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On September 14 2011 22:22 Cel.erity wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2011 22:14 Integra wrote:On September 14 2011 21:44 HereticSaint wrote:On September 14 2011 21:40 CursedRich wrote:
Yet another loser who isn't happy with his own life decides to belittle others, what a wanker, im glad that he was sent down, aspergers has nothing to do with his behavior btw.
Oh dear, I wasn't aware we had an expert on Aspergers, would you care to take a minute to explain how it isn't relevant to this case at all? Also, you called the guy a wanker, you should go to jail! Aspergers is as of this year being taken off the autistic spectrum scale( http://summit-education.com/ce-news/aspergers-to-be-removed-from-dsm/)) since the only real problem for this group of people is that they have problem with body language and speech. Since these are the only real problems, and they can 99% of the cases be trained to more fit the norm, for the group of people that suffers from Aspergers they saw no reason to keep it as an autistic disorder. Some people who are perfectly "normal" do bad shit all the time. People with aspergers are no different. Some are just assholes, regardless of their mental state. Just because Asperger is not considered a syndrome of Autism does not make it any less valid. It does not fit with autism by proper definition, and I've agreed with this for years, but it is still a very real problem, and eventually it will probably get its own entry into the DSM. It is biological in nature and therefore is not something the individual can control.
Any less valid in conjunction to what exactly? Name ONE THING that isn't biological in nature when it comes to behavior and psychology. and Please explain how something that is biological equals impossibility to change or to control.
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imo the mother shouldn't have made that facebook page in the first place.. trolls are everywhere on the internet, so there wasn't anything else to expect than rude ppl making fun of what happened to her daughter.
the video is hilarious tho, probably the music..
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On September 14 2011 22:27 Deleuze wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2011 22:02 hypnoxide wrote:On September 14 2011 21:51 Deleuze wrote:
This is utterly shocking, this is one sonuva bitch.
I wouldn't call him a troll though, I mean this in all seriousness, I think that's an insult to trolls.
Cyber bullying and harassment online is something totally different to being a troll.
Calling him a troll undermines exactly what it is he has done, a troll is some moron on a forum, not criminal bully/stalker harassing someone.
I think it's just the British media capitalising on a term that has just recently surfaced in to main stream dialogue.
RIP to the kids he mocked and wishes to the families and friends he harassed, there's no place for his behaviour in society and it is right that he has been excluded from participating in social media because he has proven how utterly unready he is to use it responsibly.
Although he does look like something I'd find under a bridge.
No, that'd be ignorant of you. This is originally what trolling was before all the kids came along and it turned into stupid shit like "This is my first game. LOLOL TROLLLED LOL TROLLED SO HARD LOL." or making up stupid ass stories and adding Bel Air or some retarded bullshit like Rickrolling. That's not trolling, it's stupid. Does anyone even get mad at that shit? Trolling used to get on the news. Now it's gay. I was under the impression that the term troll originated from usenet (?) where the l33t members of the community would 'troll for noobs' by raising topics that have been discussed repetively to catch out who was new to the forum? Anyone like to correct me? Two questions to you hypnoxide: 1) When was trolling on the news before? Source please, I'd genuinely like to know. 2) What/who is gay?
youtube.com/128IR21ZQa0 is the first that comes to mind and I know I've seen several other DIFFERENT news stories on TV or articles in written media both in America and my own country. I don't think you're ignorant enough to truly believe this shit doesn't make the news when some retard and her equally retarded off-spring cry to anyone that'll listen about evil people on the internet.
2) If I say you, is that verbal harassment and can I face a reprimand for it? Stop trying to be a smart ass.
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On September 14 2011 22:24 ElPeque.fogata wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2011 22:03 Chargelot wrote:On September 14 2011 21:53 ElPeque.fogata wrote:On September 14 2011 21:36 arbitrageur wrote:On September 14 2011 21:33 ElPeque.fogata wrote:
he is an asshole.
but what the fuck. just close his account and be done with it.
jail? wtf Your solution is not well thought out. The guy can make another account, or go to an internet cafe and do it there. So be it, close the new account. as it happens with hackers on battle.net. And go to privacy settings and dissalow him from contacting you or whatever. Ignore him, then it is not fun anymore and he moves on. There are so many trolls because trolled people are usually pretty retarded dealing with it. Jail for insulting? You take freedom away from being verbaly offensive? Oh yeah, we are much more human than him. Verbal offense is a very fuzzy area. Will you include making fun of religion? God damnit we live in a fascist world. There is the left, the right, but in the end we are all fascists. In all fairness, he didn't challenge the laws, or the right of the state to prosecute him. He pleaded guilty. If he didn't, it would have been just worse for him. Yet, so what? He probably knows unless he is just too crazy he is "guilty" of being an absolute asshole. The question is wether it makes any sense sending somebody to jail just for being an asshole and making someone else feel bad. If i cheat on my girlfriend and then leave her for her best friend and tell her i couldn't stand being with a girl with such a fat ass, and so then she commits suicide because of it, should i be sent to jail? There is no doubt i would be an absolute asshole and caused a huge ammount of pain, but should i be sent to jail?
^A thousand times this.
On September 14 2011 22:10 Thorakh wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2011 22:07 hypnoxide wrote:On September 14 2011 22:05 Thorakh wrote:
He was harassing the family, this has absolutely nothing to do with free speech. Absolute free speech is absurd anyway. I agree man. How dare people be allowed to voice their thoughts and opinions no matter how many people agree or disagree with them? Lets take it to the next logical step and ban talking all together, it'd prevent anyone from getting offended and we wouldn't have to argue over what is protected by pesky free speech. What part about it being harassment do you not get? So according to you I can come to your house, stand just outside the front yard and yell "YOUR MOM IS A SLUT AND YOUR DEAD BROTHER IS RETARDED" all day long? Free speech bro.
If you set foot on my property, then no, because that would be trespassing. If you were doing it incredibly loud, then also no, because that would be disturbing the peace. If, however, you wanted to say at a reasonable decibel what you just said over and over all day and all night then go right ahead man. You are just going to lose your voice and look like an asshat while I laugh at you.
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On September 14 2011 22:26 hypnoxide wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2011 22:24 Toadesstern wrote:take into consideration that this did not happen in the us guys... We all know you guys love freedom and most of you guys are more liberal than everyone else. However Insulting IS a crime in some places. I don't know what it's like in the us but reading this makes me think it isn't so I'm going to quote german law for example (cause I'm from ger). I know it did not happen in germany but I'm guessing we're not the only ones who got something like this in europe. First one is the german one, the second one is my rough translation: + Show Spoiler +§ 185 Beleidigung
Die Beleidigung wird mit Freiheitsstrafe bis zu einem Jahr oder mit Geldstrafe und, wenn die Beleidigung mittels einer Tätlichkeit begangen wird, mit Freiheitsstrafe bis zu zwei Jahren oder mit Geldstrafe bestraft. § 185 Insultin
The act of Insulting is punished with (by?) prison sentence by up to one year or a fine. If this is happening as/with and act of violence it is punished with prison sentence by up to two years or a fine
So I don't see a problem here. It's not exactly common that those things get sued, dealt with or whatever you want to call it but I think it's perfectly fine. Basicly: If you're insulting for the purpose of insulting it's not ok. However, you obviously won't get sued if you call someone a bitch and even if it would happen, probably nothing would happen or you'd have to pay a fine. Never actually heard of someone going to jail for that kind of stuff. That's ridiculous. How do you define being insulted? Why does the law not apply if you are called a bitch? What if I'm insulted by that law and it's infringement on my right to free speech? I hope the German translation is a lot more specific or it's a rather empty law that's open to exploitation.
The law probably would apply if you are called a bitch, but noneone sues you for that kind of thing although you probably could do that.
I don't know how it's defined and I just googled for "insultin + law" (in german) to get the right quote.
Maybe theres another paragraph that's explaining that, like 185.1 or 185.a or whatever or it's just up to the judged I really don't know.
The german part I quoted isn't explaining more than the english one I just did :p
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On September 14 2011 22:24 ElPeque.fogata wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2011 22:03 Chargelot wrote:On September 14 2011 21:53 ElPeque.fogata wrote:On September 14 2011 21:36 arbitrageur wrote:On September 14 2011 21:33 ElPeque.fogata wrote:
he is an asshole.
but what the fuck. just close his account and be done with it.
jail? wtf Your solution is not well thought out. The guy can make another account, or go to an internet cafe and do it there. So be it, close the new account. as it happens with hackers on battle.net. And go to privacy settings and dissalow him from contacting you or whatever. Ignore him, then it is not fun anymore and he moves on. There are so many trolls because trolled people are usually pretty retarded dealing with it. Jail for insulting? You take freedom away from being verbaly offensive? Oh yeah, we are much more human than him. Verbal offense is a very fuzzy area. Will you include making fun of religion? God damnit we live in a fascist world. There is the left, the right, but in the end we are all fascists. In all fairness, he didn't challenge the laws, or the right of the state to prosecute him. He pleaded guilty. If he didn't, it would have been just worse for him. Yet, so what? He probably knows unless he is just too crazy he is "guilty" of being an absolute asshole. The question is wether it makes any sense sending somebody to jail just for being an asshole and making someone else feel bad. If i cheat on my girlfriend and then leave her for her best friend and tell her i couldn't stand being with a girl with such a fat ass, and so then she commits suicide because of it, should i be sent to jail? There is no doubt i would be an absolute asshole and caused a huge ammount of pain, but should i be sent to jail?
Are you telling me you can't go to jail for driving someone to suicide? If a person harrass/manipulate someone to suicide and it's severe enough you bet you'd go to jail. And I'd hardly compare this case with calling someone else a fat ass. In contrary to what people seem to believe, people are partly judged on the concequences of their actions not only the intent.
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United States7483 Posts
Harassment on that level probably should be punishable in the U.S. if you can prove it, that's pretty disgusting. Glad to see he got what he deserved, what a fucking prick.
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On September 14 2011 22:24 ElPeque.fogata wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2011 22:03 Chargelot wrote:On September 14 2011 21:53 ElPeque.fogata wrote:On September 14 2011 21:36 arbitrageur wrote:On September 14 2011 21:33 ElPeque.fogata wrote:
he is an asshole.
but what the fuck. just close his account and be done with it.
jail? wtf Your solution is not well thought out. The guy can make another account, or go to an internet cafe and do it there. So be it, close the new account. as it happens with hackers on battle.net. And go to privacy settings and dissalow him from contacting you or whatever. Ignore him, then it is not fun anymore and he moves on. There are so many trolls because trolled people are usually pretty retarded dealing with it. Jail for insulting? You take freedom away from being verbaly offensive? Oh yeah, we are much more human than him. Verbal offense is a very fuzzy area. Will you include making fun of religion? God damnit we live in a fascist world. There is the left, the right, but in the end we are all fascists. In all fairness, he didn't challenge the laws, or the right of the state to prosecute him. He pleaded guilty. If he didn't, it would have been just worse for him. Yet, so what? He probably knows unless he is just too crazy he is "guilty" of being an absolute asshole. The question is wether it makes any sense sending somebody to jail just for being an asshole and making someone else feel bad. If i cheat on my girlfriend and then leave her for her best friend and tell her i couldn't stand being with a girl with such a fat ass, and so then she commits suicide because of it, should i be sent to jail? There is no doubt i would be an absolute asshole and caused a huge ammount of pain, but should i be sent to jail?
people are making the dumbest comparisons ive ever seen. how is downloading music and breaking up with your girlfriend comparable to making fun of a dead girl to her mother? seriously?
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On September 14 2011 22:32 Toadesstern wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2011 22:26 hypnoxide wrote:On September 14 2011 22:24 Toadesstern wrote:take into consideration that this did not happen in the us guys... We all know you guys love freedom and most of you guys are more liberal than everyone else. However Insulting IS a crime in some places. I don't know what it's like in the us but reading this makes me think it isn't so I'm going to quote german law for example (cause I'm from ger). I know it did not happen in germany but I'm guessing we're not the only ones who got something like this in europe. First one is the german one, the second one is my rough translation: + Show Spoiler +§ 185 Beleidigung
Die Beleidigung wird mit Freiheitsstrafe bis zu einem Jahr oder mit Geldstrafe und, wenn die Beleidigung mittels einer Tätlichkeit begangen wird, mit Freiheitsstrafe bis zu zwei Jahren oder mit Geldstrafe bestraft. § 185 Insultin
The act of Insulting is punished with (by?) prison sentence by up to one year or a fine. If this is happening as/with and act of violence it is punished with prison sentence by up to two years or a fine
So I don't see a problem here. It's not exactly common that those things get sued, dealt with or whatever you want to call it but I think it's perfectly fine. Basicly: If you're insulting for the purpose of insulting it's not ok. However, you obviously won't get sued if you call someone a bitch and even if it would happen, probably nothing would happen or you'd have to pay a fine. Never actually heard of someone going to jail for that kind of stuff. That's ridiculous. How do you define being insulted? Why does the law not apply if you are called a bitch? What if I'm insulted by that law and it's infringement on my right to free speech? I hope the German translation is a lot more specific or it's a rather empty law that's open to exploitation. The law probably would apply if you are called a bitch, but noneone sues you for that kind of thing although you probably could do that. I don't know how it's defined and I just googled for "insultin + law" (in german) to get the right quote. Maybe theres another paragraph that's explaining that, like 185.1 or 185.a or whatever or it's just up to the judged I really don't know. The german part I quoted isn't explaining more than the english one I just did :p
And I'm not trying to be an asshole or start a fight but as a German, how do you feel about that law and how do you feel about possibly being prosecuted for saying something that insults someone (with such a broad definition), leading to you facing jail time?
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wtf? this is just wrong
RIP to the girl
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On September 14 2011 22:14 Integra wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2011 21:44 HereticSaint wrote:On September 14 2011 21:40 CursedRich wrote:
Yet another loser who isn't happy with his own life decides to belittle others, what a wanker, im glad that he was sent down, aspergers has nothing to do with his behavior btw.
Oh dear, I wasn't aware we had an expert on Aspergers, would you care to take a minute to explain how it isn't relevant to this case at all? Also, you called the guy a wanker, you should go to jail! Aspergers is as of this year being taken off the autistic spectrum scale( http://summit-education.com/ce-news/aspergers-to-be-removed-from-dsm/)) since the only real problem for this group of people is that they have problem with body language and speech. Since these are the only real problems, and they can 99% of the cases be trained to more fit the norm, for the group of people that suffers from Aspergers they saw no reason to keep it as an autistic disorder. Some people who are perfectly "normal" do bad shit all the time. People with aspergers are no different. Some are just assholes, regardless of their mental state.
You might very well be right with most of what you say, but you seem to misunderstand the article you linked to.
It's not "taken off the autistic spectrum scale", the term "aspergers disorder" is just planned to be removed from the DSM, so it wont have its own term anymore and instead will for example just be called a mild case of autism.
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I guess it's England so I'm not as concerned, but I do find it odd that the government has the power to ban you from social networking sites. The fact they suddenly have the right to define what you do in your spare time and where you can go on the internet (in more specifics, not broad internet censorship, that's another topic) is somewhat unsettling.
The guy's a douche, but he deserved to have his ass kicked, not legal trouble. Opens too many doors for me to be comfortable with.
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On September 14 2011 22:26 hypnoxide wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2011 22:24 Toadesstern wrote:take into consideration that this did not happen in the us guys... We all know you guys love freedom and most of you guys are more liberal than everyone else. However Insulting IS a crime in some places. I don't know what it's like in the us but reading this makes me think it isn't so I'm going to quote german law for example (cause I'm from ger). I know it did not happen in germany but I'm guessing we're not the only ones who got something like this in europe. First one is the german one, the second one is my rough translation: + Show Spoiler +§ 185 Beleidigung
Die Beleidigung wird mit Freiheitsstrafe bis zu einem Jahr oder mit Geldstrafe und, wenn die Beleidigung mittels einer Tätlichkeit begangen wird, mit Freiheitsstrafe bis zu zwei Jahren oder mit Geldstrafe bestraft. § 185 Insultin
The act of Insulting is punished with (by?) prison sentence by up to one year or a fine. If this is happening as/with and act of violence it is punished with prison sentence by up to two years or a fine
So I don't see a problem here. It's not exactly common that those things get sued, dealt with or whatever you want to call it but I think it's perfectly fine. Basicly: If you're insulting for the purpose of insulting it's not ok. However, you obviously won't get sued if you call someone a bitch and even if it would happen, probably nothing would happen or you'd have to pay a fine. Never actually heard of someone going to jail for that kind of stuff. That's ridiculous. How do you define being insulted? Why does the law not apply if you are called a bitch? What if I'm insulted by that law and it's infringement on my right to free speech? I hope the German translation is a lot more specific or it's a rather empty law that's open to exploitation.
So you suggest we shouldn't have laws against battery, because it might be hard to say where the line goes between nudging someone and actually beating someone?
Laws are hard to define so that they're 100% clear and set in stone, and many of them are up to interpretation to a certain degree.
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but does anyone know the reason for her to commit suicide?
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My god some people here do not realise what words can do to a person.
Inb4 "lol grow some balls"
One day you'll grow up and understand that you can't just say whatever the fuck you want.
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On September 14 2011 22:24 Cel.erity wrote:Show nested quote +On September 14 2011 22:14 radscorpion9 wrote:On September 14 2011 22:11 RPR_Tempest wrote:On September 14 2011 22:10 Thorakh wrote:On September 14 2011 22:07 hypnoxide wrote:On September 14 2011 22:05 Thorakh wrote:
He was harassing the family, this has absolutely nothing to do with free speech. Absolute free speech is absurd anyway. I agree man. How dare people be allowed to voice their thoughts and opinions no matter how many people agree or disagree with them? Lets take it to the next logical step and ban talking all together, it'd prevent anyone from getting offended and we wouldn't have to argue over what is protected by pesky free speech. What part about it being harassment do you not get? So according to you I can come to your house, stand just outside the front yard and yell "YOUR MOM IS A SLUT AND YOUR DEAD BROTHER IS RETARDED" all day long? Free speech bro. *thumbs up* You sure can! haha...it depends on the situation and the type of speech. Do none of you guys ever consider that there are some types of hate speech that causes serious mental/emotional damage, that could lead to psychological disorders? You mean like...the kind of hate speech that caused the girl to kill herself in the first place? I wonder what happened to the guy who spewed that hate speech. Oh wait, nothing. Because the government wasn't willing to spend the money to track down the individuals responsible, so they just punished the most convenient guy available to them.
Your logic process is sort of weak here. You seem to be suggesting that the government should totally ignore potential illegal actions of one (the troll) in favor of pursuing legally unrelated, alleged action of someone else. Just because the government "isn't willing" to "spend money" to "track down the guy" responsible for bringing about the teen's death does not suggest that the government should simply ignore the blatantly wrong actions of an unrelated troll.
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On September 14 2011 22:28 Fir3fly wrote:oh god oh god. dont even get me started. all he needed was a banned from the facebook page.then it would've stoped and that would be it. and at any rate, what sort of mother makes a shitty facebook page in memoriam? thats more fucked up than what he did imo. this is honestly nothing but "hurr durr cyber bullies" if you guys think this is bad, you should've read some of the old archives of ED. (before it turned shithouse) some kid killed himself cause he lost his ipod = a bunch of people "hacked" into his myspace and made him the golden ipod award infront of all his friends and family. (its also where the phrase "an hero" came from) this is fucking pathetic and more proof of how the older people do not know about the younger technologies. we're literally in a fucked up time right now. and im going to end before i start up on freedom of speech. + Show Spoiler +hurr durr cant say how i feel cause i might hurt some retard's feelings :c :c :c :c
nothing more to add.. just lol at all the band wagoners "zomg he should get lifetime for it, poor family". LOL.
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I am not sure which is more disturbing, the fact that he got jail time for this? or the fact that people (presumably rational thinking individuals) actually support that he got jail time for this. Do you people not hear what you are saying? You are advocating support for essentially police state type activities. "If you don't think and act as we tell you too, you got to jail". That is honestly more frightening then anything this guy did.
Is he a massive asshole douchebag? You bet he is. However being a massive asshole douchebag is not and should NEVER be jail worthy. All that requires is someone finding him and proceeding to give him a proper ass kicking. Honestly any of you supporting jail time for this should be ashamed of yourselves as individuals.
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On September 14 2011 22:38 deth2munkies wrote:
I guess it's England so I'm not as concerned, but I do find it odd that the government has the power to ban you from social networking sites. The fact they suddenly have the right to define what you do in your spare time and where you can go on the internet (in more specifics, not broad internet censorship, that's another topic) is somewhat unsettling.
The guy's a douche, but he deserved to have his ass kicked, not legal trouble. Opens too many doors for me to be comfortable with.
it depends on each government policies and their definition of what the internet is, in some country, like sweden they think that it is everyone rights to be able to use internet, that's why they have free internet.
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On September 14 2011 22:28 Fir3fly wrote:oh god oh god. dont even get me started. all he needed was a banned from the facebook page.then it would've stoped and that would be it. and at any rate, what sort of mother makes a shitty facebook page in memoriam? thats more fucked up than what he did imo. this is honestly nothing but "hurr durr cyber bullies" if you guys think this is bad, you should've read some of the old archives of ED. (before it turned shithouse) some kid killed himself cause he lost his ipod = a bunch of people "hacked" into his myspace and made him the golden ipod award infront of all his friends and family. (its also where the phrase "an hero" came from) this is fucking pathetic and more proof of how the older people do not know about the younger technologies. we're literally in a fucked up time right now. and im going to end before i start up on freedom of speech. + Show Spoiler +hurr durr cant say how i feel cause i might hurt some retard's feelings :c :c :c :c
what's your problem really? what he did was not merely a "troll", it was on another level of disrespect toward a dead person. Would you ever steps on the corpse of your dead grandfather? If you say yes, i have nothing more to say.
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EPT
