• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 10:29
CEST 16:29
KST 23:29
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play1Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection7Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview8
Community News
[TLMC] Summer 2026 Ladder Map Rotation05.0.16 patch for SC2 goes live (8 worker start)83ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo39Weekly Cups (June 8-14): Clem and Solar double, PTR tested0RSL: S6 Finals played at BlizzCon 202611
StarCraft 2
General
Is the larve respawn broken? The Death of Cheese: From a Professional Cheeser 5.0.16 patch for SC2 goes live (8 worker start) Old Replays From 1.4.6 The future of the SC game model
Tourneys
Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule ! Douyu Cup 2026: $20,000 Legends Event (June 26-28) RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event INu's Battles#17 <BO.9> Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
New Map Maker - Looking for Advice - Love or Hate Work In Progress Melee Maps [D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 532 Nuclear Family Mutation # 531 Experimental Artillery Mutation # 530 One For All
Brood War
General
ASL 22 Proposed Map Pool Best thing happen to StarCraft since Remastered? ProGamer Paychecks Story Data needed BW General Discussion
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL21] Grand Finals The Casual Games of the Week Thread [BSL22] GosuLeague Casts - Tue & Thu 22:00 CEST
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Creating a full chart of Zerg builds Relatively freeroll strategies Why doesn't anyone use restoration?
Other Games
General Games
ZeroSpace at Steam NextFest - Last free demo Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Games Industry And ATVI Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine
Fan Clubs
The HerO Fan Club! The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Series you have seen recently... [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [TV/BOOK] *SPOILERS* Game of Thrones Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion McBoner: A hockey love story TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Cricket [SPORT]
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Listen To The Coaches!
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
I'm an arrogant trash talke…
FlaShFTW
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 10339 users

E3 2013 Discussion Thread - Page 115

Forum Index > General Games
Post a Reply
Prev 1 113 114 115 116 117 134 Next
ZenithM
Profile Joined February 2011
France15952 Posts
June 11 2013 03:43 GMT
#2281
On June 11 2013 12:38 {CC}StealthBlue wrote:
Ps4 preorders are live on Amazon.com

Wait it says on the amazon page that the 400$ product includes the camera thing.
I don't think this is true right?
Ideas
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
United States8173 Posts
June 11 2013 03:44 GMT
#2282
For me titanfall and watchdogs were the 2 more appealing games with demos today. luckily both will be on PC.

I feel like there really weren't many good games shown today that were for people that aren't interested in online co-op :\
Free Palestine
Infernal_dream
Profile Joined September 2011
United States2359 Posts
June 11 2013 03:44 GMT
#2283
On June 11 2013 12:43 Mania[K]al wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 11 2013 12:41 Infernal_dream wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:40 Mania[K]al wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:38 jmbthirteen wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:35 Mania[K]al wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:23 TheRabidDeer wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:22 Mania[K]al wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:19 Dantat wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:17 Mania[K]al wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:12 Iblis wrote:
[quote]
Fan of RPG, fantasy? Kingdom hearts 3, FF15
Fan of action, open world? Assassin's creed, Infamous, Watch dogs
Fan of fps? Killzone
Bored and some time to kill? Find some funny looking indie game and have fun.




KH is the only positive from all that. Most others are multiplatform. Killzone is just bad.

Going to have to see is PSN is still shitty and how many more people are on XBL comparatively. All these games coming out are mostly MP and persistent worlds, population will be a factor and XBL has always had more people.

Pretty happy with Sony overall, finally.


Infamous is awesome.



Doesnt look interesting at all.

Currently the only thing i feel i missed out on without ever getting a PS3 was God of War, Demon Souls and now The Last of Us

You don't seem to be a fan of console games in general, what do you normally play if none of those looked appealing to you?



I have 60 xbox360 games sitting next to me. Not counting the GC/Xbox/Ps2 games.

What im saying is i dont see how people think Sony smashed anything other than that stupid used games policy microsoft is enforcing. DRM has no effect on me, nor the used games thing but people like to complain about stuff for the sake of making their preference look better.

Xboxs exclusives looked much more fun and everything else is multiplatform.

The Last Of Us looks 10 times better than anything announced for the XB1



Last of Us looks amazing. Im real pumped about these "mmofps" games coming out like The Division and Bunjies game.

However, im not considering buying a PS3, so unless PS4 is backwards compatible which it isn't, I wont be able to play The Last of Us


Cloud storage makes it backwards compatible.


Isnt it in development and not going to be available till next year?


And? It's still going to exist. You're a microsoft fanboy so I'm not really going to put a lot into arguing with you. But you saying "i wont be able to play" is wrong. That's all I was disproving.
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
June 11 2013 03:45 GMT
#2284
I want to play the crew kinda
Carrilord has arrived.
BoZiffer
Profile Joined November 2011
United States1841 Posts
June 11 2013 03:45 GMT
#2285
On June 11 2013 12:43 Infernal_dream wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 11 2013 12:41 BoZiffer wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:38 Taku wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:36 BoZiffer wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:34 Taku wrote:
Jesus christ, this year's E3 will be famous just for how badly Microsoft got crushed today.


I'm just waiting for how Microsoft will respond between now and launch. They won't just sit still....gonna be interesting.

They'd basically have to backpedal on their entire keynote today. Sony has beaten or undercut Microsoft in basically everything today.


I don't see how outside of used games. Xbox price point includes the kinect sensor so the overall console only price is probably identical. Used games is a self-imposed problem. Outside of exclusive titles, there isn't a damn bit of difference here...


Except the massive hardware difference, the price for online playing, the ideologies that you're supporting. The indie scene. You're right, they're the same.


Hardware difference may be negligible to the player so we will have to wait till hands on time. Indie scene? I understand they have different idealogies but Xbox Live Arcade has fantastic quality so there is good to be had there. Mutliplayer online now costs nearly identical. So yeah, they are.
Stratos_speAr
Profile Joined May 2009
United States6959 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-06-11 03:50:31
June 11 2013 03:46 GMT
#2286
On June 11 2013 12:41 BoZiffer wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 11 2013 12:38 Taku wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:36 BoZiffer wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:34 Taku wrote:
Jesus christ, this year's E3 will be famous just for how badly Microsoft got crushed today.


I'm just waiting for how Microsoft will respond between now and launch. They won't just sit still....gonna be interesting.

They'd basically have to backpedal on their entire keynote today. Sony has beaten or undercut Microsoft in basically everything today.


I don't see how outside of used games. Xbox price point includes the kinect sensor so the overall console only price is probably identical. Used games is a self-imposed problem. Outside of exclusive titles, there isn't a damn bit of difference here...


http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-02-20-sony-announces-playstation-4

...PS4 will come with a new PlayStation 4 Eye camera in the box - similar to how Kinect 2.0 is expected to ship with the next Xbox. PS4 Eye will let users to log in via face recognition and allow the use of gamer's body movements or voices in games. It works using dual camera lenses to capture a better view of the gameplay space, and four microphones to accurately source who's speaking. A mono headset will also be included...


$100 difference
Used games ("self imposed problems"? this is a real issue for many)
No need for internet
Cheaper multiplayer service (this assumes that you have to pay for multiplayer, which is not yet clear)
Better online service (PS+ > XBox Live, hands down)
Exclusives that are equal in quality (and potentially better)
More reliable system (the XBox has always been notoriously frail and error-prone)
Better looking
A sound mind in a sound body, is a short, but full description of a happy state in this World: he that has these two, has little more to wish for; and he that wants either of them, will be little the better for anything else.
ZenithM
Profile Joined February 2011
France15952 Posts
June 11 2013 03:46 GMT
#2287
On June 11 2013 12:45 Slusher wrote:
I want to play the crew kinda

Yeah that shit didn't look bad
BLinD-RawR
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
ALLEYCAT BLUES51081 Posts
June 11 2013 03:46 GMT
#2288
On June 11 2013 12:44 Ideas wrote:
For me titanfall and watchdogs were the 2 more appealing games with demos today. luckily both will be on PC.

I feel like there really weren't many good games shown today that were for people that aren't interested in online co-op :\

I liked titanfall and I watched ubisoft's conferance only for watchdogs, in fact I knew that my main interest for E3 was watchdogs and indie games, only now do I want the PS4.
Brood War EICWoo Jung Ho, never forget.| Twitter: @BLinDRawR
Kipsate
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Netherlands45349 Posts
June 11 2013 03:46 GMT
#2289
So, anyone an idea what Nintendo is going to come with?
WriterXiao8~~
s3rp
Profile Joined May 2011
Germany3192 Posts
June 11 2013 03:47 GMT
#2290
On June 11 2013 12:43 Mania[K]al wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 11 2013 12:41 Infernal_dream wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:40 Mania[K]al wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:38 jmbthirteen wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:35 Mania[K]al wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:23 TheRabidDeer wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:22 Mania[K]al wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:19 Dantat wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:17 Mania[K]al wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:12 Iblis wrote:
[quote]
Fan of RPG, fantasy? Kingdom hearts 3, FF15
Fan of action, open world? Assassin's creed, Infamous, Watch dogs
Fan of fps? Killzone
Bored and some time to kill? Find some funny looking indie game and have fun.




KH is the only positive from all that. Most others are multiplatform. Killzone is just bad.

Going to have to see is PSN is still shitty and how many more people are on XBL comparatively. All these games coming out are mostly MP and persistent worlds, population will be a factor and XBL has always had more people.

Pretty happy with Sony overall, finally.


Infamous is awesome.



Doesnt look interesting at all.

Currently the only thing i feel i missed out on without ever getting a PS3 was God of War, Demon Souls and now The Last of Us

You don't seem to be a fan of console games in general, what do you normally play if none of those looked appealing to you?



I have 60 xbox360 games sitting next to me. Not counting the GC/Xbox/Ps2 games.

What im saying is i dont see how people think Sony smashed anything other than that stupid used games policy microsoft is enforcing. DRM has no effect on me, nor the used games thing but people like to complain about stuff for the sake of making their preference look better.

Xboxs exclusives looked much more fun and everything else is multiplatform.

The Last Of Us looks 10 times better than anything announced for the XB1



Last of Us looks amazing. Im real pumped about these "mmofps" games coming out like The Division and Bunjies game.

However, im not considering buying a PS3, so unless PS4 is backwards compatible which it isn't, I wont be able to play The Last of Us


Cloud storage makes it backwards compatible.


Isnt it in development and not going to be available till next year?


Yeah but hey at least it's something thats in the works thats confirmed to enable backwards compatibility.
TheRabidDeer
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
United States3806 Posts
June 11 2013 03:47 GMT
#2291
On June 11 2013 12:46 Kipsate wrote:
So, anyone an idea what Nintendo is going to come with?

Zelda, Mario, SSB:4... maybe some other stuff.
Al Bundy
Profile Joined April 2010
7257 Posts
June 11 2013 03:47 GMT
#2292
On June 11 2013 12:46 Kipsate wrote:
So, anyone an idea what Nintendo is going to come with?

Smash Bros and that's it
o choro é livre
BLinD-RawR
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
ALLEYCAT BLUES51081 Posts
June 11 2013 03:47 GMT
#2293
On June 11 2013 12:46 Kipsate wrote:
So, anyone an idea what Nintendo is going to come with?

Nintendo Wii-V, just to confuse us with its name.
Brood War EICWoo Jung Ho, never forget.| Twitter: @BLinDRawR
Slusher
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States19143 Posts
June 11 2013 03:48 GMT
#2294
On June 11 2013 12:46 Kipsate wrote:
So, anyone an idea what Nintendo is going to come with?


if not a price drop they aren't selling anything.

(I hear smash/Kart/3d Mario and Zelda will all be shown)
Carrilord has arrived.
Mania[K]al
Profile Joined May 2009
United States359 Posts
June 11 2013 03:48 GMT
#2295
On June 11 2013 12:44 Infernal_dream wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 11 2013 12:43 Mania[K]al wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:41 Infernal_dream wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:40 Mania[K]al wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:38 jmbthirteen wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:35 Mania[K]al wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:23 TheRabidDeer wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:22 Mania[K]al wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:19 Dantat wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:17 Mania[K]al wrote:
[quote]


KH is the only positive from all that. Most others are multiplatform. Killzone is just bad.

Going to have to see is PSN is still shitty and how many more people are on XBL comparatively. All these games coming out are mostly MP and persistent worlds, population will be a factor and XBL has always had more people.

Pretty happy with Sony overall, finally.


Infamous is awesome.



Doesnt look interesting at all.

Currently the only thing i feel i missed out on without ever getting a PS3 was God of War, Demon Souls and now The Last of Us

You don't seem to be a fan of console games in general, what do you normally play if none of those looked appealing to you?



I have 60 xbox360 games sitting next to me. Not counting the GC/Xbox/Ps2 games.

What im saying is i dont see how people think Sony smashed anything other than that stupid used games policy microsoft is enforcing. DRM has no effect on me, nor the used games thing but people like to complain about stuff for the sake of making their preference look better.

Xboxs exclusives looked much more fun and everything else is multiplatform.

The Last Of Us looks 10 times better than anything announced for the XB1



Last of Us looks amazing. Im real pumped about these "mmofps" games coming out like The Division and Bunjies game.

However, im not considering buying a PS3, so unless PS4 is backwards compatible which it isn't, I wont be able to play The Last of Us


Cloud storage makes it backwards compatible.


Isnt it in development and not going to be available till next year?


And? It's still going to exist. You're a microsoft fanboy so I'm not really going to put a lot into arguing with you. But you saying "i wont be able to play" is wrong. That's all I was disproving.


Im not sure why you think were arguing? Yes, i love MS. Ive used their OS/Programs and consoles for years.

Right now Sony is looking pretty strong and im considering getting a PS4 so im asking obvious sony fans what they like about their console, but apprently that offends you
BLinD-RawR
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
ALLEYCAT BLUES51081 Posts
June 11 2013 03:48 GMT
#2296
On June 11 2013 12:47 TheRabidDeer wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 11 2013 12:46 Kipsate wrote:
So, anyone an idea what Nintendo is going to come with?

Zelda, Mario, SSB:4... maybe some other stuff.


all with the money they took from LPers.
Brood War EICWoo Jung Ho, never forget.| Twitter: @BLinDRawR
Mania[K]al
Profile Joined May 2009
United States359 Posts
June 11 2013 03:49 GMT
#2297
On June 11 2013 12:47 s3rp wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 11 2013 12:43 Mania[K]al wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:41 Infernal_dream wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:40 Mania[K]al wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:38 jmbthirteen wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:35 Mania[K]al wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:23 TheRabidDeer wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:22 Mania[K]al wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:19 Dantat wrote:
On June 11 2013 12:17 Mania[K]al wrote:
[quote]


KH is the only positive from all that. Most others are multiplatform. Killzone is just bad.

Going to have to see is PSN is still shitty and how many more people are on XBL comparatively. All these games coming out are mostly MP and persistent worlds, population will be a factor and XBL has always had more people.

Pretty happy with Sony overall, finally.


Infamous is awesome.



Doesnt look interesting at all.

Currently the only thing i feel i missed out on without ever getting a PS3 was God of War, Demon Souls and now The Last of Us

You don't seem to be a fan of console games in general, what do you normally play if none of those looked appealing to you?



I have 60 xbox360 games sitting next to me. Not counting the GC/Xbox/Ps2 games.

What im saying is i dont see how people think Sony smashed anything other than that stupid used games policy microsoft is enforcing. DRM has no effect on me, nor the used games thing but people like to complain about stuff for the sake of making their preference look better.

Xboxs exclusives looked much more fun and everything else is multiplatform.

The Last Of Us looks 10 times better than anything announced for the XB1



Last of Us looks amazing. Im real pumped about these "mmofps" games coming out like The Division and Bunjies game.

However, im not considering buying a PS3, so unless PS4 is backwards compatible which it isn't, I wont be able to play The Last of Us


Cloud storage makes it backwards compatible.


Isnt it in development and not going to be available till next year?


Yeah but hey at least it's something thats in the works thats confirmed to enable backwards compatibility.



Hopefully it comes soon enough so that newer games dont come out and drown away The Last of Us. Thats all im worried about.
Taku
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Canada2036 Posts
June 11 2013 03:49 GMT
#2298
I hope they announce a 3ds revision. The biggest thing holding me back from a purchase right now is the wait for the inevitable Nintendo handheld revision that is 1000x better than the release version.
When SC2 came for BW, I cried. Now LoL/Dota2 comes for SC2, and I laugh. \o/
{CC}StealthBlue
Profile Blog Joined January 2003
United States41117 Posts
June 11 2013 03:50 GMT
#2299
So the PS4 comes with the eye gizmo so there goes the MS argument about Kinect adding to the price.
"Smokey, this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules."
ZenithM
Profile Joined February 2011
France15952 Posts
June 11 2013 03:50 GMT
#2300
Now if Sony could somehow make some good games come to the PS Vita
Prev 1 113 114 115 116 117 134 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
WardiTV Weekly
11:00
WardiTV Mondays #93
WardiTV1204
IntoTheiNu 1110
TKL 215
IndyStarCraft 140
CranKy Ducklings114
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
MaxPax 243
TKL 215
Rex 188
Ryung 143
IndyStarCraft 140
trigger 32
SHIN 28
RushiSC 18
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 7328
Jaedong 1186
Light 778
Mini 623
Soulkey 541
EffOrt 476
BeSt 378
Soma 331
Hyuk 313
Rush 251
[ Show more ]
Mong 240
Zeus 235
Snow 226
ggaemo 119
hero 108
Dewaltoss 85
Pusan 82
Hyun 80
[sc1f]eonzerg 61
Sea.KH 58
ToSsGirL 43
sorry 35
scan(afreeca) 31
Aegong 25
Movie 22
yabsab 22
Hm[arnc] 21
Bale 19
IntoTheRainbow 13
Sacsri 12
GoRush 12
ajuk12(nOOB) 8
Dota 2
Gorgc7761
singsing5284
Dendi1039
XcaliburYe195
420jenkins147
BananaSlamJamma23
Other Games
B2W.Neo978
hiko959
Lowko700
crisheroes303
Mew2King59
ArmadaUGS20
KnowMe18
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream516
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 16
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP4
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV252
• lizZardDota249
League of Legends
• Nemesis3398
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
19h 32m
RSL Revival
1d 2h
Bombastic Starleague
1d 5h
PiGosaur Cup
1d 9h
Kung Fu Cup
1d 20h
Replay Cast
2 days
CrankTV Team League
2 days
Bombastic Starleague
3 days
The PondCast
3 days
HomeStory Cup
3 days
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
4 days
HomeStory Cup
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
HomeStory Cup
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
Douyu Cup 2026
Murky Cup 2026

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
YSL S3
CSL Season 21: Qualifier 2
SCTL 2026 Spring
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026

Upcoming

CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
ASL Season 22:Wild Card Qualifier
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
BCC 2026
Light Tournament 2026
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale
Eternal Conflict S2 E1
Heroes Pulsing #3
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Disclosure: This page contains affiliate marketing links that support TLnet.

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.