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On October 06 2013 11:17 Mataza wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2013 10:38 Bippzy wrote:
Hey guys I was a PL with CM AND KOTL on my team(and Zeus and Centaur). best game ever right?
anyhow I farmed much and got diffusal and the other team started five manning us. They were Enigma, WD, Storm Spirit, Dark Seer, and one other.
Basically they started forcing fights before I got manta(And heart) and my team started blaming me for us losing, saying I couldn't carry. Given this was an all random game, I can't really complain about the picks. Doesn't the other team have too much teamfight for us to win? I and my team was blown up instantly everytime a battle started. Was it really my fault? Theorycrafting is fine and dandy, but my first concern is that in all random you are never sure someone can play his own hero. People always think they can(and blame the weaknesses of their play on the hero "Leshrac sucks" etc.). The point is that your team has 3 really squishy heroes and they have storm and 2 stunners for followups/safety. Their combination doesn't require much coordination since they can just go 5man and do ok, while your team needs to coordinate better and walk together just for safety reason(besides centaur nobody should be able to survive any engagement alone). Many pub players lack the discipline or the will to play ratdota/teamfight avoiding. There is probably one of those in the 4 other people of your team in any game. In short: you win some, you lose some, people like to blame someone else.
Rat doto is incredibly punishing and tiring to play. It feels like you're losing the entire time, until you manage to make a miracle comeback and win. It should be expected that people struggle with it. But you CAN lead them there. It just takes a lot of talking. Buy wards, lay them to mark out an area that your team can safely farm in, show your team what movements they should be making, CONSTANTLY draw their attention to where the enemy team is. I've done this, so it's not impossible. It just takes a lot out of you.
It's amazing that team captains do this every single game.
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I know that ratdota is possible in pubs, it just takes discipline as I said.
I have never seen it played out properly in pubs though, as surely one of ten people will get impatient before it comes to fruition. I had enough when I played an inhouse that took 20 minutes(I am not exaggerating) to finish after the losing side couldn't possibly recover. The losing team had Naga Siren and Elder Titan and boy was it boring to push their high ground with only manta illusions and visage's revenants.
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On October 06 2013 11:42 Mataza wrote:
I know that ratdota is possible in pubs, it just takes discipline as I said.
I have never seen it played out properly in pubs though, as surely one of ten people will get impatient before it comes to fruition. I had enough when I played an inhouse that took 20 minutes(I am not exaggerating) to finish after the losing side couldn't possibly recover. The losing team had Naga Siren and Elder Titan and boy was it boring to push their high ground with only manta illusions and visage's revenants.
What heroes did you have? To the best of my knowledge, the best answer to that situation is to farm until every hero has BoTs and then triple splitpush. If they go on any one side, Travels are your friend!
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i wish one of my friends was a good chen player so we could do chen + meepo.
chen + meepo is so legit
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On October 06 2013 09:50 Mataza wrote:Did IF change the default values of hero-type damage towards fortified-type armor? It has been so long I honestly don't remember. I know I used this frozen throne site for any of those mechanics questions, but I know IF messed with some of those numbers, at least chaos-type damage(jungle creeps like centaor khan did/do chaos-type damage and those do only 40-50% against tower armor. Opposed to real chaos damage which is 100% against everything.)
The dota numbers are vastly different from ladder. You're better off using the playdota table. The hero -> fort is one of the few damage values that wasn't changed.
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i wasn't expecting dota demon to cry on stream.
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On October 06 2013 11:46 Acritter wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2013 11:42 Mataza wrote:
I know that ratdota is possible in pubs, it just takes discipline as I said.
I have never seen it played out properly in pubs though, as surely one of ten people will get impatient before it comes to fruition. I had enough when I played an inhouse that took 20 minutes(I am not exaggerating) to finish after the losing side couldn't possibly recover. The losing team had Naga Siren and Elder Titan and boy was it boring to push their high ground with only manta illusions and visage's revenants.
What heroes did you have? To the best of my knowledge, the best answer to that situation is to farm until every hero has BoTs and then triple splitpush. If they go on any one side, Travels are your friend!
They were contained in their base for 20 minutes. As in their creeps make it down the ramp and then get immediately killed.
We just couldn't take a high ground fight against naga/titan bullshit. Titan even got refresher. Then there were 3 other heroes on top of it, but I don't remember from the top of my head.
It was interesting to play it out to the end, with only chipping damage to their base. My curiosity is forever sated though, because it was boring as hell.
It got a little faster after they lost their first baracks, but not as much as you think.
Pro teams usually gg out before the long siege happens. Remember ig vs DK, longest game of dota 2? DK could have won, but I am sure it would have taken literally 40 more minutes of chipping away at the base. Even DK didn't have the patience to play that out.
On October 06 2013 12:28 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2013 09:50 Mataza wrote:Did IF change the default values of hero-type damage towards fortified-type armor? It has been so long I honestly don't remember. I know I used this frozen throne site for any of those mechanics questions, but I know IF messed with some of those numbers, at least chaos-type damage(jungle creeps like centaor khan did/do chaos-type damage and those do only 40-50% against tower armor. Opposed to real chaos damage which is 100% against everything.) The dota numbers are vastly different from ladder. You're better off using the playdota table. The hero -> fort is one of the few damage values that wasn't changed.
Thanks for the table. Didn't think there would be one. (Icefraud never documents his changes hue hue etc.)
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On October 06 2013 12:45 Mataza wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2013 11:46 Acritter wrote:On October 06 2013 11:42 Mataza wrote:
I know that ratdota is possible in pubs, it just takes discipline as I said.
I have never seen it played out properly in pubs though, as surely one of ten people will get impatient before it comes to fruition. I had enough when I played an inhouse that took 20 minutes(I am not exaggerating) to finish after the losing side couldn't possibly recover. The losing team had Naga Siren and Elder Titan and boy was it boring to push their high ground with only manta illusions and visage's revenants.
What heroes did you have? To the best of my knowledge, the best answer to that situation is to farm until every hero has BoTs and then triple splitpush. If they go on any one side, Travels are your friend! They were contained in their base for 20 minutes. As in their creeps make it down the ramp and then get immediately killed. We just couldn't take a high ground fight against naga/titan bullshit. Titan even got refresher. Then there were 3 other heroes on top of it, but I don't remember from the top of my head. It was interesting to play it out to the end, with only chipping damage to their base. My curiosity is forever sated though, because it was boring as hell. It got a little faster after they lost their first baracks, but not as much as you think. Pro teams usually gg out before the long siege happens. Remember ig vs DK, longest game of dota 2? DK could have won, but I am sure it would have taken literally 40 more minutes of chipping away at the base. Even DK didn't have the patience to play that out. Show nested quote +On October 06 2013 12:28 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:On October 06 2013 09:50 Mataza wrote:Did IF change the default values of hero-type damage towards fortified-type armor? It has been so long I honestly don't remember. I know I used this frozen throne site for any of those mechanics questions, but I know IF messed with some of those numbers, at least chaos-type damage(jungle creeps like centaor khan did/do chaos-type damage and those do only 40-50% against tower armor. Opposed to real chaos damage which is 100% against everything.) The dota numbers are vastly different from ladder. You're better off using the playdota table. The hero -> fort is one of the few damage values that wasn't changed. Thanks for the table. Didn't think there would be one. (Icefraud never documents his changes hue hue etc.)
Although I pity your predicament, DK threw that game. There were times when they had aegis and were running as five towards the Radiant base with a pickoff on iG, and then just turned around to farm some more. It wasn't that they were being forced into chipping away, it's that they refused to push their advantage.
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On October 06 2013 12:52 Acritter wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2013 12:45 Mataza wrote:On October 06 2013 11:46 Acritter wrote:On October 06 2013 11:42 Mataza wrote:
I know that ratdota is possible in pubs, it just takes discipline as I said.
I have never seen it played out properly in pubs though, as surely one of ten people will get impatient before it comes to fruition. I had enough when I played an inhouse that took 20 minutes(I am not exaggerating) to finish after the losing side couldn't possibly recover. The losing team had Naga Siren and Elder Titan and boy was it boring to push their high ground with only manta illusions and visage's revenants.
What heroes did you have? To the best of my knowledge, the best answer to that situation is to farm until every hero has BoTs and then triple splitpush. If they go on any one side, Travels are your friend! They were contained in their base for 20 minutes. As in their creeps make it down the ramp and then get immediately killed. We just couldn't take a high ground fight against naga/titan bullshit. Titan even got refresher. Then there were 3 other heroes on top of it, but I don't remember from the top of my head. It was interesting to play it out to the end, with only chipping damage to their base. My curiosity is forever sated though, because it was boring as hell. It got a little faster after they lost their first baracks, but not as much as you think. Pro teams usually gg out before the long siege happens. Remember ig vs DK, longest game of dota 2? DK could have won, but I am sure it would have taken literally 40 more minutes of chipping away at the base. Even DK didn't have the patience to play that out. On October 06 2013 12:28 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:On October 06 2013 09:50 Mataza wrote:Did IF change the default values of hero-type damage towards fortified-type armor? It has been so long I honestly don't remember. I know I used this frozen throne site for any of those mechanics questions, but I know IF messed with some of those numbers, at least chaos-type damage(jungle creeps like centaor khan did/do chaos-type damage and those do only 40-50% against tower armor. Opposed to real chaos damage which is 100% against everything.) The dota numbers are vastly different from ladder. You're better off using the playdota table. The hero -> fort is one of the few damage values that wasn't changed. Thanks for the table. Didn't think there would be one. (Icefraud never documents his changes hue hue etc.) Although I pity your predicament, DK threw that game. There were times when they had aegis and were running as five towards the Radiant base with a pickoff on iG, and then just turned around to farm some more. It wasn't that they were being forced into chipping away, it's that they refused to push their advantage.
i dont think they necessarily "threw" because the game was slightly close but yeah they were too timid that game
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where did demon cry on stream wtf
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On October 06 2013 12:56 rabidch wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2013 12:52 Acritter wrote:On October 06 2013 12:45 Mataza wrote:On October 06 2013 11:46 Acritter wrote:On October 06 2013 11:42 Mataza wrote:
I know that ratdota is possible in pubs, it just takes discipline as I said.
I have never seen it played out properly in pubs though, as surely one of ten people will get impatient before it comes to fruition. I had enough when I played an inhouse that took 20 minutes(I am not exaggerating) to finish after the losing side couldn't possibly recover. The losing team had Naga Siren and Elder Titan and boy was it boring to push their high ground with only manta illusions and visage's revenants.
What heroes did you have? To the best of my knowledge, the best answer to that situation is to farm until every hero has BoTs and then triple splitpush. If they go on any one side, Travels are your friend! They were contained in their base for 20 minutes. As in their creeps make it down the ramp and then get immediately killed. We just couldn't take a high ground fight against naga/titan bullshit. Titan even got refresher. Then there were 3 other heroes on top of it, but I don't remember from the top of my head. It was interesting to play it out to the end, with only chipping damage to their base. My curiosity is forever sated though, because it was boring as hell. It got a little faster after they lost their first baracks, but not as much as you think. Pro teams usually gg out before the long siege happens. Remember ig vs DK, longest game of dota 2? DK could have won, but I am sure it would have taken literally 40 more minutes of chipping away at the base. Even DK didn't have the patience to play that out. On October 06 2013 12:28 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:On October 06 2013 09:50 Mataza wrote:Did IF change the default values of hero-type damage towards fortified-type armor? It has been so long I honestly don't remember. I know I used this frozen throne site for any of those mechanics questions, but I know IF messed with some of those numbers, at least chaos-type damage(jungle creeps like centaor khan did/do chaos-type damage and those do only 40-50% against tower armor. Opposed to real chaos damage which is 100% against everything.) The dota numbers are vastly different from ladder. You're better off using the playdota table. The hero -> fort is one of the few damage values that wasn't changed. Thanks for the table. Didn't think there would be one. (Icefraud never documents his changes hue hue etc.) Although I pity your predicament, DK threw that game. There were times when they had aegis and were running as five towards the Radiant base with a pickoff on iG, and then just turned around to farm some more. It wasn't that they were being forced into chipping away, it's that they refused to push their advantage. i dont think they necessarily "threw" because the game was slightly close but yeah they were too timid that game
Slightly is exaggerating. They had a vast gold lead. The problem was that they kept on falling back and let the iG cores farm up their critical items, while all DK got was a 12-slotted bear (which really isn't as good as one might think). And if they'd actually committed to the high ground, they would be able to do major tower damage even if they lost the fight, and iG wouldn't be able to take rax in the meantime.
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On October 06 2013 13:26 Acritter wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2013 12:56 rabidch wrote:On October 06 2013 12:52 Acritter wrote:On October 06 2013 12:45 Mataza wrote:On October 06 2013 11:46 Acritter wrote:On October 06 2013 11:42 Mataza wrote:
I know that ratdota is possible in pubs, it just takes discipline as I said.
I have never seen it played out properly in pubs though, as surely one of ten people will get impatient before it comes to fruition. I had enough when I played an inhouse that took 20 minutes(I am not exaggerating) to finish after the losing side couldn't possibly recover. The losing team had Naga Siren and Elder Titan and boy was it boring to push their high ground with only manta illusions and visage's revenants.
What heroes did you have? To the best of my knowledge, the best answer to that situation is to farm until every hero has BoTs and then triple splitpush. If they go on any one side, Travels are your friend! They were contained in their base for 20 minutes. As in their creeps make it down the ramp and then get immediately killed. We just couldn't take a high ground fight against naga/titan bullshit. Titan even got refresher. Then there were 3 other heroes on top of it, but I don't remember from the top of my head. It was interesting to play it out to the end, with only chipping damage to their base. My curiosity is forever sated though, because it was boring as hell. It got a little faster after they lost their first baracks, but not as much as you think. Pro teams usually gg out before the long siege happens. Remember ig vs DK, longest game of dota 2? DK could have won, but I am sure it would have taken literally 40 more minutes of chipping away at the base. Even DK didn't have the patience to play that out. On October 06 2013 12:28 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:On October 06 2013 09:50 Mataza wrote:Did IF change the default values of hero-type damage towards fortified-type armor? It has been so long I honestly don't remember. I know I used this frozen throne site for any of those mechanics questions, but I know IF messed with some of those numbers, at least chaos-type damage(jungle creeps like centaor khan did/do chaos-type damage and those do only 40-50% against tower armor. Opposed to real chaos damage which is 100% against everything.) The dota numbers are vastly different from ladder. You're better off using the playdota table. The hero -> fort is one of the few damage values that wasn't changed. Thanks for the table. Didn't think there would be one. (Icefraud never documents his changes hue hue etc.) Although I pity your predicament, DK threw that game. There were times when they had aegis and were running as five towards the Radiant base with a pickoff on iG, and then just turned around to farm some more. It wasn't that they were being forced into chipping away, it's that they refused to push their advantage. i dont think they necessarily "threw" because the game was slightly close but yeah they were too timid that game Slightly is exaggerating. They had a vast gold lead. The problem was that they kept on falling back and let the iG cores farm up their critical items, while all DK got was a 12-slotted bear (which really isn't as good as one might think). And if they'd actually committed to the high ground, they would be able to do major tower damage even if they lost the fight, and iG wouldn't be able to take rax in the meantime.
they did not have a significant gold lead (nor xp lead), rewatch the game
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demon blaming maelk for goin on vacation too much and wife problems
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On October 06 2013 13:36 rabidch wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2013 13:26 Acritter wrote:On October 06 2013 12:56 rabidch wrote:On October 06 2013 12:52 Acritter wrote:On October 06 2013 12:45 Mataza wrote:On October 06 2013 11:46 Acritter wrote:On October 06 2013 11:42 Mataza wrote:
I know that ratdota is possible in pubs, it just takes discipline as I said.
I have never seen it played out properly in pubs though, as surely one of ten people will get impatient before it comes to fruition. I had enough when I played an inhouse that took 20 minutes(I am not exaggerating) to finish after the losing side couldn't possibly recover. The losing team had Naga Siren and Elder Titan and boy was it boring to push their high ground with only manta illusions and visage's revenants.
What heroes did you have? To the best of my knowledge, the best answer to that situation is to farm until every hero has BoTs and then triple splitpush. If they go on any one side, Travels are your friend! They were contained in their base for 20 minutes. As in their creeps make it down the ramp and then get immediately killed. We just couldn't take a high ground fight against naga/titan bullshit. Titan even got refresher. Then there were 3 other heroes on top of it, but I don't remember from the top of my head. It was interesting to play it out to the end, with only chipping damage to their base. My curiosity is forever sated though, because it was boring as hell. It got a little faster after they lost their first baracks, but not as much as you think. Pro teams usually gg out before the long siege happens. Remember ig vs DK, longest game of dota 2? DK could have won, but I am sure it would have taken literally 40 more minutes of chipping away at the base. Even DK didn't have the patience to play that out. On October 06 2013 12:28 Blitzkrieg0 wrote:On October 06 2013 09:50 Mataza wrote:Did IF change the default values of hero-type damage towards fortified-type armor? It has been so long I honestly don't remember. I know I used this frozen throne site for any of those mechanics questions, but I know IF messed with some of those numbers, at least chaos-type damage(jungle creeps like centaor khan did/do chaos-type damage and those do only 40-50% against tower armor. Opposed to real chaos damage which is 100% against everything.) The dota numbers are vastly different from ladder. You're better off using the playdota table. The hero -> fort is one of the few damage values that wasn't changed. Thanks for the table. Didn't think there would be one. (Icefraud never documents his changes hue hue etc.) Although I pity your predicament, DK threw that game. There were times when they had aegis and were running as five towards the Radiant base with a pickoff on iG, and then just turned around to farm some more. It wasn't that they were being forced into chipping away, it's that they refused to push their advantage. i dont think they necessarily "threw" because the game was slightly close but yeah they were too timid that game Slightly is exaggerating. They had a vast gold lead. The problem was that they kept on falling back and let the iG cores farm up their critical items, while all DK got was a 12-slotted bear (which really isn't as good as one might think). And if they'd actually committed to the high ground, they would be able to do major tower damage even if they lost the fight, and iG wouldn't be able to take rax in the meantime. they did not have a significant gold lead (nor xp lead), rewatch the game
...You know, rather than rewatch the least bearable game of TI3, I'll just say you're right. All I can say is that it wasn't anyone on iG who ended with the highest net worth ever recorded.
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On October 06 2013 13:36 FinestHour wrote:
demon blaming maelk for goin on vacation too much and wife problems
maelk taking his vacation was basically EG forfeiting their chance of receiving a direct invite.
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On October 06 2013 13:36 FinestHour wrote:
demon blaming maelk for goin on vacation too much and wife problems
did you even watch that whole thing?
I would say he took 90% of the blame.
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fear has a dream and he won't let even his closest friend stand in his way.
emotional dota
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EPT
