General Discussion - Page 4857

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Dead9

United States4725 Posts

February 20 2014 21:55 GMT

#97121

i don't think there's any time you ever want to shift queue unless you're trying to hide in the trees after casting a spell
sof -> remnant literally never even returns you to where you cast sof from, if you shift queue i assume it starts the blink after the sof, though i've never tried it

and idk about the pudge thing but a lot of heroes can't do anything to him. for example rubick can't lift and his cast point is tiny
even in the link yango posted you can see that am doesn't get very far on his blink

Jaeger

United States1150 Posts

February 20 2014 22:27 GMT

#97122

On February 21 2014 06:55 Dead9 wrote:
i don't think there's any time you ever want to shift queue unless you're trying to hide in the trees after casting a spell
sof -> remnant literally never even returns you to where you cast sof from

Unless you cast it too early and you're hitting multiple targets.
Go into a practice game create 5 enemies SoF them and remnant immediately or after 1-2 jumps and you'll go to the remnant and then get teleported back to the start of SoF.

http://dev.dota2.com/showthread.php?t=114481

Erasme

Bahamas15899 Posts

February 20 2014 22:54 GMT

#97123

Well you just need to get the jump on him and he will die 100%

Z-BosoN

Brazil2590 Posts

February 20 2014 23:34 GMT

#97124

Can someone please explain all the $322 references? I'm lost =(

crms

United States11933 Posts

February 20 2014 23:36 GMT

#97125

On February 21 2014 08:34 Z-BosoN wrote:
Can someone please explain all the $322 references? I'm lost =(

Solo bet against his own team for $100 in some tournament and threw the game which net him $322 in winnings. He was caught and banned for awhile from playing in tournaments and kicked off his team. He's back now so everyone trolls him about it.

Z-BosoN

Brazil2590 Posts

February 20 2014 23:46 GMT

#97126

thanks!

PassiveAce

United States18076 Posts

February 21 2014 00:06 GMT

#97127

In American sports history, athletes who cheat to lose have been crucified. They are respected even less then people who cheat to win. Its so god damn funny to me that roxkis would rehire him.

hariooo

Canada2830 Posts

February 21 2014 00:17 GMT

#97128

On February 21 2014 06:42 Jaeger wrote:

Show nested quote +

On February 21 2014 06:06 hariooo wrote:

On February 21 2014 05:02 Jaeger wrote:

On February 21 2014 03:53 hariooo wrote:

On February 21 2014 03:32 Jaeger wrote:

On February 21 2014 00:05 hariooo wrote:

On February 20 2014 18:33 Jaeger wrote:

On February 20 2014 10:09 hariooo wrote:

On February 20 2014 06:38 Jaeger wrote:

On February 19 2014 20:02 govie wrote:
[quote]

I think you guys forget his big assets, ult and SoF. If someone has some level of gamesence its hard to kill an ember,

Although in some situations SoF makes killing ember easier given that it returns to a fixed point you may find an arrow or a black hole waiting on you in some situations.

Ember Spirit has a cast point of 0. Played properly by shift-queuing remnants after SoF, it is not a foregone conclusion that SoF will be punished, at least by skills that require such as Sacred Arrow.

If you only hit 1-3 targets he completes an animation before executing anything shift-queued.

If you hit more targets he doesn't do the animation but if your remnant is behind you he turns before jumping.
I can land pudge hooks between SoF and the shift-queue jump pretty easily.
(FWIW it also seems pudge hook can hit him during SoF and does nothing, basically wasting the hook)

If you issue a move command towards your remnant behind you during SoF he'll come back facing the remnant and be able to jump instantly but you can't shift queue that jump because he'll finish the move command before doing the jump.

Basically looks like right clicking towards your remnant during SoF and jumping to the remnant without queuing is the fastest and pretty sure the timing of that is not going to be instant.

Hook is one of the least dangerous skills for Ember to worry about. I have literally never been solo killed by a Pudge as Ember. Pudge has zero way of guaranteeing the Dismember post-Hook. Like I said, 0 cast-time on Remnant. You don't have to time it, just spam it.

Except for if the hook hits during ember turning towards the remnant he gets hooked, the remnant explodes, and you have no remnant and no SoF.

Anyways hook is just an example the point being if you're just shift-queuing your jump after SoF you can get hit.

FWIW there is a way to avoid the turn animation and shift-queue the jump still.

SoF in, right click towards remnant, press stop, shift-queue jump.
i.e. W, left-click, right-click, S, D, shift + left-click

No one is talking about dodging Hook here? I'm saying Ember gets hit by the Hook (which requires proper timing by Pudge in the first place) and you spam Remnant, at which point you jump before the Dismember 100% of the time without external support.

And I'm saying if you get hit by the hook you don't have a Remnant to escape to.

Anyways like I said hook is just an example, replace hook with sacred arrow or dragon tail or anything else instant or precastable (silence or stun).

Your entire premise is that the Ember is going to shift-queue his Remnant after SoF and waste it by having it proc before Hook hits him.

This entire discussion is based on you saying ember can just shift-queue remnant after SoF and be fine.

Show nested quote +

You mean DK has to press W and then spam click on the spot where ember will return to after SoF.
However the jump does still go through and he's stunned at the remnant location for some reason.

"Played properly by shift-queuing remnants after SoF, it is not a foregone conclusion that SoF will be punished" is my exact quote. So please don't misrepresent me.

And come on if that DK can just stand next to the cast location for potentially 1-3 seconds (5-15 targets for SoF) just spamming stun without doing anything else, the fight is probably already decided anyway.

Dead9

United States4725 Posts

February 21 2014 01:36 GMT

#97129

On February 21 2014 07:27 Jaeger wrote:

Show nested quote +

i know, i'm assuming ember is timing it properly
it's not really that hard with a bit of practice

Dead9

United States4725 Posts

February 21 2014 01:36 GMT

#97130

On February 21 2014 09:17 hariooo wrote:

Show nested quote +

On February 21 2014 06:42 Jaeger wrote:

On February 21 2014 06:06 hariooo wrote:

On February 21 2014 05:02 Jaeger wrote:

On February 21 2014 03:53 hariooo wrote:

On February 21 2014 03:32 Jaeger wrote:

On February 21 2014 00:05 hariooo wrote:

On February 20 2014 18:33 Jaeger wrote:

On February 20 2014 10:09 hariooo wrote:

On February 20 2014 06:38 Jaeger wrote:
[quote]

Although in some situations SoF makes killing ember easier given that it returns to a fixed point you may find an arrow or a black hole waiting on you in some situations.

Your entire premise is that the Ember is going to shift-queue his Remnant after SoF and waste it by having it proc before Hook hits him.

This entire discussion is based on you saying ember can just shift-queue remnant after SoF and be fine.

On February 21 2014 06:06 hariooo wrote:
Mirana has a chance but DK actually has no chance to land Dragon Tail, due to targeting speed. He has to click on the skill and then the hero while Ember has to click his skill then literally anywhere else on the screen. Guess who wins that race?

You mean DK has to press W and then spam click on the spot where ember will return to after SoF.
However the jump does still go through and he's stunned at the remnant location for some reason.

dk's stun is ranged in dragon form
anyways this is pointless don't shift queue remnants problem solved

Nevuk

United States16280 Posts

February 21 2014 01:51 GMT

#97131

Is anyone else getting absurd packet loss (ie 60%+) to us east right now?
edit -
I just ran a ping test and every other server is normal but US east returns "ERROR"

Shaella

United States14828 Posts

February 21 2014 01:55 GMT

#97132

totally.

Jinxed

United States6450 Posts

February 21 2014 02:05 GMT

#97133

On February 21 2014 10:51 Nevuk wrote:
Is anyone else getting absurd packet loss (ie 60%+) to us east right now?
edit -
I just ran a ping test and every other server is normal but US east returns "ERROR"

Just got kicked out of a game completely and that was after a huge lag spike.