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On April 20 2013 05:33 SKC wrote:
He really screams mid hero to me.
"I repeated many times that Skywrath Mage is a very fragile hero, so he can’t dominate the lane."
He can dominate the lane, since he can force the opponent out of it by sheer nuking. You may have issues last hitting until 3, but then it shouldn't be that bad.
He says clarity is crucial, it really isn't if you rush bottle. Rushing a RoP really isn't as well.
It really seems too much like a low level pub guide, you really need levels, you need farm, you are a great 1v1 hero. Solo mid seems obvious. I could maybe see him as support, but that's a diferent build entirely.
I see him pretty varied so I wasn't sure if I should just keep him safer as lane (helping with ganks with the two abilities) or going straight mid (where he's pretty frail).
Even so, would he need Mekansm then?
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On April 20 2013 05:35 SKC wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2013 05:34 Torte de Lini wrote:On April 20 2013 05:33 Sn0_Man wrote:
Thats a bad guide.
Think of Skywrath like zeus: infinite magic damage, hugely level and mana dependant, very fragile. I attributed him similar to OD with less control of the lane (Astral. Imprisonment). Would you lane OD?
I put him as mid in my guide, but that's because I think Astral Imprisonment has a lot more to offer in terms of control (plus the extra int to last hit).
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On April 20 2013 05:35 Torte de Lini wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2013 05:33 SKC wrote:
He really screams mid hero to me.
"I repeated many times that Skywrath Mage is a very fragile hero, so he can’t dominate the lane."
He can dominate the lane, since he can force the opponent out of it by sheer nuking. You may have issues last hitting until 3, but then it shouldn't be that bad.
He says clarity is crucial, it really isn't if you rush bottle. Rushing a RoP really isn't as well.
It really seems too much like a low level pub guide, you really need levels, you need farm, you are a great 1v1 hero. Solo mid seems obvious. I could maybe see him as support, but that's a diferent build entirely.
I see him pretty varied so I wasn't sure if I should just keep him safer as lane (helping with ganks with the two abilities) or going straight mid (where he's pretty frail). Even so, would he need Mekansm then?
Well, I said on the other post I wasn't sold on the Mek, but that's a detail I can't really comment much on, so if someone says it is I won't argue it. Can't say I've really played him much tbh.
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On April 20 2013 05:37 SKC wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2013 05:35 Torte de Lini wrote:On April 20 2013 05:33 SKC wrote:
He really screams mid hero to me.
"I repeated many times that Skywrath Mage is a very fragile hero, so he can’t dominate the lane."
He can dominate the lane, since he can force the opponent out of it by sheer nuking. You may have issues last hitting until 3, but then it shouldn't be that bad.
He says clarity is crucial, it really isn't if you rush bottle. Rushing a RoP really isn't as well.
It really seems too much like a low level pub guide, you really need levels, you need farm, you are a great 1v1 hero. Solo mid seems obvious. I could maybe see him as support, but that's a diferent build entirely.
I see him pretty varied so I wasn't sure if I should just keep him safer as lane (helping with ganks with the two abilities) or going straight mid (where he's pretty frail). Even so, would he need Mekansm then? Well, I said on the other post I wasn't sold on the Mek, but that's a detail I can't really comment much on, so if someone says it is I won't argue it. Can't say I've really played him much tbh.
If I slot him as a mid hero, I would think to skip Meka and just put both atos and Force staff in there (Atos for the health + int and FS for obvious reasons).
And of course bottle.
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OD's mid is based on the idea of disabling your opponents spells and CRUSHING in lasthits because of how much auto-attack damage you do. Plus if they have weak range you can harass them extremely well.
Skywrath's mid is based on "GET OUT OF MY LANE" aka a billion magic damage aimed at any lane opponent.
Mek is situational, much like it is on silencer/warlock etc.
Problem is that Skywrath needs 1 serious mana item (bigger than Bottle/Arcanes) before he can really cast all his spells more than once (which is important because they have miniscule cooldowns). A mek hurts that more than it helps. In fact, I'd avoid mek on him unless your team is desperate.
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On April 20 2013 05:38 Sn0_Man wrote:
OD's mid is based on the idea of disabling your opponents spells and CRUSHING in lasthits because of how much auto-attack damage you do. Plus if they have weak range you can harass them extremely well.
Skywrath's mid is based on "GET OUT OF MY LANE" aka a billion magic damage aimed at any lane opponent.
So with that in mind, what would his initial items be? Would getting two Null Talismans be worth it for the extra Arcane Bolt damage to really harass foes or is it just not worth it?
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On April 20 2013 05:40 Torte de Lini wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2013 05:38 Sn0_Man wrote:
OD's mid is based on the idea of disabling your opponents spells and CRUSHING in lasthits because of how much auto-attack damage you do. Plus if they have weak range you can harass them extremely well.
Skywrath's mid is based on "GET OUT OF MY LANE" aka a billion magic damage aimed at any lane opponent. So with that in mind, what would his initial items be? Would getting two Null Talismans be worth it for the extra Arcane Bolt damage?
I wouldn't say randomnly getting two nulls is ever worth it. It won't really make a big diference if all you are worried about is Arcane Bolt.
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On April 20 2013 05:40 Torte de Lini wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2013 05:38 Sn0_Man wrote:
OD's mid is based on the idea of disabling your opponents spells and CRUSHING in lasthits because of how much auto-attack damage you do. Plus if they have weak range you can harass them extremely well.
Skywrath's mid is based on "GET OUT OF MY LANE" aka a billion magic damage aimed at any lane opponent. So with that in mind, what would his initial items be? Would getting two Null Talismans be worth it for the extra Arcane Bolt damage?
4 branches, tango
Bottle -> Arcanes -> Force/Euls/Ghost/Sheep. Kill people at 3 5 6, never stop killing.
PS: Unless you want to revolutionize him. In that case go Bottle/Arcanes -> Lothars/Euls/Drum. Maximum cuteness.
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Why discuss OD vs SM? OD kills SM anytime...
A few Astrals will wreck SM's nuking power (damage, and manacost), not to mention reduce right click damage too.
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Noone was discussing OD vs SM anyway. He compared OD to SM.
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On April 20 2013 05:42 trinxified wrote:
Why discuss OD vs SM? OD kills SM anytime...
A few Astrals will wreck SM's nuking power (damage, and manacost), not to mention reduce right click damage too.
We were discussing the parallels between the two in terms of mid-lane control.
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Updated with credit to the community :D
I'm still refining it though. Mixing between what's situational, extension, etc.
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I'm trying to decide how legit I think bloodstone is on Skywrath. He is SO squishy he needs some kind of survivability item against most lineups, but the way he scales with int makes me less inclined to buy an expensive regen item that offers 0 int like bloodstone. I guess I just need to play with him a bit.
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On April 20 2013 05:46 Sn0_Man wrote:
I'm trying to decide how legit I think bloodstone is on Skywrath. He is SO squishy he needs some kind of survivability item against most lineups, but the way he scales with int makes me less inclined to buy an expensive regen item that offers 0 int like bloodstone. I guess I just need to play with him a bit.
Lovedrop thinks bloodstone is good. I think so too, but at the same time, it's a pretty lengthy item when you can get away with atos, euls and force staff for the extra mana and damage.
You don't need that much regen later in the game, right?
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On April 20 2013 05:46 Sn0_Man wrote:
I'm trying to decide how legit I think bloodstone is on Skywrath. He is SO squishy he needs some kind of survivability item against most lineups, but the way he scales with int makes me less inclined to buy an expensive regen item that offers 0 int like bloodstone. I guess I just need to play with him a bit.
Solve this problem with Atos. I really like the value of the item. Nice buildup, cost efficient (no recipe, you get more bonus when assembled, etc.) if you ask me.
The only thing you're missing now is mana regen. I like Orchid for this. Even Necro book is legit because of the STR and INT gain.
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On April 20 2013 05:46 Torte de Lini wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2013 05:46 Sn0_Man wrote:
I'm trying to decide how legit I think bloodstone is on Skywrath. He is SO squishy he needs some kind of survivability item against most lineups, but the way he scales with int makes me less inclined to buy an expensive regen item that offers 0 int like bloodstone. I guess I just need to play with him a bit. Lovedrop thinks bloodstone is good. I think so too, but at the same time, it's a pretty lengthy item when you can get away with atos, euls and force staff for the extra mana and damage. You don't need that much regen later in the game, right?
Your ulti is 800 mana on a 20s cooldown. thats 40 mana per second, ONLY FOR THAT ABILITY. Your Q is on a 2s CD. Mana is everything. As in, you could probably out-spend Bloodstone+Sheepstick+Linkens regen (all 3).
PS I think atos is probably enough HP most games? dunno.
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On April 20 2013 05:46 Sn0_Man wrote:
I'm trying to decide how legit I think bloodstone is on Skywrath. He is SO squishy he needs some kind of survivability item against most lineups, but the way he scales with int makes me less inclined to buy an expensive regen item that offers 0 int like bloodstone. I guess I just need to play with him a bit.
I think it's the kind of hero that getting a little bit more tanky won't really save you anyway, so it's more worth it to get mobility items and disables to you can get a good position and away from fights. Your spells already allow you to stay at a pretty good distance from the fight, and if a Naix bomb drops on your face, you are dead either way.
You could get something like Drums + Atos for a little bit more health.
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United States47024 Posts
On April 20 2013 05:47 trinxified wrote:
The only thing you're missing now is mana regen. I like Orchid for this. Even Necro book is legit because of the STR and INT gain.
Eul's is better than Orchid on this hero given how he has zero need for autoattack stats (which Orchid is buying a ton of). The Orchid Silence is also not that necessary given that the hero has no lack of offensive capability and has a greater need for defensive power from his item actives.
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On April 20 2013 05:52 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2013 05:47 trinxified wrote:
The only thing you're missing now is mana regen. I like Orchid for this. Even Necro book is legit because of the STR and INT gain. Eul's is better than Orchid on this hero given how he has zero need for autoattack stats (which Orchid is buying a ton of). The Orchid Silence is also not that necessary given that the hero has no lack of offensive capability and has a greater need for defensive power from his item actives.
What about the amplify damage?
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On April 20 2013 05:53 Torte de Lini wrote:Show nested quote +On April 20 2013 05:52 TheYango wrote:On April 20 2013 05:47 trinxified wrote:
The only thing you're missing now is mana regen. I like Orchid for this. Even Necro book is legit because of the STR and INT gain. Eul's is better than Orchid on this hero given how he has zero need for autoattack stats (which Orchid is buying a ton of). The Orchid Silence is also not that necessary given that the hero has no lack of offensive capability and has a greater need for defensive power from his item actives. What about the amplify damage?
You are getting a whole item just for the silence/amplify damage. Plus, if you focus down one hero he is likely going down anyway.
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EPT
