shikyo wrote:
Also the game has just a few globals, and they're relatively weak. Forever Furion would just be a super weak champion without his globals so it help balance him(instead of him being good without it and it making him even better), Zeus ulti is super weak in comparison to Karthus but balanced by it being a global, AAs ulti is really difficult to aim, etc.
Zeus's ult is weak compared to karthus but is balanced by being a global? WHAAA? Karthus's ult is a global too, so i have no idea what you're talking about.
Furion weak without globals? If you take out two of ANY heroes' abilities of course he's going to be weaker. That's a duh statement.
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On May 06 2011 20:25 Caller wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2011 20:05 EmeraldSparks wrote:
Maybe it's because of my heritage as a DotA player, but the idea that an ultimate is badly designed because it's point and click nuke or slow just doesn't make any sense to me. If you get into a position where Bane comes out of the woods, summons his necros, and has them beat the shit out of you while he ults and you stand there with a dumb look on your face, or you're farming and Lina and Lion unload a double combo on your head, nobody would ever think about saying "wow that's dumb I couldn't do anything about that," or "derp ults characters to easy to play" the problem is that you were in a situation where you let somebody freely unload a combo into your face. the problem is that an ultimate that is point and click is just as strong as an ultimate that needs to be aimed, a lot of the time. Imagine if Lina's ultimate was a skill shot while Lion's wasn't. Would that be fair?
I agree that an ultimate that can whiff should be stronger than an ultimate that can't - in terms of raw effect, Kunkka's Ghost Ship, Jakiro's Macropyre, and SK's Epicenter, are some of the strongest when you hit everybody that you want to hit - but that's just a balance issue. Somewhere earlier somebody was complaining that point click ults were somehow problematic simply because you couldn't do anything to avoid getting nailed by them.
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On May 06 2011 20:54 EmeraldSparks wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2011 20:25 Caller wrote:On May 06 2011 20:05 EmeraldSparks wrote:
Maybe it's because of my heritage as a DotA player, but the idea that an ultimate is badly designed because it's point and click nuke or slow just doesn't make any sense to me. If you get into a position where Bane comes out of the woods, summons his necros, and has them beat the shit out of you while he ults and you stand there with a dumb look on your face, or you're farming and Lina and Lion unload a double combo on your head, nobody would ever think about saying "wow that's dumb I couldn't do anything about that," or "derp ults characters to easy to play" the problem is that you were in a situation where you let somebody freely unload a combo into your face. the problem is that an ultimate that is point and click is just as strong as an ultimate that needs to be aimed, a lot of the time. Imagine if Lina's ultimate was a skill shot while Lion's wasn't. Would that be fair? I agree that an ultimate that can whiff should be stronger than an ultimate that can't - in terms of raw effect, Kunkka's Ghost Ship, Jakiro's Macropyre, and SK's Epicenter, are some of the strongest when you hit everybody that you want to hit - but that's just a balance issue. Somewhere earlier somebody was complaining that point click ults were somehow problematic simply because you couldn't do anything to avoid getting nailed by them.
thats because they bad
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On May 06 2011 20:53 Caller wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2011 20:46 Shikyo wrote:
Also the game has just a few globals, and they're relatively weak. Forever Furion would just be a super weak champion without his globals so it help balance him(instead of him being good without it and it making him even better), Zeus ulti is super weak in comparison to Karthus but balanced by it being a global, AAs ulti is really difficult to aim, etc. Zeus's ult is weak compared to karthus but is balanced by being a global? WHAAA? Karthus's ult is a global too, so i have no idea what you're talking about. Furion weak without globals? If you take out two of ANY heroes' abilities of course he's going to be weaker. That's a duh statement.
Yeah and hence Karthus's is op in comparison though balanced slightly with the delay. Really simple.
Furion would be weak if the ulti for instance just had a decent range and his tp was a blink... for example the 2009 december TF was strong even with the globals, and what I mean that the other 2 skills are pretty weak and he's balanced by his other skills being global, instead of him being strong already and having globals as a bonus. His ulti also is pretty weak apart from being global
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Itemizing Flash would be a bad idea and I think everyone that ever played DotA or HoN knows this. I think Flash is ok at the moment, it's on an ass long cooldown and you can't dodge projectiles. I'd rather see a buff to weak summoners.
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On May 06 2011 21:08 Woony wrote:
Itemizing Flash would be a bad idea and I think everyone that ever played DotA or HoN knows this. I think Flash is ok at the moment, it's on an ass long cooldown and you can't dodge projectiles. I'd rather see a buff to weak summoners.
We don't even need to itemize it, just need the 3 second cooldown timer after taking dmg from champion sources
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![[image loading]](http://i52.tinypic.com/flf4ah.png)
i honestly think flash is fine
and the only change they should do to it,is take back the retarded fucking pub qq demand to stop it from popping projectile
lower skill cap in the game = no bueno
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I think both flash and lee young ho are pretty OP. Most games I see on tourney streams have like 8 flashes or something.
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With the projectile speed in this game even my dead grandpa could dodge projectiles with flash. It's not hard, or even that detrimental to the skillcap. It just makes balancing a lot easier. It's not like flash needs the buff.
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Then again, removing flash would completely break the game and make champions with built in escapes bat-shit retarded OPd and the classes that don't have it or even need it to get their job done UP.
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On May 06 2011 22:03 BouBou.865 wrote:
With the projectile speed in this game even my dead grandpa could dodge projectiles with flash. It's not hard, or even that detrimental to the skillcap. It just makes balancing a lot easier. It's not like flash needs the buff.
Not all people can dodge Ashe arrows with flash.
<-------
D:
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Russian Federation4235 Posts
Corki doesn't need to be even more retarded kthx.
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Wait, so the carry tier list would be like this after flash removal?
Corki/Tristana > Ez > everything else
REMOVE FLASH
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On May 06 2011 22:03 Senx wrote:
Then again, removing flash would completely break the game and make champions with built in escapes bat-shit retarded OPd and the classes that don't have it or even need it to get their job done UP.
*cough*Galio*cough*
Flash is fine, I don't know why they would even consider removing it.
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On May 06 2011 21:46 locodoco wrote:i honestly think flash is fine and the only change they should do to it,is take back the retarded fucking pub qq demand to stop it from popping projectile lower skill cap in the game = no bueno
Are you serious? If we brought the old flash back the game would be 0-0 at 35 minutes
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On May 06 2011 22:53 Shikyo wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2011 21:46 locodoco wrote:i honestly think flash is fine and the only change they should do to it,is take back the retarded fucking pub qq demand to stop it from popping projectile lower skill cap in the game = no bueno Are you serious? If we brought the old flash back the game would be 0-0 at 35 minutes
Flash popping projectile = lower skillcap
See that stun coming? Press D! Doesn't matter if you flash on the spot, you just escaped death.
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Every Eve game I play leaves me feeling dirty... She should be removed from the game, really. Or replace her W invis with another utility effect, like a disjoint or something.
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EPT
