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On December 14 2012 06:50 Sn0_Man wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2012 06:46 Numy wrote:
Luna is a great 5 man dota carry and urn is great for 5 man dota not just ganking. If noone on your team can get it , Luna getting it is fine
If noone on your team can get it... Seriously? I'd get it on every other hero before your carry (luna). Luna getting it is Awful :| She doesn't need the Strength, she DOES need the slot, the mana regen is pretty meh, and the heal could easily be a teammate. Its like, "why don't you see luna get a mek? Its a great 5-man dota item..." derp.
Hah... She does need the strength. Something to consider instead of a aquila I guess. Not saying it's best but saying its worst is a bit of an overstatement. A lot of unusual heroes get mek when you 5 maning. The only real item Luna needs is a bkb. I don't even think she needs any form of mana regen in most cases of defensive trilane into 5 man. If you do want regen I think an urn is a possibility over aquila in some situations
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yeah orchid is generally bad because shredder barely uses any part of the item very well
Int increases his mana pool a little but not enough to be super effective
Mana regen is great on him, but % mana regen makes it less good since his int pool will be so low
Damage is mostly a wasted stat on shredder
Attack speed the same
the silence is nice, but he doesn't have problem chasing escaping players nor does he surprise people to make himself immune to retribution.
the amplify damage does a little bit of damage, but it applies when the orchid wears off and shredder doesn't really do a ton of bursty damage more so a constant drain on health over time due to his cooldowns.
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United States47024 Posts
On December 14 2012 07:15 Haee wrote:
I'm conflicted :/.
I feel that the metagame right now would have allowed Luna to be viable regardless of adding tranq because like you said, the game is just so mid game oriented. Luna reaching level six gives immediately makes her a presence because of how obnoxious it is to gank her with ult off cooldown or just the sheer amount of damage it does in teamfights. Eclipse alone makes her so appealing in this metagame in contrast to other late game carries having a bit of longer build up to have that said "presence".
The counter argument would be whether she could even reach 6 without tranquil I guess and we still don't really see PL much in competitive games although in PL's case, yes tranquil without question is a why people look at him a bit more although the agility gain shouldn't be forgotten (armor bonus is pretty insane)
Luna wouldn't function well at all without Tranquil's allowing her to smoothly build stat items early on. Lucent Beam/ulti are only half the story--she still would be weak without the ability to get such efficient stat items as Aquila+Janggo so early on.
Playing Phase+HotD Luna is like playing a totally different hero.
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Euls gives the same mana regen as an orchid and move-speed and the cyclone effect is neat for a ganker.
I'd say i prefer it over orchid on shredder. Especially because none of the stats are wasted and the active is neat too.
Not that orchid couldn't be really nice against QoP, Storm, AM and such.
Not to mention euls is way cheaper and also has relatively cheap components.
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On December 14 2012 07:30 PrinceXizor wrote:
yeah orchid is generally bad because shredder barely uses any part of the item very well
Int increases his mana pool a little but not enough to be super effective
Mana regen is great on him, but % mana regen makes it less good since his int pool will be so low
Damage is mostly a wasted stat on shredder
Attack speed the same
the silence is nice, but he doesn't have problem chasing escaping players nor does he surprise people to make himself immune to retribution.
the amplify damage does a little bit of damage, but it applies when the orchid wears off and shredder doesn't really do a ton of bursty damage more so a constant drain on health over time due to his cooldowns.
orchid gives a lot of int, and silence is nice because then heroes don't cast spells at you
the only part that's moderately useless is the attackspeed/attack damage, and even then it's not like you don't punch things at all
edit: other items are probably better but orchid isn't bad
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On December 14 2012 07:40 Dead9 wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2012 07:30 PrinceXizor wrote:
yeah orchid is generally bad because shredder barely uses any part of the item very well
Int increases his mana pool a little but not enough to be super effective
Mana regen is great on him, but % mana regen makes it less good since his int pool will be so low
Damage is mostly a wasted stat on shredder
Attack speed the same
the silence is nice, but he doesn't have problem chasing escaping players nor does he surprise people to make himself immune to retribution.
the amplify damage does a little bit of damage, but it applies when the orchid wears off and shredder doesn't really do a ton of bursty damage more so a constant drain on health over time due to his cooldowns.
orchid gives a lot of int, and silence is nice because then heroes don't cast spells at you the only part that's moderately useless is the attackspeed/attack damage, and even then it's not like you don't punch things at all
You can't attack as long as your ulti is active. Which it should always be during teamfights, ideally.
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On December 14 2012 07:40 Unleashing wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2012 07:40 Dead9 wrote:On December 14 2012 07:30 PrinceXizor wrote:
yeah orchid is generally bad because shredder barely uses any part of the item very well
Int increases his mana pool a little but not enough to be super effective
Mana regen is great on him, but % mana regen makes it less good since his int pool will be so low
Damage is mostly a wasted stat on shredder
Attack speed the same
the silence is nice, but he doesn't have problem chasing escaping players nor does he surprise people to make himself immune to retribution.
the amplify damage does a little bit of damage, but it applies when the orchid wears off and shredder doesn't really do a ton of bursty damage more so a constant drain on health over time due to his cooldowns.
orchid gives a lot of int, and silence is nice because then heroes don't cast spells at you the only part that's moderately useless is the attackspeed/attack damage, and even then it's not like you don't punch things at all You can't attack as long as your ulti is active. Which it should always be during teamfights, ideally.
most of the time you fire it off and return it within a couple seconds, because usually people try to avoid the blade
during smaller fights and while farming it's nice to have a bit of extra autoattack damage
it's not super useful but it's not entirely useless either
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On December 14 2012 07:35 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2012 07:15 Haee wrote:
I'm conflicted :/.
I feel that the metagame right now would have allowed Luna to be viable regardless of adding tranq because like you said, the game is just so mid game oriented. Luna reaching level six gives immediately makes her a presence because of how obnoxious it is to gank her with ult off cooldown or just the sheer amount of damage it does in teamfights. Eclipse alone makes her so appealing in this metagame in contrast to other late game carries having a bit of longer build up to have that said "presence".
The counter argument would be whether she could even reach 6 without tranquil I guess and we still don't really see PL much in competitive games although in PL's case, yes tranquil without question is a why people look at him a bit more although the agility gain shouldn't be forgotten (armor bonus is pretty insane) Luna wouldn't function well at all without Tranquil's allowing her to smoothly build stat items early on. Lucent Beam/ulti are only half the story--she still would be weak without the ability to get such efficient stat items as Aquila+Janggo so early on. Playing Phase+HotD Luna is like playing a totally different hero.
Whenever i see a phaseboots luna i want to kill her again and again. So you think your luna can outrun your death? Nope!
Transquil on luna is very nice especially allowing her to do some nuetrals when your team is not fighting.
All luna need is some hp to stay alive longer in team fight. Urn is totally fine on her since you are most certainly getting a bracer/drum anyway but i'd go for orge axe straight (for bkb) if i got urn for her and my team better fight nonstop everytime my ulti is on cd.
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yea def tranquil on luna. and u can easily dissemble it late game for your bots instead of having to sell the whole thing.
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I have gotta stop playing All Pick. I think most of the noobs are playing there.
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On December 14 2012 07:54 trinxified wrote:
I have gotta stop playing All Pick. I think most of the noobs are playing there.
i can say with certainty that most of high mmr games page 1-5 are ap.
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On December 14 2012 07:54 trinxified wrote:
I have gotta stop playing All Pick. I think most of the noobs are playing there.
When most players find they are always getting idiot teammates it is because of the mode.
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it's more like 99% of people just play AP
i think it's mostly because all the other modes suck unless you have a 5stack with good players
and if you have a 5stack with good players all the modes are kind of a joke anyway
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On December 14 2012 08:00 aintz wrote:Show nested quote +On December 14 2012 07:54 trinxified wrote:
I have gotta stop playing All Pick. I think most of the noobs are playing there. i can say with certainty that most of high mmr games page 1-5 are ap.
at least at my MMR, it's where they are at.
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On December 14 2012 07:54 trinxified wrote:
I have gotta stop playing All Pick. I think most of the noobs are playing there.
cm is the only mode where I have noticed any sort of higher skill level. the rest are just as bad/good as ap, perhaps even worse due to the propensity of rd and sd to throw up retarded team comps
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On December 14 2012 08:01 Dead9 wrote:
it's more like 99% of people just play AP
i think it's mostly because all the other modes suck unless you have a 5stack with good players
and if you have a 5stack with good players all the modes are kind of a joke anyway
-CM and RD for sure, but SD not so much imo. I think it's just that a lot of people like the freedom to choose whathever they want, and the rest follows it because the queues are faster.
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It's just so frustrating when I get noob team mates who random and just feed. I only solo queue because I don't have friends. 
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Another random question...
What do you guys like to go with on Batrider after the typical upgraded boots + Blink + Force staff + Maybe urn
I never know what to get after that. :/ Like Pipe? Shivas? Sheep? Even Dagon?
Is there anything that is considered "core" on bat after blink + force?
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United States47024 Posts
I've been saying this for months: Valve please implement -EM so that all the bad players that would play -EM can get out of everyone else's games.
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EPT
