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Anime Discussion Thread - Page 3930

Forum Index > Media & Entertainment
Post a Reply
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If you come in here looking for "anime recommendations" then please refer to this chart before posting: Anime Recommendations (as of may 2014). We also have an IRC channel called #tladt where we all hang out. The channel is on Rizon, not QuakeNet! Feel free to check it out. TLADT discord is Discord.gg

For currently airing anime, please see Anichart.net
Ryuhou)aS(
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
United States1174 Posts
July 01 2014 03:22 GMT
#78581
On July 01 2014 12:13 Sentenal wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 01 2014 11:51 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 11:22 Sentenal wrote:
On July 01 2014 09:22 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
Maybe we wouldn't have to go so far as completely overhauling the rec list, but i think like a 2-3 sentence description for each would go a long way. Sort of like the season list has.

Not happening, that list was remade not too long ago anyway. They already have enough description as far as genre goes, its not there to completely spoon-feed people.


but but but....I want the glorious pleasure of being spoon-fed by the Great and Wonderful Sentenal >.<

Done
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/234486-sentenals-guide-to-mecha
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/332650-sentenals-guide-to-gundam


+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]



Now i feel bad that you took that 2 seconds to copy+paste those. But a beautiful response considering Mecha is like the one genre I have a hard time getting into. You win this battle Sent...BUT THE WAR SHALL BE MINE!!!!
BW. There will always be a special place in my heart for the game I spent 10 years to be mediocre at.
BLinD-RawR
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
ALLEYCAT BLUES50196 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-01 03:30:50
July 01 2014 03:27 GMT
#78582
On July 01 2014 12:22 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 01 2014 12:13 Sentenal wrote:
On July 01 2014 11:51 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 11:22 Sentenal wrote:
On July 01 2014 09:22 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
Maybe we wouldn't have to go so far as completely overhauling the rec list, but i think like a 2-3 sentence description for each would go a long way. Sort of like the season list has.

Not happening, that list was remade not too long ago anyway. They already have enough description as far as genre goes, its not there to completely spoon-feed people.


but but but....I want the glorious pleasure of being spoon-fed by the Great and Wonderful Sentenal >.<

Done
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/234486-sentenals-guide-to-mecha
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/332650-sentenals-guide-to-gundam


+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]



Now i feel bad that you took that 2 seconds to copy+paste those. But a beautiful response considering Mecha is like the one genre I have a hard time getting into. You win this battle Sent...BUT THE WAR SHALL BE MINE!!!!


anyone who doesn't like mecha must be banished from this realm.

who doesn't love Giant robots going pew pew and swish swish.
On July 01 2014 10:31 goody153 wrote:
Clearly zerg needs "FUN"


this is the third time you said it but the joke still isn't funny, not enough punch.
Brood War EICWoo Jung Ho, never forget.| Twitter: @BLinDRawR
TL+ Member
BigFan
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
TLADT24920 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-01 03:41:24
July 01 2014 03:35 GMT
#78583
On July 01 2014 12:27 BLinD-RawR wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 01 2014 12:22 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:13 Sentenal wrote:
On July 01 2014 11:51 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 11:22 Sentenal wrote:
On July 01 2014 09:22 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
Maybe we wouldn't have to go so far as completely overhauling the rec list, but i think like a 2-3 sentence description for each would go a long way. Sort of like the season list has.

Not happening, that list was remade not too long ago anyway. They already have enough description as far as genre goes, its not there to completely spoon-feed people.


but but but....I want the glorious pleasure of being spoon-fed by the Great and Wonderful Sentenal >.<

Done
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/234486-sentenals-guide-to-mecha
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/332650-sentenals-guide-to-gundam


+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]



Now i feel bad that you took that 2 seconds to copy+paste those. But a beautiful response considering Mecha is like the one genre I have a hard time getting into. You win this battle Sent...BUT THE WAR SHALL BE MINE!!!!


anyone who doesn't like mecha must be banished from this realm.

who doesn't love Giant robots going pew pew and swish swish.
Show nested quote +
On July 01 2014 10:31 goody153 wrote:
Clearly zerg needs "FUN"


this is the third time you said it but the joke still isn't funny, not enough punch.

punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch!

Is this enough, BR?

TLADT Commandment 1: Thou shall watch and enjoy mech lest you be labelled an outcast! lol.

ps what's the origin of your name? For some reason, I keep thinking of this when I read your name lol.
Former BW EiC"Watch Bakemonogatari or I will kill you." -Toad, April 18th, 2017
Ryuhou)aS(
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
United States1174 Posts
July 01 2014 03:47 GMT
#78584
On July 01 2014 12:35 BigFan wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 01 2014 12:27 BLinD-RawR wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:22 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:13 Sentenal wrote:
On July 01 2014 11:51 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 11:22 Sentenal wrote:
On July 01 2014 09:22 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
Maybe we wouldn't have to go so far as completely overhauling the rec list, but i think like a 2-3 sentence description for each would go a long way. Sort of like the season list has.

Not happening, that list was remade not too long ago anyway. They already have enough description as far as genre goes, its not there to completely spoon-feed people.


but but but....I want the glorious pleasure of being spoon-fed by the Great and Wonderful Sentenal >.<

Done
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/234486-sentenals-guide-to-mecha
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/332650-sentenals-guide-to-gundam


+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]



Now i feel bad that you took that 2 seconds to copy+paste those. But a beautiful response considering Mecha is like the one genre I have a hard time getting into. You win this battle Sent...BUT THE WAR SHALL BE MINE!!!!


anyone who doesn't like mecha must be banished from this realm.

who doesn't love Giant robots going pew pew and swish swish.
On July 01 2014 10:31 goody153 wrote:
Clearly zerg needs "FUN"


this is the third time you said it but the joke still isn't funny, not enough punch.

punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch!

Is this enough, BR?

TLADT Commandment 1: Thou shall watch and enjoy mech lest you be labelled an outcast! lol.

ps what's the origin of your name? For some reason, I keep thinking of this when I read your name lol.


that's ok, I don't mind being labeled outcast. Pariah of TLADT, the vagrant exile Ryuhou~!

come at me!
BW. There will always be a special place in my heart for the game I spent 10 years to be mediocre at.
BigFan
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
TLADT24920 Posts
July 01 2014 03:57 GMT
#78585
On July 01 2014 12:47 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 01 2014 12:35 BigFan wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:27 BLinD-RawR wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:22 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:13 Sentenal wrote:
On July 01 2014 11:51 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 11:22 Sentenal wrote:
On July 01 2014 09:22 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
Maybe we wouldn't have to go so far as completely overhauling the rec list, but i think like a 2-3 sentence description for each would go a long way. Sort of like the season list has.

Not happening, that list was remade not too long ago anyway. They already have enough description as far as genre goes, its not there to completely spoon-feed people.


but but but....I want the glorious pleasure of being spoon-fed by the Great and Wonderful Sentenal >.<

Done
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/234486-sentenals-guide-to-mecha
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/332650-sentenals-guide-to-gundam


+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]



Now i feel bad that you took that 2 seconds to copy+paste those. But a beautiful response considering Mecha is like the one genre I have a hard time getting into. You win this battle Sent...BUT THE WAR SHALL BE MINE!!!!


anyone who doesn't like mecha must be banished from this realm.

who doesn't love Giant robots going pew pew and swish swish.
On July 01 2014 10:31 goody153 wrote:
Clearly zerg needs "FUN"


this is the third time you said it but the joke still isn't funny, not enough punch.

punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch!

Is this enough, BR?

TLADT Commandment 1: Thou shall watch and enjoy mech lest you be labelled an outcast! lol.

ps what's the origin of your name? For some reason, I keep thinking of this when I read your name lol.


that's ok, I don't mind being labeled outcast. Pariah of TLADT, the vagrant exile Ryuhou~!

come at me!

No need to get involved. I'll just let the rest of TLADT lecture you on why you should like mech while I sit back with popcorn and watch the drama unfold
Former BW EiC"Watch Bakemonogatari or I will kill you." -Toad, April 18th, 2017
Slaughter
Profile Blog Joined November 2003
United States20254 Posts
July 01 2014 04:04 GMT
#78586
I don't really like mecha, although I do indulge in it once in a while.
Never Knows Best.
Ryuhou)aS(
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
United States1174 Posts
July 01 2014 04:05 GMT
#78587
On July 01 2014 12:57 BigFan wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 01 2014 12:47 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:35 BigFan wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:27 BLinD-RawR wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:22 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:13 Sentenal wrote:
On July 01 2014 11:51 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 11:22 Sentenal wrote:
On July 01 2014 09:22 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
Maybe we wouldn't have to go so far as completely overhauling the rec list, but i think like a 2-3 sentence description for each would go a long way. Sort of like the season list has.

Not happening, that list was remade not too long ago anyway. They already have enough description as far as genre goes, its not there to completely spoon-feed people.


but but but....I want the glorious pleasure of being spoon-fed by the Great and Wonderful Sentenal >.<

Done
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/234486-sentenals-guide-to-mecha
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/332650-sentenals-guide-to-gundam


+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]



Now i feel bad that you took that 2 seconds to copy+paste those. But a beautiful response considering Mecha is like the one genre I have a hard time getting into. You win this battle Sent...BUT THE WAR SHALL BE MINE!!!!


anyone who doesn't like mecha must be banished from this realm.

who doesn't love Giant robots going pew pew and swish swish.
On July 01 2014 10:31 goody153 wrote:
Clearly zerg needs "FUN"


this is the third time you said it but the joke still isn't funny, not enough punch.

punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch!

Is this enough, BR?

TLADT Commandment 1: Thou shall watch and enjoy mech lest you be labelled an outcast! lol.

ps what's the origin of your name? For some reason, I keep thinking of this when I read your name lol.


that's ok, I don't mind being labeled outcast. Pariah of TLADT, the vagrant exile Ryuhou~!

come at me!

No need to get involved. I'll just let the rest of TLADT lecture you on why you should like mech while I sit back with popcorn and watch the drama unfold


Not Fair!!!! Gimme popcorn!!
BW. There will always be a special place in my heart for the game I spent 10 years to be mediocre at.
BigFan
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
TLADT24920 Posts
July 01 2014 04:09 GMT
#78588
On July 01 2014 13:04 Slaughter wrote:
I really like mecha so I do indulge in it once in a while.

ftfy

On July 01 2014 13:05 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 01 2014 12:57 BigFan wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:47 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:35 BigFan wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:27 BLinD-RawR wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:22 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:13 Sentenal wrote:
On July 01 2014 11:51 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 11:22 Sentenal wrote:
On July 01 2014 09:22 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
Maybe we wouldn't have to go so far as completely overhauling the rec list, but i think like a 2-3 sentence description for each would go a long way. Sort of like the season list has.

Not happening, that list was remade not too long ago anyway. They already have enough description as far as genre goes, its not there to completely spoon-feed people.


but but but....I want the glorious pleasure of being spoon-fed by the Great and Wonderful Sentenal >.<

Done
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/234486-sentenals-guide-to-mecha
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/332650-sentenals-guide-to-gundam


+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]



Now i feel bad that you took that 2 seconds to copy+paste those. But a beautiful response considering Mecha is like the one genre I have a hard time getting into. You win this battle Sent...BUT THE WAR SHALL BE MINE!!!!


anyone who doesn't like mecha must be banished from this realm.

who doesn't love Giant robots going pew pew and swish swish.
On July 01 2014 10:31 goody153 wrote:
Clearly zerg needs "FUN"


this is the third time you said it but the joke still isn't funny, not enough punch.

punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch!

Is this enough, BR?

TLADT Commandment 1: Thou shall watch and enjoy mech lest you be labelled an outcast! lol.

ps what's the origin of your name? For some reason, I keep thinking of this when I read your name lol.


that's ok, I don't mind being labeled outcast. Pariah of TLADT, the vagrant exile Ryuhou~!

come at me!

No need to get involved. I'll just let the rest of TLADT lecture you on why you should like mech while I sit back with popcorn and watch the drama unfold


Not Fair!!!! Gimme popcorn!!

only after you watch Knights of Sidonia
Former BW EiC"Watch Bakemonogatari or I will kill you." -Toad, April 18th, 2017
Sentenal
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States12398 Posts
July 01 2014 04:50 GMT
#78589
While Mecha is clearly the ultimate genre, its okay if people don't like it. Just as long as they understand that it makes their taste inferior.
"Apparently, Sentenal is a paragon of friendship and tolerance. " - Ech0ne
Ryuhou)aS(
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
United States1174 Posts
July 01 2014 04:57 GMT
#78590
On July 01 2014 13:09 BigFan wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 01 2014 13:04 Slaughter wrote:
I really like mecha so I do indulge in it once in a while.

ftfy

Show nested quote +
On July 01 2014 13:05 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:57 BigFan wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:47 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:35 BigFan wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:27 BLinD-RawR wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:22 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:13 Sentenal wrote:
On July 01 2014 11:51 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 11:22 Sentenal wrote:
[quote]
Not happening, that list was remade not too long ago anyway. They already have enough description as far as genre goes, its not there to completely spoon-feed people.


but but but....I want the glorious pleasure of being spoon-fed by the Great and Wonderful Sentenal >.<

Done
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/234486-sentenals-guide-to-mecha
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/332650-sentenals-guide-to-gundam


+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]



Now i feel bad that you took that 2 seconds to copy+paste those. But a beautiful response considering Mecha is like the one genre I have a hard time getting into. You win this battle Sent...BUT THE WAR SHALL BE MINE!!!!


anyone who doesn't like mecha must be banished from this realm.

who doesn't love Giant robots going pew pew and swish swish.
On July 01 2014 10:31 goody153 wrote:
Clearly zerg needs "FUN"


this is the third time you said it but the joke still isn't funny, not enough punch.

punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch!

Is this enough, BR?

TLADT Commandment 1: Thou shall watch and enjoy mech lest you be labelled an outcast! lol.

ps what's the origin of your name? For some reason, I keep thinking of this when I read your name lol.


that's ok, I don't mind being labeled outcast. Pariah of TLADT, the vagrant exile Ryuhou~!

come at me!

No need to get involved. I'll just let the rest of TLADT lecture you on why you should like mech while I sit back with popcorn and watch the drama unfold


Not Fair!!!! Gimme popcorn!!

only after you watch Knights of Sidonia


I believe it's on my plan to watch list...I'll get there eventually


On July 01 2014 13:50 Sentenal wrote:
While Mecha is clearly the ultimate genre, its okay if people don't like it. Just as long as they understand that it makes their taste inferior.


Well, coming here already makes me feel like I have no taste so this doesnt really bother me. I'll still like the things I like (basically everything but mecha) and maybe one day I'll work mecha into that. But not today.
BW. There will always be a special place in my heart for the game I spent 10 years to be mediocre at.
XenOmega
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Canada2822 Posts
July 01 2014 05:15 GMT
#78591
On July 01 2014 11:10 Slaughter wrote:
Yo Goody, don't be hatin' on Ahh! My Goddess. Its average at its worst and slightly above average at times.


Xen, Read the manga for Knights of Sidonia: It explains more. Also I think the reactor that burns corpses doesn't burn all those you mentioned I think it was a joke when that was said.



Yea, I read all of the manga. The waiting is killing me though (as for most manga who are being published)

No!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!, don't joke
BigFan
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
TLADT24920 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-01 05:25:48
July 01 2014 05:24 GMT
#78592
@Ryu take however much time you want lol.

On July 01 2014 14:15 XenOmega wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 01 2014 11:10 Slaughter wrote:
Yo Goody, don't be hatin' on Ahh! My Goddess. Its average at its worst and slightly above average at times.


Xen, Read the manga for Knights of Sidonia: It explains more. Also I think the reactor that burns corpses doesn't burn all those you mentioned I think it was a joke when that was said.



Yea, I read all of the manga. The waiting is killing me though (as for most manga who are being published)

No!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!, don't joke

lol. What's the best site for the manga? Like most accurate translation? I'm still deciding if I should wait till November for season 2 or just take the plunge and read the manga now while I'm still interested. btw, I started watching Terra e, first episode though but looks good so far!
Former BW EiC"Watch Bakemonogatari or I will kill you." -Toad, April 18th, 2017
Sentenal
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States12398 Posts
July 01 2014 05:38 GMT
#78593
I had to look up what Terra e was. For a show that doesn't seem too far off from LOGH (at least superficially), I've never heard it mentioned once when people ask for things similar to it. I wonder if thats a bad thing, or if Terra e is different enough to not fit in there?
"Apparently, Sentenal is a paragon of friendship and tolerance. " - Ech0ne
BLinD-RawR
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
ALLEYCAT BLUES50196 Posts
July 01 2014 05:40 GMT
#78594
On July 01 2014 12:35 BigFan wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 01 2014 12:27 BLinD-RawR wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:22 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 12:13 Sentenal wrote:
On July 01 2014 11:51 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
On July 01 2014 11:22 Sentenal wrote:
On July 01 2014 09:22 Ryuhou)aS( wrote:
Maybe we wouldn't have to go so far as completely overhauling the rec list, but i think like a 2-3 sentence description for each would go a long way. Sort of like the season list has.

Not happening, that list was remade not too long ago anyway. They already have enough description as far as genre goes, its not there to completely spoon-feed people.


but but but....I want the glorious pleasure of being spoon-fed by the Great and Wonderful Sentenal >.<

Done
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/234486-sentenals-guide-to-mecha
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/332650-sentenals-guide-to-gundam


+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]



Now i feel bad that you took that 2 seconds to copy+paste those. But a beautiful response considering Mecha is like the one genre I have a hard time getting into. You win this battle Sent...BUT THE WAR SHALL BE MINE!!!!


anyone who doesn't like mecha must be banished from this realm.

who doesn't love Giant robots going pew pew and swish swish.
On July 01 2014 10:31 goody153 wrote:
Clearly zerg needs "FUN"


this is the third time you said it but the joke still isn't funny, not enough punch.

punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch!

Is this enough, BR?

TLADT Commandment 1: Thou shall watch and enjoy mech lest you be labelled an outcast! lol.

ps what's the origin of your name? For some reason, I keep thinking of this when I read your name lol.


theres a story, but I'm just gonna give you the short short version.

I was 12.
Brood War EICWoo Jung Ho, never forget.| Twitter: @BLinDRawR
TL+ Member
Slaughter
Profile Blog Joined November 2003
United States20254 Posts
July 01 2014 07:23 GMT
#78595
On June 30 2014 08:56 Sentenal wrote:
For the record, any anime that has a toaster in it is also mecha anime, because toasters are considered mecha.


This makes me want to look for toasters in every show I watch then troll tag them as mecha on MAL if they do.
Never Knows Best.
Nagisama
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Canada4481 Posts
July 01 2014 07:39 GMT
#78596
On July 01 2014 16:23 Slaughter wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 30 2014 08:56 Sentenal wrote:
For the record, any anime that has a toaster in it is also mecha anime, because toasters are considered mecha.


This makes me want to look for toasters in every show I watch then troll tag them as mecha on MAL if they do.

Every highschool anime is now mecha, because the first scene always has MC running to school late with toast in their mouth.
Calendar"Everyone who has accomplished more than you has no life; Everyone who has accomplished less than you is a noob." | Elem: "nagi is actually really smart"
Slaughter
Profile Blog Joined November 2003
United States20254 Posts
July 01 2014 07:42 GMT
#78597
The patron Saint of Mecha sanctioned it so its legit.
Never Knows Best.
KazeHydra
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Japan2788 Posts
July 01 2014 07:47 GMT
#78598
We already established Lucky Star as a classic example of such mecha.
"Because I know this promise that won’t disappear will turn even a cause of tears into strength. You taught me that if I can believe, there is nothing that cannot come true." - Nana Mizuki (Yakusoku) 17:36 ils kaze got me into nana 17:36 ils by his blog
Slaughter
Profile Blog Joined November 2003
United States20254 Posts
July 01 2014 08:59 GMT
#78599
We'll the Tonari no Kaibutsu anime was pretty bare bones but what can you expect from 13 episodes I guess. Really does give off that feel of just being an advertisement for the manga.
Never Knows Best.
BigFan
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
TLADT24920 Posts
July 01 2014 09:10 GMT
#78600
XenOmega, loving Terra e so far! I thought the pacing was a bit fast, too many characters introduced at once etc... but things seems to be fine for now. I'm on episode 8 now:
+ Show Spoiler +
Loved when Jomy awakened his power, so awesome! Reminds me of dbz and all the other animes that had a similar awakening. Never gets old to see :D I do feel bad for him having all that truth revealed at once, must've been a shock. So far, the characters have had clear roles and such. I like how grand everything feels though the whole erasing the memory to become an adult is a bit much. It's like, what? Guess it makes sense that parents are saddened by their kids doing the examination.

I see what the rebellion is. Keith, an interesting character. Good on Shiroe for trying to get him to feel things lol. I'm enjoying his valiant efforts and it seems to be working so far. Wonder when Jomy will come in again with the Mu. I want to see more fights! :D
Former BW EiC"Watch Bakemonogatari or I will kill you." -Toad, April 18th, 2017
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