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Off topic discussion and argumentative back and forth will not be tolerated. |
On March 18 2011 19:51 Pika Chu wrote:
Yes we can talk about Ceausescu if you want to but i don't see similarities. No one came with millitary to help us, most of the romanian people were tired of Ceausescu and that's how he went down.
Yeah so we need to wait for the Bahrain situation to come as Libya's. The bahrain authorities are using force (guns/bullets and etc) to take down the rebels. They aren't doing air hits and everything simply because the rebels aren't as armed as they are in Libya.
I'm from Bahrain, and I can confirm that Both the saudi and the Bahraini forces are using everything they have including various semi-auto and auto machine guns, buckshots, rubber bullets, tear gas. In addition there were attacks by helicopters firing LIVE ROUNDS at protesters. They were even using cobra helicopters. We dont have a single fire arm to fend them of and we are still stressing on the peacefulness of our movement. Yet they are still showing absolutely no mercy. Situation is dire.
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On March 18 2011 19:51 Pika Chu wrote:
Yes we can talk about Ceausescu if you want to but i don't see similarities. No one came with millitary to help us, most of the romanian people were tired of Ceausescu and that's how he went down.
Yeah so we need to wait for the Bahrain situation to come as Libya's. The bahrain authorities are using force (guns/bullets and etc) to take down the rebels. They aren't doing air hits and everything simply because the rebels aren't as armed as they are in Libya.
The protesters in Bahrain are not armed - the are not rebels. They are... Protesters. Who are being murdered. Intervention in Bahrain is just as justified as it is in Libya (And in comparison, it was not justified in... Egypt, as that uprising resolved itself more or less peacefully), but inconvenient for western powers.
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On March 18 2011 19:51 Pika Chu wrote:
Yes we can talk about Ceausescu if you want to but i don't see similarities. No one came with millitary to help us, most of the romanian people were tired of Ceausescu and that's how he went down.
Yeah so we need to wait for the Bahrain situation to come as Libya's. The bahrain authorities are using force (guns/bullets and etc) to take down the rebels. They aren't doing air hits and everything simply because the rebels aren't as armed as they are in Libya.
Did you read what I wrote? If we get involved in Bahrain it will mean a lot more than a no fly zone there is no way that the UN will agree on intervening on that. Like I said hipocracy is a reason to help the rest not to not help Lybia.
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On March 18 2011 19:55 RvB wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2011 19:51 Pika Chu wrote:
Yes we can talk about Ceausescu if you want to but i don't see similarities. No one came with millitary to help us, most of the romanian people were tired of Ceausescu and that's how he went down.
Yeah so we need to wait for the Bahrain situation to come as Libya's. The bahrain authorities are using force (guns/bullets and etc) to take down the rebels. They aren't doing air hits and everything simply because the rebels aren't as armed as they are in Libya. Did you read what I wrote? If we get involved in Bahrain it will mean a lot more than a no fly zone there is no way that the UN will agree on intervening on that. Like I said hipocracy is a reason to help the rest not to not help Lybia.
The most important thing the UN has to do now is force Saudi to take back its army and go home! 2 countries are teaming up against one's own protesters.
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Cheers mate, hadn't realised that there was a live stream
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United States42977 Posts
Sold the people of Bahrain to their dictators in exchange for legitimacy in Libya. Still, it's progress in the broadest sense.
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In the coming hours UK planes will move to bases to enforce no fly zone.
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United States42977 Posts
This is the least Britain could do after Blair's deal in the desert.
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On March 18 2011 19:36 Nizaris wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2011 19:28 Pika Chu wrote:On March 18 2011 19:20 vyyye wrote:On March 18 2011 19:16 Pika Chu wrote:On March 18 2011 19:05 Kukaracha wrote:On March 18 2011 18:56 Pika Chu wrote:
This is horrible news. The world is going into a mess again.
Please, next time you see terrorist attacks in europe don't fucking ask yourselves why. This is why. Everyone is going to yell, omg innocent people dieing, you think the war on libya won't kill innocents? If you do think so you're out of your minds.
Sad day for the world, just as sad as the day we turned Iraq into a mess. Extactly what I was talking about! It has NOTHING to do with Iraq! Nothing! Justs stop saying this please. And there has always been civilian casualties and friendly fire. Just check the estimated numbers of soldiers who died from friendly fire and you'll see that no, it doesn't make the big news, even though it's a tremendous amount. We had 2 options: Ghadaffi, or no Ghadaffi. First one would've crushed the opposition, and THEN you get the development of underground organizations like Al-Qaida. Ghadaffi had little support from the population. We could've sacrificed the population for the leader. But the situation would've been worse. To all of those whining and trying to be smart about this, please provide possible alternatives instead of blindly comparing a dinosaur to a cat. I am comparing to Iraq from a different point of view, try to comprehend it. It's not the reasons, it's opening a can of worms for a long while. No, we had the option of not interfering. So if it's Ghaddafi what? At least under Gaddafi the country was stable, and for crying out loud Al-quaida is already supporting the rebelion. I think Gadaffi has more support from population than you believe. If even 10% of the population supports him, they aren't going to give up. I'm not supporting Gadaffi's actions, i'm thinking from a very objective point of view how it's better for everyone (a geopolitical stand and for the population of libya). Libya isn't stable now, that's the point. Doesn't fucking matter what happened yesterday, the problem is here today. You (and I) have no idea what would happen if there was a major effort to remove Khadaffi and he was removed, that wil simply be speculation but you can't compare the Libya situation to just any other. Hell, compared one nations crisis to another is overall a stupid idea as there are so many factors at play no one has any clue about. I cannot, however, see how it's objectively better to let Khadaffi murder half his population and turn a blind eye. Oh and stop the bullshit about hypocrisies. Do you think we'd be better off doing nothing at all? No but it could get stable after they sort it out themselves. No we don't have any idea but we can assume it and with arguments. Yes i can compare Libya's situation to Bahrain, give me one reason i couldn't. And give me a reason why we should intervene in Libya but not in Bahrain? I don't think we'd be better off doing nothing, i think we'd be better off playing it smart and understanding the situation before judging. Not invading some other country doesn't mean we're doing nothing. Stop with this media induced nonsense of Gaddafi murdering half of his population, he's not murdering his population he's fighting an opposition, a rebellion. What do you think the rebbels are peaceful? No, they were hanging police forces when the protests begun. Are Bahrain protesters getting bombed by airplanes? are they getting shot at by Tanks? Bahrain has nothing of a civil war. And the protesters were peaceful until the Army started murdering them. I call bs on the hanging police. got any sources?
They are getting hit with everything the Bahraini leaders can muster, only the scale is different. The truth is no one wants to anger their Saudi allies.
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This is the first time in 19 years that I have seen Conservatives and Labour agree on something.
What was Blairs deal in the desert?
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On March 18 2011 20:27 Cain0 wrote:
This is the first time in 19 years that I have seen Conservatives and Labour agree on something.
What was Blairs deal in the desert?
Deal in the desert
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i think this "becoming rid of a dictator" revolution, is a huge thing in history and the way gaddafi and his sons dealt with it, is not correct at all. And i really think it's important that the UN shows support in such a hard time. also it's important to show the ppl that they r not alone and have influence to what happens there after the revolution
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I am deeply ashamed by my government (Germany). They see Gaddafhi winning so they do nothing to get access to cheap oil..
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meeting in paris tomorrow with arab union reps. highlighting the communication and cooperation within the international community for the common goal of overcoming a potential humanitarian disaster. minister discussing closely with obama, sarkozy
democracy, not security as the main drive behind this initiative
they'll take all necessary measures to protect the civil population, including military action
noting british interests are to ensure stability at europe's southern border, and desire of the uk to spearhead intervention in lybia
stroking each other's cocks for diplomatic successes and leadership; credit given to the french
regime change under controversy; intent is to allow the lybian people to choose for themselves, but that gaddafi has to be removed - however, that regime change per se isn't the main purpose of the resolution, but the protection of the population
concerns about logistic possibilities of the uk to intervene - the prime minister confirms the high level of preparation and competence of its military
concern raised about the possibility of making the situation worse - point made for taking a risk because it is 'wrong to stand aside' when the civilian population is getting slaughtered
reassurance that the un resolution limits the execution of the intervention, so as to not overstep its intended boundaries
discussion over germany abstaining - for them to explain, african union voting in favor - welcomed support in the region
large number of countries considering participation; high-level meetings/discussions to come
gaddafi and supporters to be under scrutiny for crimes against humanity
reconstruction and humanitarian aid to be ensured by 'considerable resources' of the un
the danger of a stalemate if the no-fly zone is established in a timely manner. implications of potential immigration, of national security etc. being looked into thouroughly, should gaddafi be stopped but not defeated
china and russia's abstention seen as a positive move for international relations, since they didn't veto what is a controversial, difficult to adopt resolution about the internal issues of a foreign country
edit: spelling; gtg now
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On March 18 2011 20:27 Nightfall.589 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2011 20:27 Cain0 wrote:
This is the first time in 19 years that I have seen Conservatives and Labour agree on something.
What was Blairs deal in the desert? Deal in the desert
Wow, really. Tony Blair is even more of a joke than I thought he was.
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I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the involvement, if any, of British Naval assets.
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EPT
