EPT
General Discussion - Page 1331
| Forum Index > Dota 2 General |
IRC chatter should remain in IRC - http://webchat.quakenet.org/?channels=tl.dota2 Posts that relate to topics with their own thread, such as in News, Tournaments or Strategy should go in those threads. | ||
|
PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
| ||
|
Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
So you need some way to keep the heat off of drow, but most of those are melee (don't benefit from the aura) and traditionally there are better glass cannons to pick in this circumstance. The big change with this patch, then, is that drow may now be the best glass cannon to pick if you can support such a hero. Food for thought, and it needs a lot of in game testing. Sniper is obviously making a case for this role as well, especially since his positioning is substantially easier. EDIT: History has kinda taught us that this role simply doesn't work too well (morphling was popular due to invincibility, not due to being "glass"), but IceFrog is doing his best to make it viable. | ||
|
Blitzkrieg0
United States13132 Posts
On October 27 2012 00:39 Baggage wrote: I think a lot of fundamental misunderstandings about drow comes from the idea that she's a hard carry that requires a lot of farm, when in reality she has a very brutal midgame power. Drow's strength as a hero comes with the lvling up with her ultimate that dramatically increases her damage output. As a result, whenever she hits lvl 6, 11 or 16 there is a timing window where teams can exploit this damage gain to engage in a fight or push a tower. In Starcraft terms, this would be like have a big upgrade advantage over your opponent. To put this into a numbers perspective, with the recent buffs at lvl 6 drow has the potential to gain +40 agility if left to her own devices, which is roughly the equivalent of an eaglesong + blade of alacrity. With that level up, you've suddenly gotten a ~4300 gold advantage over other heroes. Admittedly if you enter into team fights it is halved to +20, but a 2000 gold gain still isn't too bad. With regards to drow's skill build, it is not necessary to max out frost arrows. Lvl 2 frost arrows is usually sufficient of a slow to chase down and kill enemy heroes (provided you have enough attack speed). Ideally you want to max out her trueshot aura to exploit your the agility gains from your ultimate. The damage output of a lvl 11 drow with yasha + treads + helm of the dominator at the 15-18 minute mark is no joke. It's true that AM or void can farm and outcarry, but they are nowhere near as effective as drow in that midgame timing window, unless you get some gigantic mana void/chronosphere off. tl;dr Drow is a glass cannon that can have a lot of presence, which can translate into a decent lategame. It is only a 4000 (2000) gold advantage if you consider what you're comparing it to, to be worth nothing. No ultimate is worth nothing. Drow has a very strong timings at ult levels, but you need them to sync up with other timings your team has and the enemies anti-timings. This is the challenge and if you miss them, then you're left with a carry who has no escape who is pretty strong, but nobody is strong when they're dead. With no flash farming ability you really need to build a lead off towers so that you're actually stronger. | ||
|
Yoshi-
Germany10227 Posts
| ||
|
KillerSOS
United States4207 Posts
On October 27 2012 00:53 Yoshi- wrote: So cent and drow will turn into such an op hero as treant? I get the joke, treant is hardly played even by the top teams. Although the few game he has been have been quite interesting to say the least. | ||
|
Baggage
Hong Kong593 Posts
On October 27 2012 00:53 Blitzkrieg0 wrote: It is only a 4000 (2000) gold advantage if you consider what you're comparing it to, to be worth nothing. No ultimate is worth nothing. Drow has a very strong timings at ult levels, but you need them to sync up with other timings your team has and the enemies anti-timings. This is the challenge and if you miss them, then you're left with a carry who has no escape who is pretty strong, but nobody is strong when they're dead. With no flash farming ability you really need to build a lead off towers so that you're actually stronger. Yeah, I agree with your points, I was just emphasizing that she has a lot more presence in the early midgame that people tend to overlook. Competitively, it'll be interesting if teams try to find ways to capitalise with drow's various timings. | ||
|
akatama
Romania982 Posts
| ||
|
Brainling
United States660 Posts
Has anyone done the actual math? Does a ranged creep dominated actually equate to more damage than a Crystalys, which is essentially the item people seem to want to drop for the HoD? Even when considering that the ranged creep can just be killed? | ||
|
Heh_
Singapore2712 Posts
On October 27 2012 01:52 Brainling wrote: Wait...people are making HoD an actual core item for Drow? I was just kidding when I started saying that to people! Has anyone done the actual math? Does a ranged creep dominated actually equate to more damage than a Crystalys, which is essentially the item people seem to want to drop for the HoD? Even when considering that the ranged creep can just be killed? What? Do people really get HotD to take a ranged creep? Sounds really weird. I thought drow got it for some sustain and the ability to regain hp/jungle when out of large-scale battles. | ||
|
Blitzkrieg0
United States13132 Posts
On October 27 2012 01:56 Heh_ wrote: What? Do people really get HotD to take a ranged creep? Sounds really weird. I thought drow got it for some sustain and the ability to regain hp/jungle when out of large-scale battles. I thought people bought it because it is a recommended item on drow. It is good for stacking ancients though if your team is incompetent. | ||
|
akatama
Romania982 Posts
| ||
|
Yoshi-
Germany10227 Posts
| ||
|
Brainling
United States660 Posts
I've always thought of her core as Treads -> Yasha -> Crystalys...but new patch, new world. Just interesting to see HoD coming in to play with her after this patch. | ||
|
PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
| ||
|
Yoshi-
Germany10227 Posts
On October 27 2012 02:11 Brainling wrote: I've just never seen HoD listed as a core Drow item until this patch, and now I've seen it listed twice in this thread. I know it's in the recommended items list in game, but that doesn't always mean much. I've always thought of her core as Treads -> Yasha -> Crystalys...but new patch, new world. Just interesting to see HoD coming in to play with her after this patch. Hotd was the core on drow for a really really long time. | ||
|
Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
 I still feel like Treads -> Manta -> Bfly is the way to go if you have the farm. However, it can be hard to farm that, whereas HoD makes farming substantially easier (lifesteal + dominated creep to tank/stack/etc). I kinda feel like crits are later-game items since they are % based as opposed to static number boosts. Crystalys is 35 + 15%, Daedalus is 81 + 42.5%. When the aura wasn't global based on your agi, Daedalus was a legitimate first item after yasha/manta. | ||
|
akatama
Romania982 Posts
I'm asking this since stuff has changed slightly compared to tft dota, for example if you take a DD rune and have an armlet or treadswap, the bonus damage will change dynamically. | ||
Kipsate
Netherlands45349 Posts
| ||
|
Sn0_Man
Tebellong44238 Posts
| ||
|
KillerSOS
United States4207 Posts
On October 27 2012 02:21 Kipsate wrote: Bkb is core after yasha Basically true. If you can get away with no bkb 2nd then the other team is either horribly outdrafted or just bad. | ||
| ||
