Now that we have a new thread, in order to ensure that this thread continues to meet TL standards and follows the proper guidelines, we will be enforcing the rules in the OP more strictly. Be sure to give them a complete and thorough read before posting!
NOTE: When providing a source, please provide a very brief summary on what it's about and what purpose it adds to the discussion. The supporting statement should clearly explain why the subject is relevant and needs to be discussed. Please follow this rule especially for tweets.
Your supporting statement should always come BEFORE you provide the source.
On August 23 2026 03:46 oBlade wrote: Unclear why liberal Canada would retaliate by imposing a tax on its own citizens like that. They should know that tariffs are taxes by now. It's like punching themselves in the face to get back at Trump.
what the hell does "liberal Canada" mean? LOL.
Anything not MAGA is "liberal" to these people (which is usually the same as socialist and/or communist). Probably makes politics very simple.
what i love about the Liberal party of Canada is that they believe in open, free market competition and capitalism. So, I'm not sure what "liberal" means in this context.
Any how I thought i'd ask google AI
ME: back when the liberal party of canada first got its name didn't liberal mean "economic liberty" almost kinda like libertarianism
GOOGLE AI:
Yes, your intuition is historically spot on. When the Liberal Party of Canada was officially formed at Confederation in 1867, "liberalism" meant classical liberalism, an ideology centered on individual freedom, limited government intervention, minimal taxation, and free-market capitalism.
On August 23 2026 03:46 oBlade wrote: Unclear why liberal Canada would retaliate by imposing a tax on its own citizens like that. They should know that tariffs are taxes by now. It's like punching themselves in the face to get back at Trump.
what the hell does "liberal Canada" mean? LOL.
Anything not MAGA is "liberal" to these people (which is usually the same as socialist and/or communist). Probably makes politics very simple.
what i love about the Liberal party of Canada is that they believe in open, free market competition and capitalism. So, I'm not sure what "liberal" means in this context.
That is what liberal means basically anywhere except in the US. In the US it seems to just mean "leftist".
But here this resolves easily, because anyone who is not MAGA is viewed as leftist, no matter what their positions actually are. And since Canada is not ruled by MAGAs, they are "liberal" in the MAGA sense. Since they are ruled by the liberal party, i guess they are also liberal in the normal sense?
the root meaning of Liberal Party of Canada in its full context is economic liberty. There are many hard core right wingers in the Liberal Party of Canada. Hazel Mccallion, probably the most right wing Mayor Canada has ever had, endorsed Liberal Justin Trudeau in the 2015 election.
I'm very right wing, and ~1/2 of the time vote Liberal in Canadian elections of various levels.
Back to the topic of the thread. Trump has been bad as President. I think Kamala Harris would've been worse though. So, I'm still happy with my vote. The worst thing about the election is that both candidates were very bad. I was hoping Trump would be good. Oh well. If I had to do it over again, I'd still vote for Trump.
On August 23 2026 03:46 oBlade wrote: Unclear why liberal Canada would retaliate by imposing a tax on its own citizens like that. They should know that tariffs are taxes by now. It's like punching themselves in the face to get back at Trump.
what the hell does "liberal Canada" mean? LOL.
Anything not MAGA is "liberal" to these people (which is usually the same as socialist and/or communist). Probably makes politics very simple.
Canada is liberal both in the normal sense and because the Liberal Party are the government and PM.
On August 23 2026 03:46 oBlade wrote: Unclear why liberal Canada would retaliate by imposing a tax on its own citizens like that. They should know that tariffs are taxes by now. It's like punching themselves in the face to get back at Trump.
what the hell does "liberal Canada" mean? LOL.
Anything not MAGA is "liberal" to these people (which is usually the same as socialist and/or communist). Probably makes politics very simple.
Canada is liberal both in the normal sense and because the Liberal Party are the government and PM.
What does "normal sense" mean though. Lol. Canada is applying tariffs to encourage consumption of Canadian products and to create a negotiation lever. Wait and see what products get tariffed before deciding whether this is a good move or a bad move.
Oblade wanted to make a sarcastic remark about how we call America moronic for imposing tax on itself via a blanket tariff.
He just utterly failed at it because Canada will not be applying a blanket tariff and instead will specifically target American industries that rely on the Canadian market.
On August 23 2026 03:46 oBlade wrote: Unclear why liberal Canada would retaliate by imposing a tax on its own citizens like that. They should know that tariffs are taxes by now. It's like punching themselves in the face to get back at Trump.
what the hell does "liberal Canada" mean? LOL.
Anything not MAGA is "liberal" to these people (which is usually the same as socialist and/or communist). Probably makes politics very simple.
Canada is liberal both in the normal sense and because the Liberal Party are the government and PM.
What does "normal sense" mean though. Lol. Canada is applying tariffs to encourage consumption of Canadian products and to create a negotiation lever. Wait and see what products get tariffed before deciding whether this is a good move or a bad move.
So what? If that were determining of whether a country is liberal or not, almost no countries in the world would be. By how ubiquitous tariffs are. Canada has wide political and economic freedom.
You think the actual future will differ from what the PM has said?
On August 23 2026 19:55 Gorsameth wrote: Oblade wanted to make a sarcastic remark about how we call America moronic for imposing tax on itself via a blanket tariff.
He just utterly failed at it because Canada will not be applying a blanket tariff and instead will specifically target American industries that rely on the Canadian market.
But it doesn't "target American industries." It taxes Canadian companies (importers), which is immediately passed through 100% to Canadian citizens, according to the CNN principles of tariffs. It's an absolute consumer tax, I thought. Seems hypocritical to not update our prior assumptions when we see Canada, to spite Trump, making the exact same mistakes ("dollar for dollar") as Trump, back at Trump.
You could be the exception though. You're intellectually discerning, and realize that contrary to the blanket tariff, that Trump's targeted tariffs on Canada, and Canada's targeted retaliation are fine, okay. Even if that's the case, surely Canada putting 70% of its exports at risk in a trade war, plus taxing innocent businesses and consumers that rely on American industries, is a problem.
Which by the way, the rational thing is to target the industries that rely on your market? THE WORLD relies on the US market so you've managed to justify a Liberation Day blanket tariff against THE WORLD.
On August 21 2026 13:39 Sermokala wrote: Theres a serious conversation about how and why young men fall down into the alt right>neo nazi pipeline to be had. Things are going to get much worse in the next economic collapse but young men these days are in a dire place. There is just so much hate and anger in them and society is not giving them any help in dealing with it. They get taught that they're the bad person and they don't understand why.
The problem is almost all social movements nowadays are about anti-establishment more than anything else.
You have all these pro Palestine with lgbtq+ and feminism group, Australia and many have these same group with pro Aboriginals group etc.
Men don't belong to minority and hence they don't get support from these well funded organized group. What slogan can they feel comfortable to use?
Rofl, some men are assholes because they just don't have it hard enough in live and therefore they have zero lobby supporting their life structure. We should just give minorities and women less of a thought, so that assholes don't feel bad bout themselves.
Equality isn't a zero sum game. Feminism up until now was fighting a lot of legitimate equality and needed to be anti-establishment to get the change that was needed.
But this incredibly toxic idea that we should be creating more neo nazis by not only ignoring the issues with young white men but to antagonize them further is ghastly.
Theres a ton of issues when a social movement goes from being in the minority to being the majority. You can't just hand wave things like women only getting the ability to get a bank account and own a business in the 1970's in america. But, the cratering of relationships between men and women isn't a one sided affair.
Its not just that there are no well-funded organized groups for men but the ones that are there are dieing like the lions or just don't exist.
"They have worked hard, in good faith, to defend the interests of Canadians throughout these negotiations up until the very last minute. However, last-minute changes in the U.S. proposed terms were unfair, uneconomic, and called into question the reliability of any deal."
fucks sake just physically incapable of acting in good faith.
I... can't tell whether you use the most sarcasm ever or none, sorry. To be clear, I was being sarcastic. To me, the reason people are turning towards neo nazi/ alt right solutions is they feel that capitalism is slowly choking their wealth away while the establishment shrugs or is bad at communicating how they want to fix this and the alt right just screams immigrant transgender rapists want to take your bathrooms away. And then the Internet amplifies that enough.
White young men habe all the political agency they could ever need, the issue is if they are not already rich, they can still feel they are losing the game of life and the fact that everyone else not rich has it even worse then them registers enough to them that they feel these groups are not them, but they are still tricked into thinking these groups get more attention and benefits.
I know but I'm not going to quote the other guy.
I think you ignore the social and cultural norms to your peril in these cases. I'm at my last family gathering and my cousin brings his new baby around, who are the members of the family that are trusted to hold them? I'm as physically capable as anyone and I should be trusted with being able to hold them, but theres not even the thought of it. If a woman brings up her mental health everyone comes up to support them, when a man does it its only used against them.
Just look at every time the male loneliness epidemic is brought up, you get people out of the woodwork to make fun of men and ignore their real issues. The Man vs Bear debate is the same, the humiliation and inherent lack of trust in men who have done nothing wrong and are never given a chance to be anything but a monster in the publics eyes.
That is one very specific angle where women are allowed a tad better outcome compared to men and even that has it's nuances. For instance society is very much changing to accept men as caretakers more and more.
The world has gotten more lonely in general, women just don't have to find a life long relationship anymore and endure it to be alive. I struggle to see why this should explain the drastic rise in especially alt right or neo nazi circles. The world is definitely getting more unhinged because the old societal structures are breaking up, and the new ones are just pure anger amplification and cold heartedness, I don't disagree with you here. I just disagree that this is the main driver of the political right.
It’s a complex issue for sure. Both of you make very salient points.
There’s one pretty obvious issue in that men broadly didn’t build the movements, networks and push the discourse that women (or other minority groups) had to do by necessity due to oppression and disadvantage.
Now the pendulum has swung so to speak, at least for some well, because those networks simply don’t exist to anything like the same degree. Certainly the perception of abandonment is rather prevalent anyway.
I guess what turns this for me from a disappointing gap into something particularly problematic for both individuals and society at large is into that relative vacuum, anti-feminist thru outright misogyny has gained a big foothold.
What’s most frustrating about this is that it’s often the demonised feminists who are trying to advocate for changes to address the very issues many of these angry men have.
I’d agree this phenomenon isn’t directly causative of the rise of right-wing populism, but symptomatic of a general pattern I guess. Some ‘other’ is keeping us down so we have to agitate against it to reclaim our rightful place.
I think what Serm was saying has a lot of validity. I found female friends and my partner had quite negative views on certain aspects of gender relations, as did I on occasion. Things that have come in many instances from our media consumption, but when we sat down and had conversations on our perspectives properly, a lot of those moderated, and we often saw the travails faced by the other side so to speak.
It’s easy to see how such things can fester for people who aren’t in a position to have those kind of conversations, or aren’t open-minded enough to shift their perspectives
On August 23 2026 20:47 oBlade wrote:But it doesn't "target American industries." It taxes Canadian companies (importers), which is immediately passed through 100% to Canadian citizens, according to the CNN principles of tariffs. It's an absolute consumer tax, I thought. Seems hypocritical to not update our prior assumptions when we see Canada, to spite Trump, making the exact same mistakes ("dollar for dollar") as Trump, back at Trump.
You could be the exception though. You're intellectually discerning, and realize that contrary to the blanket tariff, that Trump's targeted tariffs on Canada, and Canada's targeted retaliation are fine, okay. Even if that's the case, surely Canada putting 70% of its exports at risk in a trade war, plus taxing innocent businesses and consumers that rely on American industries, is a problem.
Which by the way, the rational thing is to target the industries that rely on your market? THE WORLD relies on the US market so you've managed to justify a Liberation Day blanket tariff against THE WORLD.
On August 23 2026 20:47 oBlade wrote:But it doesn't "target American industries." It taxes Canadian companies (importers), which is immediately passed through 100% to Canadian citizens, according to the CNN principles of tariffs. It's an absolute consumer tax, I thought. Seems hypocritical to not update our prior assumptions when we see Canada, to spite Trump, making the exact same mistakes ("dollar for dollar") as Trump, back at Trump.
You could be the exception though. You're intellectually discerning, and realize that contrary to the blanket tariff, that Trump's targeted tariffs on Canada, and Canada's targeted retaliation are fine, okay. Even if that's the case, surely Canada putting 70% of its exports at risk in a trade war, plus taxing innocent businesses and consumers that rely on American industries, is a problem.
Which by the way, the rational thing is to target the industries that rely on your market? THE WORLD relies on the US market so you've managed to justify a Liberation Day blanket tariff against THE WORLD.
0/10 troll attempt, try again.
You have failed to convince me you're capable of articulating any objectionable difference between the US's tariffs on Canada and Canada's tariffs on the US besides the order of the names.
On August 23 2026 18:59 JimmyJRaynor wrote: the root meaning of Liberal Party of Canada in its full context is economic liberty. There are many hard core right wingers in the Liberal Party of Canada. Hazel Mccallion, probably the most right wing Mayor Canada has ever had, endorsed Liberal Justin Trudeau in the 2015 election.
I'm very right wing, and ~1/2 of the time vote Liberal in Canadian elections of various levels.
Back to the topic of the thread. Trump has been bad as President. I think Kamala Harris would've been worse though. So, I'm still happy with my vote. The worst thing about the election is that both candidates were very bad. I was hoping Trump would be good. Oh well. If I had to do it over again, I'd still vote for Trump.
In what areas do you think Harris would have been worse than Trump?
On August 23 2026 20:47 oBlade wrote:But it doesn't "target American industries." It taxes Canadian companies (importers), which is immediately passed through 100% to Canadian citizens, according to the CNN principles of tariffs. It's an absolute consumer tax, I thought. Seems hypocritical to not update our prior assumptions when we see Canada, to spite Trump, making the exact same mistakes ("dollar for dollar") as Trump, back at Trump.
You could be the exception though. You're intellectually discerning, and realize that contrary to the blanket tariff, that Trump's targeted tariffs on Canada, and Canada's targeted retaliation are fine, okay. Even if that's the case, surely Canada putting 70% of its exports at risk in a trade war, plus taxing innocent businesses and consumers that rely on American industries, is a problem.
Which by the way, the rational thing is to target the industries that rely on your market? THE WORLD relies on the US market so you've managed to justify a Liberation Day blanket tariff against THE WORLD.
0/10 troll attempt, try again.
You have failed to convince me you're capable of articulating any objectionable difference between the US's tariffs on Canada and Canada's tariffs on the US besides the order of the names.
On August 23 2026 20:47 oBlade wrote:But it doesn't "target American industries." It taxes Canadian companies (importers), which is immediately passed through 100% to Canadian citizens, according to the CNN principles of tariffs. It's an absolute consumer tax, I thought. Seems hypocritical to not update our prior assumptions when we see Canada, to spite Trump, making the exact same mistakes ("dollar for dollar") as Trump, back at Trump.
You could be the exception though. You're intellectually discerning, and realize that contrary to the blanket tariff, that Trump's targeted tariffs on Canada, and Canada's targeted retaliation are fine, okay. Even if that's the case, surely Canada putting 70% of its exports at risk in a trade war, plus taxing innocent businesses and consumers that rely on American industries, is a problem.
Which by the way, the rational thing is to target the industries that rely on your market? THE WORLD relies on the US market so you've managed to justify a Liberation Day blanket tariff against THE WORLD.
0/10 troll attempt, try again.
You have failed to convince me you're capable of articulating any objectionable difference between the US's tariffs on Canada and Canada's tariffs on the US besides the order of the names.
I suspect that he can live with that.
I’m sure he can. But still strange that Oblade doesn’t know the difference in word like blanket and targeted. Or what reciprocal means. Or liberal.
Not shocking considering his world view, but learning some definitions would really blow his mind.
EPT
