• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 14:27
CET 19:27
KST 03:27
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros9[ASL20] Finals Preview: Arrival13TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting10[ASL20] Ro4 Preview: Descent11Team TLMC #5: Winners Announced!3
Community News
Weekly Cups (Oct 20-26): MaxPax, Clem, Creator win52025 RSL Offline Finals Dates + Ticket Sales!10BSL21 Open Qualifiers Week & CONFIRM PARTICIPATION2Crank Gathers Season 2: SC II Pro Teams10Merivale 8 Open - LAN - Stellar Fest5
StarCraft 2
General
RotterdaM "Serral is the GOAT, and it's not close" Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros Weekly Cups (Oct 20-26): MaxPax, Clem, Creator win Weekly Cups (Oct 13-19): Clem Goes for Four DreamHack Open 2013 revealed
Tourneys
Merivale 8 Open - LAN - Stellar Fest SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia Kirktown Chat Brawl #9 $50 8:30PM EST 2025 RSL Offline Finals Dates + Ticket Sales! Crank Gathers Season 2: SC II Pro Teams
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 497 Battle Haredened Mutation # 496 Endless Infection Mutation # 495 Rest In Peace Mutation # 494 Unstable Environment
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Ladder Map Matchup Stats Map pack for 3v3/4v4/FFA games BW General Discussion SnOw's ASL S20 Finals Review
Tourneys
[ASL20] Grand Finals BSL21 Open Qualifiers Week & CONFIRM PARTICIPATION Small VOD Thread 2.0 The Casual Games of the Week Thread
Strategy
How to stay on top of macro? PvZ map balance Current Meta Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread The Perfect Game Beyond All Reason Path of Exile Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion LiquidDota to reintegrate into TL.net
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640}
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread The Big Programming Thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Korean Music Discussion Series you have seen recently...
Sports
TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 2024 - 2026 Football Thread NBA General Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
Career Paths and Skills for …
TrAiDoS
KPDH "Golden" as Squid Game…
Peanutsc
Reality "theory" prov…
perfectspheres
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1780 users

Rings Disgraced - Page 3

Forum Index > Final Edits
152 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 Next All
capek
Profile Joined September 2008
United States585 Posts
November 06 2008 03:38 GMT
#41
man my image of WCG being a quality product was just utterly destroyed.
guess it was for the better...
Im-JaY
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Canada69 Posts
November 06 2008 03:40 GMT
#42
I didn't realize that the whole of WCG was this messed up. I thought that it was just a few isolated incidents here and there in the qualifiers, and in some cases a lack of funding. > A very enlightening read. However this doesn't surprise me because as always, it unfortunately comes down to dollar signs.

btw, That is a really cool pic in the OP.
BlackMagister
Profile Joined October 2008
United States5834 Posts
Last Edited: 2008-11-06 03:48:59
November 06 2008 03:43 GMT
#43
This is the first WCG I've been following so I'm not so sure about the poor tournament setups, but if it's as described it is pretty bad. The game lists for WCG are a joke though. Didn't realize Guitar Hero was actually being included in the tournaments, when I saw it in pictures I thought it was just for people to have fun. Also isn't one of the racing games a cell phone racing games?

Anyways if TL is so upset why not tell their best possible contact to change WCG, Tasteless? He's casting in WCG, lives in Korea, knows people in the proscene, etc. I'm sure if anyone connected to the foreign SC scene has a chance to change WCG it would be him.

On a side note while I'm sure there are more valid fighting games than DOA, but I did see on TV there were progamers that play DOA. The way they live is similar to the way Korean SC progamers live, in dorms , practicing with each other, etc.
Phantom
Profile Joined September 2004
Canada2151 Posts
November 06 2008 03:45 GMT
#44
WCG has become just another e-sports FESTIVAL, the competition is merely for show.
http://www.gosugamers.net/starcraft2/members/Phantom
jaesung
Profile Joined November 2006
124 Posts
November 06 2008 03:54 GMT
#45
OP has nicely informed many TL.net community that participant of WCG is nothing but a show maker.

No_eL
Profile Joined July 2007
Chile1438 Posts
November 06 2008 03:58 GMT
#46
in our country wcg its a disaster.. year after year we waiting for a national qualy and never happens...

its sad for all the gamers around the world dont have a real tournament and organization for test our habilities and knowledge.

i hope tha in a short time, the situation reverts, all want a real e-sport fest!!
Beat after beat i will become stronger.
hideo
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Canada1641 Posts
November 06 2008 04:08 GMT
#47
thanks thedeadhaji,
this was a great, informative read.
InfeSteD
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States4658 Posts
November 06 2008 04:15 GMT
#48
wcg... venezuela wcg is prolly the biggest disgrace loool
w/e
RamenStyle
Profile Joined September 2004
United States1929 Posts
November 06 2008 04:16 GMT
#49
I think the main problem is the autonomy given to all the national wcg organisers. It basically is:

WCG Central gives power to local WCG org --> Local WCG org. is run by morons who don't give a fuck about competitive gaming and WCG itself and are there to squeeze some easy bucks --> Morons who don't give a crap about the event itself try to attract sponsors, who can clearly notice this guys have no fucking idea what they are trying to sell them --> they kick moronic representatives out of their offices.

I wonder if WCG Central could get more involved in the local organisers, like send a supervisor or something. But right now their way of acting is more like: let's give them full responsability and see what money they can drag in by fall.

Oh, btw, you guys all realise that the only reason we still have BW in WCG it's because Samsung is the biggest sponsor of WCG(actually I think Samsung owns the majority of WCG)? And not including the national esport would be like not giving the progaming they are so proud of any recognition at all.

Had it not been for Samsung, BW would have been gone from the WCG game lineups a long time ago. Then again, hadn't it been for Samsung, we wouldn't even have WCG in the first place.
CynanMachae
Profile Blog Joined September 2006
Canada1459 Posts
November 06 2008 04:23 GMT
#50
So true...

I was so angry about WCG Canada.

Quite great article, pretty good read.
Jang Yoon Chul hwaiting!
BlueBird.
Profile Joined August 2008
United States3889 Posts
November 06 2008 04:25 GMT
#51
I enjoyed the article..

However, the comments on the game selection is a little off.. Your obviously going to be biased cause of your game preference, and I will be the first to say that SC BW is the best competitive game ever, but does it really mean other games shouldn't be played internationally?? That's like saying that no games should have a chance but yours.

Halo for example is a pretty established competitive FPS, and there is a clear skill gap between the pros and the am bracket, its not the best FPS ever, and Halo 3 is actually less competitive then Halo 1, but its still a good game. However WCG is a joke as far as halo community is concerned, not a single top 16 team attended from the US, I could have probably came in top three if my team had attended.. Canada had one top 16 team attend... but mostly due to the scheduling. Who schedules a WCG qualifier the same weekend as the playoffs for seeds for the national championships happen in Dallas??? Now the U.S.A., the only place Halo is played as far as the competitive gaming world goes, is not going to medal.. Fail on WCG's part.

Currently Playing: Android Netrunner, Gwent, Gloomhaven, Board Games
gondolin
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
France332 Posts
November 06 2008 04:28 GMT
#52

Thanks to gondolin for filling in the holes for the war3 part, and Beside_kr for pointing out my mistake! (it was 2006, not 2007)


No problem, if you want more information about it, this discussion resume well what happened:
http://www.wcreplays.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-52462.html

+ Show Spoiler +

Frozgard
11-26-2005, 06:52 PM
Some of you may have followed the discussions that arose from the fact that one of the players in WCG apparently had never played a game of Warcraft 3 in his life. This person was representing Luxembourg and was playing under the country's nickname. Here is a bit of information that I managed to glean from forums about gaming in Luxembourg.

First of all, a non-profit organisation called LESF (http://www.lesf.lu/) ( Luxembourg Electronic Sports Federation) contacted the WCG organisers to hold a national qualifier in Luxembourg. By default, only one spot was open for the country, with the possibility of having more spots at the national organiser's expense. Since LESF is pretty new and sponsorship for gaming is hard to come by, they planned to send only one player to Singapour. However, apparently they didn't know which game the spot was for. So they held off organising a qualifier until they would know which game it would be for. Also, they didn't talk about the spot nor the possibility that one gamer may be able to represent the country in the international finals. So nobody except the few organisers knew what was going on at the time.

Then, three days before the WCG Finals were about to start, they recieved confirmation that the spot was in fact for Warcraft III. Now, the organisers didn't publicise this either but in a hurry tried to contact Warcraft 3 players they knew. From what I saw, only a few were contacted and out of these nobody could attend because of the short timeframe and school / work commitments. So in the end they asked around if anybody could go and finally they found this Peter Freitag guy. He had indeed not played any Warcraft before and the only reason he was sent was to not void the ticket.

I'll try and get an official statement from LESF and translate this into English if necessary. The blame lies with them and their inactivity and failure to have any communication at all about the issues they were facing or at least contacting the wider LAN community in Luxembourg. It's a sad story of an inefficient organisation, but at least there doesn't seem to have been a willingness to commit fraud against the War3 community in Luxembourg.

Personnally I'm quite disappointed by the end result and by this failure. I hope the wider Warcraft community will realise that this person's skill doesn't represent the best skill of Warcraft 3 in Luxembourg in any way and that we, the Warcraft 3 players from Luxembourg are the ones who have been really hurt by this turn of events.

As final words, I would like to thank the people who have helped me track down the information I needed to find and all the people who have lent moral support. We all want a fair and square WCG, where players deserve to be there and show the best level their country has to offer. And I hope that this incident will stay isolated, but will still serve as a reminder to those who organise, follow the scene and play Warcraft III.

Frozgard


I don't know if Frozgard is still active, but he was a pretty good and cool orc from luxembourg (although not pro level), and he even got qualified for eswc i think (but he was worth it )
KOFgokuon
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States14899 Posts
November 06 2008 04:32 GMT
#53
good read thanks haji
cgrinker
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States3824 Posts
November 06 2008 04:33 GMT
#54
I don't feel so bad for missing '07 when it was in my hometown. I am kinda disgusted with video gaming now.
SilverSkyLark
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Philippines8437 Posts
November 06 2008 04:33 GMT
#55
That's why there was no ace combat in the wcg. They only included it when it was exclusive for xbox.

I think Virtua Fighter is included but not too sure about that.

I also agree on some countries not funding their teams. My country hasn't been competing in StarCraft ever since SteelHeart 2-0'ed his group and got 2-0'd by Hwasin, the government said that our players weren't worthy. It wasn't really SteelHeart's fault if he had to go against Hwasin after the group stages. Now they sponsor Guitar Hero (in which we won 2nd place in the South East Asian World Cyber Games).

Even our olympic team didn't get enough funding, I guess its really that corrupted in here.
"If i lost an arm, I would play w3." -IntoTheWow || "Member of Hyuk Hyuk Hyuk cafe. He's the next Jaedong, baby!"
Xeris
Profile Blog Joined July 2005
Iran17695 Posts
November 06 2008 04:39 GMT
#56
lol you forgot the fact that there is actually CELL PHONE RACING GAME at WCG O_O!
twitter.com/xerislight -- follow me~~
Felagund
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Philippines504 Posts
November 06 2008 04:40 GMT
#57
On November 06 2008 12:23 jaesung wrote:
too long to read. basically OP is telling us that WCG is disappointed.
OP is keep comparing WCG to an ACTUAL OLYMPIC.
WCG is not backed/sponsored by government or country like OLYMPIC does.
They dont have money, they do their best to keep things in order.

and about wcg omitting some countries.. i dont see how this is WCG fault when your country or sponsors in your country could have helped the players.

Seriously, you expecting WCG organize hundres and thousands of players themselves in every country? Well shit, what does your country do?
At least WCG is hosting for most of us.

So have you read it or not?
TL CJ Entusman #5 "now she is unarmed, u shall go gather ur army, siege ur tanks and her choke and send some vessels to spot her lurkers, at this time she may have defilers so, if u spot some, unsiege and bring fbs" -Ki_Do
talismania
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States2364 Posts
November 06 2008 04:55 GMT
#58
guitar hero is a legitimately competitive game, in the sense that some people are better than others and it can be pretty impressive to watch someone really good at it. I think it belongs perhaps at a different kind of place, maybe. Like World Bemani Games, if that existed, along with games like DDR, PIU, Pop'n Music, etc. Bemani is just a different genre of game, really. Not sure if it fits in well with all the others at WCG.
NightToad
Profile Joined July 2008
60 Posts
November 06 2008 05:05 GMT
#59
I remember a few years back there was actually online vote for which games should be included. I can't remember which exactly, but most were legitimate titles from each genre.
SK.Testie
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
Canada11084 Posts
November 06 2008 05:14 GMT
#60
Hmmmm... WCG Canada is a bit different. Our organizers are really great people trying their best and they care. So they can be lumped in with the Germans.
Social Justice is a fools errand. May all the adherents at its church be thwarted. Of all the religions I have come across, it is by far the most detestable.
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
SC4ALL
14:00
SC4All Day 1
LiquipediaDiscussion
SC4ALL
14:00
SC4ALL - Day 1
Artosis861
ComeBackTV 620
RotterdaM573
SteadfastSC230
IndyStarCraft 185
CranKy Ducklings164
LiquipediaDiscussion
Epic.LAN
12:00
Epic.LAN 46 Playoffs Stage
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Artosis 861
RotterdaM 573
SteadfastSC 230
IndyStarCraft 197
ProTech111
BRAT_OK 54
MindelVK 10
LaughNgamez 1
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 4375
Barracks 410
PianO 222
Dewaltoss 99
Rock 49
HiyA 17
Dota 2
monkeys_forever296
LuMiX1
Counter-Strike
fl0m2650
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor424
Other Games
Gorgc3011
Grubby2791
Beastyqt644
WinterStarcraft202
KnowMe156
Hui .150
QueenE92
Skadoodle87
nookyyy 51
Trikslyr51
Mew2King43
Organizations
Counter-Strike
PGL30521
Other Games
gamesdonequick1372
StarCraft 2
angryscii 0
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 19 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 53
• printf 41
• Adnapsc2 12
• Kozan
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• sooper7s
• intothetv
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• Azhi_Dahaki40
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 2130
• Ler78
League of Legends
• Nemesis3113
• Shiphtur486
Other Games
• imaqtpie1076
Upcoming Events
BSL 21
33m
BSL Team A[vengers]
19h 33m
Cross vs Sobenz
Sziky vs IcaruS
SC4ALL
20h 33m
SC4ALL
20h 33m
BSL 21
1d
Replay Cast
1d 14h
Wardi Open
1d 17h
Monday Night Weeklies
1d 22h
Replay Cast
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Korean Royale
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
3 days
The PondCast
4 days
Korean StarCraft League
6 days
CranKy Ducklings
6 days
IPSL
6 days
dxtr13 vs OldBoy
Napoleon vs Doodle
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
CranK Gathers Season 2: SC II Pro Teams
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

BSL 21 Points
BSL 21 Team A
C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
SOOP Univ League 2025
SC4ALL: Brood War
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025

Upcoming

YSL S2
BSL Season 21
SLON Tour Season 2
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXVIII
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
RSL Revival: Season 3
Stellar Fest
META Madness #9
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026: Closed Qualifier
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.