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On January 07 2015 22:03 Biff The Understudy wrote:
What is really telling is that those islamists cunts don't target the racist anti-muslim far right.
They didn't target Minute which is an openly fascist anti-arab anti-muslim newspaper. They didn't target Eric Zemmour that calls for all muslims in France to be deported. They didn't target Marine Le Pen and her neo fascist discourse.
They target free thinkers, people with no hatred, people whose weapon is humour and satire.
There is no reason for them to attack the open hate groups like you mention (They have already achieved what these types of attacks are meant to achieve on them). Their mission is to inspire a global war for/against Islam.
The point of the strategy is to inflame average people against the generic thought of Islam/The West as opposed to the specific radicals who wear it as a shield or the specific hate type groups you mention.
Every person haphazardly conflating all of Islam with Terrorism is a win for the terrorist. Every person that says events like this or people like the gunmen are acting on behalf of Islam confirms the propaganda that the attackers have been fed.
I don't understand how people still can't understand that stripping these people and their actions of any religious context is the single most offensive thing people can do to the terrorist.
Calling them Muslim, mentioning "Allahu Akbar" being said, referencing Jihad, and generic anti-Muslim hate is precisely what the terrorist want people to do. They want random westerners to be afraid and defensive when they hear "Allahu Akbar".
They are more afraid of being made fun of than they are being called the intended insults (Jihadist's, Terrorists, etc... that are basically compliments and confirmations)
It's the same reason that NK got all but hurt about "The Interview". They fear being thought of as a joke a hell of a lot more than they fear being called the things people think are insulting them.
When they show footage of westerners being "terrorized" and in fear that's a lot better propaganda for them to use than if everyone was laughing at their fails like the "underwear bomber"
If you made a comic of a terror leader blowing up a school they'll just play it off like another western media thing. You draw a cartoon of a terror leader getting admonished by the spirit of a respected religious leader or made into a joke and they will lose their shit.
TLDR: Terrorists appreciate it when westerners make them sound like scary terrorist monster Jihadists acting on behalf of Islam. They hate it when you strip their actions of any religious significance and when you act like it doesn't scare you/ give the perception you think they are a joke (while still treating them like the threat they actually represent)
Also these guys look trained to some degree. Much different than the recent attack in Australia.
EDIT: I notice I was ninja'd a bit, I've never been so pleasantly surprised to see that there actually are several people here who get what the points of these attacks actually are.
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On January 07 2015 22:33 FFW_Rude wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 22:30 WhiteDog wrote:On January 07 2015 22:27 Biff The Understudy wrote:On January 07 2015 22:19 endy wrote:On January 07 2015 22:03 Biff The Understudy wrote:
What is really telling is that those islamists cunts don't target the racist anti-muslim far right.
They didn't target Minute which is an openly fascist anti-arab anti-muslim newspaper. They didn't target Eric Zemmour that calls for all muslims in France to be deported. They didn't target Marine Le Pen and her neo fascist discourse.
They target free thinkers, people with no hatred, people whose weapon is humour and satire. That's also what surprised me the most. A question begs to be asked: who does this attack benefit? Well, it's not that surprising. Fundamentalists benefit from being hatred and feared, but being laughed at, that's intolerable for them. Le Pen or Zemmour say that those people are a danger and that we are at war: that's exactly what they want. Cabu and Charb were saying they were pathetic morons that deserve to be mocked, and they killed them. Apparently they were talking a really bad french, so it's not sure they're french. Maybe they didn't even know about Zemmour, he is a french phenomena, but the caricature of the prophet had an eccho internationally. Dunno if posted, a video of the two armed men : http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2e6xny_attentats-au-siege-de-charlie-hebdo-images-de-la-fuite-des-terroristes_news?start=3 ""Ils ont tiré sur Wolinski, Cabu… ça a duré cinq minutes… Je m’étais réfugiée sous un bureau… Ils parlaient parfaitement le français… Se revendiquaient d’Al-Qaïda."" They were talking perfect french. it's from coco who survived the attack. Oh man... She opened the door for them  http://www.humanite.fr/charlie-hebdo-le-temoignage-de-la-dessinatrice-coco-562041
Ho okay, weird in France Culture (like 30 min ago) they just interviewed a girl who was in a building next to charlie hebdo and who was saying the opposite.
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On January 07 2015 22:37 WhiteDog wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 22:33 FFW_Rude wrote:On January 07 2015 22:30 WhiteDog wrote:On January 07 2015 22:27 Biff The Understudy wrote:On January 07 2015 22:19 endy wrote:On January 07 2015 22:03 Biff The Understudy wrote:
What is really telling is that those islamists cunts don't target the racist anti-muslim far right.
They didn't target Minute which is an openly fascist anti-arab anti-muslim newspaper. They didn't target Eric Zemmour that calls for all muslims in France to be deported. They didn't target Marine Le Pen and her neo fascist discourse.
They target free thinkers, people with no hatred, people whose weapon is humour and satire. That's also what surprised me the most. A question begs to be asked: who does this attack benefit? Well, it's not that surprising. Fundamentalists benefit from being hatred and feared, but being laughed at, that's intolerable for them. Le Pen or Zemmour say that those people are a danger and that we are at war: that's exactly what they want. Cabu and Charb were saying they were pathetic morons that deserve to be mocked, and they killed them. Apparently they were talking a really bad french, so it's not sure they're french. Maybe they didn't even know about Zemmour, he is a french phenomena, but the caricature of the prophet had an eccho internationally. Dunno if posted, a video of the two armed men : http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2e6xny_attentats-au-siege-de-charlie-hebdo-images-de-la-fuite-des-terroristes_news?start=3 ""Ils ont tiré sur Wolinski, Cabu… ça a duré cinq minutes… Je m’étais réfugiée sous un bureau… Ils parlaient parfaitement le français… Se revendiquaient d’Al-Qaïda."" They were talking perfect french. it's from coco who survived the attack. Oh man... She opened the door for them http://www.humanite.fr/charlie-hebdo-le-temoignage-de-la-dessinatrice-coco-562041 Ho okay, weird in France Culture they just interviewed a girl saying the opposite.
Maybe the random girl was still in a bad moment.
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On January 07 2015 22:37 WhiteDog wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 22:33 FFW_Rude wrote:On January 07 2015 22:30 WhiteDog wrote:On January 07 2015 22:27 Biff The Understudy wrote:On January 07 2015 22:19 endy wrote:On January 07 2015 22:03 Biff The Understudy wrote:
What is really telling is that those islamists cunts don't target the racist anti-muslim far right.
They didn't target Minute which is an openly fascist anti-arab anti-muslim newspaper. They didn't target Eric Zemmour that calls for all muslims in France to be deported. They didn't target Marine Le Pen and her neo fascist discourse.
They target free thinkers, people with no hatred, people whose weapon is humour and satire. That's also what surprised me the most. A question begs to be asked: who does this attack benefit? Well, it's not that surprising. Fundamentalists benefit from being hatred and feared, but being laughed at, that's intolerable for them. Le Pen or Zemmour say that those people are a danger and that we are at war: that's exactly what they want. Cabu and Charb were saying they were pathetic morons that deserve to be mocked, and they killed them. Apparently they were talking a really bad french, so it's not sure they're french. Maybe they didn't even know about Zemmour, he is a french phenomena, but the caricature of the prophet had an eccho internationally. Dunno if posted, a video of the two armed men : http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2e6xny_attentats-au-siege-de-charlie-hebdo-images-de-la-fuite-des-terroristes_news?start=3 ""Ils ont tiré sur Wolinski, Cabu… ça a duré cinq minutes… Je m’étais réfugiée sous un bureau… Ils parlaient parfaitement le français… Se revendiquaient d’Al-Qaïda."" They were talking perfect french. it's from coco who survived the attack. Oh man... She opened the door for them http://www.humanite.fr/charlie-hebdo-le-temoignage-de-la-dessinatrice-coco-562041 Ho okay, weird in France Culture (like 30 min ago) they just interviewed a girl who was in a building next to charlie hebdo and who was saying the opposite.
Yeah i have some contradicting "facts" from the 3sources i have opened.
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A huge terrorist attack was to be expected in France. Not being surprised doesn't prevent me from feeling really bad. I hope they get caught alive and get interrogated. This is not the last time we get targeted, and we need info more than vengeance.
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On January 07 2015 22:36 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 22:03 Biff The Understudy wrote:
What is really telling is that those islamists cunts don't target the racist anti-muslim far right.
They didn't target Minute which is an openly fascist anti-arab anti-muslim newspaper. They didn't target Eric Zemmour that calls for all muslims in France to be deported. They didn't target Marine Le Pen and her neo fascist discourse.
They target free thinkers, people with no hatred, people whose weapon is humour and satire. There is no reason for them to attack the open hate groups like you mention (They have already achieved what these types of attacks are meant to achieve on them). Their mission is to inspire a global war for/against Islam. The point of the strategy is to inflame average people against the generic thought of Islam/The West as opposed to the specific radicals who wear it as a shield or the specific hate type groups you mention. Every person haphazardly conflating all of Islam with Terrorism is a win for the terrorist. Every person that says events like this or people like the gunmen are acting on behalf of Islam confirms the propaganda that the attackers have been fed. I don't understand how people still can't understand that stripping these people and their actions of any religious context is the single most offensive thing people can do to the terrorist. Calling them Muslim, mentioning "Allahu Akbar" being said, referencing Jihad, and generic anti-Muslim hate is precisely what the terrorist want people to do. They want random westerners to be afraid and defensive when they hear "Allahu Akbar". They are more afraid of being made fun of than they are being called the intended insults (Jihadist's, Terrorists, etc... that are basically compliments and confirmations) It's the same reason that NK got all but hurt about "The Interview". They fear being thought of as a joke a hell of a lot more than they fear being called the things people think are insulting them. When they show footage of westerners being "terrorized" and in fear that's a lot better propaganda for them to use than if everyone was laughing at their fails like the "underwear bomber" If you made a comic of a terror leader blowing up a school they'll just play it off like another western media thing. You draw a cartoon of a terror leader getting admonished by the spirit of a respected religious leader or made into a joke and they will lose their shit. TLDR: Terrorists appreciate it when westerners make them sound like scary terrorist monster Jihadists acting on behalf of Islam. They hate it when you strip their actions of any religious significance and when you act like it doesn't scare you/ give the perception you think they are a joke (while still treating them like the threat they actually represent) Also these guys look trained to some degree. Much different than the recent attack in Australia.
I agree with that. Religion is always an excuse, not a goal. What we saw recently was that the guy that were recruited and went to Syria or wherever are generally poor guys that could have end in any other extremist organisation. They just chose the one that media are enlightening at this moment, nothing to do with a god or a religion.
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Fucking extremist morons.
Le Pen and co. will be happy about that.
Edit:
+ Show Spoiler +On January 07 2015 22:36 GreenHorizons wrote:
There is no reason for them to attack the open hate groups like you mention (They have already achieved what these types of attacks are meant to achieve on them). Their mission is to inspire a global war for/against Islam.
The point of the strategy is to inflame average people against the generic thought of Islam/The West as opposed to the specific radicals who wear it as a shield or the specific hate type groups you mention.
Every person haphazardly conflating all of Islam with Terrorism is a win for the terrorist. Every person that says events like this or people like the gunmen are acting on behalf of Islam confirms the propaganda that the attackers have been fed.
I don't understand how people still can't understand that stripping these people and their actions of any religious context is the single most offensive thing people can do to the terrorist.
Calling them Muslim, mentioning "Allahu Akbar" being said, referencing Jihad, and generic anti-Muslim hate is precisely what the terrorist want people to do. They want random westerners to be afraid and defensive when they hear "Allahu Akbar".
They are more afraid of being made fun of than they are being called the intended insults (Jihadist's, Terrorists, etc... that are basically compliments and confirmations)
It's the same reason that NK got all but hurt about "The Interview". They fear being thought of as a joke a hell of a lot more than they fear being called the things people think are insulting them.
When they show footage of westerners being "terrorized" and in fear that's a lot better propaganda for them to use than if everyone was laughing at their fails like the "underwear bomber"
If you made a comic of a terror leader blowing up a school they'll just play it off like another western media thing. You draw a cartoon of a terror leader getting admonished by the spirit of a respected religious leader or made into a joke and they will lose their shit.
TLDR: Terrorists appreciate it when westerners make them sound like scary terrorist monster Jihadists acting on behalf of Islam. They hate it when you strip their actions of any religious significance and when you act like it doesn't scare you/ give the perception you think they are a joke (while still treating them like the threat they actually represent)
Also these guys look trained to some degree. Much different than the recent attack in Australia.
EDIT: I notice I was ninja'd a bit, I've never been so pleasantly surprised to see that there actually are several people here who get what the points of these attacks actually are.
Thanks GreenHorizons. Very well put.
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Northern Ireland22208 Posts
marie le pen already planning her presidential inauguration ceremony
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On January 07 2015 22:35 Aeromi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 22:34 ahswtini wrote:this is the reality facing the streets of Europe Sorry, I can't allow you to post this.
Indeed this is disgusting.
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On January 07 2015 21:27 mdb wrote:
I wish all the newspapers all over the world publish on the front page the cartoons from this magazine tomorrow morning.
Imagine what would happen next? How many wars in our history we had due to a religion differences? Religion and progressive future goes different ways.
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On January 07 2015 22:37 WhiteDog wrote:
Ho okay, weird in France Culture (like 30 min ago) they just interviewed a girl who was in a building next to charlie hebdo and who was saying the opposite.
So she was not in the building they attacked ?
...
Sounds like a reliable source.
BTW
“Our punishment will be more generosity, more tolerance and more democracy.”
The Mayor of Oslo, after Utoya's massacre.
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Fucking hell man... I can't believe this happened, still in shock over it.
And the worst part, this will have repercussion over French politics and mentality for the next Presidential election that I don't want to see.
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On January 07 2015 22:48 FFW_Rude wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 22:39 corumjhaelen wrote:
A huge terrorist attack was to be expected in France. Not being surprised doesn't prevent me from feeling really bad. I hope they get caught alive and get interrogated. This is not the last time we get targeted, and we need info more than vengeance. It's the 4th attack in two month if i'm not mistaken. It is indeed way bigger than the other but man... i really don't get it. i have friends coming to those Paris district in reinforcement.
4th ? First or second, the 2 guys during Xmas were alcoholic.
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GreenHorizons
+ Show Spoiler +On January 07 2015 22:36 GreenHorizons wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 22:03 Biff The Understudy wrote:
What is really telling is that those islamists cunts don't target the racist anti-muslim far right.
They didn't target Minute which is an openly fascist anti-arab anti-muslim newspaper. They didn't target Eric Zemmour that calls for all muslims in France to be deported. They didn't target Marine Le Pen and her neo fascist discourse.
They target free thinkers, people with no hatred, people whose weapon is humour and satire. There is no reason for them to attack the open hate groups like you mention (They have already achieved what these types of attacks are meant to achieve on them). Their mission is to inspire a global war for/against Islam. The point of the strategy is to inflame average people against the generic thought of Islam/The West as opposed to the specific radicals who wear it as a shield or the specific hate type groups you mention. Every person haphazardly conflating all of Islam with Terrorism is a win for the terrorist. Every person that says events like this or people like the gunmen are acting on behalf of Islam confirms the propaganda that the attackers have been fed. I don't understand how people still can't understand that stripping these people and their actions of any religious context is the single most offensive thing people can do to the terrorist. Calling them Muslim, mentioning "Allahu Akbar" being said, referencing Jihad, and generic anti-Muslim hate is precisely what the terrorist want people to do. They want random westerners to be afraid and defensive when they hear "Allahu Akbar". They are more afraid of being made fun of than they are being called the intended insults (Jihadist's, Terrorists, etc... that are basically compliments and confirmations) It's the same reason that NK got all but hurt about "The Interview". They fear being thought of as a joke a hell of a lot more than they fear being called the things people think are insulting them. When they show footage of westerners being "terrorized" and in fear that's a lot better propaganda for them to use than if everyone was laughing at their fails like the "underwear bomber" If you made a comic of a terror leader blowing up a school they'll just play it off like another western media thing. You draw a cartoon of a terror leader getting admonished by the spirit of a respected religious leader or made into a joke and they will lose their shit. TLDR: Terrorists appreciate it when westerners make them sound like scary terrorist monster Jihadists acting on behalf of Islam. They hate it when you strip their actions of any religious significance and when you act like it doesn't scare you/ give the perception you think they are a joke (while still treating them like the threat they actually represent) Also these guys look trained to some degree. Much different than the recent attack in Australia. EDIT: I notice I was ninja'd a bit, I've never been so pleasantly surprised to see that there actually are several people here who get what the points of these attacks actually are.
You are kinda missing the point here. We are not making them looking scary. Those guys are scary, and should be threated as such. Look when making fun of them got those people at Charlie Hebdo. They are dead. 12 people are dead and possibly more. I know there is no perfect solution but right now something is terribly wrong.
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On January 07 2015 22:47 Majax wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 22:37 WhiteDog wrote:
Ho okay, weird in France Culture (like 30 min ago) they just interviewed a girl who was in a building next to charlie hebdo and who was saying the opposite. So she was not in the building they attacked ? ... Sounds like a reliable source.
Apparently the guy asked different shop where the charlie hebdo's office were, so he entered her building and talked to someone.
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fuck man, fuck this shit
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On January 07 2015 22:46 cSc.Dav1oN wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 21:27 mdb wrote:
I wish all the newspapers all over the world publish on the front page the cartoons from this magazine tomorrow morning. Imagine what would happen next? How many wars in our history we had due to a religion differences? Religion and progressive future goes different ways.
What happens next doesn't matter. What matters is that the West shows that it will not be intimidated by extremists of any kind.
Of course, it would also help if many western countries did something about the often impoverished and marginalised muslim minorities living in their countries. Poorly educated young men with no prospects of a better future are easily turned into extremists.
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On January 07 2015 22:49 Aeromi wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 22:48 FFW_Rude wrote:On January 07 2015 22:39 corumjhaelen wrote:
A huge terrorist attack was to be expected in France. Not being surprised doesn't prevent me from feeling really bad. I hope they get caught alive and get interrogated. This is not the last time we get targeted, and we need info more than vengeance. It's the 4th attack in two month if i'm not mistaken. It is indeed way bigger than the other but man... i really don't get it. i have friends coming to those Paris district in reinforcement. 4th ? First or second, the 2 guys during Xmas were alcoholic.
I thought the two drivers called some revendication. I will edit my post then. I am mistaken then. I thought they were same kind of attack.
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On January 07 2015 22:53 FFW_Rude wrote:Show nested quote +On January 07 2015 22:49 Aeromi wrote:On January 07 2015 22:48 FFW_Rude wrote:On January 07 2015 22:39 corumjhaelen wrote:
A huge terrorist attack was to be expected in France. Not being surprised doesn't prevent me from feeling really bad. I hope they get caught alive and get interrogated. This is not the last time we get targeted, and we need info more than vengeance. It's the 4th attack in two month if i'm not mistaken. It is indeed way bigger than the other but man... i really don't get it. i have friends coming to those Paris district in reinforcement. 4th ? First or second, the 2 guys during Xmas were alcoholic. I thought the two drivers called some revendication. I will edit my post then. I am mistaken then. I thought they were same kind of attack.
Well, two guys had a really higw level of alcohol in their blood ( 1.8g/L )
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EPT
