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On November 24 2010 12:09 Teras wrote:http://www.rense.com/general37/nkorr.htmThat's a pretty interesting article regarding a possible conflict of N Korea vs USA if it ever came to it. Long read but worth it
Quite confident this is not accurate. First of all, besides numerous spelling/grammatical errors, there are factual errors. Ive been reading the New York Times recently, and they have stated that North Korea is suspected to have less than 20 nuclear weapons.
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/22/us/22talk.html
Furthermore, this article never provides references or sources ("a study found," "a test showed"... etc).
Lastly, the tone of this article makes it sound like North Korea is able to counter everything the US can throw at them. I dont know the real scenario, of course, but I doubt any conflict would be as dangerous to the US as this article makes the North out to be.
Edit: good job, Nullshock (from below)
On November 24 2010 13:18 Nullshock wrote:From Wikipedia: "Jeff Rense is an American conspiracy theorist and radio talk-show host of the Jeff Rense Program, broadcast on US satellite radio via Republic Broadcasting Network (RBN) and Internet radio.[1] Rense's radio program and website, Rense.com,[2] cover subjects such as 9/11 conspiracy theories,[3] UFO reporting, paranormal phenomena, Holocaust denial,[4] Zionism, tracking of new diseases and possible resultant pandemics, environmental concerns (see chemtrails), animal rights, possible evidence of advanced ancient technology, geopolitical developments and emergent energy technologies, complementary and alternative medicine among other subjects. Rense's show has been noted as being among "conspiracy-oriented Internet radio shows that often feature antisemites and extremists" by the Anti-Defamation League, a non-profit organisation that opposes antisemitism." Not sure I'd put too much weight into his site.
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On November 24 2010 12:39 GoodWill wrote:
<snip the nested quotes for sanity>
According to wikipedia, Germany's total military losses is at 5.5 million, 4.3 million of those are lost in eastern front. How would the war turn out had either USSR or USA stayed out of conflict? We will never know. But Soviet contribution to the war clearly dwarfs all other nations.
there is nothing clear about that at all. It simply shows that Germany lost most of its troops on the Eastern front. It says nothing about military aid, money spent or loaned, nothing about munitions supplied, food, transportation or any of the other hundreds of factors that go into fighting a war. Not to mention the weather. I will say no more on this as your post is as ignorant as it is abrasive. I'm sure you a very respectable person. But picking one aspect and pointing to it and saying 'there, this proves my opinion is right' is preposterous.
*raises hand* check please.
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On November 24 2010 13:10 Knee_of_Justice wrote:Quite confident this is not accurate. First of all, besides numerous spelling/grammatical errors, there are factual errors. Ive been reading the New York Times recently, and they have stated that North Korea is suspected to have less than 20 nuclear weapons. http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/22/us/22talk.htmlFurthermore, this article never provides references or sources ("a study found," "a test showed"... etc). Lastly, the tone of this article makes it sound like North Korea is able to counter everything the US can throw at them. I dont know the real scenario, of course, but I doubt any conflict would be as dangerous to the US as this article makes the North out to be.
This article sounds like NK propaganda.
edit- According to this article Han Ho Suk (or He Seok) is a 'pro-Pyongyang theoretician'.
http://oldsite.nautilus.org/fora/security/0006B_Nam.html
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On November 24 2010 12:09 Teras wrote:http://www.rense.com/general37/nkorr.htmThat's a pretty interesting article regarding a possible conflict of N Korea vs USA if it ever came to it. Long read but worth it
From Wikipedia:
"Jeff Rense is an American conspiracy theorist and radio talk-show host of the Jeff Rense Program, broadcast on US satellite radio via Republic Broadcasting Network (RBN) and Internet radio.[1]
Rense's radio program and website, Rense.com,[2] cover subjects such as 9/11 conspiracy theories,[3] UFO reporting, paranormal phenomena, Holocaust denial,[4] Zionism, tracking of new diseases and possible resultant pandemics, environmental concerns (see chemtrails), animal rights, possible evidence of advanced ancient technology, geopolitical developments and emergent energy technologies, complementary and alternative medicine among other subjects.
Rense's show has been noted as being among "conspiracy-oriented Internet radio shows that often feature antisemites and extremists" by the Anti-Defamation League, a non-profit organisation that opposes antisemitism."
Not sure I'd put too much weight into his site.
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On November 24 2010 13:18 Nullshock wrote:From Wikipedia: "Jeff Rense is an American conspiracy theorist and radio talk-show host of the Jeff Rense Program, broadcast on US satellite radio via Republic Broadcasting Network (RBN) and Internet radio.[1] Rense's radio program and website, Rense.com,[2] cover subjects such as 9/11 conspiracy theories,[3] UFO reporting, paranormal phenomena, Holocaust denial,[4] Zionism, tracking of new diseases and possible resultant pandemics, environmental concerns (see chemtrails), animal rights, possible evidence of advanced ancient technology, geopolitical developments and emergent energy technologies, complementary and alternative medicine among other subjects. Rense's show has been noted as being among "conspiracy-oriented Internet radio shows that often feature antisemites and extremists" by the Anti-Defamation League, a non-profit organisation that opposes antisemitism." Not sure I'd put too much weight into his site. \
Hmm, well at least he believes we went to the moon!
... or maybe that just wasn't listed.
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I feel that too much attention is given to North Korea's capabilities, and there is insufficient discussion about her intentions. I am far from certain that her late actions can be construed as blackmail negotiation tactics, or that they are the consequences of a deliberate policy of escalation.
At this point, I do not think making ideological speeches with ambiguous warnings is a helpful approach. The tendency of both western media and politicians to commit statements on the basis of momentary emotions will not be properly understood by the North Koreans, and they will produce no opening for future negotiations.
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On November 24 2010 12:00 Asshat wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2010 11:56 Odyssey.561 wrote:
There are some very ignorant posts in this thread besides the point of how off topic some have gotten. The N/S korean conflict could carry some big repercussions depending on who gets involved with either side. I wonder what all the players there for GSL are thinking? I could only imagine there has to be some tension through out the entire country. Although I'm sure tensions are high right now, I doubt this incident will progress any further than it already has. Nothing major will happen and a week from now nobody will be talking about it anymore.
I'm in the Osan area of Korea. People here act like nothing even happened.
Only difference is our commander told us that we can't drink a single drop of alcohol at the moment. (Air Force) He didn't say why we can't drink alcohol, but I'm sure I know one of the main reasons...
Got dammit North Korea... ruining Thanksgiving.
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On November 24 2010 11:05 DannyJ wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2010 10:16 TwoPac wrote:On November 24 2010 10:01 johanngrunt wrote:On November 24 2010 09:42 Frits wrote:
This is ridiculous, western society is built on morals and rights. If what you say is true we'd still be keeping slaves. Also, America did not win WW2, Russia did. Russia never would've pushed the Germans back without American and British Aid. Also America won in the pacific theatre and merely allowed Russia to make it Berlin first. Russia "won" the European theater, and essentially WW2, there is absolutely no denying that. America came in and cleaned up the easy bits.
By "easy bits" you mean the Normandy Landings?
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2 dead soldiers, 17more wounded and 3 wounded civilians, atleast that what mexican news said.
Its really a tense situation.
USA and Mexico(lol) condem the atack from NK... Its going to be pretty interesting
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I don't like this. I'd prefer a peaceful end to North Korea.
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On November 24 2010 13:10 Knee_of_Justice wrote:Quite confident this is not accurate. First of all, besides numerous spelling/grammatical errors, there are factual errors. Ive been reading the New York Times recently, and they have stated that North Korea is suspected to have less than 20 nuclear weapons. http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/22/us/22talk.htmlFurthermore, this article never provides references or sources ("a study found," "a test showed"... etc). Lastly, the tone of this article makes it sound like North Korea is able to counter everything the US can throw at them. I dont know the real scenario, of course, but I doubt any conflict would be as dangerous to the US as this article makes the North out to be. Edit: good job, Nullshock (from below) Show nested quote +On November 24 2010 13:18 Nullshock wrote:On November 24 2010 12:09 Teras wrote:http://www.rense.com/general37/nkorr.htmThat's a pretty interesting article regarding a possible conflict of N Korea vs USA if it ever came to it. Long read but worth it From Wikipedia: "Jeff Rense is an American conspiracy theorist and radio talk-show host of the Jeff Rense Program, broadcast on US satellite radio via Republic Broadcasting Network (RBN) and Internet radio.[1] Rense's radio program and website, Rense.com,[2] cover subjects such as 9/11 conspiracy theories,[3] UFO reporting, paranormal phenomena, Holocaust denial,[4] Zionism, tracking of new diseases and possible resultant pandemics, environmental concerns (see chemtrails), animal rights, possible evidence of advanced ancient technology, geopolitical developments and emergent energy technologies, complementary and alternative medicine among other subjects. Rense's show has been noted as being among "conspiracy-oriented Internet radio shows that often feature antisemites and extremists" by the Anti-Defamation League, a non-profit organisation that opposes antisemitism." Not sure I'd put too much weight into his site. I agree the Rense article does not seem properly supported by reference and evidence and is therefore not to be taken as reliable alone.
But it is a sad, stupid day when you can discredit someone by linking a fucking wikipedia article. That's an insult to our intelligence and totally irrelevant to political discussion. Wiki is great for what it is, but it is not good at balanced analysis of political dissidents. I don't know who Mr Rense is or what he thinks, but I am not going to take Wiki's opinion on it either way. Jimmy Wales != Jesus.
As for the World War 2 nonsense, the WW2 derailment itself got derailed.
The original point was not to quantify the contributions of the allied powers, but to point out that had Russia not been entangled into the conflict by the German invasion, the resources that Germany could have brought to bear upon the Western front would have been between 6 and 10 times as great. The US would not have been so easily able to enter such entrenched and supported lines, and probably would have cancelled or deferred any military contribution for years, at the least. And Britain would have fallen, eventually.
And the world would look different today as a result.
I hope this WW2 stuff truly is a derailment of the thread and not an apt comparison for all our sakes.
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On November 24 2010 13:14 Patton1942 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2010 12:39 GoodWill wrote:
<snip the nested quotes for sanity>
According to wikipedia, Germany's total military losses is at 5.5 million, 4.3 million of those are lost in eastern front. How would the war turn out had either USSR or USA stayed out of conflict? We will never know. But Soviet contribution to the war clearly dwarfs all other nations.
there is nothing clear about that at all. It simply shows that Germany lost most of its troops on the Eastern front. It says nothing about military aid, money spent or loaned, nothing about munitions supplied, food, transportation or any of the other hundreds of factors that go into fighting a war. Not to mention the weather. I will say no more on this as your post is as ignorant as it is abrasive. I'm sure you a very respectable person. But picking one aspect and pointing to it and saying 'there, this proves my opinion is right' is preposterous. *raises hand* check please.
Hello, Patton 1942. Here's what I found about western aid to the soviet union during WWII on wikipedia. The US lend-lease program shipped $11.3 billion worth of supplies to the soviet union (one-third as much as she gave to the UK). For a reference, the cumulative GDP of the soviet union, over the entire war, is 2785 billion. I will save you sometime and let you know 11.3/2785 is 0.00405.
Hope this helps, Patton1942.
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Obama Vows to Defend South Korea, Calls for Joint Military Exercises
President Barack Obama on Tuesday pledged the United States would stand "shoulder to shoulder" with South Korea and stage joint military exercises in response to what the White House branded a provocative, outrageous attack by North Korea on its neighbor.
Obama called South Korean President Lee Myung-bak Tuesday night, saying the U.S. would work with the international community to strongly condemn the attack that killed the two South Koreans and injured many more, the White House said.
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/11/23/obama-s-korea-stage-military-exercises/#ixzz16AvHCkO0
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It must be pointed out that you seem to have no idea what you are talking about. Royal Saudi family? Really?
So far reporting by Al Jazeera on this topic has been good. And the English Al Jazeera doesn't have the "strong anti US bias" you claim it has anyway. This might be different for the Arabic channel but then I wouldn't be able to tell.
Well, Al-Jazeera is run by the royal family of Qatar, one of the members of the United Arab Emirates. It does have an open distrust of US foreign policy, but these days who doesn't? Generally they've been a fairly professional news source.
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On November 24 2010 14:41 Coagulation wrote:
hope this dont escalate.
+ Show Spoiler +Though blood has been shed, I think that the situation has undergone a bit of coagulation.
Edit: Given the serious nature of this event, my pun was out of place. I apologize.
User was warned for this post
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is there no more updates on this?
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Maybe this will finally lead to the dismantling of the NK government. I hope there's a way to end this without making SK suffer, but I don't see NK gradually becoming more moderate. The only way this conflict will be resolved is with military action(or "coercion"). Something has to be done about NK eventually.
But I have a feeling that being too aggressive won't bode well for SK at all. Their economy only just recovered from the 1997 crisis.
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Well, carrier has arrived, quite literally.
Joint training between Korean and US forces will start on the 28th with USS George Washington in the yellow sea.
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On November 24 2010 14:13 DaemonX wrote:Show nested quote +On November 24 2010 13:10 Knee_of_Justice wrote:On November 24 2010 12:09 Teras wrote:http://www.rense.com/general37/nkorr.htmThat's a pretty interesting article regarding a possible conflict of N Korea vs USA if it ever came to it. Long read but worth it Quite confident this is not accurate. First of all, besides numerous spelling/grammatical errors, there are factual errors. Ive been reading the New York Times recently, and they have stated that North Korea is suspected to have less than 20 nuclear weapons. http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/22/us/22talk.htmlFurthermore, this article never provides references or sources ("a study found," "a test showed"... etc). Lastly, the tone of this article makes it sound like North Korea is able to counter everything the US can throw at them. I dont know the real scenario, of course, but I doubt any conflict would be as dangerous to the US as this article makes the North out to be. Edit: good job, Nullshock (from below) On November 24 2010 13:18 Nullshock wrote:On November 24 2010 12:09 Teras wrote:http://www.rense.com/general37/nkorr.htmThat's a pretty interesting article regarding a possible conflict of N Korea vs USA if it ever came to it. Long read but worth it From Wikipedia: "Jeff Rense is an American conspiracy theorist and radio talk-show host of the Jeff Rense Program, broadcast on US satellite radio via Republic Broadcasting Network (RBN) and Internet radio.[1] Rense's radio program and website, Rense.com,[2] cover subjects such as 9/11 conspiracy theories,[3] UFO reporting, paranormal phenomena, Holocaust denial,[4] Zionism, tracking of new diseases and possible resultant pandemics, environmental concerns (see chemtrails), animal rights, possible evidence of advanced ancient technology, geopolitical developments and emergent energy technologies, complementary and alternative medicine among other subjects. Rense's show has been noted as being among "conspiracy-oriented Internet radio shows that often feature antisemites and extremists" by the Anti-Defamation League, a non-profit organisation that opposes antisemitism." Not sure I'd put too much weight into his site. I agree the Rense article does not seem properly supported by reference and evidence and is therefore not to be taken as reliable alone. But it is a sad, stupid day when you can discredit someone by linking a fucking wikipedia article. That's an insult to our intelligence and totally irrelevant to political discussion. Wiki is great for what it is, but it is not good at balanced analysis of political dissidents. I don't know who Mr Rense is or what he thinks, but I am not going to take Wiki's opinion on it either way. Jimmy Wales != Jesus. As for the World War 2 nonsense, the WW2 derailment itself got derailed. The original point was not to quantify the contributions of the allied powers, but to point out that had Russia not been entangled into the conflict by the German invasion, the resources that Germany could have brought to bear upon the Western front would have been between 6 and 10 times as great. The US would not have been so easily able to enter such entrenched and supported lines, and probably would have cancelled or deferred any military contribution for years, at the least. And Britain would have fallen, eventually. And the world would look different today as a result. I hope this WW2 stuff truly is a derailment of the thread and not an apt comparison for all our sakes.
Although I can't say I agree with the severity of your rage over this and especially over the poster of it, as in me (sad, stupid, insulter of intelligence), but this is most definitely not the place for a source validity argument, so I won't pursue it.
On topic, I do hope this is just some twisted flexing of muscles on NKs part. People here are likely right in NKs ability to "win" a potential war, but when Chemical, Biochemical, and nuclear weapons are involved, no matter the outcome, everyone loses.
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EPT
