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On July 16 2012 11:18 Azarkon wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2012 11:06 vRadiatioNv wrote:On July 16 2012 10:50 Azarkon wrote:On July 16 2012 10:39 NevaN wrote:
@azarkon- enough with you man, why not you play against him? This time looking at floating minerals when he is just saving it, go win NASL for yourself then you are worthy to be listened too. . .Who are you to question a champion's game when he does win the tournament. You seemed to be indicating to be the better player by over knowing a flaw of someone who just wins a tournament right at the moment. Im not saying he does a perfect game but can you name someone with a perfect game? Stephano does have flaws but MC,Hero,and alicia did more errors or bad decisions thats why they lost. Reflect on that and assess your opinions before deving on here. No, he was not saving minerals. He ended up with ~170/200 supply after the 'remax.' You know he wanted 200/200 during that remax, but wasn't able to hit it because he was larvae starved, which happened because he didn't make an extra hatchery when his resource income started spiking up. Fanboyism is not seeing that he made a mistake and supporting him whatever he does. There is a lot of room for improvement in his mechanics, but he wins because he has better engagements and decision making than other Zergs, including the bulk of Korean ones. With better mechanics, he is able to take that further and reach a level no other Zerg has reached before. You realise that if he had that many hatcheries and larva he could only support 1 reinforcement? Once those resources are drained having that many hatcheries would prove to be inefficient. You cant support that many hatcheries. The reason he's floating resources is because he maxes and then builds the bank. The amount of hatcheries he has perfectly matches his income. In fact, usually he has TOO MANY larvae (hence, 120 zerglings built at once in a recent game). If his reinforcements die he doesn't want to end with 0 money in the bank and 900+ resources worth of macro hatches. An extra hatchery is 350 minerals. He was floating 1500+...
Do you even play this game? If yes, have you ever tried zerg?
1500 is nothing on 4 bases. And he reloaded with pure zerglings, had he reloaded with roach or even half roach, he floats absolutely nothing.
"THEORETICALLY" 1500 is a little under 1 minute of income, so if he had planted a macro hatch and made a queen a minute before, he would have floated nothing at the reload, but theoretically correct =/= practical. How could he have known he was going to be reloading pure lings?
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On July 16 2012 11:27 Azarkon wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2012 11:20 vRadiatioNv wrote:On July 16 2012 11:18 Azarkon wrote:On July 16 2012 11:06 vRadiatioNv wrote:On July 16 2012 10:50 Azarkon wrote:On July 16 2012 10:39 NevaN wrote:
@azarkon- enough with you man, why not you play against him? This time looking at floating minerals when he is just saving it, go win NASL for yourself then you are worthy to be listened too. . .Who are you to question a champion's game when he does win the tournament. You seemed to be indicating to be the better player by over knowing a flaw of someone who just wins a tournament right at the moment. Im not saying he does a perfect game but can you name someone with a perfect game? Stephano does have flaws but MC,Hero,and alicia did more errors or bad decisions thats why they lost. Reflect on that and assess your opinions before deving on here. No, he was not saving minerals. He ended up with ~170/200 supply after the 'remax.' You know he wanted 200/200 during that remax, but wasn't able to hit it because he was larvae starved, which happened because he didn't make an extra hatchery when his resource income started spiking up. Fanboyism is not seeing that he made a mistake and supporting him whatever he does. There is a lot of room for improvement in his mechanics, but he wins because he has better engagements and decision making than other Zergs, including the bulk of Korean ones. With better mechanics, he is able to take that further and reach a level no other Zerg has reached before. You realise that if he had that many hatcheries and larva he could only support 1 reinforcement? Once those resources are drained having that many hatcheries would prove to be inefficient. You cant support that many hatcheries. The reason he's floating resources is because he maxes and then builds the bank. The amount of hatcheries he has perfectly matches his income. In fact, usually he has TOO MANY larvae (hence, 120 zerglings built at once in a recent game). If his reinforcements die he doesn't want to end with 0 money in the bank and 900+ resources worth of macro hatches. An extra hatchery is 350 minerals. He was floating 1500+... Aaaand he doesn't have enough economy to support more hatches. What aren't you understanding? How does floating 1500+ minerals = not having enough economy to support the hatches? Banking larvae is always a positive in the late game. It's the exact same logic for having extra gateways for a Protoss, and extra rax for a Terran. You never want to be in a situation where you have a lot of resources but not enough production to support them. Having extra production is a plus, not a negative, especially when you go lings, which are larvae heavy. There are Zergs who never float resources until maxed, and who are able to hit higher unit counts at faster timings. I don't see why that's bad. Stephano himself has said that he has a lot to improve in his play - why think otherwise?
I agree, but Stephano is so good because he fights always in good positionings, he is not the best macroer at all but his battle micro is the best of zergs imo
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On July 16 2012 11:25 revel8 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2012 10:50 Azarkon wrote:On July 16 2012 10:39 NevaN wrote:
@azarkon- enough with you man, why not you play against him? This time looking at floating minerals when he is just saving it, go win NASL for yourself then you are worthy to be listened too. . .Who are you to question a champion's game when he does win the tournament. You seemed to be indicating to be the better player by over knowing a flaw of someone who just wins a tournament right at the moment. Im not saying he does a perfect game but can you name someone with a perfect game? Stephano does have flaws but MC,Hero,and alicia did more errors or bad decisions thats why they lost. Reflect on that and assess your opinions before deving on here. No, he was not saving minerals. He ended up with ~170/200 supply after the 'remax.' You know he wanted 200/200 during that remax, but wasn't able to hit it because he was larvae starved, which happened because he didn't make an extra hatchery when his resource income started spiking up. Fanboyism is not seeing that he made a mistake and supporting him whatever he does. There is a lot of room for improvement in his mechanics, but he wins because he has better engagements and decision making than other Zergs, including the bulk of Korean ones. With better mechanics, he is able to take that further and reach a level no other Zerg has reached before. At some point, you should just relax and congratulate Stephano for winning. Overly critical is overly critical. Winning is better than whining.
I did in the LR thread. It's a great win for him all things considered, because he hasn't won a big tournament in a while and winning HerO and MC has to be a great feeling given that he struggled vs. them in the past.
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On July 16 2012 11:28 Kontys wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2012 11:18 Azarkon wrote:On July 16 2012 11:06 vRadiatioNv wrote:On July 16 2012 10:50 Azarkon wrote:On July 16 2012 10:39 NevaN wrote:
@azarkon- enough with you man, why not you play against him? This time looking at floating minerals when he is just saving it, go win NASL for yourself then you are worthy to be listened too. . .Who are you to question a champion's game when he does win the tournament. You seemed to be indicating to be the better player by over knowing a flaw of someone who just wins a tournament right at the moment. Im not saying he does a perfect game but can you name someone with a perfect game? Stephano does have flaws but MC,Hero,and alicia did more errors or bad decisions thats why they lost. Reflect on that and assess your opinions before deving on here. No, he was not saving minerals. He ended up with ~170/200 supply after the 'remax.' You know he wanted 200/200 during that remax, but wasn't able to hit it because he was larvae starved, which happened because he didn't make an extra hatchery when his resource income started spiking up. Fanboyism is not seeing that he made a mistake and supporting him whatever he does. There is a lot of room for improvement in his mechanics, but he wins because he has better engagements and decision making than other Zergs, including the bulk of Korean ones. With better mechanics, he is able to take that further and reach a level no other Zerg has reached before. You realise that if he had that many hatcheries and larva he could only support 1 reinforcement? Once those resources are drained having that many hatcheries would prove to be inefficient. You cant support that many hatcheries. The reason he's floating resources is because he maxes and then builds the bank. The amount of hatcheries he has perfectly matches his income. In fact, usually he has TOO MANY larvae (hence, 120 zerglings built at once in a recent game). If his reinforcements die he doesn't want to end with 0 money in the bank and 900+ resources worth of macro hatches. An extra hatchery is 350 minerals. He was floating 1500+... Do you even play this game? If yes, have you ever tried zerg? 1500 is nothing on 4 bases. And he reloaded with pure zerglings, had he reloaded with roach or even half roach, he floats absolutely nothing. "THEORETICALLY" 1500 is a little under 1 minute of income, so if he had planted a macro hatch and made a queen a minute before, he would have floated nothing at the reload, but theoretically correct =/= practical. How could he have known he was going to be reloading pure lings?
He was floating 1500 minerals and 0 gas. Do you understand this? He did reload with roaches - he used up all his gas for ~6-7 roaches, then made 30-40 lings. Zerg is gas starved to begin with. Stephano was never going to run out of minerals before he ran out of gas. He did not have the ability to remax on roaches because he spends all his gas on infestors, which is the best way to spend them, mind you. But it does leave you gas starved.
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Well done, stephano. Big win.
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He says in the gamespot interview that he'll only play GSTL in Korea, no GSL. Don't know if that's news.
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On July 16 2012 11:30 Azarkon wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2012 11:28 Kontys wrote:On July 16 2012 11:18 Azarkon wrote:On July 16 2012 11:06 vRadiatioNv wrote:On July 16 2012 10:50 Azarkon wrote:On July 16 2012 10:39 NevaN wrote:
@azarkon- enough with you man, why not you play against him? This time looking at floating minerals when he is just saving it, go win NASL for yourself then you are worthy to be listened too. . .Who are you to question a champion's game when he does win the tournament. You seemed to be indicating to be the better player by over knowing a flaw of someone who just wins a tournament right at the moment. Im not saying he does a perfect game but can you name someone with a perfect game? Stephano does have flaws but MC,Hero,and alicia did more errors or bad decisions thats why they lost. Reflect on that and assess your opinions before deving on here. No, he was not saving minerals. He ended up with ~170/200 supply after the 'remax.' You know he wanted 200/200 during that remax, but wasn't able to hit it because he was larvae starved, which happened because he didn't make an extra hatchery when his resource income started spiking up. Fanboyism is not seeing that he made a mistake and supporting him whatever he does. There is a lot of room for improvement in his mechanics, but he wins because he has better engagements and decision making than other Zergs, including the bulk of Korean ones. With better mechanics, he is able to take that further and reach a level no other Zerg has reached before. You realise that if he had that many hatcheries and larva he could only support 1 reinforcement? Once those resources are drained having that many hatcheries would prove to be inefficient. You cant support that many hatcheries. The reason he's floating resources is because he maxes and then builds the bank. The amount of hatcheries he has perfectly matches his income. In fact, usually he has TOO MANY larvae (hence, 120 zerglings built at once in a recent game). If his reinforcements die he doesn't want to end with 0 money in the bank and 900+ resources worth of macro hatches. An extra hatchery is 350 minerals. He was floating 1500+... Do you even play this game? If yes, have you ever tried zerg? 1500 is nothing on 4 bases. And he reloaded with pure zerglings, had he reloaded with roach or even half roach, he floats absolutely nothing. "THEORETICALLY" 1500 is a little under 1 minute of income, so if he had planted a macro hatch and made a queen a minute before, he would have floated nothing at the reload, but theoretically correct =/= practical. How could he have known he was going to be reloading pure lings? He was floating 1500 minerals and 0 gas. Do you understand this? He did reload with roaches - he used up all his gas for ~6-7 roaches, then made 30-40 lings. Zerg is gas starved to begin with. Stephano was never going to run out of minerals before he ran out of gas. He did not have the ability to remax on roaches because he spends all his gas on infestors, which is the best way to spend them, mind you. But it does leave you gas starved.
I'm saying if he had the extra hatches, he would have 0 money, more larva then he could use, and he would be unable to reinforce if his army died again. In the long run, it's innefficient.
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On July 16 2012 11:40 StarVe wrote:
He says in the gamespot interview that he'll only play GSTL in Korea, no GSL. Don't know if that's news.
That's news. A lot of people thought he was going to play GSL. Sad to hear he's not.
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I'm just happy i could see this live. Stephano you are a genius 
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Azarkon, you seem like a person who would analyze a glass of wine all night long, instead of enjoying it. In moments like this you don't nitpick, you just don't. Stephano went 11:3 vs top class Korean protoss, won 30 000 dollars, and you are focusing on the lack of hatcheries to support his minerals? Seriously? Seems that i'm not the only one who finds this amusing/annoying/confusing. Maybe you are training to become a professional critic? I like perfection as much as the next guy, but success stories should be celebrated, not over-analyzed. It's like saying "Damn it, they should have won by 5:0..." after Spain lifted the EURO 2012 trophy.
I support the right to express your opinion, what you say is not incorrect, but you are definitely overdoing it by a mile. Cheers!
On another note: Stephano. Fuck yeah.
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On July 16 2012 11:48 Psyclon wrote:
Azarkon, you seem like a person who would analyze a glass of wine all night long, instead of enjoying it. In moments like this you don't nitpick, you just don't. Stephano went 11:3 vs top class Korean protoss, won 30 000 dollars, and you are focusing on the lack of hatcheries to support his minerals? Seriously? Seems that i'm not the only one who finds this amusing/annoying/confusing. Maybe you are training to become a professional critic? I like perfection as much as the next guy, but success stories should be celebrated, not over-analyzed. It's like saying "Damn it, they should have won by 5:0..." after Spain lifted the EURO 2012 trophy.
I support the right to express your opinion, what you say is not incorrect, but you are definitely overdoing it by a mile. Cheers!
On another note: Stephano. Fuck yeah.
I agree with that, so I'm going to save the analysis for when he loses. Obviously he's doing a lot of things correctly, else he was never going to win HerO and MC, who are easily the best PvZers in Korea when looking at the last few months. Switching from roaches to that ling heavy style was awesome, and I think played a huge role in his victory against those players.
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On July 16 2012 11:42 Azarkon wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2012 11:40 StarVe wrote:
He says in the gamespot interview that he'll only play GSTL in Korea, no GSL. Don't know if that's news. That's news. A lot of people thought he was going to play GSL. Sad to hear he's not.
No the plan has allways been to play in GSTL with TSL.
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On July 16 2012 11:57 Benjamin99 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2012 11:42 Azarkon wrote:On July 16 2012 11:40 StarVe wrote:
He says in the gamespot interview that he'll only play GSTL in Korea, no GSL. Don't know if that's news. That's news. A lot of people thought he was going to play GSL. Sad to hear he's not. No the plan has allways been to play in GSTL with TSL.
He said he was thinking about the GSL for a while. This thread talked about it before, and from reading the LR threads, that's what people still think he's going to do. Not playing in the GSL has its own benefits, but I think a lot of people hoped he was going to try to play it once before he retires.
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On July 16 2012 11:59 Azarkon wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2012 11:57 Benjamin99 wrote:On July 16 2012 11:42 Azarkon wrote:On July 16 2012 11:40 StarVe wrote:
He says in the gamespot interview that he'll only play GSTL in Korea, no GSL. Don't know if that's news. That's news. A lot of people thought he was going to play GSL. Sad to hear he's not. No the plan has allways been to play in GSTL with TSL. He said for a while that he was going to play in the GSL. This thread talked about it before, and from reading the LR threads, that's what people thought he was going to do until that news recently.
No he has sayd many times that he is going to Korea to train and do GSTL and if he got time he will play GSL if it dont interfere with other major tournaments
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Best player in the world.
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I would agree that Stephano definitely needs to refine his ZvZ. He has shown some promise lately when he 2-0'd Nerchio at DH. Those were some pretty sick games. His ZvT has been pretty good lately. And his ZvP has to be the best in the business. He just beat some of the best Protoss in the world right here, quite convincingly I might add. I would still put DRG slightly ahead of Stephano as best Zerg overall, but if Stephano can smooth out the edges, it won't be long before he's the top. Would love to see Stephano stomping like this in all matchups. Grats, Stephano!
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On July 16 2012 12:06 TheWorldToCome wrote:
Best player in the world.
he's most definitely the best player outside of Korea, but you have to have success in the GSL AND in foreign events to earn the best player in the world title.
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The Legend continues...
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/W4qDh.jpg)
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@azarkon- Then who do you suggest us to portray the player your opinion is seeing?? You can't demand out from him to produce perfect games man for other players train so much harder than him yet commits more mistake than Stephano. and i assure you, 200% in your game your not that perfect too. Don't litter the thread of your opinion that he is declining for you yourself can simply look at the results.Anyway as someone has said haters gonna hate.
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EPT
