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World Chess Championship 2013 - Page 82

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Chess discussion continues here
Orome
Profile Blog Joined June 2004
Switzerland11984 Posts
November 21 2013 14:59 GMT
#1621
Again, the concrete position isn't the problem (it's worse than the game continuation, but not dramatically so), but unless you have a clear plan of how you're going to attack using your Nh5 move, Nh5 isn't logical. You could look at Nf6+ sacs here for example (Nf6+ gx gx at least looks scary optically), but unfortunately they don't work. If your best plan remains pushing f6 and provoking g6, Nh5 remains a clear mistake like I pointed out in my last post.
On a purely personal note, I'd like to show Yellow the beauty of infinitely repeating Starcraft 2 bunkers. -Boxer
champinjonen
Profile Joined November 2012
Sweden182 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-11-21 15:16:40
November 21 2013 15:05 GMT
#1622
On November 21 2013 23:53 Plexa wrote:
http://tcec.chessdom.com/anand-carlsen-2013-live.php
Go to 22... b3 and all the engines have Nh5 as an option and the line they suggest.


The engine only showed one variation of Nh5 and when following it it says after Qf4, Black goes Kb5, but then the engine choose white Qd2. But couldn't see what happend if white instead goes Kf6.

Edited* ahh sry x9
[image loading]

What now?
urboss
Profile Joined September 2013
Austria1223 Posts
November 21 2013 15:07 GMT
#1623
On November 22 2013 00:05 champinjonen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 21 2013 23:53 Plexa wrote:
http://tcec.chessdom.com/anand-carlsen-2013-live.php
Go to 22... b3 and all the engines have Nh5 as an option and the line they suggest.


The engine only showed one variation of Nh5 and when following it it says after Qf4, Black goes Kb5, but then the engine choose white Qd2. But couldn't see what happend if white instead goes Kf6.

What now?


Black can defend the mate threat with Kh8 and Rg8.
champinjonen
Profile Joined November 2012
Sweden182 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-11-21 15:11:37
November 21 2013 15:10 GMT
#1624
On November 22 2013 00:07 urboss wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 22 2013 00:05 champinjonen wrote:
On November 21 2013 23:53 Plexa wrote:
http://tcec.chessdom.com/anand-carlsen-2013-live.php
Go to 22... b3 and all the engines have Nh5 as an option and the line they suggest.


The engine only showed one variation of Nh5 and when following it it says after Qf4, Black goes Kb5, but then the engine choose white Qd2. But couldn't see what happend if white instead goes Kf6.

What now?


Black can defend the mate threat with Kh8 and Rg8.


Kg8 and Knight goes d5 and white is a pawn up. Right?

Or even better bishop takes pawn on d5.
urboss
Profile Joined September 2013
Austria1223 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-11-21 15:13:13
November 21 2013 15:11 GMT
#1625
On November 22 2013 00:10 champinjonen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 22 2013 00:07 urboss wrote:
On November 22 2013 00:05 champinjonen wrote:
On November 21 2013 23:53 Plexa wrote:
http://tcec.chessdom.com/anand-carlsen-2013-live.php
Go to 22... b3 and all the engines have Nh5 as an option and the line they suggest.


The engine only showed one variation of Nh5 and when following it it says after Qf4, Black goes Kb5, but then the engine choose white Qd2. But couldn't see what happend if white instead goes Kf6.

What now?


Black can defend the mate threat with Kh8 and Rg8.


Kg8 and Knight goes d5 and white is a pawn up. Right?



I mean after the exchange, then Kh8:
gxf6
gxf6 Kh8
Qh6 Rg8
Oleo
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands283 Posts
November 21 2013 15:12 GMT
#1626
On November 22 2013 00:05 champinjonen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 21 2013 23:53 Plexa wrote:
http://tcec.chessdom.com/anand-carlsen-2013-live.php
Go to 22... b3 and all the engines have Nh5 as an option and the line they suggest.


The engine only showed one variation of Nh5 and when following it it says after Qf4, Black goes Kb5, but then the engine choose white Qd2. But couldn't see what happend if white instead goes Kf6.

What now?


There seems to be a black bishop missing??
Managing Siegetanks is like raising a superhero - Artosis.
urboss
Profile Joined September 2013
Austria1223 Posts
November 21 2013 15:15 GMT
#1627
On November 22 2013 00:12 Oleo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 22 2013 00:05 champinjonen wrote:
On November 21 2013 23:53 Plexa wrote:
http://tcec.chessdom.com/anand-carlsen-2013-live.php
Go to 22... b3 and all the engines have Nh5 as an option and the line they suggest.


The engine only showed one variation of Nh5 and when following it it says after Qf4, Black goes Kb5, but then the engine choose white Qd2. But couldn't see what happend if white instead goes Kf6.

What now?


There seems to be a black bishop missing??


Bishops are overrated anyway..
urboss
Profile Joined September 2013
Austria1223 Posts
November 21 2013 15:21 GMT
#1628
Kasparov:
"Anand knew keeping queens on was his best chance against Carlsen.
But not three queens! He overdid it!"
mihajovics
Profile Joined April 2011
179 Posts
November 21 2013 15:30 GMT
#1629
so sad...
don't want to discredit anything from Carlsen, but it kind of seems like Anand losing the title, not Carlsen winning it...
of course, this is his style, constant pressure, etc, but still...
champinjonen
Profile Joined November 2012
Sweden182 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-11-21 15:33:44
November 21 2013 15:31 GMT
#1630
+ Show Spoiler +
On November 22 2013 00:05 champinjonen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 21 2013 23:53 Plexa wrote:
http://tcec.chessdom.com/anand-carlsen-2013-live.php
Go to 22... b3 and all the engines have Nh5 as an option and the line they suggest.


The engine only showed one variation of Nh5 and when following it it says after Qf4, Black goes Kb5, but then the engine choose white Qd2. But couldn't see what happend if white instead goes Kf6.

Edited* ahh sry x9
[image loading]

What now?



[image loading]

Next?
urboss
Profile Joined September 2013
Austria1223 Posts
November 21 2013 15:37 GMT
#1631
On November 22 2013 00:31 champinjonen wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
On November 22 2013 00:05 champinjonen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 21 2013 23:53 Plexa wrote:
http://tcec.chessdom.com/anand-carlsen-2013-live.php
Go to 22... b3 and all the engines have Nh5 as an option and the line they suggest.


The engine only showed one variation of Nh5 and when following it it says after Qf4, Black goes Kb5, but then the engine choose white Qd2. But couldn't see what happend if white instead goes Kf6.

Edited* ahh sry x9
[image loading]

What now?



[image loading]

Next?


We exchange pawns and White has no attack at all.
If you need a free engine for analysis download Arena.
http://www.playwitharena.com/
Arnstein
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Norway3381 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-11-21 15:43:03
November 21 2013 15:39 GMT
#1632
Magnus is so sick! I hope he wins tomorrow, just to show how good he is!

Edit: wow, the awkwardness after "I was thinking about what to eat tonight"...
rsol in response to the dragoon voice being heard in SCII: dragoon ai reaches new lows: wanders into wrong game
champinjonen
Profile Joined November 2012
Sweden182 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-11-21 16:12:35
November 21 2013 15:55 GMT
#1633
On November 22 2013 00:37 urboss wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 22 2013 00:31 champinjonen wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
On November 22 2013 00:05 champinjonen wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 21 2013 23:53 Plexa wrote:
http://tcec.chessdom.com/anand-carlsen-2013-live.php
Go to 22... b3 and all the engines have Nh5 as an option and the line they suggest.


The engine only showed one variation of Nh5 and when following it it says after Qf4, Black goes Kb5, but then the engine choose white Qd2. But couldn't see what happend if white instead goes Kf6.

Edited* ahh sry x9
[image loading]

What now?



[image loading]

Next?


We exchange pawns and White has no attack at all.
If you need a free engine for analysis download Arena.
http://www.playwitharena.com/


Thanks alot! Just started to figure out how the UI works. But my moves are down -5 so I guess their is no chance but gonna see it until the end ^^

*Ahh close but no cigar
caelym
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
United States6429 Posts
November 21 2013 16:02 GMT
#1634
Really exciting game. Too bad it came so late in the series.
Acrofales
Profile Joined August 2010
Spain18317 Posts
November 21 2013 16:07 GMT
#1635
Ok, back to the Rf4 move. I understand Anand was trying to keep the pressure on, but it was completely obvious that that move would give Carlsen a queen and check, and there didn't seem to be an immediate mate from Rf4 in any case.

Why not play defensive? Ke2 has already been discussed a bit, but I'm not sure what is wrong with Rb1 either. Either black defends with the queen, or sacrifices it, but I don't see what can be gained in the sacrifice. I haven't looked at any analysis of it, but it seems decent, albeit defensive.
vndestiny
Profile Blog Joined September 2011
Singapore3457 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-11-21 16:21:36
November 21 2013 16:19 GMT
#1636
Can someone help ? I still can't see the line after 28. Bf1. Following the line 28... Qd1. 29. Rh4 Qh5. 30. Nxh5.
Now what :/ ? How would it be a draw from there ?

Edit: or is it 28. ... Qe1 ? After that Anand seems dead though ?
urboss
Profile Joined September 2013
Austria1223 Posts
November 21 2013 16:23 GMT
#1637
It's funny that Carlsen won the game without ever moving his Queen or Bishop.
Holgerius
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Sweden16951 Posts
November 21 2013 16:44 GMT
#1638
This is all but over. Grats Carlsen! Chess history in the making.
I believe in the almighty Grötslev! -- I am never serious and you should never believe a thing I say. Including the previous sentence.
soon.Cloak
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States983 Posts
November 21 2013 16:59 GMT
#1639
On November 22 2013 01:23 urboss wrote:
It's funny that Carlsen won the game without ever moving his Queen or Bishop.


Ha, great call!
kwizach
Profile Joined June 2011
3658 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-11-21 17:03:54
November 21 2013 17:02 GMT
#1640
I must say I'm incredibly happy that Carlsen is about to win the title (it's well deserved), BUT:

1. I'm sad Anand blundered in such a way. He deserves to go out better than this.
2. The format was bad - it should at least have been a bo16 or 18. We simply did not see enough interesting games, and it was quite predictable that the players would be very prudent.
"Oedipus ruined a great sex life by asking too many questions." -- Stephen Colbert
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