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On October 09 2012 10:35 GhostTK wrote:
I'm against gays. I don't believe you are born with a sexual orientation. it is a learned behavior. Im not a homophobe by any means. I have a gay friend and several gay girl friends. I just don't think it is right. i think there is a reason there is man and woman. you don't see gays in animals. maybe occasional but if animals were gay they would all go extinct. theres a reason gays cant' reproduce. it wasn't intended. Therefore it is wrong.
This is a troll. If not, may God help us all.
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On October 09 2012 10:35 GhostTK wrote:
I'm against gays. I don't believe you are born with a sexual orientation. it is a learned behavior. Im not a homophobe by any means. I have a gay friend and several gay girl friends. I just don't think it is right. i think there is a reason there is man and woman. you don't see gays in animals. maybe occasional but if animals were gay they would all go extinct. theres a reason gays cant' reproduce. it wasn't intended. Therefore it is wrong.
Ahh, the classic, "I have [x] friends but I still have a problem..." troll. Taking the bait anyway:
Animals display homosexual behavior all the time. Just look it up when you have some time 
I don't believe you are born with a sexual orientation either to be honest because there haven't been any "gay genes" definitively defined. However, does it matter to you if other people are gay? Does it affect you?
Yeah, there are man and woman because when they have sex they further the human race. That doesn't make not furthering the human race wrong, though, unless you're one of those people that only approves of procreative, chaste relationships.
On October 09 2012 07:35 KaiserKieran wrote:
Hello! I am a First Class scout (practically a star just need to do a board of review) and i am appalled how the BSA has continued to act negatively to the gay community in not allowing gay eagle scouts. While i am straight, i am a firm believer of gay rights. Being an eagle scout is incredibly hard (in fact only around 3% of boy scouts achieve it) and not being recognized for this achievement is incredibly disappointing. Even though he is turning 18 on Monday, i hope that the BSA still awards him for his accomplishments. 2 things that people often get confused is that when they think of boy scouts they think of 7 and 9 year olds while boy scouts is 10-18. (or grade level Below boy scouts is cub scouts.
The BSA thinks that if they do not allow gays in their troops, child abuse/molestation will go down. While this may seem like a good idea to some, it is practically the same as banning middle eastern people from entering the United States to decrease the likelihood of terrorist attacks.
Another view is that gays are some how "abominations of god" or something or another when that is simply not the case. I hope that the BSA changes these acts of bigotry and welcomes gays in Boy Scouts by not only giving this scout his eagle, but by also welcoming other gays in troops.
In addition, the BSA tried to justify their acts by also saying that the scout did not believe in god. While boy scouts are firm believers in their "Duty to God" and such, believing in a higher being and believing in god are the exact same thing[b] If the BSA only allowed Christians, what culture diversity would there be? Where would the freedom of religion have gone? I believe if any changes are to come to the BSA, they must first happen in states i.e. gay rights. Once Amurrica (ahem America) has allowed more gay rights i think the BSA will be put in a very precarious position and be semi forced to allow gays in boy scouts.
GL HF BSA!
hopefully we will get a gg soon.
[/b]
I am a life scout and will do my Eagle Board of Review once I finish all the paperwork in the next couple of days hear back from the council. This means I have done everything but the final "test" where I relate my experiences and get tested on what I learned by some officials and adults in my troop/
First off, gay-policy varies between troops. The scoutmaster's son in my troop talks and acts like a stereotypical homosexual. Doesn't mean that he is one, but I would bet that he is. I don't think anyone in my troop cares about if you're gay (at least nobody in charge). Nobody cares about religion either. I'm an atheist, I have two friends in my troop who are atheist who actually told one of the adults that when inquired about their religion. He didn't care, he just told them to say that they were agnostic-christian. If you are a member of a very conservative troop or are dealing with the council, just abide by don't ask, don't tell. It sucks and it's not fair, but it's far smarter than walking into a room of Christians announcing that they are wrong. To be honest this gay-atheist guy was probably just too brazen, which is stupid in the BSA.
I disagree that becoming an Eagle Scout is hard, it just takes time and you have to start from when you are younger. In my troop all of the people that "stick with" scouts become Eagles, you just have to be dedicated and willing to work.It does suck that the guy isn't being recognized for it though, because the only reasons I, and many others, participate are the benefits in the workplace or in applications for college.
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As a boy scout (going to be Eagle soon), I have always been confused by how a bunch of males camping together in the woods with no female presence whatsoever can discriminate against gays.
I have a friend in my troop who I believe is gay (he never officially told me, but I accidentally read parts of his diary). It would make me feel terrible if he was kicked out because of it.
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On October 09 2012 10:35 GhostTK wrote:
I'm against gays. I don't believe you are born with a sexual orientation. it is a learned behavior. Im not a homophobe by any means. I have a gay friend and several gay girl friends. I just don't think it is right. i think there is a reason there is man and woman. you don't see gays in animals. maybe occasional but if animals were gay they would all go extinct. theres a reason gays cant' reproduce. it wasn't intended. Therefore it is wrong.
You...
Do...
See...
Gay...
Animals...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexual_behavior_in_animals
So to get this straight, you believe that it's a choice for a person to choose to be bullied, ridiculed and assaulted by bigots their entire life just because, well whatever it's a choice!
Just you're... gah everything that's wrong with the human species.
Here's how I imagine a conversation with you.
"I just don't think it's right!"
Well why's that?
"It's a learned behavior!"
Oh and?
"THERE ARE NO GAY ANIMALS!"
Well there are... so what are you getting at?
"Um man and woman! It's what makes sense!"
Well makes sense to who? Through history homosexuality has played a very common role all over. In fact our society based on religious principles made up from thin air for political purposes is one of the only societies that takes sex so seriously. It's like an annerexic disorder.
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United States7483 Posts
On October 09 2012 10:46 Chocolate wrote:Show nested quote +On October 09 2012 10:35 GhostTK wrote:
I'm against gays. I don't believe you are born with a sexual orientation. it is a learned behavior. Im not a homophobe by any means. I have a gay friend and several gay girl friends. I just don't think it is right. i think there is a reason there is man and woman. you don't see gays in animals. maybe occasional but if animals were gay they would all go extinct. theres a reason gays cant' reproduce. it wasn't intended. Therefore it is wrong. Ahh, the classic, "I have [x] friends but I still have a problem..." troll. Taking the bait anyway: Animals display homosexual behavior all the time. Just look it up when you have some time I don't believe you are born with a sexual orientation either to be honest because there haven't been any "gay genes" definitively defined. However, does it matter to you if other people are gay? Does it affect you? Yeah, there are man and woman because when they have sex they further the human race. That doesn't make not furthering the human race wrong, though, unless you're one of those people that only approves of procreative, chaste relationships. Show nested quote +On October 09 2012 07:35 KaiserKieran wrote:
Hello! I am a First Class scout (practically a star just need to do a board of review) and i am appalled how the BSA has continued to act negatively to the gay community in not allowing gay eagle scouts. While i am straight, i am a firm believer of gay rights. Being an eagle scout is incredibly hard (in fact only around 3% of boy scouts achieve it) and not being recognized for this achievement is incredibly disappointing. Even though he is turning 18 on Monday, i hope that the BSA still awards him for his accomplishments. 2 things that people often get confused is that when they think of boy scouts they think of 7 and 9 year olds while boy scouts is 10-18. (or grade level Below boy scouts is cub scouts.
The BSA thinks that if they do not allow gays in their troops, child abuse/molestation will go down. While this may seem like a good idea to some, it is practically the same as banning middle eastern people from entering the United States to decrease the likelihood of terrorist attacks.
Another view is that gays are some how "abominations of god" or something or another when that is simply not the case. I hope that the BSA changes these acts of bigotry and welcomes gays in Boy Scouts by not only giving this scout his eagle, but by also welcoming other gays in troops.
In addition, the BSA tried to justify their acts by also saying that the scout did not believe in god. While boy scouts are firm believers in their "Duty to God" and such, believing in a higher being and believing in god are the exact same thing[b] If the BSA only allowed Christians, what culture diversity would there be? Where would the freedom of religion have gone? I believe if any changes are to come to the BSA, they must first happen in states i.e. gay rights. Once Amurrica (ahem America) has allowed more gay rights i think the BSA will be put in a very precarious position and be semi forced to allow gays in boy scouts.
GL HF BSA!
hopefully we will get a gg soon.
I am a life scout and will do my Eagle Board of Review once I finish all the paperwork in the next couple of days hear back from the council. This means I have done everything but the final "test" where I relate my experiences and get tested on what I learned by some officials and adults in my troop/ First off, gay-policy varies between troops. The scoutmaster's son in my troop talks and acts like a stereotypical homosexual. Doesn't mean that he is one, but I would bet that he is. I don't think anyone in my troop cares about if you're gay (at least nobody in charge). Nobody cares about religion either. I'm an atheist, I have two friends in my troop who are atheist who actually told one of the adults that when inquired about their religion. He didn't care, he just told them to say that they were agnostic-christian. If you are a member of a very conservative troop or are dealing with the council, just abide by don't ask, don't tell. It sucks and it's not fair, but it's far smarter than walking into a room of Christians announcing that they are wrong. To be honest this gay-atheist guy was probably just too brazen, which is stupid in the BSA. I disagree that becoming an Eagle Scout is hard, it just takes time and you have to start from when you are younger. In my troop all of the people that "stick with" scouts become Eagles, you just have to be dedicated and willing to work.It does suck that the guy isn't being recognized for it though, because the only reasons I, and many others, participate are the benefits in the workplace or in applications for college. [/b]
It's a pretty sad state of affairs that the most lenient and tolerant people in the organization tell you to lie about your beliefs to avoid problems.
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Guys, GhostTK's post was totally only flamebait. I can't believe people actually responded to him.... m-(
@Whitewing:
It's a pretty sad state of affairs that the most lenient and tolerant people in the organization tell you to lie about your beliefs to avoid problems.
Or just not bring them up in the first place?... There's a time and a place for it, and that's usually privately between parents and child. I can't fathom a reason necessary enough to broach the subject publicly at a Scout function, or even between Scout leaders.
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why does it matter, it isn't like they are being denied a job or something good.
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On October 09 2012 12:02 Doubting wrote:
why does it matter, it isn't like they are being denied a job or something good.
Right. Fuck that gay Eagle shit, and play SC2 instead so you can become a pro-gamer and make that cash.
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United States7483 Posts
On October 09 2012 11:59 cLAN.Anax wrote:Guys, GhostTK's post was totally only flamebait. I can't believe people actually responded to him.... m-( @Whitewing: Show nested quote +It's a pretty sad state of affairs that the most lenient and tolerant people in the organization tell you to lie about your beliefs to avoid problems. Or just not bring them up in the first place?... There's a time and a place for it, and that's usually privately between parents and child. I can't fathom a reason necessary enough to broach the subject publicly at a Scout function, or even between Scout leaders.
It's in their charter that religion is super important to the boy scouts. Seriously, it's one of their core values, and it says as much on their official website. Here's a link to the page:
http://www.scouting.org/Visitor/WhyScouting/FaithTraditions.aspx
It's also mentioned in most of the other pages you can look at.
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If being homosexual gives no advantage to us as a race evolution would of gotten rid of it a long time ago. Homosexuality is something genetic and there are multiple studies on this. Being born with the "gay" gene does not necessarily mean one is gay. Homosexuality exists for cooperative reproduction and to limit the overpopulation problem.
Homosexuals have their own place within society and I just can't be bothered over senseless bickering. A lot of religious organizations are against gays regardless of sex. This is just another reason why religion within itself is absolutely flawed. Can't wait for mankind to get over this "religion" vice. Then just maybe we will all progress even further as a race.
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On October 09 2012 11:59 cLAN.Anax wrote:Guys, GhostTK's post was totally only flamebait. I can't believe people actually responded to him.... m-( @Whitewing: Show nested quote +It's a pretty sad state of affairs that the most lenient and tolerant people in the organization tell you to lie about your beliefs to avoid problems. Or just not bring them up in the first place?... There's a time and a place for it, and that's usually privately between parents and child. I can't fathom a reason necessary enough to broach the subject publicly at a Scout function, or even between Scout leaders.
Life doesn't work that way. Kids talk amongst themselves, photos are shared, gossip travels around and questions are asked.
It was an adult who inquired about the atheist's beliefs in that story related by the Scout a few posts back. Not the kid.
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On October 09 2012 00:47 neversummer wrote:
First of all I don't think anyone is supporting the Boy Scouts of America.
Secondly I applaud them for maintaining their position in the midst of criticism from the community; I've never really cared for what is "politically" correct and quite frankly I don't think gay men should be prancing around with large groups of 8-10 year old boys.
User was temp banned for this post.
Temp ban for this post? I'm sorry but I just do not think it's fair? Sure, he didn't get the age group correctly but so now anyone who doesn't agree with having homosexuals in boy scouts should get a temp ban? The user stated their opinion and I'm sure that there are a lot of people who would agree, though obviously not openly on a forum like TL. I swear, people who have one thing to say against homosexuality get bullied 1000x more than homosexuals themselves.
Why even let this thread live if the only posts that are allowed are the homosexual praising ones and agreement with OP ones?
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I thought being gay was a requirement...... lol
User was warned for this post
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On October 09 2012 12:19 shizaep wrote:Show nested quote +On October 09 2012 00:47 neversummer wrote:
First of all I don't think anyone is supporting the Boy Scouts of America.
Secondly I applaud them for maintaining their position in the midst of criticism from the community; I've never really cared for what is "politically" correct and quite frankly I don't think gay men should be prancing around with large groups of 8-10 year old boys.
User was temp banned for this post. Temp ban for this post? I'm sorry but I just do not think it's fair? Sure, he didn't get the age group correctly but so now anyone who doesn't agree with having homosexuals in boy scouts should get a temp ban? The user stated their opinion and I'm sure that there are a lot of people who would agree, though obviously not openly on a forum like TL. I swear, people who have one thing to say against homosexuality get bullied 1000x more than homosexuals themselves. Why even let this thread live if the only posts that are allowed are the homosexual praising ones and agreement with OP ones?
as someone who might agree with him, i have to say, what he said was wrong, and was said in a needlessly offensive way. if he had left out the "prancing around" part, then you might have a point.
as to the OP:
that sucks. poor kid. but a policy is a policy i guess...
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On October 09 2012 12:19 shizaep wrote:Show nested quote +On October 09 2012 00:47 neversummer wrote:
First of all I don't think anyone is supporting the Boy Scouts of America.
Secondly I applaud them for maintaining their position in the midst of criticism from the community; I've never really cared for what is "politically" correct and quite frankly I don't think gay men should be prancing around with large groups of 8-10 year old boys.
User was temp banned for this post. Temp ban for this post? I'm sorry but I just do not think it's fair? Sure, he didn't get the age group correctly but so now anyone who doesn't agree with having homosexuals in boy scouts should get a temp ban? The user stated their opinion and I'm sure that there are a lot of people who would agree, though obviously not openly on a forum like TL. I swear, people who have one thing to say against homosexuality get bullied 1000x more than homosexuals themselves. Why even let this thread live if the only posts that are allowed are the homosexual praising ones and agreement with OP ones?
Issues with moderation go in Website Feedback not in the thread itself. You can also check the exact reason a user was banned on the Automated Ban List.
OT - As an Eagle Scout myself, I cannot say I am pleased with the stance the BSA has taken.
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On October 09 2012 12:19 shizaep wrote:I swear, people who have one thing to say against homosexuality get bullied 1000x more than homosexuals themselves.
Are you talking about TL or society in general? And bullied? If that's the extent of "bullying" let's consider ourselves lucky. Or do you have any other examples more egregious?
I don't agree with that ban, either, in any case.
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On October 09 2012 00:47 neversummer wrote:
First of all I don't think anyone is supporting the Boy Scouts of America.
Secondly I applaud them for maintaining their position in the midst of criticism from the community; I've never really cared for what is "politically" correct and quite frankly I don't think gay men should be prancing around with large groups of 8-10 year old boys.
User was temp banned for this post.
I think you're mistaking homosexual men for pedophiles.. Do you think just because someone is gay, they want to sleep with everyone of their gender? Narrow-minded thinking such as that is a disappointment.
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On October 09 2012 12:11 MooMu wrote:Show nested quote +On October 09 2012 12:02 Doubting wrote:
why does it matter, it isn't like they are being denied a job or something good. Right. Fuck that gay Eagle shit, and play SC2 instead so you can become a pro-gamer and make that cash.
Where does Starcraft come into this and what are you trying to say?
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On October 09 2012 10:35 GhostTK wrote:
I'm against gays. I don't believe you are born with a sexual orientation. it is a learned behavior. Im not a homophobe by any means. I have a gay friend and several gay girl friends. I just don't think it is right. i think there is a reason there is man and woman. you don't see gays in animals. maybe occasional but if animals were gay they would all go extinct. theres a reason gays cant' reproduce. it wasn't intended. Therefore it is wrong.
oops
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I really think it is unfortunate that the Boy Scouts insist on holding this position because all it does it show the organization in a bad light. What I am interested in knowing is whether their dependance on local religious institutions is somehow pressuring them to keep this rather prejudiced policy alive or whether it is just the work of a few bigoted officials. Either way these policies need to be reversed, officially allowing people of any sexual orientation and atheists to be boy scouts.
I am an Eagle Scout and in my local troop your religious beliefs or sexual orientation was a complete non-issue. Whenever such policies were talked about many adult leaders would bring up their devotion towards Pastafarianism and dismiss this "official Boy Scout policy". Meeting with other troops, I get the sense that my troop's thoughts on this are really what the majority of leaders believe (at least in my area.) So really, I get the sense that the National Organization is really at a disconnect with local troops and is supporting a minority of heavily prejudiced individuals that should not be near any Boy Scout leadership position.
So, am I saying, "its okay that these policies exist, because most local troops don't follow official policy anyway." No! I am not. The Boy Scouts deserve the flack that they get for this. I just think its an absolute shame that an organization that is not really relevant at the local level and a few bigoted leaders have the potential to ruin what I believe is a very rewarding experience for many of today's youth. I know many other people already have put their thoughts into this topic and have mentioned similar things but these are my 2 cents.
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