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Math Problem - Page 2

Forum Index > General Forum
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BlackJack
Profile Blog Joined June 2003
United States10574 Posts
January 22 2008 14:50 GMT
#21
agreed with 9/1, though i think the whole question is kind of stupid ;P
Konni
Profile Blog Joined February 2003
Germany3044 Posts
January 22 2008 15:44 GMT
#22
On January 22 2008 23:38 .MistiK wrote:
how can you conclude that if 12/2 is impossible, 12/1 and 12/8 are impossibe too?

I don't understand this part either.
dybydx
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Canada1764 Posts
January 22 2008 15:59 GMT
#23
ok

If Mike's number is 7 or 2 then he immediately knows which day it is. (6/7, or 12/2)
John's first statement means that he know, using the day of the month alone is insufficent. Thus John knows the month is not 6/X and its not 12/X
...from the land of imba
Konni
Profile Blog Joined February 2003
Germany3044 Posts
January 22 2008 16:02 GMT
#24
but why?
with only 6/4 left, it's clear that 6 is not possible because then john would know the date
but there's 12/1 and 12/8 left so john wouldn't know the date if his month was 12
dybydx
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Canada1764 Posts
January 22 2008 16:05 GMT
#25
suppose mike's number is 2, then mike know right a way its 12/2
then john's 1st statement is false
...from the land of imba
Konni
Profile Blog Joined February 2003
Germany3044 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-01-22 16:13:05
January 22 2008 16:07 GMT
#26
suppose mike's number is 8, then mike knows what?
and how can john then eliminate 12/8?
[edit] forget it i'm gonna ask maenander irl to clarify
LonelyMargarita
Profile Blog Joined August 2007
1845 Posts
January 22 2008 16:24 GMT
#27
On January 23 2008 01:07 Konni wrote:
suppose mike's number is 8, then mike knows what?
and how can john then eliminate 12/8?
[edit] forget it i'm gonna ask maenander irl to clarify



+ Show Spoiler +
If mike's number was D = 8, john would have M = 12. If john had M = 12, he would not know that mike didn't know it, because 12/2 is the only date with 2 as the day. John's first statement shows that he knows it is not a date that has only 1 date with the given day. This means his month cannot be 12 and it cannot be 6.
I <3 서지훈
Konni
Profile Blog Joined February 2003
Germany3044 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-01-22 16:32:46
January 22 2008 16:29 GMT
#28
On January 23 2008 01:24 LonelyMargarita wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 23 2008 01:07 Konni wrote:
suppose mike's number is 8, then mike knows what?
and how can john then eliminate 12/8?
[edit] forget it i'm gonna ask maenander irl to clarify



+ Show Spoiler +
If mike's number was D = 8, john would have M = 12. If john had M = 12, he would not know that mike didn't know it, because 12/2 is the only date with 2 as the day. John's first statement shows that he knows it is not a date that has only 1 date with the given day. This means his month cannot be 12 and it cannot be 6.

Thank you, I got it!
+ Show Spoiler +
I would've understood it better if John just would've said: "Mike can't know the date". Because the if-clause is totally confusing and useless (John can't know the date in the first place with no information about Mike's number)
atarianimo
Profile Joined June 2007
United States82 Posts
January 22 2008 16:36 GMT
#29
+ Show Spoiler +

3/4

John says: "If I don't know the date, then Mike can't either"

(Mike, knowing he has 4 would deduce that it's either 3/4 or 6/4 at the beginning. John, having 3, knows it's 3/4, 3/5, or 3/8.)

Mike says: "I didn't know it at first, but now I know it"

if it was 6/4, John's statement would be false because John would have 6 which gives
the possibility of Mike knowing the answer right from the beginning

John says: "Now I know it too."

(John can use the same logic as Mike here to figure it out)
Navane
Profile Blog Joined February 2007
Netherlands2748 Posts
January 22 2008 16:42 GMT
#30
to the op: your use of the word "date" is confusing.
dybydx
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Canada1764 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-01-22 16:52:57
January 22 2008 16:49 GMT
#31
atarianimo,

if mike really had 4, john would have no way of guaranteeing 3/4 is the right date
...from the land of imba
fusionsdf
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
Canada15390 Posts
January 22 2008 16:51 GMT
#32
to explain the first step: */7 */2 only appear once. Each other number is mirrored. Meaning that If I know the day is the second, only one month is possible. If I know the day is the 8th, 2 different months are possible.

because 7th and the 2nd only appear once, mike can rule those out as soon as john gives the hint
SKT_Best: "I actually chose Protoss because it was so hard for me to defeat Protoss as a Terran. When I first started Brood War, my main race was Terran."
atarianimo
Profile Joined June 2007
United States82 Posts
January 22 2008 16:54 GMT
#33
He knows it's 3/4 because if it was 6/4, John's statement would be false (John would have 6 and therefore think it is either 6/4 or 6/7, if it was 6/7, Mike would know right away, since that's the only date with the day as 7.)
drift0ut
Profile Blog Joined June 2004
United Kingdom691 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-01-22 17:00:43
January 22 2008 16:57 GMT
#34
Good question. It's better to set out the problem like this:
+ Show Spoiler +

month
3-- | -- | -- | 4 | 5 | -- | 8
6-- | -- | -- | 4 | -- | 7 |-
9-- | 1 | -- | -- | 5 | -- |-
12 | 1 | 2 | -- | -- | -- | 8

then you clearly see which month have which days i common and you just have to cross out whole rows/colmns
dybydx
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Canada1764 Posts
January 22 2008 17:00 GMT
#35
if john had 3, as far as john knows, mike could have had 8
...from the land of imba
atarianimo
Profile Joined June 2007
United States82 Posts
January 22 2008 17:06 GMT
#36
That is why John didn't know the answer until Mike says: "I didn't know it at first, but now I know it"

If Mike had 8 or 5, he wouldn't have been able to figure it out from John's opening statement.
dybydx
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Canada1764 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-01-22 17:21:43
January 22 2008 17:19 GMT
#37
if mike had 8, he would know the date is 3/8, after john tell him 6/X and 12/X are impossible.

Edit by Chill:

Adam, Bruce and Chris got arrested for crimes. Court sentenced 1 of em to death and release the other 2.

Adam asked the guard which one of his friends will be released. The guard said Bruce.

Assuming the guard is honest, what is probability of Chris being sentenced to death?

[Show proof, guessing a number doesnt count]
...from the land of imba
lololol
Profile Joined February 2006
5198 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-01-22 17:54:06
January 22 2008 17:22 GMT
#38
dybydx, your other math problem is not even a math problem.
The answer is 100%.
Adam asked the guard which one of his friends will be released.
So... he obviously knows he's not the guilty one, but one of the other two and since the guard tells who isn't, the answer is obvious.
I'll call Nada.
dybydx
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Canada1764 Posts
January 22 2008 17:29 GMT
#39
i never said hes not the guilty one. you assumed it.
...from the land of imba
lololol
Profile Joined February 2006
5198 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-01-22 17:32:04
January 22 2008 17:31 GMT
#40
He asked which of his friends will be released, he wouldn't ask if he was guilty, because he would know that both would be released.
Also, the guard wouldn't answer in this way, if they were both released.
I'll call Nada.
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