EPTOn August 16 2017 20:56 Rolltide wrote:
Solar best Zerg on earth right now!
Solar best Zerg on earth right now!
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/fan-clubs/443189-the-solar-fan-club
Zest Fan Club - Page 193
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pvsnp
7676 Posts
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/fan-clubs/443189-the-solar-fan-club | ||
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Mun_Su
France2063 Posts
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
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Rolltide
United States447 Posts
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Silvana
3713 Posts
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Plopus
Switzerland112 Posts
On August 17 2017 07:12 Silvana wrote: This is a cliche since a long time now but... "Hell... It's about time!" I will agree with you once he does well in a korean offline tournament. He is way better than a few weeks ago, but he needs to confirm this. | ||
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Rolltide
United States447 Posts
The last group will not be played until August 26th. The final will not be played until mid September. That's a period of 40 days or more. You cannot win a tournament like that by being hot for 2-3 weeks. Same with Master's Coliseum where the first group played on July 2nd and that was when Zest was eliminated. These groups are tough we just saw Alive and Gumiho get eliminated this week. These are not tournaments where you can get hot for a couple of best of fives. You need to be qualified in the first place and you need to beat good people at every turn. In last years GSL season 1 Zest dominated from the very first map. He was not just temporarily in form. | ||
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pvsnp
7676 Posts
Form doesn't always persist across big design changes, just look at ByuN pre-3.8 compared to ByuN post-3.8 | ||
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
On August 18 2017 08:42 pvsnp wrote: Form doesn't always persist across big design changes, just look at ByuN pre-3.8 compared to ByuN post-3.8 A better example is pre-3.8 Zest and post 3.8 Zest. He looked great at blizzcon and HSC, then by IEM Gyeonggi he was outright terrible. Although I personally believe that was due to leaving KT, and not the patch. ByuN specifically seemed to have been hurt by the tankivac/baneling/reaper changes iirc. Zest right now just relies on amazing mechanics and army control to win. Just like he did in HoTS and early LoTV when he looked unbeatable. The biggest changes to Protoss (moma core, colossus etc) could actually benefit him in that sense. It's guys like sOs and herO that I would be worried for in the upcoming patch. | ||
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Lil_nooblet
United States459 Posts
On August 18 2017 09:29 Fango wrote: A better example is pre-3.8 Zest and post 3.8 Zest. He looked great at blizzcon and HSC, then by IEM Gyeonggi he was outright terrible. Although I personally believe that was due to leaving KT, and not the patch. ByuN specifically seemed to have been hurt by the tankivac/baneling/reaper changes iirc. Zest right now just relies on amazing mechanics and army control to win. Just like he did in HoTS and early LoTV when he looked unbeatable. The biggest changes to Protoss (moma core, colossus etc) could actually benefit him in that sense. It's guys like sOs and herO that I would be worried for in the upcoming patch. The chronoboost change will also help him. He's always been great at sharp timing attacks and fine tuning builds. | ||
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pvsnp
7676 Posts
On August 18 2017 09:29 Fango wrote: A better example is pre-3.8 Zest and post 3.8 Zest. He looked great at blizzcon and HSC, then by IEM Gyeonggi he was outright terrible. Although I personally believe that was due to leaving KT, and not the patch. ByuN specifically seemed to have been hurt by the tankivac/baneling/reaper changes iirc. Zest right now just relies on amazing mechanics and army control to win. Just like he did in HoTS and early LoTV when he looked unbeatable. The biggest changes to Protoss (moma core, colossus etc) could actually benefit him in that sense. It's guys like sOs and herO that I would be worried for in the upcoming patch. You have a good point in that guys who rely heavily on mechanics (Zest, Inno, soO, etc) tend to endure design changes pretty well, but it's undeniably a complication that introduces uncertainty/change and when you are at the top the only way to go is down. | ||
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Rolltide
United States447 Posts
We can look for easy answers to why a player did or did not do well but the it's not the same for every player. We can say that Zest was hurt by losing his team but TY and Stats were not negatively effected at all. Inno sure wasn't damaged by losing SK. | ||
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Rolltide
United States447 Posts
Feb 17th 2016 2-0 in group. Beat Taeja 2-0 and Journey 2-1. April 2nd 2016 2-0 in group he won both matches 2-0 April 15th 2016 rd of 8. Beat Taeja 3-1. Taeja retired after that match. April 22nd 2016 semi final beat Dear 4-0. May 1st 2016 final beat TY 4-2. This was not an IEM tournament where you have to be on your game for one long weekend. To win a GSL you have to bring it on 5 different occasions, 5 different dates against the best opposition. There was a whole month and a half just between groups. Zest could have been red hot on Feb 17th and then slipped in between. This is not a sport for people who are temporarily on their game this is a sport for people who are consistently good. | ||
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Plopus
Switzerland112 Posts
On August 18 2017 16:29 Rolltide wrote: Based on Innovation's 2016 results LOTV in general seemed to wreck him. He was half the player in 2016 that he was in 2015. We can look for easy answers to why a player did or did not do well but the it's not the same for every player. We can say that Zest was hurt by losing his team but TY and Stats were not negatively effected at all. Inno sure wasn't damaged by losing SK. I totally agree with you. I think that the loss of the KT team really affected Zest. He has always been mechanically really good but since he is not supported by a team, he is making poor decisions in game. | ||
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Mun_Su
France2063 Posts
On August 18 2017 16:29 Rolltide wrote: Based on Innovation's 2016 results LOTV in general seemed to wreck him. He was half the player in 2016 that he was in 2015. We can look for easy answers to why a player did or did not do well but the it's not the same for every player. We can say that Zest was hurt by losing his team but TY and Stats were not negatively effected at all. Inno sure wasn't damaged by losing SK. INno said he wasted this year on LoL. | ||
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Silvana
3713 Posts
I have lots of memories of games where he is making errors mechanics but remained calm and won by other means like starving the opponent or make him impatient, waiting for the right moment to take the big decisive fight that ended the game, or keep them busy until he could fix his army composition... Overall Id say he's more reliant in timings and builds he had practiced to death. | ||
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Fango
United Kingdom8987 Posts
On August 18 2017 21:59 Silvana wrote: I'm not really convinced Zest has always relied on his mechanics to win. At least not to Inno's level. I have lots of memories of games where he is making errors mechanics but remained calm and won by other means like starving the opponent or make him impatient, waiting for the right moment to take the big decisive fight that ended the game, or keep them busy until he could fix his army composition... Overall Id say he's more reliant in timings and builds he had practiced to death. He doesn't win the majority of his games with timings and build orders though? Not that I've seen outside of PvP Zest is relient on practicing to absolute perfection true. But at his peaks (2014, early 2016, now) he wins with good decision making and control. Especially in PvT, it seems no matter how bad it looks he always keeps himself in a winnable position (example, his games against Inno) herO is a protoss who relies almost entirely on timings and builds (honestly I think herO's best feature is his ability to choose builds so well). | ||
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Silvana
3713 Posts
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Rolltide
United States447 Posts
At least 2 will be in the final 8 anyway. | ||
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Rolltide
United States447 Posts
Same old story for Zest. His inability to take a map off Impact and Rogue has frozen him out of another big tournament opportunity. His combined record in maps in SSL events this year is 3-13. | ||
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