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Personal attacks in this thread will draw a temp ban. |
On February 13 2012 14:02 Megabuster123 wrote:
I don't see how Idra is the only one at fault here. Alive cheesed him 2 games in a row, and so Idra said fuck it and decided to cheese back and so the games were stupid...>_>
The only difference is Terran can transition out of a reactored hellion or 2 rax build MUCH easier than a zerg can transition out of a six pool. If the six pool fails and the terran is walled off, he can march into your main and you lose. I think we both know this is a stupid argument. We can just give him the benefit of the doubt and say he was having a terrible day prior to the matches.
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Yeah I don't care if this is his fan club, that was terrible play and terrible sportsmanship.
I was a fanand have been for quite awhile, however, after watching these games (vs alive) it strikes me that no player should attempt to emulate idra as his attitude and play style are quite frankly, lacking.
I feel that his unwillingness to accept all-in play, coupled with his unwillingness to give his fans the show they want and deserve is contrary to everything I think e-sports stands for.
We are (were) your fans idra, we are the ones that make you in demand, we are the ones that give your stream views and your games views, by doing what you did in the showmatch you show that not only do you not care about your fans (which really isn't that suprising), but also, that you do not care about your games.
Their are many times when Slayers Boxer has said it doesn't matter whether he wins or loses but only that good games are given, that fans leave satisfied.
You have shown you care about neither.
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On February 13 2012 14:04 hysterial wrote:Show nested quote +On February 13 2012 14:02 SC2NeCro wrote:People need to accept the fact that IdrA is the LeBron of Starcraft. Popular and controversial! He just need a 1 hour special on Twitch about his "The Decision" to take his talents over to the Terran Race.  IdrA hwaiting! Except Lebron is actually the best player in basketball and Idra is("was") a top foreigner.
IdrA is the "talent" with no "rings".
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On February 13 2012 13:43 Mrvoodoochild1 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 13 2012 13:40 ampson wrote:
Ignore haters, train with your head down for a while, qualify for code A and smash MLG's. I certainly hope this happens. Stop being a blind fanboy. What Idra did is disgraceful to say the least. When you 6 pool two straight games, you are spitting in the face of all your fans. How you don't see this is a mystery. It's like Idra doesn't even care anymore. It's sad.
Let me tell you something about something. I'm not a fanboy, idra isn't even one of my favorite players. In fact, he would probably tell me to apologize for playing my race if he met me in a game. I don't usually even like zerg players, but I do in fact like idra. I'll tell you why, too. I like strong foreign players. IdrA is strong foreign player. He has beaten MC when MC was near his best, he has competed with and beaten many top koreans and foreigners alike. Sure, he has some problems. All players have weaknesses, his are just more noticable than most. But idra is currently a top foreigner in korea and I would really like to have him in the GSL as opposed to some random korean who I have no strong feelings for one way or another. I of course want idra to do well, and I think that saying I want him to do well =/= being a blind fanboy.
As for the games, you play to win the fucking game. The first 6-pool nearly worked, and the second was actually a smart decision. Not many people would 6-pool twice in a row, and alive got a build order win, just like game 2. 6 Pooling twice in a row was certainly what idra felt would give him the best chance to win the game, and I have absolutely no problem with that. I guess you're one of the people who bitches and moans in LR threads whenever somebody 1/1/1s or 4gates. But here's the news. That is not the same thing as spitting in the face of your fans, and idra plays the game for a living. He cares.
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I like how everyone is bitching at Idra for doing 2 allins, but completely ignoring the fact that Alive did 2 allins..
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On February 13 2012 14:09 Chewbacca. wrote:
I like how everyone is bitching at Idra for doing 2 allins, but completely ignoring the fact that Alive did 2 allins..
Well aLive won with them  I doubt people would complain (as much) if IdrA had won.
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On February 13 2012 14:09 Chewbacca. wrote:
I like how everyone is bitching at Idra for doing 2 allins, but completely ignoring the fact that Alive did 2 allins..
Apparently because he did the same cheese twice.
Oh no. The disaster!
Apparently playing predictable means you are giving up despite 6 pool being a valid, yet looked down upon strategy.
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On February 13 2012 14:06 ampson wrote:Show nested quote +On February 13 2012 13:43 Mrvoodoochild1 wrote:On February 13 2012 13:40 ampson wrote:
Ignore haters, train with your head down for a while, qualify for code A and smash MLG's. I certainly hope this happens. Stop being a blind fanboy. What Idra did is disgraceful to say the least. When you 6 pool two straight games, you are spitting in the face of all your fans. How you don't see this is a mystery. It's like Idra doesn't even care anymore. It's sad. Let me tell you something about something. I'm not a fanboy, idra isn't even one of my favorite players. In fact, he would probably tell me to apologize for playing my race if he met me in a game. I don't usually even like zerg players, but I do in fact like idra. I'll tell you why, too. I like strong foreign players. IdrA is strong foreign player. He has beaten MC when MC was near his best, he has competed with and beaten many top koreans and foreigners alike. Sure, he has some problems. All players have weaknesses, his are just more noticable than most. But idra is currently a top foreigner in korea and I would really like to have him in the GSL as opposed to some random korean who I have no strong feelings for one way or another. I of course want idra to do well, and I think that saying I want him to do well =/= being a blind fanboy. As for the games, you play to win the fucking game. The first 6-pool nearly worked, and the second was actually a smart decision. Not many people would 6-pool twice in a row, and alive got a build order win, just like game 2. 6 Pooling twice in a row was certainly what idra felt would give him the best chance to win the game, and I have absolutely no problem with that. I guess you're one of the people who bitches and moans in LR threads whenever somebody 1/1/1s or 4gates. But here's the news. That is not the same thing as spitting in the face of your fans, and idra plays the game for a living. He cares.
I have to interject. I do agree with you, six pool is a legitimate strategy, however the way Idra did it was how he showed that he didn't care. He went straight through the middle of the map, right where the svc could scout them, He could have spent 3 extra seconds to go around the tower, he chose not to. He didn't GG once the entire matchup. This in itself isn't that bad but you can put two and two together. He threw away the games. Now, that's his choice but ultimately from a financial standpoint it's not a good idea. Your fans are a large chunk of your income. Players from multiple sports have been dropped simply because the fanbase was so enraged.
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Jaedong 4 pooled twice in his last BoX series against Flash. He GGed though.
EDIT + Show Spoiler +
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On February 13 2012 14:11 NoctemSC wrote:Show nested quote +On February 13 2012 14:06 ampson wrote:On February 13 2012 13:43 Mrvoodoochild1 wrote:On February 13 2012 13:40 ampson wrote:
Ignore haters, train with your head down for a while, qualify for code A and smash MLG's. I certainly hope this happens. Stop being a blind fanboy. What Idra did is disgraceful to say the least. When you 6 pool two straight games, you are spitting in the face of all your fans. How you don't see this is a mystery. It's like Idra doesn't even care anymore. It's sad. Let me tell you something about something. I'm not a fanboy, idra isn't even one of my favorite players. In fact, he would probably tell me to apologize for playing my race if he met me in a game. I don't usually even like zerg players, but I do in fact like idra. I'll tell you why, too. I like strong foreign players. IdrA is strong foreign player. He has beaten MC when MC was near his best, he has competed with and beaten many top koreans and foreigners alike. Sure, he has some problems. All players have weaknesses, his are just more noticable than most. But idra is currently a top foreigner in korea and I would really like to have him in the GSL as opposed to some random korean who I have no strong feelings for one way or another. I of course want idra to do well, and I think that saying I want him to do well =/= being a blind fanboy. As for the games, you play to win the fucking game. The first 6-pool nearly worked, and the second was actually a smart decision. Not many people would 6-pool twice in a row, and alive got a build order win, just like game 2. 6 Pooling twice in a row was certainly what idra felt would give him the best chance to win the game, and I have absolutely no problem with that. I guess you're one of the people who bitches and moans in LR threads whenever somebody 1/1/1s or 4gates. But here's the news. That is not the same thing as spitting in the face of your fans, and idra plays the game for a living. He cares. I have to interject. I do agree with you, six pool is a legitimate strategy, however the way Idra did it was how he showed that he didn't care. He went straight through the middle of the map, right where the svc could scout them, He could have spent 3 extra seconds to go around the tower, he chose not to. He didn't GG once the entire matchup. This in itself isn't that bad but you can put two and two together. He threw away the games. Now, that's his choice but ultimately from a financial standpoint it's not a good idea. Your fans are a large chunk of your income. Players from multiple sports have been dropped simply because the fanbase was so enraged.
I think that can be explained by him being tilted to shit from losing 3 incredibly quick games. I doubt he was thinking much during the game. And I honestly don't see why people think gg'ing is so important. Sure, it's nice, but it's the players choice and nobody should judge them by it.
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On February 13 2012 14:14 ampson wrote:Show nested quote +On February 13 2012 14:11 NoctemSC wrote:On February 13 2012 14:06 ampson wrote:On February 13 2012 13:43 Mrvoodoochild1 wrote:On February 13 2012 13:40 ampson wrote:
Ignore haters, train with your head down for a while, qualify for code A and smash MLG's. I certainly hope this happens. Stop being a blind fanboy. What Idra did is disgraceful to say the least. When you 6 pool two straight games, you are spitting in the face of all your fans. How you don't see this is a mystery. It's like Idra doesn't even care anymore. It's sad. Let me tell you something about something. I'm not a fanboy, idra isn't even one of my favorite players. In fact, he would probably tell me to apologize for playing my race if he met me in a game. I don't usually even like zerg players, but I do in fact like idra. I'll tell you why, too. I like strong foreign players. IdrA is strong foreign player. He has beaten MC when MC was near his best, he has competed with and beaten many top koreans and foreigners alike. Sure, he has some problems. All players have weaknesses, his are just more noticable than most. But idra is currently a top foreigner in korea and I would really like to have him in the GSL as opposed to some random korean who I have no strong feelings for one way or another. I of course want idra to do well, and I think that saying I want him to do well =/= being a blind fanboy. As for the games, you play to win the fucking game. The first 6-pool nearly worked, and the second was actually a smart decision. Not many people would 6-pool twice in a row, and alive got a build order win, just like game 2. 6 Pooling twice in a row was certainly what idra felt would give him the best chance to win the game, and I have absolutely no problem with that. I guess you're one of the people who bitches and moans in LR threads whenever somebody 1/1/1s or 4gates. But here's the news. That is not the same thing as spitting in the face of your fans, and idra plays the game for a living. He cares. I have to interject. I do agree with you, six pool is a legitimate strategy, however the way Idra did it was how he showed that he didn't care. He went straight through the middle of the map, right where the svc could scout them, He could have spent 3 extra seconds to go around the tower, he chose not to. He didn't GG once the entire matchup. This in itself isn't that bad but you can put two and two together. He threw away the games. Now, that's his choice but ultimately from a financial standpoint it's not a good idea. Your fans are a large chunk of your income. Players from multiple sports have been dropped simply because the fanbase was so enraged. I think that can be explained by him being tilted to shit from losing 3 incredibly quick games. I doubt he was thinking much during the game. And I honestly don't see why people think gg'ing is so important. Sure, it's nice, but it's the players choice and nobody should judge them by it.
Very true. I think the arguments here are more passion based than logic. It's nice to find someone I can bounce around theories with without getting hot headed.
Yes losing 3 games so quick would get to anyone, all I can say is that if I were in his shoes even if I felt like crap I'd still give it my all that one last game, for the fans, for my career and for the opportunity to get invited to another showmatch.
I'm not condoning his behavior, in fact I think he was in the wrong but many people would do the same in his situation.
Do I think he should be punished for this? Not at all, this was his choice and his alone. He's getting paid to play, however I'm sure the implications of what he did will settle in given enough time. Whether he learns from this or not is up to him.
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On February 13 2012 14:11 NoctemSC wrote:Show nested quote +On February 13 2012 14:06 ampson wrote:On February 13 2012 13:43 Mrvoodoochild1 wrote:On February 13 2012 13:40 ampson wrote:
Ignore haters, train with your head down for a while, qualify for code A and smash MLG's. I certainly hope this happens. Stop being a blind fanboy. What Idra did is disgraceful to say the least. When you 6 pool two straight games, you are spitting in the face of all your fans. How you don't see this is a mystery. It's like Idra doesn't even care anymore. It's sad. Let me tell you something about something. I'm not a fanboy, idra isn't even one of my favorite players. In fact, he would probably tell me to apologize for playing my race if he met me in a game. I don't usually even like zerg players, but I do in fact like idra. I'll tell you why, too. I like strong foreign players. IdrA is strong foreign player. He has beaten MC when MC was near his best, he has competed with and beaten many top koreans and foreigners alike. Sure, he has some problems. All players have weaknesses, his are just more noticable than most. But idra is currently a top foreigner in korea and I would really like to have him in the GSL as opposed to some random korean who I have no strong feelings for one way or another. I of course want idra to do well, and I think that saying I want him to do well =/= being a blind fanboy. As for the games, you play to win the fucking game. The first 6-pool nearly worked, and the second was actually a smart decision. Not many people would 6-pool twice in a row, and alive got a build order win, just like game 2. 6 Pooling twice in a row was certainly what idra felt would give him the best chance to win the game, and I have absolutely no problem with that. I guess you're one of the people who bitches and moans in LR threads whenever somebody 1/1/1s or 4gates. But here's the news. That is not the same thing as spitting in the face of your fans, and idra plays the game for a living. He cares. I have to interject. I do agree with you, six pool is a legitimate strategy, however the way Idra did it was how he showed that he didn't care. He went straight through the middle of the map, right where the svc could scout them, He could have spent 3 extra seconds to go around the tower, he chose not to. He didn't GG once the entire matchup. This in itself isn't that bad but you can put two and two together. He threw away the games. Now, that's his choice but ultimately from a financial standpoint it's not a good idea. Your fans are a large chunk of your income. Players from multiple sports have been dropped simply because the fanbase was so enraged.
1. 3 extra seconds means alot in starcraft time ifi you havent noticed some matches depends on the seconds
2. So WHAT he didnt GG like omg.. thats why i like idrA because he doesnt give a shit of what you think or what i think he actually has the balls to not care and not scared to show it to the whole sc2 community
3. people are just mad that he lost get over it trying to find excuses on why he losted
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All of you are talking out of your butts i think idra let his emotions get the best of him but all of you need to realize that your not in the same position as him.
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On February 13 2012 14:20 naux wrote:Show nested quote +On February 13 2012 14:11 NoctemSC wrote:On February 13 2012 14:06 ampson wrote:On February 13 2012 13:43 Mrvoodoochild1 wrote:On February 13 2012 13:40 ampson wrote:
Ignore haters, train with your head down for a while, qualify for code A and smash MLG's. I certainly hope this happens. Stop being a blind fanboy. What Idra did is disgraceful to say the least. When you 6 pool two straight games, you are spitting in the face of all your fans. How you don't see this is a mystery. It's like Idra doesn't even care anymore. It's sad. Let me tell you something about something. I'm not a fanboy, idra isn't even one of my favorite players. In fact, he would probably tell me to apologize for playing my race if he met me in a game. I don't usually even like zerg players, but I do in fact like idra. I'll tell you why, too. I like strong foreign players. IdrA is strong foreign player. He has beaten MC when MC was near his best, he has competed with and beaten many top koreans and foreigners alike. Sure, he has some problems. All players have weaknesses, his are just more noticable than most. But idra is currently a top foreigner in korea and I would really like to have him in the GSL as opposed to some random korean who I have no strong feelings for one way or another. I of course want idra to do well, and I think that saying I want him to do well =/= being a blind fanboy. As for the games, you play to win the fucking game. The first 6-pool nearly worked, and the second was actually a smart decision. Not many people would 6-pool twice in a row, and alive got a build order win, just like game 2. 6 Pooling twice in a row was certainly what idra felt would give him the best chance to win the game, and I have absolutely no problem with that. I guess you're one of the people who bitches and moans in LR threads whenever somebody 1/1/1s or 4gates. But here's the news. That is not the same thing as spitting in the face of your fans, and idra plays the game for a living. He cares. I have to interject. I do agree with you, six pool is a legitimate strategy, however the way Idra did it was how he showed that he didn't care. He went straight through the middle of the map, right where the svc could scout them, He could have spent 3 extra seconds to go around the tower, he chose not to. He didn't GG once the entire matchup. This in itself isn't that bad but you can put two and two together. He threw away the games. Now, that's his choice but ultimately from a financial standpoint it's not a good idea. Your fans are a large chunk of your income. Players from multiple sports have been dropped simply because the fanbase was so enraged. 1. 3 extra seconds means alot in starcraft time ifi you havent noticed some matches depends on the seconds 2. So WHAT he didnt GG like omg.. thats why i like idrA because he doesnt give a shit of what you think or what i think he actually has the balls to not care and not scared to show it to the whole sc2 community 3. people are just mad that he lost get over it trying to find excuses on why he losted
You obviously didn't read what I said, at all. I never said not "GG"ing was terrible. I said that isn't that bad. You're right 3 seconds can mean a lot, however if you cut corners and go straight through the center and you're scouted, you auto lose anyways. If he skirted and aLive didn't figure out it was a sixpool until after he had scouted, there's a chance he wouldn't have dropped that second depot.
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Hmmm, things seem to be blowing up over the showmatch thing. I wonder what idra and EG have to say about it.
On February 13 2012 14:26 Antimatterz wrote:
I'm not gonna lie, playing zerg right now actually is fucking hell. I'm extremely close to taking a long, peaceful break and just not playing Starcraft for a while. ZvP feels almost impossible to win, terrans are much better at abusing cheese or strategies than they used to, and ZvZ is still stressful as hell. There is only one zerg in Code S now (DongRaeGu), 4 toss, and 3 terrans. All of the zergs that I thought would advance have gone to Code A, and might be knocked to Code B. I have only seen one zerg beat a toss in GSL so far (DongRaeGu, but I know there are a few other series zergs won, just haven't found them yet). People are bitching about how IdrA is just giving up, and that he sucks, and that he is going to drop off the face of the earth.
IdrA wouldn't be practicing in Korea, with SLAYERS FOR GODS SAKE, if he was giving up. IdrA wouldn't be playing these showmatches if he was giving up. Explain to me how someone is bad if they are top 100 Korean GM. Sure, IdrA may be in a slump. But a lot of fucking zergs are in a slump right now. IdrA has been in Korea only a 2 months, and your expecting him to beat the highest caliber of Korean on the planet. He is probably putting more effort and time into Starcraft than you have put into almost anything in life right now, and your talking about how your "no longer a fan after seeing him cheese".
Its basically what I did. I got really tired of losing ZvPs to the same stupid blink stalker plays, so I just decided to reduce my playing time until I see someone with a ZvP strategy that works.
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I'm not gonna lie, playing zerg right now actually is fucking hell. I'm extremely close to taking a long, peaceful break and just not playing Starcraft for a while. ZvP feels almost impossible to win, terrans are much better at abusing cheese or strategies than they used to, and ZvZ is still stressful as hell. There is only one zerg in Code S now (DongRaeGu), 4 toss, and 3 terrans. All of the zergs that I thought would advance have gone to Code A, and might be knocked to Code B. I have only seen one zerg beat a toss in GSL so far (DongRaeGu, but I know there are a few other series zergs won, just haven't found them yet). People are bitching about how IdrA is just giving up, and that he sucks, and that he is going to drop off the face of the earth.
IdrA wouldn't be practicing in Korea, with SLAYERS FOR GODS SAKE, if he was giving up. IdrA wouldn't be playing these showmatches if he was giving up. Explain to me how someone is bad if they are top 100 Korean GM. Sure, IdrA may be in a slump. But a lot of fucking zergs are in a slump right now. IdrA has been in Korea only a 2 months, and your expecting him to beat the highest caliber of Korean on the planet. He is probably putting more effort and time into Starcraft than you have put into almost anything in life right now, and your talking about how your "no longer a fan after seeing him cheese".
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On February 13 2012 14:26 Antimatterz wrote:
I'm not gonna lie, playing zerg right now actually is fucking hell. I'm extremely close to taking a long, peaceful break and just not playing Starcraft for a while. ZvP feels almost impossible to win, terrans are much better at abusing cheese or strategies than they used to, and ZvZ is still stressful as hell. There is only one zerg in Code S now (DongRaeGu), 4 toss, and 3 terrans. All of the zergs that I thought would advance have gone to Code A, and might be knocked to Code B. I have only seen one zerg beat a toss in GSL so far (DongRaeGu, but I know there are a few other series zergs won, just haven't found them yet). People are bitching about how IdrA is just giving up, and that he sucks, and that he is going to drop off the face of the earth.
IdrA wouldn't be practicing in Korea, with SLAYERS FOR GODS SAKE, if he was giving up. IdrA wouldn't be playing these showmatches if he was giving up. Explain to me how someone is bad if they are top 100 Korean GM. Sure, IdrA may be in a slump. But a lot of fucking zergs are in a slump right now. IdrA has been in Korea only a 2 months, and your expecting him to beat the highest caliber of Korean on the planet. He is probably putting more effort and time into Starcraft than you have put into almost anything in life right now, and your talking about how your "no longer a fan after seeing him cheese".
I'm fine with IdrA losing to a top terran like aLive - even 0-4. He is #2 on KR ladder and in RO8 in this season of GSL. He is a lot better than IdrA. The most disappointing thing here is how IdrA lost/played.
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I don't mean to offend anyone but, am I the only one who'd like to see him switch back to Terran like in BW? I just have this strange feeling that it's his calling. A Terran with crazy mechanics would be a sight to see. Sometimes when you're struggling a change is necessary, not saying that's the case here but it's a suggestion.
I watched some of the matches in BW he had and he looked really awesome. Just thinking out loud.
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i think maybe its time that idra needs to be reminded that he chose this path. since he made such a decision, he must comply with it.
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The reason people are upset with Idra right now is because he blatantly gave up on the series. The first six pool, maybe it was planned (probably not), the second there was no way he went into that game thinking he'd win with a six pool. At best he was hoping that alive would proxy rax or cc first. Which is just Idra rolling dice to see who would win, which I personally think is absolutely dumb, and Idra does too. Its all he ever says about cheesy/all inny players.
If it was a different player who wasn't as adamant about how dumb players who essentially go for build order wins then maybe you could make the case that he was legitimately trying to win. But with how well documented Idra's thoughts on that type of play style are, I have trouble believing anyone sincerely believes he put his best effort in. I'm sure Idra himself would just say it was a joke series so he played it like a joke.
That being said I'm not really offended, just disappointed. I'm more upset and just amazed at the extent some of the fan boys will go in here in their denial.
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EPT
