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On March 06 2017 02:50 The_Red_Viper wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2017 02:43 Elentos wrote:On March 06 2017 02:42 The_Red_Viper wrote:
I mean the differences might be less than for other weekend tournaments but i still think it's not equal overall.
We should be able to agree on the part that we want him to win a starleague though no matter what, no ? :D The only thing we'll ever agree on because you refuse to agree to anything else. Not everything else  Top korean players missing at these events simply makes it less valuable in my book. But sure the difference might be negligible overall and i am just a bit pedantic, could be the case
in a starleague you might only go up against 2-3 actual top tier players and still win. You only play against like 20% of the overall tournament playerbase
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On March 06 2017 03:40 Fango wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2017 02:50 The_Red_Viper wrote:On March 06 2017 02:43 Elentos wrote:On March 06 2017 02:42 The_Red_Viper wrote:
I mean the differences might be less than for other weekend tournaments but i still think it's not equal overall.
We should be able to agree on the part that we want him to win a starleague though no matter what, no ? :D The only thing we'll ever agree on because you refuse to agree to anything else. Not everything else Top korean players missing at these events simply makes it less valuable in my book. But sure the difference might be negligible overall and i am just a bit pedantic, could be the case in a starleague you might only go up against 2-3 actual top tier players and still win. You only play against like 20% of the overall tournament playerbase
Oh yeah ofc, bracket luck, etc is always a factor. But the more top players are at an event the more likely it is that any player there has to perform on a very high lvl to go far. Like put all the best players in the world into the same tournament, or only take half of them. It makes a difference imo, even though it is still theoretically possible that the winner has to play vs a top contender every single round
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On March 06 2017 03:44 The_Red_Viper wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2017 03:40 Fango wrote:On March 06 2017 02:50 The_Red_Viper wrote:On March 06 2017 02:43 Elentos wrote:On March 06 2017 02:42 The_Red_Viper wrote:
I mean the differences might be less than for other weekend tournaments but i still think it's not equal overall.
We should be able to agree on the part that we want him to win a starleague though no matter what, no ? :D The only thing we'll ever agree on because you refuse to agree to anything else. Not everything else Top korean players missing at these events simply makes it less valuable in my book. But sure the difference might be negligible overall and i am just a bit pedantic, could be the case in a starleague you might only go up against 2-3 actual top tier players and still win. You only play against like 20% of the overall tournament playerbase Oh yeah ofc, bracket luck, etc is always a factor. But the more top players are at an event the more likely it is that any player there has to perform on a very high lvl to go far. Like put all the best players in the world into the same tournament, or only take half of them. It makes a difference imo, even though it is still theoretically possible that the winner has to play vs a top contender every single round
TY had to beat Zest, gumiho, aLive, and Stats. Those are players he could very easily go through in GSL and win. The only one a bit lacking was gumiho (and technically aLive but he was playing top tier today).
Put it this way If Stats won he would have gone through Nerchio, ByuN, Dark, and TY. That's more impressive that going through ByuL, Inno, Ryung, and sOs to win a GSL. Which he could very well do this season.
The only difference is that this is a weekend cup they don't have 2 weeks between matches
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On March 06 2017 04:04 Fango wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2017 03:44 The_Red_Viper wrote:On March 06 2017 03:40 Fango wrote:On March 06 2017 02:50 The_Red_Viper wrote:On March 06 2017 02:43 Elentos wrote:On March 06 2017 02:42 The_Red_Viper wrote:
I mean the differences might be less than for other weekend tournaments but i still think it's not equal overall.
We should be able to agree on the part that we want him to win a starleague though no matter what, no ? :D The only thing we'll ever agree on because you refuse to agree to anything else. Not everything else Top korean players missing at these events simply makes it less valuable in my book. But sure the difference might be negligible overall and i am just a bit pedantic, could be the case in a starleague you might only go up against 2-3 actual top tier players and still win. You only play against like 20% of the overall tournament playerbase Oh yeah ofc, bracket luck, etc is always a factor. But the more top players are at an event the more likely it is that any player there has to perform on a very high lvl to go far. Like put all the best players in the world into the same tournament, or only take half of them. It makes a difference imo, even though it is still theoretically possible that the winner has to play vs a top contender every single round TY had to beat Zest, gumiho, aLive, and Stats. Those are players he could very easily go through in GSL and win. The only one a bit lacking was gumiho (and technically aLive but he was playing top tier today). Put it this way If Stats won he would have gone through Nerchio, ByuN, Dark, and TY. That's more impressive that going through ByuL, Inno, Ryung, and sOs to win a GSL. Which he could very well do this season.
You misunderstand my point. I am not saying that every road to the title is necessarily "harder on paper" in a GSL. But in a GSL pretty much every top player participates which makes it harder for the whole field. If a Ryung beats Maru there it validates his form more than if he makes it far in a weekend tournament where he has to play mostly lesser players, etc
The whole field pushes each other more. So yes you can still have to play very good players to win a weekend tournament, i don't ever deny that. But these players probably got there by beating easier competition which got there by beating even easier one, etc. Which is why i say that the overall lvl of competition is simply higher in GSL and that matters because it influences the whole tournament.
Arguably tournaments where you can prepare a lot/have more time in between the rounds are also harder because you have to be on point for a longer period of time.
So yeah in my book GSL/SSL/OSL > any weekend tournament ever. Even though certain ones are pretty damn close for sure.
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It has to be surreal for him tbh, after all these years with little to no success on an individual lvl he surely thought about retiring more than once. Now he is here <3
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On March 06 2017 05:04 The_Red_Viper wrote:It has to be surreal for him tbh, after all these years with little to no success on an individual lvl he surely thought about retiring more than once. Now he is here <3
ByuN had a similar situation. His earnings went from around 40K to 350K in 2016. TY went from 100 to 400 in 2 months. Wonder if he will get a new haircut with it?
edit: I remember they interviewed TY's mother during GSL S1 finals (TY's first final), she must be proud of him now.
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On March 06 2017 06:26 Fango wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2017 05:04 The_Red_Viper wrote:It has to be surreal for him tbh, after all these years with little to no success on an individual lvl he surely thought about retiring more than once. Now he is here <3 ByuN had a similar situation. His earnings went from around 40K to 350K in 2016. TY went from 100 to 400 in 2 months. Wonder if he will get a new haircut with it? edit: I remember they interviewed TY's mother during GSL S1 finals (TY's first final), she must be proud of him now.
I mean yeah similar for Byun but TY is a progamer since the start of sc2 (afaik) while TY plays competitive starcraft since 2006
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On March 06 2017 02:27 The_Red_Viper wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2017 02:19 Elentos wrote:
Other than Blizzcon, IEM Katowice is like the only tournament that I'd say isn't worth less than a win in a Korean league. Hm nah both are worth less simply because the lvl of competition OVERALL isn't the same. That doesn't mean that the roads are more easy necessarily, but in a GSL there are simply more players who could win the thing, etc. That being said i obviously still think this is great for TY  Just wanna see him win a GSL/SSL as well ^^ Show nested quote +On March 06 2017 02:24 Elentos wrote:TY is the highest earning player in esports in 2017 so far  Sad that no starcraft player can actually keep that title though haha
If you include qualifiers every korean top player participated. So imo it's worth just as much as a GSL win.
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On March 06 2017 08:09 Charoisaur wrote:Show nested quote +On March 06 2017 02:27 The_Red_Viper wrote:On March 06 2017 02:19 Elentos wrote:
Other than Blizzcon, IEM Katowice is like the only tournament that I'd say isn't worth less than a win in a Korean league. Hm nah both are worth less simply because the lvl of competition OVERALL isn't the same. That doesn't mean that the roads are more easy necessarily, but in a GSL there are simply more players who could win the thing, etc. That being said i obviously still think this is great for TY Just wanna see him win a GSL/SSL as well ^^ On March 06 2017 02:24 Elentos wrote:TY is the highest earning player in esports in 2017 so far Sad that no starcraft player can actually keep that title though haha If you include qualifiers every korean top player participated. So imo it's worth just as much as a GSL win.
That's online though which is still a bit different + the argument about the need to stay at the top lvl for a longer time instead of showing top performance on a few days + preparation.
But yeah as i said it's closer than others for sure, maybe even a negligible gap
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Seriously though, shouldn't the original post be updated with all those pretty trophies TY has won lately?
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Yeah it should, but Gumba is fairly inactive
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Even more perspective on his wins:
In 2016, ByuN broke Mvp's 5-year-old record of the highest-earning single year of SC2. Mvp's best year had him win around 257,502.48$. After IEM Ggyeongi in December, ByuN had reached an incredible 306,111.36 $ in a single year.
It's now early March of 2017. TY is guaranteed to break the record at some point this year (Blizzcon at the very latest). Pretty absurd.
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I mean that's what happens if you have a 200k tournament :D Which is why money won is a bad metric to define greatness (not saying that you did), but interesting trivia nonetheless
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On March 07 2017 08:02 Elentos wrote:Show nested quote +On March 07 2017 07:57 The_Red_Viper wrote:I mean that's what happens if you have a 200k tournament :D Which is why money won is a bad metric to define greatness (not saying that you did), but interesting trivia nonetheless It's really the combination of WESG and IEM. ByuN won a 200k tournament last year too, if the Blizzcon prize pool wasn't doubled he'd never have broken Mvp's record Also if TY somehow ends up winning Blizzcon, he will break 600k earnings and become the highest earning SC2 player ever
That would be quite funny. He could even break JD's record for the whole of starcraft :O
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If he already has been payed earnings for ro8 GSl finish he already sets the record for most earnings in one year btw
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btw, strange place to ask but do we know anything about the GSL vs the world tournament? Like prize pool, player size etc. If it is held in a big arena like the other global WCS events it would be amazing to see. Would even be tempting to go out to Seoul (no clue why I didn't go to Katowice tbh I wish I had).
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Ro8 is worth 4200$, so he'd still be ~1500$ short.
And Viper you're right, if he won Blizzcon and did well in other tournaments for the rest of the year, he'd break JD's record.
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On March 07 2017 08:48 Fango wrote:
btw, strange place to ask but do we know anything about the GSL vs the world tournament? Like prize pool, player size etc. If it is held in a big arena like the other global WCS events it would be amazing to see. Would even be tempting to go out to Seoul (no clue why I didn't go to Katowice tbh I wish I had).
All we know is it'll be in Korea at some point mid-year and won't give WCS points.
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EPT
